IFH 803: From Wrestling Rings to Public Access Mayhem: The Wild Ride of Mad Man Pondo
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Just go to www.nextlevelsoul.tv. Next Level Soul TV, where your soul goes to grow. You are listening to the IFH Podcast Network. For more amazing filmmaking and screenwriting podcasts, just go to ifhpodcastnetwork.com. Welcome to the Indie Film Hustle Podcast, episode number 803. Cinema should make you forget you're sitting in a theater. Roman Polanski.

Broadcasting from the back alley in Hollywood, it's the Indie Film Hustle Podcast, where we show you how to survive and thrive as an indie filmmaker in the jungles of the film biz. And here's your host, Alex Ferrari. Welcome, welcome to another episode of the Indie Film Hustle Podcast. I am your humble host, Alex Ferrari. Today's show is sponsored by Rise of the Filmtrepreneur, how to turn your independent film into a profitable business.

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If you want to order it, just head over to www.FilmBizBook.com. That's FilmBizBook.com. Enjoy today's episode with guest host, Dave Bullis.

Without further ado, this week's episode has a guest who is a pro wrestler, TV personality, and author of the new book, Memoirs of a Madman, which covers his entire 30-year career. It's not just a wrestling book, and he's going to touch on that as well. In this episode, we're going to chat all about becoming an agent for the Jerry Spurrier Show, creating his own public access TV show, participating in a demolition derby, and just generally fun, crazy stories about

And I honestly, this is a guy I've been trying to get on for a while. And then when I saw he came out with this book, I just finally I was able to get him to come on. And finally he agreed and said yes to come on with guest Madman Pondo. Hey, thank you, man, for giving me time to talk about the book and whatever else you want to talk about. And I'm ready to roll when you are.

And, you know, Pondo, it's funny because you and I have actually met way, way back in the CZW days. I was actually I was, you know, I used to go to all those shows back then. And I have a picture somewhere in my room. I have a picture of us and it's you, myself and Bridget the midget.

And it was just hilarious because I always use that photo. And I used to show it to people. And people would be like, it just looks like a story. There's an interesting story behind because Bridget has a bottle of wine with her. And it's just funny because it looks like there's such an interesting story behind it. And I was like, well, let me tell you about Pondo. And then I'll tell you about Bridget. And then I'm not that interesting. But at least you guys are interesting.

There's a bunch of stories behind that. There's actually a few of them in the book. But yeah, Bridget's real cool. We still talk today. I get hit in the head a lot. I can't even remember her having a wine bottle or taking a picture. But yeah, maybe put that on my Facebook sometime, that picture.

Yeah, I will do, Pondo. I'll have to find it. I've been, I, it got kind of lost in the shuffle with all my other stuff as I've moved. But I'm going to find that again and I'll post that. But, you know, just to, just to get started, Pondo, you know, I wanted to ask you how you actually got started, you know, doing all this, all of the wrestling and in the movies. So, you know, just to get started, you know, how did you get involved with wrestling? Did you watch a lot of wrestling growing up?

Man, did I. This is all in the book, but I'll go ahead and tell you. So,

At a very young age, I always realized my family is very reserved and, you know, not like super religious, but just never wanted to be the center of attention. And me and my brother would always go to family dinners on Sunday at my great-grandma and grandpa's house. And everything, you know, was pretty calm. But the cool thing was,

When Evansville Wrestling, Channel 7, would come on out of Memphis, Tennessee, Jerry the King Lawler and Bill Dundee and all them guys, my great-grandma and grandpa would lose their nuts. Talking about dirty motherfuckers and me and my brother, we were just blown back that

my great grandma and grandpa was talking like this, but it made me an instant fan of professional wrestling. Just the good time that I would have listening to them. So, uh, at an early age, I told my mom and my dad that that's what I was going to do. I was going to be a professional wrestler. And my mom to this day still has a paper from my school, uh, grade school, uh,

It said, draw a picture of what you want to be when you grow up. And kids were drawing police officers and doctors and, you know, KISS-ass kids was drawing teachers. Well, mine had a ring with two stick people wrestling, you know, getting ready to wrestle each other. And that's what I put. I want to be a professional wrestler. So my mom still has that paper today and she,

Over the years, that's what you would hear. I want to be a professional wrestler. I want to be a professional wrestler. So then, you know, I was, okay, so I'll give you this scenario. I lived in Flora, Illinois. An hour and a half to the west was St. Louis, Missouri, which had Wrestling at the Chase. An hour to the south was Carmichael, Illinois, Harrisburg, Illinois, and Enfield, Illinois, and that had Angelo Poffo's ICW.

