What Slot wants this summer & Guard of Gooners
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Alright Reds, Tony Evans here with Walk On, your Liverpool podcast from The Athletic. I'm here with James Pearce and Andy Jones. Slots won us the league, now it's time to build on that. Today, we'll look at the role he could have during the summer business before previewing Arsenal's visit. But before we get to that, let's have your three words.

Andy, welcome back to the show. Hello. The man with the best shuchel in Christendom. There you go. Get one in early there. I'm going to go in really uncontroversial style. Artessa's dodgy maths. LAUGHTER

I mean, yeah, you know, they've been the best everywhere, haven't they? You know, it's best in the league, best in the Champions League. I mean, I just, you know, to me, they're one of the dominant teams of our era and we should, you know, we should cherish them. James...

Chin up, Arsenal. Oh, well, that's what James and Andy think. Here's what you're seeing. Graeme Jones, back to business. Tom Wilkinson, roll Arsenal over. Taki van der Petterflet, play like champions. And Marty Kitabunya, guard of gooners. To join our community of listeners on Facebook, just search Walk On Podcast and join the group.

Winning the league, having these fans, I think this is a big attraction to every player we want to bring in. Well, that was Arne Slot speaking before last week's game at Stamford Bridge about Liverpool's pull on power. James, he talks about the fans and winning the league, but, I mean...

He'll be as much an attraction, won't he? Because I remember we used to talk about how much pulling power Jürgen Klopp had, but surely Slott's going to drag them in as well.

Yeah, I think it's an interesting element to this summer because I think if you go back to probably last year, then I think players, certainly players at Liverpool and probably players anywhere else would be thinking, I wonder what this guy is about because he didn't have a huge body of work, did he, as a manager behind him, hadn't managed outside of Holland. But I think, yeah, without a shadow of a doubt...

all of those stories throughout the season in terms of how the players who are there currently feel as if he's elevated them to the next level, the attention to detail, all the stuff we've talked about previously in terms of the analysis, the meetings, the

how good a communicator he is, you know, all of these things will have got around, won't they, in terms of what he's like to work with. And, you know, and the, you know, the reviews have been pretty glowing. And then, of course, you also throw into the mix, you know, the fact that he's masterminded this remarkable title winning career

season I think players will undoubtedly want to come and play for him and I think back to the Brendan Rodgers era and that was always an ongoing issue wasn't it because you had that situation where Liverpool would essentially get Steven Gerrard to message them and say do us a favour you couldn't try and swing it for us could you it is Tony Cruz's mobile just give him a shout and tell him he'd love it

I don't think we're going to be needing to do that this summer. I think, yeah, I think players will want to come and play for this fella. Well, definitely. Well, Andy, you've been at a lot of press conferences with him this summer. You know, you and him have become bezies and all that like. So, how impressed have you been with him? Really impressed. I think it's across the board really. I think there's all the coaching side of things and

And I think sometimes it's something it's not spoken about probably often enough of just how important it is that coaches behind the scenes are able to improve players. And I think that's something that Klopp, going back to his, I think sometimes he doesn't quite get the credit for the sort of the work and the way he was able to bring players on in the way he did and take them to the next level. And Slott looks like he's a coach who can do the same things.

But I just think his manner, the way he's gone about everything, every press conference was...

generally calmly delivered. There was thoughtful answers, but not sort of, you know, masking anything. If he felt he needed to be hard on a player, he'd be hard on a player. But ultimately, he will give plenty of praise and there's been plenty of opportunities to do that this season because of how well Liverpool have done and how well, you know, players have done as well. So, and ultimately, I think the contract situations summed it up that at no point was he ever sort of

you know rattled by any questions or there was no point where he was um you know looked like he was in a he'd been put in a bit of an awkward position he sort of he just knew how to answer it and just make a bit of a joke out of it and I think that relaxed demeanor you know obviously behind the scenes he's not always relaxed and there's the element of of setting the standards but I think just the way he's gone about everything you know and he chose in the press conferences is

has sort of created the atmosphere or helped create the atmosphere that has helped Liverpool succeed this season. Yeah, James. I mean, there's been no instance of mistaken identity where he's called you out for someone else's mistakes, has he? Like he reckons it. I don't know what you could possibly be referring to, Tony. No, I think certainly in terms of the media dealings and stuff, I think it's been interesting to,

