NBCU's streaming chief isn't worried about you canceling cable
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Hello, welcome to the coder. I me like to tell, edit and chief of the and decoder is my show about big ideas and other problems. Today I am talking with math stress, who is chairman of direct consumer at N B C. universal. That's a fancy title.

IT means he's in charge of p cock and all of nbc universal other consumer products that includes everything from fan dano and it's fan ango at home video service which used to be voto to rotten tomos to the core platforms that powers the now TV service run by sky. In that's a lot in all of that is under the overall otherness of comcast, which is in the middle. Its own massive transition is the traditional cable T, V business.

Matt actually spent almost two decades at home cast proper working on its cable products before switching over to N, B, C, U. And I was really interested in his of you, and how the economics of the TV business will shake out this. Almost everyone moves over to streaming. Matt also oversees what's called the global streaming platform, which peaked, and other services at conchas run on.

I wanted to know if that big tech investment is generating the kind of economies of scale that really pay off over time, stuff that tech companies think about all the time, but which media companies have had to learn? And one thing that I really wanted to talk to about about was how picot handle the olympics this year. IT really felt like things clicked for that platform.

And peacock in paris over the summer in the idea that all of the coverage and olympics could be served up in multiple different formats on demand and live really came together IT. Turns out that a lot of these ideas have been brewing inside of N. B.

C. For a long time, for a decade or more. In some cases, you will hear matt describe how some early efforts didn't really go so well.

There's a lot going on in this one tech, media, sports, culture all IT wants. It's quite a right are usual disclosure before we start N B C U as an investor in the virgins parent company of ox media. But they have no control over in his room.

And I remain free to demand n fell games in four K, H, D, R. Whatever I want. You're on the hook now that okay, math stressed, had a direct consumer IT. And we see universal here. you.

That stress. You are the chairman of direct consumer of nbc universal. Welcome to decoder.

Thank you. I is good to bear.

That is a very formal title. IT sounds like you sit in a leather chair in a board room and just sort of issue. Ecs, what that means to me is that you oversee peacock. Is that really the the scope of IT? Well.

it's a little bit broader than that. You know, maybe just to give a little bit of background, I actually had just celebrated my twenty year anniversary at contest, and so I ve been at the company for a quite a long time. When I came to contrast, I actually came there as cable was transitioning from analytic digital and IT gave way to the two week connectivity that ultimately build things like on demand and so on.

Demand technology is something i'd ve been very passionate about my entire career and was really focused on how I build that out of for conchas. And I spent quite number of years doing that. And then we ultimately launched the x one platform, which was conchas IP sector box because we realized that the future was on demand that was good to give people instant gratification.

And we needed a platform to allow people ultimate control that they could navigate all these on demand choices. X one became the platform where we did that, and IT really was ahead of its time because IT aggregated live and on demand and D V R and even apps and made them all really seamless for consumers and including the ability to navigate them with your voice, with the voice, which was before even syria. And alexa, like we work experimenting with voice.

And I think as my career there kind of group, I took on more of the role of overseeing the residential services, a conchas, which included video and broadband and phone. I got a call or data come to N B C H, which obviously is is a subsidiary of comcast. And I got a call from Steve burke with the time was the CEO.

He'd asked if I would come there to help them build a streaming service and take IT to market. And I got that call on a thursday and monday. I showed up in new york city with my success that I I was ready to go.

And with very common inside of large companies in my experience is that you know when you're trying to build something, knew it's it's common, almost incubated, you kind of create resources. You put a little bit offence around IT because you don't want the day to day activity necessarily interfering with the ambition of trying to build new business. And and peak ck was the same inside of nbc.

But what I realized early on was that there's lots of other businesses within nbc that actually are very complimentary, can help get us more scale, can help the risk, the execution in the ambition we had with pickup. For example, you know, B C O N fan ango, which is where the largest stickling companies in their own video, which is now called finding go home, which has, you know a catalog of children, fifty thousand titles for digital purchase and rental. The ond run tomatoes, which is certainly known for moving in TV reviews.

You know, they also, everyone similar with N, B, C and a lot of the cable networks that we have, the united states, but nbc distributes their networks in almost every country around the world. And so what we recognized was that if we could aggregate e all these businesses under one portfolio, IT actually could give us even more, more economies of scale. And that's what we started to do.

And so the umbrella of direct consumer P C, A big piece of IT. But all these other businesses, the global businesses and these other digital businesses now sit under this d to c umbrella. And there they each have their own individual p nl.

But in the aggregate, you, they reach a hundred thousand users. They generate billions of dollars of revenue. And they also you know they're available over seventy countries around the world. And so I think that, that is the port folio that i'm not managing. And so how we then leverage that portfolio is something that i've been trying to build out over the last few years around you, again, trying to build one product team, one, one technology team, one decision science is research acedera to give us kind of these centres of excEllence incited N, B, C. As we continue to roll out, you know, our our digital plans for directed consumer.

While you're quoters, i'm absolutely going to ask you about how all of that is structured and how all of those individual p nl. Fight for your sources. But I I want to just take one step back and focus on on the transition you mentioned from comcast, nbc to direct to consumer broadly in the TV world.

We're going from a place where big cable companies like contest's spectrum, whatever, had big regional physical infrastructure monos, right? You had these natural and all places at wires in the ground, go in everyone's houses. You were the distractor. The video providers would come to you and you would resell the services. And I was a pretty good business for everyone.

Now we're a place where there is multiple ways to get programing over the internet, whether it's wireless, whether it's fibre in the ground, whether IT is still the cable network when IT is other forms of road mate with starlink. And the distributors don't have as much power over the suppliers because the splicing get to consumers in lots of different ways that the transition that you're mentioning and IT is really disrupted the whole industry. How do you see peacock fitting into this at the end? Is that gonna be as good of a business is the cable business was once upon a time because IT feels like everyone is searching for a business that good.

There's no question you know that you know the cable business is a good business that continues to be a good business. I think to answer the question, you you almost need to look at a through the ends of the consumer. What i've learned is there really are different cohorts of how people consume video, how they subscribed to video.

So for example, the cable customer tends to watch a lot of T, V. You know, the average consumer watches about five hours a day. If you subscribe to cable, you you typically watched that much, if not more.

