391: Connectivity and Mindfulness Changes Everything | Miesha Tate
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Welcome to the ancient health podcast where East meets West in the world of medicine I'm dr Chris Motley and here we explore how modern Western science and traditional Eastern wisdom come together to unlock the body's full healing potential each week We'll dive into powerful tools techniques and approaches from both sides of the world to help you optimize your health and live with vitality Let's bridge the gap between ancient practices in cutting-edge medicine. Let's get started

Hey, everyone. Welcome to the Ancient Health Podcast. I'm your host, Dr. Chris Motley. And today, I'm going to say she's one of my closest friends, but we just did a podcast yesterday here at A4M Conference, and it is the incredible Misha Tate, UFC champion. Thank you so much for joining me today. Hey, thank you. I feel the same. You know, sometimes you just connect with a person and you're like, do we just become best friends? I think we did. I

The one thing I will say though is your calmness. And I think that's really, really good to be able to show an even steadiness. And I think that what you've put your body through and the competition you've had, it's like, we'll get to it, but has it been tough? First, I want to just say, was it tough to keep this steady all the time? You know, I think for me, it was difficult to find the balance in everything. You know, I

I think outside of fighting, I'm just naturally a pretty calm person. Yeah, yeah. So that's just always been me. I think maybe what surprised me was what came out when I was, you know. When you're in the ring. Yeah, when I'm in hot water, when I'm in the ring, when push comes to shove. Sometimes that's what really surprises me because it's just a glimpse into what I'm capable of.

for that moment in time right I love that okay so for you guys out there she's a champion she's did UFC and I well some people if they are just listening to the podcast they do want to hear a little bit of your background too so I want to go back and say can you give us a bit of a background yeah so I would say that as a young girl growing up um I'm the oldest sibling and I um I didn't have

older brothers that like beat me up you know like a lot of times you hear that like that's how I got tough like no I didn't have that my closest brother in age is seven years younger than me so

There was no fighting or anything like that. No, I didn't grow up with a family that had a fighting or wrestling background or martial arts, anything like that. But destiny has a way of finding you sometimes. And it came knocking on my door as a freshman in high school. And it was, hey, winter season's here. It's wrestling or basketball. And really, wrestling wasn't an option because...

it was all boys it was boys wrestling it wasn't girls wrestling so my my best friend at the time her name was sharon and we were sitting in english class and she looked at me and she said hey would you want to go out for wrestling and i was like what i mean total curveball and i was like they don't they don't have girls wrestling what do you mean she's like well

you know, if they don't have it for the girls, I guess they have to offer it. Like they have to let you do that on the boys team. And I was like, Oh, learn something new every day. So I went home and I asked my mom, I just wasn't interested in playing basketball. So, you know, everybody has that one sport that they absolutely know that they will not, not, not born to be good at, nor did I have interest to try to be good at it. And my mom came from

kind of a lineage of strong women in their own right. I would say that my grandma was a bit of a trendsetter. She came over from Switzerland when she was three years old and didn't speak any English. And she just kind of was like a hard, tough woman that was like, hey, I just remember her voice, oh, what the hell with them if they try to tell you that you can't? So it was just great to come from that. And I think my mom leaned on my grandma a little bit and my grandma was like, well, why the hell not? Yeah.

Why can't she go out for wrestling? And so my mom was like, well, I'm not going to tell you you can't do it. And especially for the reason being because you're a girl. Because that was a lot of the reason why more women weren't doing it was just the

thought it wasn't for women. So I went the next day, I didn't even have wrestling shoes and I got my butt kicked for the better part of two hours. It was one of the most challenging, difficult things I'd ever done. And although I don't think that it was a team full of bad guys, but they had the same preconceived notion that everybody else did. You shouldn't be on. I shouldn't be here. I didn't belong. And the best way to let me figure that out was to make it as

as challenging and difficult as possible right up front no easing you in no teaching moves no anything just you're going to get in there with you know state placing wrestlers and you're going to get your butt kicked and we're going to push you through the the gauntlet of you know strength and conditioning and surely you'll figure out that you don't belong here oh heavens yeah and did you like keep going i loved it i absolutely loved it it was the most challenging thing i had ever done and i would say um

I certainly was no better at basketball, at wrestling than basketball. I was equally terrible. But the difference was that I had a desire to get better at wrestling. And that's really what it came down to was that it just felt like this was the right thing for me to do. And so I just kept showing up every day. And the harder and harder they made it, the more that I felt like I started to thrive. And I thought, well...

Law of diminishing return. You know, if I just keep showing up, eventually I won't be as terrible as I am today. And you started to get better and better. I started to get better and better. And I just loved it. I look forward to wrestling season every year. And, you know, they became like a brotherhood. And I think that was a really important lesson for me to learn young is that you can change perception. Yeah, that's good. That's good. And so that...

