Rice & Raya all-but seal second
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Did you know that foreign investors are quietly funding lawsuits in American courts through a practice called third-party litigation funding? Shadowy overseas funders are paying to sue American companies in our courts, and they don't pay a dime in U.S. taxes if there is an award or settlement. They profit tax-free from our legal system, while U.S. companies are tied up in court, and American families pay the price to the tune of $5,000 a year. But

But there is a solution. A new proposal before Congress would close this loophole and ensure these foreign investors pay taxes, just like the actual plaintiffs have to.

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The Athletic FC Podcast Network.

The only way to score is, of course, to play with a hand break off. Hello, I'm Ian Stone. This is Hand Break Off, the Arsenal podcast brought to you by The Athletic. Yesterday, the Arsenal secured Champions League football, beating Newcastle 1-0 at the Emirates. And it looks like we've got a second place as well, unless something mad happens next weekend. To reflect on the game,

I'm joined by Adrian Clark and Amy Lawrence. Good morning. Hello. Morning. Morning. Let's just discuss for a minute before we get into the game. Eddie Howe and Jason, whatever his name is, complaining about time wasting. Yeah.

They were moaning right in front of us about us time wasting. Not that we were particularly, but the hypocrisy of it. Adrian, the downright, come on, mate. Have a look at yourself in the mirror-ness.

of it. It was outrageous. Yeah, no, they got no right to complain about time waste in Newcastle, that's for sure. What was it? 58 minutes ball in play the other year? Yeah, but yeah, it's nice to see the shoe on the other foot, isn't it? I've never been that hypocritical, I believe, but it's possible I have. What about you, Adrian? Can I be hypocritical? Yeah, I think so. Probably when I'm watching my kids play football.

because I'm one of those parents that probably slaughters other parents for like being a bit busy and a bit overexcited and a bit over keen like oh aren't they taking it a bit seriously you know I'll bitch about that and

And then, of course I do. Of course I get caught up in it and I'm getting all angsty and wound up and everything like that. I can't really find it hard. I really find it hard not to sort of get sucked in. So yeah, me complaining that other parents are taking it too seriously when actually...

I take it probably more seriously than they do. So, yeah, hands up. I mean, kids, that's the one, really. Amy, do you get busy, a little bit busy as age? I love that. I'm going to use that expression, by the way. Do you get a little bit busy with your kids? I imagine you do. I can see you screaming on a touchline. I have seen you screaming on a touchline, to be fair. I think my hypocrisy really mostly is within the home. I sometimes actually...

like almost as I'm shouting at my children to you know pick up their mess and not drop the

things all over the floor, I'm literally thinking you are. So how can you be saying that? While you're dropping things on the floor. Yeah, exactly, exactly, exactly. You wouldn't see me doing that. Oh, no, I'm guilty of that as well, Amy, yeah. Yeah, yeah. And having to have various conversations with him about certain life experiences that you want to try and advise them on, and I'm thinking, how have I got the gall? LAUGHTER

To be trying to say this with a straight face. In fact, I don't even remember what the details were, but I do remember at one point having to tell one of them...

and having to look the other way because I thought I'm going to burst out laughing here. I knew my face was not serious. You can't tell them off when you're laughing. It just ruins the effect. It does. They normally laugh at me when I tell them off. They just don't take me seriously. I can't see you as much of a teller-offer, Adrian. I'm a terrible teller-offer. I'm really bad. Yeah.

Yeah, well, I've never been hypocritical personally. I'm straight down the line myself. But you guys, with your human failings, that's fair enough. I understand. Most people have them. My kids are very talented, though, I must say. Anyway, Arsenal 1, Newcastle 0. We beat them. We beat them. And Amy, you said to me, we had a little phone chat just before we came on, that you tried to start off second again, and it didn't really go down well. Can I just say that I did the same thing? Not nice.

I'm not saying that it didn't go down well. It just didn't quite catch fire. There were people around that were kind of, you know, smiling and laughing or a few people joined in, you know, but obviously an ironic representation of that song, I think is absolutely in order. Yeah. Take ownership of it. Yeah. I think that would be the best way of,

making other sets of supporters who would like to sing that, you know, realise it's not really worth drawing breath. I love that. No, I love it, Amy. Well done. I think that's a great shot. But I also, I also, you know, I don't know. It's one of those things where you don't open social media for the kind of divisions that you get in terms of people who,

regard second is like, yeah, you got to be winning stuff. I think personally in the current era of football with the amount of, you know, crazy funds that are thrown around, some of which when rules are kind of bent to the nth degree, you

you know, finishing second is actually, it is an achievement. I mean, it's not the achievement that everybody wants. It's not the ultimate achievement that we all dream of, but it's not nothing. And it's something that pretty much everyone else in the league, apart from one team each season, would be happy with. And I think given all the circumstances that Mikel has talked about at times, when it got to it, people were, there were some people around me looking at, you know, discussing things before the game.

that Arsenal might lose and then lose at Southampton and other teams would do this and then Arsenal wouldn't even be in the Champions League and like might Arsenal finish sixth and there's a sort of slight neuroses going on in some quarters.

