US Steel-Nippon "Partnership" with Marc Morial
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There's no business like small business. Hiscox Small Business Insurance. Bloomberg Audio Studios. Podcasts. Radio. News. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and Tim Stenevek on Bloomberg Radio. Well, it is the five-year anniversary of George Floyd's killing. That happens this Sunday. That's the anniversary. Hard to believe that. Since then, we've seen a pendulum, I think it's fair to say, swing back and forth between

When it comes to the way companies talk publicly about race, when it comes to the way that we hear administrations talk about it, the National Urban League is out with a new report. And we're joined by Mark Morial, president and CEO of the National Urban League. It calls itself, quote, the nation's largest historic civil rights and urban advocacy organization devoted to empowering communities and changing lives since 1910. Mark joins us here.

in the Bloomberg Interactive Brokers Studio. Mark, welcome. Hey, I'm glad to be here. And, you know, I want to take a minute, if you will, to talk about U.S. Steel. Oh, please. Because we took a position against this transaction. And I think people should be reminded that both Biden and Trump during the election cycle opposed what, in effect, was an acquisition by Nippon Steel of U.S. Steel.

Cleveland Cliffs wanted to buy U.S. Steel. Right. Both Biden and Trump opposed it on the theory that it would lead to the loss of American jobs. The fear being that Nippon would close American plants, transfer production to Japan. So now with this iteration, you asked the right question. Is this...

a partnership or is that a public relations move? Is it still the original deal, which really was an acquisition and what protections are going to be there? We took a position from a jobs perspective. So you were concerned about some of the black communities there, right? In terms of the socioeconomic impact. And steel. And we're in a conversation where we're talking about manufacturing. So the real impact question is, will this protect American steel jobs?

Or will it potentially lead to the transfer of production to Japan? Well, I will say the president said that it would create at least 70,000 jobs and add $14 billion to the U.S. economy. But as we did just hear from Richard Bork, he has a hard time imagining that after investing $14 billion, then Nippon Steel would add an additional $14 billion to the U.S. economy. And the question is, are there any guarantees? And I think we all need to...

Watch for the details. Understand the specifics. Because those jobs and those communities have been heavily dependent on those types of jobs. Well, just to contextualize the 70,000, that's just a massive number of jobs, especially for the steel industry. U.S. Steel only has 22,000 employees right now. Yeah, and I hope it's not a lot of hype. And I think that we owe it to look at the transaction and see what impact it will have, what guarantees are going to be there.

for American workers and what are the guarantees that five years from now there's not a decision made a reversal and the jobs move to Japan or they move abroad for some reason so that's really what if you will handcuffs and guardrails are going to be placed on this transaction until we see what they file until we see what they promise it's hard to know but I'm just it's interesting that

the president opposed it as a candidate biden opposed it as a candidate the union opposed it at the camp as a candidate uh uh union opposed it last year right and there was an american suitor for u.s steel cleveland cliffs right so there's a lot to unpack here and i just you know we work hard uh on the issue of jobs right and we're very focused on transactions

to determine whether it's going to have a positive and negative impact on the communities we serve. Well, look, you've spent... You want to talk to George Floyd? Well, wait, I want... Do you want to, in a minute... I want to stay with this for a moment. Stay on economic development and stay on jobs because as somebody who's been involved in government for so long, mayor of New Orleans, serving in the Louisiana State Senate, you understand this stuff.

When it comes to economic development, take a big picture approach to what you view as the economic policy of the Trump administration and its effects on American jobs. Because the president and the administration would say, hey, we are imposing tariffs to protect U.S. jobs. I think a tariff approach without an industrial policy, which says what specific industries...

are you trying to grow? It appears to be a scattershot approach designed to leverage some deals without any specificity. So we're talking about iPhones, automobiles, blue jeans,

What specific? So I can buy the selective use of tariffs, the selective use of trying to rebuild an American industry, but you need an industrial or economic development policy that matches the tariffs in order to give certainty to American business and consumers. So I am curious, you know, Mark, when the,

president putting pressure on a company like Apple to kind of increase its investment here? And we've talked a lot with our reporters who cover it and our team that covers it, that they say, you know, it's going to be a while before we can do it, that maybe there isn't the skill of the workers, the type of automation, so on and so forth. But is that the kind of thing that you think would create jobs that would actually benefit

black communities, middle class communities, which we have just kind of carved out in a big way. Look, the outsourcing of jobs that took place in the 80s and the 90s to really Reagan era free trade policies, which were continued in the Bush and the Clinton era

Republicans, Democrats alike, yeah. Communities, right? They did damage communities. The benefit was cheaper goods on the consumer side. Right. So there were some benefits, but it hurt. The issue today is what jobs are the jobs of the future? Is it rebuilding automobile component parts? I would say that what people have not paid attention to is the disinvestment through the NIH cuts in biomedical research and technology where we do have

bit of a competitive advantage where we do have we ought to be pouring more investments into that. What's the impact of that from your view? The impact of that is long-term damaging because what happens is the scientists and the investments go abroad and once they go abroad just like manufacturing you can't get them back. So our economic policy ought to be focused on where do we have a bit

of some tailwinds and how can we grow it. But then on manufacturing, I agree with the notion that we ought to try to rebuild manufacturing, but we need to be more specific about it. If someone said, I want to bring jobs to Detroit, Newark, Gary, New Orleans, Atlanta, I'm all for it. But I need some specificity as to how this policy is going to generate that type of response. Are you getting time at the White House?