An hour and a half to the east was Evansville, Indiana, that had CWA, which turned into USWA, Jerry King, Miller, Bill Dundee. Five hours to the north was Chicago that just had everything. You know, AWA, WWF, and WCW, and Windy City, and all these companies.

And there was a guy named Roy West Jr. And as long as you did good in school, he would take you, you know, to these wrestling shows. So I've been going to live wrestling shows since childhood. And then, excuse me, and then I was friends with a college teacher named Milton Smith.

And he called me on the phone one time and said, hey, I have a professional wrestler in my class. And I said, please get the guy's telephone number. He got it to me. And he said, are you trying to get tickets out of the guy? And I said, no, this is my chance. I'm going to call this guy and become a professional wrestler. The guy's name was Terry Runyon.

And he was at a team called the sensational hillbillies. Excuse me. I'm so sorry. I wrestled last night and I was healed. I yelled. Now my throat's all scratchy, but, uh, so I called Terry Ruggin and started school that very next week with, uh, a guy named Bud Chapman out of Allney, Illinois. Both those guys are, uh, passed away now, but, uh,

They were both the two that gave me a chance at professional wrestling. And, you know, it's not just on my account, but everybody that was in that class says that I'm the one that, you know, I'm the only one that went far out of Bud Chapman's school, which makes me feel pretty good. But that's where it started. It wasn't hardcore. It was just basic wrestling. So, yeah.

After I learned as much as I could out of Bud Chapman, Chris Champion, who just passed away also, I started going down and wrestling for him. And then Bill Dundee at his furniture store in Evansville, I started wrestling for him. And things just took off. And then I met Ian Rotten and became retarded, landed in stuff, and here I am today. Yeah.

And no worries, Bondo, about your voice, by the way. I'm actually sick right now. So if I said a little bad or you hear me hacking or something, that's what's wrong with me. But you mentioned wrestling school and how you had to get connected. And do you look around today and you see all these different wrestling schools?

I mean, do you ever think to yourself, like, my God, it's kind of the ease of sort of access is so much easier now because, you know, they're publicly, you know, mentioned these schools now. Like, you know what I mean? Like, they're possibly promoted and they're all over the place now. We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor. And now back to the show.

Well, I will say this, but when I got into wrestling, things were so much rougher. Like, I hear kids today get trained and not what job or, you know, don't pick me up and body slightly. Just ridiculous stuff that I hear today. But the thing about it is, when I got into wrestling...

Then we got me and my best friend, Leslie Thompson, which, you know, we always called Flick. It was Pondode Flick, week after week after week, trying to show these guys that this is where we wanted to be. You know, we'd go home with black eyes, busted lips. These guys didn't give too much care about our welfare. And, uh,

finally flick Stobie. He's like, man, I'm not paying to go down there and just get my ass kicked week after week. I'm like, well, it's going to pay off someday. Trust me. Well, he quit. I kept going. And now I'm the only one, you know, there was two others where I got a small break. Now I'm the only one. So for about another three weeks, it was pretty bad. But, uh,

Fridays for more students came and things got easier on me because I wasn't the new guy anymore. Plus, I'm kind of funny, so everybody kind of liked me, you know. So everything fell into place for me as a school. But, you know, I don't hate on how many restful schools there are because the thing about it is, say there's 10 restful schools in the area, there's going to be one to two stars there.

that go far out of those schools. So, you know, who knows if, say, Joey Ryan, who's pretty huge now, if he didn't go to one of those one out of 10 schools, would he be a star today? So,

You know, those wanted kids schools just like me. I branched out, kept going, and, you know, I'm not a star, but whatever you think about me is what I am. But, you know, you got to have schools for future stars. And since we're on the subject, I'll also say, you know, it's just like what you said. Okay, so...

Always make sure the school that you go to can help you get a little farther. The Rio Honor School, Les Thatcher School, Tutankhamen has a school. Guys like that that can get you just a little farther to help you get your name out there. Billy Bob's School or

John Smith's school that he just bought a ring and put up in a barn and all the dressers have tennis shoes, maybe not the best choice. Always make sure the school we go to has a little bit of rep to it to where you should go a little farther.

Yeah, yeah, that's good advice, Pondo. Because I even saw that Gangrel has a school now, and Ricky Morton has a school now. So I figure that... They have an excellent school. Yeah, I figure most wrestling fans have heard of either one of those guys. Right. She has a school out of California. There's guys that... I mean, I'm not saying this about every school that people...

People don't know about, but, you know, just make sure whoever owns the school that they care about the other wrestlers, not just the guy who says, hey, make sure your dues are paid and has everybody else go in and train you, you know. Always make sure it's somebody who cares about you.

Right, exactly.

