Welcome to Club Renaissance
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This message is brought to you by McDonald's. Did you know only 7.3% of American fashion designers are Black? Well, McDonald's 2024 Change Leaders Program is ready to change the face of fashion. The innovative program awards a monetary grant to five emerging Black American designers and pairs each with an industry professional to help them elevate their brands.

I know specifically and distinctly how McDonald's can support and empower not just black Gen Z, but black people. My first job was McDonald's. I learned a lot there about customer service and how to relate to people. I still love that place and go there very often. Look out for the change of fashion designers and mentors.

at events like the BET Awards and the Essence Festival of Culture. And follow the journey of the 2024 McDonald's Change Leaders on their Instagram page, WeAreGolden.

Here's an HIV pill dilemma for you. Picture the scene. There's a rooftop sunset with fairy lights and you're vibing with friends. You remember you've got to take your HIV pill. Important, yes, but the fun moment is gone. Did you know there's a long-acting treatment option available? So catch the sunset and keep the party going. Visit pillfreehiv.com today to learn more. Brought to you by Veve Healthcare.

Hey girl, it's Zach. And before we start today's episode, I have some really exciting news to share with you that you better have heard already because that means you listen to the show weekly and we won't stop talking about this because we're so excited to announce again that we have two live events coming up very, very soon. Our first event is in Boston on Thursday, June 22nd at the WBUR City Space.

And I'm so excited to be in Boston with black people because that never happens. And then in New York the next day, we'll be at the 92nd Street Y with special guest Penn Badgley, who I cannot wait to flirt with on stage in front of my boyfriend. So until then, buy your tickets now before they sell out. And we will see you there because this is the first time we have ever done a live event ever. And it is the first time we have ever been on stage together at one time. So click the links in our episode description for tickets to the show. We can't wait to see you there.

Hello, my international sisters of mystery, my Carmen Sandiegos. Your alien superstars. Yes, alien superstars. I'm Sam Sanders. I'm Saeed Jones. And I'm Zach Stafford. And you are listening to Vibe Check, the Renaissance Edition.

You know, if you haven't been able to tell already, this week we're talking about seeing Beyonce live and in color in London. Some of us saw her multiple times, which we'll get into. And right now begin to guess who was the two-timer. Yeah, guess which of us decided to go to the mountaintop twice. Yeah, it may surprise you, it may not. You'll see.

And then after that, we are talking about Pride Month because the vibes are truly off this year and we want to break down exactly why. Because we're definitely feeling it and we know that you're feeling it too. But before we get there, let's check in. How are we doing? How's the jet lag treating my girls? Sam, because you haven't even been home yet. I haven't been home yet. So I am taking a week in New York for some work stuff on the way home from Europe, but

I'm doing good. After we all saw Beyonce in London, my partner and I, we went to Lisbon for a few days. Let me tell you, child, it's nice out there. They know what they're doing in Portugal. Awesome.

all the wines listen i was just sitting there like obrigado obrigado obrigado obrigado porto lisbon uh-huh did you get port wine did you have some from no we had a bunch of really good orange natural funky wine not me being gagged that port wine is port wine from portugal was that the implication yeah from porto yeah porto yeah yeah all right yeah

But no, a lot of orange wine, seafood was good. All the hams and salamis and meats, they just do it big out there. And like the shopping was fun. The weather was great. I had like runs on the beach every morning. Just the like didn't want to come back.

But you know what? I'm back and I'm feeling rested. And I'm really grateful for that time off. Time with y'all. Time with Beyonce. My vibe this week is a little jet lagged. But overall, V, V, V, V, grateful. Would you move to Portugal? Because it is a place where... Oh, that's already in the works, sweetie. That's already in the works. Oh, really? Because you can buy citizenship. You can buy citizenship. Like, if you purchase real estate, you can become a citizen. And I want to say Alex and I were there 24 hours. And we both were like...

So, we can maybe consider, and of course it's all, you know, pie in the sky. Are there black folks in Portugal? There are. There's a large African population in Portugal. I always try when I'm like abroad, it's like, will black people over here do the nod? And they did. Okay, per. Saeed, how are you doing? How's the jet lag hitting you today? Oh, it's hitting me hard. Um,

So much is going on in my life right now. And a lot of it I'm not ready to really talk about in detail. But I will just say London was great. Seeing Beyonce felt a bit like self-actualization. It meant so much to be there with y'all and our friends, especially after the last few years. I feel like I've been holding on to Renaissance and this moment for dear life.

But, yeah, personally and also like news near and far. I mean, and we're going to talk about, right, everything kind of going on. And there are so many topics in the news that we want to talk about and we don't even have time to reach. But, you know, everything feels like it's kind of on fire. And I certainly feel, at least speaking for myself, damn near every quadrant of my life in the last couple of months is demanding news.

deep transformation. And there's a season, like, you know, was it Zora Neale Hurston? There are years that, you know, ask questions and then there are years that provide answers. I think there are seasons that demand change and you're not always ready for it. And so, yeah, it's, it's a, I'll be honest. It's a painful time. I'm very angry at having to,

Make space in myself and in my mind and in my memory for all of this and figuring it all out at once. But I know I'm going to. And I'm just deadly serious in the opening of Renaissance. She gets to the welcome to Renaissance and I'm that girl comes on and the sample of these motherfuckers ain't stopping me. I just have...

such an emotional response to that and i just remember pounding my fist and just like getting more and more energy and so we're gonna do it and it's gonna be great and i'll set fire to the rain when the time comes but uh yeah that's where i'm at right now yes we love well we're here for you as you enter this journey chapter season as aura says um because we're here zach how are you

Oh girl, I am jet lagged. I have never in my life flown from Europe back to LA. It's always been a New York thing. How long is the flight? Oh, you know, I think I traveled for 20 hours on Sunday. It was like something crazy. Was there a layover? Because I had to go to JFK for some reason. Didn't realize that. And then, you know, you do a whole other six plus hour trip. And yeah, it is not a joke at all. Flying there was fine. Coming back?