They sort of let you into the fold, I guess. Absolutely. You know, they really were just like, oh, OK, I guess they can do it. You know, I guess girls can do this. And they were great. You know, I loved them and I loved the coaches and everybody. And I actually ended up winning the coaches award my senior year. What? I know it blew my mind because I didn't.

win matches against guys. You know, I started late in the game. 15 isn't... Is late? Is late. You know, most of these people, these guys have been wrestling since they were young. First grade, maybe. Sometimes younger. And at the very least, since sixth grade. So you don't usually see...

athletes coming out freshman year of high school that have never wrestled a day in their life. Oh my goodness. So that's rare. And I wasn't small either. You know, I've never been like a super tiny girl. So I was still wrestling. I was wrestling the guys that had gone through puberty, you know, like sometimes because there's as the weight class is as small as 103. So if you were, you know, a tiny girl, then sometimes you could get

you know, guys that weren't physically quite as developed yet. Usually the guys that 103 haven't gone through puberty. They're also usually younger. You know, usually seniors are, you know, up at 125 or above. So I was never even as small as 125. I think I remember the first weight check that I ever had was I was 130.6 as my freshman. 130.6. 130.6. And I remember so my freshman year I wrestled 130.6.

sophomore 135 senior uh junior 145 40 excuse me if i could count and then 145 um my senior year and i never knew how to cut weight i didn't do any of that stuff i didn't cut any weight yeah maybe like

stop drinking or eat light that day, you know, but I didn't know how to like run around and sweat or I didn't know how to do that. So, yeah, I would just make sure that my weight was close on that, which is still about close to what I walk around at today. So I've pretty much been the same. Same weight. Yeah. Did it when you were going into that and you were like going up freshman, sophomore, senior, like basically, yeah.

Was there a lot of resistance like in other schools and stuff like, you know, I mean, just in like schools, like did people say anything like other districts or something like you shouldn't be?

Well, I did have some instances when we would go to tournaments where they would have like Catholic schools or religious schools and the guys would have to forfeit because they weren't allowed to wrestle girls. Yeah. So that would happen. And I did have a forfeit happen and the guy was actually really nice. He shook my hand. He's like, I'm sorry. He's like, I would if I could, you know. Yeah.

So it's, you know, nothing personal. We're just not allowed to, according to the rules of my school. So he forfeited. Yeah. But most of the time, you know, I think...

I think I was a bit oblivious to the negativity. And I don't know if that was as much conscious as it was just my subconscious being of just, hey, what I need to do to survive in this is control what I can control and not pay attention to the other parts of it. So I just didn't.

really dive into it. I know that there was negativity. I know that there were derogatory comments. I know that these things happened, but I can't recall a specific instance of that. I think I was pretty good at brushing that stuff off. I mean, it would show like in your demeanor and how you approach life and such. And we were talking yesterday about like connectivity and such. And like when you say brushing things off,

Has that helped like when you went through your career like I want to talk to about like your your Avenue into health and how it really became really important to you and like when you first started your career we're talking about connection like to the heart and to who you are and stuff, but

How important, when you first started your career, you started going to career and you're like, did you just go right into it? Say, I'm going to go into UFC and stuff like that. And were you connected from mind, body? How was your health? And what was the angle you had there? That's a great question. There's going to be a lot to unpack there. So the short answer is no, I wasn't. I didn't know that this would ever be the path that I would take. Even when I started wrestling, that was...

Again, it was a happenstance kind of chance, wasn't even really my idea. And I just wasn't afraid to see what the worst thing could happen was. I just wasn't afraid to take a chance basically. Some people would call that stupidity. I like to think of it as just a blind courage, just like I'm just gonna try and see what happens. I don't know what I've got to lose.

And so I went through wrestling. I loved it. I went to Central Washington University and I was looking for something to kind of fill that void. I missed it a lot. And I didn't know what was on the horizon for me as far as, you know, contact. I just missed the contact. And again, another friend of mine came to me with this idea in our dorm rooms and she was like,

her name is Rosalia, we're still friends actually, and she was like, "Nisha, there is this mixed martial arts club sport and you have got to come check it out." And I was like, "Um, no thanks. No interest at all." I had never seen fighting. I didn't know what she was talking about, but I thought she was talking about something like karate and I just wasn't interested in it. I didn't want to put on the outfit. I felt like I would be way too vulnerable. It was like I had my martial arts and I, my martial art and that's, it was wrestling and like

that kind of contact. So I couldn't wrap my head around going like another direction and striking because I had no desire to fight. I didn't grow up as a violent person. I didn't have this like troubled background of aggression and these kinds of things. You know, I was always...

pretty humble in all of that and I mean like I never felt like I had anything to prove gotcha yeah right so so I just even on the rare occasion I'm pretty easy going so it usually I just walk away like even you know a girl would come up to me and be like you know what's your problem what are you looking at I'm like

Nothing. Like, sorry. Like, you know, I just didn't, I wasn't a super prideful person, I guess, in those kinds of things. I'm willing to just be like, no, I'm good. Even if, you know, you know, you can kick their ass. That's what I was about to say. I'd be like, friend, you probably don't want to do that. Right. Probably don't want to tell her that. Don't do that. But, you know, yeah.

it just wasn't in my, my, I guess my personality to, to want to challenge people in that way. And so when I found this mixed martial arts club sport via my friend, I was not interested in the least bit. Yeah. And so she was like, she went the first day without me. Okay. Yeah. And cause I had said no. And she was like,

Came back the next day. She's like, you got to go. Trying to go to it. You got to go. She's like, most of these guys are former wrestlers and there's stuff you can learn on the ground. And I said, okay, well that kind of perked my ears up a little bit. Yeah.

I went in and it was just students that were running a program there. And so, you know, collaborative, we just get together. It's just a little club sport. And on my very first day, I learned how to choke people. Oh, man. I was in. You're like sold. Yes, sold. So sold. But I had...

First day I learned how to choke somebody out. That was it. That was it. That was my hook, line, sinker. So I went and I also very vehemently was anti-learning any of the striking bill. I didn't want to learn it because I didn't ever envision a world where I would hit anybody. I had...

you know, quite an inversion to the idea of punching someone and also getting punched in the face. It just didn't feel like my calling. And it's so funny sometimes how little we know about ourselves.