And there's a lot of benefit of having cable because as I mention, if you have the x one platform, there's a simplicity of just having all the choices in one place. IT works with like ninety nine point nine nine percent reliability. And in many cases, people are also stribling to the bundle.

So they're getting video, but they're also getting internet. In some cases, they're getting their wireless and boundings, even though people tend to say they like OA car. Bondi has a lot of virtue because the more you take, the Better the Price.

And so people who subtribes the cable and satellite today is sound that they're not aware of other choices. They're paying in some cases for that for that convenience and that reliability. They also tend over index in subscribing to stringing services.

And so it's not one of the other. In many cases, you're seeing you that customer by both. And so that's one part of the market.

You have another part of the market which might be more Price sensitive, maybe does not consume as much video in in some cases, you know they might watch video, but they might be spending more time on social media 或 or video gaming or or how else they are occupying their time。 And they like the flexibility of being able to subscribe to a subset of services. And in many ways, that's what director consumer is offering.

And so there is a one diagram though here where media company, you want to cast a Brown enough net where you're providing a valuable proposition for one segment, which is like the content counter war, but at the same time offering the optionality and in some cases with direct consumer and in many cases, there's an overnight between the two. And so when you look at IT as a portfolio, which is really how we manage the business in nbc, it's not direct consumer sits outside of the broadcast in the cable networks. It's actually all one group.

And we manage IT as a portfolio. And and there's examples where that comes to life like the olympics. I think that you we're kind of looking at IT in totality and that it's about giving customers choice and options, and that's how we see ourselves growing. And so if pay T V declines and cord cutting growth, you know, we still want to service the customers who have pay T, V, but at the same time, we recognize that the growth over the next you foresee what future is going to continue to come from directive consumer.

yeah. The last time I was a comic cast customer was fifteen years ago. I lived in chicago and everyone I knew was a comcast customer that was the choice in my building in most neighbor ods, and my friends lived in and and we all also got into t from podcast because of what you're describing in the bundle.

There was not another thing which is the easiest next thing to do when you described direct to consumer. That's another distribution method, right? You're going literally directly to consumer and charging their money and then giving them services directly in new manager. The customer relationship is that the part that's gonna grow is the experience I had when I was a comcast customer. And I would watch N, B, C, five in chicago, but comcast was the relationship with me.

You know, when you kind of study the the P T, V ecosystem and kind of the trajectory of K T, V, I think it's consistently been declining you know, year over year. And you know, I don't think anybody really knows what at what point is a kind of start to flat now. But I do believe that there's always going to be a fairly large group of people who are willing to pay a premium for cable for all the reasons that I said before.

And so I think that still going to be a very, very large part of T V of the T V viewing, T V households viewing. But yes, I mean, direct consumer is where we're really protecting the growth to come from. And and certainly, what's interesting about what you're putting your finger on is I actually think that there's a lot of signs of what i've learned in the cable business that I see happening in the direct consumer business that in some ways, it's going to be, I think, back to the future.

And what I need by that is that, you know, people who maybe did cut the cord, part of the rational, I believe, was because they'd they were going to save money by going and discuss extreamly services and to a circle that was true for some period of time. But I was very predictable that, you know, the cost of content hasn't gone down. The cost of sports rights haven't gone down.

IT was inevitable that Prices of streaming services were going to have to increase, and we've seen that as an industry over the past. Eighteen to twenty four months where streaming services have continued to take a right the rates up in an effort to drive more profitability, although we were not excluded from that and we took a Price increase over the summary. And so I think that, that though, was a very predictable outcome.

The other predictable outcome, for my point of view, is what I said earlier, which is people watch more video than they really know. Like if you look at the nelsen numbers, at the amount of time that people spend watching video has been fairly consistent over the past decade. And so if you cut the cord and you sign up for a streaming service, you're unlikely going to get your video calories as a consumer from one service.

And so what happens if you subscribe to two, three and now the average consumer is to driving to four or five services. And so you take these two things together where i'm subscribing now to fortify services. The rates are continuing to go up.

In some cases, you may be asking yourself like weight, I might be paying more and possibly getting less than what I got when I subscribed the cable. And I think that these are the ingredients in the marketplace that is driving the market to bundle. Ling and I talked about this five years ago that will likely going to see an explosion of streaming and directed consumer, only to then find IT almost reagon gate itself under a new bundle.

And I think there's obvious a lot of evidence over the last two years where that's exactly what's been happening. So again, in many ways, like IT doesn't change the fact that you're going to still have people who described the cable or streaming or both. But I think that direct consumers is going to be a very important component. But I think increasingly, direct consumer and direct consumer is part of a bundle in construct, is got a likely to have many people over time or subscribing to these different services, which again is is ironically back to where everything started with cable television.

Are you seeing the growth in the bungling? And are you able to maintain the customer relationship? Is the bundles grow? I'm thinking specifically of my customer relationship with your competitor, max, which is somehow to this day, still mediated by my A T N T account because i'm A T N T subscriber. And I don't think they remembered that they spun the company out. I said, max, A T N T, and is actually quite confusing, right? Because I can address that account and whatever emotional leave alone, are you seeing that sort of thing play out as you bundle, as you go out to market that someone else is owning the customer for you?

We might be a little bit unique, but because we actually do not have that much bundle ling, the majority of our scriber basis is direct consumer, and we've been very disciplined in how we've tried to grow the subscriber or base. You know, again, if you just go back a couple of years, peacock launched in twenty, twenty. And at the time, the market was really focused on on demand, scripted dramas, binge viewing and most add free.

You know most services were chasing that segment of the market. And you know we came to a market late, uh, for being honest about IT. But one of the benefits of coming to a market late is you could assess the White space and like where you see opportunity.

So we believe the opportunity for us was to position p cock in the premium and supported space and not just kind of focus on premium scripted dramas and movies and on demand, even though that is a piece of the programme strategy. But IT was also about live sports and live news and unscripted programming and multi cultural programming. And again, playing to the strength of of what we do as a company is a broadcast company, which was to targeting broad household demographic.

