Elizabeth Warren Gaslights Inflation, The Enhanced Olympics Are Here, Woke Kindergarten
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On a set, i'm gonna get me Green .

corporations are jacking up Prices on items. Why is big audio softening the load of oros? He wants to .

regulate the poison that your fat children are putting in the body.

Peter, to billionaire answer manius crazy person is creating olympics where you have new. You can put, you should, if you're entering the drug olympics, you gotta do drugs.

The garis actually called working the garden is what you might smell. You might smell tear gas and you might feel key. Queer and trans liberation.

Imagine to queer at age six and then we wonder whether hard right is like they are. All goers will just stop teaching him about sex. And at each five .

I don't get IT.

Welcome back to the pod guys another friday. Uh, another moment with you all to discuss the news first. Actually before begin for the topics, I just want to say you thank you guys um the show has definitely IT seems to a present an inflection point is pretty interesting.

We've like to double the amount of of views and and comments and what not over just the last couple of months is like we have more growth now that we have the first six months. The show, I think we're definitely getting there is exciting. And this is the moment is definitely subscribe.

If you haven't, please rate IT comment. This is like this is the kind of step that helps IT uh on the algorithm side um tell all your friends, force them to watch IT this is um this is important. This is for you, not for us, it's for us um but thank you.

Uh I do wana um we have a be a special guest today for the first time, first time in a while. I guess we've been doing this thing where we do of interviews sometimes and then it's like it's the crew here I am going to bring someone in to talk about a topic that things can be really from where in top these special special olympics with Christian anger. My this is um I will get into IT in the minute but he's going to beyond after our first topic which is um we going to talk about warn so a little little bit boring.

She's been doing this. She's been kind of like like ooks beating around this topic for quite a bit. She's referenced IT before, added to IT before and and i've seen this sort of left talk about this before. I was more popular during a the height of the inflation conversation maybe a couple years ago, two years ago. Um the idea is this IT is uh Green corporations are jacking up Prices on items um that actually what's happened there is no inflation is is big bad, evil corporations um who are colluding and uh and just raising the Price on goods that used to be sort of less expensive. Now a version of that is um okay, so the goods let's say consumer goods like oros or the rios are actually the same Price but you're getting less and that is what .

is the .

exact question what was IT called street string flag? Er I have a lot I mean we have I got thoughts on this with warning um I have thoughts on trinity lation um but I maybe we to start with like have you guys noticed have beginning less to reos what this is the I think we call this, this is the greedy orio theory of economics. Um is that what's happening? I don't know.

I think I feel like maybe I start kicky to you river. I feel like if someone of this chat is like buying ddos, I don't know. I think it's, I think I think it's you.

About a couple of pounds.

you know it's not a pounds. It's like it's like you're working classifies part .

of your brain I think um um I mean I did so I have a noticed anything personally but I did watch the uh sort of like a kind of autistic guy on uh youtube who like keeps track of all of this and he's like look half anounced lower than IT was last year at least serial boxes or whatever. So apparently IT is kind of a thing but it's like really small um and there are people out there out there that are here later keeping drag of IT.

Yes, I think I think it's definitely a thing. But the quite why are they doing IT? Why why is orio? Why is big o softening the load of orioles? And it's because the cost of everything is higher.

And so they're trying to deliver value in a way that is not completely um infuriate and turn off consumers. And this is kind of what they have to do. It's think there's not like some giant meeting of all the people producing just the worst wherever there.

By the way I think is another part of this I think is kind of funny. It's like elize with Warren trying to speak to poor people and so she's like they are going after your diregus. How do you feel about that? Um which is just I mean it's it's that's funny to me going after the rivers of the world. Yeah yeah .

she's always had this a like pareni zing school marm a tone that he addresses people with. I remember like in the twenty twenty campaign there is a berny staff is like a really just like a funny and entered that gay guy then been more who got fired because he had all these like mean tweets by walk to count work. You said that like a little, but one always like adult dire finishes and like OK because he goes, she's like the you're getting small world. The Prices are getting small like and it's it's weird like the way that SHE talked to people SHE does talk .

to you like a child yeah i've rever um I mean, is that in Jason conversation but it's it's it's iconic rember the the beer the beer thing where he was running for president. Hold on a sec. I'm gonna get me.

Hey, covered my hubby. Burst is now in here. Um you want there? So this is one three I. Like thank you for car I do you have a beer and talk about the world today um that is it's the I don't like this from, I don't think get anybody like this from their qualities I think what of the endorsing fascinations of Donald trump um for a lot of people is that he just is honestly he's like, yeah, my toilets are played gold.

Why would they not bear you poor? I'm really rich like he just leaned into the fact that he is wealthy. He is not pretending he's sort of speaks in a cadence so I think is accessible to a lot of people from um not his world of a lead you know new york city real state but he is that he doesn't pretend that he's not wealthy, infected with the opposite he pretends his wealthy than he is. He's also a great .

observable behavior because in that video he thanked her husband, says, thank you for being here to her husband and trip like pointing the sun. He was like the crazy part of the elimination. N beth, give him sick twice.

This at two A M or whatever the crazy is thing but that was with boring beer. Thug isn't SHE thinks her husband for being there. It's their house. He's supposed to be there. Like, that's so great.

Um have you guys uh, sound in a branded, if you notice uh, less orio in the bag.

I don't know about less or I mean, I guess i've noticed chips. I feel like i've always they've always had like a generous amount of air and them the boys rented about IT. The thing I find funny about the liz warn stuff is the follow up in her original tweet is like we're gna crack down on this and it's not here because she's like, you know, there's less there's fewer oria in the bag and there's fewer chips and whatever.

And it's like, what is he proposing? Is he proposing that the government established like, you know, minimum chip requirements for bags? Like what is the sort of actual policy that's going to come out of? This is just a the .

people she's .

a regulator. He wants to regulate the poison that your fat children .

are putting in their body, but in the opposite direction, he wants to make sure you have more of IT.

It's totally .

so I that I I can I can handle that kind of thing. Um I do I think it's funny also that in her appeal to the working class, she's like we're going to make sure that you have more, as rivers said, poison in your bag um rather than we're going to fix the border. There's only one thing that anybody in this country, uh certainly anybody in the sort of uh like bottom half in terms of uh, income cares about.

That's the border. That's the only thing they care about and you're out you're trying to talk about arias. It's um well, it's exciting for me because I am a great prevent of bullshit and i'm excited for this next year of IT. We have Christian anger minor in the chat. I'm going to let them here is the one and only Christian anger marry introduced yourself to the guests of of the pirate nation you are we're .

going talking about making if they know yours so we had this one funny heroic con where was tog teazle's so many Christian i'm running their own investment from a pie on um where we do very simply fight said tech biotech in biotech. Uh we did a lot focuses uh especially on mental house and here especially on bring psychiatric back into the medical rm and on longevity um and sort of its kind of site project.

