How to discover your authentic self -- at any age (w/ Bevy Smith)
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You're listening to How to Be a Better Human. I am your host, Chris Duffy. When I was a little kid, I was positive that I was going to grow up to be a marine biologist. I was obsessed. I even had these printed out color maps of the ocean currents that I got from the Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution. And I would study those maps and think, this is going to be so useful when I'm a grownup.

Well, that turned out to not be the case. I have never once in my adult life needed to be able to draw the ocean currents from memory. It's not something that comes up very often. Later on, I thought I was going to be a doctor and then I thought I was going to be a neuroscientist and then I thought I was going to be a journalist. And when I think back on each of those dreams and on my younger self, I love how passionate I would get each time. And I laugh at how very, very, very far I am currently from being a doctor. And that's not in the cards at the moment.

I think sometimes as we get older, we feel like we no longer have permission to dream big or to imagine new, exciting life paths and different versions of ourselves. But that doesn't have to be the case. As today's guest, the incredible Bevy Smith makes very clear in her TED Talk. Here's a clip. I am a late bloomer. In fact, a friend of mine you may have heard of, Chris Rock, he once called me the most late blooming mofo he'd ever met.

Now, some people might consider that snide, but I revel in it. I'm 55, and I'm here in this curvy body as someone who has done the work. Now, coming to this realization wasn't easy. At the age of 38, I was a very successful fashion advertising executive, and I was really living what most people considered a dream life. I was jet-setting the fashion shows. I was receiving free designer clothes. I was double-kissing my way across the globe.

It was everything that I ever wanted it to be, and then one day I realized I was only pretending to be happy. But I couldn't blow up my good life in my prime earning years, right? Wrong. Which leads me to lessons my mother Lolly taught me. Lolly's number one lesson? Don't settle.

Settling is very insidious. It keeps us dancing on this string, waiting for this elusive better day to miraculously appear. That's not my story. In fact, I take each day as it comes, but I try and make it better than the last. Because I don't settle, what that means is that I also don't second-guess my decisions. And I'm also not worried about my future because I'm firmly rooted in the present.

We're going to talk with Bevy all about her present, her past, and her future in just a moment. But first, a quick ad break. Don't go anywhere.

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Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and Affiliates. Comparison rates not available in all states or situations. Prices vary based on how you buy. These days, we're surrounded by photo editing programs. Have you ever wondered what something or someone actually looks like under all the manipulation? I'm Elise Hugh, and you might know me as the host of TED Talks Daily. This October, I am giving a TED Talk in Atlanta about finding true beauty in a sea of artificial images.

I'm so excited to share the stage with all the amazing speakers of the TED Next conference, and I hope you'll come and experience it with me. Visit go.ted.com slash TED Next to get your pass today. Today, we're talking with Bevy Smith about finding yourself and dreaming big, no matter what age you are.

Hi, I'm Bevy Smith, radio and TV host, public speaker, and author. So Bevy, one of the things that I'm so excited to talk to you about is this idea that it gets greater later. When you say that in your TED Talk, what do you mean by that? Well, for me, it gets greater later really stemmed out of the fact that I needed something to hang on to when I was changing my life. As we all know, transformation is never easy.

And I had real obstacles in my way to transforming my life. And I was doing it at what seemed like then a ripe old age of 38, you know. And although that's young, I know it's young, but most times when you're in your late 30s, that's when your career really starts to take off.

Those are your golden years to kind of really establish yourself in whatever it is that you're doing. And that's when you really start making all the money and receiving all the accolades. So right when I am literally in the height of my superpowers as a fashion advertising director, I decide to chuck it all to become a TV personality and to write and to do anything that strikes my fancy.

So when I go broke in the middle of this process, I need something to ground me. And it gets greater later is the mantra that grounds me and allows me to keep going when there are so many obstacles in my way. And when everyone around me is saying, why don't you just go back and get a job?