And the strategy there was that if we anchored ourselves in that place and then we're not directly competing with other streamers were more complimentary. IT was about competence and in somebody has been like the best of cable TV for a relatively affordable Price. And we also believed that the future was not just going to be beyond demand.

Even the on demand is a core piece of the way we consume television. But that linear and live, which a lot of people four years ago we're saying was dead like that was just a nonsense. And so that's why when we launched p cog, we wanted to have you know both Linda networks we've launched with dozens of liniers channels we ve launched with the a library of eighty thousand hours.

We grown the library over eighty thousand hours of programing. And we were also very intentional about being at supported because a dual revenue stream from our point of you was Better than a single revenue stream. And this is also core competency for what we do at MBC with having a very strong at sales team and deep relationships with the advertisers.

And we went to market with five minutes of us per hour, which again was a very controversial thing to do at the time. But that's given us an advantage because, you know, it's also allowed us to focus on how do we innovate on the advertising beyond fifty and thirty second thought because been core toward DNA for the beginning. And the only reason giving you all this context is that when we built the service with that in ten IT really was different in the market.

And so the vast majority of people who signed up for p cock signed up directly with the exception of conchas, we did do a bundle deal with conchas and they currently do wholesale peacock with in a certain of the of their packages like high and gig uh broadband describes. But the algal onely majority of our subbed is direct consumer. Now to answer your question, the like, as the market moves more and more towards bundle ling, I do see that becoming an increasingly larger portion of our subscriber base.

And again, taking the history lesson from what we know about bungle ling, the one thing that argue is always held the bundle together has been sports and sports you coming from that side of the business. If you remember, we launched peacocky was supposed to be around the tokyo olympics. And so live sports was always fundamental to our strategy.

And we've been aggregating life sports and sports rights fairly consistently as we have launched peacock with real purpose intention, knowing that not only is sports going to be a driver of acquisition, which is proven to be true for us, but that sports is going to be an important component that if the market does move to bundling, that not only will we solidify our place in that under, but equally important, if not more important, that you get the right hostile economics around how your position in the net bond. And so we feel like we're in a really good position based on the trajectory that we're on. But if the market does move more towards bundle ling, we also feel like we're well position to be included in, in that kind of packaging. But I don't think it's going to kick away from directly. I just think for us has got continue to argument the describer base that we currently have.

we need to take a short break.

We'll get more into that bundle ling comment when we come back.

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Looking back, i'm talking to nbc universal math stress, who is described live sports as foundational to peak since IT launched in twenty twenty. Can I just uh, unpack the phrase housel economics in a slightly more lucky valley way? What you're describing is you're onna have the sports that every once.

So when the bundles go out to market, you will charge a higher rate or take a higher percentage of the rate people pay inside a bundle, right? This is classically E S P N. In the cable companies, E S P N got the highest rate of any of the cable companies, right? This I well.

i'm i'm describing Price value and and there's a high value on sports, and that's obviously manifesting itself when you just look at sports rights in the Price that sports rights are going for in the market. And so essentially, yes, that you I mean yes to your question, that when that we see ourselves, I mean, if you look at peacock tics, an example, we have more live sports than any of the streaming service.

You when you look at the nfl, the premier big ten, the olympics, obviously the NBA that's coming to peak a later next year. And you know over the course of a year, we have like some live sports three hundred and three hundred and sixty five days. And so we need to get there by accident. You know, we got there through real intention, like we've had a very consistent strategy and vision from the beginning. And I think what you're just seeing is as executing against that strategy, we would say IT truly like, look, this is not a sprint, it's a marathon.

Will you get a sprinter sh pace? You know because the obvious ly the markets moving very quickly, but we're fortunate to be part of a much broader diversified company at conchas with a senior management team that believes in our vision, in our strategy and that allowed us to not do things like case low value subs or do wholesale boundary deals without the right economic relationships. And I think it's positioned us in a really, really good way going forward because we don't feel like we have to a do things artificially, just a kind of grow or sub base like we want to grow sales at the right r po revenue pressly ber at the right level of engagement you and and build a subscribe base in the right way. And that's essentially what we've been doing, and we haven't waiver red from that strategy or that vision from the beginning.

You describe the different segments to the audience, right? There are some people who start traditional N, D, P, D subscriptions, and they are just ever there's other people who are watching tiktok all day. I would segment them differently.

I think you've got older customers and Younger customers, and the Younger customers will almost certainly never sign up for traditional multi channel cable bundle type thing, right? When you think about that split that has a timeline on IT where you're going to lose older customers at summit and hopefully gain yang Younger customers at a faster ate. Are those lines gonna sing up on time? Do you see the growth in the Younger customer offsetting the decline in the older customer? Because what happened lately is right when you rather decline to pay TV tradition and pay TV, it's getting faster is what everybody tells me.

yeah. We'll remember though, the decline P, T, V, isn't this may. So who is not just because older people are passing away?

I mean, some of IT is people at all ages are making decisions where, no, they might feel like it's more valuable, where they wanted just cut the cord, so to speak, and get services. And you could be at any age to to do that. But to answer you more broad bus, yes.

I mean, that is essentially the strategy where which is why p coc exists with an nbc universal is as we see the P, T, V business still being a very good business, it's still a very profitable business for our company. And we built really strong brands in the patent ecosystem. That streaming is a way for us to kind of drive more growth and offset that decline and eventually become the broader growth engine for the company.

But as I mentioned before, um I think sometimes it's it's interpreted that legacy networks are somehow like dinosaurs and that know that's not really where people are spending a lot of time. I see IT very, very differently. I see IT as a strength. You know when you have a broadcast network and you could do something like the olympics and you're averaging over thirty million viewers a day, that actually becomes a huge promotion of vehicle for you to also drive awareness and audience for your streaming service.

When you have networks like bravo with really deep fantoms, and you can tap into that fandom on a streaming service by making some of that content available to court cutter, IT creates a little bit of infinity loop where linear networks and pay T, V can drive audience to streaming and awareness for streaming. And vice versa. Streaming can drive people back to linear. In another example of this would be a show like yours.

