Trump To Launch Mobile Services, Robots Learn the Physical World
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Bloomberg Tech is live from coast to coast with Caroline Hyde in New York and Ed Ludlow in San Francisco. This is Bloomberg Tech. Coming up, President Trump's family is getting into the mobile phone business with the Trump branded service. Plus, Meta will start showing ads in WhatsApp and offer paid subscriptions for the first time.

A robotics firm, One X Technology, says it can evaluate a robot's performance without deploying it into the real world. But first, President Trump is attending a Group of Seven summit in Canada today. This amid tariff uncertainty and Middle East crisis between Israel and Iran. Let's go over to the G7 summit where Bloomberg's Anne-Marie Horden is standing by. AMH, what do we need to know?

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photo and the president was sitting with his arms crossed looking up at Angela Merkel, the then German chancellor. She was surrounded by a number of leaders, the only one that's lasted since then. And then, of course, President Trump pulled the U.S. out of that joint communique. So Mark Carney is taking a different approach this time, looking at different statements that they can have a common thread for specifics, not one

THE U.S. IS NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO COMMUNICATE FOR A WIDE RANGE OF TOPICS, MAYBE SOMETHING REGARDING ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE, CRITICAL MINERALS. POTENTIALLY THERE WILL NOT BE AN AGREEMENT FROM ALL OF THESE COUNTRIES WHEN IT COMES TO THINGS LIKE THE WAR IN UKRAINE, THINGS LIKE CLIMATE CHANGE, OR EVEN WHEN IT COMES TO WHAT IS GOING ON WITH IRAN AND ISRAEL.

of the agenda today. The president was speaking about it as he left the White House yesterday on his way to Canada. And he was saying that these two may have to fight it out. But in the end, he wants a deal.

Bloomberg's Anne-Marie Horden will stick with what's happening in the G7 throughout the day. Thank you. Let's go with Donald Trump and over to D.C. to talk about some news in technology. The president's family launching a Trump branded mobile phone service that will rely on wireless networks and hardware, quote, made in America. Bloomberg's Kelsey Griffiths here with more.

The idea is that they're not building the network from the ground up, right? They basically license capacity from the three major U.S. carriers. But what else do we know about Trump Mobile?

That's right, Ed. So the Trump family's mobile service is they say they're going to rely on the three major U.S. telecom networks that have already been built. And this is a pretty common strategy that we see. Mint Mobile is one of the pretty well-known so-called MVNOs that was eventually acquired by T-Mobile.

We also saw some celebrities last week looking to get into the mobile game, launching their own MVNO. So the Trump family is following a pretty popular tradition here by getting into this business. Kelsey, popular. Last time I checked, there were hundreds, more than 100 here in the United States of mobile virtual network operators. But what they're trying to tap into here is the Trump narrative, the Trump brand. How will it be priced versus other competitors in the space?

That's right. So the brand is going to cost about just under $50. I think it's $47.45 per month. And I would say that is pretty competitive with the space. These MVNOs tend to target these niche markets that are looking at customers that maybe don't want to or can't pay $100 or somewhere higher.

in that range. So I do think that there is a chance they will be targeting this niche that, you know, maybe other operators aren't necessarily looking at. Kelsey, it's a competitive field, right? When you're looking at any carrier. When I was reading the news from Trump Mobile, they're including everything that you'd expect. Unlimited text, data, voice protection, overseas call. Just give us the basics of the plan.

Yeah, exactly. So there are going to be some of these value-added services on top of your mobile services that you would expect. There is going to be some sort of roadside assistance. There will be international calling thrown in. And there's also going to be the opportunity to purchase

a mobile device that will also be branded with the Trump family logo. It will come in a gold variety, which I'm looking forward to seeing. Kelsey Griffiths puts us perfectly onto our next discussion because we want to talk about the hardware perspective. Bloomberg's Dana Willman is here with us. $499. You're going to be able to get it as soon as September. You can put $100 down for initial

well name on a list but can they make that in america never say never but certainly the smartphone industry is not really making phones here in the us right now and it's unclear from the report so far and what we know so far who exactly are with what partners um trump and his family would be making these devices all that we know as kelsey has said is that the device will be golden color which is very on brand for trump and that it will be caught that it will be priced at 499 which even before

Recent inflation was a pretty budget price for a phone and seems especially low these days. So not knowing anything about the hardware, we can at least say safely these are probably not phones offering the most advanced features. And maybe that's not the point, as Kelsey said, for this particular niche.