And being there right from the word go when he did the unveiling press conference, what was it, start of July? I think when the Euros were still going on last year throughout the season. I think he's grown in confidence and stature in terms of feeling like he really belongs at Liverpool. I thought from the first day he struck the perfect kind of balance between being respectful to the past and everything Klopp had done and what Klopp had left him with.

but also showcasing the belief that he felt that he could take Liverpool on to the next level. And I think one thing that struck me recently was how many times has he said something silly in a press conference or something that's been this kind of created unwanted headlines or noise or...

that you've kind of cringed a bit and thought, and I think that's really difficult as Liverpool manager, because everyone is trying to pick apart every single word you say and analyse and scrutinise, what does he mean by that, what does he mean by that? And the only thing I can think of would be, I think it got used subsequently as a bit of a stick to beat him with when he kind of said, how can you possibly lose to Nottingham Forest?

But again, at the time, it was one of the ones that aged badly because obviously Forrest then went on to have a really good season. Obviously, a bit of a late season wobble now. But at the time, it wasn't. And I think that riled Forrest a bit, that suggestion, which to be fair, is never a bad thing to rile Nottingham Forrest.

Yeah, by and large, I just think, and especially when you think of everything else that's been thrown at him with like the constant questioning about the contract sagas and, you know, and he's been blunt at times. You think about taking off Kwanzaa on the opening weekend and, you know, having a pop at Darwin Nunes about his work ethic after that Villa game. But yeah, I think that that side of the job, which is so important as Liverpool manager, he has handled incredibly well.

Yeah, I was thinking about that myself, you know, how few missteps he's made. And talking to people at the club, Andy, and they were saying, like, he's a pleasure to work with in the sense that he's very, very straightforward. But there's no, you know, you're not on a roller coaster with him. You more or less know what to expect. And what we've come to expect is success.

Yeah, exactly. I think James Sundar did really well there. I think you can just feel he's getting more comfortable and he's got more comfortable as time has gone on. Even the fact that every time he made a joke early in press conferences, like at the start of the season in press conferences, he made sure he clarified that it was a joke.

Whereas now he just says it and carries on because he now knows and understands that everyone knows that he's joking as well. So yeah, it's all those little things. And ultimately, if you are the type of person that you're describing there, Tony, which seems exactly what Slott is, then it just creates the right working environments. I guess he's not the boss boss, but he's the boss of the players, if you like. And

And if he's given off a certain vibe, if you like, and a certain way of working, then generally that's the way that, you know, those under him and those working, you know, with him, that's sort of what they'll give off as well. And especially when it's a positive one, because the last thing you want is sort of negativity creeping in and stuff like that. But ultimately Liverpool haven't, you know, really had the chance to be negative this season because they've done so much winning so,

And yeah, ultimately you can just see it in the way the players are and the way they talk about camp and the atmosphere and the dressing room and everything. It's just all sort of come together really, really well. And he's sort of stamped his authority on it early and, you know, continue to set a level-headed standard throughout. Oh, no!

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It's an achievement, James. It's been pretty remarkable. One of only five managers to win the Premier League in the first season in charge. Well, we're only taking football from starting in 1992, people. But, you know, in any era, whether he's done, it'd be fantastic.

What impact do you think winning the Premier League will have on his authority in rebuilding the team this summer? Because when he was actually engaged as head coach, it was pretty clear that they didn't want a sort of charismatic manager who would sort of grow into the role in the way Klopp did.

in the sense of becoming a, for want of a better phrase, an old school type manager, you know, who was controlling the whole club. But what that suggests is a little bit of diminished power. Do you think this season will give him more of, will he have a bigger say in the transfer dealings than they perhaps anticipated last summer?

I don't really see Liverpool changing, to be honest, because I think you're right. They did see the end of the Klopp era as quite a big reset in terms of the way things were done. And I think...

Because of all the churn in other positions as well during the Klopp era, it meant that he found himself taking on more and more responsibility at times that I think sometimes he wanted and sometimes he probably didn't. Yeah, it becomes too much for him. Yeah, yeah. And that obviously ends up probably contributing to the burnout that

that led to him stepping down. So I think it was certainly a very clear approach that we're going down, you know, for the first time it is a head coach and not a manager. And we're going to build this structure around him so that this guy can focus on what he is absolutely best at, which is developing and improving players and,

and putting them into a cohesive, slick unit. So, yeah, I don't see that changing because I think the relationship between Richard Hughes, the sporting director, and Slott is very good. There's obviously open and constant dialogue with Michael Edwards.

