Deep Dive
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Welcome to the WNBA Nation.
WNBA Nation! It's mid-January, so it feels weird saying Happy New Year, but also we haven't done an episode in a while. So, I guess Happy New Year. We have a lot to talk about, and not exactly an insanely long time to do such, but the show's back, crew's back. I'm Steve Schwartzman. I'm here with Logan Jones. Logan, how it do? Hey, what's up, Steve?
Just so you know, because I have a late January birthday, I actually celebrate the new year and do resolutions and stuff like three or four weeks into January. So happy New Year's totally. I think the whole month is fine. Just being like, we're doing it. 2024, we're doing it. There it is. Yeah, that's good stuff. It's funny because I was talking to my wife recently about how I don't want to do resolutions at all.
And then we had this discussion of like, what if the resolution was no resolutions? And then because of how resolutions work, you suddenly became really goal oriented and efficient because you were like, my resolution is no, like not nothing. And then all of a sudden it's like, wow, I'm exercising a lot more just like naturally. Yeah.
For the record, by resolutions, I mean like I keep a notes app on my phone of just like things I want to remember throughout the year. It's not necessarily like run a marathon, do this and that. It's usually just like, hey, remember this year?
Like for the last year, you've wanted to do this and you didn't get around to it this year. Right. Some of your book, play the guitar some more, blah, blah, blah, blah. Like just keep it in mind. That sort of resolution, especially because it's been 2021 for three years now. I think it was 2021 for three years. 2024 actually feels like let's okay. Let's go. Yeah. Shoot. Yeah. Like, here we go. Yeah.
Like you're back at it. We're all, we're all in the headwind. Well, we have a great deal of stuff to talk about. We have some college updates. Obviously we're in the dead heat of the college basketball season. This is always when things pick up.
conference matchups start to seep down and we're getting closer to a tournament. But fun thing, depending on which team you're a fan of, we have some W stuff to talk about or at least speculate about. As we know, Logan,
Free agency is right around the corner. We're not too far away from the free agencies in the last couple of years have been electric in terms of the free agent market. And every year, from my experience, there tends to be that first like domino, like that first thing that's going to fall, that's going to make things happen, or at least like.
a center point move. Like this is the centerpiece move that kind of like sets everything around it. Yeah. You could say Bree Stewart was, was last year. Uh, Candace also in, in a way a couple of years ago, Candace to Chicago is that, uh,
This year might be someone that walking into 2024, a lot of people may not have expected. Maybe some did, but I feel like a lot of people didn't. But reports have been coming through the pipeline. I mainly first heard them out of JWS, just women's sports. I'm not sure if they're the initial source or if they picked someone else, but that's where I heard it first. That Elena Deladon, at least as of a few days ago, said,
There was expectation as an unrestricted free agent that she may be leaving the Washington mystics that got a little bit spicier over the last couple of days. Uh, well, the Washington mystics, um,
enlisted their core designation on Elena Deladon officially. So that obviously limits options for Deladon in terms of how that moves, but that hasn't necessarily changed that there may be high expectation Elena Deladon may be playing with a different team this season. It just simply changes the narrative of instead of going and signing with the team, there is high potential for a sign and trade. And this allows Washington to potentially get,
something back in turn and hit that value. Of course, with a quarter designation that also guarantees at least a one year super max deal in play to provide leverage. So while that does change the narrative from the simple, like I landed out on sweepstakes, who's going to sign her. We're definitely still in the mode of, I don't think anyone can fully confirm that.
Where she's playing right now, I think the only thing Elena Deladon has confirmed is she has a wine brand she's launching and just did a public tasting for. That's pretty exciting stuff. Logan, what's your reaction to the Deladon rumor mill? I don't think we have a lot set in stone, but things are definitely moving along. Yeah, looking at Deladon's last three years, I get why Washington isn't giving their star the star treatment right now. They aren't completely...
Screwing things over either. I think they would just much rather commit to a short-term one-year supermax than they would anything else. Purely based on... She played 25 games two years ago and 23 games last year. So she's out there two-thirds of the time.
That's okay. It's not great for a foundational piece of your team. And then obviously 2021 was her big injury season where she just... That's just a lost season. But she's still really effective as a player. I think we... It depends on how you think of her. If you're still thinking Elena Deledon is going to go out and be the centerpiece of a championship team, I don't know if I'm going to expect that from her in the year ahead. She's going into her year 34 season.
Um, her points per game have declined each of the past four years, but they've declined from like 21, 20 points per game to like 16. So she's still an elite scorer and elite a sister at the professional level. You want her on your team. If you're one of those like teams looking for a mercenary type player, like, Hey, we're one piece away. Let's, let's, let's just load. Let's get this, you know, yes, it's a big name, but like maybe she comes off the bench. Maybe she does this and that. I don't know.
But even that sort of scenario doesn't seem like a long-term deal. And I imagine Deladon, with her injury history and going into year 34, probably is looking for more than one year signing onto a team. So it depends on what she's looking for. I don't know what teams are in financial...
like a financial place to make a move for her right now. We'll have to dig deeper into that depending on whether it looks like she is going to return to the mystics or not right now, I would put like a 51% chance that she returns to the mystics. So this really could go. Yeah. I think they would have an amicable split if they can't reach it in agreement here.