You know, Pando, one of the stories that I can't remember if it's in the book, but I remember hearing this. You tell the story on Hannibal's podcast where, you know, you wanted to you had the opportunity to go to Japan to wrestle and you had to drive all the way home to make a tape.

Um, I, I think that I love that story because that just shows you, you know, determination. And I, I love stories like that because it's kind of like, you know, what are you willing to do or how are you willing to pay your dues to sort of follow your dreams? Um, so if you, if you don't mind, you know, would you mind retelling that story? Uh, just for those listening, I was wrestling, uh, Abdullah the butcher in Overland, Missouri. And, uh,

I believe I was even legal. I believe I was living in either Florida, Illinois or Louisville, Kentucky, man. I swear my brains are beat out and I forget things so much, but, uh, I'm doing the butcher.

after we got done wrestling, was really happy with that match. He said, kid, you got it, you know. You need to go to Japan. And when he said that, I was flabbergasted of excitement. So he said, I'll tell you what, I'm going to Japan in four days.

So if you could get me a videotape by the time I come back, when I go back to Japan, I will take your videotape and see what I can't do for you. I didn't let that slide. You know, I was so excited I couldn't sleep anyway. So...

From Olin, Missouri, I drove straight home, got my two VCRs together, put the cables in, stayed up all night making this videotape, and was at the post office when it opened. I think I rested them on a Friday, so it was going to be open from 9 to noon. The post office was going to be open from 9 to noon on Saturday. Went to the post office.

overnighted, I don't remember, back then it wasn't as bad as what it is now. I think it was like 24 bucks or something like that. Overnighted this videotape to Abdullah's restaurant and within three days he called me on the phone and said, damn champ, you really want to go to Japan, don't you? And I said, yes sir, I do. He took the videotape that time and the next time he went, I was going too.

So not only was he telling the truth, but he also realized the determination that, you know, that was my dream. Never WWE, WCW, none of the big companies. My dream was I wanted to go to Japan and wrestle. And 43 trips there and back, I believe I exceeded my dream pretty hard.

Yeah. And it also shows again, you know, what I was just saying before, you know, it really just shows you were willing to just do whatever it took because, you know, other people would may have just been like, well, shit, I don't have anything ready. Do I really want to drive all the way back? Then have to edit a tape together, then send it out. You know what I mean? Like, so you actually just, you know, just drove back and it was like, wasn't even a thought. It was like, I had no other option. I guess I just got to do this.

All the way home, I was thinking of what matches to put on this videotape. So if that tells you...

how determined I was, but you know, like, uh, I remember, and I had it for the longest time and I don't anymore. I've been divorced and broke up with chicks so much that, or they broke up with me, but stuff's get left behind. But I had this napkin that had the matches that I wanted to put on it and the, uh, the listing of, of how I wanted to do it. So, uh, yeah, uh,

the minute he said that, that's all I could think of was, hell yeah, I can't wait to get home and make this tape. And another funny thing, yeah, when Hannibal, when I was on his podcast, he asked me, he was like, so how'd you get in the pen? And I was like, man, I,

I was hoping you wouldn't ask for this, but Abdullah got me over there. But it wasn't as uncomfortable as what I thought it was. But, yeah, he really didn't even act like it fazed him. And so there's that story. So when you finally were able to go to Japan, I mean, that was your dream. So that first, you know, that first tour, that first day that you kind of set foot on Japanese soil, you know, what did that feel like, Pondo?

Well, of course, this was before cell phones. But there was a thing at the airport that said, welcome to Japan. I just sat there and I looked at it for a minute. And then some people walking by, I had them take my picture. You know, of course, it wasn't a digital picture. It was a... This was before...

anything modern so it was just one of those little uh disposable cameras but uh i took like four or five pictures in front of the sign that said welcome to japan we'll be right back after a word from our sponsor and now back to the show because i i had made it you know that was the dream and there i was i had three dreams growing up i wanted to be an abolitionist

I wanted to marry an Asian chick. I wanted to wrestle in Japan. And I pretty well exceeded all three. And so you actually did end up going into a demolition derby? I sure did. My car was decked out in horror movies. I had Jason Leatherface, Freddie, Michael Byers, Tall Man, Jack Nicholson from The Shining. I mean, my car looked...

Looked like something out of a comic book when I was done. But yeah, my buddies, Sam Delaney and Robert Delaney, knew how bad I wanted to be in the Demolition Derby. They sold me a car for 200 bucks, helped me put it together, and yep, I got into a Demolition Derby. So did you end up winning?