the FSG CEO of football as well. And we're going to see, you know, a return to the very much the data led approach with Will Spearman, the director of research and his team playing a big part in the decision making process, just like they did in the process that led to Liverpool appointing slot, you know, coming up to a year ago. So I don't see a situation where we'll now Liverpool have won the league. It's like, well,

Arna, you just give us a list of names and we'll go and box it off for you. I just don't think that is the way things are going to be done in this era. I think certainly there might be an element of... I think when you do as well as Slott has done in his first season, I think it stands to reason that when he says certain things...

you know, other people around him would certainly be like, well, actually, you know, look at this guy's track record so far at this club. He's pretty much nailed everything. Maybe that is the way we should go, but it will still be very much a collaborative approach. You know, that is what Liverpool think has worked so well over the last 12 months, you know, a more kind of collegiate way of working. And yeah, they're not going to move away from that. I mean, that makes a lot of sense, doesn't it, Andy? I mean, I think people...

probably misunderstand anyway the way even clubs that are running a more old-school manner, how much collaboration goes on between it, you know, because every man has got to work within constraints, you know, budget constraints. And, you know, it's not just a, I give you a wish list, you go and get them for me. But the thing I'm interested in is one of the points that Simon, Simon, he's hardly ever used, always makes, is that...

Klopp was relatively easy to buy for because he had such an established system of playing. Now, I think slots appears to me to be a lot more flexible and a lot more pragmatic in many ways. Does that make it easier or harder to buy for him?

Good question, because essentially he's showing that he can mould players into his style of play straight away by taking a squad that wasn't his and making them the champions. So it's a good question. I think there's elements to it. I think what Slott certainly wants is technical players.

I think that's a massive part of it. He essentially needs every single player on the pitch to be really good on the ball, to play his style. Yeah, he likes players to run with the ball, doesn't he? Yeah, so it's being technical, it's being able to either progress it with passion, which he talks about a lot, or you know, you're more Gravenberg, Schauber's like, you know, progression, and Bradley, if you like progression with the ball at your feet.

So I think they're two core parts of it because, you know, it is ultimately more about control, more about possession, more about not always, you know, trying to be as direct as Liverpool were under Klopp at times and being a little bit more structured. I mean, ultimately, the way football's going, every sort of coach, you know, especially at the top level is looking for that now and alongside work rate being important and being able to understand that.

you know, pressure triggers and all that type of stuff. So yeah, but what I think he's shown, which again, makes him probably, makes it probably easier is that he, he can coach players. He's really good at coaching players. And we've seen that with the improvements of, you know, even the likes of Canarte and Sobber's life, for example, this season who've gone up, you know, another level and, you know, maybe for all the season, maybe for parts of it, but you can, you can see how he's able to adapt people into different roles and like Ryan Gravenberg, for example, and,

And even Luis Diaz, who barely ever played as a centre-forward and arguably was...

Liverpool's most trusted by him throughout the season of the three options that he had. So I think there's differences, but I think it probably opens your pool of players up a little bit more maybe into what you can look for and how you can maybe adapt them. But ultimately, as you say, it's because of his flexibility. That's never a bad thing if you're able to

to move players into different positions and be able to say, look, this is what we want from you now. And we're going to make sure you're able to do this, you know, to the best of your ability, which is what he's shown he can do with a number of players already this season. Yeah, what's fascinating to me, James, is that he's taken a squad that wasn't his and it's become a...

You know, they've won the title, obviously. And we talk about managers and head coaches stamping their image on a team. You know, is in the summer we going to see some changes? Are we going to see some development? Are we going to see an Arna Slott team? Which seems to me a bit like...

Stretching the points a bit too far because he's put a stamp on this lot already, hasn't he? Yeah, he has. And I think also his brand of football isn't... It's not massively different to Klopp's, is it? It's not... That was one of the reasons why he got the job, wasn't it? Because, you know, and again, going back to the data side of things, you know, with all the algorithms and models that they have, it was like one of the things that they felt that slot, the box that he ticked was...

is his brand of football suited to the players already at Liverpool? That was one of the reasons why Ruben Amorim didn't get the Liverpool job was because they looked at his brand of football and they thought, well, two things. One was he plays three at the back.

you know, is our squad set up to play three at the back? And secondly, they felt that it was a pretty uninspiring brand of football that wouldn't really energize the fan base. So I think, you know, that's why, yeah, I don't see it as kind of like, you know, it's only from this summer onwards he starts to bring in players that will really see

the way that he wants to do things. Because I think we pretty much saw it from the get-go in terms of, you know, it's slight tweaks and a change in approach and probably greater protection when you're not in possession and, you know, a more considered approach rather than the kind of the chaos of Klopp's football, to be honest. So, yeah, I don't see it as being like a big...