I think that's the occasion for today. Uh, we just started a new sports league, uh which is called the enhance games, uh, which is practical little bit like olympics or similar disciples. But the main difference is that sort of toping is not just the loud but actually endorsed. So we hope, uh, people will use the platform to really showcase what the humans are capable of with the help of size.

One of my favorite tweet of all time, one of my favorite, the sort of viral tweet IT says something to the effective like um we need to allow I don't I don't care about the doping thing. I mean to I I want a special games where where be allowed doping and then we see how high amen can really jump what and that is it's it's what you're doing. So obviously you this is announced aon, the the super company, and the headlines explode because Peter involved. So it's like Peter tio, like billionaire transform ist s crazy person, is creating an olympics where you have to do drugs or you .

can win you what you if you're entering .

the drug olympics, you got to do drugs. I mean, we want to see IT. We want to say sorry, not just drugs.

So yeah, I guess this is I have a bunch of questions on this. I know the team has a bunch of questions on this. I'm going to start with just like.

I guess I should start with the most obvious question. We just like why why are you doing this? Why is that important? okay.

So about we are serious know like it's not you don't have to because like IT could be actually also and it's already one reason IT could be the very fair transport platform where somebody who's extremely good without doping can show that he is he is even outperforming people of topic is imagine now like fun fact is like, by the way, sought our number. This is like extraordinary research.

Like harvard have done surveys like whatever, like the assumption. But the very serious assumption is that around forty to fifty percent of all olympian athletes are doped anyway. So imagine you are, number two, you win silver.

You know? You know what we call an actual, but you do know that number one who wins gold east of you can't prove IT yeah because like Better way to rectory at the moment just to get around all the doping controls like they know exactly when to stop, like a week before whenever. So so the whole science, which is a waste, by the way, the whole brain at the almost or a big part of the brain output goes into how to avoid being caught.

So you are sila, you know gold has as though, but you can't prove IT isn't that sad because actually you want in the in our games if you are natural and again, we completely want that as well. And do you win silver and the gold won says, hey, what I was stop. You feel like a enough so it's very fair for everybody yeah and image, you know even Better, your natural and you will go you like you guys even with dopy you cannot beat me.

I think it's just like separate the shirt version is one of the main reasons why we doing IT. It's because people dump anyway, but they do with in the shadows yeah it's unfair. It's not transparent.

We just make level playing field. You can do yeah have to but like you have to tell us what you do yeah and then we want to see what people get. So let's want things is fairness and transparency.

The second thing is like by fairness and transparency, IT is much healthier yeah because like once you have to show what you do or even by the way, once you can do IT officially, people won't do IT like in the government or the stuff online ah. And so so it's it's Better healthy for the athlete and we have one rule, you need to be healthy when you start so different than you look. Because they cannot do IT because they make, which show that half of them adopting everybody has to do the day before a complete health check up.

And if you would do sort of, let's call IT bad doping in a way, misuse of doping, and you would, for example, have an a large heart, that's one of the risks. But not if you do proper, let's call IT Better performance enhancing, you stopping such a backward, if you don't prop performance and hunting in a very medical way, yeah, you shouldn't have any side effects. So the side effects people are always afraid of, like all telling me now, oh, but away.

But like isn't that risk? Y when people do performance and animal because they could have in a large heart, it's when you do IT wrong. yeah.

And we tell the athletes, look, if you do IT wrong, you get this because we don't want somebody having a heart attack on the field. yeah. Um so we gonna have a full house check. We gonna pay forty states.

And in the third reason, what we do in because the olympics are inherently also back to their athletes, like, uh, an average olympics metal winner in the prime of their time make like thirty, forty thousand dollar a year, including enormous by away. It's a total disGrace how we treat these amazing athletes. And it's, by the way, completely different that in soccer, formula one, in any other sports where the top athletes also get a really fair share of the revenue. So a short version is the olympics are a very corrupt, a very self sorbing, a very intranet arent, a very unfair organization. And we just want to to bring that basic idea of the olympics showing what humans are capable of into the modern world in a much fear, much more transparent version they are, especially for the etes.

I keep here and you say doping, and and I look at your website and and you also mentioned you know performance enhancement, IT and some other terms in your website that you I think part of your project is you're trying to change this this notion of doping from bad to good um and you should .

the word because like toping, I think in here any people have a bad association ah this my performance and has when I think is a nice word or is this a right word?

Right right right. And that got me thinking, you know if if you're successful suddenly you know steroids in the gym is no longer perhaps on a wide cultural perspective all that shameful or taboo.

How do you think that um if you're successful, the the broader fitness and athletic culture changes from you know your average person that goes to the gym to even like the nfl, do you think the nfl may be forced to, if you're super successful, allow performance enhancement and sort of integrate some of the stuff? Like how do you see the future playing out in terms of culture? If do you think you have an impact there?

So okay, so many things is short is yes yeah I think the let's start with the n fell on the way my thesis that equally to the olympics, yeah, most of the guys are doping yeah actually I think the ef hour is even more lenient and the M, B, A, whatever, because it's about money yeah so i've never heard of drug testing. Whatever you might offficers eny still exist.

But I think they are like turning very actively applied die now again, which is more unfair yeah than saying IT openly about way you can but but I think it's already but way it's very simple take against the olympics like in the moment world records have broken all the time I go over the last decade. It's like there is a reason for IT and it's not because we suddenly eat that, that maybe a tiny hit, but like there is a lot of science to say already at work and we just wanted actually just talk about IT activity. Ah the second is um coming to the more like sort of and it's everyday use our regimes of whatever of anabelle stereos.

And even for me, I I was surprised when I looked at the one chart and the one graphic I was using most over the last five years. And but where everybody was listening, you shot google that chart because it's my favorite, favorite team when talking about drugs and general yeah it's from a very famous a friend of mine, David, not easter, sort of key neuroscientist here, britain. And here I think he was two thousand twelve, but long said wrong here.

But someone then wrote an entire book. So the books is worth reading, but like the chart to sort of the essence of the book about how skilled, wrong and crazy our societies feel on drugs and drugs. He means medical drugs, illegal drugs, but that their creational uses.

Yeah, because if you and so everybody was listening, google, just David, not David. And then N, U, T, T. And then start because we need first thing what you see that way what he did um he defined what risk actually is people throwing that word around, oh, this is risky.

This is not risky. And he was like, okay, as a scientist, let's first start. What is risk yeah and you see like in the a general like you see he has a very comprehensive definition for us.

Can you die? Can you get disable long lasting side effects? Yeah uh also social effects whatsoever yeah and in a comprehensive risk um assessment by far and by the way, this uh study at this whole book is to date totally unchAllenged.