Yeah, I think the dynamics with Washington are very interesting because talent-wise, just to be clear, pound for pound, is Linny Della Dunn a lead player, obviously. I don't think that's what's in question. There's a lot of factors behind her point and shot load, a lot of that being in the absence with injuries. Natasha Cloud...
has become an elite level player and, and she's always had that ability, but has very much Natasha cloud has argument to become the face of the mystics franchise. Should she agree to sign? Cause she's also an unrestricted free agent, which may think makes things really spicy, but you know, I think a lot of that's gone down, but I think the move by the mystics was more strategic in terms of, and I don't recall if breeze last year,
in Seattle was core designated. I don't believe so. I believe she just signed a one-year deal, but I think the narrative there was let's run this back one more time. Let's try this out. I think this storm understood very much this potential for greener pastures, but we've got one more year potentially with this crew at the time. I don't think they knew for sure, but like good reason to believe the Sue bird's going to be calling it like let's,
Try this out. And then that decision was made. And I think the idea here with the Mystics that I sort of understand is the court designation guarantees you a one-year supermax deal. And we have the potential to say, if we can get Cloud back and we can have a healthy season with this roster, let's see how far we can take it. Maybe add something to intrigue. There's potential there to make things happen. I think the other side that Washington has here is they
If we can't get you to energetically want to take that supermax, I don't think they're looking to negotiate a contract with her right away. No. I think you're saying if you're not exuberantly excited about the potential of that one year, at the very least, it's important for us to get something back out of this. And...
you know, make something work. And I think that's where the leverage of the core designation works here because, and not only with player ability and like who they can get back and what they even put together, Washington currently sits sixth on the draft list right now. And there's potential that they could talk a team or two into finding their way, maybe in the top four,
I mean, Indiana is obviously not going to move their spot. I don't know if LA would too. From three on, you have some argument potential of, is Elena Deladon enough of an argument to drop yourself to six and
It's still a deep talent riddled draft. You're going to pick up someone solid. That puts them in high draft situation. Pick up some key players. If you can maintain yourself and sign Natasha Clyde to a contract, you still have her star power. Shakira Austin is still on the rise. There's a lot of high potential in Washington. The narrative switches. It's...
And this officially becomes the post Mike Tebow, Eric Tebow era of let's, let's try this with a, with some new clothes. But that's kind of what remains to be seen. That's kind of where I'm interested is I think Washington knows they have leverage to make some moves. Just comes down to if there are teams that are willing to do that, because now the argument is,
On Deladon's end, it's different. It's not necessarily like courting Deladon, where's she going to go, where's she going to sign? It's more about who can make that deal and who can put that together. And that's what I'm interested in. And I don't know if that's our next question is, if that's happening, if that's the discussion, what team's answering that call? Like what potential is there? Who's adding that? I have an immediate team in mind.
I don't know if you have any thoughts. I don't go for it. I have one that jumps out just because of the potential I have in front of me. And because of narrative, I want to be clear. This is pure Steve speculation. I've never had a source for anything in my whole life. I have no one to back this up with. And I'm certainly not taking words out of anyone's mouth. I've watched the H bomber guy video many times. I understand the importance of sources. I don't have any, this is speculation. Um,
But based on next moves, based on building around a roster and based on draft leverage, the Seattle Storm seems like an intriguing landing place for Deladon. They're fourth on the draft list. So you're looking at talking to Seattle, dropping back a couple spots. That puts potentially, this is kind of the name that comes to mind. A lot of people probably would see this as a second or third pick, and I get that. But that might hop the Mystics into Cameron Brink territory. Yeah.
Which I think if you need to replace, you know, you need to put a rookie into that Deladon spot. That's a solid one. And I'm not saying that's for sure who they'd be gunning for. On the Storm's side, we just watched...
Jewel Lloyd break the single season scoring record, cement herself as a bona fide top level offensive star in the WNBA. That's known. That's understood. It got the storm as a roster seemingly nowhere. And I say that in the nicest way possible. They were one of the worst teams in the league. They need something to build off of that. They need something to fill that gap that they no longer have with not having a
Brie Stewart around Elena Deladon is a pretty enticing name to add to that ability. If that's something she's comfortable with core designation means she essentially has the ability to call off a trade. So she has a lot of right to pick where she goes. So if that's something that's intriguing to her, that's interesting in the past. I know Elena Deladon has voiced the desire to be close to home for a lot of reasons. And that's a big part of why she went from Chicago to Washington because
So that limits you geographically. If that's not something that's high on her list now, I know she's had quotes recently about how winning is her ultimate priority. She wants to, you know, she wants to win. She wants to have high level success. The opportunity to pair with Jewel Lloyd and try to build something in Seattle is intriguing. And they have that leverage. I don't see Phoenix being that place. I could just looking at the draft board and seeing where they could pop up.
And I certainly don't see the Sparks necessarily making that move for some reason. It's just not on my... So Seattle's the first thing that pops into my head. But as I look at things, it's interesting to see who else could buy. For instance, I think Atlanta will have a compelling discussion because that's a bump up for them. The Lynx is like a perfect fit for Cheryl Reeve. Yeah.