Stone, you know, not everybody maybe as aware, but yellowstone, we have the exclusive rights to stream yellowstone on peacock when we licensed yellow stony was not the number one show in television, which is part of the reason why we got the rights to him, because we took a bed that we thought that was a really good show that that show was on paramount network, which is a cable network on various tears of cable. It's not even a basic cable network. What happened there, I think fairly predictably, because IT is an excEllent show, is that people are finding IT on streaming because we were the expensive home for IT.

They were then catching up as the show progressed in its seasons, and then they were tuning back to watch the new season, in some cases, on paramo network. And then that was driving people back to p. Cock, where maybe they wanted to watch IT from the beginning, or they wanted catch up.

And IT became this really interesting infinity loop. And this is the same thing that happened with breaking bad when I was available on MC in another streaming service or or mad men. And so I I look at IT very differently.

I look at IT as this is a strength. And if we can figure out ways to continue programing these different platforms that they can continue to drive the audiences in a way that becomes A A differential and a growth engine for us. And again, IT goes back to why we ve organized ourselves in the way that we have, which is to really think of IT as a portfolio.

Yeah, two things. One, I appreciate that you won't name you're convenience very good. You title in netflix too. I could talk you for the rest of the our time about yellowstone and whether the dutton family is rich or not, which is deeply confusing as that show goes on. I just want to be clear, they have a helicopter but then they like me to say it's .

a very confusing they can pay for .

the gas is so confusing it's cro. Once I was just to call a duty character, I really could just talk else time for the rest of the time. You've talked a lot about being the place where the customer goes every day, opening the APP every day, having the relationship.

A lot of what you're talking about is being the interface for television, but pekoe has to run on devices from apple and roku and google and whoever else on samsung tvs. All of those companies, they want a piece of your ad sales, they want a piece of your substitution revenue. What are those relationships like? Are they in your way? Are they something you're just handling? Are they not in your mind?

Well, no, I I think when you're looking at delivering a streaming service, we obviously need to be available every single platform and device, but the majority of video consumption is still on the television. So these distributor relationships are really important. I think we have really good relationships with all the different partners.

You even saw that in the olympics like roku, for example, built a fantastic interface to promote the olympics. Apple and amazon did a really great job promoting i'm not trying to name drop any specific platform, but I think we've got to the right business relationship with their incentivize to sell peacock to participate in our growth. And we benefit also from the the placement.

What I meant when I said frequency navigation is I think of IT is like how often nearly do you use your phone? And I can tell you the average consumer uses their phone or looks at their phone two to three hundred times a day, and you probably never turn off your phone. It's I know for me, it's the the first thing I look at in the morning.

It's the last thing I look at the night. I even use IT as my a lamm clock. I never turn off my phone.

Think about your TV. Well, you probably turn on your T, V when you want to watch IT. And you maybe do that a couple of times a day. And then what do you do? You turn that off.

And so i'm looking at a different and say, what do you need to do where someone never wants to turn off their TV and they want to open up our APP every single day? That, to me, is the ambition of chAllenging my team to think through. And so that influences decisions were making around that, a very different dynamic around how you programme and ager service, if that's your ambition.

But that's where I think we need to go as a streaming platform. You know, the closest example might be a show like love island, which was a huge hat for us over the summer. That show was on five days a week.

And so that obviously required you, if you are watching a joe, to tune in five days week. And that is part of the hyborian ation frequency that I was referring to. That I don't think is really discuss the law when people are value extreme services.

Let me ask you some of the decoder questions, like because I think we've LED up to them pretty directly. And me see universals, a big company, have got a broadcast division. You've got a sports division. These are old, famous groups inside the company. How is your group organized with nbc universal right now?

We we are all part of, as I mention, the same, the same group inside the of which report into mark lazar and mark lazar overseas, all TV and streaming, as I mentioned, like initially, IT was like p cock was like its own separate entity, end to end, like on programming, on marketing, on support services like H, R. And legal eeta. Everything was kind of insulated.

And we have been mechanically breaking down the silos. And so are we really believe the opportunities to come around like more shared services? And so as I mentioned, like we now have one programme division across the entire portfolio, which reported to dona anley, who also oversees our movie studio.

And so now when we're making programme decisions for broadcast, cable or streaming. You've got one group that's overseeing that strategy and that vision, which again, I think helped us as we make decisions around content that could potentially play across multiple platforms in different windows. You know, we work very, very closely with the marketing department of M P C.

And that you probably notice like abc promote p cock and locks up p cock, whatever the promoting the prime time show. And so we work very closely at the p cock marketing team, works very closely with the MBC marketing team. And we have something which we call symphony y, where we all contribute a certain amount of inventory that we used to cross promote across all of our platforms.

And so if you're going to see a show like fight night, which is A A new show on peacock from the packer, you know you're going to see that promoted on nbc, on our cable networks, on peacock because of how are partners on symphony. And we've done something very similar with like we've consolidated decision sciences and research, which is really the center of gravity around all the analytics and the reporting. And so again, give one team that's looking at holistically across linear and across streaming.

And we've also is back to what I sit earlier about d to c. We have one product team and one technology team that's managing a single platform. And this is kind of a really, really talked about this publicly, but maybe it's just worth just spending one minute on what we're trying to effect ate here is 有 N B C。

We ve built this part of p ock, a fairly large team of people that are building out our streaming platform, both on the product side and on the tech. On the engineering side, our sister company sky, which Operate in the U. K, italy and germany, predominated.

They have a streaming service that you may be familiar with, cot TV. And these are two different groups with fairly large team that we're building, different platforms, in some cases, similar features. And we recognize that there was an opportunity to consolidate all under one team, which we did. And it's called the global streaming platform group, which sits inside of d to C. I know throwing .

a lot of acronyms. This is what .

the code all ready for um and so to G S P is made up now of thousands of people that report into my team that are all across the the world. They are in the U K. They're lisbon there in prog.

They're new york there. Like we've got a we've built one holistic teen, and that platform is what power's peak up. But this but the same platform is what powers a joint venture that we have in eastern and central europe with paramount called sky showtime.

It's the gsp platform that we have built as one company. IT also powers the platform that we launched in over fifty countries in africa through adventure that we have with a distributed of multi choice. That's also the G S P platform.

