Bilbao Pressure Builds – United’s Season Rests on This Game | The Midweek Debate
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Hello and welcome to the Manchester is Red podcast. This is an edition of the Midweek Debate. My name is Stephen Ralston, as I'm sure you're probably aware, and I'm joined by my partner in crime, as usual, Tyrone Marshall, for today's episode. It's all about the Europa League at the moment with United, who play Bilbao on Thursday night. So this podcast is only going to probably be out for 24 hours before that game. So we're going to sink our teeth into that, talk a bit about European football and a

A specific quote from Ruben Amrum that was made two weeks ago, but we'll get onto that in a second. I'll begin by asking Tyrone Marshall how he is because we do that on this podcast, don't we, Ty? We do. It's a friendly podcast, Stephen. Yeah, I'm good. Thank you. That was a very egotistical intro as well. I'm Stephen Railson. I'm sure you know who I am by now. Very unlike you, Stephen, when people in the office, when they hear you've been egotistical, people will be amazed. Yeah.

um i've got a haircut today so i'm feeling myself maybe that's what it is yeah yeah and the sun's out so you know i've got a little bit of a tan going on the end of the season holiday coming up soon feeling quite happy ty feeling optimistic good good let's get yourself in optimistic on friday morning um you could do with some sun and a haircut as well to be fair so maybe hopefully you get some time to improve your appearance uh as the summer comes in right football uh

less of the bad crack from us and the bad, that was particularly bad. We're going to talk about a call, as I said, from two weeks ago in a press conference, he actually said it ahead of the Leon game, the second leg at Old Trafford. And he said, if you look at this moment, we are not ready to be really competitive in the Premier League and cope with the Champions League.

But if you play in one club, you should fight for this competition. I mean, that second bit doesn't really make too much sense without the rest. But he's essentially saying United aren't ready for the Champions League because of where they are, the squad they have.

They will sign players this summer and things will change. Of course, to get into the Champions League, they need to win the Europa League because that will grant entry into that. What did you think about that, Cooks? It's interesting really, isn't it? I get what he's trying to say. However, for me, the pros of qualifying for the Champions League completely outstrip the negatives. I mean, players, commercial revenue, it all kind of rolls into one. And United simply need to be in European competition next season for me. And their only route is the Champions League.

Yeah, I mean, I thought it was interesting at the time when he said it. And I remember, I don't think it really made much people's copy ahead of the, I think it was the Lyon second leg, wasn't it? And I don't, I remember him saying it in the press conference. I don't recall it making many headlines on the Thursday in previews and things like that. But I remember it being interesting because it was something I hadn't really considered, to be honest. I think we've all just thought they've got to win the Europa League to get in the Champions League. And it,

It did kind of make me think, and it's made me think since, and I've considered writing a piece on it, but not really the right time. And if they win it, maybe there'll never be a right time now. But I thought it was interesting in that I think everyone is like, they've got to win this. They've got to win this. They've got to win this. And it was almost like Amarim saying, I've looked through the quotes. I thought he said more about it, to be honest, but I can't find it. And I may be in a different press conference, but Amarim,

It's almost like you're absolutely right. They need the hundred plus million. United should be in the Champions League. It will give them a wider pool of players.

But at the same time, this team are miles from the Champions League. And one advantage it will have is that it'll give them three midweeks in training next week to make a big difference, to bed this system in. Yes, you've got to balance that with having better players. You know, the Champions League will be huge to United's revenue and transfer budget, but they've still got the same sort of PSR concerns. And, you know, the example it made me think of was Chelsea, I

under Antonio Conte when he won a title in his first season pretty unexpectedly. And there is a difference there in that they'd won the league two years previously. It had fallen apart under Mourinho, not because the squad weren't good enough, but because of other kind of issues, really. I think maybe the squad, you know, wasn't of the standard you expect from league winners. And then it drifted and Mourinho got sacked that year. They finished 10th, didn't qualify for...

for any european football it kind of felt like chelsea's era was over and then conte comes in changes to a back three and wing backs and don't have any midweek games because they're not in europe gets all that training time to implement this different system teams couldn't work it out and they won the league with victor moses and marcus alonso at wing back and a lot of that i think was that they had those free midweeks i'm not saying that if united they're going to win the league very underrated win back those by the way i thought in those rules they were excellent in those specific yeah yeah i would agree with that yeah

But it just made me think that maybe it won't be the disaster

We all kind of think it as if they don't win the Europa League. Well, United fans aren't... Let's say they progress through this tie against Bilbao in the next week and they go back to Bilbao for the final and they lose that game, whether that be against Tottenham or Bordeaux-Glimpse. I don't think United fans are going to return to Manchester on the flight and think, well, we've got a few midweeks next season, that'll help. Well, that's the reality of it. I get your point because it's a fact. It will help and it would benefit next season having that extra time in training. Just look at Newcastle. I think they're a good example this season who...