It's interesting because I think sometimes we think about this idea of reinventing ourselves as something that you need to do when nothing is working, right? Like your life is a disaster. Everything's gone wrong. You've kind of lost it all. Okay, I need to find a way to reinvent myself and dig myself out of this. But for you, it was kind of the opposite. You were at the height of success and then you felt this need to reinvent yourself. And I feel like that's something that doesn't get talked about as much is

The part where you can actually have achieved what people from the outside think of as success, but it doesn't feel meaningful to you inside. Yeah, that's exactly what I was going through. So that's the reason why when I quit Rolling Stone magazine, my publisher asked me to lunch and said, you know, you're having a midlife crisis. But here's the thing. We're sitting in a booth at the 21 Club, which is now no longer there. But it was like the pinnacle of like publishing hub.

He's like, one day you're going to be sitting in a booth with your name on it. We were sitting at a booth and his name was there. Yeah. And I said, wow, I'm so happy you believe in me. But here's the thing. I don't want my name in a booth at the 21 Club. Yeah. And he said, well, what do you want to do? And I said, I just want to do, I want to write. I want to act. I want to sing. I want to juggle. I want to be a fire eater. I want to be, you know, a ventriloquist. I want to do whatever it is that strikes my fancy. I just want to do anything.

Anything that has ever kind of crossed my mind, I want to be able to give it a go. And when you are an advertising executive and you are a salesperson and you have a quota of millions of dollars to hit every single year, there's not a lot of room for exploration. So I needed to leave in order to become this person that I am today. Can we talk a little bit more about that idea of exploration? Because I think

Sometimes for me personally, right? Like sometimes one of the hardest things is to not exactly have the word for what it is that you want to be or for what you're becoming, right? It's easy. Like,

I just give my own example, right? Like I was a fifth grade teacher, very easy and explainable, right? Everyone understood. As soon as I say I teach fifth grade, they're like, yep, I had a fifth grade teacher. I understand what that is. And then I became a comedian and people understood what that was. And it was hard to do it, but I accomplished it. But then now as I'm trying to like go into new things, I don't necessarily have a definition or like a word for them. And it's hard to explain it to other people. So how do you think about that exploration without like

without a clear, precise little target. But here's the great thing about the true sense of exploring. A lot of times we don't have a destination. That to me is what excites me about the idea of exploring who you are and also how you want to show up in this world. Because oftentimes we have a very clear-cut idea of what we should be doing and how we should be showing up in the world.

But when you start to excavate and you start to peel back the layers, oftentimes you'll find, oh, so what I was supposed to be doing and what people told me I was good at. And so that's why I should pursue and all of that. They had something. They were onto something. They're right. But that doesn't make me happy. And that's what kept happening to me. And so when I decided that.

When I decided that was going to, you know, kind of uproot my entire existence and also change my life in such a radical fashion, I had to be okay with people not getting it. And I think that that's something that anyone who's in the process of transformation has to really kind of be okay with.

then a lot of people are not going to get it. And that's okay. Because when you succeed at your transformation, then they'll get it. Or sometimes they just won't at all. But who cares as long as you get it, right? Like for me, I didn't set out with a real concrete goal, as you said, Christopher. I didn't really know exactly what I wanted to be. That's the reason why...

I rattled off so many different things to my boss, you know what I mean? Because I didn't know exactly what this life looked like. But I knew how I wanted to feel. And I think that's something that if you can grasp on to how it is that you want to feel, oh, then you're on to something. Then you're on this incredible path. And that path will surely lead you to where you need to be. How did you want to feel? What would you have answered? Free. Free.

I wanted to feel unencumbered with a good life. Like you said, most people, they transform their lives because the old life is not working. This life was working just fine. I just was no longer satisfied. But I remember walking around and noticing that there were people that were in like Starbucks at like one o'clock in the afternoon on laptops. Or if I took a day off and I went to the museum, I would see people just milling about.