And I didn't, I wasn't too worried about that. But on the other hand, I was, it did feel like it mattered to me to finish second and not relinquish that. Yeah, kind of. I'd said before the weekend that I didn't really care where we finished. Yeah.

as long as we were in the Champions League. But actually... Until you saw Jason Tindall. Yeah, it was probably a lie. I actually did care. But on your ironic song, which I really like, by the way, second again at ALA, because like you say, it takes ownership of it and it stops people hammering us.

I was at Walsall, the playoff game on Friday night. And Walsall had, I think, a 15 or 17 point lead at the top and somehow didn't get automatic promotion in League Two. They collapsed and they're in the playoffs and they've reached Wembley. And the whole stadium was singing top of the league. And we effed it up. Really? Yeah, it was brilliant. And I just thought that's exactly the same as what you're saying there in terms of like, you know, just own it.

and sort of have a little bit of a giggle about it. And yeah, it seemed to help the players. So yeah, I love all that. I think we've lost a little bit of self-mockery that used to be more frequent in football fandom. You know, even the boring, boring Arsenal stuff that we will all remember from decades past, you know, and that was, I think...

I think we even sang that at Anfield. I mean, it was just like, you know, I do have definite strong memories of winning stuff a long time ago and everyone singing boring, boring Arsenal. And when Arsene turned up and it certainly wasn't boring, singing it even more ironically and,

I think, you know, because everybody takes it all so seriously now and because there's so much of this sort of like social media sort of constant trolling or whatever is going on where it's all about the wind up. People have lost that capacity to have a bit of a giggle at themselves. But it's great if you can do it. Quite. Mikel Arteta was asked that he was talked about being best of the rest of

After the draw at Anfield, he said, any other team I've seen with one injury finishing eighth, fifth, and then he said 16th, 17th. Yeah, that was nice. What my team has done is, in my opinion, incredible. I mean, one, it's great to dig at May Night in Tottenham and an absolute joke that one of them is going to be in the same competition we're in next year.

but hopefully it ruins them. Team spirit though, Adrian, fighting back at Anfield and then beating a Newcastle team who'd come to play. Yeah. And, you know, in the end, we reasonably comfortably, by a few moments when it was a little hairy, particularly in the first half, but I thought...

They didn't have a shot between, I think, the 36th and 75th minute. So we were holding them off quite comfortably for a while. But there is a bravery about this team, isn't there? Yeah, there is a bravery, a bit of courage about them. They've got fight. You know, when really it's not, we're not fighting for the big prize anymore, but fighting for pride and second place and everything.

and whatnot so no that was that was definitely good I think the last couple of games have shown that we can turn games around as well because I think that was something we maybe struggle with a little bit not that we've found ourselves in that many holes this season because we've

been very good starters haven't we and it's kind of managing from the front that's been the issue yeah taking the lead and then giving it away in the last couple of games Liverpool obviously went two up and were flying and we found a way to stay in the game regroup and

and come back with something a bit different. And in the Newcastle game, it was exactly the same. Because let's face it, we were outplayed in the first half, completely and utterly outplayed by Newcastle. Lucky not to be 3-0 down, but for David Rye, it was a brilliant save. But we found a way and we took ownership of the second half, started our half,

We just had loads of the ball. We kept hold of it, pinned them in, played with a bit more aggression, didn't get knocked off the ball as much, got our goal, and then we did a Newcastle on them and said, all right then.

Come and break us down if you think you're good enough. And they weren't. So, yeah, no, it's been nice the last couple of matches to see a kind of a different side to Arsenal. And also it shows that Mikel Arteta does have his finger on the pulse and that he can make these little adjustments to help the team. Yeah, and I like the, at the end, for the laugh of appreciation and then the speeches, and I like Mikel's speech.

and there was a definite feeling in the ground. There's plenty of support for him, isn't there, Romy? I mean, obviously second is not what we wanted, but when you see what the team's been through, and I think it's a fair point, the amount of injuries, Saka out for four months or whatever it was, Erdegaard out for three, Gabriel for half a season, Havertz for half a season, Jesus for most of the season, Tommy Asu, who we hardly talked about, out for most of the season.