To finally see like now that you look back, it's like man, it's something I was actually very talented at and opened up doors. So what got you to do it? And that I love. You love to do it? Like was there, hopefully this is not going down this side of the side, but was there a science to it that you started to learn and you went, oh, this is actually something that I'm good at? Oh no, the story gets better. It wasn't that good or well thought out. So I started training.

I start learning you know rear naked choke um triangle choke some arm bars some joint locks and I'm like well this is really cool I could add this on it's jujitsu that I could add this on to what I kind of already understand about wrestling and that sounds really fun so you know I was already thinking maybe you know some jujitsu competitions that might be really fun um then I got invited by the same group of people to go to an amateur fight event in Yakima Washington it was

It was being hosted by Yakima MMA and I walk into the venue and I watch these fights happen. I had this visceral reaction. I mean, I was so in that moment and I was so taken back by what I thought was beautiful. I really saw the tenacity, the heart, the determination, the craft.

And I didn't so much see the violence because that was my preconceived notion that fighting was angry and violent. Yeah. And when I watched it, I'm like, this isn't what I thought. This isn't like bar fights. This isn't just two angry, drunk brawlers. This is a craft. And they're working hard at that. And they're passionate about it. And they're leaving absolutely everything that they have. And that appealed to me. Because you saw the craft, like the workmanship in it. Because...

My brother used to box, and he had friends, and he'd go there, and he would say...

He says, remember, it's not how hard you hit. It's where you hit and, you know, like what location and things. And you think like you see these guys on boxing, you go, oh, that's a good hit, you know, because you think that could, you know, cause a person to go down. But I also thought there was a science behind it. Yeah. So you started learning that. Did you go? So I'm more emotional at this point. Although there is a science behind it, I don't think that that was where I was at in this process. I love the passion and tenacity and the challenge. Hmm.

So although I saw beauty in it, it was mostly because of how hard they pushed themselves and how they displayed their whole heart in front of everyone. There's no barrier. There's nothing. I mean, they were all in. And I loved that. And I thought...

well, if they could do it, I could do that. And Destiny had another way of dropping itself right on my lap. As everybody's leaving, I hear the announcement that there's going to be an all-female fight card in three weeks. And if there are any females on the audience, which tells you if they're announcing to an audience of random people asking them to fight, tells you how many women were actually fighting at that time. But I made my way down there and I just signed up.

And then three weeks later, I had my first fight. And you don't learn anything in three weeks. That's what I was going to say. But you want to be great at it anyways. Yeah, I was like. So I just dove right in. You just dove right in. That's what I was going to ask you. Like, I mean, jitters. I mean, or was it like just like I'm going in there and I just got to go. I think I was naively calm.

That's why I would see that in you. You'd be very calm. That's why I think that evenness inside of you is like... When you say passion and you say, I went in there and I'm like, win or lose is a great experience and I'm going to go for it. Yeah, that's kind of what it was. And I've had to...

find my purpose and meaning in things because sometimes I can be too calm to where I'm flat when I perform. And I can, and especially with like, when I start counting my blessings and I think about now, you know, as my children and I've already accomplished,

you know, the pinnacle of sport. I've been a world champion. Like what reason am I doing it for now? It's not for the money. It's not for the fame. It's not for the accolades. It's just to test myself and see where I can continue to grow and improve. Because for me, that is, it's, it's addicting. It's such a fun process for me to go through and see where I can continue to edge myself and get better and learn. And I've,

I've learned so much compared to that first fight and even the majority of my career, I would say I started becoming so outcome based where it was the win was the most important thing. And if I didn't get that, then I started to identify with that, you know, being the fighter, being a winner, being a loser. And that was really tough for me emotionally and mentally because you start to put all your value in that. So your value system is based on a single outcome.

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And it can get really difficult when you do that. And I think this is not an uncommon thing for athletes, especially professional athletes, when the weight of sponsorship, your paycheck, your livelihood, even the way that people look, view, or treat you is so based on this one outcome. So you start to really dive into that. And I would say I had a big shift

once I retired from the sport, which I'm kind of jumping way ahead here. But I had this big shift.

When I left a relationship that I considered to be quite toxic, it was a long relationship, about nine years. And I retired and I stepped back from all of it. And then I, you know, I met my fiance and, you know, we had our kids and I was pregnant with my son. And I said, I think I want to come back and fight. And what I realized in that moment was never that I didn't love the sport. It was that I

I just didn't know how to evolve through everything that was going on. And it wasn't until much later that I started peeling back the layers of who Misha is that I started to be able to say, okay, so yes, I fight. That's a part of what I do. It's a part of who I am, but it is not the core. And it actually doesn't

rock the the boat if I if I win or I lose I want to win because I work hard for it and people around me sacrifice for it and I sacrifice for it but it's the effort that matters right it's the effort it's the journey that's the beauty in it and and when you lose sight of that it just gets so ugly and it's not fun and and you miss the point of why we do something like that in the first place it's like when you say like the journey like I enjoy looking back

that your identity was like you could have had that identity that was given to you by people around you. But you went down and reconnected. Like, I have a journey. The journey is what I love about this. And like a pioneer that goes out there, I'm like, no, that's the passion. So you can – could you like then start to like, I don't – you know, push all this stuff away. This is where I'm at like with my journey. It's much more centered. And I started – when I went from outcome-based, I think, is –

external feedback, right? It's kind of like when you're, when an outcome is so important, a lot of times it has to do with because how the rest of the world is going to see that outcome, right? You go out there to display this and hopefully it's pleasing to the judges, it's pleasing to your boss, it's pleasing to your cornerman, you know, it's pleasing to your family and your friends that are there to watch you and it's pleasing to the fans and the crowd, right? So there's a lot of pressure to do all of that. And when you fall short,

You know, it's like you get...

reprimanded in a way because of course there's social media, you know, people are going to say things and, you know, then, you know, maybe sponsors drop out, you get half of your paycheck. Oh man. Right. So all of these things do put a lot of weight on, on, on the outcome. But once I centered myself and I started to realize that, that the effort, what was, is, is what was important. I realized that I went, um, like for my internal feedback,

Right. Instead of external feedback. That's good. That's good. So you were like that internal dialogue was like, I'm really trying to connect with me, with myself instead of listening to all that. Let's keep going. This is so good. And so I was listening. So I started listening to my own feedback. I started to tell myself, Misha, you are the CEO of your life and your career in fighting.