Right. The point, Dana, is that this is billed as being designed and built in America at a time where the president is putting pressure on Apple to build the iPhone in America or face tariffs of as much as 25 percent. I think it's really notable that it's going to run Android OS as well. Yes, absolutely. As we said, as I said, it's unclear exactly how

THE TRUMP ORGANIZATION WOULD MAKE THIS PHONE COME TO PASS SO QUICKLY IN THE U.S., JUST KNOWING FROM APPLE AND OTHER MANUFACTURERS AS WELL, ALL OF THE HUMAN RESOURCES, THE HUMAN LABOR AND PHYSICAL RESOURCES

that just are lacking here in the U.S. And by human resources, I mean specialized talent that know how to use this particular manufacturing equipment. A lot of the equipment itself is abroad. So it's unclear exactly how the team plans to surmount those challenges that other smartphone makers either haven't tackled or just seem to be avoiding. It's interesting who ultimately it'll be competing against.

Because we've heard him take aim, President Trump this is, of course, the phone being made by a Trump organization in his family. But President Trump himself and the administration have taken aim at Apple front and center. Bring your manufacturing back to the United States. But at a 499 price point, yeah, it might compete against an iPhone SE. But really it's going against other Android phones. It's going against the Pixel 8a, for example.

Yes, maybe perhaps not even the Pixel A line, perhaps even more budget sort of bargain basement phones that I'm not able to recite offhand and most of us can't recite offhand.

And I think one key question is how many does the organization plan to produce? I think one of the key lines in our story is that smartphone makers aren't producing at scale in the U.S. So that to me is a really key question. Could you produce a small, really sort of limited run number of phones here in the U.S.? Probably more easily than Apple could produce its whole iPhone line. So I think the volume that they're expecting is an unknown detail, but seems like an important one to me.

Motorola tried to build the Moto X in Dallas, Fort Worth in 2013, and they shut the plant a year later. It was an Android-based phone because the costs were too high. I mean, that's what we're talking about here. Caro made a really interesting point in our group chat earlier about, like, what is 499 relative to the field? It's like iPhone SE. It's like...

that kind of mid-tier of Android smartphone, but making it and the number of components go into it, that's like the key question here, if they're going to have a business in it. Yes, absolutely.

Dana Walman. All right, Bloomberg, go for it, Cara. I'll wrap it up. We've talked so much, all things about the future of actual hardware and software. But let's take a look at what's happening in the world of crypto now, Ed, because there's some Trump action there, too. Let's shine a light on what's happening with DJT. Now, we know that we were reporting last week about how they're going to be starting to buy Bitcoin in the Treasury. Well, now we understand that they're pivoting with

THE BITCOIN AND ETHEREUM E.T.F. THEY HAVE ALREADY LOOKED AT A BITCOIN E.T.F. BUT THIS IS SCALING OUT TO ETH AS WELL. BITCOIN IS UP 2.75%. ETH IS UP MORE THAN 5%. CHECK OUT WHAT IS HAPPENING WITH CIRCLE.

as we all anticipate that the latest genius act that will put into legal clarity stable coins is likely to occur this week. I also want to say that Tron is being reported in the FT, that Tron might IPO here in the United States via reverse merger, and that's sending other companies, particularly higher ed. Coming up.

Robots, they're just like us. Now, possibly more so as robotics firm 1X Technologies launches a world model that will teach robots to anticipate and understand the physics that's all around them. That's coming up next. This is Bloomberg Technology.

Discover how one of China's largest financial services companies serves 240 million customers with AI-powered solutions. Hear from Ping An's co-CEO and chief scientist. We're on a goldmine of data integrated to provide tailored solutions to our customers. Public domain tax, 3.2 trillion tokens, 7.5 billion images. Tune in to our technology-powered growth podcast.

Find it at group.pingan.com, Spotify, or Apple Podcasts.

The world is built on code. From the apps we use every day to the systems powering industries, developers like you are the architects of tomorrow. But let's be real, the road to innovation can get a little tricky. You need the right tools to move fast, but you also need a community to help you go further. That's where Microsoft comes in. Microsoft has the tools to help you move at lightning speed, like GitHub Copilot, VS Code, and a ton of AI resources to keep you on the cutting edge.