No, not a lot. Maybe I didn't understand that you're not supposed to hit people hard and save your car. And there was a guy who was kind of sandbagging right around the entrance to where he wouldn't get pushed up on a log. So I went from one end of the track to the other, hit this guy,

And when I did it, knocked my accelerator off. It was like it was laying down on the floor. And after that, I knew I was done. See, I would have made that same mistake, Pondo. I would always say that the idea is to just wreck as much stuff as possible. Right. So, yeah, I mean, hey, you know, that's awesome, man. You're able to at least do that. And by the way, that's a really cool idea for a car, by the way. It was so cool. And, of course, my number was Friday the 13th.

So 513 was the name of the car? Yes. Nice. Number 13. That's really cool, man. Would you ever do another demolition derby? There is a tag team called the Mercy Brothers. They're out of Strictly of Fame Pro Wrestling in Crossrail, Illinois. And there is a demolition derby where you can have a rider with you.

And one of them asked me if I wanted to ride with him at the Demolition Derby. And I said, hell yeah, I'm there until January. I'm not going to be driving, but I will be at another Demolition Derby. That's cool. So you're going to be kind of like, you can actually give him advice too. You might tell him like, hey, look, don't just smash. Don't drive across the track full speed and smash into somebody. I think he's done a few. So I think, you know, he's got it. But that was my first and only one. And I didn't have it at all.

I would again, but I would have made that same mistake. Right. So, you know, as you continue your career, you know, you were doing wrestling and all the independence. You got to you actually started your own public access show. And this is really cool because, you know, I again, I've heard the story before and I read it in your book, but you were able to start your own public action show called Skull Talk TV. And you know,

You know, it's so interesting. So could you tell everybody, you know, how you got able to, how were you able to start this show and, you know, what the whole theme and format of the show was? Well, I was working for IWA Mid-South and an older gentleman, like, I don't think, I don't even think I saw him at another show.

But an older gentleman was coming over and telling me he really liked my stuff, you know, that I was a good character. And he started telling me that this wrestling should be on TV here in Louisville for... He said there's a company called... I can't even remember what it was called. Excuse me. Let me get a drink real quick. And he...

You know, they're wrestling horrible. He said, you know, you guys should try and do something on public access. I told him, I said, well, Ian sells these DVDs. I'm pretty sure he's not going to give them away free on a public access show. So he said, you know, I try to watch public access as much as I can, but one of the biggest problems with it is

They could do whatever they want on public access. And I was like, really? He was like, yeah, they could cuss and they could say as much as the F word on there. I was like, I'm appalled.

And the next thing he said, and you know what else I could do? They could have nudity on there. And I was like, no kidding. And I just act like I was so disgusted. But by the next week or two, I had a public access show on there just by that guy telling me what I could and couldn't do. But it was called Skull Talk. It was one of the best and worst ideas I ever had. I...

I was a big tape trader back in the day, but I still had a whole bunch of those videotapes. And what I did was I would put together, I had two VCRs, and I would edit everything myself. And I would have topless or naked girls sitting on my lap, and I would introduce different wrestling matches, and then we would play them. And it was just a half-hour show. But, you know, I'd have, like,

Old matches from Florida with Jimmy Del Rey. I do believe I had a... I don't remember what the matches was, but the cool thing was I had these naked chicks sitting on my lap for no apparent reason, just that there was naked chicks sitting on my lap. Now, one of the rules... Well, not one, but there was a few rules

You couldn't advertise anything. You couldn't show penis, which I wouldn't anyway. And you couldn't show penetration. Well, this was back when Web TV. Do you remember Web TV? Yeah. Yeah, I had a Web TV. Well, you could put your email address at the bottom there. So I put my Web TV address, which would really aggravate everybody, was

Mad Man Pondo in da house, which was long enough. And then you had to put at WebTV.com. So everybody who was best to me had to write out that whole thing. Mad Man Pondo in da house. So that was at the bottom, which my every episode, my inbox would just be full of

50-50. 50% of people, oh, I love this show. This is so funny. What a great idea. The other 50 was all hate. And I think the public eye show, I think they was having a little fun with either me or the other shows. But I was in the middle of two religious church shows.

There would be a religious church show, naked chicks on my lap, and then another religious church show. And this one preacher...

Every episode would just write this. He'd put scripture in my inbox and tell me how fast I was going to hell. Just all this stuff. So finally it got down to being a little bored of it. And I had a girl...

use a vibrator on ourselves. And that was considered penetration. So they called me on the phone and said, I'm sorry, we're not going to be able to play your TV show anymore. Which, because I was kind of bored, because the girls were such a problem. You know, what you think could take 10, 15 minutes was taking hours because the girls had to pee or, you know, they wanted to check their makeup, all this shit. So,

I really just let it go, and that was after, I believe, 17 episodes. And finally, after maybe a month, month and a half, the public access people called me back and said, we was wondering if you could keep on doing those shows because people was ordering cable just to watch your shows. And by then, I was done with it. I said, no, I'm not interested. Thank you. But it was a good feeling knowing that

that many people watched it or talked about it to the public access show that they would call me and ask me to come back. Yeah. Cause I, I imagine cause they, they weren't really going to pay you anyway. So you're probably, you know, it was kind of like a, you know, really a no brainer for you. Right? Right. Exactly. We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor and now back to the show. So, you know, Pana, you mentioned the girls, you know, how would you approach girls, you know, to come on, to come on skull talk?