And I just remember hanging out with some of my writer friends and them saying, oh, let's catch up. And, you know, what about four o'clock tea? And I'd be like, well, I'll be in a meeting at four o'clock. And I was like, oh, there's a whole other way to live. And what's so interesting is when I went to TEDx,

which is held in Vancouver, as you know, Chris, everyone is always outdoors. And for me, that's a big part of my blissful brand, being outdoors. Exploration is big for me. Getting lost in my own city, being a tourist. But when I went to Vancouver and saw people just milling around, right? And being on ferries in the middle of the day and bicycling and just existing, right?

And I remember I went to one of the little islands out and I took a ferry. And the ferry was quite crowded. I said, oh, people must live over here on this little island. It turned out it was one of the greatest vantage points to see the sunset. So people had left work because they had on work clothes. And then they got off the ferry and we all walked in the same direction. And these folks sat on driftwood in their work clothes and loosened up their ties and

And kicked off their shoes and watched the sunset. And I said, well, what the hell am I doing? Well, I'm going to do this every single damn day. Yeah. You know? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so that was really inspiring to me. You are someone who, you talk about finding ways to be happy and blissful. You talk about, you know, treating people a way that you want to be treated, all of that. That's so inspiring.

you have these amazing lessons in your book and in your talk. At least for me, I always wonder, like, is that what the person is like in their real life? And I just want to share an anecdote, which I don't even know if you'll remember, but...

The first time that I ever went to the TED conference was the time when you were given a talk. And afterwards, I just happened to be behind you in line at the airport going home. And someone had somehow they had messed up your flight somehow. There was something wrong with the ticket. And you were on the phone with them and you were so polite and nice and fun. And like, I just remember thinking like, oh, yeah.

This is for sure the real deal. I would be so upset and I would be so cranky. And you were just like, after a whole week of, you know, working in conference, you were hilarious and great and kind. And I was like, oh, this is she lives this life.

Even in the moment when like, of course, it would be understandable to be frustrated and upset. So that really stuck with me. I really remembered that. I'm so glad you remember something like that. I was so horrified as to what you were going to say. You thought I was going to be like, and you said something horrible to the woman. No, you were so nice and so funny and great. I was like, wow, that's how I want to treat people when they make a mistake that affects my day, even if it makes me frustrated. I wish I was like that.

Well, you know what? It's an active practice. I will say that. It's not exactly easy work.

But it's also really not easy to walk around being like bitchy all day long. It's not good for the spirit. Like if you feel like everyone is against you, why is this happening to me? No one wants to help me. If you have that kind of spirit, then guess what? That's what you're going to receive back. So for me, I really do believe that people want to work with me.

So that really helps. But it doesn't always happen. Of course, of course, of course not. We're going to take a quick break and then we will be right back with more from Bevy. Stick around. We'll be right back.

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And we are back. We've been talking with Bevy Smith about continuing to grow and evolve at whatever age you may be. But sometimes, even when you think you've made a lot of progress, you still can find yourself dealing with something like jealousy. Here's a great clip from Bevy's TED Talk where she talks about her own jealousy. Intellectually, I had grown and evolved. But emotionally, I was Tom Petty and I was living in Petticoat Junction.

I told y'all that brown doesn't look good on me. Petty looks even worse. It's not my shade. And so what I wound up having to do was really get a grip. In that talk, Bevy, you tell the audience that you have a practice that you do when you're feeling jealous, one that helps you to get a grip. It's called take a note, give a note. Can you tell us what that means and how you do it?

So basically, it's when you're on social media or sometimes doesn't have to be social media. It's anything in life where you're seeing people get things that you think you should have. So that could be the job. That could be a relationship. That could be a pair of shoes. It could be anything. But you're like looking at them having this thing that you covet and you're like, well, why didn't I get it? And you have this kind of angst.