There shouldn't be anybody else running, driving this ship. You know, so fighters oftentimes make the mistake, I think, of letting their coaches be in charge of everything. And the reason I say that's a mistake is because you forget to listen to yourself. So if your strength and conditioning coach wants to make sure that you know that you felt their workout, right? And then you go to your wrestling coach and your wrestling coach is like, ooh,

My day to crush her, you know? And then you go spar, you know, to your striking coach and they just kill you on the mitts. And then...

you go to sparring and you wonder why you didn't have a good practice. Yes. You didn't listen. You let everybody else make all the decisions for you, run you into the ground. And not that they meant bad by it either. But a lot of times people who are coaches and teaching techniques are not formally educated in how the science of the body works anyways. Right? So they're mean well, but it's a little bit of the blind leading the blind sometimes. And

And when you had to experience that and you learned it and you like look back at it, like listening to yourself and no blanking to yourself like, oh, I should have done this or should have, you know. Now that you're connecting with yourself, people out there would be like, you know, learning to center where they're,

moments when you started to have internal dialogue, but were there any type of practices like that started to develop? Like, how am I going to talk to my intern? Mindfulness. Oh, yeah. It's a big practice. Yeah. So the, so the UFC provides a mental coach. Really? Yeah. And it was,

It was a game changer for me. So I'll tell you, after I retired and went through a lot of turmoil and four and a half years away from the sport, and I started to heal from that, a lot of it from just removing things. And I say, I'm going to note this real quick, that although it is important to remove certain things in your life if they're not good for you, I still believe that

in order to operate at 100, you've got to put something in the place. Wow. Right? We can't just take away. Because then you just don't have the same stability. So although I had removed some things, I didn't know what to put in that place. So my mindset about competition at that time was it was still outcome-based and it was still...

my whole mindset about the sport and everything was, what can I produce and what are people gonna think about it? And I just couldn't make that jump until I started connecting with myself. And that came with the mindfulness. So I won my first fight back. And now that's not to say that you can't be successful with this type of thought process. I think most athletes are successful with this.

But the problem is, is that afterwards, how do we transition from being this athlete that's only thought one way and valued their selves only based on one thing? They missed birthdays, weddings, funerals, holidays. All they know is to sacrifice for this sport. And when it doesn't work out or when it comes to an end,

How do we still feel good about who we are? How do we know what our value is outside of that? And so it wasn't until I started to transition and understand that, that I felt like I became my most powerful self.

Well, that is profound because, I mean, you became your most powerful self. So just no matter what everybody else says, you found that. I found my peace. And once you have that, nobody can steal it from you. Right? Nobody can take it. That's what's so beautiful about it. Now, I think about the burning monk, right? I think about like a monk lit himself on fire and sat and meditated in a peaceful protest. Yeah.

I think about that and I say, how is that possible? And that would have been a much harder question for me to answer then than it is now. What I understand is that he had his peace and nobody could take it from him. And he was so solid in that and so connected that he was able to do what most people would think is unthinkable. Yeah, oh my goodness. That is so true. Because when you, as you, when you coming back and you found who you were, like, did that open up more

more avenues of more connectivity. So you have to practice mindfulness. And I don't want to try to say like... Well, mindfulness is an open dialogue with yourself. How many times do we really sit down? The everyday person, I mean, maybe you or I do it a little bit more, but I can testament that it took me probably...

36 years, 35 years to really start to understand how important that is, like having that dialogue. Because for the longest time, I went into survival mode and I thought I need to compartmentalize. I need to put these things in boxes and shove them way down so that I can focus on what I need to. I can't afford to deal with these things right now because that would take away from the mission that I have. And I think that isn't just exclusive to athletes. I think a lot of people,

Sit down. They just don't take time to connect with themselves because the world demands that they produce whatever it is that the world says we're supposed to. Have a nice car. Have a nice home. Have a beautiful wife. Have a great husband. Have kids. And then once you have all that,

more of it and get better you know a nicer home we want a bigger we want to produce we want more money we want more of this and that's true right and so true but in all of that it's the opposite of connecting right it's it's it's disconnect because it's you i think we're being fed a lie in all of that fed a lie this is good so with all that like perceptions yeah keep going i mean i have some thoughts i mean like no yeah go ahead this is so good it's like when you i

When you found your connectivity,

And you say like the perception, like we're supposed to have this and this. Looking back, like, and not trying to backtrack, but just saying like in your, the nine year relationship and stuff, and then all the first time, all the fight stuff, do you find like you were living in that perception of how life should be? And it just sort of kept adding on weight to you. And it was like, you couldn't find yourself. And here was the worst part, but the best part was that I thought genuinely in my heart,

that if I became a world champion, that all those issues and problems I would be having would be solved. Oh, heavens. And that just wasn't the truth. And I wonder how many other celebrities or athletes get that gold medal at the Olympics and realize that it didn't solve the problems that they have here in heart, mind, and body. It doesn't take those demons away. It's a great mask,

And it feels good for a short time. I'll tell you, you know, it was probably a great two weeks after I won my world title. And then I got real depressed. Really? Really depressed because I got to look behind the curtain. I was there and I thought it was going to be everything that I needed to fix my emotional deficit.