That fact i'm not saying that an opinion of him that's a scientific fact ever IT was published Lancer like it's one of its the most sorrow analysis of risk for recreation fox the number one risky drug by far by the way, is alcohol closely followed by I have so he said the two or just let me know where alcohol is now so whenever but we fun fact, they have discussions like that at a dinner and people look at me and said, oh my god, did you just say psychedelic the last five years or now and about exteriors while they are sipping on a glass of wine and I scientifically I can't take you in serious because like you're drinking the worst poison while luxury on me yeah about something you clearly don't understand yeah because if you go on the other side of the charge, people see IT yeah on the right side you have practically the zero risk drugs which is psychedelics ah uh the all only risk sec delay s hf which is the and pillow at magic mushrooms the risk instead you literally have an accident why you do IT because you dripping yeah so means, by the way, which I am a very big proportion of, you have to do IT with a guide on the meat to stuff. But if you do that, zero yeah but also and I didn't didn't see IT because I was not interested till the enhance scheme. What is also at the very right with very, very, very, very low risk are an apolitical.

So what the fact is that sort of the the the press and also the whole crazy iss in the eighties and nineties about doping has completely seed the the idea of society if he tells somebody and serious, I like all my god, like, yeah. But it's practically super lower because, by the way, these were and are S, D. A approved drugs.

These are not like crazy designer drugs somebody came up with lately. Yeah, these are S D air proof drugs, which were actually used for medical reasons a for a very long time. And practically as a collect call IT. A side effect also have to effect a positive one.

anybody? So when then people say, but i've heard of somebody who does most of that stuff in urban legends yeah but but away and then it's always about doing if you drink twenty vocs t you did yeah uh most likely lets you prove my like, but I yeah good. But are .

obviously .

if people do like twenty, thirty, forty times too much of IT, yes, and IT gets dangerous. But like as long as you use them sort of a sensible medic way yeah ah they actually have noticed that is nice. I don't think .

it's interesting what we what we turn performance hanckel rugs and and what we really do they know is this it's like we all drink coffee and in fact, I think we're mostly all addicted to coffee. Brand might be drinking coffee right now. Um it's a real addiction that is broad and.

I think alcohol is very similar. Speaking of charts, I saw one other day that broke down the number of people who comprise the bulk of alcohol sales. And IT is like seventy five percent of alcohol sales are dominated by twenty five percent of people.

So the entire industry is fuelled by alcoholics. People drinking ten drinks a day. That is weirdly not it's like not counted because it's so pervasive. And I mean nicotine is is a step up from that, I think because they didn't recently so much.

Um and my recent in the last year three, four decades so much anti smoking um attention um but we don't yet like it's it's not it's not counted for some reason, which is just interesting in itself. You know what drugs count? What do I do?

Won this decide historically, people, the army is be a human streak. I cols in two thousand years, but like also killed thousand two thousand years. I to kill somebody. Like it's like just like it's a very weird like um few we have on drugs. It's very one of the most pizarro on scientific things that a where nobody has a red explanation.

where we how we ended up here. I do wonder what it's like to create. Were doping allowed across the entire industry? And this is the probably the question that you get assuming the most because it's the most obvious to me. Um it's like in a world where that's allowed you kind of have to do IT to perform. And how do you feel about that about the introduction of a rule that um you know yes is optional, but if you want to compete against someone at the top of their game who is just as strong as you, but doping, don't SHE sort of have to do to compete. Are those your .

choices to do? Try to compete. It's a little bit like if you go in the job and if you like Better way we should could also talk about because sorry happening like yeah um so so h people take a lot of more if know which is a very ah the way sk yeah uh if you look at the sight effect stay from my point of view that I want to give medical ice but very much yeah and IT makes you much Better at your job, depends which job you have but like yeah um because like for example, creativity is different than like just working except ap but like so but for certain jobs for certain definitely gives you a real ge.

Like does that mean that IT forces now every Young investment bank to say more? Definitely no but maybe he says okay if but if you wanted do a certain thing like maybe if you know if you never forced to life but you can you have to maybe in real sessions decision yeah so you're not forced to do if you wanna be then and then hand game, but you should go in time and it's just like I I think like that is sort of free will will still exist. It's big but give me all right let's go by me one step back because I think what I love when I thought about IT and it's got you are like you because, like, I know your political correct, but like I think who did the biggest service to the whole enhance ment movement is the transmogrified the ultimate or clear first and then trains?

Because, like, so my fuel and whole stuff is that farma follows society and norms. And over the last hundred years, so actually even longer. But let's just look at the sort of recent history, society was fairly Normalize.

So we define something as a norm. And just when you deviated from the norm, then society said, oh, you are sick. And then in farma terms, you were allowed treatment.

Better way, being gay was able to sick till just some decades ago. yeah. And and that has changed now. H, because first, to quiet with my sort of pushed to the norms in terms of me, laugh, and then sort of the trans movement, when even one step further and said, look, even who I am, what my gender is, my identities, whatever I can defined for myself. And I think we just starting to see that, that societal movement now also has an effect on farma because IT does is not there is no logy anymore. If somebody I would say if somebody can change a Better way, I give them the right.

I actually like any any as long as you like bother me like I think people should have the I to identify whatever they are, and even should have the right to use certain medications to sort of change their are there are they are their sex so but at the same time you content say, oh, but you are not allowed to take anybody theos to look Better because again, maybe for me that is equally important. And i'm i'm shopping. I know all the sensitivities, yeah, but i'm shocking.

He always use that as an example. I always felt like a olympics swim. Like I always. I was .

set to identify .

densify body wise as an olympic swim, but unfortunately i'm trapped in a finance student body. Yeah so but now I realize I can go to a doctor and help get help to sort of a just my inner body to my feelings that was, you know what I want to say like. So I know i'm very grateful. I don't mean very grateful both for the korean movement because I gay like, but also a tran's movement, because IT liberates us from a completely biotic view, that you have to be sick in order to be allowed to access medication yes .

but IT also there I .

don't it's not is risk .

free as um I don't think it's very RAID all from whatever I mean it's fundamentally all to your body and i've been kind of around enough meat heads to know that there are all sorts of risks about um tea production following doping and things like this like you you is there are consequences right for your life. You're chain. We are seeing this now and the trade movement specifically, we're seeing this.

There are consequence is especially of of a of of hormones as introduced to the opposite gender um bucket Angel is a famous trans mail who has talked a lot about what has happened to him in older in sort of older due to all of this right? Like there are there are IT is an extreme intervention to some extent. No.

yes, no, no. But that is more extreme than than like topping. I would say that we ever weird maybe mix of libertarian and conservative. You work on this stuff. They have more conservative than people might think.

Like what did you say? Like the one is like, I think once you're, by the way, a certain age because I think you should understand what you're doing yeah and I think you downed when you like sixteen eighteen, like I really think also scientific ally if you look at the brain, like twenty one should be the age where I would say people have the full agency to um to to make this very, very profile decision um for their body um sides of one thing. The second thing is my libertarian part says once to twenty one you should be allowed to define your own body in terms of, uh, gender, but also in terms of performance, enhances me.

However, just in the realm there comes my conservative view of F, D, A approved drugs together with a doctor. So the same, by the way, my sec docs, I think sec delicate, are extremely beneficial therapeutics. yeah.