Cause you try to have to sleep. Flying to London from, at least like from New York or the East coast is actually like a breeze. It's like flying to LA. It's just like, there you are. It's cute. Yeah. LA to Europe. Not, not wonderful. So I add that to Said's score book of why LA is hell is flying to Europe. Is there.

But beyond that, I'm so happy to be home. I'm so happy I was in Europe with you all. And we were there all for so long. I was there for 10 days and it felt like such an adventure I haven't had in so long because I went to the wedding in Camogli, which was stunning. Let me tell you, white people are getting married in Italy and they're having sickening weddings. I understand now. I see the vision. If you have a coin to spend,

You do it. It is beautiful. If you want to go have a romantic weekend with a loved one or to find love, I think it's a great place to go. And, you know, in a wedding there, I get it. I understand the vision. I will not be having my wedding there because everyone's doing it. Oh, so you're getting married? But...

I'm not married. I'm not gay. We support that union. Thank you. We all love Craig. He's great. And if that had happened, I would be very proudly saying it today. Anyway, before we get into this episode, we want to thank all of you who have sent us fan mail and reached out to us on social media. We absolutely love reading your messages and your tweets and your posts about the show on Twitter, especially because that hashtag, that's the only reason why I check Twitter is because that hashtag, vibecheckpod. So keep using it or email us at vibecheckatstitcher.com.

And with that, I think we should start talking about this Beyonce, right? We should. Let us re-enter Club Renaissance. Our first segment is a recap of our time in London town seeing Beyonce. And wait, wait, wait. Because as I've learned, some people take, I guess this is a new thing, concert spoilers very seriously. I didn't know spoilers in concerts were a thing. Me neither. But if this is your thing, you can go ahead and pause it and

Fast forward to the next segment and then come back. Some people just don't want to hear any detail. They want to wait until they see her in L.A. and just be totally surprised. So fast forward, girls. Fast forward.

Spoiler alert, we're going to get into it now and just talk about our experience going to London to see Beyonce. And I feel like we have to start with how it all came together. We were in the same boat as most of our listeners trying to figure out how we're going to get to the show and get tickets. And we were worried about the ticket master of it all and all of these things. But early on when tickets became available for Beyonce's show, I forget what day of the week it was, but Zach texted all of us and said, basically, drop everything you're doing.

Click this link. We are buying tickets for Beyonce in London. Yeah, I feel like it was like a Monday night event.

I just remember I was like walking across my apartment, you know, like going to sit down in the living room and I got a text and it was just Zach saying, I just got tickets in London. And my first, you know, and as we've kind of said, look, if anyone's going to live the life of luxury, it is Zach. So for all I knew, he was like, I just bought, you know, tickets for $5,000 or something, you know. So my first question was like, are there more tickets and like how much is it? He sent me the link and it was like, actually, shit.

It is so different than seeing her in the U.S. in terms of ticket prices. And then I just remember it was just like we entered the matrix together. We like dived in and we were just like sending it to each other. Yeah, totally. Sam, what were you doing during the sprint at 321? I was driving. I was out running errands. I was taking my ass back to the house, check on the dogs. And I'm on MLK and I get this these flurry of texts from Zach. And I was like, OK, I got to do it. I got to buy them now.

I gotta just pull over. So I'm driving out MLK and I just turn to the first parking lot I see. I end up in a Kaiser Permanente parking lot with not great reception. And I'm literally outside of the car pacing the parking lot, hopping up and down and screaming, being like, please work, please work, please work. I was just pacing my living room. Yes. Yes. Reception was bad. I didn't know if I got him or not. I ended up refreshing the link

Three times. And for days, I thought I was charged three times. I wasn't. But when I got the tickets, I like did a little praise hand in the Kaiser Permanente parking lot. And some other person in their car down the lot was just like,

What? And I was like, I got Beyonce tickets. They were like, I know insurance premiums are bad, man, but what could have just happened at Casa Permanente? Listen, and ever since then, I feel like we have just been anticipating and anticipating this trip and this concert. And finally it happened. I mean, I don't want to give too much setup besides that. I just want to ask y'all, how do we describe what the show was like for our listeners?

It was so much. I would say for me, it was life-affirming. That was the first thing I thought as it began. It just felt...

like everything I had put into my relationship with Beyonce since Destiny's Child. So Beyonce for me is, I think my most seen live performer just because my sister and I would go as kids to see Destiny's Child concert. So I saw her there, I saw the farewell tour and then every solo tour she's had, I've gone to. And people have always questioned whether she was an ally. That's been a long standing discourse in pop music is, does she really like the gays or she just performing or whatever?

And she released Renaissance. And we, us here on this group chat and the show, uh,

We saw that as like a material evidence that she does believe in us, that she does care about us. And that all of our love for her was valid. But the show itself was just it. It was just like, this is the gayest three hours of my life. It felt like allyship, the most like real allyship I've ever seen and integration of queer people. It was just, it was everything. I mean, there was that moment and this is spoiler alert listeners. The second to last song is Pure Honey, which is usually like three and a half minutes, four minutes long.