struggled with Champions League um came out of the competition didn't have Europe this season and now they're back at the top of the Premier League again currently in third so it clearly is a huge yeah it's hugely helpful but this is United here and where they want to go the players they want to sign they have to be in Europe's premium competition don't they uh I mean the figures that the financial figures were released the last couple of months of 2024 recently I've just got it up here um

Broadcasting revenue declined by 42% to £61 million. And that's because United were in the Europa League, not in the Champions League. So, I mean, if they completely come out of all European competition, it's going to really damage the financial picture, which is already looking rather bleak. Yeah, I mean, you're absolutely right. Financially, it's huge. The financial picture is bleak. I guess a bit of that, there's the 25% wage cuts built into player contracts, which makes a bit of a difference.

they wouldn't need to carry such a big squad next year if they weren't in europe but financially you know there's no getting away from it it's it's not just like you say it's not just your opening to champions league it's nothing to champions league it's probably a hundred million pound plus in revenues but you know i guess the counter argument to that is how long will they be in the champions league for we've got to remember i mean when was the last time they did anything in the champions league it's probably uh 20

2018, 19, I think it was, wasn't it? The, the,

marino solskjaer season when solskjaer had the win against psg and you know that was i mean the group stage there was some decent moments in the group station they won in juventus um the psg game was obviously spectacular they didn't they didn't lay a glove on barcelona in the quarterfinals messi was magnificent yeah and you know beyond that they've done nothing in the champions league for years beyond that and every time they get in it they don't really look like doing anything different no but it's it's more just attracting players isn't it especially this summer

if united are in europe and there's already been murmurs of your favorite player your favorite potential signing liam de la considering his options ahead of the summer which any football i would do seeing which clubs are in which european competitions it's just a no-brainer if you're in the champions you're going to be a more attractive proposition and as well you would have done it on the back of a trophy win so if you can turn around and say look we're being crap but we've still won a european trophy which it's just it's still blowing my mind that watching that game at bournemouth for the weekend

and that team is probably quite likely not to have too many changes for bill bow the fact that that side could win a major european trophy is mental it's going to be incredibly humiliating for the rest of europe if it's a united tottenham final i think i think we you know we both sat here in

January, February when the knockout stages were getting underway and I remember points going on the fact that he even beat Real Sociedad and here they are on the brink of a semi Tottenham are in the semis brink of a semi brink of a semi yeah almost not at the moment not sat with you but you know and here they are both on the brink of a final now and it's you know it's not a good look

for the rest of Europe that the Premier League's, what, 14th and 16th, are they in the table, can be in this position. Albeit both, I think, have got difficult semifinals and wouldn't surprise you yet if it was an athletic Bodo Glimp final. But, you know, the other thing to mention about this whole

it's not a case of should they win it or should they not obviously they should win it it's is there a silver lining to them not winning it yeah and i guess you'd say you know you use newcastle an example there and united fans will rightly hate me using newcastle as an example but it's kind of relevant i guess given the state where this united squad is at so they do win it they get in the champions league this year they've got all those extra games yes they improved the squad how much they improved the squad by i still don't think it's going to be

astronomical improvements. So they get in the Champions League, it hurts them to a degree of a few points next season and they miss out again the season after. Is that beneficial to long-term planning or would they get to a position where the Champions League regulars every season quicker if they don't qualify this year and he has a full season of training next year? I don't think it would have a hugely detrimental effect because

We just talked about on the last podcast, their goal for next season. It's probably top eight, isn't it? Top six would be ideal, of course. But top seven, top six, obviously more European places now with the way it's working. Is that going to change whether they're in the Champions League or not? That goal? It's not really. And theoretically, you'd sign better players because you're in the Champions League. So it would be easier to finish in the top seven or top eight. Yeah, I guess it's not. The problem is, and...

it's almost like the united free the champions league like the hooky-coky in recent years they're in and they're out they're in and they're out they're in and they're out and if that happens again

It's almost like they have these one-off seasons where they get in the Champions League, do absolutely nothing in it, and then they end up back in the Europa League or nothing. And they need to build to a position where they are top four, top five again every season, rather than just having a successful season or having a season where they win the Europa League, getting into the Champions League, haven't got a good enough squad, make a mess of it, go out in the league phase, go out and do nothing.

go out, maybe go out in the playoff phase and then the following season they're not in the Europa League. In a way, I think, I know Amrim said on Friday everyone wants to play for Manchester United.