And you have this kind of green-eyed monster who wants to show up and take over the scene. And so for me, what I realized is that everything that is for me is truly for me. You know, no man, no person, no...

mandate, no anything can stop me from having what is truly mine. So if I know that to be so, and I really want to live that versus just say that, then every time I see someone having something that I think I want, or I think I deserve, I look at it with a logical eye. And I think about, wow, well, I didn't get called for that gig. I wonder why.

And then I go through the reasons why maybe I wasn't right for the gig. And sometimes, you know, I come to find out later on that I was spot on.

Sometimes. I never find out, but that's okay. Because what I've done is I've taken it all in. I've calmed my nerves. I've let the jealousy go. I've let the anger go. I've let the angst go. And then I'm ready to move into giving the note. And this is the best part of it. So when you see that person having that thing, if you know them, you pick up the phone and you call them and you say, congratulations. I am so happy for you.

If you don't know them, then you put a little note on social media. Congratulations, that's awesome. High five, whatever it is. And what you've done then is just let go. You've let go and you've told the universe that you trust them.

That is what is for you is truly for you. So you don't have to feel upset or jealous that someone else has something that you believe that you have. You know that that's not for you because if it was for you, then you would have it. One of the reasons I love this is it's one, it's just such a practical thing that like you can do, right? I heard you say that and then I started thinking about it and doing it. And the other thing is, I think it really hits on such a universal truth that we really forget when we get...

into this competitive idea, which is that it's so rare for things to be zero sum. It's so rare that if you get something, it means that I lose something. I'll give you the perfect example because that's divine. I was on social media and I saw someone that I know. It was in the New York Times. It was announced that she's getting a show. And the TV show is exactly a show that I've been wanting to do literally for more than 10 years. Mm-hmm.

You know, I dropped her a note so quick and said, congratulations. As you know, I've been doing X, Y, and Z for many years. And seeing you get this show means that when your show is a success, Hollywood will want another version of that. And that's when I will be right there waiting in the wings to get my chance at doing a phenomenal show. So I thank you for, you know, leading the charge and for paving the path.

And it's true. That's 100% true. And then I didn't have to worry about it. And then I didn't have to have a snarly look on my face every time she got a piece of press. Instead, I was applauding her. For someone who, from the outside, it seems like you have such a clear sense of self and such a clear voice.

Has it ever been a struggle to kind of figure out what that voice is or who you are? Of course. And that's a big part of what the TED Talk is about, right? Being authentic, right? Because I had all these amazing personas that I had created over the years from the time I was 14 years old to the time I was 38. I had cycled through various personas that literally had helped me

In my life. They were my protectors. They were my cheers. They were my source of strength for many years.

And then at the age of 38, when I decided I had to change my life, I realized that the answer was not going to be found in these personas. I had to excavate. I had to dig up. I had to find out who I truly was at my core. And that was the journey. So I've had 19 years of this authentic little brown bevy gal who shows up with this joy and with this optimistic attitude and just with this

Yeah, I believe it can happen kind of space, which for many years I felt that that was a space that would lead me to be taken advantage of, that I would not be taken seriously. It just didn't feel like Lil Brown Bevy was a strong enough person to take on the world. And what I found out is that she's the strongest of them all, Lil Brown Bevy.

The child in us is far more resilient than these little personas that we create as we become adults. I love that. We don't want to be judged, right? And we fear what people are going to say about us. We fear what people are going to say to us. Can we get a list of all of the people who you've been? Like, I'm curious when you think back on it. I'd love to hear. Yeah, so the first person I channeled and who I kind of...

became was MC Bevsky. So she had been bullied from 11 to 13. You know, Beverly Smith had been bullied, who was a really sweet girl, little brown bevy, just the best gal ever. And she was bullied. And in New York City, you can select which high school you want to go to. So my tormentors decided that we were all going to go to this one particular high school. You had to apply.