But she sets up Pure Honey and then Beyonce goes backstage to, I guess, change to her final outfit. And she just lets Pure Honey run on for like 12 minutes. And her dancers just ballroom dance for like 12 minutes. It was the gayest, most beautiful thing. And they're so good. So good. So good. And like to see Beyonce not just say, I embrace queer culture. At one point she said, I'm giving you the stage.

That was fucking beautiful. I thought it was great. Saeed, what's your take on the show? So this was my third time seeing Beyonce live. She's been kind of tied actually with Janelle Monae in terms of live performances I've been able to see. And I think that kind of says a lot. The word that kept coming to mind was easygoing, a sense of flowing like water, a sense of ease, effortlessness. Because I think...

In the past, whether we're talking about something like Homecoming or, I mean, the first time I saw her was, I think, like 2014, 2015, The Mrs. Carter Show, which was like the self-titled album, Formation in 2016. I'm often just like, it's like staring at the sun with her. It's this just fully in awe and like struggling to conceive of

Her rigor the precision how can a human being she is a person she's a person she's a sister She's a wife. She's a mother. She's a black woman in America How on earth is she able to achieve this level of excellence and maintain it or even more so out there?

do herself. And I think this has almost been a liability for her, right? Because I think when we begin to idolize or put people on a pedestal, you're ultimately in a way dehumanizing them. And so I've always been like, how can I adore and just be in awe of her, but still make space for her humanity, her vulnerability. And I think she's found it. I mean, even down to the fact that, so this is a spoiler,

There is no opening act for Formation. If you look at like the posters, it's like Beyonce opening for Beyonce. So when she comes out, it's literally like, ladies and gentlemen, presenting Beyonce. And she just comes up in a very simple way on this like little riser. And you're just kind of like, almost like, wait, huh? This is too chill. Where are the bombs? Where are the crystals? And she just kind of comes out and sings ballads for like 30 minutes as her own opener.

And then it's like, and now we're going into club Renaissance. And then she comes out as like a full on femme bod. And it's this like futuristic black Barbie and, and just her smile and the movement. There was just something about the way she's come to understand her relationship to herself and us allowed for an effortlessness. And I've just, my third time seeing her live. I have never danced so much. I have never felt so comfortable in the space she created. It was like,

It was just that thing, and this episode is so much about pride and queerness. It's that way in which when you see someone who has liberated themselves, it can liberate you. That's what it felt like. Well, and so much of the show, when you watch Homecoming, they're all just fighting to stay alive. You know, like it's a great show, but there's a lot of steps to hit. It's like militaristic almost. Yes, whereas she's given herself more space in this show to just really hold court.

So she's still dancing, but there are many moments throughout many of the songs where she hits her steps, then she lets the other step, and she just walks around and looks at her kingdom. She has this strut, this show, where you're just like, she is not bothered and just living life. The strut of confidence that she had throughout the entire performance was...

magical. Magical. And it's also kind of this ability. I was there with, we had a lot of people with us between all of our groups. And one person that was there with me was Raja Feather Kelly, the choreographer of A Strange Loop. And Raja afterwards said to me, I was like, God, I can't believe she does this so much. She's like, I can. She's built a show that is so

like scalable and endurable that she allows herself time to like walk off stage, take a breath, breathe, walk around. And that for me was so exciting because, you know, she was taking care of herself while also entertaining us. And it felt like I wasn't worried about her

like I was when I saw Gaga's show for Chromatica, I was like, there's no way this woman can do this forever. Like she was like barely couldn't sing very much. She was breathing so hard. But Beyonce, what she was doing was so hard, but she has such a strength and awareness of what she has the capacity for. And that capacity is massive that you see it. It's this incredible. It's this different kind of flex because you're right. It's not just like physical movement. I know as a performer, like when you're really at your best is when you're able to kind of imperfect

improvise like when you're able to like still be excellent but like you know she was like her dancers would do something funny and cheeky and I would see her register and then laugh there's a moment and this is gonna get to Sam who saw her twice there's a moment where what because she performed I think five or six nights in London she's on stage and she sees someone in the audience and she says this is your second time here I saw you last night you motivate me that is the level of freedom she has you know because when you're doing like precise dot

You're not able to kind of step out of it and engage and be like, I remember seeing you. Like that's another level. And it's, you know, I think black excellence can be like a barbed wire, but she's found a way to be excellent and at ease. And I now aspire to that.

Oh, yeah. There are some moments in the show and there are clips of this online where one, they have like 30 cameras at all angles in that stadium moving throughout the night to capture. Ooh, that screen. I'm sure there'll be some DVD of some, not because I'm old. There'll be something on the streaming platform. I thought the same thing. I remember having the Beyonce experience DVD in like 2005. Yes.

But the whole show you realize. You just showed her age.

She was floating in a way that was so fun and real. And the music was just amazing. I was most impressed by how it actually was really hard to take everything in. There was one or two songs where I'm like, all right, they're not dancing for this one. Then I pan my eyes out. Lay Twins are on two other stages on the side, popping and locking for the last five minutes. It's so dense. That's part of why I went twice. So full disclosure, y'all. We had tickets for that first night. We went.

And I partied really hard in Club Renaissance. And the next day I was like, I need to listen. Real hard. Real hard. But the next day I wake up and I'm like, Alex, I think we need to go back because I need to be able to retain all of it even better than I did last night.

And I said, can we go back? And he said, yes. And when I went back, it was even better, y'all, because I didn't do Club Renaissance. We got tickets in the bleachers.

And we just ended up surrounded by these black women from LA and New York who were two separate groups, but they had bonded. Then they bonded with us and they loved our story of coming back for a second night. And we just had a big old fun black ass time. And by the time Beyonce got to Before I Let Go, me and these women and Alex too are teaching our whole section the electric slide.