I think there's a degree of that still, but not to the case that was a decade ago. You know, I've said it countless times on this podcast, the young players you're targeting now, the 18, 19, 20 year olds, have you got any memories of United winning the league? Certainly not the Champions League. And when they're in for a season and do nothing, and then they're out, and then they're in and they do nothing, and they're out, I don't think that's particularly appealing to the elite level players that you're trying to attract. What looks better to them is that you're challenging players

top four top five every year in the premier league and look you know i in a way i guess i'm

I don't, I'm debating for debating sake here. It's obviously better they win it. But I can see where he's coming from, that there's maybe a silver lining if they don't win it. And it's not as disastrous as it might feel at the time. I'm interviewing Luke Littler later, which will be quite fun. But he's 18, obviously, well-documented. And he was five years old when United last won the title. Yeah. Which is incredible when you think about it. He's probably not got any memory of that at all, really, in 2013. I mean, there's a big kind of debate around

a little debate to be had around ruben amram then because we talked about if he doesn't win this trophy the europa league he goes in the next season he's going to be backed in the transfer window and if results continue to be bad and there's a bit of a sticky patch let's say in the october international break the pressure will start to build and the fingers will be pointed

If, however, he wins the Europa League, it just changes the feel, doesn't it, around the club? The fact that, yes, they've had a crap six months, but they've still won a trophy. And Amram can point towards that. Well, I've delivered a European trophy.

in this rubbish season back me and the feeling is a lot better going into next season. The pressure isn't as intense and the scrutiny on those performances. So it's going to be hugely beneficial in a lot, a lot of ways, isn't it? If they do win the Europa League. Yeah, it is. I feel like we're getting into a proper, I feel like I'm just debating you for the sake of the midweek debate now. Everything you say, I'm going to disagree with.

you know, I guess. - Well, we're actually agreeing with each other, aren't we? - I think we probably do agree with each other. We're just doing a really good job of making it look like we don't. You know, the counter argument to that is that yes, they win it. They get into the Champions League. Next season is tricky as we still think it will be. And not only are they maybe eighth, struggling a little bit in the Premier League, but they finished 16th in the league phase of the Champions League, say, because Amarim's right and it is too soon for them.

In a way, that looks worse on him than having a decent run in the Europa League this year and not getting into the Champions League. Because then it's the total, it's the kind of, not the unknown, isn't it? But, you know, flopping in the Champions League next year

won't be good for Amarim. And yeah, you can say, well, I want the Europa League to get here. Could they actually flop? I mean, this United side could, but see if they win the Europa League and added a few quality players. Oshman, for example, a midfielder, a natural right wing back. You look at the extended Champions League table this year, 36 teams. I mean, some of the crap who finished outside the playoffs, Dynamo Zagreb, Stuttgart, Shakhtar Donetsk,

Bologna, Strum Graz, Sparta, Prague. You get my point. There's these very Europa League feeling teams who are in the Champions League. Yeah, but look at their playoff round. Man City versus Real Madrid. Paris Saint-Germain were...

45 minutes away from elimination against Manchester City and they'd have gone out in the league phase and now they're on the brink of a final. I think finishing outside the top 24 in the Champions League would clearly be almost impossible for Manchester United. Yeah, I agree. But finishing 9th to 24th I think would be extremely likely.

And anyway, I think you could easily kind of in the luck of the draw a little bit, isn't it? But they could easily finish in the, in the bottom half of that playoff round, get a difficult play out, playoff draw, or even a reasonably standard playoff draw and go out in the playoffs. And yeah,

you know it'll be up to people to judge their next season whether that's a success or not um it's very difficult to see them against the quarterfinals or beyond in the champions league and you know i like say i well the way that i do they win and we get to see yeah the intelligence where he's coming from the intelligent way to word it as you've been doing is well the counter argument would be yeah yeah and that implies you don't actually believe it but we're just we're talking about the nuances of it and i don't you know i don't think hammer him sat there going like oh god i hope we lose the ball yeah um this would be a disaster if we got to the champions league

It's more that, like I say, before we mentioned it against Lyon, I'd not really considered that there was any positives or silver linings to it. And it did kind of make me think again. He probably doesn't believe it himself. He's just seeing it. I don't know. There's a PR angle there, isn't there? I think he does believe it himself. And I think a lot of these modern coaches that are so training ground intensive about improving teams and improving players,

I mean, they play eight games in the league phase, wouldn't they? You're looking at maybe an extra 24,