And it wasn't any of that for me, you know, because I hadn't done the work. All I had done was pack things away in boxes and tried to do my best to disconnect with all of that because it didn't serve a purpose in my mission, or at least I couldn't see how it could serve a purpose. So the best thing I could do was just to try to not deal with it and put it as far away.

- Yep. - Shove it away. - Shove it away. - And so when you got to behind the veil, you started to see that. I guess like from our conversation before that you talked about, it could be like a blessing in some way 'cause then it forced you to say,

This is it. And you better. It didn't solve the problem. It didn't solve like this is not the problem solved. So when you started to go into mindfulness, was there that point after you won and you go, you're starting to connect, but was there like a trigger? Like, I mean, or anything in your head that said, man, I've got to fix something. I hate to use that term fix, but there's something I got to mend. Yep.

There was, for sure. So I'm hard-headed and it takes me a little while sometimes to catch on to these things. It took me a while. I won my world title in 2016 against Holly Holm and then I lost my title in July. So I fought again pretty quickly because I still was in this mindset that

Well, if that didn't fix that I must just need to win again. I must need to continue to ride that high, you know? And so I'm still chasing this. And of course, when you win, there's this huge dopamine rush and you're on top of the world and it's the best feeling. So it's easy to chase that. You know, I would think of, you know, probably similar to any other kind of addict, right? That's looking for that stimulation. We are addicted to that in our sport. And so when I started to get really depressed, I thought,

I just need to fight again. I need to be the first one. I need to defend my belt because then I'll be a champ, you know, really be a champion because they say you're not a champion until you've defended your belt, you know? So I was like, maybe that's what it is, you know?

And I lost. I think I was already on the downward trajectory before I even won my belt. I was already facing the consequences of the downward slide of being in a deficit for too long, mentally, emotionally. And then I lost my title and I thought, well, I must just need to win this.

It's the same cycle. So it just keeps repeating itself over and over. So then I fought Raquel Pennington, and I don't know where I was in that fight. Really? It was almost like an out-of-body experience. Really? Like you didn't even feel like you were there? Mm-mm.

It's so strange. And that's when I knew I needed to retire because I never wanted to feel that feeling again. I never wanted to feel like I was in a full-on fist fight and completely dead inside. - Heavens. Like you didn't even feel like you're in the middle of it. You could almost like see yourself just in the ring. - Yeah. This is just like, I mean, how could you be in a fight for your life and just feel like you don't care?

I mean, keep going. So I was so just depressed. I think I've used a lot of disassociation over my life. I think that's how I've learned probably as a child to deal with hard times or situations that you can't really change. You just begin to be somewhere else. So I was always doing the opposite of being present.

It was always somewhere else in my mind. I don't know where, but there are things I just don't remember. There's huge gaps. And, you know, so my last fight before I retired was in New York. And to this day, sometimes I'll have a friend be like, you remember when we were in New York and it was after your fight? And I was like, you were there? Whoa. That wild.

I mean, it was that bad to where I had disassociated so bad that I don't remember. I don't remember the fight week. I don't remember the weight cut. I don't remember really the fight. I mean, it feels like something I watched later. And so because of that, I have some reference to it, but not because I remember what it was like in that moment. And that should be like your most present moments. Yes. Right. I mean, that demands you to be present.

And then after the fights, I just was numbing. I don't know. I was somewhere else. So I realized at that moment, I actually started to question whether my life was still worth living. Oh, no. Yeah. So it got really, really dark for me for a little bit there. And I had to dig really deep in that moment and say, is it that I don't want to live anymore? Or is it because I don't want to live like this anymore? That's a...

That was the question. And it's beautiful. And the answer was, it's not that I don't want to live. I don't want to live like this anymore. And so I knew I had to change a lot. And so when I left the sport, I had left the relationship some...

a little while before that fight, but the person was still very involved in everything that was going on and was still trying to like get me back into the relationship. And so there was a lot of added pressures otherwise. And I just thought, Misha, if you keep down this trajectory,

You're not going to be here anymore. You're to the point. This is rock bottom. So you've got to figure it out. You've got to do something different. I don't care what it is, but it's got to be something that you haven't done before. It's not the definition of insanity. It's like doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. So I realized that I needed to do something different. So I think the hardest thing for me to do was to retire because...

it left me with no identity I didn't know who I was so that's really where the problem solving started um I had a little nine pound chihuahua he's like my best buddy little scooter and we just yeah we we packed up and we just drove um I think I started my trip in Kansas City and I just um

I just drove. You just drove? Yeah, I drove up. I drove to Vegas. I drove up the coast. And all I was trying to do was figure out what made me tick other than fighting and competition and also reconnect, mostly with people around me. But I also realize now that there was a big self-connection in that. Yeah, yeah. And so I just tried to lean into whatever it was that told me

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A lot of family and events and get-togethers and all these things you just don't really get to do because you're in training camp and so you get disconnected. So I actually called up my great-aunts and great-uncles, my grandma's brothers and sisters. Really? Okay. And I got together with them. And I sat down and I had lunch with them. My grandma had already passed at this point. She was the oldest. And...

I heard their stories and I listened and we had lunch and it was just something I'd never done before. And I was like, this feels really good. That's what I'm missing. This is what I need. And so I kind of continued on that path. And although I wasn't, I didn't get professional help at that point. I had started to realize that connection, you know, at least with family and friends was really important. I didn't really know that well how to, you know, connect with myself and mindfulness yet because I hadn't worked on that yet.