Tower of Doom was running a company in Cincinnati, Ohio. And there was all these strippers around. So that's where it started first. The strippers from his shows. And then every episode I would put on Web TV, hey, if you'd like to appear, if you're a hot chick and you'd like to appear on...

public access on my show, please email me. Well, then the email started coming in. And out of every 10 girls, you might get one or two. But that wasn't enough for me, you know, because it was coming to my house and we would put up a backdrop and

and uh film them but uh like i said it was just like one would say oh yeah i'm so into this and then you know you're waiting on her one hour two hours and finally you're like all right she's not coming but uh when those ones that did show up you'd be excited about it you're like all right we got another episode two and like i said two or three hours into them just uh

Being divas, it was just so rough, so rough at the end of the night. So, yeah, I was ready for it to stop, but couldn't stop because, one, I was just so into the TV show because I would go to wrestling shows and people would say, man, I saw that Skull Talk episode. It was so awesome. And two, I couldn't let these religious guys beat me.

But there was even a point where I took my own videotape to the public access station. And as I was walking in, the guy that had a religious show on before mine was walking out. And we didn't say nothing to each other, but he stared at me all the way in and I stared at him all the way. You know, so.

Yeah, I mean, it was time for it to stop. And when they called to see if I would continue, I had already taken a break from it and didn't have the headaches and the problems with it. And I was like, nah, I'm not interested.

Yeah, especially when you're doing it for love of the game, right? Because I had a friend of mine who was, he used to do photography and every so often, like, you know, he did professional photography. You know, he did different models and stuff. So every so often, you know, friends of his

would say, hey, I want to come in and would you give me a discount on something? So he would generally just say, hey, look, we've known each other for a while. If you come in on a Sunday at like, I don't know, like noon or whatever, or 10 a.m., he's like, I'll give you a whole session for free because I'm not going to nickel and dime you. And they would say, oh, thank you. I can't wait. And he would drive to his studio

Right, exactly.

You wouldn't think it would. You'd think it would just be something so easy of somebody coming in, sitting on my lap. You know, they don't have to talk. They don't have to do nothing. They just have to show their kids. That's it. But that was just such a chore for time after time. And you're just like, I'm sick of this. Yeah. Which is really saying something when a guy says, man, I'm sick of these titties. Get these out of here. Yeah.

That should be a quote from you, Pondo. I'm sick of these titties. Get them out of here. There you go. Pondo, in your book, by the way, I have to ask, you said on the public access, you turned it on one day and there was a show called I Eat Poop. Yes, that was the old guy.

told me about the shows, I started watching some public headsets to see what the guy was talking about, and that was one of the shows, i.e. Poop.

So, I guess this is a dumb question on my part. Is it exactly what it sounds like, or is it completely different? No, it was just four or five guys doing their best at Saturday Night Live skits, but failing horribly. But they would train the fuck word, and they would have a...

girls with small outfits on but not totally nude and I didn't you know it was just funny that there was a show on called I Eat Poop and of course they would cut so people would like it but

Then when Skull Talk came on and there's actual naked girls and, you know, not just tits, there's vaginas. And, you know, I'm fuck this and suck that. And I don't know, I guess it just people were more amazed about that and tuning in. I don't even take, you had to be a wrestling fan to watch my TV show. It was just so a shock value that it was on TV that people would tune in.

But them religious guys, man, they would talk about how terrible it was, but they would watch every episode and write me. So, you know... It's just... Go ahead. No, I was going to say they're closet fans, Pondo. Exactly. Exactly. It kind of reminds me, a few years ago, Howard Stern used to direct people to the... What is it, like the Parents Watch Group? Because basically this Parents Watch Group

on their website they had a collection of all the worst things on the internet I was like oh my god look at this this is awful we gotta boycott this or oh my god look at this well it accidentally became this like hub now for all of this like awful stuff that people

could like, oh, if you want to do something bad, go to the people in charge of decency, quote unquote. And it was like, it was just this big collection of stuff. And then they had to like, they started to realize all these people were coming to their site and it was like, it made it even easier to access all the stuff.