I don't know, 20 training sessions before Christmas? - But you're talking about that time. Has he not had enough time, right? Because he's come in the middle of the season, which hasn't been ideal, obviously, and he didn't want to do that, but he was forced to. So he's had this block of time with players who a lot of them might not be here, and he'll sign his own players. And then in the summer, finally, he'll have a full pre-season to get his message, well, his message isn't already across, to fully kind of drill it into them and work on things that he wants to.

so you'll have a full preseason behind them why does he need this free midweek to to for that it's more for the angle for me that would be a positive because it's the time to rest and recover instead of the time to actually get his message to the players because that should be yeah it should be it should be there now i mean even if they don't qualify for the champions league there will be new signings weren't there i think yeah you know i think that's inevitable that there's going to be new signings there's going to be there's going to be churn in that squad they're going to

They're going to sell. They're going to sell the three forwards we talked about last week. They're going to bring new forwards in. There's going to be change at wing-back. There's probably going to be change at midfield, whatever happens. So, the chance to work with those players. The rest is a big thing. Not as big. You know, I guess the biggest benefit is that whatever happens, they can't be in the Europa League next season. Because that's the biggest season killer. Luke Shaw will be available for every game. Yeah, and you can also operate with a much smaller squad. You know, he could get... They could...

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Gotta tell you, that's a real vibe. You got great taste as a listener, and I notice you like a lot of variety too. So I know you'll like a refreshing ice cold McAllister's Famous Tea. You can get it lots of different ways. Unsweet as lemonade tea or with a flavor shot like black cherry or strawberry or peach. We got all that good taste coming your way at McAllister's Deli. Variety is on the menu. Vitamin Water was born in New York because New Yorkers wanted more.

Like more flavor to go with all the flavor. A refreshing drink after climbing six flights of stairs to a walk-up apartment or standing in the subway station in 100 degree heat. Focus when I have an eight-hour shift and triple X after I was out all night at a club. Call triple X. Drink vitamin water. It's from New York. By replacing them, you can operate with a smaller squad. The rest is a fair point. I think the training...

you know you'd like to say you go back to Conte and Chelsea I think the training ground time made a huge huge difference to that season and the success they had in that season and I think certainly when a team is in kind of like its embryonic stage I guess this United side is under Amorim not being in Europe can be a significant advantage I think um

So I can see, you know, I think he probably does. I think he clearly wants to win the Europa League, wants to be in the Champions League. You would hope so, yeah. Maybe we'll find out by team selection in the second leg. But yeah, I think, I do think that he's, I don't think he's saying this just for effect. I think he would see reasons that it's not, it's not the be all and end all. United's build up to the Bilbao game, obviously they played Bournemouth last weekend. Yeah.

when I thought about the game in my head last few days when I write out the result of my articles I've almost wrote out 1-0 loss to Bournemouth because that's almost kind of how it felt I suppose fantastic to salvage a point in the end does the result

really matter that much. It's inconsequential, isn't it? In terms of the league. Huge inconvenience for Wrighton to be honest. Yeah, I mean, I can imagine. I did think that. I mean, it's hugely important for Rasmus Hoyland and he looked very relieved to score that goal. And Luke Shaw kind of provided the assist. I know it came off manual. You got it, didn't it? But he played the cross into the box and I thought it was worth touching on him briefly. I know we just did because he started the game a left centre-back in the free. He'd exclusively played

in the back three under Aram so far. They obviously had a run of appearances from the bench in November time before picking up a fresh injury. But in the second half, when United were pushing to equalise after that red card, Shaw was moved to left wing back. And for me, he looked so much better. He had a really poor start to the game, but I thought he recovered after that and looked more dangerous.

And I just think he has to start there on Thursday night, tomorrow night, at left wing back. I think I'd personally keep the same back five, but I'd tweak the positions, put Shaw at left wing back and Dogu at right wing back with Masuari in the right side of the three. Because of what Shaw gives you in attacking scenarios, he is the best wing back in that dressing room for me when he's at his best because of what he's able to do in those attacking and defensive scenarios. And we've seen it for England in major tournaments, how brilliant he is roaming forward.

the Euro 2020 final. Fantastic goal, wasn't it, against Italy? So would you agree with that assessment? Do you think he should start him at left wing back? I mean, I'm not sure if he did end the game at wing back, to be honest. It was so confusing. I mean, he was confused himself. The amount of times he looked over to Amarim and asked where he was playing. It was almost like Amarim threw on a second striker and then no one had a clue what was going on. Like Amarim spent more time

Like one moment, Shaw went to left wing back. Then he appeared to come back to centre half. Then Igata went into centre back. Then Garnaccio was like... Well, at that point, it is very fluid, isn't it? It was very fluid. He was in a lot more advanced positions. Yeah, he was in advanced positions. And I think he might still be normally the left-sided centre back, but there was three centre backs for zero forwards at times. And he got forwards really well. Even before the cross for the goal, he put in one really dangerous ball. His crossing's good.