But I don't think because they are they are that efficient because they very strong ah so I don't think we should sell pa deletes like cannabis in a coffee shop. But uh, what we working on with one of my portfolio companies is that you have to go to a doctor or therapist. Yeah, we at the moment, bringing all the secret lives through F D, A approved try on.

So we really show the world, look these other risks because, by the way, as much as sometimes the f is conver some, but it's the gold standard globally of how to scientifically rigorous reprove that something is working, but also show are the ety facts and if so, which are they? So we want to bring or we are about to bring only second delicate uh through F D A uh programs cession. So and then after people can go to the doctor and then trip with their doctor, I can't even take IT home.

yeah. I want them to do the secular lic experience with the doctor. And the same thing I have on performance enhancement is like, first of all, don't buy any shit on the internet. So I wanted that to be that open and that sort of Normalize, that once a twenty one, you can go to your doctor, you can talk with your doctor about your goals yeah, you are going to have A A professional sort of not just giving IT what monitoring new yeah, and just F, D, A approved darks.

And so versus I think that the trans comparison is very interesting and actually reminds me of a piece we published a few months ago about these trans maxes who basically decided to take their males who decide to take gin. And they don't even necessarily identify trans, but they specifically say they're doing IT for like some former physical enhancement.

So I do think that that this kind of interesting way to think about these body modifications. But my question is a bit more uh, pragmatic. I'm curious if you guys think um what this what is the athletic demographic you think is going to participate? Because I sort of I don't know if like if participation in these games would disqualify people from them participating in the regular olympics or is their kind of like who do you think is gonna um sign up?

So first of all, like so so is this just question? So the one is like we gonna be so economic um that people even like when my assumption at, but not just by by my assumption, we have and we can't obviously disposed in here, but like we have active athletes to competing this year in front in the olympics, reaching out to us and like, hey guys, if you put a million dollar Price 啊 on breaking a world records， yeah I mean, because I getting paid nothing yeah in a million dollar is like up.

So I think we gonna get a ton of very active current olympia to say, this is just cool, more fun. I do IT anyway, anyway, again, yeah and now i'm really going to make money yeah, because I it's just a, we gonna provide, it's one of the big parts of our strategy. We're gonna a provide a much more economic offering to estes.

The other thing which is super interesting, which is spite away also, again, very sort of diverse, is who are reaching out a lot of senior associate, senior, I mean, in their thirties, who are practically they can build to dynamic because they too old yeah. So we have in sports, you have an extreme version of costing out. Old people, and old starts with early thirties, but only a lot of soccer players really like to.

Actually, very famous soccer is reached out to us in their thirties, one not active anymore. On the super star level, they were the twin ties because they can't physically and they are like, wow, I can do what I love being an athlete. And now very efficient with performance of us. We have a second career in my and series ah so we actually opening up the field to people who have a passion for sports who will haven't been able to do IT because in the current version, they would not be able to yeah .

my question was about uh so i'm wondering is doctor um supervision and F D A approval really enough to saw people from abusing? Because I mean oxy cotton was F D A approved IT was prescribe by people's doctors um and i'd LED to like I massive epidemic appropriate tion. I like I just kind of especially in unites, it's where um drought like you can if you can basically get whatever drug you want from your doctor, like IT is like a very capitalist like health care somewhere like you can kind of shop around for doctors, if they will, will give you whatever like it's there's already like market and sense there. I think that I can produce abuse and I I don't know like just I concerned about like and I guess I wonder if you think like our doctor approved or a doctor supervision and uh, F D approve was really going to be enough to keep people from I don't .

think I don't think it's perfect. I think it's the best we can do because every system in the world, every rule said you can do, every protective provision you can always gain. And rick, yeah, so if somebody look like always murder is forbidden, people do IT still.

Yeah, even if we have police, even if we have everything, we have C, C, T, V, whatever. If people wanna do bad stuff, they gonna do bad stuff. So if somebody but Christian.

there's going to do a lot more murder of murder is legal, right? Don't don't think that we look at them for cisco. There's more crime because people are really enforcing IT you're arguing for.

I'm interested. I'm open to IT, but you are making the case for a world where people are doing many more performance enhancing drugs. So like what does that look like?

great. We all six going to be much Better. We're gonna be gradually smart. Let me give you one more current example because I think if you break IT down or make IT more tangible, people see that it's actually need nice, like is olympic, by the way, the first mass performance or looks at ancon drug issue pic because people think epic is is, is a proof to awake loss IT is not IT is approved for clinically obese people to lose weight I am an olympic I love IT yeah because IT helps me with weight management but i'm not clinic.

You be hopefully yeah so and I think that the estimated number is that ninety percent of people who do epic are not clinic obese but they used IT for just convenient reasons. So and I think that is the first out of many um sort of drugs. And by the way, the interesting thing is to come back to what we set up beginning.

I think two things have happened the last ten years. The one is the trands movement, which really like change society fundamentally, how much authority we give the individual about their body up. But the second is money talks. And people are looking at loyang c and novel notice, and they added more than hundred fifty, thinking the meantime, more than two hundred billion dollar market. And suddenly farming industries is waking up and saying, maybe we were wrong, and I think they were wrong over the last thirty, forty years to just look at smaller and smaller ntia initial diseases instead of doing, by the way, what the industry is that all alone.

One thing which postle me biotic the last twenty years since a minute, because i'm doing take at the same time in take, the key word is total address the market, if somebody would come to you and say, hey, I have an APP which is great for forty thousand people in the world, you you would say you are yeah so, uh, but that were farmer did, oh, there is a reality sees which forty thousand people? That's great. Let's all go after, and I was always, why don't we go after medical drugs, which hopefully every human being can take.

Because I defy, for example, why i'm looking so much on longevity. Yeah, because we all age in in. So everybody wants to slow IT down, by the way.

Same with sec delic. Yeah everybody wants to be Better, happier. yeah. So I think we during this golden age of individual hand, then at the mongo in this talk, we talk a lot about sports and extreme versions.

But I think that even cooler thing to talk about, he said, I think enhancement, like making you bit smart up, making you a bit, not making you more muscles, whatever whatever you please to be. You have physically and mentally. I think we got a the farmer industry gonna a provide sort of medical drugs over the next.

And but this was the whole pitch for, like oxy cotton biscuits that you don't have to live with pain anymore. Why are we living in this paradise where people have to live with pain? And, well, ababa lot and like that. That is like how you produce the oppoa crisis, is that people like doctors .

were like real because .

hear bad product never been approved. I know, sorry, you can always find. I I get for me, it's like F, D, A, plus doctor, you can always find.

It's a little bit like you would say energy training is bad because there was and wrong. And one was a bad actor. Predal farmer was a very bad actor. Yeah, they did stuff they should have never done, but just because they did IT yeah I don't think nova notice is a .

backed right? It's like the every drug is here you look and not have a little .

bit of of of self sort of you need to have a little bit of responsibility of what you do in life. But I hear you. But again, I just want to point out that the the oppoa crisis didn't happen because we didn't know like there was a clear if you're go into the case, uh, purity farmer, the family behind the management clearly acted bad, acted and wrong, as did other very bad actors.

