BONUS CONTENT | Making Episode 1 - Shambler From the Stars
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Alright, how do we start this thing? Yeah, I mean, this sounds pretty good. You rolling? I am rolling. Alright, well, ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, thanks so much for joining us this evening, or this morning, or tomorrow afternoon. I guess it doesn't matter in podcast land. We are here, Curious Matters, behind the scenes, episode 101. So anything that you are curious about out there, we're going to try to answer your questions, because damn it, it matters. You just named the show.

It's Curious Matters because the main show is Curious Matters.

So this is Curious Matters. See? You figured it out. There you go. We were trying to figure out what to name the bonus material, and there it is. Curious Matters. This is why I firmly stand behind my belief in life that you should never put any advanced effort into anything. It's magic because it happens in the moment, baby. So definitely in the future, we want to hear from you. This week, well, we just launched a week ago, so only a few hundred people have listened to it so far.

but we want to hear from you. So definitely reach out at either info at curiousmatterpodcast.com or you can reach me at Jonathan at curiousmatterpodcast.com and we will answer your questions on these extra bonus shows. We'd much rather be answering your questions, really digging to light. Otherwise, you're going to

find out a lot of useless facts like eight out of ten members of the Wu-Tang Clan are actually vegan, which is obviously not what we're here to learn today. So why don't we circle back and focus on the important stuff? I am good with a microphone in my basement alone. And when it comes to something like this, you are the necessary ingredient to whatever this spicy salsa is going to be. Well, there you go. Let's put some pepperoncinis in this thing.

All right, well, let's get to the basics. First of all, John, I've known you since I think I was 14 years old. First of all, I want to thank you for inviting me on this curious adventure. Refresh my memory because I drink a lot. How the hell do we know each other? Well, we met in high school when I showed up at Tolgate my junior year. Let's go Titans. I know. Oh, you know what? It was the second semester of sophomore year.

Sure. In Warwick, Rhode Island at Tolgate High School. Yeah, I'm sure their Facebook page just got two more likes right now, so go Titans.

So, yeah, we've known each other for a long time. In fact, we had previously tried to work together on another theatrical production that did not quite make it. This is true. This podcast might be 20 plus years in the running for finally accomplishing something. But, hey, it's not for lack of effort.

But yes, John and I do go back many years. I was quite flattered when he called me up to do some silly and fun-loving voices for this. And then just through the experience of recording a couple background characters, I got into it right away. So when he called me up and I don't know why I'm talking about you in the third person considering you're staring at me right now. But when you called me up to ask me to jump on this, the curious matters after hours, dare I say, I was happy to do so. So first of all, thank you for that.

I'd love to know just because I recognize some of the faces from the website. www.curiousmatterpodcast.com. We'll try that again. Yeah. Edit www.curiousmatterpodcast.com. The point is by episode five, our podcast website plugs are going to be solid.

Cool. They're going to be great. But anyway, so I was ruminating and rummaging around said website, and I saw some faces I recognized. But can you tell me about some of the other members of the troop that you've recruited? How did you get them to drink the Kool-Aid? I called them and said, hey, it's been a while since I've written something that I'm actually going to produce. You want to show up in my basement and record some crazy lines?

And they said, yeah, and they showed up. And there are two things that are incontrovertible facts here in Los Angeles. Every fall, the damn city burns down, as it did today when I was trying to get here. And two out-of-work actors are always willing to do stuff for next to nothing. That's true. So thank you for giving us all a voice and a medium. But they're quality out-of-work actors. Actually...

Phil Gray just got a great part. He's not out of work anymore. There we go. I can't announce what he did. I'll let him announce. Well, isn't that a curious matter? Tune back in for the Behind the Seeds episode 107 when we announce what Phil is actually doing. Yeah, what TV show Phil's on. So when you, as far as, you know, obviously you have personal relationships with these various other people in the troupe. Was there...