It was magic. It was fucking magic. - An iconic day in London town. I love that. - Yes, yes. - I'm glad you were able to like go back and stuff. 'Cause there's also a thing like, you know, as like a, I think of you as a music critic. And so I'm glad you were able to like get that. But you know, like in "Cuff It," she says at one point, "I wanna go missing."

And like when you're bringing the club to life and she really does make the being on the floor. It just feels like you're at a big nightclub and lo and behold, Beyonce is somehow lording over us as it happens. And when you're really in your body in the moment at a nightclub with your friends and you feel safe, you're not taking in every single angle that happens. You're not going to see, you know what I mean? You're going to meet up with your girls later and have to kind of piece together, you know, you're like, oh, I was in the restroom. What do you mean that?

You know, whatever. And I love that. I think that's true to the album. It just felt like she really found a way to bring Renaissance forth, to bring it into the sense of it being an actual space, which is what we talked about when it first came out. It felt like each track was a different room in a big warehouse party. Yeah. Do we all have a song or a moment we love most that we want to share with people?

It was pure honey. And I have never screamed at a concert so loudly in my life because like they're death dropping, they're twirling, they're moving. And you think they're done and they're like, no. And another one comes out.

another one comes out and you're like, oh my God. And then when you think you can't take anymore, Beyonce comes back on the silver diamond horse and it goes up into heaven. It was gay heaven. It was gay fucking heaven. Yeah. And the production design in that moment is insane because to wrap someone in chrome while light shining on them means that every picture you take of them will look godly because it's reflecting backwards. It was amazing. Saeed, what was your favorite moment? It's hard to beat

what it feels like to be in a crowd and you've kind of made friends as Sam says over the course of the night, not just with your friends, but other people who are near you and the crowd. And then to get to Heated and just she's, and she said, this is my favorite song. She like when she gets to the rap, she's all in, you're all in. It went longer. It went longer, right? It's a whole thing. And it's like this weird thing.

You know, like we're literally all, she's screaming at us, we're screaming at her. You hear the people all saying, you know, like, and just that feeling where you're like, can my body even contain this energy right now? It felt like being at the top of a roller coaster. You know, it was incredible. What about you, Zach? I love that. Yeah.

Heat It was my favorite musical moment for sure, for sure. But I think overall my favorite moment about everything was that TikTok didn't ruin any moments for me. TikTok was so short and bite-sized and what you have to understand going into this show. So don't be afraid to see

That's what I mean the spoilers. It's like you can't spoil you can't really really about like it's like watching when you watch a boiler room The very famous DJ sets that happen that are live-streamed Watching that play on your computer is very different than being at the boiler room dancing with people and to site's point This is a club. This is three hours of dancing So nothing's gonna ruin it watch the clips and get excited to spend, you know hours in the music Yeah, I think it's so magical beautiful. It was a truly

ascendant experience and I'm taking my black ass to go see her in LA as well. And last thing, last thing, the second night, the trains were so full of Beyonce fans. They were like, you got to just walk the last mile.

So Alex and I walked the last mile. It was a lot of walking. A lot of walking. But you're in this sea of humanity of Beyonce fans, old, young, black, white, gay, straight. And you're just amongst all these happy people. And there were cabbies howling out of their cars to the fans walking up. It was like this celebration. And I stopped myself and just said, oh, this is the future liberals want. This is utopia. Beyonce.

Beyonce has built Utopia for us. I wouldn't hate it. The one thing I would tell people is you absolutely need to be wearing tennis shoes or comfortable shoes. You're going to be moving. Whatever stadium you're at, it's going to be a long walk of some kind to leave, whether you're getting your Uber or train. And then you're going to be dancing and standing. So in the same way that you were like if you were going to a music festival, you know what I mean? I just remember seeing some women in stiletto heels and I was like, my God. I saw one guy in a suit. I saw one guy in a suit. And I want to be like, yeah.

Your cousin. That was your cousin. Anywho, listeners, let us know if you've gone to see Beyonce yet and what it was like. And if you haven't gone to Beyonce, tell us when you're going to go see it. You really need to do this. After the break, we're going to switch gears and talk about pride or as I call it this month, Beyonce month. All right, sisters, ladies, when you think of summer, what feels to you quintessentially summer?

I have an answer, but I want to hear from y'all. Festivals. Festivals? Yes. Festivals. Being outside. Music festivals. Getting outside. I love them all the time. And I'm happy to now talk about what I think is the best summer music festival. It is called the Essence Festival of Culture, presented by Coca-Cola. It's back in New Orleans for its 29th year. And let me tell you, if you like music festivals, if you like concerts...

You gotta be there. This is the one. This is the one. This is the one, and it's been the one. The four-day event runs from June 29th through July 3rd. This year's Essence Festival is extra special as it includes a curated 50 years of hip-hop celebration. And they have the most amazing people to help show those 50 years of hip-hop and who has helped pioneer that. They got people like Miss Lauryn Hill,

Missy Elliott, Megan Thee Stallion. They're all performing. And I just, to see those girls together is just iconic to a level I can't even believe. Just getting Lauryn Hill is iconic. Like, come on. The Essence Festival of Culture presented by Coca-Cola has something for everyone. It is truly a multi-generational experience. The kiddos and the aunties and the youths and the elders. And the uncles are invited as well.

Yes. Also, this is great. You can receive special rates on hotels when booking through essencefestival.com. So don't wait. Sign up for a weekend of culture. I like that. A weekend of culture at essencefestival.com.