Well, what they didn't know is that I refused to apply to that school. And instead, I applied to a different school. They were like, oh, my gosh, you're going to be all by yourself. You're stupid. Oh, it's going to be horrible for you. And I was like, yeah, it's going to be pretty bad not being with you guys for the next four years. And so when I went to that high school, it was a chance to become someone new, someone new.

who had never been bullied, someone who was cool, someone who had this like spirit and was outgoing, right? I didn't have to be shy anymore. And so that was MC Bevsky. And I'm MC Bevsky because, you know, hip hop is 50 years old. So at this point, it's the 80s, mid 80s, and hip hop is booming. And everyone is an MC. Right.

So I was MC Bev Ski and my specialty was freestyling in the bathroom. That was the first time I took control of my life where I decided that I wasn't just going to go along to get along. So she goes away and then I'm in my early 20s and hip hop is the golden age of hip hop. And I'm like a really popular girl.

And I'm a big bet from uptown. And I'm hanging out with Tupac and Biggie and Puff Daddy and everybody. So this gal is super popular. She takes no mess from anybody. She had the most fun. She was vivacious. She was a sparkly girl. She came into a room and she commanded attention. That's big bet from uptown. And she served me very well.

And then I became Beverly Smith Fashionista. The Devil Wears Prada, that film, had nothing on Beverly Smith Fashionista. So for listeners who are hearing you talk and they may consider themselves late bloomers or maybe they just want to figure out how to reinvent their lives.

What would you say they should do to begin the work of becoming their most authentic selves? Well, for me, I had to really kind of strip down and I asked myself three questions. And it's in the book. Who am I at my core? So I had to figure out, OK, now, without all the fanfare and the, you know, ruffles and the glitter and everything, who am I really? What are the things that truly make me happy?

What happens when you're by yourself and there's no one else around and there's no cameras, there's no audience? Who are you really? After doing a lot of intense work on myself, including therapy, I found out that who I was was Little Brown Bevy. I was this curious, adventurous person.

empathetic, you know, really sensitive gal. And I had pushed her away. And it was time for her to take center stage. So I found out who I was at my core. That was the first thing I did. And then I had to realize, how am I being perceived? So yeah, I was very well respected and people wanted to be in my presence because I was an expert in my space and all of that. But I was also being perceived as a bitch, which is what I talk about in the TED Talk.

bitchy bevy, you know, not very kind. And I was not that concerned about others. And I had to acknowledge that that wasn't a secret. People realize that. So I was being perceived as a very selfish person and self-centered person. And then the third question had to be, how would you like to be perceived?

And I had to say, I wanted to get out there and show people Little Brown Bevy. I wanted those traits that make her so divine. I wanted those to lead the way. I wanted those traits to show up when I showed up in the room. Being fabulous is far less of value to me than being kind and generous and empathetic. What do you do when...

People are just putting an expectation on you, whether that's because of how they see you or because of racism or sexism or, you know, sometimes people just...

They put you in a box that is not what you are putting out there. So how do you respond when that happens? How do you make it so that you perceived accurately and not based on their own preconceptions and prejudices? Well, no one puts little brown bevy in a corner. That's the first thing. Good, good, good. But, you know, we can't control what everyone thinks about us. We just can't. So much of what you've done is about...

Taking aside the things that people want to put on or the ways that we're supposed to act and thinking about what actually matters. And one of the other things that you've done is you started the Blissful brand, right? Which is all about figuring out pursuits and passions in someone's life that aren't connected to money and career, which is really countercultural, right? Like that is not celebrated in our culture right now. Can we talk about that a little bit?

Yeah, well, my Blissful Brand, I feel like, you know, it's a three-part process for me, this freedom lifestyle that I'm currently living, which is really lovely because I have a 95-year-old mother who I take care of. And if I didn't have a life filled with a lot of freedom, if I didn't have a Blissful Brand lifestyle,

Me getting up every morning and making her a smoothie and then making her a full breakfast and then just sitting with her and, you know, watching the Sherri Shepherd show together and the Tamron Holt. Like that doesn't exist, right? If I don't have a certain sense of freedom. Because then I'm worrying about the hustle and the grind. So no. So my Blissful brand is...