We've had so many injuries and we're still above Newcastle and above Manchester City and above Chelsea and above obviously Tottenham and Manchester United. Most teams are above them. West Ham are almost above them. You know, the fans still believe, don't they? I think so. Certainly the fans in the stadium and the fans, I think, who are out there everywhere in the world,

who are able to think and analyze and care and not just get reactionary and get too influenced by, you know, whoever, pundits or big mouths on social media and follow those kind of,

you know, those lines that get spun. Yeah, the narrative. Yeah. I get that people say there comes a... Who was it? I saw somebody that I think possibly ought to have known better saying something like, if Arsenal aren't in the top two by Christmas next season... Merce said that, yeah. They'll be, you know, looking at his position. And I was like, I love Merce. But I thought that was a little bit unnecessary. Come on, Merce. Yeah, but it's not true, is it? But I do understand people saying that, you know,

You've got to win something sooner or later. I'm not against winning stuff. Let's be serious. But it's just trying to be... I'm glad you say that. Yeah, I know. But it's because I am aware that I do tend to try and say, hang on, you know, not everybody can win every year. And it doesn't mean that you're not successful or you haven't achieved. If you don't win, I think you can still have...

a lot of enjoyment, a lot of great things. There's just a finite, small number of things that can be won. And it doesn't always go to the teams who you think necessarily merit it. This is not a dig at Liverpool. I'm more thinking about the Europa League final. But I just don't think that's the only barometer of how well you're doing. And I think that this team is moving in the right direction. And so long as it learns from...

the mistakes because they're not perfect. It's not just everybody else and all the bad luck that has been responsible for not winning. I'm sure that Mikel Arteta and his staff and all the owners and what have you, when they sit down and post-mortem the season, will be mindful of the things they could have done differently. I don't think they think, oh, we were perfect and it was just all these things that happened to us because they know they weren't. So the point is you take that

You analyse it and you put into place the best possible efforts to be better at those things. And that's what they'll do. It feels a very stable club. When you look at the manager, the set of players, the hierarchy, or Edu left last year and is now being replaced by Andrea Berta. But I've looked at some commentary from, say, West Ham fans, obviously, who are just friends of mine who support

other teams whose seasons have been pretty unremittingly awful. It's not that easy to stay competitive in the Premier League or in Europe, you know, year after year. And I think there's a feeling that Arsenal are on a good track. It's not a perfect track, but they're all going to give it everything they've got. And Mikel makes that clear in his speech. And I think he's constantly stressing his thanks. Look at those players. I see how hard they work.

I think it's a nice group there and building on it and not dismantling it is going to be really interesting. Right. And let's just, by the way, the last time we finished second three seasons in a row, we won the double the season after that. So I think it's important to stress that, you know, it's a journey and we're on it. Yeah. You only come to see the Arsenal. Come to see the Arsenal. You only come to see the Arsenal.

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Even when you're missing layups.

Prime.

Prime. One membership. Endless assists. Did you know that foreign investors are quietly funding lawsuits in American courts through a practice called third-party litigation funding? Shadowy overseas funders are paying to sue American companies in our courts, and they don't pay a dime in U.S. taxes if there is an award or settlement.

They profit tax-free from our legal system, while U.S. companies are tied up in court and American families pay the price to the tune of $5,000 a year. But there is a solution. A new proposal before Congress would close this loophole and ensure these foreign investors pay taxes, just like the actual plaintiffs have to.

It's a common sense move that discourages frivolous and abusive lawsuits and redirects resources back into American jobs, innovation, and growth. Only President Trump and congressional Republicans can deliver this win for America and hold these foreign investors accountable. Contact your lawmakers today and demand they take a stand to end foreign-funded litigation abuse. There they go. It's saved!

Adrian, Detlef Rice. Yes. My God. I mean, listen, we won't do player of the season just yet. We'll talk about that at some point. But he's obviously in the frame, particularly the second half of the season, when I think he's been absolutely splendid. And he was pretty knackered by the end.

but that strike we would i mean anyone anyone who gets i mean martin erdogan might have taken a touch on the edge of the box although even he now in the last few weeks but anyone it comes to you're going go and have a shot but you you're so happy when you see detland rice on the end of it aren't you because we know how he can hit it and my god what a beautiful goal yeah i'm kind of jealous you know i had a decent enough left foot back in the day but i'm you know a little bit envious as a

the way that he effortlessly sort of gets so much power in these shots it was it was a brilliant finish and it's why he has to be a box-to-box midfielder now you know he would be wasted sat in front of the back four you know we saw it the PSG semi-final first leg he can do it and he can do it very well but you're not getting the most out of him I mean he's got four now from outside the box well he's

He's got 15 in his Arsenal career, 102 games, as opposed to, sorry, 16 maybe, as opposed to 15 for West Ham in 245 games. So he's playing a different role and we're seeing the benefits of it. Completely, yeah. And I think that he can score...

A lot more, really. Yeah, I don't think he kind of shoots enough. Because what happens, you see, if you've got someone that carries that threat, it draws attention from opponents. So next season, he might not find it as easy to get space in around the box.