I don't think he'll play wing-back purely because he played 90 minutes on Sunday and that definitely wasn't in the plan. I think to have played 75 minutes and 90 minutes in his first game's back is not what United wanted at all. I mean, he wouldn't have come on

against Leon at half time. I mean, I'm not a medical scientist. I'm not on the club coaching medical staff. He's had so many muscle problems. Yeah, and I've actually criticised that playing him in quick succession, but it's the fact that he's been gradually brought along the last few weeks. He has been in the squad now for a few weeks. He's made appearances. He's got his first 90 minutes under his belt. Ideally, I mean, I've mentioned it. It's not ideal starting a player in quick succession on the back of a muscle injury, but if it's just this once,

I don't think it's the end of the world. If he started again at the weekend and then he started again, then it would become a problem. But surely he can do it once. Well, it depends, doesn't it? I mean, it might be just this once, but he might tear his hamstring racing down the left wing in a wingback role. I don't think anyone would be surprised if that happened. And, you know, given the data medical teams, elite clubs have on players and fitness these days, you know, like I said,

The 75 minutes against Lyon weren't planned because Masraoui had to go home at half-time. Lindelof was coming on, had to go home at half-time. Shaw, A, gets 45 minutes he wasn't expecting, then gets half an hour. That took so much out of him, he wasn't in the squad at all against Wolves. Then he plays against Bournemouth and plays 90 minutes, which Samarim has said wasn't in the plan. I think he'll start purely because I don't really think

there's anyone else. I don't, you know, I can't, we're not the squad. But you'd rather have him in the back three. I think he'll play in the back three rather than at wing back. So is that predominantly on fitness concerns instead of kind of technical and positional? A little bit, but I also think he can do a lot of what you get and a lot of what you're talking about

from a kind of left centre-back role. You don't play three centre-backs to mark one defender. The crosses, isn't it? They're absent. He's very good in build-up play and there's little passing triangles on the left side of the free. The cross he put in before the goal came from kind of the position you'd expect a left centre-back to move into, like from a slightly deeper area. Yeah.

you know i i still think he'll play dog who on the left and and masrawi on the right the interesting thing at training today was that those two so when they start out and do the the rondos dog with masrawi went separately to do their own thing and united clarified it wasn't kind of fitness concerns it was more like load management and things like that but it did kind of give me the impression that maybe they're going to be the wing backs the fact that they're doing different things it's it's the most intensive role in the squad um i can see

with Dorgo and Masraoui being wing-backs and then not playing against Brentford. I think that's got a pretty decent chance. But I still think he'll play Shaw, that left centre-back role. And to be honest, I do think he's a good wing-back. I also think he's a really good left-sided centre-back. And I think, you know, I think Amarim, like a lot of managers, would want a left-footer, especially in a back three. So, yeah, I think he'll stay there. I mean, the team was interesting at the weekend, wasn't it? Because it felt like it would be very close to something that we're going to see tomorrow night against Bilbao.

maybe two changes maximum I'm thinking or maybe just one to be fair I mean I've got it up here so you got it with potentially coming to side for Cobby Manning yeah that's what I was thinking as well obviously with Fernandes and Gannaccio and the number 10 rules and then the same back five that we just talked about

We talked about Man Utd the other week and I was kind of advocating for him to be dropped back into the pivot. Shout out to Mr. Lockhurst, Samuel Lockhurst, who loves the word pivot. In a deeper position, I just feel he's still got more to give, as I explained. And he was, he was moved back there. It's hard to really say anyone had a brilliant game against Bournemouth. I thought it was a pretty meh performance again, but...

there was sparks from me anyway i think in the first half he went on a little run down the left um ironically in the kind of position he'd find himself in the number 10 room yeah but what i think is brilliant and why i think he needs to play there is he's so good at facing his goalkeeper picking up the ball and turning he's incredibly press resistant he's just amazing at that isn't it so that is so useful when you're trying to build up from the back yeah yeah and that's why i think he's got to play there going forward a bit more yeah i i

You know, I was pretty skeptical that it would happen and then sure enough, it did happen a few days later. So I'm listening to the podcast. You finally talked up a point there.

I still don't know long term. I mean, it was quite... I tweeted it within the first minute and I noticed in the warm-up that Mainu seemed to be to do that kind of five-a-side box game in the warm-up now. And Mainu was deeper with Casemiro and it looked like he was going to play that role. But it was so fluid at times that it was hard to tell exactly where he was. I thought he started all right and then got worse, to be honest. I thought there was some really... There was a few sloppy passes. There was a moment in the second half where he kind of...