Seattle's really interesting because here's my simplified version of what this negotiation table looks like between Deladon and Washington. Deladon is coming forward and saying, I'm a name, tickets and jersey sales, blah, blah, blah, blah. I provide a baseline of 15 and 5 every night and I want to win. She's 34. She wants to win. I think she probably has two more seasons before the injuries get the best of her. And she's like, you know what? I'm tired of putting my body through this.
I want to win. Seattle doesn't seem like the place that you'd want to go if you want to win, except that they just signed Jewel Lloyd. I am surprised that Jewel Lloyd decided to stay in Seattle. But because of that,
Feels like Seattle must have been able to pitch her on a plan to quickly get back to being a winning team. Picking up Elena Deladonna in the offseason, again, she doesn't have to go in there and be Bree Stewart, but 15-5 a night from Deladonna and Seattle instantly turns that into an interesting team. I don't think the Mystics or Seattle have an easy road to competing with the Aces, but so does... Nobody does. So I think that's a worthwhile thing to explore.
And I think the Mystics are almost... You don't want to come out and say it out loud, but it certainly seems like things inside the Mystics organization are trending towards, we need to transition away from this era and create a new generation of this team. The window is closed. We need to open a new one. And I just don't see Deladon being around for that.
Can I throw out... I just had a thought. Can I throw out one more wild scenario just for fun? Oh, absolutely. Anyone who's going to hear this at home is going to say, Steve, there's no way this happens. I agree. But...
This is usually where fun stories begin. There's a couple narratives that are interesting to me. Obviously, we've talked about, and I think there's a direct quote from Della Dawn where she talked about how winning is the key point for her. That's what she's looking at. I think I have it right here. Quote, I just want to win. That's truly what I care about most. It's been my whole career, but especially coming back from all the back stuff.
I'm feeling like I'm really the strongest I've ever been. I'm in great shape. I feel like I have a lot more basketball to play and I want to win. So it really sounds like the narrative being thrown out there is I want to win basketball games. I want to get back in championship contention. Now, another name on the unrestricted free agent list that could be interesting, especially given how last thing panned out last year is John Quayle Jones. Let's say John Quayle Jones wants to be in a higher profile position where she can have much more higher standing as a name.
and importance. And let's also say she wants to play with the coach that coached her to an MVP and several finals appearances. She wants to play with Kurt Miller again. We're not exactly sure what the Okuma case situation looks like. Court designation in New York went to Bree Stewart. So we're not sure fully the situation in LA, but let's say John Quayle Jones wants to play in LA again. That's a really interesting to, to have a player probably not even yet in her prime in John Quayle Jones in Los Angeles.
suddenly opens up a spot in New York. Is it? I'm not saying it's happening, but it almost fulfills like it's New York. It's it's North, you know, it's Northeast. It's somewhat closer to Delaware. It definitely continues. Like I think in the WNBA, you're seeing some of this now of like,
They can't keep getting away with this trend where the Aces add Candice Park in the offseason and the Liberty add Elena Della. I think those sorts of things will continue to happen and make people wonder, how are they pulling this off? It wouldn't be rare for that side of the country. If you want to see what Gotham FC has been doing in the offseason for the NWSL, it's the exact same narrative. They have most of the USWNT roster over there. And people are like, how is any of this possible? Yeah.
What I find most fascinating about that scenario is I... And again, this is just my impression. I feel fairly confident about most of this. But when you look down the list of potentially coveted unrestricted free agents this coming offseason, Stewie's probably not going to go anywhere.
Brittany Griner is going to stay in Phoenix. Brianna Jones is coming off of an Achilles injury. I don't know if she's going to go anywhere or not. I don't know if Nneka is going to go anywhere. She's played her whole career for LA. It doesn't mean she couldn't go anywhere, but I kind of see her staying there. Dewana Bonner isn't going anywhere. Satu Sabali, I think Dallas is going to pay up and match any offer that she gets from another team. So a lot of these big names that could be on the move, I don't think will be on the move. And the exceptions are
the two that you just mentioned. I think John Quill Jones and Elena Deladon are two of like the top, they're the only two of the top 10 available free agents that I think are a realistic, like I could see it. Um, and NECA is probably the third, like my honorary mentioned, like maybe, but it's tough to envision it. Yeah, exactly. That's where it gets really intriguing is, um,
Like, I think those are going to be the two moves that kind of start setting a lot of things in motion that move a lot of electricity. Natasha cloud is also an extremely interesting one. I don't necessarily anticipate her not being in Washington. She could go anywhere, but every team is Natasha cloud.
cloud. There is a high demand for quality guards right now. Yeah. And not a lot of movement. Her price point could go up pretty significantly depending on where she wants to land. There is not a team in Philadelphia yet. So that argument isn't there. That's a wink and a nod. I'd love to see a Philly team. But like
It gets really interesting in that case, but I think Del Don and John Quill are where things are going to move differently because I don't know if John Quill coming back to New York is a guarantee. Is it highly likely? Yeah. I'm going to say it's about 80% to 90% likely. On the weird-off chance that we see a differential in that movement, LA makes a lot of sense to me for a lot of reasons, Kurt Miller being a big one, but then it kind of makes things really interesting with what happens in New York. But I –
In general, I expect New York to play the run it back scenario, but that's where it makes things certainly fun. And also we, I don't know. We don't know for sure if it doesn't just say, okay, we'll try this one more time in Washington. That's where your clouds movement is. Interesting. Yeah. I was gonna say, we, we've probably spent,
you know 19 of the first 20 minutes of this episode just on the elena deladon situation and how that affects everything else we could spend easily that amount of time and more on all the places natasha cloud could fit if she went somewhere else she's she's coming off her age 31 season which is not like i only bring that up to compare it to like like deladon going into age 34 is is starting to look like all right she's been injury riddled and things could be slowing down
I consider 31, 32 well in the prime of a career for a guard. And it was Cloud's best season. She averaged over 12 points a game. She's been averaging over 6 assists a game for like 3 or 4 years now. She's getting to the line more. She's being more aggressive when she needs to be to find and create shots. But also plays really well alongside big scorers. Literally, you could plug her into basically any roster in the league and make it better. Natasha Cloud is pound for pound...