And that should be ponied. Ed, yeah, they should go to jail. I think, by the way, they they still allowed, like the second family, they should not be like that, should be heavily, heavily punished shed. But IT was a bad actor, and we shouldn't use one bad criminal group to make conclusions that I think of very .

rational other decisions. Well, we do have to wrap IT up. Um I am excited to see where this goes. I see with my self.

whenever you see me, I ve going to be more rip than me.

I want to go to the first games. We would love to report on IT.

Let's definitely do that.

I think that this is a conversation that is on going on. We decided to keep having IT. And uh, thank you for joining us.

Thank you for everyone.

My guys guy.

I didn't get my question that I wanted ask if there was gonna a psychiatric part of the games where the athletes like just took about beyon .

psychosis washing the games. That will be department. I'll do that. I'll i'll be on psychosis writing about the games. Um I think it's crazy how much i'm really divided on this kind of stuff.

I I want maximum freedom and for people, I want this to X I do want people they want to go doping and see how far they can really jump. I'm down for that. I also I don't I don't really see that O, P, O sort crisis coming.

I think IT was an interesting question to raise river, and I am worried. I think that people often don't. Wonder about the second order consequent of things like sudden mass legalization of steroids.

And we tend to think about IT from the perspective ove ourselves. And we are all very four people in this chat with jobs. And we like like we're like functioning members of society. But I always go back i'm going back again and again to that chart that I just saw. Um IT wasn't just alcohol.

IT was the same thing with with a sugar IT was similar Candy like most people who are by IT was like a small some age of the people who eat Candy eat almost all of the Candy um like we see this again and again and again in society with opp IT is very interesting because it's an addiction where he doesn't seem like the people like get hit randomly like some people just cannot handle most people who take hydro de on or something. There's a fraction of people who are mad and IT doesn't seem to have anything to do with uh class background is just a weird thing that happens. Um I don't see that necessarily happening with this, but something could happen. I mean, when you make a change that is that abroad is society, something will happen. But I mean this kind of thinking also would inhibit all progress you know period right if if you everything as a second order effect .

yeah I think just the I think the way you have to think about these things is like not how like how this would affect to be. It's like how would this effect like somebody with like a ninety five five who works like a blue collar job because like that is like the media in amErica and like you have to think about like how like it's going to affect somebody who's not going to like sit through like Lancer papers and like try to figure out how it's gonna fect them.

you know. But why that's why I agree with you that that's attention here. But we can build a society that caters to the ninety five I Q person that isn't that like that seems to be one of the biggest problems we're facing right now as a society that IT does cater to that. Like look at education. Why why is our wire public schools catering to the least the lowest performing people rather than the highest? What we can IT does IT seems that there there is a huge problem in um in building society that is trying to mitigate the damage that the dumb people in society will due to themselves and it's like we can really do that there there always going to do damage and if we if we wrap our world around them, I don't know how we progressed in any meaningful way whatsoever yeah at what I mean i'm just thinking .

about like the school is an existing cover turning terms of like risk, you know what I mean if you have like other another mass epidemic of drug addiction among like more glass people works on they like they could be very bad, you know, just force society as a whole. I can lead to all sorts of secondary social problems, you know um but I I mean I I kind of agree. I mean it's um I mean I take at all and I feel like IT helps me be Better my job and I would be pressure and take IT away from me. This is that I don't think that everybody should be on out, although yeah I mean, I think we should change the paradigm around at all .

like yeah yeah and they're definitely I said I think there are probably there aren't definitely people who abuse IT and are on IT and shouldn't be beyond IT because of what it's done to them. And IT was over. I believe that was overprescribed. And yet I mean, so it's it's a performance handing, performance hanchen drug. I think it's a great comparison actually.

I I almost brought IT up in the context of school you know like there was a question, the number in college people being like you shouldn't be allowed to be on, not me I wasn't at but they were like people should not be on at all because IT means that um everyone asked do atter all I everything that was like really stupid because I was acing everybody and I was not on atter al, you're just not doing you just not doing the reading like you get to read the reading and be fine probably um but if IT were a perfect truck, like if atrial didn't have all of these h exact plenty of side effects in um if you were perfect and and like you have to do IT to compete um on one hand is great because it's a perfect jug that makes you smarter or faster or Better but on the other like this, do we want to live in in a world where where everyone needs to enhance themselves in order to function in a day's b in competition with other people who are on IT? I guess we're not there yet. You know we're not there ah, but that's I guess that's like the kind of I don't even know what class of question this is. Is that a moral question or a philosophical conry? I don't what I don't know as I look like you have to say .

I think it's a practical question. And I think like river to your earlier point about you know, some people don't like a lot of people don't have the time to read landsat papers and decide what the best sort of dosing uh, region is for them if they're going to use performance enhancing drugs.

I think that's where really I think the analogy he made with the trans stuff is so interesting to me because one thing we've consistently seen with trans medicine, with legalized ing drugs and generals, when you legalize things, there is a huge up taken use. And so with a train stuff, it's interesting as like we ve essentially it's not but IT was necessarily illegal fifteen years ago, but there were not as many gender clinics and IT was not as readily accessible. And you've seen a huge uptake in use.

And I sort of wonder if there is a benefit to keeping things not regulated as weird that sounds in that you force people those who are like insistent that they want to use either performance enhancing drugs or in the case of trying stuff, cross x hormones. They go through black market channels. This is something people have done for know decades um and of course, there's side effects because people are doing them in not medical regulated context.

But I sort of wonder that I do think there has to be a consideration of like are the tradeoffs of people doing black market uh drugs for performance enhancing or you know whatever looks maxing reasons are they outweighed by the benefits or in the increased uptake? Ker, and all the second order consequences of that with legalizing. I I wanted .

push that slight. I agree with the the general direction of where you're going here, but it's not the legality, right? Of course, the trans have has been legal for a long, long time.

It's the Normalization. So IT IT was legal plus Normalized is when IT rather became a problem. And I think river, you mentioned on the open thing, IT was like IT was the encouragement of your doctor to do this. I ve got so many people on IT, which I think is correct.

And uh, in the case of the trans saying, it's like the encouragement you get all day on the media saying like this is Normal, like this is Normal thing you can do if you feel weird your body, you should do this. And that's a conversation we didn't have, even if five years ago, argus now been quite a while. But let's say, ten years ago, that conversation didn't exist.

So the only people going to these clinics were really, really, really disturbed with generalist position. So if anybody actually quote needs this kind of stuff, the people who needed IT were because they had to go through this like enormous. There was a social hit they had to take to do this thing.