Was it kind of just, you know, reaching out to friends and colleagues and people you respect? Was there really a calculated plan in assembling the troupe or was it a little bit of both? I've been trying to put together a scripted podcast for a long time. And I recently did a wonderful writers group at the $10 or less bookshop in Northridge, California, the Door Writers Group. It's freaking amazing. And...

we dedicated the first episode to that bookshop and you should check it out. I've been wanting to do a scripted podcast for a long time. I've been writing screenplays and recently short stories and I'm working on a novel and I just wanted something that I could see through from beginning to end and really just bring to audiences. And I honestly didn't know how I was going to do it. I just kind of

started writing and then started recording. I did most of the voices in the first episode. You guys will get episode two in a week. And there are quite a few, quite a few more voices in it. This wonderful ensemble that we've started to put together, the troupe, is going to be coming back week to week and playing the different various voices as we start going through the different pieces of content that we're going to be producing in season one. But really, you know, it was, I

I just turned to friends to begin, and every person that I called to be part of it said yes, yes, yes, and they're all amazing actors. So I'm excited for people to get to hear their performances over the season. Excellent. I will, you know, I certainly don't want the entire length of this interview to be glad-handing and high-fives, but credit where credit's due, when you originally sent me the very rough

cut of the first episode as I was listening to it in traffic braving the tune hour and 47 minute drive here to Reseda from where I live. I was quite surprised when you informed me that that was all of you on the first episode and I think A, that's a compliment to your vocal range and work but B, also to the work that you're doing behind the scenes with the computers, with the equipment that you have because

I really thought I was jumping on board with something where there were already 10 different characters and voices and people that were in it. And then when you told me that, I was like, all right, he's full of shit. And then as I was preparing for this interview today and re-listening to the finished product of the first episode, I really had to listen. And I was like,

oh, damn, that is John. Oh, damn, that's John too. I completely, and again, I know it was a rougher cut, which maybe is an even bigger compliment. The first time I listened to this, I thought there were at least three or four different actors on it. Thank you. Personally, I'm a little worried about you talking to yourself so much, but professionally, my compliments are well done. John, I guess my first real question is now that we're kind of

You know, hopefully everybody's got to hear the first episode. They've got a little interest piqued on certainly the characters and the stories and the production value, which I'd really like to discuss all of those things. But let's really start at the basics. What is Curious Matter? Why is the title appropriate? I mean, when you came up with Curious Matter, what in your mind are you trying to accomplish with this entire little endeavor? I am an avid fan of...

science fiction, fantasy, horror. I have been my whole life and have stacks of heavy metal magazine. I've voraciously read Heinlein through my youth. I just love...

I love the stories that have really been the basis for our entire media landscape right now. I mean, science fiction, fantasy, and horror are the mainstream. But the authors that really were the trailblazers were...

in doing this often are not really remembered. I mean, there's modern contemporary authors that everybody knows like Neil Gaiman and you've got George R.R. Martin. You've got all these amazing contemporary writers, but the people who really paved the way aren't as heard about as much anymore. And so I thought...

I do want to have this anthology eventually deal with contemporary authors' works as well, but there's so much amazing work that also happens to be in the public domain that is from these authors that just aren't...

really being focused on anymore. And their stories are really relevant. Their stories are really current. And I mean, they need a little polish to take the, you know, to take the 1960s-ness or the 1950s-ness or the 1940s-ness off of it. But, you know, these guys like Heinlein and Block and

and Asimov and, um, like more the people that we're going to be focusing on. I mean, these, these people, they never saw, most of them never saw, uh,

wealth in their life. They were doing this because this was their passion. They were writing short stories and novels. The short stories were going into pulp magazines. And then in their lifetimes, they were mostly forgotten about. I mean, even Philip K. Dick, who were going to ultimately be doing a story from Philip K. Dick coming up after this horror trilogy that we're doing right now. You know, he was largely unrecognized in his lifetime. It wasn't really until after he passed away and others started recognizing that his work's

could be adapted into these really amazing or really potent modern tales that he started becoming famous. I think right now, especially where we are, there is so much disconnect from story to story, but more importantly, from storyteller to storyteller, which is crazy because there's more forms of media than there have ever been. There's more forms to ingest

stories, but everybody's kind of painted themselves into these little boxes. And as I was starting to research the few authors that, you know, you've put on my radar so far, and you know, some of them, it's funny. You're like, oh yeah, Lovecraft. Yeah. I know the name. I don't know anything from a hole in the wall. Then I start reading about the two things that fascinate me is all of these people told the stories that led to the story that led to a movie that I fricking love. Right. And part two is

in some way, shape or form, they were all connected in the sense, you know, to your point, you already said, it's not like these guys were rolling in dough and making a lot of money. They were thrilled when anything even got published, but there was a respect and an inner circle where they were not only feeding off each other, they were inspiring each other. They were protegeing each other. They were looking for the next Padawan. And I feel like that brotherhood, that nobility, that kinsmanship was,

is rare now. And when you find it, it's usually the trickle down of a trickle down of a trickle down of a trickle down of someone who loved these authors. And that's definitely been something that, you know, in my limited experience in coming on board with this project has been so fascinating to learn about. Well, those magazines were communities. I mean, Weird Tales, Amazing Stories, If, Analog. I mean, the...