she might be the most versatile and valuable guard we have in the league. And just in terms of she fills so many uncoachable roles, you know, she has the ability to really uplift the team in a lot of ways. It's,
Like it's, this could sound really interesting, but like when I think of the qualities, when we look back on W history, all those qualities that we loved about Kim Peratt and her story. Yeah. Natasha cloud. Like that's who I think of. You really, if you're a coach, you really want players on your team that help your superstar players look like superstars every night.
And those role players end up being stars themselves because of what they bring to, to that. And Natasha cloud might be the best in the business. Exactly. Like that was called the copper. And I think that's the cloud as well. And so that's where it gets really interesting. There's a lot of interesting moves as far as free agency hits, and that's going to become sooner than it is later. Now we've talked a little bit about the draft that I would to switch gears a little bit. We've already hit, uh,
Some potential movements that the draft order could make. I don't know that there will be a ton because this is a very deep field, but it could be significantly more or less deep, really kind of depending on one name.
You want to talk about Paige Beckers for a moment, Logan? Yeah. Is that a bad time to talk about Paige Beckers? No, never. UConn is going through it the last couple of years. And by going through it, I mean, they're still, what are they ranked right now? Poor thing aren't winning championships. But really, they're 14-3. They're ninth in the nation, just behind Stanford and just above LSU, actually, after LSU's recent loss.
Um, but that's going through it in the sense that unfulfilled expectations always hurt, no matter how high those expectations are, how earned they are or whatever. And I know there's Yukon fans and non Yukon fans. Like we, we all kind of are interested in what their current core with Becker's and FUD would look like if they were fully healthy for, for entire seasons. And we haven't been able to see it.
And that sucks. And so there is some talk going around of Becker's coming back next season, which would obviously affect the draft. It kind of feels like Caitlin Clark has overtaken the consensus number one overall pick for the fever role for next year. For the last several years, we've wondered, this is going to be a stacked class in 2024. Who's it going to be? And just the...
the complexion of the league right now just kind of feels like, I could easily see Becker's going back to college for another year just to try and go all the way with a healthy UConn team. And Iowa's Kaitlyn Clark has built something. Her play deserves what she has built, but she has built herself into a brand. And you add that to Leah Boston in Indiana and you've got something going. So...
it's interesting because I think if she declared for the draft, she's still easily a top three or four pick, just depending on team need and who's up there and who trades around and stuff like that. But because of name, image, and likeness and WNBA contracts and all that, and just the fact that she loved, like, she looks like she has a blast playing in the college game. And, and I, I think, I don't know if she wants to win and I, and I get it and not having foot out there doesn't necessarily mean that they can't do something in the tournament this year, but like,
Remember, we didn't get this tournament because of COVID, but Sabrina did the same thing. Sabrina and Sabali were like, yeah, we could go pro. We're going to win a championship at Oregon next year. Yes. Like, that's what we're going to do. Yeah. And that was the narrative and probably is what would have happened if we had a shot. No, and a lot of that is my same feelings and a lot of what I've picked up on here is...
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Indeed.com slash blue wire terms and conditions apply need to hire. You need indeed. With Yukon. It's, it's very different. You know, this is something that like in the football realm, we've seen this with Alabama and obviously the Nick Saban era of Alabama is different, but it's like, there are those programs that are dominant in real time in different sports that who would, the expectation is different. There's a weird comparison, but like, you know,
Kobe always talked – Kobe Bryant always talked with the Lakers about like the Lakers don't hang division banners, right? And like certain programs have that. UConn is one of those programs. And Paige Beckers was I think in a lot of ways to people like that next –
Kind of that next flagship moment, like that, you know, kind of that next stake in the ground of, you know, we've had Bird, Taurasi, we've had Maya Moore, we've had Bree Stewart, and kind of that next era was Paige. And while this may not be something that immediately would she'd say aloud, I don't know. I think in the UConn community, there's a lot of pressure to,
I'll put it very bluntly. And like, I could see a lot of people in the Yukon community having the feeling if we get out of the page era without a national championship, it sort of feels like a failure. And I don't know if that's necessarily some page would say yourself, but I don't know if that's fair, but I would say so. I think that it's something that feels true, even if it's not necessarily like we want a lot of games, we had a lot of success. And that's not what I believe. I think it's more like I could see that being that expectation because this was,
The next takeover is kind of what it felt like. And I remember not only when Paige signed, because I was like, when Fudd signed with UConn, it really felt like that. It really like who's going to beat this team. And we haven't had a shot at them getting a chance to run that through. And I see that being a huge element. And they also really like to play together. And Fudd has actually been open about, she's pretty much planning on playing with UConn as long as she's able to.