I don't think we're going to see some big change stylistically. I think one thing we probably will see, because I think what this season has shown, is on Slott's part, at times, a real reluctance to rotate players.

when he probably needed to because he didn't believe that the the depth in the squad would enable him to be able to make the changes he needed to to be able to maintain levels and i think that's something that obviously has to change going forward if you're serious about competing on all fronts you know and going and going really deep into competitions

Yeah, I agree with James on the star list of points because I think even if Liverpool are, you know, when we sort of go through the list of who Liverpool might sign or what positions, you're probably looking at left-back and number nine as the two where you're probably looking at starters but it's unlikely that suddenly he's going to completely reinvent the wheel of what he wants from his left-back because we've seen what he's wanted from the whole season. Number nine is a little bit different because I think ultimately we still don't quite know exactly what he wants from his number nine so

So I think if any, that would be... We know what he doesn't want. Well, yeah. So of the three that he's played up there, you would probably say, as we said earlier, probably Diaz has been the most trusted or sort of team to work in that role. But...

I think that might be where we see the biggest tweak because ultimately his number nine is on the right wing so it's what he wants next to that number nine if you like to bring the best out of him and the best out of the player themselves because that's what we've not quite seen at no point really during the season other than fleetingly under the air as it felt like the number nine is

it's been a key core part of the team. It's sort of the, you know, he does the work in the background if you like to supplement the wingers essentially. So that, that will be the interesting tweak I think of, but again, it won't be massive because ultimately, as I said, your number nine is on the right wing. So you're still going to be trying to build the team around Mo Salah. That's why you've, you've given them a new deal and pay them all the money because you still expect them. We might be seeing Salah play more centrally, but,

James, I have a theory about Amarim, you know, and them looking at him. I reckon they sat in the data bunker all sniggering and go, let's pretend, let's pretend we're taking a really serious look at this fella. Let's pretend that, like, he's at the bar. He almost comes to us. We almost wanted him. And you know what? United will take him then. And, like...

And then we can all sit back and laugh. Having said that, having said that, as we speak, it's likely United will be in the air

the Europa League final and they could get themselves a Champions League slot. So let's not laugh too hard at United. Let's save some of that laughter for Arsenal. But we'll come on into their moment. Hey, come on, come on. Just think, they've been so unlucky. Just look at their points totals the previous seasons. They should have really, I think Arteta can count that as two Premier League titles.

I didn't realise until recently that you could take another season's points total and transpose it onto a different season and, like, get the trophy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's brilliant. I don't know when the parade is going to be. I don't know yet. But, yeah, yeah. But...

I thoroughly enjoyed his interview after the PSG game as well about how the PSG bench had told him they were by far the better team. And then Luis Enrique comes out and says, no, no, no, no, absolutely not. Like, I completely disagree with him. So it's just like...

It's, yeah, I suppose when you've gone, what was it, five successive trophy-less seasons, maybe you have to frequent a fantasy land just to get your head around it. But I think my favourite bit about that actually was the fact that after 35 games, Liverpool have actually got more points than Arsenal have had after 35 games in season.

the two previous seasons anyway. And we phoned Bonin. We didn't sign against Chelsea. Let's be honest. I'm thinking that maybe it might be good fun to troll them by losing every game from now on. Think about it, Andy. Can you imagine being in their Arsenal girds of honour with their sense of grievance and

and their sense of privilege they think they should be champions and standing there at Anfield as a guard of honour and I can just imagine what they're all thinking yeah I wonder if they expect Liverpool to give them one as well just for their Premier League titles in the last couple of years maybe we should flip it round and for being the best team in the Champions League this season there should be a trophy for that really

There's going to be some really unenthusiastic clapping, isn't there? If at all. They might just all stand there and just not clap. Let's do the Finnish second last season on big points total. It'll be fantastic. I mean, James, you were at Chelsea and you saw the Guards of Honour there. The Chelsea fans really enjoyed that, didn't they?

Incredibly respectful. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There was heads falling off all around me, actually.