But then, you know, eventually I meet Johnny. Eventually we have kids. We moved to Singapore actually for about a year and a half. That's where my son was born. Yes. And I'm like out to here pregnant, like eight, nine months pregnant with my son. And I'm like, I think I want to fight again. What? I know. And it had been...

Well, maybe like three and a half years at that point since I had fought and I was just adamant about not wanting to fight again. But I also kind of associated this fighting with all these negative emotions and complications. And once I started to started to heal myself, then I felt like maybe it wasn't the problem of the sport. Like maybe it was like what was going on in here. And so if I could make that better.

Could I fight with a different approach? And so Mac and I won my first fight back was really kind of emphatic. And I feel like it was so great. And I was so happy. And then my second fight, I lost a close decision. And then my third fight, I tried to drop down to 125, which is 10 pounds lighter than I fight at right now. I fight at 135. And I'm pretty lean at 135. I think I'm around...

I don't know, maybe like 14% body fat or something like that. So pretty lean. I mean, not like... Yeah, it's pretty lean. So going down to 125 was an absolute nightmare for me. I think we did it the best way that we could, but it really messed with my hormones, which I know we want to get into that, right? Female hormones. I had no idea about that stuff. I've been a woman my whole life, and I didn't know about training for my hormones before.

competing for my hormones, dieting for my hormones, fasting for my hormones. It's so... You're so entailed. Because we talked about Mindy Pels, about how she talks about using fasting and such. So when that happened, was that what sort of prompted you to learn more about hormones? No, it's still later. I still had to suffer a bit longer. So I lost those two fights and I was... I still hadn't...

I'm still being outcome based, even though I was so much more secure in my family. And that also, I think, kind of made me, again, a little flat because I'm like, well, if I win or lose, I've got my family and that's all that I really need.

But I didn't know how to pull the most out of what I wanted out of every moment. Right. So I still had a lot of this baggage and things that I just hadn't put something else in its place. Right. So I'm still like trying to piece this puzzle together and realize that like I haven't actually exchanged pieces. I've just removed it. And the picture is kind of incomplete right now.

That's a good analogy. That's very good. So then I'm like, okay, so how am I going to paint a new picture? I need to connect these things. And I would say when I started working with Micah at the UFC Performance Institute, I learned what mindfulness actually is and how to implement it in a daily practice, not just with my fights. But I think I started with a mindful shower. So you get in the shower, and it was like two minutes. Mm-hmm.

And you try to just engage all of your senses, right? And just focus on engaging the senses. No, just engaging them. Yep. You're not listening to a podcast. You're not letting your thoughts wander. Or they will wander because that's the human brain it's going to. But he draws this kind of...

picture that I think of like a balloon floating away. So you just every time the balloon floats away, you just grab it and you bring it back. So every time you kind of lose your thought and you realize, oh, I'm down, you know, in this this thought process, I'm just going to bring it back to right where my feet are. And I'm listening to the sounds of the water. I'm looking at the way the faucet looks and the water coming out of that. I'm trying to engage in the way that the water feels. Yeah.

And is there anything that I smell? Like, what does it feel like having this moisture, like travel through my nasal cavity? Like, what are all these senses that I'm sensing right now? Right. And when you get better at doing that, it's just such a great reset in a form of connection that I don't know. I feel like it gives your subconscious a little bit of time to have some presence. Maybe, maybe, you know, kind of slip something in there, a chance for an epiphany or kind of like, oh, I never thought

thought that deep about this before. I never had that level of connection. So now I practice also mindful meals. So I was so busy before, like two little kids, I would never sit down to eat. And now I'm like, you know what? Not every time because I'm still busy. I'm going to sit down

and I'm going to focus on pulling every flavor out of this meal that I can. Oh, that's amazing. I'm going to smell my food. I'm going to look at my food. Then I'm going to enjoy my food and I'm really going to try to engage all my senses. Yes. What does it feel like when I chew this? What does it taste like? Is it salty, sweet? Oh, what's that? You know, gosh, something I never noticed before in this salad. That's really great. I don't even need dressing now because it actually tastes really good when you pay attention to it. You know, things like that are so powerful and

I know too many people who can't sit in silence with themselves and I say, "I know you. I know you because I was you." I always had to have a podcast or music or something to distract me from myself, from my own thoughts, from my own things that I hadn't unfolded or dealt with. Right? I never wanted to give those things a chance to have the floor.

Because I didn't want to deal with them. Because I didn't know how to deal with them. And the more mindful I am, the more that I realize I can work through those things if I acknowledge what they are. If I acknowledge that I have feelings. And now instead of trying to suppress my feelings, so if I have about a moment of anger, sadness, happiness, frustration...

instead of being like, ooh, feeling angry is bad. No, no, put it away. Oh no, sad? We don't do that. Don't cry. Hold it in. Suck it in. Don't do that. That's also not a good thing to do. I don't look at emotions as though they're inherently good or bad. They're just human. Oh, that's good. So I think about that now and I'm like, okay, so if I'm sad, what if

I just tried to let that emotion be as present as it can be. What if I just tried to cry harder? What if I just let that emotion just have its moment and let it all the way move through me, right? And if I'm really angry, what if I just screamed at the top of my lung and clenched my fist and just let that anger express itself and have its moment as opposed to just stuffing it away like I've always done before?