you know, why would she want to go anywhere else? I think was kind of her narrative. And that's what makes that interesting. So the page could very much before we even set this episode live, say, Hey, I'm going on the draft, but I, I think there's high potential for that kind of narrative to shift. What that makes it interesting. And that's kind of my question for you is like, where does that change the era of the draft? Like right now, my assumption is,
If, if Paige was in this draft, I see her going to maybe three, right? That's kind of generally the thought process. Yeah. Who jumps into those spots? If it's you, if we look at the mock draft board, where do you see that going? It, it,
I still see Cameron Brink as being a very high pick. It's hard for me to know exactly where, because after the first one or two picks in each of the last couple drafts, we always do our live drafts.
thing, right? That we broadcast on whatever channel we're on that year. I feel like after the second pick, where I was just like, dude, I don't know what's happening right now. Except Kyle. To Kyle's credit. I know he hasn't been on mic in a minute, but that dude studies out his draft board like no other. And he's been extremely accurate the last couple years. Props to Kyle. I...
I think this is a draft, oddly enough, as talented as it is, where you really draft for need more than overall talent. I think you take Kaitlin Clark and Paige Beckers, regardless of who you are or what you need if you're in those positions. And then after that, it gets very technical. There's a lot of teams with a lot of needs to try and catch both the Aces and a New York team that looks at times last year like they might have been able to keep...
Keep pace with the aces. And, and you're not going to do that by like bringing in a rookie and just plugging them into a roster and being like, I don't know, different systems can, you want someone that is going to compliment your existing roster if you want to compete. And that's just like hard to find. So you mentioned Brink earlier is a good fit in Washington, which you kind of have a proof of concept there because she can come in and play the Elena Della Dawn role. And it's fairly seamless. Yeah.
Outside of that, like I, the, I think this is a tough one too, but who's the, the center, the South Carolina center Cardozo.
Yeah. Take someone like that. She's six, she's six, seven. She's playing at South Carolina. So, you know, she's, you know, she's talented and she's well coached and she's got everything. She hasn't really generated the same amount of buzz as someone like Aaliyah Boston. Few players do. She still averages like 15 and 10 every night. I could see any team taking a shot on her who needs a big, but I don't think she's the sort of player that can just go to any team, regardless of roster makeup and instantly make an impact.
If that makes any sense, like, like only if you need to plug the center hole on your roster, is that something that, that I would do? Um, if Aaliyah Edwards is in the draft, I really like her pretty much anywhere. Um, she can like, it'd be really fun to play her at guard, even though I know she's placed power forward, just cause I think it'd be mean and really fun, but she'll go somewhere and play power forward. Um,
Wait, wait, wait. I apologize. Is Angel Reese declaring this year? Is she going in the draft next year? This year? I don't know if it's official or not, but there's something there. Because that's a big name that I don't want to neglect because she is... Well, that's what I was going to say. She has all the ability in the world to be a big-time scorer, but I also... I wasn't considering her part of this class, and I'm just now realizing... That was a question. I'm skimming an article, and I'm like, wait a second. If she's in this class, now it becomes...
Yeah, like I, you know, I do. I have some favorite. I love Virginia Tech, so I love Georgia Amore. She's one of those that's going to get mocked to somebody in the first round, but I could easily see her. Who was it? Was it Dana Evans?
Yeah. A couple of years ago that like we all had, it was like number four and she ended up going in like, like the second or third round or something like that. I can see Georgia more being a player like that, who we all adore. And we think she's a top six or seven pick and like ends up like the end of the bench somewhere. But Angel Reese isn't going to be there. If she declares for the draft, she's going to be going somewhere that expects her to make an impact right away. That's where it gets interesting though, because I don't see any picks taking her anything before seven. Yeah.
And I'm really intrigued why that's happening. Now, anyone who wants to make this like personality claim on it or something like a character judgment on this because of what happened this year. One, I don't care. And also, that's like an extremely soft work and I would say potentially racist thing to say. Like it seems really weird that –
Um, there are people that are, it's almost like with Reese, there's definitely people who are trying to find reasons to make that a part of the narrative. Sure. If people are not, are people are not at the scene, you know, bursting at the seams to draft angel Reese. I need a good answer as to why.
She's still a top three player in the country to me. Let's say you're the GM for... Who do you want to be the GM for? The Chicago Sky. They were the eighth seed in the playoffs last year. So you can compete or you can hit a big reset and go hard in the paint for a future high draft pick or something like that. Let's say you're like, dude, I'm looking to retool. We have some good players. We've got Copper on the team. Let's get someone in here who can be a scoring threat just her first year. We're going to get Angel Reese.
If you're a GM who believes in Reese's talent, you're not going to fade her in the draft because of drama.
Right? Because of personality stuff. It'd be one thing if it was off-the-court issues that were significant and criminal in nature. You get that in football all the time. You're like, is this guy even going to play or is he going to be not available? If you believe in her talent, you're picking her. You're not like, oh, well, if we can get her in the second round, then that'd be great. But we're not going to waste a first round. You're not doing that. And it bugs me because this isn't some Johnny Manziel situation. Right.