Um and what he's talking about now started when we at this one point out this what what Christians is talking about is not just the legalization of these things because we don't they're not thought a lot of them are not legal right now at all. Um but there's an addition. It's that plus the additional thing of like should be validate zed this or should be noral Normalized or or various zed this. And I think that almost certainly leads to it's IT not all. There is no way that doesn't lead to a massive up taking people, Young men, probably without inner likelihood taking on doping just to go to the german and look a certain way which to Christian's point, he's like, that's great like I want to live in that world but is always we know that that is the world that we're entering and then then there is a question of, I guess, what that means.

Yeah I mean, in addition to like the brother like social contacts around trans, there is also a more like k keeping like by doctors where in order to get close somewhere, orm, you had to go through psychological evaluations. And mike, you really do like you had to really, really want IT and like convince a doctor that like you needed IT.

IT wasn't you know now you have like informed concept where they basically you just sign like a release former whatever. And IT wasn't like that before. IT was um a lot more intensive because it's such an extreme change that like you have to like the doctors felt like they were compelled to make sure that people actually do what they wanted. Like you don't mean and I think I on exact carlo with steroid because I mean you can stop taking steroids and my shading is that you know your body will sort of Normal a way that likes some all of the trans ff is permanent um but my interesting is there is issues. Um I don't know if it's a dozing thing, like you just take a low dose and you one fact you and but like issues uh with like fertility and um stuff like that, that could be long term and permit and like change the course of your life if you can't have kids because you do have sterilize in your twenties like that. Um I don't know, I think that something that people would need .

to think about really talking about is IT comes down for what i've read IT comes down to improperly dozing yourself. So if you fuck IT up, you can do serious damage to your body and um that falls into the classic libertarian pro drug category which is like if it's legal and you can go to your doctor and do IT in a clinical inc. Setting and um you know your risk from IT goes down.

Um but again, the consumption does go up and just we've see we know that it's going to go up. Um ah yeah I do want to move on in less spend. You have a last thoughts on of the ages of any last thoughts. We have a couple more topics to hit.

I keep thinking about what the television show will actually be that you. Of the enhance games. I imagine that there would be an awesome vehicle for pharmaceutical advertisements. Um you could be like this athlete is on X, Y and z cocktail and he's going against this athlete with a vy and sea cocktail who's gonna win.

This is sponsored by mark and nova notice and then you have athletes who are going to get sponsorships for particular steroids and performance in handing drugs on billboards and doing commercials. There may be some regulation that gets in the way of that. But um yeah I think IT in a world where um Christian and the enhance games is massively successful, the most successful that could ever possible bly be I think the culture totally follows that. And there's a whole new side let's opened up where um kids are interested in the latest um you know I don't know performance and have hands.

I will say the cultures is already done. I mean, we see this. You can look at the superheroes. Over the last fifteen years there has been a total transformation of the superhero male body and IT is hoped as hell. And you go to the gym now and people casually talk complete openness about steroid use, which is ubiquitous um to a certain extent we have we have gone the way of this stuff without even having a conversation about IT.

And so Christian is kind of doing something that could only possibly you know iron is doing something, Christians investing in something they are all kind of working on in this space that could only possibly happen um in a culture that was somewhat like already open to IT like we we're there, I think we're there and and right thing is true. I mean it's like we're talking about men becoming transmit really that's like no no one produces uh these hormones naturally at those because maybe someone to hercules, probably based on some guy from two thousand years ago, we actually did produce a freak amount of home of ma um but the average guy is not is not is not at that level. I want to talk about well, kin garg so tell me about san Frances goes woke the garden. I think the .

the the good segway actually is like here's an example we're talking about wanting to optimize uh and you know uh reward excEllence. And this world inderal ten is a good example of going in the opposite direction. I mean basically this is a story that sounds like something the aboon b would have written satirically, but it's actually real.

Um this barrier school district um hayward jet, a city in the ebay uh has essentially theyve hired a four profit organization at two years ago. They had to four profit organization using federal money to help them improve student attendance and test scores. And the organization they chose is called woke kindergarden. It's actually called woke kindergarten. They paid them two hundred and fifty thousand dollars for three year contract.

What s what year was this? Again.

this was two years ago. So I think IT IT was either twenty, twenty one or twenty two.

They knew Better .

at this point, is not well regarding, is designed to confront Whites prema y disrupt racism and oppression and they described themselves as a, uh, global abolitionist, early childhood ecosystem and visionary, creative, pure supporting children, families, educators and organizations in their commitment to abolishing ist early education and pro black and queer and trans liberation.

Managing procured at eight, six.

yeah. Well.

so who is that you been mean, like, how do you? I had this. I was on the god filld.

So not too long, maybe couple months, few month ago, in this question of like queer children came up IT was like a program in a school or like a pride thing in the school. It's like that does not. There are no, there is no fucking in such thing as a gay six year old.

Because to be gay you have have a sexuality and they are children. Like why? And then we wonder whether the hard right is like they're all groupers.

We will just stop teaching them about sex at age five. I don't get IT. Yeah I mean the .

well the kicker for the wok inder garden stuff which really is close as I mean the person who runs that is no binary. They have a sensory guide to protests for six year olds, which basically it's called. So you made IT to a protest. And like, here's what you might smell. You might smell tear gas and you might feel heat and you you might hear a chance.

solidarity. And I D I was .

just describing, the poster says, you might also feel things like solidity, power. yeah. I mean, we've got like woke wondering.

So these are posters they make for kids. I wonder, one of them is, I wonder if eradicate borders, how might we build our communities to include and support neighbors from all over the world? Um but the real I mean, the kicker for IT is two years into their three year contract with the school district, test scores have fall into record lows at this already under performing school. So the math proficiency score.

but test are just a construct of the White supreme es thinking. So know when a they've simply to colonized their minds at age five. I think they deserve some accused tes for that. Personally.

you should note to that the funds that the school district pulled from our federal funds are earmarked for improving student performance.

Yeah well so in stream stream performance and attendance um and yeah I mean, I guess one thing I wondered why they didn't redefine the tests themselves because yeah according to the oppressive test structures already in place, the sort of the premises test structures, only four percent of kids at the school are profession and math and under twelve percent of kids are at great level english proficiency. This isn't the bay area um so IT is pretty shocking by and say I hate .

to play a game of work wall, but this one is really agree um there the concept workers is super identity based and the big part of IT is like let's chAllenge the assumptions about our society that are inherently racist and like if something is if you are not succeeding at something um let's interrogate the system around you that's not allowing you to succeed and what not and separate from all of the salary.

Just like the introduction of the idea to these people who are people, these little kids who are already not six thriving uh the introduction of the idea that is like, they were not in control of their life, which is what as like the core of wall is like, you are not in control. The system is in control. That one idea, more than any of the other bullshit ideas, I believe, is a thing that tanks their grades, because you to seek the whole concept of like doing Better implies that you are in control of your life.

Um and what I would love to see your some some country of programs elsewhere, where is the total opposite is just like radical like IT doesn't matter where you're from. To a point where I mean I am aware that there are things that are out of people's control, but I would be really interested in a radical version of of the self control argument. They like ignores all differences, all actual constraints.