Yeah, lots and lots of boos. I don't get it. I saw that there's this debate over whether it should be axed. And I don't remember it ever being an issue until someone had to give Liverpool a guard of honour. I remember being at Stamford Bridge, I think it was 10 years ago. Was it 2015 when Chelsea won the league and Liverpool went there at the back end of the season? And it wasn't even discussed. It wasn't even... It was like, well, it's just what you do. Like...

A team's won the league, you know, and yeah, you know, usually it might happen once or twice, but on the occasions when a team wins it further out than that, then they get more guards of honour. It's, I just think, I just think what, I've never had an issue when Liverpool have had to do it for another team. Because I think also it should probably maybe hurt you a little bit professionally, but surely you use that as like,

you know, fire in your belly to like, you know, I don't want to be stood here next year giving someone a guard of honor. You know, I want to be getting it myself. And it's just respectful, isn't it? I genuinely don't understand. This idea of like, oh, it's outdated. It should be. I saw Peter Crouch, I think, with someone saying, oh, I don't like it. It should be like, you know, it's somehow demeaning. And it's like, it's not, is it?

It's just a show of respect to a team that's won the title. I didn't really understand the reaction of some Chelsea fans to it. But then, you know, you're talking about and there was an element of that fan base who thought that tragedy chanting was a good use of their time for

for parts of that game so there's no getting inside the heads of people like that but yeah I'm sure we'll have lots more talk about cards of honor ahead of Sunday and and Arteta I'm sure will be asked about it ahead of the weekend but I just find the whole thing absolutely baffling just just get on with it like what is it that difficult to just applaud opponent onto the pitch that's won the league

I always remember Bernardo Silva got loads of stick from Liverpool fans because he never did it when we won it and he got loads of stick. But ultimately, he then came back and was like one of City's best players over the next couple of years. And I thought there's a reason why he's not clapped. He's used it as a sort of a I'm never letting this happen again type thing. And that's what it felt like because it always seemed to be him who produced the big moments. So,

If I was having to do it, or my set of players, Liverpool, had to do it to another team, I'd want that sort of mentality. Maybe they should clap still, but ultimately, when those players are walking past, you think, I'm never doing this again. And that seemed to be what Bernardo Silva's mentality was. And he made sure that that happened for the next few years. Not this season, though. Part of me wants to say that it's a non-issue.

But here's the reality, people. And this is a lesson in the media. We need things to write and talk about when good teams win the league more than a month ago in the season. So, you know, small issues get magnified. And yes, and where it is, is it's a sign of Liverpool's domination that this has become a big issue. And that can only be a good thing.

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But James, we saw a heavily rotated team at Stamford Bridge and Chiesa needs a game time in order to get a medal.

how many of them would have impressed the manager? Because it's an opportunity, isn't it, to manage head coach? It's an opportunity to try and stake a claim because, as you said quite rightly earlier on, he doesn't, while he has confidence in the team slot, he doesn't have confidence in the squad overall.

And there weren't many takers of that opportunity, were there? No, there weren't. I think it has to be framed in the fact that, you know,

were coming off the back of the emotional high of winning the league. And, you know, and obviously they had, they'd had time off in the wake of that achievement. So drunk are we? I wouldn't, I wouldn't, I wouldn't quite go that far, but, and of course, yeah, and it's human nature, isn't it? When you're up against, when, how many times have we seen it? When a team that have got nothing on the line play against the team who are

are fighting for Champions League qualification. And we know how important, like when you think of the ridiculous sums of money Chelsea have shelled out in recent years, you know, it's laughable that they're even, it's even in doubt whether there'll be a Champions League club next season. But it meant a lot more to them. And I just think, I just think that is a difficult scenario for those players who have been starved at game time in the Premier League to suddenly be

step up and deliver. So I thought Endo did well. I thought, you know, he's such a trusted, reliable fella, isn't he, in terms of the job he does for the team. I don't think he, I certainly wouldn't be pointing any fingers at him, I thought. But him aside, I think the others that came in really struggled to really stamp their authority on the game. I thought, you know, Harvey Elliott looked pretty frustrated at times. Jota,

is that he hasn't had a great season. When you add up the games that have been missed due to injuries and then little pockets of, I'd say, of brilliance underlining what a threat he can be, but he hasn't been able to sustain it. And then, of course, Darwin comes on for Jota and actually then makes Jota actually look quite good and produces one of those special misses for his team

for his collection. So... He's got a comedy highlights reel that is, you know, it's one of the best in football. It's some compilation, isn't it? Where you go to YouTube to watch the best bits of players you've never heard of.