Say whatever you want about any drama that's been circling around LSU. Say whatever you want about the weird, cryptic Kim Mulkey pressers while Reese was away. Say all of that. Angel Reese is a highly talented and marketable star player.
Um, she will, if you don't even want to talk basketball, if you want to be one of those Darren Revell dorks, she's also going to put butts in seats. Like that's, what's interesting to me. So like,
I'm intrigued by that. Like if it's me, I feel like Clark, if, if page is out of the discussion, Clark, Rick Reese is kind of my one, two, three, I say Clark one, and then two and three are mixed depending on who you talk to. Aaliyah Edwards, I think goes really high. I would take Georgia Amor if she was in, in the running personally. Yeah. The other name that's creeped up lists, it's slowed down a little because they've had a string of losses, but,
Alyssa Peely out of Utah, I think has turned a lot of heads. She plays very well above her size. She has a very unique style under the basket. So I think she's someone who's going to move up and down draft boards. Very interesting. So there's a lot of names that make this discussion intriguing. And,
a lot of what's going to set this in motion is, is where page ends up. Yeah. I would love, I would love if Peeley went somewhere in the draft to a coach that I would trust to coach defense, like to, to like a good player development coach. I think she could be very good. And virtually all that I was going to say, like Angel Reese could return to, she, she doesn't have to declare this year. She could return to LSU next year. Um,
so could most of the names that we're discussing. Beckers, Brink, Cardozo, even Caitlin Clark, Aaliyah Edwards. They can all... Georgia Amor. They'll have the option to return to college for another year. Some of them will declare. Some of them won't. In the case of Angel Reese specifically, her stock was so high...
Like, like Caitlin Clark was ready to define that last tournament in 2023. And then Angel Reese did like, she, she was the story. She was the name. She was the image people were seeing and her stock had never been higher in terms of draft stock. If LSU underwhelms this year in the tournament, which LSU,
They're ranked 10 in the nation right now, even though they've only lost two games. So maybe people are getting a little bit too harsh on LSU. I don't really know. This exact same narrative happened with them last year, too. Yeah. It's going to get scary. For people who hate LSU, it's going to get very scary. And yeah, but let's say they underwhelmed. They get bounced in the second round, a la Stanford. Did Stanford get bounced in the first round, second round? If that sort of thing happens...
I could see her returning for another year just in an effort to be like, I don't want to be the eighth pick. I want to be the first pick. And I could see her... I could see that. So I doubt that for any of these players, anything is set in stone in terms of them declaring or not declaring. There's a lot of money to be made and...
glory to be had and friends to play with and everything's still in college and incentive to remain in college for these players that doesn't exist in a lot of other sports. Like the dynamic between women's college ball and the pro game is very interesting in that way. So all of this could be moot other than I really think Caitlin Clark is the first overall pick to the fever this spring. I think that's happening. So that's the one thing you can, I just don't,
I think Indiana's – come on. You're looking at putting Aaliyah Boston and Kaitlin Clark on the same court. Like, go back and watch the Final Four matchup, South Carolina and Iowa, from last season, even though Aaliyah Boston was out with some foul trouble. Watch that game. Watch the talent strip right in that game, and you're telling me the best player on either team is going to be on your roster? Yeah.
Yeah. And we've talked about this before and we'll talk about it yet again because it's constant. You don't have to cherry pick a game to see Caitlin Clark doing something amazing. She just does constantly. She might be... Other than apple of my eye, Damian Lillard, who's now a Milwaukee Buck. I don't know if I've seen a basketball player...
so determined to show up in big moments as, as Clark has. And she will either hit a game winner in the biggest ranked matchup of the season or post season. Just cool as a cucumber. Or she can do what she did last Saturday and just beat the crap out of number 14, Indiana. So that a game winner isn't necessary. One of the two will happen.
We got definitely two sides of, of Caitlin Clark of the last week and a half or so was the Indiana game. And then of course the Michigan state game, which everyone obviously talks about the bonkers buzzer beater. People are for some reason forgetting to also mention that 40 seconds before that she had like a block of the year contender. Um, just, she just got good stuff. Also shout out to, she has her own cereal. Um,
So, I mean, that's – you can never – for some reason, that's always a thing with me. If you've got your own cereal, you've made it. So if you're in the Iowa area and you shop at Hy-Vee and it's still on the shelves, you're kind of dumb if you don't grab one. Also, send me one because I want – I have my display back here. I want to add a box of – That would be cool. Caitlin's Crunch Time Cereal is what it's called. Oh, that's incredible. That's great. Yeah.
Yeah, it's it's I believe it's cornflakes, which is fine. Who cares what's in the box at this point? But yeah, so the draft board is going to be really interesting. Obviously, we've talked a lot about free agency before we put a bow on things. Anything from the college line of games from the last week you want to call out because we've had some pretty fun matchups. We're now down to one undefeated team. That's a fish.
South Carolina is the lone unbeaten team as of now, which means we have a string of very dangerous one loss teams that
um, Iowa second as it stands, but a lot of really good one loss teams, but any, any recent mashups you want to call out? Yeah. The entire Sunday slate. Um, we're recording this, let's see, January 16th. So the 14th, the Sunday slate, big stuff going on in the PAC 12. They're always at the PAC 12 is always tough. Um, so you had number nine USC over number two UCLA and a good UCLA just off to a super slow start. They just couldn't get going. Um,
Colorado beat Stanford, which wasn't an upset, but they beat them by 12. So number five, Colorado continues to be really impressive. If you remember last year, again, I know we haven't recorded an episode in a while. And sometimes there's so many teams playing that things get jumbled and you don't remember what happened in the last year's tournament. Colorado, the best defensive team in the nation, except potentially Stanford in last year's tournament.