And next year we are going to actually migrate now T V. Onto this one G S. P platform. And so this is unlock tremendous efficiencies across the company for us is also, I think, has been up a huge motivator for the people that work on this because now they're working on one platform can increase the velocity where now they could build things once and not after, necessarily have teams competing against each other.

And in many ways, this is what position does so well, in my opinion, for things like the exclusive nfl playoff game january and the exclusive nfl game that we had a few weeks ago in brazil with the huggles in the packet ers, is also what position does so well as a platform, in my opinion, for the paris olympic. And it's because we've had this monico focus on how do we get more scale, more efficiency with the real, you know, commitment to like we want streaming to work like TV. And what I need by that is you don't think about IT when you turn on the T V.

Generally, it's a little bit like electricity. You don't think about electricity unless there's a blackout that you think about electricity. But the electricity would powers everything in your house, everything that you're using in your house is likely getting powered by electricity.

And that was, in a way, the ambition that we had with the platform, which is can we make the platform so stable, so scalable? That lady cy buffering, no crashes of too many people are using a out of sink audio with video, all the things that have plagued streaming for years. Let's do everything we can to just get that right.

And if we could do that in a big way, then that gives us permission then to drive innovation. And so we have been the last two years really organizing ourselves in that way, building a platform because why streaming, especially, if you haven't noticed, is very hard. But we've been really committed to that vision.

And I think i'm proud of the team of what we have accomplished because IT allowed us to then do something like the paris olympics, which we feel really good about, because all of the things that we introduced, we've wanted to introduce for years, but we didn't believe we had permission to do that until we got what I just call the basics right. And to be the basics are, if nothing matters from an innovative the standpoint, if the platform doesn't work. And so I feel like we've been very disciplines focused on doing that. We've structure ourselves around that ambition over the last couple of years.

Is that product team report to you.

is that part of your group IT? Ah the how because I team, I don't think we've ever disclosed IT publicly, but it's in the thousands. We've got thousands of people. IT has grown considerably over the last few years.

And again, I think as we built this platform and demonstrated the capabilities is actually allowed me to important with other parts of our company to shift more and more resources towards the global streaming platform team. And so this has really been the tip of the spear and how our continued to build out all of our technology on streaming going forward. And we work very closely, of course, with comcast cable, who has a very large team as well.

But they have been more focused on connected tvs and connected T V devices. And so this like a complimentary nature to how we work together. But our focus has been, as you can, not you mostly on streaming video.

Yeah, one of the things is truly interesting about what you're describing is you have a core platform and the platform is expressed through various products, right? P ock. The now service. What are we do in africa? Do you ever find yourself just looking at the trial board like litigating people's priorities, like the p cock team wants this feature, but the now team wants another feature in the platform, has to make a decision about the hose first because that like every tech company looks like that.

All the answer is, of course, yes. I mean, IT, which is which is a very classic kind of chAllenge that you have when you become a shared service as a platform. And there's ways around that though.

I mean, we do carve out a ceramic capacity to the different services that we're supporting. Like so for example, in some cases of commonality like sky, showtime has advertising. Well, they actually benefit because we had already launched advertising on p cock. And so when they want to launch advertising in poland, that's a relatively easy infrastructure turn on because it's already been built.

But you know they like in africa, just as an example, you know the viewing behavior, you are much more oriented towards mobile viewing because they don't have the brand, the broadband proliferation that we have in, in countries like the united states. And so the majority of streaming happens on mobile devices just because of the band with constrains. And there's also different payment structures because most people don't always have the ability like pay by the month, so they need to maybe paid by the day or they in some cases, go and they have to go to retail environments where they buy voulu ers to pay.

So we have to build capabilities that are more unique to that market. And so you have to be able to arbitrage certain capacity depending on the priorities. But there's a benefit, which is when you build these capabilities, we're building at once.

And so now we have that capability. And so if we ever wanted to introduce that functionality in other markets, it's not like we're building at one time, is throw a work we can actually leverage IT and IT benefits other parts of the platform. And so IT, IT is a kind of a balancing act. But I feel like generally, peacock is the certainly the center of where we're focusing the vast majority of our resources given the priority in the importance of IT. And I would say the majority of how we're using the platform and other countries is drafting behind peacock in the p kok road map, with the exception of some of the things I just mention that are more unique to those markets.

A lot of company is a build big, expensive core infrastructure oker describing once you've built IT, they want to sell IT, right? They want to go monitor ze IT White label, give each other people gets a more value out of the investment. Do you have enough scale with your own products in your own partnerships to support the ongoing investment here? Or would you go White labelled to one .

of your partners? No, we have no ambition of White labelling IT. We're being very surgical, I would say, methodical and how we're thinking of this.

And so the examples that i've given know we have partner ships, the sky showtime ventures at fifty fifty venture, the venture in africa that I mentioned. We have an equity stake in that adventure. Obviously, we own sky as a as a broader conchas company.

And so so where I think that our ambition is not to build a White label platform. The benefit of what i'm describing is that as we've been created, these partnerships, which is allowed me to get more scale IT, also subsidizes the for p cock. And so by me, strategically licensing our platform in the ways that i've described, like it's bringing and actually another revenue stream to me that i'm then able to use to add more resources to accelerate the development. And again, all these pieces is what's positioning us in a way to allow us to do some of the big things that we've been able to do over the last couple of years around especially around life programing.

You've described the core platform as a shared service a few times. You have described how p. Cock went from being inside of an incubator and the universal not being part of the brother portfolio.

Do you think of what you're doing is the sort tip of the spear to get new customers, Younger customers? Do you think eventually you'll become the center of gravity instead of a shared service? Or is IT always just going to be part of portfolio?

I mentioned earlier that you know when I came to nbc from from. Know, Steve berg called me and and i've known in Steve for a long time, he actually hired me a conchas when he was the president of comcast. And he was kind of full circle when he asked me.

Then come to N, B, C. When he became the C E O, when he was the CEO M C. But he said something to me on the phone which resonated, which is he said, you know, peacock are future and I interpreted that not just that is the future revenue growth or growth for subscribers.

I pret as it's like this is like how we could build a new culture. That's what excited me. And so we are part of what i'm really proud about that we've done inside of N B, C.