But here's the best part. You can build with confidence, knowing that Microsoft security and compliance are already taken care of. No more worrying about vulnerabilities or threats while you focus on your craft.

And with Azure AI Foundry, you can build your way. The future is yours to build, no strings attached. From ready-to-code tools to full flexibility, it's all in one place. The future's in your hands. So learn more at developer.microsoft.com.

Switch to Verizon Business and get more from your internet without paying more for your internet. Get LTE Business Internet starting at $39 a month when paired with select business mobile plans. That's unlimited data and with it, unlimited possibilities. Start saving today with Verizon Business, ranked number one in small business internet customer satisfaction by J.D. Power.

Starting price for 25 megabits per second LTE internet plan with smartphone plan savings, plus taxes, fees and economic adjustment charge. Terms apply for J.D. Power 2024 award information. Visit JDPower.com slash awards. Companies like Tesla betting their future on humanoid robots that fill labor shortages, particularly in manufacturing. Today, robotics firm 1X Technologies is out with a new world model. It says can evaluate a robot's performance without deploying it.

into the real world. The models are data-driven simulator for humanoids with a grounded understanding of physics of their surrounding world. The CEO and CTO of OneX, Berndt Berneck, joins us here in San Francisco. You would claim that this world model is the first of its kind and you have the data from it that proves its effectiveness. But the main point is validation of capability without collecting the real world data.

Kind of, yes. You got it mostly right. So what it really does is it gives us the ability to basically see the future with respect to what would happen if the robot actually takes these specific actions. And this allows us to really test at scale

where these new AI models that we're actually creating will be better than the previous ones, right? And that really allows us to climb this and really to create better and better AI models for physical labour. I wrote in the Tech In Depth newsletter this morning that if you look at particularly manufacturing jobs data,

There is a need there. It's hard to fill those roles. Why does this world model open a path to a world where humanoid robotics are genuinely useful, deployable in manufacturing or other logistics settings where a human is currently needed?

So I think, like, taking a step back, just like, you know, we're a consumer company, seen often as right now, but to us it's really about how do you create an actual abundance of artificial labor as quickly as possible, which means going into factories, going into enterprise services, and basically everything, right? But to get there and get your robots to be intelligent enough to solve these tasks, you just need this incredible diversity of data. And that's why we're going to the home first.

If you're deploying these robots at scale into homes, living and learning among us, then we also need to be able, in a safe manner, to test how will our models perform. And this is really what the World Model allows us to do. It allows us to take all of this data that we're gathering, create new models, and then see if we deploy these to our fleet of robots, how would it actually perform? Would all of the behaviors that it do actually be safe?

Would it be able to do things it couldn't do before? And kind of really benchmark the models so we can progress. How sophisticated is the hardware right now? We're talking about how the models and the software is going to really bring it to bear. What are they already doing in the home, those that are out in beta? So the hardware is actually really getting there. So I have one in my home, for example, and it's doing like tidying,

cleaning, vacuuming, some laundry, different kind of tasks around the home. And of course, all of the social aspect of this, right? Being able to have this AI companion together with you, which doesn't actually require you to look at your phone all the time to be able to interface with AI. Now, currently, this is still pretty brittle and the magic is there and then maybe lasts for a minute and then

You need someone to nudge it in the right direction, right? But it's really getting to where you see where this will go. And the hardware can do it. And now it's really about how do we gather the data that allows us to automate all this behavior. And that's also really what we're doing this year, right? So when we're talking about the goal being by end of year, we're actually going to have this commercially out in the market in homes.

It's really important to do expectation management because this is not the consumer product at that point that everyone will have at home. This is the beginning of a journey where we're inviting people in on our mission to really almost like adopt a Neo into your family, have it live and learn among us and have a lot of fun along the way.

OK, so you're pitching the early adopter here, basically. You're pitching an early adopter in the home. Go to outside the home for a moment. I really want your expertise. When we're talking about having robots help manufacture here in the US, President Trump wants to build Apple phones here in the US. Is robotics at a level in the next few years where we could ever make that achievable? In the next few years. I think this is going to happen a lot sooner than people might think, but it's not happening this year.

but we are a few years not a few decades away from where actually most importantly to me robots can build robots meaning we can have robots build more robots we can have robots build out the energy infrastructure the data centers the chip fabs and really enable us to get this multiplier on the workforce for artificial labor which will allow us to automate all kinds of factory work across the us and i think this can have

a tremendous impact on our GDP, right? And how we can grow our way out of the current deficit. But I also want to just do expectation management and say like this is years away, but years is not that long in the grand picture of things. It's not decades. You first came on our radar at Nvidia GTC. You had this sort of very prominent place and I know that 1X exchanged jackets with Jensen, etc.