Held Stanford to 59 points. That's worth keeping tabs on. Auburn, who had not won a game in the SEC, toppled number seven LSU in a very close... That was just a good...
rivalry type matchup game. Like sometimes those games are just close because they are because the players buy in and they care. And it was back and forth. It was awesome. It was just really good game. It doesn't make me see LSU as a pretender at all. It just, it's fun to see Auburn get a big win because they're currently 12 and five and unranked and, um,
Could mess some stuff up in the tournament if they end up making it. Apple of my eye, number two, Virginia Tech actually fell to Florida State. That was a ring. Number 21, Florida State. Number 11, Virginia Tech. That was another one where Virginia Tech just started slow. They made a nice push in the second quarter to get back into it. But Florida State's a really good team. And then I think that does it for all of the surprising results.
There were a lot of other really good games Sunday too, but it sucks that they always stack women's college basketball against the NFL on Sundays. But if you do seek those games out, we're getting, we're getting phenomenal matchups early. I mean, this is, this is the time of year where you start getting the conference matchups, but you're still getting some good out of conference stuff. And that's been really fun.
Also, availability is a real pain in the neck right now in terms of, you know, anything on the Pac-12 networks, a pain to get a hold of. Big Ten networks, a little tough. You've got Big Ten games on Peacock out of nowhere. I was going to say that's part of why I was excited that, like, Caitlin Clark is such a bankable... Like, I hate to refer to someone as purely through, like, their marketability and...
I don't want to commodify anybody. But if you're a network like Fox, you're like, yeah, we'll put Kaitlin Clark on TV and she will perform in this big game. She will not disappear. We know that. So seeing games on Fox for women's college basketball is really fun, but it doesn't happen often enough. And you're right. Any of these Pac-12 games, nobody has the Pac-12 network. The Pac-12 barely exists. There's no reason to have it. That's a bad...
I'm going to, I mean, you and I are West Coast kids. I'm going to miss the living hell out of the whole, the Pac-12 as a whole. It sucks. There's a lot of people, there's a lot of short-sighted people who called the end of the Pac-12 when the football season ended, not realizing that there's so many more sports left to play. But man, the Pac-12 has four players in the top, four teams in the top 10 right now.
And it's just like, man, this stinks. It's almost... It's sad to see kind of the end of there. Because this has been a lot of fun. I mean, especially where... I mean, Fight On, the Trojans, it's been really fun to watch that build up. It is fun. And Juju has been beyond as advertised throughout the season. Not just because of traditional matchups or even regional matchups, but also just like...
They're going to combine some of these Pac-12 teams that are some of the best teams in the country with Mountain West teams that just have no business playing.
playing Stanford and UCLA and teams of that caliber. And that's not very compelling. And it's so much more compelling to have these teams play each other twice every season and stack up against one another before March. So we could really get a sense of like, these teams are for real. They have something to bring to the table. I'm annoyed both because I am a big sports fan. So I love football. I love basketball. I follow it all. Having football dictate...
the conference makeup of the entire country is frustrating. Um, like the transfer portal could be frustrating, um,
There's a lot of aspects of college sports that can get sticky because it's amateur sports, but it's not really. And we all know that. But to just let football and TV money dictate conference lines is dumb because it affects women's basketball directly, even though it has no... It has about as much sway on who belongs to what conference as...
academics. So that's my, that's my only rant on that. I have one more question and I think we can call it on the episode, but this is a big one. So we have one, two, three, six, one lost team. So we talked about, we have one soul undefeated team. We have six, one lost teams in the rankings. They run two through seven. If you've got to pick one,
Who are you taking? And maybe you can throw in a dark horse pick if you want. If I have to pick one to win it all... You just got to pick one. You just got to pick one. I think the popular pick would be Iowa because they are a really good team. They didn't drop off last year after losing Sonato and some other good players. They continue to be well coached and have one of the best stars in all of college sports. I...
I really like cholera.
Stanford and UConn are not one-loss teams, so they're not in the running. That's not bad at all. LSU is a two-loss team. They're not in the running. So your choices are a perennially good NC State, UCLA and USC, who just faced off against one another the other day, like I mentioned. Kansas State is 17-1. But I think Colorado is the one that they've proven to me over the last two seasons that they belong.
And are playing better offense this season while still maintaining an elite defensive presence. But if Colorado was going to Iowa to play in front of 13,000 Iowa fans in the middle of a blizzard, I don't know if I would pick them to win. But if I'm looking at a neutral site, neutral everything, big important game, I really like Colorado.
Yeah, the next week specifically is going to be very, very interesting for Colorado, especially their next two games against UCLA and USC. UCLA, USC, Colorado, and Utah all are essentially playing each other over the next week.