But if there's two people going to block a Declan Rice shot, there'll be space to his left and right for someone else maybe. So yeah, it will help the team in the long run. But yeah, I think he could score like double figures most seasons really, in all competitions certainly. So yeah, top player, brilliant. And I thought in this game that the fact that the two heroes were Rice and Raya –

was kind of fitting really. The ones who got us over the line to finish second. Because I do think that those two have both been genuinely excellent, you know. But Raya, the first half of the season, amazing. Second half of the season, Raya stepping up. So yeah, those two are big for us. Just like to shout out Jakub Kivior yesterday. Yeah, definitely. Who I thought was a contender for man of the match. Yep. In spite of the efforts of the two that you just mentioned. I thought that his performance

His performance was, you know, was really on point from the get-go. But then when you see William Saliba doesn't come out for the second half and he shifts from the left-hand side to the right to let Calafiori play as the left-sided centre-back, you could see that it probably took a while for someone of his character to feel he could take responsibility for the back four. But I think he...

decided in that second half that he was going to shoulder a little bit of leadership. And he led by example. I thought he was imperious, really, in that second half. If you put a showreel of his performances over the last couple of months since he's come into the team together, you'd probably see a really nice evolution. He started off well, but he's just...

grown in confidence I think and that's helped him play an all-round better game

And it was really, really pleasing. Yeah, I just thought he was... I think grown is the word, isn't it, Adrian, really? He's a different centre-half now. The second half, we ended up with Myles Lewis-Skelly, Calafiori, Kivio and White as the back four. And Kivio was the leader of that group, wasn't he, really? Yeah, no, I was really impressed with him as well. I thought he was great. And yeah, it just shows the value of getting regular game time, doesn't it? He's had a run. It's so hard for football. And fans, I get why they don't care, right?

But the truth is, when a player gets dipped in and then dipped out and dipped in and dipped out, it's really hard to be brilliant. Because just as you get in a feel for it again, you're out because the main man's coming back. But he's been afforded this run of games and you're seeing him settle into that role really, really well. And I think that was one of his best games for us yesterday. He made 11 clearances. The next highest for us was 400.

He made a couple of really good blocks inside the box. Oh, one interception as well in the second half when he just stretched out and it was so important. Yeah, and his passing was good as well. He's an underrated passer. He's really capable of sort of clipping good passes forward. I think he only misplaced three passes in the whole game. So, yeah, really strong performance. And I just think he's shown that he deserves to be here. You know, so, you know, we've got four good centre-halves and

Gabriel, Saliba, Calafuri and him and others that can slide across like White and Timber. So I don't think we really need to go in the market for a centre-back. No more left-backs? Well, there's always space for more left-backs, obviously. LAUGHTER

I mean, listen, defensively, I thought in the main we coped very well and Kivial was great. But the highlight for me, I think the highlight for most people has to be Myles Lewis-Skelly beating Dan Byrne to a header. I mean, that was right in front of us. And genuinely, I think it was almost a cheer as much as a goal, really. But I just love the way that kid plays.

David Rea, Amy, we think back to when he arrived a couple of seasons ago and all that noise and we all loved Aaron Ramsdale. And there were certainly a couple of moments yesterday when his passing was not quite on point. I think that was partly to do, I have to say, with the way that Newcastle was set up and he was looking for passes and they just weren't on because of the way they were flooding the midfield or something. But...

He made some tremendous... Well, listen, your face suggests you're not sure about that. No, maybe they were misplaced passes and that happens. But I thought in goal he was outstanding yesterday. He made a couple of double saves. He's really good at a double save, isn't he? He loves a double save, yeah. He does. I really, really like him for that. It's not a bad speciality to have, is it?

A double save? No, but he did it a couple of times yesterday. We've seen it in the Champions League against Atalanta. The save from Dan Burns' header, I thought, was outstanding. They practiced that sort of stuff, getting down quickly. But then to get up and kick it away as well. I mean, he's our number one, isn't he? And any goalkeeper who comes, and we don't know who that's going to be just yet,

is going to get games in the Carabao Cup and maybe the odd group game in the Champions League to start with. Well, he is literally the number one because I think he's changed his shirt number. Yes. Finally. It's only taken a year and a half. I'm pleased for him though. I'm pleased for him because, you know,

Strong character. A strong character to come from what happened at the start of his career for Arsenal. Yeah, yeah. You know, it was definitely a shaky opening kind of couple of months or so where you could see that adapting to the scale of the scrutiny and spotlight was a process he needed to go through and come out the other side. But yeah, just going back to that kicking, I mean, interesting because...

At times during the season, that has felt like it's clearly a massive asset and a hugely important part in how the team plays. I mean, it's very obvious that they like to use Raya's vision almost and ability to execute all sorts of range of passing as a kind of almost quarterback advantage.

you know, way of starting moves and creating overloads and giving an extra body and so on. But, you know, lately there have been a few occasions this season where it's been costly and it's that fine line, isn't it? And I wonder about, I don't know why that's happened, but lately there have been quite a few sort of short passes where it's...