He's got a different type of video, different type of compilation, hasn't he? And you know what? I'd love to see some of them go in for him. I know. I mean, it was hard... Arguably, it was harder to miss that one against Chelsea, wasn't it? Like, he's, what, five yards out, free header. And he still doesn't... But you know what? I was thinking... I haven't actually...

I hadn't actually watched it back, but from where I was sat... Don't, don't. But from where I was sat, it looked like the ball ended up further away from the net than it actually was when he started to head it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Which is almost... You think that takes some doing. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, that was the classic example of the 50p head. You know...

you never know which direction it's going to go. I don't think we'll see anything like the same team out there against Arsenal. I think Slott will go back to

to his strongest team. You know, he obviously gave Gravenberg the weekend off completely last weekend, which I completely understand. You think Gravenberg had played every single Premier League match all season. You know, he rested his entire first choice midfield, didn't he, with McAllister and Zabozlai only coming on. So I think for a start, those three will come back in. I'm pretty sure of that.

Andy, what James appears to be saying to me there is that Slott wants to beat Arsenal. And the one thing I'd like to tell the head coach is you can't. You can't. You can put five past them. But you know what? They'll have been the better side. And the injuries, the injuries. They have had so many injuries. Apparently, the whole first 11 was hospitalised at one point. LAUGHTER

Now, I do think he'll want to win the game. Sorry, Tony, you're forgetting one thing as well. Do you remember the ball in the League Cup? Ah, well, yeah. That absolutely played havoc with him as well because it flies funny. Oh, and every referee, every referee. The conspiracy. Yeah. Lionsmen, fourth officials, VAR people, all of them, anti-Arsenal. It is mad that a referee slagged Liverpool off to the extent he did in a clip.

And that was used as evidence as why Liverpool have won the league. It still baffles me that that is something that people can genuinely twist in that way. But anyway, so back to the point. Yeah, I do think Slotter want to beat Arsenal. I do. I think for a number of reasons. I think the away game was one of the games for Liverpool where I think it was fair to say we're outplayed. I think Arsenal on that day were the better team. And I think that's fair. Yeah.

Particularly for the first 60 minutes of the game anyway. And I think there was elements of where Slott will want to improve and make sure that doesn't happen again and will send his players out to be the dominant side. Liverpool have also had a bit of a sticky time beating Arsenal generally in the Premier League over the recent season. So I think that's another thing. And ultimately, they're on a really low ebb and we're obviously at the highest ebb regardless, really. But I think...

I think it would be nice to just get one over them and one, just continue to, you know, disprove the narrative that Liverpool have only won the league because everyone's rubbish and not because Liverpool are just really, really, really good. So that would be nice from that perspective but also just a little bit of momentum as well. There's nothing...

it'd be great to just A, be partying, but also then beat Arsenal as well. I mean, that would just... Could the party be turned up times 10 even more? Maybe. If there's some victory over Arsenal as well. And what'd be really, really funny

And, you know, I'm no lover, as you know, of Manchester City, James, but it would be really, really funny if somehow Arsenal, the best team in the Premier League, contrived to finish third. I mean, it could happen, couldn't it? Well, I think they're three points ahead of City, aren't they, with three games to go. So Liverpool have got to play their part, haven't they? That's why I think...

I think, as, you know, obviously, you know, common sense says to you that Sunday doesn't really matter because the party will continue at Anfield regardless.

But I just think on the back of some of the things that Arteta has said as well, I just think that does add a little bit of an edge to Sunday. And you're right, I think Liverpool fans would absolutely, absolutely love to potentially help knock Arsenal down to third in this trophy-less season. So I'm looking forward to it. And it's...

you know, contrasting, certainly contrasting weeks because slot gave Liverpool, Liverpool players a fair bit of time off after the game down at Chelsea. I think they're only back in together on Friday while obviously Arsenal have had the physical and emotional toil of Paris. So, yeah, looking forward to it. There is a part of me though that is,

almost one City Arsenal win just to see what Arteta says and just to see sort of where he goes on his random we are the champions. Losing all the way in would really troll them back.

Surely, do you reckon he would come out and say that if you beat the champions after they've been crowned champions, they should have to hand over the league title to you? Guard the one off the pitch when at the full-time whistle. That's what it would be. We'd have to give them one back. What should happen? This is from, you know, because I live in London and I mix with, you know, sort of Arsenal fans. And from their point of view, it's the second we beat Tottenham and won the league, everything should have been reset then.