What is the unlock bin from NVIDIA? You know, they always talk about how they work in multiple ways, not just providing the basis for training, but the localized silicon for the robot itself and then simulated or virtual data. Just explain the relationship. Yeah, sure. NVIDIA is an amazing partner, right? And we're working very deeply together, both with their engineering team, we're using their hardware, we're using their simulators.

I think they've done an incredible job in just enabling the ecosystem and all of the things you touched upon we are using, right? So they're very fast simulators that allow us to learn a lot in simulation before we have to go into the real world. It's really valuable for us. We had some great results we published last week from our reinforcement learning and our work on how to use the entire body. Like you can see here, the robot actually using its entire body to do tasks. And this is trained in NVIDIA simulators.

The computer on board the robot actually is NVIDIA's hardware, and they've done a great job in creating very good embedded compute that can allow us to run the robot fully enclosed. It doesn't actually need to be connected to the internet to do its tasks.

And of course, we're training on the infrastructure from Nvidia like everyone else. We're talking a lot about your model, world model today, but we're showing also pictures on the screen of the hardware side. What is different? What is your different mission statement to a figure AI, agility, Tesla and Optimus, all the things we've been talking about for many weeks? Sure. So of course, I don't want to speak on others behalf, but I can say like my view on this.

I'd actually say it's pretty different because most of the companies in this field, they're focusing on how can we be useful as quickly as possible in manufacturing or some kind of enterprise. While to me it's actually all about how can we make robots that are safe so they can live and learn among people because that's how we get to truly intelligent machines.

And if you want to put them in consumer, they need to be extremely affordable. So you need to have this combination of something that's very safe, but still affordable and very capable. And then you can have this living and learning among people and basically solve the full problem, right? How do we get robots that are as intelligent as us so that we can easily instruct them in how to do labor across society at scale? So I say like we're betting to go directly to the goal instead of going through the factories.

Bernd Berneck, it's been great having you, CEO and CTO of One X Technologies. Fascinating, thanks. It is time now for Talking Tech, and first up, shares of Roku surging today. Now, the company has announced a partnership with Amazon Ads that it says will allow advertisers access to more than 80% of U.S. households with Amazon-connected TVs. Now, the full integration and rollout to all advertisers, that's expected by Q4 of this year, will likely drive more demand for Roku's U.S. inventory, analysts say.

PLUS, IMAX IS SET TO EXPAND ITS SCREENS ACROSS CHINA. IMAX'S CHINESE ARM ALONGSIDE PARTNER WONDER FILMS SAYS THEY WILL REPLACE 27 SCREENS IN IMAX'S JUMBO SCREEN. IMAX WILL CURRENTLY OPERATE 800 SCREENS IN CHINA, AND IT DREW A RECORD 22 MILLION CUSTOMERS FROM JANUARY TO MAY. AND TAIWAN'S INTERNATIONAL TRADE ADMINISTRATION HAS ADDED HUAWEI AND SMIC TO THEIR SCREEN.

It's a list of blacklisted companies. It's a move that undercuts China's efforts in developing AI chip technology locally.

Turning to Tesla, the company's full self-driving tech stack, alongside their ability to scale, is proving to be a tailwind against rivals like Waymo as the robotaxi race ramps up. That's the latest from Bloomberg Intelligence. Steve Mann, who led the research, joins us now. The kind of key headline from the React piece is that Tesla's vehicle cost is about one seventh of Waymo's. Why were you so focused on that, Steve?

Well, I think that is the critical piece in getting it on a commercial basis, on a mass scale basis. And also, you know, the payback is also important. If you can produce the cars at a fraction of the price, look, you can get more of these vehicles out on the road. And also, you know, whoever is running them can actually make their money back much sooner.