And there's really power in that because I feel like, at least for me and a lot of the people that I talk to about leaning into our emotions, it's not something that we're taught in school. It's not. We're not really taught to embrace how we feel. But when you do that, I feel like you can take the weight off. Yeah. So it's like.

going into the arena of your life where you felt the full anger of the yell or the scream. It's like you're giving your body capacity to say,

I'm letting it all through. I recognize that I honor it and I'm going to let it flow through me. And so, but you don't have to stay here, you know, because I honored you. I honored that. Exactly. Oh, and so power in that. It is like when you when that came up and you started to feel that flow, did it start to like create this avenue like this, you know, turning wheel in your body? And you're like, man, this is what is needed to be taken place for this long. Yep.

It was. It was very awakening for me and I couldn't believe how powerful I felt and how much, how alleviated I felt. So before I would kind of, I think, trick myself into believing that because I never crossed the bridge that there wasn't the problem on the other side. Right? So you're kind of like, good job. I held it together. I didn't cry.

And I made the most out of my day anyways. And I look at that. Good job, Misha. Like pat yourself on the back. You, you held, you went to training anyways, pushed yourself hard, did all the things you made dinner. You, you know, you good job. Like you, you did what you were supposed to, you manned up and you soldiered up and you did what you were supposed to do. It's like,

But that's just conditioning. I just conditioned myself to all of those things. Now I realize that there's way more power instead of stacking the bricks on yourself and patting yourself on the back for carrying a heavy load through the whole day. Oh, man.

What if we just took the bricks off when they need to so we can actually move through our day better, right? And so for me, that was so powerful to realize that. Now, like with this mindset of like, like you're taking the weight off, take the bricks off. And as you go through life, like,

With your avenues and your direction, your journey now, does it make your journey just seem like a lot lighter when you practice mindfulness? Like even the outlook looks really good to you? It's way better. I know that I have a metaphorical house and I kind of look at that as myself, my life, my everything, right? So I have this little house. And sometimes we're so afraid to let this house burn down

because we just don't know if we can build it again. Oh, I didn't see that. Right? But what I've thought about is like there's always going to be this opportunity for this house to be wrecked by any number of things.

But every time that you build it back, it'll be more to your liking anyways. Right? I mean, we all probably started in like an apartment or something like that. And you're like, I don't want to live in this forever. You know, and then you get, you know, you move into a house with roommates and you're like, well, eventually I still, you know, want this. And, you know, eventually you get to a point where you're like, God, this is home. Right? This feels really good. I really like what I've created here. And I have my garden and I have these things that make me feel like this is more than just a house and a building. Like this is my home.

This is my livelihood. This is my home. And so I look at that metaphorical home with me that every time that that burns down or it gets wrecked or I mess up or I fail or I fall really short on my goal, it's just another opportunity to build it back. What did I learn from that? And how can I improve? Because I don't fear it.

burning to the ground anymore because I know I can build it back and I know every time that it burns down I'm actually kind of getting a little excited like oh I fell pretty big on that one didn't I a little short on that one I'm really excited to see what comes from that you know I'm not kidding like you said metaphor that like some things hit you in the head in your heart and I'm like I'm gonna start that is gonna be something in my life for the rest of my life I'm serious like the metaphorical house like

I mean, you're deep and you've got a well of wisdom and you've got a podcast. But I'm also like, have you ever got a book or have you done anything? I haven't done a book yet. You're so wise about things like this. You dig deep. You know, I was talking to Bev. You know Bev. I don't know if everybody knows Bev. But I was like, should I write a book? So we were talking about it.

I think you should. I think right now my Built for Growth podcast is my passion project. It's my baby. It's where I want to help people understand and bridge the gap between science and self. Yes. And you definitely are hitting on the nail on the head. When you said like doing the mindfulness shower, I mean, I could tell you I don't ever like take time to like, you know, feel my senses or anything. Like one of the practices they always tell us like in some Chinese medicine practices is like they'll make you

tap and smack acupuncture points and they say it's the waking up. It's like having a cup of coffee. Some of the practitioners would say when you do that, what you're doing is you're waking up energy to all your organs because your body's forgetting where it's at right now and you're trying to pull you back down here because they say the mind of the organ is somewhere else and I'm like...

Yeah. I was like, okay, well, I'll try it. And you know what? I would literally do the tapping and stuff. And I was like, I feel pretty like I'm settled into the ground right now. So you got with your podcast, when you connect mind, body, and spirit, and you keep growing and growing, you got to write the book. That'd be great. And what do you see in the future as a podcast? Or it looks great. It looks bright. You're going to keep doing this. But do you want

And eventually to go into other realms, like more media. What's your thoughts for the future? I'm really open to receive whatever the universe takes from me. My main goal is to help people and provide a place for them to...

receive whatever it is that they're meant to in that moment. I'm truth-seeking. I'm trying to decipher the truth. I do think there's a lot of misinformation out there. I know I'm not perfect. I'm not a doctor. But I've really realized as just an otherwise normal person that there is so much power in being connected with yourself. And it changed my whole life. And I think it saved my life. Yeah. And I think that you being...

At the top and at the bottom at the same time. So that is what people would need. And people out there listening are like, that's where I'm at right now. And just showing that somebody that's had your type of hardships and success can tell people that you can pull yourself through this. Yeah.