Since i've been there is is not only establish p cock is the fastest growing streamer and you know our last earnings, I think you know with thirty three millions subscribers and you'll continue in to show bottle line growth, i'm also proud of the culture that we've built inside of N, B, C, which to me is equally important, you know. And I truly spent of a vast majority of my time really on how we build that culture in a way that I believe as good as for success. And you it's around collaboration, around communication, transparency.

Remember, peop was born in cove IT. We literally were I was literally in my house building a new service that I had to ordinate with hundreds of other people that were not in the same room with me. And that forced a lot of communication, a lot of transparency, a lot of trust, a lot of people feeling ownership.

And I ve been doing everything I can, with the help of others to Foster that, that sense of culture that started to spread into other parts of the company. And so I think from that respect, yes, I do think that peacock is in many ways trying to change the company from, in some ways from the inside out by also being respectful of the expertise of other parts of the company inside nbc. But I do think over time, our future is very much anchored on streaming and p ock.

And that is but but the difference is everyone inside the company owns a piece of that. It's not one group anymore. It's now news, sports, entertainment.

Every single part of our company has their DNA in some way connected back to pick. And I think that is our superpower is how do we harness that power inside the company? Uh, so everybody feels ownership of IT. And I think that's being part of the biggest transformation i've seen over the past four years since i've been to the company. We need to take another .

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really matters.

Walk back and talking N B senior russels match stress. By the way, peacock really fits into the global conchas organization. This leads right into the other decoder question.

You're obviously a change agent inside of N B, C, right? You're going around to the this group is getting them to participate when you are on the cable side. And assuming you had A A different attitude towards making change, how do you make decisions now? What's your framework and how is changed?

Well, just to take us, I actually didn't have a different perspective when I was a cable only because over ten years ago, you know, I was part of a group that was nested inside of the cast cable, which was called a conchas in interactive media and we were there to disrupt the cable business yeah um and that's exactly what we did.

And so being a change in IT is actually something I enjoy but I put but being a change IT in the right way, I think, is also important, which is through collaboration, you are through chAllenging people, but doing and I think and I was back for away in more of like an intellectual way and getting people to buy IT. I really enjoy that aspect of the roles that I played a conchas and the role that I played IT MBC. But you know it's very a much of the answer your question directly, but I think it's our goal with nb bc as we want to get pick up to scale. You know we have described targets that we want to get to we certainly want to get to profitability.

and we've got to profit now.

We are not profitable now, but it's invested. The way I look at IT and this is kind of something that's so interesting because and I just ignore IT, to be honest with you, but know it's you'll see press articles where it's like picot is losing money. I mean, we are start up business.

I've never see the start. I bet um you did have the zone, big buddy immediately. I think that you've gotta have a much Better longer term view here where I say we know we are investing in a business.

And so what you're looking for when you're investing in a new business is, are you growing? Are you hitting your KPI in the metrics? Are you achieving the long range plan objectives? And the answer to those are, yes, we are we're rush exceeding those objectives, which only gives us confidence that we're on the right path. And so we have a long range plan and we're executing against IT. And so getting peak up to scale, getting peak up to profitability, but again, doing in a way inside the broader portfolio is really where where we're focusing a lot of our resources in our our efforts, and we feel really good that we're on the right path.

How do you make decisions inside of that homework.

you know, in order to achieve what I just said, if you are a subscription business, you need to say, okay, what's going to drive acquisition, which is an important ingredient to a subscription service? What's going to drive for attention and act in an engagement? What is going to dry frequency, you know, which is something that's not really talk a lot about with streaming services, but it's something that i'm very focused on, which is, you know how do you actually change the paradigm where um you want people to go into your APP every single day and again, that's not the way people typically think extremely because if it's all on demand or it's all binge viewing, you're essentially telling the consumer is there whenever you want IT, there's no urgency to IT and we want to actually get people to open up our up every single day because that just gives you more at bats, so to speak, to try to drive them into other parts of the service which stand drives more engagement, more monetization, Better retention.

And so when you look at a few, that lands IT drives a lot of our decisions making. So our programme decisions around is you know what's the it's like a mutual find. You need a baLance.

IT can be one extreme or the other. If you're too focus on acquisition, then it's a leaky bucket. You'll get a lot of people to sign up for your service, but then you'll just lose them because you don't have enough content to engage and retain them and advise versa.

If you you got a lot of content that drives engagement, that's not going to get you to scale because you need. And so we are managing and was like, I think of as A A mutual fun. And so we have a budget, we have a programme budget with a marketing budget.

Now we have A P L inside of universal that's dedicated to p cock, even though we are part of the product portfolio. And so we're making decisions around what do we need to do in order to achieve those goals. But I feel like we got rocket fuel because I have the added benefit of tapping into this product portfolio that could materially add more marketing value. Or remember, were the home for all the universal movies. And so when twisters or wicked, you know, goes in the theater, you know, we're the next stop, you know, after the transactional premium, transactional window were the exclusive home for all the next day, N, B, C, programming were the exclusive home for the bravo program.

Can I ask you about that work? Because i've been curious with this, that strategy has been tried by some of their larger competitors. Disney notably tried this. Uh, max has tried this in different ways. And one of the issues there is your studio IT doesn't get to go to market and say, how much do you want to pay for twisters in in the first window after the pay window and get bids for netflix and max in p OK. Do you have to bit do you win is how how are their economic account work?

Well, you ve probably heard this and this is something it's funny because a lot of people don't believe this, but some of the most contagious negotiations happen impartially course, you know, s and sometimes it's countered with tive to people. But the short answer is yes. I think we profit title pants.

We have to keep negotiations at arms length, and in many cases, our content is in the Price of our content is being set by the market. You know, we know exclusively license every single piece of content. P cock, I mentioned our movies.

You know, our movies. We are the first window. But then you there's a pay one a and there's a pay one b.

And so there are other third parties that you know our our teams license their content to. And so IT establishes market dynamics that we then need to negotiate. And so we are paying our fair share when IT comes to programing. And even in the case of the N B C next day programing, you know that content was available before on another streaming service. And so there was a set value that was already describe to IT that we essentially had to step into if we then want to migrate that content on the peak c, which we did.