The issue you really highlight is the lack of production of real vehicles by Waymo versus Tesla that just has hundreds of thousands of millions on the road already. Is that the key dividing factor, Hizdi? That's one key dividing factor. I think technology is also important. Look, I don't want to discount Waymo's technology. I think they have had a number of cars on the road already.

It's working. There's always going to be some issues here and there. But look, I think if you look at Tesla's technology and their approach with using cameras, it's just much easier to scale.

And especially now, if you look at the recent news, the Chinese are actually opening up the market for them and allowing them to export some of that training data out of China. That's a huge win for Tesla in scaling over the long term. Steve, I used full self-driving SuperVise, the latest version this morning, to go the 30 miles from my house to the studio. I do it every day.

You say very clearly it's still a level two system, right, on a technical basis. Do you see the jump to a software platform that powers a vehicle with no one in the driver's seat at all? That's going to be a while. I have to admittedly say it's going to be a while. I think the consumer needs to gain confidence. It's going to be a gold standard. It's going to be, you know, if a car is 99.99%,

accurate, I think then the consumer will be more confident. Before that, I think there's going to be always some level of monitoring from the consumer. We're not at that stage where we see-- this is not like the iRobot movie that Will Smith was on a long time ago, where cars are actually driving itself and making decisions on their own. We're not at that moment yet.

But what's really important is the training data. And that's where Tesla also comes in as well, where they have just tons of training data from around the world. Steve Mann of Bloomberg Intelligence has a great read. Thanks for coming on. Now coming up, Meta, it plans to start showing ads in WhatsApp. Its private messaging services. We'll find out what the change means for users and for the social media giant. This is Bloomberg Tech. Welcome back to Bloomberg Tech. I'm Caroline Hyde in New York.

I'M ED LUDLOW IN SAN FRANCISCO. QUICK CHECK ON THE MARKETS. WE ARE POWERING BACK AFTER SELLING OFF ON FRIDAY. WE RALLY AS WE ALL EYES ATTEND OUR ATTENTION TO IRAN, ISRAEL AND WHAT IS HAPPENING AT THE G7 SUMMIT. UNDER THE HOOD, CHIPMAKERS ARE HAVING A NICE DAY.

because it is one of the key points contributors, the second biggest points contributor on the day. We're up 3%. Why? Because of announcements when it comes to advertising, Ed.

Yep, Meta's announced it's introducing ads as well as some new features into WhatsApp. It marks a change for the privacy-focused messaging platform. Bloomberg's Riley Griffin joins us. This is all about the updates tab and what people maybe outside of America actually don't appreciate is like one and a half billion visits per day to this updates tab. What's the ad strategy here for Meta? Because clearly the shares are higher.

this is something the market sees as positive. Yeah, Meta has begun introducing ads to various outlets other than Instagram and Facebook, the platforms that we know really well. And here with WhatsApp, they're introducing those ads starting today, rolling that out over time into the updates tab, which is much like stories. You're able to get other kinds of information there. They're not actually introducing it to the conversations, the messages that you and I might be having, Ed.

But this is a new revenue line. They're introducing it while at con this week. Advertising is the name of the game and more to come. And in terms of how big of a share of revenue this will pull in. Riley, yeah, they've got to walk that fine line that they don't invade what we feel is very personalized and private conversations. They're going down the updates route, but also subscriptions in the longer term. The business communications is really going to be where it's at.

No doubt. They've been using the platform to bring businesses on. You can communicate with airlines, with shops.

But a really important point that you made, Caroline, is that this was not the intention of the original WhatsApp owners when Meta bought the company in 2014. Even before then, the co-founders had said that they would never introduce ads to the platform. So this is a market change and one very specific to Mark Zuckerberg. The main thing about Meta right now is that ads is still the core. It's still the bread and butter business.

But success and growth and top line growth all justifies investment in AI. I think that's still the formula. Absolutely. We know that Meta might be spending more than 70 billion on AI this week. This comes on the news last week that Meta is finalizing a deal for scale AI that is more than 14 billion investment to be specific. But ads are going to be improved by AI, no doubt. And that's the conversation in com this week.

And it's a perfect setup, Riley Griffin. We thank you because let's go out to Cannes right now and talk about social media advertising more with Rachel Tippegraff, founder and CEO of Micmac. You're out there taking a step out of the sun for a moment to be with us, Rachel. Just talk about the euphoria around how generative AI is going to be helping the AI offering and advertising offering. But is it going to impact companies and people?