It's created a bit of chaos. Well, truss hard up front, you know, if you've got Havertz or Marina, you can just clip it up. You know, you're more inclined to go a bit longer, aren't you? Yeah, I know. But I mean, if a poros isn't on... No, I agree. ...to someone who's close to you, then just hoik it anyway, no? I mean...

Yeah, William Saliba in the Bernabeu, you know, he gave him that ball. And even Mikel Mourinho, you know. Against, yeah, against Liverpool last week, yes. And then there were two in the first half that were horror shows, really, against Newcastle, and it was fortunate to get away with it. It's good to get them out of the way when it kind of doesn't matter too much, really.

really hey listen now listen according to rules watching the FA Cup you can pick the ball up outside the area it doesn't seem to matter anymore really anyway and by the way does anyone think that an Arsenal goalkeeper doesn't get sent off for exactly the same thing but let's maybe we shouldn't go there alright I'll tell you what we're going to talk about a couple more players after we have a break Ian Stone Amy Lawrence and Adrian Clark here on the Athletics Arsenal podcast handbrake off

♫ You're only come to see me on snow ♫ Come to see me on snow ♫ You're only come to see me on snow... ♫

As you've probably heard by now, we've teamed up with BetMGM this season. We'll be using BetMGM lines to make all of our picks, and we'll have special offers for our listeners each week. If you haven't signed up for BetMGM yet, use bonus code THEATHLETIC, and you'll get a one-year subscription to The Athletic, plus up to a $1,500 first bet offer on your first wager with BetMGM. Here's how it works.

Download the BetMGM app and sign up using bonus code THEATHLETIC. Make your first deposit of at least $10, place your first bet on any game, and claim your voucher for a one-year subscription to The Athletic. See?

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When it's the NWSL season, I'm locked in. I'm streaming matches on Prime Video, breaking down plays in real time, and queuing up hype tracks on Amazon Music. Amazon Prime helps me stay ready, whether it's fast delivery for last-minute watch party snacks or digging into behind-the-scenes content between games. For me, following the league isn't a hobby. It's a full-time passion. Whatever you're into, it's on Prime. Visit Amazon.com forward slash Prime to get more out of whatever you're into.

But

But there is a solution. A new proposal before Congress would close this loophole and ensure these foreign investors pay taxes, just like the actual plaintiffs have to.

It's a common sense move that discourages frivolous and abusive lawsuits and redirects resources back into American jobs, innovation, and growth. Only President Trump and congressional Republicans can deliver this win for America and hold these foreign investors accountable. Contact your lawmakers today and demand they take a stand to end foreign-funded litigation abuse.

they get a humbric off and you can see that they are more free to play okay let's talk about uh leandro trossard i thought that was one of his best games for the arsenal um i really really liked the way he played um he works hard adrian um i like his hold-up play yesterday um

We want him at the club next season, right? I mean, there is talk about, well, we might have to sell someone to get someone in. But I really like him. I like angry Leo, don't you? Angry Leo. Generally, when he comes off the bench and he's sort of pissed off because he hasn't been picked.

And I like him in that situation. I mean, Mikel Arteta said he's a bit of a moaner, but I thought he was great yesterday and worked so hard. Yeah, he had the most touches of any Arsenal player, which is not bad going when you're playing sort of forward players.

And when you also consider, you know, Arsenal didn't have actually as much of the ball as we probably normally do. What I liked about his game, obviously, is that he never hid. Like he always wanted to be that person that we could find. And he was quite calm on the ball as well. He just didn't rush it. But I loved his dribbling. And I think he's an underrated dribbler. He's come out with some great moments this season.

Was it a Spurs game where he sort of twisted Pedro Porro up massively, didn't he, with a court turn? Injured him. Injured him. He's lying there. One of my favourite moments of the season. Hands down. But he's got that in his locker. And in this game, you know, he twisted and turned and he got to the byline a few times. I think he had eight dribbles, which was a lot. You know, a lot of them were successful. So, yeah, I do want him to stay. I don't think he's got huge value in the...

like as in fee, because of his age, I don't think you'd get enough money to really justify...

Sort of letting him go. So, yeah, I think he's got a part to play. It'll be harder for him, won't it, next year? Because I do think, well, I'd like to think we're going to get a striker and we're going to get a left winger. With all the forwards coming in. Yeah, exactly. It's going to be harder. He's going to be even moodier, let's be honest. Yeah. He's going to be angrier and moodier. That's true. This is exactly the plan. Get another three forwards in. And that was the, was it the Villa game where he was really grumpy? And then he, did he score or set one up and...

He was brilliant, wasn't he, when he was proper grumpy. So next year, when he gets his rare runouts in the FA Cup and in League Cup or whatever, he's going to be our match winner, isn't he? He's going to take us all the way to Wembley. Furiously brilliant. I do think there is a sense that, I mean, Adrian, maybe you can give us a bit more kind of lowdown on this, but let's just put it this way. I get the impression that quite a lot of our players really don't like Newcastle. Yeah, yeah.