It kind of went in to tackle the ball, but gave it away. It was a little bit half-hearted maybe. And it was kind of right in front of us. And obviously it's a small stadium at Bournemouth. We're right near the dugout. And you could hear Amarim just shout, copy! And you could sense like, it came off a few minutes later. I don't think he came off for that. I think he came off because these were pre-planned, pre-planned sobs, that triple change. But yeah, I don't know. I still get the, I guess I'll get the feeling that Amarim is not entirely sure about

how best to use him. I think he needs a run...

consistent run of games in that role or if he's going to stick by the number 10 position which I don't think is advisable he needs just to be given right this is your position you're going to play here for a month a month and a half and we're going to make a decision because when you mess players around and you tweak their position as Manu has been in the last two months I mean playing up front and then he's been playing on both sides actually of the number 10 he's been playing occasionally on the right and then occasionally during the game he'll get moved to the left position it's just not good for finding your rhythm and for momentum is it it's much easier to kind of

give the best account yourself if you're in a settled role yeah well i think his last his last three starts or three of his last four starts now have come in different positions and you know versatility can be a benefit but also when you kind of reach the age that manu is now it's it's a hindrance really and i think you know the contract talks are still ongoing and united still say they're confident

The fact is they're clearly difficult talks. Otherwise it would have been done and signed and sealed by now. And you wonder if now Mainu is, I don't think there should have been an issue 12 months ago when these talks started. I mean, it's gone on for 14 months now. I mean, I was told in March last year, I was looking, it's almost May. So 14 months. But a long time. And now it's a fresh kind of issue that he's probably saying,

where's my future in this team where do you see me playing and it does feel like amarin kind of needs to say this is what you are and at the moment it feels like he doesn't really know what what he is and i think

I think he's unsure. Well, I know he's unsure about his defensive work because he said it in a press conference. I think he really likes his ability to operate. You mentioned that press resistance and operating in small spaces. That's a great attacking weapon as well. As we saw against Lyon, the shot he had against Bournemouth was quick feet. Nobody in that squad right now can do what he does in that sense where they can face Andre and Arna, pick up the ball, maybe Christian Eriksen to be fair, but he's leaving...

on the expiry of his contract this summer pick up the ball turn be press resistant and find the right pass casimiro's not that good at it you got it it's not his strength i think casimiro's passing is decent there maybe but you rarely see him coming short for it and turning kind of drop a shoulder and the bigger issue is i mean i wouldn't play mainu in that position now for that because the rest of them can't play out from the back it is

amateur hour when those lot try and play out from the back it really is but if that's their long-term kind of approach and what he wants to do and how he sees them playing it ain't going to work with these players every game five minutes in i'm running to go into anana

like that not very good for an audio format but basically pointing just go long and you saw it again like five minutes in against Bournemouth he's like Andre Andre like boot it a lot of impressions of Amram did they yeah yeah there is quite a few yeah yeah I have to work on my Portuguese um and then obviously they play out from the back from that free kick and I mean that was

That was like amateur teams don't concede goals like that. It was. And Arne comes out to take that free kick and scoffs a pass backwards to his centre-half who's five yards from him. Gives Sean no option but to go to Dorgu. By this point, everyone in that Bournemouth team knows where it's going and can just press Dorgu. Like there's no...

The way the ball was played, the fact it was bobbling, the body position of players, it was obvious what was going to happen. What frustrates me about that is someone takes some bloody responsibility. It went to three different players. All three of them made the wrong choice, really. They're all kind of accountable in some sense. At one point, you just have to go along. Yeah, I think it starts with Inanna. Inanna plays a really bad ball to short. It's a simple ball. And it kind of...

It only really gave Shaw the one option, rather maybe the two options, like you launch it or you go to Dorgu. And then when you go to Dorgu, like I say, by that point, from the body position of the players, it was so obvious where it was going to go that before Shaw's played that pass, Bournemouth are moving in for the kill to press. And that's why you see them very occasionally play out from the back. They'll get it wrong a couple of times and Amarim will just do that whole Andre, Andre, point, and it goes long again.

We'll stick with Anana then because I actually fought back to David De Gea yesterday against Sevilla April 2023, two years ago. How was that two years ago, by the way? It's flown by, hasn't it? It really has. De Gea had a really, really bad game in Spain that night.