So everyone's in agreement that AI is going to lower the barrier to entry for advertising. Where is all the friction been in the creative and ad buying process, generating creative, figuring out where you're going to invest your dollars, launching those ads and auto optimizing experiences and ultimately getting reporting back.

Where the friction is in the conversation right now at Khan with CMOs is that they absolutely agree that there are efficiency disease to be had in the process that I just described. But what they feel cannot be outsourced is creative ideas that break through culture.

And so it's interesting that Zuckerberg has been very bold in his statement, where he's essentially said by the end of 2026, all human intervention will be removed from advertising. I believe that 50% will be removed, but not 100%. And the biggest CMOs in the world share the same sentiment. What about the social media companies? The biggest in the world is TikTok as it unveils its generative AI offering, also as bullish as Mark Zuckerberg.

Absolutely. There's a place to lower the barrier to entry in terms of creative. What's interesting with TikTok's announcements this week is that they even said that they're going to help generate influencer content, which raises the question around authenticity. So while AI is going to help lower the barrier to entry, increase productivity, it's also going to create new questions in advertising. Is this real? How much is an advertiser willing to spend on

on a agentic impression? Will they spend the same amount on a human impression? It's going to create a whole new opening in advertising for new companies to come to market to define what the standardization is in terms of ad buying measurement in forms of agentic AI and creative experiences.

Rachel, what are people talking about on TikTok and Can? There's a June 19th deadline for sale or shutdown. We haven't yet got an extension. What are you hearing? Everyone has come to the point in this journey where they believe TikTok is here to stay. When we look at Micmac data, it's essentially held as our third most trafficked channel on any given day. Meta number one, Google search number two, TikTok number three.

When TikTok went dark on January 19th, it did take about until March 1st for advertisers to get back to Q4 levels of traffic. By May, we saw it surpass. On any given day in May, it represented 17% of traffic. Rachel Tippegraph, Keeping It Global. So good to have you, Fanrasio, Micmac. Remember when a single technology glitch could bring an entire workday to a standstill? I'm Mark Banfield, Chief Commercial Officer at TeamViewer.

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is about fundamentally reimagining how work happens for everyone. And the companies that move first get competitive advantages in terms of efficiency, productivity, and innovation. To find out more, visit bloomberg.com forward slash teamviewer.

The world is built on code. From the apps we use every day to the systems powering industries, developers like you are the architects of tomorrow. But let's be real. The road to innovation can get a little tricky. You need the right tools to move fast, but you also need a community to help you go further. That's where Microsoft comes in. Microsoft has the tools to help you move at lightning speed, like GitHub Copilot, VS Code, and a ton of AI resources to keep you on the cutting edge.

But here's the best part. You can build with confidence, knowing that Microsoft security and compliance are already taken care of. No more worrying about vulnerabilities or threats while you focus on your craft.

And with Azure AI Foundry, you can build your way. The future is yours to build, no strings attached. From ready-to-code tools to full flexibility, it's all in one place. The future's in your hands. So learn more at developer.microsoft.com.

Switch to Verizon Business and get more from your internet without paying more for your internet. Get LTE Business Internet starting at $39 a month when paired with select business mobile plans. That's unlimited data and with it, unlimited possibilities. Start saving today with Verizon Business. Ranked number one in small business internet customer satisfaction by J.D. Power. Starting price for 25 megabits per second LTE internet plan with smartphone plan savings plus taxes, fees, and economic adjustment charge.

Terms apply. For J.D. Power 2024 award information, visit jdpower.com slash awards. VC firms are continuing to step up their investments in AI. AIX Ventures is one of those early stage VC firms doing just that. Sean Johnson, co-founder and general partner of AIX Ventures, joins us now. Earlier in the show, 1X on the robotic side. We've been thinking a lot about scale AI data on that side.

agentic AI, what they all have in common to my mind is that the cost of getting towards this level of intelligence is coming down and down and down. How do you invest at the early stage to kind of ride that wave?

Yeah, and thank you so much for having me. Absolutely, we think a lot about this new era where the cost of intelligence, just as you called out, is going to zero. And so what does that mean for the new world we're going to live in? That means that on the consumer side, you're going to have ready access to tutors, doctors. On the enterprise side, you're going to see more and more knowledge workers be engaged

augmented and some replaced by AI. And so we invest at the early stage, first check. We are looking at founders with big visions, looking to change the world that want to move very fast to bring that disruption to market. And that's how we've positioned the firm.