Can we go back? It's a four-game season. A four-game season. And he lost the first one. About to come out on top. In fact, can you imagine if they did end up finishing third and Tottenham won the Europa League? Oh. And James, the thing as well is everyone made so much about the 30-year wait that we had from winning the league, but you kind of don't realise how quickly that clock ticks along.

You know, for Arsenal, for Manchester United...

The years are flying by, aren't they? Yeah, they are. And, you know, obviously United are absolutely miles off it at the moment, aren't they? When you think, you know, it looks like we could have a situation where it's 15th against 16th in the Premier League to win the Europa League final. Arsenal have come close in recent years, but... Not that close. Well, no, yeah, not that close. And also, it's...

you know, the recruitment side of things has cost them. Like for all the talk of, I also don't honestly believe that Arteta is an elite manager, but I also think, you know, recruitment has let them down because it's for all the talk about injuries and everything else.

they don't have a centre forward, do they? They don't have, they don't have, you know, a 25, 30 goal a season, you know, attacker who's going to spearhead the kind of the title winning team and, and, and win tight games in the way that, you know, Salah has obviously been the talisman for Liverpool on that front, hasn't he? So, um,

So yeah, they've, you know, for all the money they've spent, I think Arteta is fortunate in a way that the narrative around him is that he's just been unfortunate because I think a lot of managers, if you didn't win anything at such a big club in five successive seasons, you'd be out the door. Yet it looks like they'll invest again heavily this summer. And if he does get the number nine that clearly they need, then surely there won't be any excuses if they fall short again. Well,

Well, I mean, I think you can explain what's happened there at Arsenal by listening to what Arteta said after the PSG game, which just like, I got Brendan Rodgers vibes really bad. He says we've been the best team, except in both penalty areas. Best team over the rest of the pitch, except in the penalty areas. And you go, hmm. So, like, you were the best team except where it mattered. I mean, aren't you?

I mean, that's mega levels of delusion, isn't it? Yeah, yeah. I mean, there's a point to it. And generally, when you're building a side that you want, you know, ultimately you're trying to lead to success, you need to be, you know, ultimately you want to get the middle of the pitch right and be really good and common, you know, and controlling and dominant. But then you've got to add

the stuff on both sides and ultimately Arsenal have failed to do that they've had opportunities I mean I hope there's a bit of a Brendan Rodgers transfer committee argument in the summer of who they want as number 9 and they get the wrong one in and the player who should be playing is playing left wing back Is Ricky Lambert still available?

Well, yeah, the player that they should be playing number nine is playing left wing back at Old Trafford and all that type of stuff in Roberto Firmino. So, yeah, I mean, I hope they have a few transfer committee issues like Rodgers did.

But yeah, I do think that it can come back strong next season. Or it could go two ways because it's emotionally taxing to constantly be at the top. And we've seen it in Liverpool and there's been reasons why Liverpool have dropped off in certain seasons. But even Liverpool haven't been able to sustain three, four, five years of constantly challenging for the title. Obviously, there was a sense of that half-time.

you know, everyone getting injured and then the midfield decided to not turn up for the season a couple of years later. But then within that, Liverpool have been able to then sort of reinvent themselves, re-energise themselves and go again. I think with Arsenal, you know, it's hard to keep

you know, getting yourself up with the same group of players and not going again. So I think their window is really important because ultimately they need that fresh injection. Whereas Liverpool have got the core, there's no reason why they wouldn't, you know, have the energy to go and win it again. And now you're going to supplement it with,

I think ultimately Liverpool don't need to go out and buy five starters, which is what a rebuild generally is. What we're talking about is rebuilding a squad and supplement with maybe better options and more versatile options off the bench with one or two starters maybe coming in. But ultimately Liverpool have got an 11 there. That slot is generally used all season and there's no reason why they can't repeat what they've done this season. And with better help behind them and more rotation, that's only going to make them stronger.

Yeah, definitely. And let's face it, Antony players we're looking at this summer don't want to end up like Zubermenti, who, you know, the message we should be sending to him is, we don't look at mountains, we climb mountains. It's off one right now.

We are, we are. And that's it from Walk On, your Liverpool podcast brought to you by The Athletic. Thanks to James and Andy and you two for listening. We'll be back on Tuesday after we've seen off Arsenal. We'll catch you then.

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