For me, he was mostly at fault for that pass, if fans remember, to Harry Maguire, because he could see the whole pitch. The pass wasn't on. He still made it. Maguire obviously played a role and Sevilla scored within 10 minutes. And then the third goal as well. Can you remember how bad that mistake was when Sevilla punted it forward? De Gea came for the ball, seemed to forget how to use his legs and mishit it. It was really embarrassing. There was a lot of pressure, kind of, sorry, conversations about De Gea's future at that time, about whether he should be given a new contract. He was obviously let go

There is kind of a similar discussion around Andre Nana, again, going into a knockout tie in the Europa League with pressure around United's goalkeeper. We've kind of said in this podcast continually that

the can should probably be kicked down the road with them um but i feel like these next few weeks could will and could decide his future because if he messes up like they did at the business end of the season they made that are in the epic up final as well um then you think the writing would probably be on the wall and it would be a priority instead of something that's down the list yeah remember the shades of the hair because i think around the time of that severe game and probably building up to that

Ten Hag was of the view that you could kick the can down the road and that he would stick with De Gea and then the season ends so badly for De Gea makes a mistake in the cup final and it just changes Ten Hag's mind and De Gea's gone and in comes Inan so maybe there's

Maybe there's kind of elements of that here. Again, I think the can probably will be kicked down. It feels like he just doesn't have, if he doesn't make a mistake, it feels like some high profile errors in the running. It feels like the number one one. I mean, the biggest issue is that when he came, his super strength and what we were told is super strength is he's playing out from the back. And I know United haven't really got the structures and the players to do it a lot of the time.

We just haven't really seen any of it. You don't see him being comfortable in possession when that's what he's supposed to do. And, you know, he's made some incredible saves this season. There's no doubt about it. But there's also been way too many mistakes. But he's going to have to perform in these two semifinals for sure. Because I think, you know, Atletico are certainly favourites to win this tie. And I think if United get through, Anon is going to have to have two big games.

I mean, that team, yeah, completely agree with Anana. I saw some quotes from Valverde today as well, which was interesting. We'll talk about those. Lost my mind there. I was thinking where we were. And he said about set pieces. It works, Stephen. Yeah, I know. Sorry, I forgot about that. I was daydreaming. And he said, Highland, Maguire and De Ligt are the biggest threats from set pieces. And the United, sorry, Bilbao need to be careful, really. But it's interesting because I think they've only scored 15 goals between them this season.

Not exactly a massive goal for Adelaide. No, they're not, no. I wouldn't, is Hoyland a threat from set pieces? No, I don't think so. I don't really feel like he is, to be honest. Certainly Maguire is and certainly De Ligt is. United were going for, certainly when Ten Hag, at the start of the season, Ten Hag, United were aiming for De Ligt from every corner, it felt like, and he was getting shots away pretty regularly and getting headers away pretty regularly.

Again, I don't think he'll start. We'll probably find out more, A, if he's in the squad and B, from Amarim's press conference. Maguire's the obvious one. They're going to aim, you know, Maguire's the big threat from corners. He's...

the big threat from open play he's just the big threat all around isn't he it is interesting that when he's come on I mean he came on against Nottingham Forest up front and obviously scores against Lyon it's this kind of trend in recent years when you've seen goalkeeper coaches Lee Grant for example become striker coaches striker coach Ipswich

it's having that understanding of how the position that you're up against works so deeply so mcguire's against strikers all the time he knows their movement when you watch him his movement's actually really good yeah yeah i mean i'm not going to say he's going to be a permanent relocation but but that kind of puts highland to shame sometimes when we've talked about highland yeah yeah yeah holland's movement's not yeah not great i mean maguire when he came on at the city ground against notland forest

his kind of intelligence and the runs he was doing in the box. You could see his eyes. He was looking at the defenders and kind of going behind that into their blind spots. Always really clever. Yeah, I think, you know, I hadn't thought of that. I think it's probably more to the fact that

Maguire knows when anyone gets the ball, they're going to launch it towards him. And he's probably got a good idea of where that ball's going to go. I guess for Hoyland, during open play, it's a bit different in that United aren't launching balls into the box. He's got to make different runs, if you know what I mean. Maguire's not making a run. His movement's not a strength, though, is it, Hoyland? No, it's not. But Maguire's not got to make a run as a centre-forward to hold a ball up or bring a number 10 into play or think, how can I get Gannaccio into this game? He's got to make a run somewhere around the six-yard box where he thinks the cross is going to go.

And that's probably a lot easier than doing what Hoyland has to do for 89 minutes. And Maguire's great strength is aerial prowess, isn't it? You stick a ball to him, near him in the box, and he's going to have a pretty good chance of winning it.