And so Milly point was as a company, we made the decision that we wanted pick up to be the home for our content, which meant that we were going to also have to put our money where our mouth is, how to speak and make the investment to allow us to claud back that programme. And we've been doing that. But by doing that, IT also continues to tether us directly into other parts of the company in a very positive way because, again, we're we're all working together to continue to achieve these collective goals around p cock.

I do like the week treating networks like four to more, and we want to say its name. It's very good.

I have tremendous respect for that. I really I tremendous respect for for them. And I really I don't think a whole lot about other student services. And so this is not i'm not trying to be derogatory in anyway, I you are not our first .

executive who will not name competence. We just like great going to show and affects the public company. We can look at the economics they are doing well.

We can see also inside of the business, they're investing in essentially cheaper programing, right? Lots of live comedy special, lots of reality shows. They're not doing the big premium dramas the way they used to be doing. You've got the big catalog from nbc do does that give you the ability to say, okay, we're going to make the money again, like friends is long paid for that is pure margin for p cock. We're gonna invest in paying more for universal catalogue e because I don't keep .

people here will listen. I kind of what I said earlier, like we we're playing to our strength and one of our strength and to be us. I did not appreciate this when I first came to nbc. Just how much people love the MBC content, like not just talking about the current programming i'm talking about you know the the deep catalog gue of content that nbc has. And there's a very, very large and we have an eighty thousand hours of programing on peacock on demand that has been a huge advantage.

Know to have a show like the office parks and rec berk in nine nine, you to be able to have the dick wolf kalo gue e of long waters in chicago s to have every season of S N L on the in. These are things that again, play to our strengths that we knew drives a lot of engagement. And and so that's been a benefit.

But just back to your other common when I said about consistency of vision, we never subscribe to the fact that streaming has to be just script to dramas like that is a big piece of IT for sure. Script to dramas due drive, acquisition and help with brand development. And you can almost probably think of a show that you could describe to a streaming service as an kind of like IT put IT on the map, so to speak, as an inflection point.

So so that was always part of the calculus for us as well. But we always knew and believed that streaming could be so much more and so unscripted, live sports, live news that's been part of pick up from day one. And so arguably, like it's the hunter becoming the hunted where you're seeing other driving services, I would argue, or moving more into our space, that we're moving into their space, including the fact that we've been very committed from the beginning to an ad model, which know we believe was the big opportunity for us because we knew that eyeballs were going to continue to shift more to streaming for all the reasons that you said earlier.

And we also knew that the majority of streaming happens on the T, V, even though most people thought that happened on the phone. But the T, V is like the new T, V. And you you're now seeing every streaming service, for the most part, launching an at here.

And so the the market is evolving, but it's evolving, I think, in a very predictable way. But but we really have been very consistent with our vision and strategy. I think that's actually given us an advantage. Because it's allowed to several years to invest in life programing and invest in advertising, this part of our platform, DNA, which just puts us in a very different place in our trajectories compared possibly some other services.

Yeah, let's check about sports and the olympics in the nfa little bit. Just to wrap up, the olympic were a big hit on peacock a the APP was ready. The features were incredible.

I'm curious, there was a lot of stuff going on. A P cock. You had the gold zone.

You had live highlight. There's an AI l Michael situation and replace as multiple channels. How did you integrate the product and programing teams there? Was that, uh, single team. Did the olympics team from nbc command say we're going to do the gold zone get already?

How do that work well with me from a product and technology perspective, it's this G S P team, this platform, that imagine so the same thing. And since we're all part of the same group, we locally sit right next to the abc sports team and next to the NPC entertained the team. And so we work hand in glove with these different teams.

And when we brainstorm ideas and we identify where we want to go and where we see the opportunity. And I think that we kind of recognize with paris early on, like the stakes were high, we're coming out of covered for the last two olympics where there was questions about the cultural relevance y of the olympics going forward. I think if i'm being very candid, I don't believe p cock really fulfill the promise of the olympics.

First streamers and for cord cutter with beijing and with tokyo for a variety of reasons. But I think that there was real questions about whether or not we could really deliver of the experience that we knew we needed to deliver. And so the stakes were high and we take IT so serious like it's a privilege to work on the olympic ics.

That's really how a lot of us feel. And and it's a tremendous responsibility. And so we really set out to, to do something that we this was the moment where I mentioned, like we thought we were ready to surprise of delay and introduce features that we believe potentially could change the way people in experience sports.

What I don't think people appreciate, and this, again, is just the benefit of being a part of a bigger company, is that this parisse has been ten years in the making, you know you? So for example, when you went on to peacock and you watched a replay like either you missed an event, you want to watch the moon bias, making the content available on demand for replace. I was first done in london twenty twelve at conchas.

That was the first time we made all the olympic available on demand. When you saw the gold zone with Scott hansei, which was fantastic, and the abc sports team did an amazing job producing that. We actually tested that. If you look in sochi and twenty 4， we've tested the gold zone.

That idea, when people are watching soup, who became the ambassage of the olympics, which is like a surreal think, because he became so late, able to, so many people, we test in snoop in tokyo in twenty twenty, where we give him a show on olympics, show on pick up, because he was too controversial to put him on MBC at the time. And so this has been an evolution that has gotten to this place. But this is an example where every part of the company was firing on all cylinders.

IT also speaks. So what I said earlier, where no p. Cock was the number one APP. We had more digital consumption on p cock for paris than every other olympics combined. And at the same time though, there was always a question, what is that could account ized the prime time show for nbc? And that didn't happen.

The abc prime time show had a record number of viewing because people were watching a peacock during the day, but then they wanted to see the story calling that NPC does a welder's part time and that that infinity loop that I was referring to. And so IT really is an example of, like, I think, what plays to our strands, what we do well as a company. We were preparing for years for that moment. We were really proud of what we were able to deliver.

And I I think in many of respect, there's no going back because when you could deliver that kind of experience and you get that response, we're now looking at and say, well, how do we then apply that to the NBA? How do we apply that to the premiere c, how do we apply that to other types of experiences? And this is the next frontier for streaming, from my point of view, because right now, streaming is arguably a two dimensional service, which is I sign up for your service based on your content in your Price.