Like you could be a para poo logic there. Like I don't want to hear any fucking excuses like get out there and start running like I would love to see what that does to a class of people. Just IT will be IT will be interesting I think will be IT will be interesting. Some new data points um which we are decidedly be at a lack for who is a who.

The students in this vote condition is IT like rich, like the area kids who is IT like poor kids.

This is a predominantly um I believe it's primarily low income school. Two thirds of the kids are english learners, almost all his pal, latino kids, so lot of them english is their second language. Um like B L should.

That doesn't make any sense to me. I don't know.

Like what are they being up?

What are we abolishing with? I don't always like fuck me up with because I like you came here like you want to come here like .

it's IT does not count. There's no one allow to .

pain because they didn't come here about choice .

at the very least. 爷爷 的 不爱 cover 不 americans。 That story is complicated.

There are legitimate grievances that are obvious, that are that persists. I wouldn't say the grievances any longer will the grievances clearly persist. So I would say there is nothing systemic any longer in place.

However, like you can't deny that black americans on average are in uh a studio place that many other people and so there are I think it's fair to ask why I think they draw the wrong think the wall left, draws the wrong conclusions but completely on your side ever when he comes to the question of like how do how is the first thing that you do when you move here? Like complain about oppression, like why did you come? I don't get IT, I don't understand.

And like obvious, I am not blaming like the kids for that because are being like taught that bit like you did. Immigrant children especially should not be taught that because that hinders a simulation. Like, I mean, the masking kids that I grew up with, I mean, someone were like old school, like taxi, like the fails have been here for like generations, but observe, like their parents warm mexican immigrants and like, but when we graduate high school, they are just like bread necks, like everybody else. Because the amErica they hung out with, like all these ticks and like, that's just who they were yeah and like, so how I think like that, like actually his spanish actually be similarly very well if a you just treat them like Normal people instead of like telling them they have like a chip on their shoulder. Reasons I have nothing to do with america.

you IT is not surprising that you would have a group of people suddenly become suspicious of the system of everyone in the system is saying you, we're going to be so racist to you. Just F I like, like, you Better buckle up because people here and you like and then we're surprised of there. Like, dm, everybody here seems to hate us.

Like the friendly White person. Just set IT to them to their face like rabadan like that's crazy. Welcome to amErica like it's going to be be talk in brutal like no, that's yes, bad, bad news.

God, I wish everyone was as smart as us. Um let's talk about my last one for the day. I really do want to get about um I want about care swish.

Er uh cara had this phenomenal piece in new york magazine in which he talks about the evolution of the press generally, media generally, but the tech press in particular uh and there was this one really excEllent quote. Most teckel now doubling in the media are arrogant amateurs who think, because they sell in one area, they are masters of all domains. What they, what they really are is incomplete, giving any insider illumination beyond their own narrow self interests. While decidedly cheaping discourse um my first cut on this is like SHE swish er represents this really fascinating trend among the tech journalists um who are really kind of uh in endanger species.

You don't see too many of them anymore um but for years IT was like there was a gatekeepers of in tech these these are media people are gay keeping tech people from following other tech people on the question of tech and they're like, no, no, you can only follow these people over here who are appropriately discerning in critical of what you do and like industry at the conceptual level and that is just it's this weird thing that does not make sense in the context of the internet, which is why the high level fees of are not theses I guess this the ark of carribean, which was just her journey in tech and SHE opens up as like this hero who's telling all the newspaper guys like you're gonna go out a business unless you become digital first in ba blah blah um SHE paints herself as this tech forward thinker who understands the trends that are coming uh but while carroll was correct about what was wrong with the model, with the business, mol. The time SHE was totally wrong on what was right because he is sort of kim up SHE blew up in the new the era, which is totally gone now like nothing has been designated as badly as new media the people who rushed to the internet first, uh the sort of internet first presence and try to live on on advertising revenue online. But nothing was hit harder than that.

And now she's sort of again, fundamentally misunderstanding heavy internetworking. We don't need to listen to her thoughts on what's happening in tech. We can just ask the people who are working inside of the industry.

Now there are all sorts of ways where we need journalism, and we talk about them here. But this like commentary on track on tech themes, which is basically what SHE is. She's like an opinion person.

Um nobody cares. This is why she's not really than anymore at the end of the day. I mean, this is a person who's who is trying to explain to us what's happening in tech press.

What is he even SHE has a podcast that's what he has he has he has SHE is a woman with a podcast um he said another as hole with a podcast so are we as hole with podcast? Um there is no difference, cara. We're in the same swimming pool. I guess there is a difference. The difference is that cara represents um I guess an audience of primarily like media elite I people. These are the very people who gave her the new york magazine peace whereas you know we represent a large and growing audience of people who actually um just love what we're doing and working on which I am forever grateful for thank you guys are continuing to spread the good word. I don't know what you guys what you guys make of carriage journey um and and maybe just like the concept of of of media gatekeepers uh in these different nisha kind of um I mean clearly this write to me like eulogy and uh and I wonder if he even understood that um and she's miss a lot SHE can't possibly have missed that much though yeah I think there's .

like an enormous amount of cognitive distant on display in that article because he talks extensively about how much of an outsider SHE was at the journal when SHE first started. SHE was reporting on the internet and how he was talked down to by all of these established media reporters and then he literally says that in the article is sort of like snow by media reporter who talked down to her.

And then, you know, SHE goes off on techies who are overplaying their hand by, I don't know, blogging about what's going on their industry and it's IT. Is this kind of thing that I think often happens to people like her who begin as outsiders and then become the establishment right? Is like if you've built your brand on being an insurgent outsider, right, who's sort of know you're writing about the internet when no one's talking about IT or whatever, what do you do once you become the establishment?

I mean, do you have a kind of a reckoning with yourself and an honest assessment of like where you stand visagie the industry that you're discussing? Or do you and I think that's probably the the honest way to do IT um and in knowledge ment of like okay, I am now the establishment and maybe I should be aware of the position I I stand in right and how my influences weaning or you double down on this narrative that I get the newcomers suck basically and they're out of their their depth. Um it's not even do .

they look like not even do this. I even SHE says yes just I mean it's I I agree completely with everything excited is totally and in a phenomenal example of the disciples, um they don't just suck though the whole like sort of end of the peace is I mean he goes after all of these two companies for insufficient political censorship. SHE doesn't just hate the the people like us who are speaking and competing and winning in the game, by the way uh over her the old guard, who you know really not relevant all anymore, other than when he pops up to say something that I think is unna like this um SHE wants to actually prevent IT. He wants to use the government to stop IT. And so is is this kind of like tragic story of a women who, while he was wrong about what was right, he was early to the internet trend, and he was probably dislike really cool Younger person who be all would have liked to a certain extent, like, I mean, SHE SHE was he was writing about interesting things SHE was doing something that wasn't so popular as you said he was being SHE was speaking up to the sort of old, stuffy stage immediate people at the time um but but her story is so much more tragic than just becoming irrelevant like she's actually she's like the scared old woman now who's so frightened Donald troud binion mosque that he wants he wants to become like an authoritarian an is like contrary completely to that that the youthful freedom oriented internet eo like she's just become the the man like the the bad guy and um I feel in a way bad for her because um it's a sad way to conclude what could have been like a pretty interesting. Compelling legacy that we look back on finally but now is just like she's just one of the other ones and it's like that .