So, you know, whether that was a part of the, you know, the make-up between a kind of slightly angry Leo, I don't know. Well, you wouldn't want it any other way. They beat us three times and we didn't score in any of the games. And they kind of bullied us in most of those matches. So if our players...

didn't hate them, I would be worried. You know, they've given them the right hump, haven't they? And that's what you want. What did you make of that brouhaha at the end? I have to admit, it was down the other end and I didn't really see what happened very well. But like, was that just two sets of players that don't like each other? Well, it wasn't. No, it kicked off, didn't it? Because it was actually a game, it was a cleaner game than I anticipated, actually, up until the end. And then Simon Hooper just went a bit mad with his yellow card.

but what I think wound our suppliers up was the added time on the added time. Cause it was just went on and on, didn't it? And I think there was a grown feeling of sort of frustration at the ref and then it, something happened and it just triggered it. But yeah, what I'd loved was, well, Raya was risking it actually. Cause he was on a yellow. He was on a yellow already. Yeah. He was shoving one of their players in the chest. So now I love, I love all that. I,

I'll never complain about these melees and whatnot and players defending each other. It just shows a bit of togetherness. It shows they actually care. We don't like them. They don't like us. No, but years ago, that sort of Galas team and Vermaelen, when they were the captains, didn't seem to hurt us. Didn't hurt the team when they lost. No one protected each other. No, it didn't. That was a really difficult period. You see someone getting bullied a bit and no one would go up

fight their corner and it seemed to have gone like complete 180 from the old days of Tony Adams you need seven you need seven you have a fight with in any team and then yeah so it is pleasing definitely helpful to you know they want to stick up for one another and they want to be together quite nice to see Kai Havertz not quite nice excellent in fact to see Kai Havertz back playing again and

I mean, all this talk about a new striker, but I was walking back to the pub afterwards. Back to the pub. That's instructive, isn't it? I was walking back to the pub after the game, talking to my pal Susan, and she was saying he looked, he had a bit of menace about him when he came on. Adrian, do you think that as well? I mean, there was a definite feeling. He doesn't like Newcastle. He doesn't like Newcastle, no. It's all Tindall, isn't it? Tindall's the one that gets them all going. Yeah.

Because he's a little bit of an Esther, isn't he? Jason Tindall. Now, Havertz definitely had one on him. And he was aggressive and he could have got sent off, to be honest. So, yeah, no, it was great to see him. And I think, yeah, again, it's a strange time for him because he knows the noise. He knows that Arsenal will almost certainly sign a top-level striker. So, you know, Havertz,

How's he feel about that? Where's he see himself fitting in? It's a strange time, but...

I do think that he will have a big part to play next season for sure. He's turned into a very likeable footballer, hasn't he? After that timid start where I think we were all a bit worried, I definitely was. He's shown that he's got the mettle, he's got the character and temperament to play for a club like Arsenal. So yeah, I think next season left some great moments, I'm sure. Amy, it's a similar sort of thing to David Ryer, isn't it? He comes in, there's a lot of doubt, so we didn't need a player like that.

But he really stepped up. And by the way, the team helped, didn't they? Giving him the penalty at Bournemouth and helping him along a little bit. There was a genuine feeling of, no, no, no, we think this guy's got talent. And he could play in midfield, couldn't he? He could play a bit further back next year if we get a centre forward. Total football, man. Who knows what's coming? You can stick Kai anywhere. Let me tell you, I know he's big.

But you could stick him anywhere. He actually could be the competition for Martin Odegaard next year. Like Martin Odegaard, obviously, he's a captain. He's more than likely to play most games. But if anything happens to him, I wouldn't be upset to see Kai step into that position and see what he can produce, kind of as a 10. If that happens, I'd see it shifting a little bit with Rice maybe being a 2 with someone.

But Kai in behind. Rice at right back? No, Rice at centre-back. So send him midfield, rather. Send him midfield. Hey, who knows? Who knows? No, what I'm saying is... Because Mikel Marino could play eight games at centre-forward. You know what I'm saying. We know what you're saying. I just think him playing off of striker X, whoever that might be, would be interesting to see. Yeah, so let's see.

Couple of other things before we go. Oh, well, goodbye. Sort of home goodbye to Kieran Tierney and Jorginho. There was a genuine... I mean, Georgie, obviously, he's been around and we liked him and he did a good job for us. And, you know, thank you. I mean, it was...

You know, a leader on and off the pitch and a very likeable personality. But Kieran Tierney, Amy, there are regrets with Kieran, aren't they, really? Because of the injuries he had. And there was a period when I thought, my God, he could be Arsenal captain for 10 years. Didn't quite work out for him, but he's been great. I think he's been very professional the way he's been the last few months. He's a stellar character. Top lad, isn't he? And human being. And I think...