I do the same thing with, there's a website, it's called badnumbers.com. And what badnumbers.com is, it's a website that will put numbers that people...

have called their number, and, you know, it's like the Microsoft scammers or the FBI is about to arrest you if you don't give us this money, scammers. And the reason the wet right was made was so you don't call these telephone numbers.

But I figured if scammers are out to waste our time, we need to waste as much of their time as well. So I'll go to that site, I'll find a bad number, and I'll get a bunch of friends around and I'll start fucking with these scammers. So kind of like the same, what you just said with the Howard Stern one. That seems like that would be a pretty funny TV show or podcast, Pondo. I hear you. Maybe I'll try to do that.

And if you do that, just remember your old pal Dave. I'll do it. So, buddy, after you did Skull Talk TV, you ended up becoming a producer for the Jerry Springer Show. I wouldn't call me a producer. I would call me a hired hand. I mean, I was just getting them guests, and they was giving me a check, so...

And all I had to do was call in. And, and of course all my friends are show offs to fight me and was ready to go. So it was, it was a win-win situation for everybody. So, so how did they go about contacting you to, to come on the show and to sort of be the hired hand for them? Well, uh,

My buddy, Ace Craft, got on the Jerry's Freedia show and they asked him, do you know any crazy people? And of course, he showed them my videos. And I was on the show twice.

And finally they asked, hey, do you know any crazy people yourself? And I said, I'm a wrestler. I know all types of crazy people. So I just started getting wrestlers or fans and putting them on the show. And that's the thing I know. I got $800 check, $600 check. And I was like, well, this is easy. But just like the Skoltov show, after a while it just got so boring because

They wanted you on call 24 hours. If they needed somebody at 2, 3, 4 in the morning, they would call you and say, hey, we need this. Well, who the hell are you going to get at 2 or 3 or 4 in the morning? So, but they were very demanding, you know. And then when you said, well, I don't know who I'm going to get. Well, we've been paying you and we've been, you know, it just became bullshit and I didn't want to do it no more. So I stopped.

Yeah, I can imagine getting called two or three in the morning and just being like, hey, Bondo, we need a, you know, a couple to come on the show or whatever. And you're like, well, how am I supposed to get that right now? It's, you know, it's three o'clock in the morning and, you know, they may be halfway across the country. We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor. And now back to the show. Right, exactly.

So, you know, Ponda, what were some of the crazy people you met while doing Springer? I know in the book you mentioned that you met Butterbean. Yeah, Butterbean. Rod Jeremy was there for one. And one of the Backstreet Boys. I don't listen to him, so I don't remember who it was. But he was just there to work. I guess they was doing a concert somewhere in the area. And he was at the show to...

to watch, not to be on the show, but I got to meet him. And plus, when you would go to the circus, it wasn't the circus that would draw me in. It was the small freak show before the circus. Jerry Springer's show, From Green Room to Green Room, was its own freak show that I just loved. And they would fly me in to hang out with

you know, the people that I was getting on the show. So I was able to go to Green Room to Green Room to Green Room. And, man, I'm telling you, there was some strange ones, some hot ones, some ugly ones, some misshaped ones. I mean, that Jerry's Fear of Green Rooms was a freak show all in itself, and it would draw me in.

So you mentioned, you know, I actually I mentioned Butterbean, you know, so was he was he there to be a guest on the show? Yes, but he was in the back with us first. He wasn't like waiting in line. I guess his manager had called the Springer show and said, hey, Butterbean would be interested in coming in. So, of course, I put him on the front row. And and ironically, that was.

I got all the guests for that show except two. And two of the guests that I got was the Bumpin' Uglies. And my buddy Bubba was like challenging Butterbean.

to get up on stage and fight him. So, uh, you know, just, it was, yeah, Butterbean and, and, uh, Ron Jammie. I don't remember why he was there. He was on the show though for that. I do believe, I don't remember, but you know,

Just any little perk that you got. And of course, I got to hang out with Jerry every once in a while. Steve didn't really care for me, so I didn't really get to hang out with Steve all that much. But Jerry Springer was a really nice guy. He would talk to us and stuff. He would go from green room to green room and welcome everybody there. So I got to meet him a lot, be in all these green rooms. It was a fun experience, but

When it's time to go, it's time to go, you know.

Yeah, I definitely know what you mean. Just to sort of follow up with Butterbean, you mentioned him fighting, or somebody challenging him to fight him on stage. Do you remember when Butterbean fought in the Brawl for All in WWF? I do, yeah. What are your thoughts on that whole Brawl for All thing? I remember when Butterbean knocked out Bart Gunn in like 20 seconds, but what did you think about that whole competition that was actually legit? Oh, yeah.