So there's going to be a lot of interesting results coming out of the Pac-12 and where that shakes out coming into this week. But that's interesting. I like that call out. I think that's really solid. By the way, their one loss is to NC State and they do have a win over LSU. So they all, all those top teams are obviously after each other, but that that's their one loss. Yeah, that's exactly. So I like that call out. I think that's a huge, yeah, there's a lot to like about how that's gone down. I,
So you call out Iowa. They're kind of the trendy and easy pick, and I get that. Watched a lot of Iowa basketball, and that makes total sense. A biased part of me would want to say USC because I've watched almost every game they've had this year. But you know something? Give me Kansas State.
The 17-1 Wildcats. Give me Ayaka Lee and Kansas State. I really like this team. Their one loss is to Iowa, and that was a revenge win for Iowa because Kansas State knocked them off early.
early season. That's right. They beat them like three games into the season on the road. And it was like, yeah, it was a, whoa. You're like, that's why it was, it was like a neutral site tournament. You know, one of those showcases and they met each other in like the final of that. And Iowa got the revenge win, but that was, that's after they'd already knocked them off and they have looked, I mean, they've been smooth since and very similar color up defensively sound. They, they,
distribute the ball well. They shoot really well. Lee is a fantastic big under the basket. I really, really, really like this Kansas State team. They had a very quality win against Texas just a couple nights ago. Yeah, I like what I'm seeing out of them. They're number seven in the country right now because their schedule hasn't been what the other one-loss team schedules have been. But the win against Texas, and then I think coming up they've got somebody –
Who do they play? Baylor. And then I think they have Texas again right after that. Who's on a relative skid. And then I believe... I mean, TCU's 14-4. They're nothing to...
to blink at either. So that's going to be an interesting one. Kansas just knocked off Baylor handily and they're playing Kansas in a couple of nights. Like it's, uh, that was weird. That was a weird matchup. The Kansas state Texas game was incredibly close start to finish. Um, so playing them in Texas, when is that February 4th? That's going to be a must watch. If you, if there's a way for you to watch that game, um, that's going to be a great one. That's what you need to tune into.
And, you know, on the 27th, as always, they get to put just a real pounding on BYU. And that's always fun to see. Yeah, I do like that. That's always a nice thing to see. If you're us and we are, I mean, they're 11-7. I don't want to call them out. I call them out too much. I get smacked in the face. They're not good. Thank goodness.
There's a handful of Y fans somewhere. Listen, I'm an NWSL fan as well. I'm excited to have the Utah Royals back. And there are now like seven BYU soccer players that I have to support because of that, because there's been a real love affair with the Royals and picking up BYU players. So I'm struggling with that.
So BYU fans who are mad at us talking about this right now, that's your rating about me. Listen, if you're a BYU fan and you're mad and you're playing favorites because you're a Utah State person, I'll put it this way. BYU beat Utah State women's basketball this year by just six. And I think Utah State might be the 340th best team in the country.
They are one of the worst basketball teams I have ever seen. So a six-point victory makes me feel like, ah, I don't know if BYU is very good. Anyway, I'll get off of that train. At some point, I will spend an hour...
talking to absolutely no one. Nobody who listens to this podcast cares about Utah State basketball. And that's okay. But they, they got to get that coach out of there and get, I mean, they just got to reset the whole program. This is, this, yeah, this speaks to only the four hosts of this show. Why that's important as a, as Utah State alumnus is in different formats. But I would say, yeah, which by the way, if we're going to talk about Utah State coaches, current or former, congrats to Reagan Pebley. Uh,
GM with the Sparks, former Utah State coach, hanging around Texas, commentator for the Wings. I like Reagan Pebley a lot. I really liked her when she was coaching at USC as well. I was doing school paper covering in the women's team at the time. She was always a great interview and a really good person and seemed to be a solid coach. And had a solid big. Do you remember Bona Giop? No. So that's before I got here and it was Feigbeiner.
Okay. So that was about it. Yeah. They had a really decent big at Bonner. I wonder what happened to them. That said, that's really kind of the lay of things as it were. But this is very exciting. Obviously, this is when college ball is going to heat up big time. A lot of good conference matchups as things go. And before you frigging know it, it's going to be March because that's just how these things happen. And then you're going to need to take many days off of work and school to enjoy what's going to be an electric tournament.
We've got free agency right around the corner. I've talked a lot. If you're a women's sports fan, there's a lot to get into. Watch the living hell out of the PWHL, by the way. Get on YouTube and watch those matchups. For all I can say about my frustration with them not branding their teams this year, I haven't watched a single PWHL game that hasn't been fantastic. Packed houses every time.
And all their games are very accessible live on YouTube. Check it out. Love it. It's so good. So if you need another women's sports fix, it's right there around the corner. But big things happening in the WNBA and women's basketball. Very exciting. Anything else you want to call to attention before we put a bow on it? That's it for me.
Fantastic. Well, it's so good to be back in this chair and in front of this microphone. We're going to work really hard to continue to bring quality content to you. As always, stay connected with us, WMENation.com, WMENationPod on Twitter, Facebook, all those areas. Stay connected with us.
some of our other streams of content we may be pulling out a little bit. So keep your Twitch app close. Keep your YouTube app close. Keep your TikTok app close. We're hoping to try and refresh things at the start of the year and get some new content for you. And we hope you'll be along the ride for all of it. But until then, thanks as always for listening to WNBA Nation. I'm Steve Schwartzman. I'm Logan Jones. And we got you next time.
I'll see you later.