Hopefully everybody will agree that it's been a pleasure to have him associated with the football club. And, you know, like you say, a tinge of regret that things didn't work out a little bit differently for him. You can only admire the way he's carried himself.

from the first day he walked into the club until now. Yeah, I'm sad in a way that there wasn't a way to keep... That's the trouble with football. You get attached to everyone. You're sitting here having this conversation. It's like, oh yeah, you know, you want Trossard to stay, but you do want another winger as well. You know, you want Kieran to stay because we haven't got enough left backs and he's great. You know, you do get attached to people.

you kind of end up feeling like they're part of your extended family. And my eldest, he was, when Giorgino came over at the end and with his family and he was sort of applauding and stuff, and he just said, he's given me maybe my best ever moment in football. Villa away. Yeah, it wasn't quite. But in his football watching experience, going to Villa Park as a youngster on an away day was,

And, you know, we were going for the league at that point and it was unbelievably sort of like anything could happen game. And Jorginho provides a moment of such brilliance, shoots from far out and it was a great hit and then goes off Emi Martinez as an own goal. It was, so it was funny as well as brilliant and meaningful, all wrapped into one and proper limbs in the away section and,

It was a seminal moment in his football-watching life. Yeah, he won't forget that. And he will forever be grateful to Jorginho for giving him that. And that's what it's about. It's about feelings and how you feel about these people and the bonds that you create with them and that they create with you. And that all happens through the prism of the club. And you know that wherever Jorginho and Chiarantini and whatever go...

They will carry love for Arsenal inside them because it's been a good time for them to be at the club.

I've always liked players that play with personality. And I just think, you know, you saw it with Vardy. Vardy's not everyone's cup of tea, but you can't say that he, he doesn't play with personality. He, he's truly himself. And he was winding up the Ipswich fans yesterday. It was a perfect finish, wasn't it? He scores a goal near the away end. He goes and gives, gives them powers. It was perfect. And that's why Leicester fans will, will, you know, just love him forevermore. But I,

I just think with someone like Rice, he plays a personality. But I do think the two that you're talking about here also do. Certainly Tierney with his sort of, you know, roll up his sleeves attitude and he's sort of, yeah, he's just so determined in everything he does. And then, and Jorginho is that sort of quiet, charismatic guy

sort of leader isn't he he owns it when he's on the pitch so and i think he's obviously really good in the dressing room as well so i'm sure that whoever comes in they'll they'll make sure that they're decent characters too there should be it should be a mural on the tunnel outside of kieran tierney walking away with this carrier bag don't you think i think that's not gonna happen let's get what's his name um what's it north banksy

no thanks he'll be on his to-do list won't he I'm just saying I have a lot of love for the guy Palace beat Man City in the FA Cup I mean that was that was funny wasn't it I mean in the end that was funny and I'm and I'm and I look

First of all, I'm glad for my Palace mates. They've got a lot of them. It's great to see Man City lose any game anywhere ever. And particularly in that way by a goalkeeper who probably should have been sent off there making 100 amazing saves. Great saves. Jay, our producer, has written here, can we go out and get Eberichie Eze, please? I mean, Amy, he's a tremendous talent. And I don't, it feels a bit,

much talking about him right now in this way but I'd have him I'd have him tomorrow he's he's got awesome connections as well I think he was a supporter as a lad and was at the at the club amongst one of many rejections that he had to bounce back from but I think one of the things about watching that game watching that Palace team and their ride through the FA Cup and indeed their fans you know it

It was one of those where, as a neutral, you kind of fall a little bit in love with what's going on and you get really spitten. I was almost tearful at the end watching the way that their fans were. It didn't look like there was a dry eye, you know, however many in their 30,000, 40,000 section at Wembley. You know, people of all ages were just crumbling into tears, crying.

And you could see how much it meant to them. And if you can seek it out, there's a video put together by a Brazilian journalist called João Castelo Branco, where he took some footage from just in front of the fans, I think, pitch side at the end of the game. And it's really very, very moving. And it hits home just how much this great game of ours means. And, you know,

I saw someone write on social media and it really stuck with me. And it's silly, but it's the reality of different clubs' status and expectations and what you go through in different moments. But he said, I hope Palace win because, this was before the game, because it will be the best day of their lives for their fans. And for Man City fans, they'll have forgotten about it by Tuesday. Yeah.

It's a bit extreme, but we know what they mean. And just seeing people have their lifetime memory that they'll cherish forever. And you looked at that Palace team, and we're just talking about the Arsenal boys. And I think what's great about the current Arsenal team is they do seem like a lot of really good lads. And I think that that's a big part of the homework that they're

Mikel Arteta and now Andre Berta and all the rest of the guys do when they're looking at who they want to bring into the club is what they're like as a person. Personality, you used that word Adrian. What kind of character they are. How much will they buy into it? How much will they get on with everybody else? How much will they sacrifice? How much will they feel it together?