And those people conversed with each other. They were colleagues. They were collaborators. I mean, that was their connective tissue. So it's funny that they're all contemporaries, but they all may not have known each other in person, but they knew of each other and they all fed off each other. And I mean, in the case of Lovecraft, I think he wrote like 100,000 letters in his lifetime that we know about. I mean, he was...

He worked his mailman. Yeah, insomniacs with a pen. I respect it. I get insomnia and I end up playing Cascade or Pandas on my phone all damn night, so I'd call this guy a little more productive with his inability to get a good night's sleep. Yeah, there's a lot more you can do creatively when you're not completely distracted. Exactly. Did you know the unicorn is the national animal of Scotland?

Little known fact. I do now. There you go. There was something you touched on that I want to circle back on, A, because I think for fans of podcasts and B, for other potential podcasters, not that we want to give away all of our secrets. Two words lit up in my mind that you said as a fellow producer, public domain.

This to me sounds A, like a challenge because you don't quite know what you're working with, but B, wonderfully affordable. It is wonderfully affordable. You spend so much time looking for an opportunity to make something and it all just clicked recently that this was something that I could do and it would be sustainable because, you know, I love writing serial content and

But with being a new father, I thought that breaking this out into individual stories that I already had the utmost respect for, but that were established plots and established stories that I could develop into stories.

you know, modern retellings was going to allow for just sustainability to really bring the audience something really interesting and really novel, but also be something that I could do week to week.

So, I mean, you know, we've mentioned a couple names so far. Dick, Block. Let me start that again. We mentioned a few names so far. Block, Dick. Still doesn't sound good. Dick, Block, Lovecraft. It's like the 86 Bears team. Did public domain come first? Did the authors come first? How did you kind of arrive on the people you knew you wanted to produce? Block and Lovecraft, the starting with them is really personal. Not Dick. Not Dick.

Well, I mean, Philip K. Dick, the stories are very connected to growing up. But I knew that I wanted to start out in horror. I knew that I wanted to start out in this Lovecraftian setting. And Haunter in the Dark was the first Lovecraft story I ever read. We went to high school in Rhode Island, California.

But I'm not from Rhode Island originally. I'm from California. Matt Hoban was born and raised in Rhode Island. Rumor and conjecture. We're still not sure. But H.P. Lovecraft, as he said, he's I.M. Providence. His influence on that city is really amazing. And as I was in high school, I discovered, one, that he existed and that his works were amazing. And I read Haunter in the Dark, and I just loved it.

Because, I mean, I hadn't read anything like that before. There weren't really movies that existed in that kind of noir-esque, like super dimensional horror genre yet. It just hadn't really been touched on in the mainstream media. And I just loved it. So when I knew that we were kicking this off, I knew that I wanted to start with that as one of the first stories because it was where I started. It was one of the things that...

you know, really started me on my storytelling journey. And it was also something that I read at one of the most kind of important growth periods in my life, like high school in Rhode Island. And it was a really important time because it was when I really decided to be a creative. And that, you know, I just, that story just means so much to me that I've thought, you know, you know, it's not necessarily the most dynamic, most,

twisty-turny of stories, these first two. But there's something really compelling about them. They're creepy as all F, and they're just fun. And I thought, okay, I can use this. This can be my kickoff. I know how to adapt these and make them really fun, and they mean a lot to me. So we'll start with that, and I know that I can deliver this. So that's why we started there. Interesting thing about the book

The public domain thing, getting back to your actual question. It's about time. Okay. So obviously, licensing stories can be expensive. And going to these writers who are in the public domain meant that I could continue doing this stuff. But what I didn't realize as I started my research is that

Prior to 1964, the rules for copyright in the United States were that you got 28 years. If you filed your copyright, it was for 28 years, not this 90 plus year scenario that we're in now. And that you could extend it for another 28 years, but you had to file a mandatory copyright extension in the 28th year. Which I'm guessing was not something that these guys were...