really came to me because I realized that I'd gone through a couple of stages. And then I started tapping into the fact that, wow, you're in your 50s and you feel better than ever. And I started to really understand that it does get greater later. And I started to really embrace that idea wholeheartedly.

and to go forth and encourage other people to tap into that. Because there's nothing to be afraid of about aging other than, you know, there are some practical things, you know, like my mom had two strokes and so now I'm taking care of her. So yes, you do want to think about those kinds of things. But my dad used to always say, you can only get out what you put in. And so when I take that, a dose of that,

medicine, along with a dose of it gets greater later, that steadies me. I know what I put out. I know what I give out, which is love and support, kindness. And so I believe that when it's my turn for to be cared for and all of that, someone will show up for me.

And so because I don't have anxiety over aging, now it's time for me to really kick into overdrive what I want my life to really start looking like now that I'm no longer in the hot pursuit of success and money in the traditional sense of the way. And that's where I tap into my Blissful brand. And my Blissful brand is about romping around.

Skipping. Dancing. Being outside. I am literally... I was in Mexico City...

And I saw a park with some swings. And Chris, you would have thought I was seven years old the way I ran over there with so much glee and got on that damn swing and just was swinging. Are there some things that you are specifically looking forward to right now as you look ahead? People are not going to probably appreciate this, but I enjoy painting. And I'm not good at it, not even a little bit. I like to do multimedia, right? Like,

I like to do a little paint, and then I like to do some glitter on there, and then I like to...

use a magic marker, and then I like to put some clay on top of it. And it's really inspired by my friend Mickalene Thomas, who's a world-class painter. Her paintings go for millions of dollars. But I love the fact that Mickalene will build a set, then take a photograph of people in the set, then put that on top of a canvas, do a collage over that, putting all kinds of other objects on top, and then paint.

And so I do that in my own little way. And that's something that I love doing. And honestly, I do it right now on a very small scale. But the goal is to use canvas next time. And again, it's not art that will be particularly very good with the quote fingers or not art that I can sell, but just...

The freedom that I feel when I'm like painting and sketching and just getting my fingers dirty with clay, it's very liberating. It's very freeing and the world kind of drifts away. I love that so much. Why did you think people weren't going to like that answer? You know, I think a lot of times...

Folks will be like, yeah, sure, right. But what about money? Or, you know, what about real stuff? You know what I mean? Like, I've got real problems. And I think we all have things, challenges in life, right? But that can't be the sum total of what our life is, focusing on our challenges. So that's the reason why Blissful Brand is so important to me.

Because it's important to really tap into the things that make you happy, that spark joy in your life.

And hold on to those. The stuff that you're talking about, like with painting and not worrying about whether you're good at it or whether it's sold, the things about like wandering the streets and not worrying about where you're getting to, those are trying to accomplish something different, right? Like your life needs meaning too. It's not just about meaning and excitement and joy. Those are just as important in having a life that's actually worth living rather than just functionally able to be lived. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

Like who wants to just, well, you know, it's so trite, but it's so true. No one's ever on their deathbed saying, I wish I had worked more. Well, Bevy, it has been an honor and a privilege to talk to you. So thank you so much for making the time and for all of the insights and anecdotes and ideas that you've shared. I really, it has been an absolute pleasure. Well, thank you, Chris. I've had a great time with you as well. Thank you.

That is it for today's episode of How to Be a Better Human. Thank you so much to today's guest, Bevy Smith. You can find more from her at bevysmith.com. I am your host, Chris Duffy, and you can find more from me, including my weekly newsletter and upcoming live shows at chrisduffycomedy.com.

How to Be a Better Human is brought to you on the TED side by the high fashion team of Daniela Balarezo, Chloe Shasha Brooks, and Joseph DeBrine. This episode was fact checked by legendary MCs Julia Dickerson and Mateus Salas. On the PRX side, our show is put together by a team who may get greater later, but they start out pretty great right now.

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