This message is brought to you by McDonald's. Did you know only 7.3% of American fashion designers are Black? Well, McDonald's 2024 Change Leaders Program is ready to change the face of fashion. The innovative program awards a monetary grant to five emerging Black American designers and pairs each with an industry professional to help them elevate their brands.

I know specifically and distinctly how McDonald's can support and empower not just black Gen Z, but black people. My first job was McDonald's. I learned a lot there about customer service and how to relate to people. I still love that place and go there very often. Look out for the change of fashion designers and mentors.

at events like the BET Awards and the Essence Festival of Culture. And follow the journey of the 2024 McDonald's Change Leaders on their Instagram page, WeAreGolden.

Here's an HIV pill dilemma for you. Picture the scene. There's a rooftop sunset with fairy lights and you're vibing with friends. You remember you've got to take your HIV pill. Important, yes, but the fun moment is gone. Did you know there's a long-acting treatment option available? So catch the sunset and keep the party going. Visit pillfreehiv.com today to learn more. Brought to you by Veve Healthcare.

All right, we're back. All right, so the three of us had already planned to use this week as an opportunity to talk about June being Pride Month. As black queer people who have all worked in media for over a decade now in various capacities and lanes, look, we know how this month works. We know the game. We know the ad campaigns. We know the Pride Month hustles, whether we're talking about corporate pride.

Kink at pride. Self-esteem. Body issues at pride. Class division and straight up racism. Anti-trade. At pride. All of that. There have been years that I can frankly say where I swear I was just so burnt out on the idea of pride. It felt like I navigated the month kind of with my eyes closed. Just like whatever. Whatever. Sometimes it can feel like a holiday. You know, like Christmas and you're just like, whatever. You know what I mean? But this year, it's different.

The stakes for the events, protests, parades, and yeah, even the parties that come to define the month of June for queer people are higher than ever in every way in terms of what they mean, in terms of their visibility, in terms of safety for people.

And to underscore that fact, in a statement released by the Human Rights Campaign on Tuesday morning, the organization declared a national state of emergency for the LGBTQ plus community. HRC noted that this is the first time in their 40-year history – think about what's happened in the last 40 years for queer people in the United States. This is the first time that they've actually issued like a declaration of a state of emergency. So it's big. Yeah.

Sam, Zach, does a state of emergency make sense, feel warranted to y'all? Or to come at it in a different way, are you surprised that it took so long? It makes total sense to me. I mean, I'm reading stories now of queer families and parents of trans kids having to flee certain parts of the country to feel safe.

That is hearkening back to some Jim Crow shit. It is not right. And so I think this state of emergency is real. I think if we were seeing headlines like this about a foreign country...

We would say, oh my god, that nation's in crisis. We have a situation where American citizens are afraid to live where they live just because of who they are. That's wild. And it's not just in one state. It's in many. So it makes total sense. And it also does this really weird thing, for me at least, where it makes –

all of the other arguments in previous pride months seem downright trivial it feels like every pride month there's a big debate you know one year it was like should kink be at pride and the next year it's like should cops be at pride and this year the debate is are they going to kill us all it's crazy and it makes me reconsider how i even want to celebrate pride and part of me is like i don't want to celebrate i want to march i want to protest i want to stonewall this shit

Yeah, to your point about the way U.S. government and U.S. media perceives what happens in other countries, this is an article I just wanted to let people know. You can look it up on your own from Al Jazeera English. The United States is to consider visa restrictions over Uganda's recently passed anti-gay law.

And so, yeah, you're absolutely right. It's kind of like, well, wait a minute. Should the UK consider visa restrictions for US citizens because of drag bans, for example? But Zach, what do you think about this? For me, we have been in a state of emergency for a long time.

I think we've had the facade to act like we weren't. So we had Obama in office. We had Biden just when, and that was the great hope that, you know, we always forget this. Trump argued he was the most LGBTQ friendly president of all time, which just is like not real at all. So Biden being elected, who is one of the most publicly supportive of queer people historically as a Senator, as a vice president, he's the one that like even slipped out to support and push same sex marriage across the line. Cause obviously,

Obama wouldn't say it yet. And Biden slipped up. I was like, I'll do it. He kind of slipped up. He's like, I'll do it. So Biden's like a ferocious supporter of the community. But even with him in office, we have seen more bills than ever before, not only be introduced, but begin to pass in ways that didn't even happen under Trump.

We've seen consistent killings of trans women, specifically black trans women, and it's only increasing more. And now with this migration patterns we've seen, it's just been really interesting to see research come out that showed in the wake of the, you know, 2015 federalization of same-sex marriage, a lot of queer people moved to conservative states, which had never really been seen before. If y'all remember, you know, the It Gets Better campaign with Dan Savage,

the crux of that campaign was you will grow up, you will be queer, it will suck, and at 18, you'll move to a city and you'll leave these conservative places. And what

And what we saw in marriage happened is that that stopped. The thought was, you can go home now. I can be anywhere. Exactly. And now people who stayed home or went back home are fleeing. And not just the people themselves, but their families, their parents, grandparents, caregivers, everyone's leaving. And it just feels so bizarre because it was just a few years ago that we were fighting Trump at the borders trying to let queer asylum seekers in. And now it's like they should even cross the borders because it's

equally as bad here for folks. It just, it does feel like an emergency and I don't know where we go from here. I don't know what to do next, honestly. It's very alarming. And you sent that article to us about families, one, deciding to either to move back home or just like in the case of someone like Saeed Jones being like, oh, I can,

move to Columbus, Ohio. Sure, the politics more broadly in the state of Ohio in 2019 or, but Columbus is a blue jewel like Austin, Texas or Portland, Oregon or Nashville, Tennessee. You can find your place. It felt like with marriage equality and then broader wins regarding LGBTQ rights over the last few years, it was like, gosh, there are just so many more options available to us in terms of places we can live safely.