What's interesting is there's big visions coming from big companies, Sean. We can't help but sort of draw the attention that it's phenomenal amounts of money coming from just a few key players, whether it be Amazon, whether it be Meta, and of course reports that OpenAI might be snapping up one of your portfolio companies. Weights and biases has already been eyed as well and bought by CoreWeave. Is M&A going to happen for these smaller companies a lot?

Absolutely. I mean, so I'd say two things there. The first is it makes sense for the large companies to get a lot of attention. They make a lot of revenue. They have large market caps. Venture capital is a business that's focused on small companies that start with no revenue and then have.

much smaller prospects in the short term, but can grow quickly and under the radar to an extent of the large companies. Now, large companies are certainly focused on building AI native teams, bringing AI throughout, diffusing that sort of mindset throughout their organizations. And M&A is very important for that. And it's going to happen at all stages. It's going to happen at startups that are really just getting started. It's also going to happen at startups that are fairly far along too.

Perplexity, we just showed some of the portfolio companies on the screen. There's this thesis building that they're almost peerless. They get talked a lot about in the context of Google and search. And they also get talked about in the context of sort of those working on the frontier model. Just your thesis on them, please.

Sure. So, you know, Arvind and the team have been setting their sights on building an iconic business. And we all know one thing is true in AI is it moves very fast. You never know what's going to be launched tomorrow, what's going to be launched the next day. And the amazing thing about Perflexity and the team is they have a group of some of the world's foremost practitioners executing at the speed of light, if you will.

And so they're all focused right now on redefining what knowledge, a knowledge engine looks like. But then also you're going to see Comet, their new browser, come out very soon. And that's going to redefine again what agentic solutions can bring. You, of course, yourself were very much helming product design at startups before you came on to co-founder AIX Ventures, Sean. What's the number one question people are coming to you, your founders coming to you at the moment? Is it about talent? Is it about tariffs? What is it about?

Yeah, that's a really good question, Caroline. Founders often talk to us about, you know, number one, how do you start, you know, connecting with early customers, early prospects? It's all about product market fit. And that can be elusive for many years into the journey, you know, that is an entrepreneur's. And so, yeah.

What we do is orient ourselves around the founder, and we think a lot about how do we get to product market fit with the founder through lots of customer conversations, hiring a team, thinking about business strategy, execution, but then also connecting with the next wave of venture firms that will continue to back the founders.

Sean Johnson of AIX Ventures, we appreciate you coming on today. Thanks, Carol. Now, let's just talk about one-time login codes. You probably have them a lot. They're meant to be security and verify a user's identity that may not actually, though, be all that private. Millions of those codes sent via text pass through intermediaries, making it possible for entities to actually see their content.

The most Ryan Gallagher has been really leading the charge. This is an investigation, a deep one, Ryan, just showing how actually we shouldn't really be using text SMS as our form of two factor authentication. That's right. Yeah. We looked in depth at this issue because I think a lot of people don't realize that when you log into whether it's a banking app or whether it's Google or Meta,

when you receive one of these login codes via SMS, it isn't actually coming directly from the tech company or the platform that you're logging into. It's routed through intermediaries all across the world, and there's very little oversight of who actually handles those messages. So that's what we set about to do is to show, look, who is actually looking at these security codes, and is there a potential vulnerability in terms of

the people who are accessing the codes and that's what we found that there's some concerns around some of the entities that are handling them ryan what's the alternative then to sms we just have 30 seconds

The alternative is to use, for example, an authenticator app on your phone, which actually gives you the code on your phone. You don't have to rely on SMS. It doesn't go across any network. It's just on your device all the time and it stays there. So authenticator apps, Google those and you'll find plenty of options. Ryan Gallagher, it's a really thoughtful piece. We urge you to go and read it from a business perspective, from a security perspective. Now that does it for this edition of Bloomberg Tech Ed.

Yeah, astonishing way to start the week. Don't forget to recap through the podcast. You know where to find the pod. It's on the Bloomberg Terminal, all the Bloomberg platforms, as well as online on Apple, Spotify and iHeart. All right. Strong way to start the week from San Francisco, New York City. This is Bloomberg Tech.

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