So this is such a great convo. I'm sorry we're sensitive about your time. I know we're out here at the conference and people's time is really, really confined. So I want to make sure I respect yours. But I just want to say, really, this has really been fun. And I'm not kidding. You've got a really soft spirit. But even when you say I get in the ring, I'm like, I'm going to go back on YouTube and just watch you just...

start nailing people because it's so funny seeing both sides. I ran into someone here the other day who we had done a podcast, actually Carol Caroline, um, with B minerals. So we had done a podcast together and I think before we did the podcast, she had never seen any of my fights or whatever. And I ran into her here and she was like,

Misha, she's like, I watched your fight. She's like, that is just so... She was just kind of taken back. I guess I kind of like it. I guess I kind of appreciate that that's not the demeanor that I display all the time because it's just a part of, again, it's just like a glimpse of what I'm really capable of. And I think there's such beauty in knowing what you're capable of. I know that I have power and that I'm powerful. But

I have control of that. I can be dangerous, but I can be kind and sweet and gentle and loving and mothering and all the things that I feel like are more of my core values, but break into my house. I just love that feeling. I love the feeling and the polarity of that. And so I think that's a really beautiful...

balance for me and finding that balance for me has been really powerful. I think that's why I love the yin yang of your life. Like the way you pulled it all around and you're continuously like balancing it. And I think when people see that and that you can say it and speak it, I mean, it'll inspire people. It does. It inspires me. I'm not kidding. The way you speak and say things like house metaphors,

I mean, more people out there are going to, I mean, keep wanting to listen in to you. So I'm just, I'm encouraging you to talk to Bev and to do the books. Yeah, I think so too. You know, I would say, and one more thing, I wanted to talk about my most recent fight, which at this point is December of 2023. So it's been a little while ago. I'm still trying to get back in there, but...

I want to say, though, that was the fight that I feel like was the most important fight of my career. It wasn't my title fight against Holly Holm or any number of fights before that because that was the fight that I really proved to myself. Mm-hmm.

That I've done the work. Not physically, because I always do the work physically. But mentally and emotionally, I knew what I wanted out of every single moment in that fight. I remember it all. And it was powerful and beautiful. And I was the betting underdog going into that fight. And I won that fight first two rounds, 10, eight rounds, which is kind of a...

it's a difficult score to get because it just has to mean like you you're literally dominant from bell to bell yeah for the judges to give you 10 8 usually 10 9 rounds or what you know what are what are given out so um you know i remember

after my weigh-ins walking I took a walk by myself we talked about this on my podcast that I need time by myself that I do because I need to to process and give myself time to really feel and connect with what it is that I want and what's going in you know on inside myself and I remember thinking like come on Misha like you you worked hard for this like you really want this and and

you can do this and you deserve that. And that was kind of the motto of the camp. I deserve this. I deserve to know what it's like to be connected to myself and what it's like to accomplish my dreams. I deserve that and I'm working hard at that in ways that I didn't even know were possible before. And in that fight, why it was so important to me was because

You might look at it from the outside and say, well, that was just a great performance from Misha. But I know what was happening in my mind and in my heart. And I know how connected I was to exactly what I was doing. And I took it moment by moment because you can't plan out a whole flight. No, not at all. Right? No. I went in there with...

And one goal that was physical was like, I will take her down. I don't care what's going to happen in this fight. Maybe I'll lose. Maybe I won't. It's not the most important thing. I was like, but I will take her down. And I was successful in that. And then what I realized too is, oh, when we move from outcome-based to effort-based,

we're more likely to get the outcome that we want anyways. Oh, I know. That's good. That's good. Because sometimes goals are limiting. People don't really realize that. It's like, oh, I know what I want. I want this goal. But what you don't know is that that goal is 10 goals short of what you actually could have accomplished if you just went in there and said, I'm just going to do and be my best. Wow. Right? So many fights I won, and I know that I was far from my best. And so many fights I lost because I was...

I didn't know how to just be my best. I was so scared of losing that I held back. And the same thing in my wins. I was so, so scared of the outcome of losing that I never really put my full self out there because it could have been a risk. So you just went from that goal focus to that effort focus. Effort focused. And then the outcome far exceeded even my best expectations. So that was just...

And you can apply that to every aspect of life if you really like connect with yourself. It's so important. Wow. I'm going to chew on that like for a long time. Seriously. Because I think about even in life, like where do I want to be? And I'm like, no, focus here and be focusing on the effort. Be where your feet are. It's a powerful one. Be where your feet are. Okay. I'm just saying this has been a great interview. Thank you. I really am so thankful to you. And so, I mean, I know people know where you're at and who you are and stuff, but I

Instagram feed, website, where can they find you? - Yeah, so if you go to my website, it's just MishaTate.com, I before E except after C, works for my name too, don't be fooled by any of the fake profiles that are out there. It seems like there's more and more every day.

Um, so it's just MishaTate.com and if you go in there, you know, you'll see all the cool things and whatever, um, I'm working with and believe in. And, um, you also get a chance to sign up for my newsletter, which I think that you should because I write it myself and I'm really proud of that. Um, might seem like something simple and small, but, um, it comes from my heart and it comes from my genuine experiences and whatever speaking to me, um, you know, that week, um,

And that's what you're going to hear. That's what I think that the people need to hear from my life. So, yeah, I'm really passionate about that. And you can tell. People out there listening right now and watching know that you're passionate. And I think you always want to have people that help you and guide you that are passionate. So I can tell it and everybody else can feel it. Thanks.

Thank you. Thank you for coming out on your busy day. I know. I really appreciate it. And we're thankful here at Ancient Health Podcast. So everybody, you know where to find her. And I'm so thankful for this interview. We're going to put it out there as quick as we can. And so from all of us here at the Ancient Health Podcast, have a great day. We'll talk to you later. Thanks.

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Remember, true health is about balance, mind, body, and spirit. So stay tuned for more episodes where we continue to explore how ancient wisdom and modern science can work together to help you thrive. Here's to your health, balance, and well-being. I'm Dr. Chris Motley, and I look forward to our next episode together.