Extended Interview: Jack McCain
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Hi, this is Margaret Brennan, moderator of Face the Nation and chief foreign affairs correspondent at CBS News. I spoke earlier this week with Jack McCain. He is the son of the late Senator John McCain and Cindy McCain. Jack served as a combat veteran in the war in Afghanistan. Here's our conversation.

So we know when you were in Afghanistan, you flew alongside and helped to train some of the Afghan Black Hawk pilots. Why is it important to you now to speak out on their behalf? Are any of your personal contacts there at risk?

Yes. Basically, everyone that we were unable to get out is at risk. These pilots and crew members fought the Taliban toe-to-toe, and because of that, the Taliban is trying to seek them out for reprisal, something that they distinctly promised that they would not do. So not only are they in danger, but we owe them a debt. I believe that I'm vertical and still on this earth because of the efforts of my Afghan pilots and crews,

And not only do I owe them personally, but the nation owes them a debt of honor, one that we have yet to repay. Everyone, interpreters, ground troop pilots that worked and fought alongside the United States at our behest should be able to be evacuated here to the United States and should be taken care of.

So you were active duty at the time of the very chaotic withdrawal from Afghanistan. I know you helped to get Afghans out during that period of time. There were a lot of Afghans airlifted out. Who was left behind and what promises were made? Yeah.

Problem is everyone was left behind, whether it was family members, including family members of U.S. servicemen, whether it was pilots, crews, the people that I worked with, special forces. We did everything we could to get as many as we could out. But due to the chaos of the withdrawal and, frankly, the lack of planning on the part of the United States government, it was up to individuals and sometimes smaller military units to help either. In my case, I had to triage who we were going to take out.

I've had to prioritize operational pilots over pilots in training versus crew members in the back simply because everyone was trying to do everything they could. So we have tens of thousands that fought alongside us left behind, each one of them in danger in their own way, not to mention family members that can be used as tools of leverage against those that are even here in the United States now.

And to that point, under the Taliban right now, women aren't even allowed to speak in public. They can't go to school over the sixth, past the sixth grade. They're not allowed to work. So the daughters, the wives, the female family members of a lot of these people who worked with Americans are facing some pretty serious

tough conditions. However, this administration just recently said through Homeland Security that it is safe for Afghans to return. So those here could be sent back. Some Afghans who had arrived here and been given temporary protection. Does what the U.S. government said match in any way what you are hearing is happening on the ground? I would disagree with the

entire notion that it is safe for anyone, especially if they've been in the United States, to return to rule under the Taliban. Whether they are male, female, young, old, that regime has proven itself to be, to not only have gone back on every promise they made to us, but to be, um,

to have no problem using human lives as pawns to imprison, torture, rape, kill, even sell into slavery. So, no, I disagree that Afghanistan is safe for anybody, much less those that fought on behalf of the United States. My pilots were doing gun runs on Taliban positions as they were moving forward on the base in Kandahar.

I would say that they have a score, the Taliban has a score they'd like to settle. So absolutely not unequivocally, it is not safe to return.

So there are a number of veterans of the war in Afghanistan who serve currently as lawmakers in the United States Congress, and it is Congress that sets the number of visas for these special immigrant visas, SIVs. We checked. There are more than 144,000 applicants in the pipeline, but there are only 11,000 visas left. That's not even counting family members here. Have you gotten any indication from the lawmakers you know that they are going to raise that cap?

No, I have not. And it is an utter travesty that that is the case. People on both sides of the aisle have served in Afghanistan or have fought alongside Afghans, much like me. And the political theater that has taken place of simply ignoring the problem can only be summarized by the word despicable behavior.

This is an issue of humanity. This is an issue of national honor. And this is a debt that we owe. So I would urge lawmakers on both sides of the aisle to solve this problem because it is not going to go away. It is your job to legislate. So please do so. 911 6 emergency. Yes, we're dead. We're dead.

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So that's in the hand of lawmakers. That was a problem even during the last administration. Now, though, we have this extra complication where the Trump administration has put in orders to restrict refugee admissions and said the U.S. should prioritize people who can, quote, fully and appropriately assimilate and who do not pose a threat to the security or welfare of the United States.

That's made it hard for Afghan refugees, family members to enter here. How do you reassure the public that these refugees are not a risk? Even the Vice President of the United States has said he does not trust the vetting of refugees. Well, I mean, I think I passed the ultimate test in that I literally put my lives and my life in these people's hands. So not only are they worthy of trust, but they are worthy of our care.

The vetting process has taken place. It continues to take place. And if vetting is the issue, fantastic. Let's pass legislation to solve that problem. Let's make sure everyone up to this point has been vetted. But if there is something else that would make anyone on any side of the aisle feel safer, then great. There's a solution for this. It's called the legislative process. So I would urge lawmakers to

do the one job that they're paid by the American people to do and to solve the problem that we have created ourselves.

Secretary Rubio testified this week that he will follow the letter of the law as written by Congress. Congress had established a program to help pay for the Afghans to be resettled here. It's the CARE program at the State Department. But now the program is no longer paying the way for these Afghans. How difficult is it for some of the Afghans you know to pay to get their wife, their family members here?

These people were taken from their country with only the clothes on their back in about 99% of cases.

They were dumped off into locations that they were unfamiliar with. And as much as service members and the government did an amazing amount to try to support them, it's still not enough when you imagine the massive change in their lives, not to mention the fact that their entire country and family has now been shattered as a result of American action. It is beyond difficult. I have...

individuals who are combat wounded, who have extreme injuries that make them almost unable to work. And it's not like I can send them to the VA despite the fact that they got shot at on behalf of the American government. So

I would say that life is extremely difficult, but those individuals are of great resolve and they are doing everything they can to overcome and to become great Americans, the great Americans that I know they will be and that anybody that knows them personally knows them to be. She's made up her mind, pretty smart. Learned to budget responsibly right from the start. She spends a little less time.

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There have been a few investigations of the withdrawal from Afghanistan by the Pentagon, by the State Department. They have found fault with the Biden administration. They have found fault with the first Trump administration. This past week, Secretary Hegseth announced he's going to do a new investigation of it all that will be led by his spokesperson. It's unclear why that person in particular. What do you think was missing from those original reviews?

I don't think anything is missing from those original reviews, and I don't think that going back over the process of the withdrawal is going to solve any of the very real problems that exist today. It was political theater the first time, it is political theater the second time, and it is political theater yet again.

This does nothing to solve the problem that we created. This does nothing to make the lives of Afghans better. This does nothing to help stabilize the region. It is simply the Biden administration pointing the finger, the Trump administration, the Trump administration pointing the finger, the Biden administration. It's happening all over again. This is a useless waste of effort, but frankly, it is one that...

I see continuing. Before I let you go, your father famously said it matters less that you can fight, but what you fight for is the real test. I know you feel passionately about this particular issue. Can you ever see yourself entering politics to fight for other issues?

That's a very interesting question, one that I happen to get asked fairly regularly. And I would say, trying to follow his example, that the best life

is one lived adventurously and in service of a cause greater than one's self-interest. I'm doing that, and if someday that does take me to office in service of the nation, then by all means. But to live a life simply focused on the single goal of attaining public office is not, in my mind, a life purposefully lived. In service and office, it is a purposefully lived one, but that should not be the overriding goal of your life. Mm-hmm.

We will continue watching. Jack McCain, thank you for weighing in on this important issue.

Welcome to the team.

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