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cover of episode Market Predictions, Rates & Inflation, DOGE, CES, AI Compute | BG2 w/ Bill Gurley & Brad Gerstner

Market Predictions, Rates & Inflation, DOGE, CES, AI Compute | BG2 w/ Bill Gurley & Brad Gerstner

2025/1/11
logo of podcast BG2Pod with Brad Gerstner and Bill Gurley

BG2Pod with Brad Gerstner and Bill Gurley

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Brad Gerstner
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Elon Musk
以长期主义为指导,推动太空探索、电动汽车和可再生能源革命的企业家和创新者。
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Elon Musk: 我认为未来三到四年内,人工智能将能够完成人类能够完成的任何认知任务。这将取代价值数万亿美元的人类劳动。 Brad Gerstner: 2025 年可能是具有里程碑意义的一年。税收降低、监管放松、GDP增长强劲、就业形势良好,以及人工智能等大趋势带来的生产力提升,都将带来积极影响。然而,当前估值相对较高,通货膨胀和利率上升是潜在风险。大型科技公司(MAG5)的盈利增长虽然强劲,但市场预期其增长将放缓,非科技类公司的盈利增长能否实现存在不确定性。大型科技公司的资本支出(CapEx)增长速度前所未有,这既可能带来高回报,也可能存在风险,如同当年的电信投资热潮。 Bill Gurley: 大型科技公司的大规模资本支出是他们对人工智能未来发展前景的押注。英伟达是最大的受益者,但内存产业和能源产业也将受益。然而,高资本支出也带来风险,市场存在担忧。 Brad Gerstner: 美国面临能源短缺问题,这将对人工智能产业的发展构成挑战。国会能否削减预算以应对潜在的通货膨胀风险,是2025年美国经济的关键。如果国会能够大幅削减预算,则利率可能会下降,从而刺激经济增长;反之,则可能抑制经济增长。 Bill Gurley: 对人工智能的监管应该在联邦层面进行,而不是在州层面进行。 Brad Gerstner: 2025年,更多的人工智能模型将开源,大型科技公司之间存在合作竞争关系。谷歌面临着创新困境,但其丰富的资产使其在人工智能领域具有优势。 Bill Gurley: 人工智能领域对推理计算的需求正在快速增长,这将推动计算能力的进一步发展。 Bill Gurley: 我对人工智能的未来发展持乐观态度,因为美国拥有世界上最聪明的人才,以及前所未有的资金投入。然而,人工智能的成功不仅取决于计算能力,还取决于模型架构和算法。

Deep Dive

Key Insights

What is Elon Musk's prediction about AI and human cognitive tasks?

Elon Musk predicts that every cognitive task that can be done by a human will be able to be done by AI within three to four years, potentially replacing trillions of dollars in human labor.

Why are interest rates and inflation considered the 'boogeyman' for 2025?

Interest rates and inflation are seen as potential risks because unexpected rises in rates, combined with high valuations, could dampen market performance. The 10-year rate has already risen by nearly 100 basis points, contrary to expectations of rate cuts.

What is the expected earnings growth for the MAG-5 companies in 2025?

The MAG-5 companies (Microsoft, Meta, NVIDIA, Amazon, and Google) are expected to see earnings growth drop from 44% in 2024 to 21% in 2025, reflecting a deceleration as they face harder comparisons.

Why are large tech companies increasing their CapEx significantly?

Large tech companies are increasing their CapEx to invest in AI infrastructure, particularly in training and inference compute. This is driven by the belief in high returns on these investments and the need to stay competitive in the AI race.

What is the significance of inference scaling in AI development?

Inference scaling is crucial as it is expected to increase by a million to a billion times, requiring significant new compute infrastructure. This scaling is driven by advancements in chain-of-reasoning models, which are compute-intensive but essential for AI's future.

What are the concerns around federal spending and its impact on the economy?

There are concerns that federal spending, combined with potential tax cuts, could lead to higher inflation and interest rates. The market is skeptical about Congress's ability to cut deficits, which could further pressure the economy.

What is the potential impact of state-by-state AI regulation in the U.S.?

State-by-state AI regulation could create a patchwork of rules, increasing complexity and slowing innovation. This could harm the U.S.'s competitive position against China, as it would add regulatory hurdles for AI companies.

What is the outlook for reasoning models in AI development?

Reasoning models are expected to see significant scaling advantages in 2025 and 2026, with breakthroughs in coding and enterprise applications. These models are becoming more capable, blending pre-trained and O-series models for broader use cases.

Shownotes Transcript

Open Source bi-weekly convo w/ Bill Gurley and Brad Gerstner on all things tech, markets, investing & capitalism. This week they discuss Brad’s public market predictions, AI enthusiasm and fears, interest rates, inflation, DOGE, federal budget analysis, big tech capex, scaling inference, Satya Nadella, Jensen Huang, Elon Musk, AI reasoning models, chain of thought,  & more. Enjoy another episode of BG2!

Timestamps:

(00:00) Intro

(02:58) Frontline Ideas for 2025

(07:02) The Bogeyman (Interest Rates and Inflation)

(09:21) Mega Cap Valuations & Expectations

(14:02) Big Tech CapEx

(16:51) Scaling Inference

(20:11) Future of AI

(39:50) Role of Power in AI Development

(42:58) Interest Rates & Economic Growth

(45:11) Federal Spending & DOGE

(54:15) Regulatory Landscape for AI

(01:01:27) Co-opetition in AI

(01:17:06) Reasoning Models & Chain of Thought

Available on Apple, Spotify, www.bg2pod.com)

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Brad Gerstner @altcap)

Bill Gurley @bgurley)

BG2 Pod @bg2pod https://x.com/BG2Pod)