Painstakingly tracking. A lot of these guys didn't have a lot of money. It was expensive to keep copywriting this stuff. But so their copyrights would be done by the magazine, right?

And then they could choose to extend the copyright of the magazine down the line themselves and extend their copyright. So they could take the story out of that magazine and extend that single copyright with an extension. The interesting thing is most people didn't know about it, I guess, or didn't do it. Well, for short stories and things that were submitted to publications, it's like one in ten people.

was renewed. When it comes to books, it's really like maybe three in 10. And people didn't know about this because nobody had really digitized the catalog of copyright books into digital form. They had been scanned a long time ago and you pen in some other places and put them online. But recently, as I found out in a Vice article actually, is that the

They, uh, the New York public library recently got a grant to digitize the renewal records and basically combine, figure out a way to combine them, um, into a single searchable registry. Now this isn't available right now, but knowing this information, I started looking at the resources that did exist and knowing that I wanted to do Haunter in the Dark. I, I remember that there was that Haunter in the Dark was actually a sequel to Robert Block's story, Shambler, uh,

From the stars. It's the first episode, John. I can't believe you forgot the name already. It's the Shambler from the stars. Shambler from the stars. I know. Anyways, Shambler. So I knew about Shambler and I started discovering it. And as I was doing my research, it turns out that there was no renewal record. And I had to do the research myself on that one. So please don't sue me.

I do have proof that this is the case. Again, my name is Matthew Tobin. It's T-O-B-I-N if there is a litigious person listening on the other end. He's more Google-able than I am. Stop reading my YouGoogly. So just to summarize, you're dealing with authors, obviously, of great talent and renown. Really, the most important thing is how the hell do you take these stories, keep true to what the author was trying to accomplish and make them your own, which I think...

is the entire point of this podcast and why I hope we're going to be drawing a lot of fans toward it. Because certainly, you know, in reading Shambler from the Stars, the original block rendition... Try that without the scream, because I'm going to edit that part out. Oh, backpedal, backpedal, reverse. The hills are alive with the sound of rich people's houses burning down. So, when we're dealing with the actual first episode, the Shambler from the Stars, the original...

Now, this was from a magazine, is that correct? Weird Tales? Yeah, it was from Weird Tales, September 1935. That sounds right, from the research I collected. September 1935. Yeah. I mean, certainly not a word count, I won't hold you to it, but I mean, we're talking about a many page...

Well, you know... I mean, it's certainly still a short story, but... It's another reason why Shambler was a great start. It's relatively short. It's, you know, it's really only a few pages. Haunter is longer. It was contained because it's, you know, I wasn't sure I was going to put it together. So it was a great test bed to figure out what I wanted to do with it. It's a great story, you know,

Robert Blake, as he's named in these, was not Robert Blake originally. He was the unnamed protagonist. And not the same Robert Blake. No, no. Not Murder Blake. No, not Murder Blake. Wonderful coincidence. Yes. All right.

This was Robert Blake was named after Robert Block, but in the sequel, he was given a name. So in the first story, he was the nameless protagonist and the other character that dies in the first episode was modeled after H.P. Lovecraft. And so neither of these characters had names in the first story. So I took the name from Haunter in the Dark, which is the continuation of the story and when

Lovecraft gives the unnamed protagonist his name and Robert Blake being very, very similar to Robert Block.

But the character played by Lovecraft never got a name. So I went and I used a name that Lovecraft had given himself in other stories. Randolph Carter kind of was a stand-in for himself in his stories. So I figured that was pretty apropos, considering the character was an homage to him. Nice. And, you know, if you were to take the magazine and this podcast side by side, I'm assuming there's going to be some parallels and some creative license. Yeah.

I tried to stick pretty close in the first couple stories. They are lovely in that they take place in a time and a location that no one really knows. No one really remembers. So I have the creative license to make that time feel like pretty much anything, and it's believable. The...

It's very close to the original story. I didn't veer too far outside the lines because I just wanted to see, can I be really honest to a story that's mostly first-person journaling and make it compelling and interesting, as interesting as I feel it is in a dramatic format? Yeah.

So I think it worked. Yeah, I could not agree more. I wouldn't be here asking questions about it. And this one is, you know, certainly not meant to be a jab, but you feel this was also kind of a perfect training wheels episode to launch the podcast. I mean, you've got a relatively self-contained story. There's a lot of interesting commentary going on in the story. You don't have to take too much creative license to it. Was this kind of like hitting a home run off a tee?