I think the next iteration will be product. How do you start to use the product in a way that differentiate the experience from one streaming service to another? We're arguably now there's more similar than differences.

The olympics is an example of what I mean when I say product can become part of the value proposition of where we want to go over time. If I were to project out in the future, I actually think the next version of where I then want to go with p cock and with streaming is to expand the appeal even beyond video. And IT goes back to what I said, about time.

How do you get more share of time? And if five hours is the ceiling for video, how do we start tapping into other ways that we could drive engagement on our platform and add more value? Because you know that it's not a streaming platform, it's an entertainment platform.

That's the way we're trying to think of IT. And we've got lots of other parts of the company that could be leaning into how do we get more share of time, but also how do we start to get more share of wallet. And like you can imagine one day, milli, that you subscribe to peop, and now you get this great video service.

But maybe if your pecos s riber, you get a free movie ticket defend angle. Maybe if you're picot the riber, you get early mission to universal the parks. Maybe, you know, given our advertising of relationships, maybe you get discounts to mcDonald need. So we are thinking very differently. I believe in how we want to evolve the value proposition beyond just what IT is today, anticipating kind of where we think we need to go as a platform.

You have a big gan, foxy subscribers for the olympics. How many of you retained? We thought with this lot of you held onto a lot of the subscribers.

We haven't disclosed the number. But I guess one way to think of IT is ninety percent of people who engage with sports on picot watch other content. And so again, you we we look at sports, there's no Better there's no bigger fandom than sports.

And so sports, as I mentioned earlier, a very effective tactic to drive acquisition. We've shown that with the nfl exclusive games and n fell just regularly and games. We've shown that certain ly. We've seen that with the olympics, but we also have such a great portfolio of other programing.

And so and the way that that's manifesting itself just to kind of build on this for a second, is that when you look at something like the the playoff game that we did earlier in the year, we had the t that was the most viewership engagement we've ever had on p OK. But the next day after the playoff game was the biggest on demand, you said they ever had p cock. And one of our original ted, the sec fan show, was the number one of original we ever had on p cock.

And then the traders, which just actually want the M V for best on script to competition show was the number one unscripted show on picot. And so we have the ability to bend the when we could take somebody who comes in for sports, but you utilized the product in way to interact, gage them with other content platform. Again, that's the benefit of having such a large catalogue e programing for each individual in the home sports that .

are getting more, more expensive over time, producing the olympics, obviously not cheap. Nbc can do all this because you can monitor ze that in several different ways. right? You have broadcaster is liquid cable, which is still lucrative in IP cock. Will peak ck ever get to a place where can support one of these large sports right deals all by itself?

If you look at like something like our ww deo, which is sports entertainment, all of those events used to be paper view events and those are now exclusive available on peacock. And that was a deal that we entered into that even though we have a relationship with the W W. E for USA, that was a decision that we made that was very specific p but I would I actually think a bit, little bit differently.

We're not really focused on like sports that are unique to just peacock. I think one of the benefits of being part of this bigger portfolio is we have the ability to make content by the sports available on different platforms. And when you look at something like the MBA, which we are very excited about and obviously is a very big deal for us as a company, these rights only come up every decade.

And so it's nice to have these rights back where they belong on nbc and on p cock. I think part of the reason that we were able to during into that relationship is because we're more than just streaming and that we have, you know such a broad reach with broadcasting, with cable into that. I see that as a strength. And to me, that something that I would want to continue reading into as we evaluate sports right deal, right deals going forward. My belief is most leagues see at the same way that they don't necessarily wanted to be limited to distress ing because you still have such a large audience that's available on these other platforms.

including pay television. Alright, you've walked into my trap by talking about the product and talking about sports. What do I have to do to get a true 4KN fl game on p cock？ How much I will pay you directly?

Well, I, I, I don't know how how to quit .

heart. You you want.

I do want to. And so, yes, you know, we have the same ambition that you do like. We want to offer every event in the high C I talked .

to and I neil youtube like what's keeping you. He's like millions of partnerships in broadcast or nbc owns the whole chain. You've got the broadcast booth.

You've got the production. You've got the right directly. You ve got the platform. What's stopping you?

We want to make sure that when we're delivering content, especially contact that simulcast across the different properties that our ambition is we wanted delivered in the highest quality university. And so we're going to deliver with the content. And for.

On peacock, I think it's also important that we're able to delivered in for to our broadcast at stations and to our cable and satellite distributors. And so IT adds a little bit of complexity in having that focus. And so the relationships and how we approach the market is meaningful to us, and we want to make sure that we're doing IT in a very comprehensive way for all of our partners.

Not just not just one, but but I am your partner and I want you to know that .

I I want well, this if I share your I share your ambition in your new gas m, we will get there. I think we've shown that we're continuing to of all of the product in the platform. Hopefully, you're seeing that is as a consumer and I get the olympics.

Do you see demand for higher video quality? This is the thing I worry about is that people pick convenience of equality all the time. And the demand for four k or hybrid rate IT doesn't there will listen.

I think i'm going to put back on my conchas head. You know, we've been delivering four and most people don't even know if they have a 4k television or they think they're watching in 4k and there you know there watching like p and so I don't think the average consumer generally really does understand because this is confusing like what is for kate？ What's ultra H D? What's H D R? There's a lot of marketing retorted.

And so I don't know if it's being really driven by the consumer as much as maybe a sub segment of the consumer that really is more a cute to like this guy. Did you notice the differences? I but I will tell you, our ambition is to offer the best and highest quality video and audio.

So because to me, that's an important quality of the platform. And so technically, that is what we're building towards whether the consumers is actually really asking for d or not. We want to offer them the best and highest quality. And so that is really where or that is the ambition of where we're going with pico, and I think we will absolutely get there.

This has been great. You got ta come back when you have four k football because that's that's the only thing I wanted. This is all conversation. Wait the end. I want to.

Well, IT was a real pleasure. IT was real pleasure talking you. Thank you for having me on the show. I appreciate IT.

I like to think matters for taking time to join the coder. And thank you for listening. I hope you enjoyed you.

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