sad and she's complaining about like the loudest voices on social media and IT and whenever ver people start complaining about that, that means that they are not good at to water is basically yeah like the only people I ever even complain about this sort of think or people who are not very good at marketing themselves in social media. I think that like SHE sees kind of the writing on the wall a little bit and yeah, as you are kind of about hinting at sheet of turned into her old editor at the beginning, like this person who like doesn't see what's coming and like, uh, I I don't know .

what I thinks that even the idea that you would go after the sort of direct model, conceptually, the idea of tech, of tech workers talking to tech workers, that's just contrary not to like the present moment they were and that's contrary at last ten years um you know that is contrary to a trend that's been obvious for a very long time. And uh it's it's just it's taught it's a betrayal of her ignorance and she's a super arrogant person which. I don't know. I kind of like in a person sometimes, honestly.

Yeah, i'd like her. So was I think she's a teaser writer. Like, I like her, like lesbian, like bravado kind of like, I don't know he is like I find her charming a little bit. But I mean, SHE trump broker SHE became historical yeah and I think many such cases.

I think IT was bad for a while. I think trump really, really, really agree with you to completely ruin her because it's all you can think about now. Um I also I just think the future of media .

is interesting .

and if you're not interested in IT in you just kind of mad about IT, then you can't possibly be part of the future and um all that says is like that like the end of something and uh and IT was fitting that IT was in new york magazine right because like whoever reads that unless something goes viral like this to make fun of and that's it's like you just SHE continues to pick the wrong side IT doesn't have to because it's like your your internet. I will say one ah I will say one last thing um that I thought was really interesting a you ever you are saying people get frustrated that when there are loud voices they say like the loud voices online and that really just means that bit twitter. Um I agree.

I think maybe the lag here, the reason is taken her so long to realize what was obviously in front of all of us, which is this trend to new media, the trend to direct t like what actually is happening online right now, the end of new media, the rise of what I like, I guess you would say description based on things like this ah which is a trend that started years ago with like ban from techy and the information again, this has been happening for a while. SHE was blinded to a lot of this because he thought he was popular on twitter. He had over a million followers years ago.

And what was happening at that time was twitter, every time you signed up for the platform, would recommend people to follow and and I would include people like if you were in tech and you've falls some tech account that be like care swish er and there are a handful of VC that never actually had a successful venture deal, but they were on twitter. And so have these brands is like people who mattered in venture and they never didn't be still done, but they got a lot of followers. And um I also believe just based on the on the way things changed, following the um the I guess slashing of the number of people who are at twitter and they could do log sort of feed things.

We're got rid of training topics. We ve got rid of the curated topics. We got have a lot of those push notified erb are the suggestions, recommendations and things like this.

I think that there was an artificial implication of the like, correct voices. IT wasn't just sensor ship. I think IT was like a territory that there are curious on twitter who are pushing content.

And I think IT gave people like care of false sense of of popularity on the platform. And so what they're really mad about, what the ella musk over more than anything else, is like they lost their secret sauce um it's funny. I've seen some of them claim the other thing was true.

They claimed elan came and appliqued all these bad people. And that's not what happened. What happened was all of the rules were flattened, suddenly was a level playing field, and popular content rose at the top and unpopular content died.

And careers content is is is not popular. So that this is this is this is what she's feeling. And the reason she's writing about IT now rather than then is because it's kind of taken her a while to feel that um because she's been heard her own sense of the internet has been historic for so long.

Brand actually you you have to have I mean, I I want to wrap up, but I I do want to give you some time here. I kind of reflect on this because you in in the game for a while from the very beginning new media, I know you want us to write that book um that ben Smith came in rod head, you are traffic. What do you .

think .

I found the peace. strange. A lot of ha logic is just super thin. There's a quote from IT in their place came an army of fleas clad adult, mostly White men. You feel like if you revert to saying somebody y's skin color, your arguments already pretty like not flushed out enough with mostly light men. Some things are entering whose knowledge of media and history, most important, what IT took to keep a democracy humming was dangerously thin.

And it's just a strange way of advocating for higher quality information, which I feel like your job as a journalist or something that that is interested in the media is to do. You should be on the side of sort of a truth with with higher violence, let's say. And so she's arguing that the people who are the closest to the truth, which are the people creating the products, building these things because they don't have enough knowledge of media, you shouldn't listen to them.

Instead, you should listen to somebody who knows more about media, but isn't as close to the truth. IT just seems like very strange to me what she's arguing. And and I think IT broadly dest reveals the fact that she's not really talking about what she's saying, if that makes sense.

think she's really talking about there.

She's worried about her position that that she's worried about the old guard and the um the incubate position. And and I think like you said, IT does seem like eulogy IT seems like a sort of death at all regarding the I don't know that the transition away from traditional media yeah .

I was IT I mean, on the White guy thing to speaking as a White guy, I found the defensive um I don't care I I think it's she's White and like what do you like? How much logger to? We ought to endure this trend of why people talking about, how about why people are.

And like, if worked for these White people, other people like me, a White person would have a real shot around here carrer swish er is also extraordinary ily wealth SHE comes from family money. She's talked about to herself. She's like a one I don't know, shea, one percent, but she's fuck in rich, richer than me.

My dad was a construction. My mom was a teacher and special ed. And she's going to tell me about my privilege. I don't want cara just be a Better writer that's IT just be a Better writer or go away and that sounds like he is gonna away. So in stock .

about democracy, when you really just mean establishment politics too, there's another one that annoys me.

Yes, I mean, she's like, it's like the latest thing and that's what dripping out of this piece is just like she's a typical rich girl who was like a SHE want to be a little bad as and pretend that he was his outsider. But SHE comes from family. Well, SHE grow in printed and now SHE don't you probably fire? I don't know SHE I like SHE worked when your time anymore.

But it's like SHE has descended the ranks of of of the most of leaders, institutions in the world. And now she's mad that other people who are not from that world are doing Better than he is at the job that he supposed to know the the most about. And um I don't know suck to suck but thank you for your service.

He once said I was a great writer, even though was a bad person. And he saw was a bad person machine imply IT just like but like he can write though I was a tweet I loved IT IT did mean a lot to me actually and um yeah thoughts and prayers so guys, it's been real. Uh, go home, get doped up.

Come back and I want to see ten thousand words on the future of media rate review subscribed. Tell all your friends. Thank you guys for hanging out with us again. Have a great weekend. Um it's been real.