Yeah, it was a softball. But it was a softball that I thought people would really love. For our fans that don't know Robert Block, Blake Block, whichever one you want to go with. Block is the real name. Block is the real name. Blake is the fake. Tell me about his relationship with Norman Bates.

Well, he's the creator of Norman Bates. What? I know. So, yes, he later, he wrote Shambler very early in his career, super early in his career, and later went on to very much change his style and was inspired by Ed Gein, right? Yes, Ed Gein.

Gain or gains? I always forget. I know, that's what I'm trying to say. Point is, he killed people, and I'm pretty sure his house is now available on an HGTV show. That's probably true. Murder with a mortgage? So block...

Block very much went on to develop his own style later. This first story is very much an H.P. Lovecraft style writing. But when he did, he started to focus more on serial killers and Ed Gein at the time was...

some notoriety and as he's now gaining notoriety again on Mindhunter, which you should watch because it's awesome. And he developed Psycho. And, you know, Psycho was the story about a young, charismatic, elusive serial killer and very similar to Ed Gein.

And it became, I don't know that it was a hit, but Alfred Hitchcock found it and decided that they were going to adapt it and made their amazing classic horror film. Well, and it kind of goes back to what I said at the beginning of this, you know, truly there really are only four or five stories. And when you track these things back, I mean, you've got...

you know, to your point, his original works were much more Lovecraft because you fake it till you make it. And you, you, you know, write in the voices that you love until you find your own voice. And certainly this author adapted and evolved. Psycho comes along, which obviously leads to falling into Alfred Hitchcock's lap. And one of his most iconic films, Ed Gaines is now back in this loop again. Certainly Hannibal Lecter has always kind of been connected to that Ed Gaines character. So, you know, you're,

Kevin Bacon-ing seven degrees of Kevin Bacon going from some of the best horror movies that are out right now, even the stuff Jordan Peele's doing, all the way back to the, you know, Shambler for your podcast.

All art is a lineage. I mean, painting, music, storytelling. You know, you keep saying there's four or five stories and there's a limited number of plots maybe. But the thing that I love about sci-fi, fantasy, and horror is that there's an infinite number of worlds. This is where the creativity really shines because drama, those scenarios are mundane. Those stories are told in a mundane way. But when you translate them into these

and times, these like what if stories, like I said in the intro to the first episode, they take on this completely different form and they become something that I honestly think we need more of. Just imagination is such an important part of, I think, growing in this world that we're in. I don't know. This is taking a weird tangent. But, um,

I think that it's like the sci-fi fantasy and horror taught me that I could come up with the craziest thing. And whatever the fantasies of my own mind were, if I followed them and I walked through them with the perspective of what does it mean to be in this? What does it mean to experience these things? You can tell these really unbelievable things.

and fantastic stories. And there's an infinite amount of combinations that can be put together to create these worlds that are, you know, wholly unique. Like any business, it takes a lot to put together a podcast. You need a website, a logo, someone to write your ad copy. You might even occasionally need somebody to record voiceover and pretend to be a crazy cult leader. Thank the lucky stars there's Fiverr.

Fiverr is the world's largest freelance services marketplace. You need graphic design? They can help you find the perfect designer. Website creation? Check. Marketing services? Check. They can even help you find someone to edit your podcast. Just go to www.curiousmatterpodcast.com slash Fiverr and click on the link. That's Fiverr with two R's. Find the talent you need on your budget today. We hope you're enjoying the podcast.

We are committed to bringing you amazing experiences in the worlds of science fiction, fantasy, and supernatural horror. Help Curious Matter keep going by subscribing on the podcast platform of your choice and rating us with five stars today. It really does make all the difference. This show is lovingly produced in my basement in Reseda, California. You can hold the Karate Kid jokes right there. Each episode can take as much as 100 hours to produce, and we can't do it without your help.

So if you can, please consider supporting us on Patreon at patreon.com slash curiousmatter and to get some cool perks in the bargain. Thank you for spending your time with us.

These people were penning amazing stories at a time where, not to say it was completely in the dark or the back alleys, but it certainly wasn't mainstream circulation. And the irony is not lost to me that right now we are actually two nerds in a basement talking about this, but the sci-fi horror comic book genre is no longer just for the nerds in the basement anymore. When you look at the most blockbuster hitting movies, the fact that the horror genre is

is the most profitable genre in cinema right now because the movies are still so affordable to produce.