And now that safety is being, you know, as short lived as it was taken away. And I just, you know, everyone can't afford to move. Everyone shouldn't have to move. And I think we've said that before. And it's just really scary. And particularly, you know, when it's like families, when they're like, well, I'm moving because of my child. I was listening to an interview with Masha Gessen with David Remnick for The New Yorker.

And they were expressing how the moment when they realized they were going to have to leave Russia because lawmakers were specifically targeting Masha and gay families that adopted children. And Masha was like, oh, I've got to get out of here. You know, like, it's not just about me. It's about my child now, you know? And so that's what's going on in that. Yeah, that's totally a state of emergency. And it's like that, like, we used to always focus on these things as emergency.

a thing that happened outside the U.S., even under Bush, et cetera. So you had Russia doing this, Uganda doing this, et cetera, et cetera. And now not only is it here, but it's becoming so muddled with all the other issues at play. So something about why these families are leaving places like Texas and Florida isn't just because they're banning trans kids in healthcare, trans kids in housing or whatever. It's also because gun rights are expanding so rapidly

and that we have seen continued attacks on queer spaces, whether it's in Columbus, down the street from Said, where people are showing up with AK-47s to intimidate Nina West, or Pulse nightclub shootings in Florida, that's only been exasperated in the past few years. Q nightclub in Colorado Springs, Colorado last year. So it's like we're now sitting at the pressure cooker of all of this happening at once. Well, and then even when you think about the stuff that you want to say feels trivial compared to those really big, tough issues,

It's not trivial either. We're also seeing as we enter this Pride month, a lot of corporations being afraid to do Pride. Target has pulled stuff off the shelves. Bud Light is still in trouble for partnering with trans, TikTok celebrity. And you say, well, oh, it's just corporations. They didn't mean this shit anyway. But as we know, a lot of queer people, they rely on Pride for their income.

And a lot of people who partner with a company like Target for Pride, that funds their livelihood the rest of the year. So even though it feels like whatever, when companies like Bud Light or Target or whoever spend less dollars on Pride, that's less money to queer people.

Yeah. I would also say that, you know, in corporate pride is it is a truly complicated, gnarly kind of, well, it's not just bullshit. It's complicated. And the reason for that is something I've always thought about is it's also an opportunity for these corporations to communicate to their own employees.

Like, I remember when working at BuzzFeed early on, I joined BuzzFeed in January of 2013. And so as the first LGBT editor, I was coordinating like our first few pride events and parades and parties and all of that kind of stuff. So it's not just about a corporation communicating to consumers. Right.

I also like, I made it clear that I was like, this is a way to acknowledge people here in the same way with AAPI month or women's history month, Juneteenth. Like, yes, a major component of it is it's a, it's a bid for attention from consumers. It's a way to bring in a different demographic, but it's also like when a company like Delta or whatever, they're also fucking acknowledging the many, many thousands of

of LGBTQIA employees who work for them. And so, you know, I don't want to...

that because generally your companies can't talk about this kind of stuff. You know what I mean? Yeah. And then what's crazy is that it used to be there were corporations who were very much about pride and then corporations that just kind of stayed quiet. Now what we're seeing is a conservative push to actually make these corporations perform anti-queerness. Now it's like, tell us that you don't support these things, that you don't support these people. And I've been seeing...

signs from across the country like mom and pop shops in different parts of the country where they're saying now no trans people allowed that's the kind of time that's being created oh yeah yeah and it's also you know for years we would see protests pop up against brands that were too supportive of queer people so target's one that's been very complicated so 2010 no one imagined they would be as supportive as they are now and then they got in some trouble because they were caught

giving money to some anti-gay people, and then they eventually became the target we know today that's now backtracking on everything. And what we saw through that time of like the target from 2010 to now and getting more in front of queer things is that their support actually helped stop legislation. So famously, North Carolina in 2014, 15, there were the bathroom bills, the very first iteration of them. And because places like PayPal and other major corporations came in and said, we're not bringing jobs here, those bills failed.

And what we're seeing today is corporations not willing to do that type of work to block any legislation because for the first time in the past few decades, these protests against corporations are actually working. So the Bud Light protests that started because of Dylan Mulvaney, the trans social media influencer who just got a few cans with her face on it that weren't even sold in the store. And I do want to acknowledge we don't have time to go all the way into that, but both with the Bud Light campaigns and the Target campaigns,

misinformation was a large part, which makes it even more complicated because it's not even, companies are being targeted, not even for what they're actually doing in terms of corporate pride. They're being targeted by like an anti-trans hysteria. And that's important to acknowledge. - And why that's so important is that it is impacting their bottom line. Misinformation is directly hitting them. So Bud Light was the first beer company I've ever seen in my life actually see money loss because of this.