I mean, of course I was. I couldn't take my eyes off of it. But I'll tell you a funny story. Do you remember Bart Gunn won one of those? I know he got beat down by Butterbean. I don't remember the situation. But Bart Gunn won one of those brawl for it all. And he brought the trophy to IWA Mid-South. And he said he would get it when he came back. And he never came back.

So the original trophy was sitting in the locker room of IWA Mid-South for, I bet, a whole year. But it was the original trophy from Brawford Hall. You know, big tall thing about, I bet it came up to my shoulder. You would think somebody who won that trophy would want it back, but it was just there for some reason. So whatever happened to it? You know, I don't know, but...

Ian probably sold it on eBay for something. I don't know, but it was there for, I remember, a long time. Yeah, it would have been kind of funny if you had taken it and been like, you're the Brawl for All champion, you know?

Nah, I'm not. That'd be like a target on my forehead saying something like that. I ain't having them guys beat the shit out of me. Nah, I'm just kidding, Pondo. Plus, you're such an awesome guy. I can't imagine. I do remember in the Brawl for a while when Bart Gunn beat Dr. Death. That was kind of an upset. And they thought Dr. Death was going to win the whole thing. Do you remember that? I do, yeah.

They was pumping it up. I don't even think Mark Gunn had a promo. It was Dr. Debt doing promos all through the thing. And that thing, you know, Mark Gunn just knocked him out.

Yeah. And then, and then they had him had him fight Butterbean. And I mean, I mean, that, that was, I mean, I mean, Butterbean, you know, he's, I don't know how you classify Butterbean if he's like an amateur or a professional or somewhere in between. But I mean, that guy, I mean, he was a legit fighter regardless of.

I actually saw that fight, and when I saw that, within the first couple of seconds, Butterby knocked Bart Gunn down, and then I think a couple of seconds later, he just gave him that right hook. I mean, he dropped Bart Gunn, and I think Bart Gunn kind of left after that, right? I can't remember. I think that was his demise. I think when he lost that, that was more or less his ticket out.

Yeah, but yeah, just to kind of tie this all in, I'm surprised he actually left that trophy there in the locker room. Do you think maybe he just forgot where he left it? Or just didn't give two shits about it. One of the two. Yeah, that's true. Yeah.

But now I guess it's kind of lost or it was sold somewhere on eBay. But that's interesting as hell, man. But just to continue along, I just want to say, Pando, I read your book from cover to cover. And when I heard it was coming out, I was really excited because, again, I followed your career for a while. When I used to watch wrestling, I haven't watched wrestling since probably 2004 or 2005.

Um, right around when I graduated high school and I just kind of, I just got kind of, uh, kind of got out of it. But, um, but, uh, you know, the, your, your book memoirs of a, of a madman, it's sitting right here next to me. Um, I have some, I actually marked up some pages, so I, I, you know, had some things that, you know, I was like, Oh, I better ask him about this. I want to ask him more about this. But, uh, you know, where did you start to, you know, one, you know, uh, get, you know, sort of get the impetus to write your own book.

There was, uh, John Cosper wrote another book called Eat, Sleep, Wrestle. And he had asked me, uh, I don't even remember what the question he asked me, but I had a couple of paragraphs in that book and people kept asking John Cosper, Hey, if Madman Pondo wrote a couple of, uh,

paragraphs, you should do a book on him. It'd be really funny and entertaining. So John Costner kept asking me, you know, hey, I want to do a book on you. Are you interested? And, you know, to me,

I don't know if it's the humbleness in me or just the, the, uh, fright of, of, uh, nobody giving a shit. But, you know, I was, I was really on the fence about, I don't know, you know, I don't know about being a book cause I didn't want a book written about me and then walking in like the dollar tree. And it's, it's even half off at the dollar tree, you know, just some shit like that. But,

finally people started coming to me and saying hey you should write a book and they didn't even know that John Cosper was making me the proposition

So then I started thinking, you know, maybe, maybe people would read my book. So I went to John Cosworth and I said, all right, let's do it. Let's write this Batman Pondo book. And when I finally did agree to do the book, he was also working on Dr. D David Schultz's book, which is also available. And, uh,

So it took longer to get the book written because he was really focusing in on that. And there was a lot of stuff he had to go over. But on his free time, we would meet at Denny's or his house and work on my book. And then finally, when he was done with Dr. D's, we just focused in on it, got it done and

There it is in front of you. But I just want everybody to know that, yes, I'm a wrestler, but this book isn't all about my wrestling career. I put things that I messed up in my life, funny things that I did on the road. I believe there is a...

A whole conversation with a Nigerian scammer in there. I made it in a comic book that's in there. It's full of pictures, a few that I've taken over the years. We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor. And now, back to the show.