De Ligt scored a few, hasn't he, this season? Is it three, maybe? But I don't particularly look at him and think he's a huge threat. I mean, he's a big lad. He puts himself about in the box, bit of a cliche, that. Should we touch briefly before we end? Because we haven't had a huge amount of talk to today. Come on, let's talk about De Ligt a bit more because me and you, when we looked at the signings and we discussed the transfer window, we actually praised him and said he'd been a better signing than a bad signing.

People's opinions have changed on this season. I think he's kind of split opinion as a player, but he has had a pretty good season now, hasn't he? Now we're towards the end of it. I think we can confidently say he's had a decent first year. Yeah, I think so. Given the pressure he was under, I guess, when he came in as another player

Ten Hag, Dutch, former Ajax player, sign in. The fact that things hadn't worked for him at Juventus and Bayern Munich, there's no getting away from that. Juventus and Bayern Munich don't sell you at a loss after a couple of years if things are going well. And, you know, he wasn't disastrous for either club.

but he also didn't live up to what either club expected, which is why they sold him for a loss. And then he had that nightmare international break in September with the Netherlands. So you add all that together, and I think he's had a pretty good season, a change in manager, what he signed on for, and a reunion with the manager who made him Ajax captain at 19, comes to an end pretty quickly. I think he's had a perfectly solid season, a good season, and

I think as good as he is, he could have in a team that's struggled. Yeah, given everything that's happened, you know, I think on an individual basis, he's been pretty fine. He's been pretty fine. I don't think there's been loads of mistakes. I think he can get better. But, you know, given how maybe it could have gone for him and maybe the pressure he was under at the start of the season, I think you'd have to say it's been reasonably good. I asked him when he came out the mix zone after that game against Nottingham Forest because he was limping. I asked him if he was okay. He said he was fine, but he was clearly lying because he's not played since then.

Thank God he's back in training. I don't know why I said thank God. It's not that important, is it? They've got the slaps on their heads today. Yeah, Val Verde is correct. I'm set pieces tomorrow night. United obviously fly to the Basque Country later on. We're recording on Wednesday.

I've seen some suggestions that it is an advantage to play the second leg at Old Trafford. I'd be inclined to agree, especially when you look back at the games they've played in the last couple of years where they've went out to abroad and to European countries in the second leg and they've collapsed under such a really raucous atmospheric crowd. Yeah, and I think playing the three knockout ties in...

home with a second leg at home sausage dad leon and athletic is going to be an advantage against leon it was an advantage against rail sausage dad it should be an advantage against athletic i think thursday night they've just got to stay in the tie you know i i think i might have been talking to samuel about from bournemouth not sure who it was but i did say to someone you can it's perfectly within the realms of possibility that this united side's loot three nil tomorrow and the ties all but over because it's interesting it's going to be really difficult i think

A, the crowd, the atmosphere tomorrow, the quality of athletic, the fact that they've had eight days off. I think they are going to really go for it tomorrow. All logic suggests, I mean, they should breeze through. United are 14th, Bilbao are fourth. They've got the best defensive record in the league. I think 26 goals have conceded. They've got some...

really decent players, obviously Williams and Aki Williams is probably the star there. But I think a few midfielders who, when people watch tomorrow night, including myself, who I've not had a chance, but you'll realise how technically good they are, as usual, Spanish technicians. So everything just points towards a Bilbao win, but it's just not as simple as that, is it? Especially on the back of that Lyon game, it feels like there could be something just special brewing or... Yeah, I mean, I think Atletico favourites, but I'd say only 60-40, to be honest. Yeah.

like you said, they are fourth. They're a pretty comfortable fourth in the league. I think that feels like they're definitely going to be in the Champions League next year. Whatever happens, I think the motivation of reaching a final at home

I mean, it's arguably bigger than United's motivation of getting into the Champions League, I think, because they'll never get this opportunity again. You know, the final in the lifetime of this, the era of this playing squad, probably the lifetime of those fans is not going to be at that stadium again. This is a once in a lifetime opportunity for them to reach the European final on home soil. I think the motivation for that is massive.

I think they will see their best chance as being to really make Thursday night just really intense, really loud, really horrible and try and play on the frailties of this United team. But as much as I think Atletico favourites, I think it's only 60-40. If you tell me United, if I go to sleep tonight and wake up nine days later, A, I'll feel refreshed and B, if I woke up and you told me United got through,

I wouldn't be surprised. I wouldn't give it a shot. We'll leave it there then, should we? Sounds good to me. Yeah, thanks very much, Ty. Thank you, Stephen. And thanks, listeners, as usual. Leave us a comment on YouTube, like and subscribe, and subscribe on your audio platforms as well. Let's hope they win tomorrow night. Have a great week.