We've not been in any direct discussions with anyone in the administration. But as always, if it's about the benefit for the community, I'm open to discussions with anyone. Is that different than other administrations? Do you typically have a direct line to the White House? You know, in the Clinton, the Bush, the Obama administrations, the Biden administrations, I think there was a much...

more candid, open working relationship with civil rights leaders, with African American leaders. And they were frank and candid, and they were not performative. You see, meetings, many of these meetings took place without cameras, without press, without performance, without posturing. So, I mean, my view of meetings is I want to talk business,

I don't want to play games. What's interesting is that the communities that you represent at the National Urban League in the last election moved further to the right for the most part. And I'm not, I don't want to paint every community with a broad brush. Some moved and many didn't vote. And there was a cynicism about whether government can make a difference. Why was that? I think that people's objective economic conditions changed.

the difficulty of COVID, the depression of wages, inflation, a whole host of factors.

and the idea that politicians come and go and make promises and never keep them. - So how does the Democratic Party get these voters back? - It's gonna be up to a specific candidate. I think people will rally around the right person. I don't know if it's so much about a party. Think Trump, right? Trump remade, quote unquote, the Republican Party. I think the Democratic Party is, the Democratic Coalition,

is poised for a makeover. It's poised for a group of people who are going to come and talk about how they're going to change and disrupt, but build a vision for the future. So who are some names that are on your mind? I wouldn't offer any names now because right now...

the horses have not gotten out of the stable. So we got to see them on the practice track. Well, was Kamala Harris the wrong candidate at the wrong time? I thought she was a good candidate. She was given a tough lane to run in, 60 to 90 days to get known amongst the American people. Remember, she came within one point

of defeating someone who was on their third run for president. So we got to remember, there was no landslide, there was no mandate, but there was a victory for Donald Trump. So I would love to say, speaking of victories, that we've made a lot of progress in the last five years, considering the tragic killing of George Floyd. And I think, you know, it was COVID, we were all home,

We had a lot of conversations, really frank and real with CEOs and leaders about the importance and the racism that still is in this country and blacks being targeted around the country and just the injustices. And I feel like we've slip-slided back. Tell me how you see it. Five steps forward and three steps back.

on two issues we cover in this report. I encourage people to go to NUO.org. You guys have a report out, yes. On policing. Many communities...

Many police departments, many cities, supported by the Civil Rights Division of the Justice Department, made strides. We didn't pass a comprehensive federal law. The George Floyd law did not pass. But 180 police officers were in fact convicted. Dozens of police departments ended up in agreements to reform themselves. A number of states like Maryland passed statewide police reform measures. That was good. Now, what's the obstacle now?

The current administration has walked in and said we're freezing all civil rights investigations, regardless of merit, regardless of the basis of those. That puts headwinds into this effort to continue to do reform. On the other hand, there were these incredible...

commitments by many great American institutions, businesses, philanthropies, etc. And now some are walking them back. And there are three categories. Those that have just abandoned them, some who've held firm, and those that are making cosmetic changes because they know they need to be committed, but they're under the pressure

of the administration which is using its regulatory power to force their hand. Which one do you think happened more? Do you think these are just cosmetic changes and they're committed to these so-called DEI policies? Or do you think they are actually making fundamental changes and moving away from them? I would encourage American business to demonstrate a sense of courage. And the reason why that courage is important is to recognize the marketplace for both employees and customers of the future.

which is becoming far more diverse, black, brown, Asian, women. That's the workplace of the future. The customers of the future. I mean, you've seen Target get really, really hammered, right? And they had an incredible record. They've walked it back. Now they'll tell you, no, the changes we made were really around the edges.

But people today, if you look at DE&I, diversity, equity, and inclusion, equal opportunity, and you poll it, the lowest polling numbers I've seen in any publicly available poll is 50%. See, the American people...

are not on the side of the loud anti-voices. American business knows deep in their soul. They know and they understand, but they're being, I think, pressured. They're being intimidated. And I think that's just the reality of today. We're squeezed for time, 25 seconds. Are you surprised by the fear of corporate leaders to speak out? And I apologize that it needs to be quick. I am, but there are exceptions. Jamie Dimon.

Roger Goodell, two people with whom I've spoken and two people who've made important statements. And I think others should do the same thing. - Thank you. - Are you done with public service? - Never done with public service. - So are you, is there a chance you would run for something else? - There's always a chance. But I love my job. I love what I do, but there's always a chance. - Like what?

Stay tuned. All right. TBD. We'll come back and tell us. You can break it. Mark, thank you so much. He's, of course, President and Chief Executive Officer of the National Urban League. Joining us in studio. Mark, thank you. Colgate Total may make your favorite toothpaste, but it's also a science innovator committed to oral health. For instance, the Colgate Total Active Prevention System. With a cutting-edge toothbrush, refreshing antibacterial mouthwash, and a reformulated toothpaste. With a technology so innovative, it won the 2024 Edison Patent Award.

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There's no business like small business. Hiscox Small Business Insurance. This is an iHeart Podcast.