So much in this book. And after it came out, John Cosper wrote me. He said, hey, you're the number one wrestling autobiography on Amazon. I was like, holy shit, are you kidding me? So it showed me that people did really want to hear what I had to say. But in reality, I was just the newest book. And then Shinsuke wrote his. And then, you know, that number one fight.

got the shit kicked out of it. But I was a number one something on Amazon, which is a pretty big thing for me. So like I said, you should get this book on amazon.com or you can contact John Cosper and get your own autographed copy at eat sleep wrestle.com. And I'm going to, I'm going to link to everything, uh, Pano and I just talked about there in the show notes, everybody, uh, Pano, I just want to ask you real quick. Um, what is your favorite story from the book?

I don't know if it's my favorite story, but as you read the book, you saw that I held on to a story and never told anybody. And then finally, when I was writing the book, I was like, you know what? Let's put this in there. And it was the Junksyard Dog story. Did you like that story? Yeah, I did, actually.

That was the one. That was the story that I held on to for my 29 years of wrestling. And I was like, you know what? Fuck it. Let's put it in there. So let's not ruin it for everybody what the Jack Garrett Dog story is. But that was probably my favorite one that I put in the book.

Yeah, we won't ruin the story. But I have two favorite stories from the book. One is the Abdul the Butcher story. And the other one is the Joe LaDuke story. Yeah. Both those are... I get asked a lot about that Joe LaDuke story.

Because I think that's hilarious because I can just see something like, you know, we'll call it an unfortunate series of events happening. Things just keep getting worse and worse. And you can't... Wrong place at the wrong time. Yeah, it's just like whatever could have went wrong in that story went wrong for you, Pondo. Like, from the get-go, it was bad. It was real bad. Yeah.

But he made me a star at my school, so the hell, you know. Yeah, it all worked out in the end. So, you know, Pondo, we've been talking for about, you know, roughly 50 minutes now. So just in closing, is there anything you sort of want to say to put a period at the end of this whole conversation? Well, we didn't cap on it, but

I've started my own all-girls wrestling company. It's called Girl Fight Wrestling. You can go to Facebook and search Girl Fight. It'll be the first thing that pops up. And, you know, it's a platform for newer girls to network and get to work with the vet girls online.

So I'm pretty proud of it. And we have another one. We did one called Midnight Girl Fight. We drew pretty good for it. So the night before Thanksgiving, we're going to have another Midnight Girl Fight. And what that is, we start at 11.59 because if I started it at midnight, oh, my God, you can't believe how many people thought.

a Friday show was going to be on a Saturday you know it was just a big headache so I changed the flyer and uh it starts on 11 59 on Wednesday and uh it's just a good time you know I mean uh people come out at midnight and it's still uh really loud and they're all uh having a good time but uh you know

pick up a girl fight DVD or, uh, uh, whatever and, and see what we're all about. But, uh, girl fight, that's my, uh, my all girls wrestling company. Yeah. And I'll, I'll make sure to link to that in the show notes is, uh, is there any, uh, social media sites that people can find you at Pondo?

Uh, you know, I'm real terrible about that shit, but, uh, my name's Kevin Kennedy, C-A-N-A-D-Y, and I'm on Facebook, and I do have an Instagram and a Twitter, but I don't know. For the longest time on Twitter, I was writing people, and they wasn't writing me back, and I'm like, what an asshole, but I didn't know you had to put at at the beginning of who you're trying to

Right. So I was the asshole. But anyway, Facebook is probably the easiest one. And that's Kevin Kennedy, C-A-N-A-D-Y. I think there's a picture of me and Elvira. Yeah, it is. It's me and Elvira is my profile pic right now. And I'll link that in the show notes. By the way, I think, Pondo, I think you're at your friend's cap because I actually sent you a friend request and it just said, I think you were at your limit.

Oh, really? Well, I'll delete some people. I don't give a shit. Yeah. Thank you. You make room. This makes room for me. Uh, uh, but, uh, man, man, Pondo, I'm going to say thank you so much for coming on, man. Oh, thank you for giving me the time, man. Like, uh, you can't wrestle enough to, to keep on living after you die. So things like this help my name stay out there. Thank you so much.

I want to thank Dave so much for doing such a great job on this episode. If you want to get links to anything we spoke about in this episode, head over to the show notes at indiefilmhustle.com forward slash 803. And if you haven't already, please head over to filmmakingpodcast.com. Subscribe and leave a good review for the show. It really helps us out a lot, guys. Thank you again so much for listening, guys. As always, keep that hustle going. Keep that dream alive. Stay safe out there, and I'll talk to you soon.

Thanks for listening to the Indie Film Hustle podcast at IndieFilmHustle.com. That's I-N-D-I-E-F-I-L-M-H-U-S-T-L-E.com.