Big thing, big. And you looked at that Palace team and in their dressing room, and I think they look like a really good bunch of lads as well. Mateta and Eze and the way they were dancing and the, you know, the expressions on their faces. It was hard not to be pleased with them because they do look like a really likeable bunch that came together and found a unity this season.

But yes, in answer to your question, I would take Edric. Yes, of course you would. Absolutely, were he available and were Arsenal able to do that deal? Tremendous, tremendous talent. And they backed the manager, didn't they, Adrian, as well? And that's, I think it's an important, because they lost, they didn't win a game, did they, till October or something? That's a shocking start to the season. Yeah, but look, he's clearly a really good coach.

he's embarrassed Ruben Amorim in regards to using the same formation. But what the difference is that he's got players that suit each position. There's such a balanced team and the style of football suits each individual as well. So it's all about releasing those, getting those front three on it quickly with those fast transitions. And that's how they scored. Obviously the wingbacks are big. So yeah, I'd like us to,

develop that strand. I've got to be honest in terms of like having a plan B where we might need to go to three at the back sometimes. I'd like to think at some point in pre-season we might, and I don't want it to be our primary system, but I do think that it's sometimes...

could be something to have up our sleeve. So, you know, if injuries bite and, you know, it actually suits to have two number 10s in behind a striker, you know, et cetera. But see us sort of experiment with it maybe in preseason. Because as we saw in this game, it can be a very effective way of playing. Yeah, really good. Let's have a song.

Do you know what? I slightly drunk yesterday. That's the truth of it. But I was in Sweden yesterday morning and I got back from the game. So, yeah, I didn't manage to come up with one. Amy, have you got a song for us? I have. I have. I was thinking about songs with second in the title. I mean, this is assuming that, you know.

Something crazy doesn't happen down at Southampton, England. I think we can assume. Assume a way. So there was a range of songs with second in the title that I liked and nearly went for, but going to Plumford, I second that emotion and tempted as I am to go with the Japan version given my 1980s Porsche. You can't do that. I'm going to go with Smokey Robinson and the Miracles. Come on.

Yeah, all right. Fair enough. Adrian, what have you got for us? It's funny. I mean, we're not morphing into one another, Amy. You'll be relieved to know. But I did contemplate something similar. Yeah, I've just gone with Declan Rice in the end because of that goal and what he did.

And I've gone route one price tag by Jesse J. I'm sure you'd absolutely love that song. Amy, you'll know it price tag because it doesn't matter about the price tag. He doesn't care. He's worth every penny. And yeah, I just think, yeah, it was an absolute bargain.

Yeah, I like that tune. Amy, not for you. Okay. Just give us a quick rendition then. Not about the... Not about that one. Yeah.

Oh, she's pulled a fake. Hang on, how are we morphing into one another to go from Smokey Robertson and the Miracles to that? I said I'd considered songs with second in the title. Oh, okay. Sorry, Mr. That's what's going on. That's it, yeah. All right, by the way, I've just found I Don't Care Anymore by Phil Collins for May Night Against Tottenham. Yeah. That would be it. I don't care anymore.

Yeah, enjoy your ridiculous, pointless final. The rest of Europe must be looking around going, what a joke. I mean, they are 16th and 17th. Long may that continue. We'll be back later in the week to discuss Southampton in that big game. That'll be a fun day out, won't it? It'll be a fun day out. And thanks for watching.

Thanks to Amy Lawrence. Oh, Amy, you've got something to say. I was going to say, traditionally, the last away game of the season, if it was away, you'd go in fancy dress. I'm just wondering, lads, do you have a fancy dress of choice? LAUGHTER

I don't like fancy dress. I'm not into it. Do you not? Do you not? Yeah, wouldn't I have a fancy dress of choice? I don't know, maybe a noddy holder. That might be quite nice. Something big like, you know, light, like one of those hats with the mirrors on and a few sideburns, something like that. Yeah.

You know, kipper tie and big, you know, flared trousers and boots. I think I'd quite enjoy it. It'd be nice to be tall for once. I went as Chrissy Waddle once. Chris Waddle once. You went in fancy dresses. How did anyone know it was Chris Waddle? Did you have a shirt with Waddle on? Oh, the hair. The hair. I got a wig. Did you have a...

proper money no no I got a wig and I cut it in a brilliant manner and had an English shirt an old school English shirt it was quite good actually but I don't like yeah I don't like fancy dress who would you go as Amy who are you what's your fancy dress no I just asked the question oh right come on now come on you can't ask us and then have you not got a fancy dress yeah you can you're right you can there's no rules there are no rules do what we want well right we're going now thanks for listening we'll see you later in the week

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