And that's what has all these corporations scared is that they're actually losing money right now. And then the thing with Target, it's like,

you can get caught up in stuff that isn't even true. So a lot of what started this pushback against Target and Pride was people online were claiming that Target was making tuck-friendly underwear for kids. They've never done that. They make tuck-friendly underwear for adults and tuck-friendly swimsuits for adults. So one lie starts, one conservative online runs with it, and it

ends up stopping an entire company in its tracks. That's what's so crazy about it. And that's like, I think that's the big danger here is that lies are not only moving faster than truth, but they're actually building laws around these lies, which never really happened before. Like this, like we used to be able to swat these things down because people believed in the media and we would fact check them.

them. But now people don't believe in the media as much. They're getting their information from influencers, Twitter profiles that are not verified or being fact-checked. And it's actually causing real harm to not just people, but also bottom lines. And now we're in this situation that feels quite dire. You know, here in Columbus, Ohio, I am very, I am, I'm,

but I'm also like kind of alarmed and worried because Nazis have shown up at drag brunches and children's stories hours, some of which they showed up even when the events are canceled, but they're still there without...

with their flags and sometimes their guns, sometimes getting high fives from cops. And given how much money the city pours into policing, I'm just very scared. So I talked to one of my dear friends here and neighbor, Denzel Porteus, who's the executive director of Stonewall, which is

one of the major LGBTQ organizations here in Columbus. And I just asked him, like, what are you thinking? And he, you know, he started trying to send a voice note and then like typing a text. So he was like, oh my gosh, I have so many thoughts. But he said something that I think is important as a last thought on this, which is that the LGBTQIA community, we have demonstrated in the past that we can come together. The Stonewall riots started one night because of a raid that

and the rage that came in response. But sometimes I think people forget it went on for six days. And it got even larger when the, 'cause a village voice, an incredible detail of the Stonewall riots is that

A village voice reporter somehow managed to slip into the actual Stonewall Inn with the cops when they barricaded themselves in that first night, that first morning. And so then was able to eventually publish an incredible account. And then the riots, which were already intense, got even bigger because people in the community, different people, got up and joined the sex workers, the trans women like Marsha P. Johnson and Sylvia Rivera, the

Unhoused people who were already there. That's why it was able to make such a big impact Solidarity and I love that Denzel was like, yeah, he was like I don't want to be Pollyanna but we have an opportunity basically to tap into our history and

It may be hard to find for some of us, but it is there. It is in us. And I think if we can tap into it, it's a very high-stakes, scary time. But that's the thing about high stakes. You can lose big or you can win big. And I just hope everyone thinks about that.

Well, and one thing I've been thinking of, and I kind of ask myself every year, it's like, what is the ask of pride this year? Like, what is the actual ask? And I feel like it's actually just a debate between like two central questions. Are we asking society to let us in or are we asking society to let us be? Yeah.

And I think for a long time, pride has been a way for us to ask to be let in. We're just like you. Let us get married like you do. We're just like you. Let us be in your corporations. Give us your corporate money. Let us walk the halls of government and let us in. Yeah. We're even willing to ostracize kink, to ostracize and other trans people and sex workers. Yes. And I feel like for me, the move this year, this month with pride is let us be.

Leave us the fuck alone and let us live. I don't want to have a month where we do this thing where we ask for scraps from the rest of society. I want to have pride for me this year, feel like a reclamation of our rights, of our dignity, of our spaces, of our time and our freedom. So for me, the vibe this year is let us be. If you won't let me in, at least let me be.

That's what I want. I mean, the whole allure of tolerance that came in the 90s of, well, just let us be here. We won't bother you. I even hate the word tolerance. I hate tolerance. Don't tolerate me. Love me. I hate it.

Love me or leave me alone. Accept me. Let me be here. And that to tie to the beginning of the show is what Beyonce did. I was just about to say. Again, the album begins with these motherfuckers ain't stopping me as a mantra. She was tapping into that and trying to tell us something. So yeah. Uh-huh.

Pride was a riot, baby, and by all means. And I would just tell people, look, the great thing about Pride Month is it's not just one day. You have an entire month and so many different ways to celebrate. You deserve to party, baby. Go party. You can also go to a parade. You can also go to a community event. You can go to a family event. And then, yeah, I hope you fucking show up at a protest when the opportunity presents itself. You contain multitudes, and I want you to think about how you can activate multitudes

all of your various capacities this month. You know what I mean? You don't just have to sit back. It ain't just a party. You don't have to just sit back. Yeah. Well, we're going to take a break from there, and then we will check in about Pride Month on the other side of Pride events where we've all gotten to go and see what actually happens. But for now, we'll take a break, and when we come back, we'll talk about recommendations. ♪

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All right, we are back. And before we end the show, we'd each like to share something that's helping us keep our vibes right or throwing us off this week. I think this week is keeping them right. I hope. We're keeping them right. That's what we're trying to do. So with that, Saeed, what's keeping your vibes right this week?

Yeah. So one of the many wonderful things I got to do in London was go to the Tate Britain Museum and see the Isaac Julian show. And Isaac Julian is an incredible black gay British filmmaker who's been making great work since the 80s. I remember first learning about his iconic film Looking for Langston, which is this

black and white Harlem Renaissance Fantasia. And you actually hear Toni Morrison's voice at the beginning reading something. You hear James Baldwin. Obviously, we get some Langston Hughes. And just the story of making the film, the Langston Hughes estate, which is pretty anti-gay, um,

fought tooth and nail against Isaac Julian to get this work made. And so that was something that I often think about, like in a state literally trying to suppress a part of Langston Hughes's legacy, which is just like what an impressive thing

act of hate and yet the film is here. So yeah, I think if you're in London, I would recommend going to the Tate Britain to see what freedom is to me. That's the name of the show. But also you can like look up and learn about his work elsewhere. And just one thing I want to say quickly about the way it's set up that I thought was very beautiful is so Isaac Gillian has made five or six pretty iconic films. And so it's kind of like you walk in and it's this beautiful, like all white hub. And then there are these like five or six hallways.

that go off, each with a different colored carpet and walling. And so it's almost felt like you're inside this artist's brain and you're like, which neural pathway do I want to choose? Oh, I love that. There's a show about immigration. There's a show inspired by Frederick Douglass and obviously looking for Langston's there. And it was really cool. And again, just thinking of that huge image of Uncle Johnny at the end of the Renaissance show, to see a black queer person

artists imagination just on this scale was really moving. - I love that. And looking for Langston is, I took a queer theory class my freshman year of college and it is so, so good. Like it is, Isaac Julian is, and he's still alive. - Still alive, still making work. - Thank God he's still here. And we love, we love, we love. Sam, what's keeping your vibes right this week?

So I actually have two things now that I think about it. I want everyone to go read that piece in The Atlantic, the profile of Chris Licht, the new head of CNN. It's wild. It's full of drama. Pooped and gagged. There's a moment in the piece where the reporter has followed him to the gym with his personal trainer. And while working out very heavily, Chris Licht says, I bet you Zucker couldn't do this, referring to his CNN predecessor. That's so sweet.

Just the petty of it all. The whole thing is a gag. Straight men are not well. Read it, read it, read it. They're not well. But what I really want to recommend is a movie I saw as soon as I got back to New York on Sunday to stay up and avoid jet lag. I went to see this movie with my friends, Caitlin and Daniel. It's a new film called Past Lives.

It's a small indie courthouse film starring Greta Lee, who many of you know from Russian Doll. She is the exuberant best friend on that show who always says, happy birthday, baby. Well, now she's a serious actress, and this movie hits you real hard. It's all about two young people in Korea who might have been lovers, but one moved away. They reunite in adulthood, and it all comes to this climax in one pivotal scene where

at a bar in New York and before you know it, you're not just weeping in the theater. You are thinking about every misconnection you've had in your own life.

It's heavy. I love it. It starts out real slow, but once it hits you, baby, it pulls your heart out. Go see it. Past lives. I have been waiting to see this movie forever, and I'm still so mad that no one at age 24 has invited us to see a screener of this because this movie is like my shit, a romance. It's deeply emotional and feelings and considering other paths you could have taken with a random person from

you know, you know, five is just so good. And it's getting incredible reviews. It's being called one of the great romance films of the past 50 years. So it will get under your skin. And like, it was one of those movies where I wasn't just to myself, like, Oh, we were like all of us in our section. We're like, Oh damn. Oh damn. Like holding each other. Like literally. And then the movie's over. We all go outside to the lobby. Everyone's in tears. And everyone has to like, take a beat to just stand there. Go see this film. Well,

I'm going to see it this week, so I'm going to talk about it next week with you. Zach, what's your rec? So mine is a bit of a surprise to me because I have avoided the show for a long time, so I haven't seen it. But it's a show called The Boys on Amazon. And, you know, I like superhero things, but this I didn't know. And the show's premise is that you're following a group of superheroes. They live in a world where superheroes are kind of everywhere, but they all work for a corporation called Vought. And it's kind of this critique of –

but this exploration of what would it actually be like if superheroes existed and how they probably wouldn't be so great. They'd probably be deeply messed up, kind of addicted to drugs sometimes. God complex. God complex. And how, and how, yeah, it's like what it would actually be for like them just as people. Cause it's like these powers, like,

Yeah.

Yeah. So it's a lot, it deals with a lot of big questions in the, through the lens of a superhero, which are really fascinating. But I think it's perfect for this week. If you're really vibing with our conversation on corporations and freedom and what the role of a corporation is, because all shows about these privatized superheroes that work for one corporation and how it may not be as it seems. And it may not be for the better good of people, but better for capitalism at the end. So it's a really fantastic show. You should check it out. Full disclosure. And I love the show. I've watched all three seasons. It's,

It is the most violent and gross show. Like they take it as far. I mean, they're like, what would superheroes have sex like? For example, if there was a superhero who could like shrink to being the size of an ant, what would he use that ability for in a very adult way? So I just, I just, if you're going in blind and just like, oh, I want to make it very clear. It's not just like a interesting satire. They take it.

as far as far as possible yeah it's really graphic and there is a sex scene where someone dies in the first season in a very graphic way so yeah it really takes this idea of superheroes and makes it so real that you're cringing the whole time so check it out if you're interested and Tim I'll talk to you about it I need to talk to someone about it well listeners what are you feeling or not feeling this week what's your vibe check in with us at vibecheck at stitcher.com

Thank you for tuning in to this week's episode of ViCheck. If you love the show and want to support us, please make sure to follow the show on your favorite podcast listening platform, tell a friend, and come see us in Boston and New York in a couple of weeks. You better come see us in Boston and New York or I will come find you. We swear it's optional. No, it ain't. No, it ain't. Listen.

Huge thank you to all of our listeners coming to our show. Also, huge thank you to our producer, Chantel Holder, engineer Brendan Burns, and Marcus Holm for our theme music and sound design. Also, special thanks to our executive producers, Nora Ritchie at Stitcher and Brandisha Sharp from Agenda Management and Production.

Not Brandisha Shaw. Brandisha Shaw! Leave it in. Deeply inside joke. We will not erase. We will not stand for Brandisha Erasure. Listen. Listen. Yes. And listeners, as always, we want to hear from you. Don't forget you can email us at vibecheckatstitcher.com and keep in touch with us on Instagram at at Zach Staff, at Sam Sanders, and at The Ferocity. You can also use the hashtag

Hashtag vibecheckpod. Anywhere. Anywhere. But especially Twitter. I feel like that's the best place it works, sadly. And with that, stay tuned for another episode next week on Wednesday. Goodbye. Bye. Stitcher.

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