And they're raking at the box office. Everybody is looking into this now. There's, you know, elves and dwarves have been in the commonplace for 15 years now. There's more D&D parties going on than Drunken Ragers. I know. It's a very popular type of podcast. The Revenge of the Nerds is finally coming out, so I completely understand why you're digging into it. And little known fact, Captain Crunch's real name is Horatio Magellan Crunch.

That's my nerd fact. I'll take your word for it. You can GTS. You can Google that shit. So, you know, all you Jersey Shore kids out there that are more worried about Jim Tan laundry, you know, the chickens have come home to roost because the world, you know, for better or worse in the woke culture and everybody who's got a bit of a stick up their ass with some of the stuff, I got to say, I do love that this is...

Safe isn't even the right word. This is the most supportive and encouraging time to be weird and to Comic-Con your ass off and be crazy. And I, you know, I think an homage to these authors is appropriate and

More so than just appropriate, it's needed. Yeah. Because, you know, the evolution of these stories and these characters, you know, they did start somewhere. And one thing I wanted to touch on when I was doing some research, this whole idea of the master and the apprentice and passing on these stories and this relationship that Block and Lovecraft had with each other.

You know, to me, obviously, you always go, you know, as my nerddom goes, I go Jedi. And it's always, you know, the apprentice eventually kills the master. To give some backstory on Block and Lovecraft, there's plenty of information online about this. But Block was very young and he managed to start a pen pal relationship with Lovecraft. And Lovecraft really encouraged him to write, to look at

taking his work and trying to put it into a professional form. And with his support, um, Block got a few of his early stories published. Uh, I think most of them were actually in Weird Tales also. And, uh, the two of them struck up a friendship, but you know, Lovecraft had this really amazing circle of collaborators, circle of friends that all kind of played in the same sandbox. And, um, he encouraged Block to, to play in that sandbox. Um,

In 1935, Block was publishing his fifth short story and he wrote Shambler and he dedicated it to Lovecraft and included characters for himself and his mentor in the story. And he killed his mentor's character. So ironically, you know, a year later, Lovecraft writes a sequel and dedicates it to Block and

But the thing that I find most interesting about all of this is that that was H.P. Lovecraft's last short story. There was definitely a passing of the torch in this. And these two stories represent the beginning of one legend and the last story of another. And there's something poetic in that. And though these stories were maybe on the simpler side from an adaptation standpoint, there is a definite...

of the guard in these tales. And I don't know that they've ever been unified into a single dramatic form. So that's kind of cool. And I just thought, you know, we're going to start this new adventure. Let's take a set of stories that really represented the

Well, I like that, the idea of handing off the baton of actually passing from one generation to the next. So what better place to jump in? And I may not have the cerebral physiology down accurately, but if we could pass from your

Left brain to the right. I want to talk a little less about the creative now and more about the actual making of this podcast. How are we doing this? Okay. Yeah, I guess the simplest thing is, you know, when you first... Jumping from, hey, I have this really cool idea. I'm going to get my friends involved. Here's some stories and things that I love to... I'm now sitting hour after hour in the basement like...

Were you surprised by the level of commitment? Let me take a step back. What has proved to be the most challenging to get the first episode where you wanted it to be? I wouldn't say that it's challenging. I think the challenging thing is just figuring out what my process is. And this has been a great test bed. So for people who don't know, I'm a professional video editor that I write on the side and I do a lot of stuff, but I make my most...

money as a professional video editor. So for me, now, do you ever, do you ever have to encounter audio when video editing? Cause it seems like they could be two different worlds. I mean, storytelling, storytelling. And the thing that I did is I'm very fast in Adobe premiere and avid. So instead of cutting this in pro tools, those are not sponsors by the way. So if you're listening, send money. Yeah.

So instead of cutting it in an audio program, I decided I was going to cut the initial edits in Premiere because I can move really fast. And so this process is for me...

I give myself three days to adapt a 20-page script. I usually have an idea about what I'm doing before I start it. And then record in a day or two and try to turn around a first cut in about 40 hours. I mean, that's a lot for a podcast. I mean, we're talking 100 hours minimum to make a podcast ultimately come together. But in terms of doing what is essentially a half-hour drama every two weeks...

Um, we're turning them around pretty fast. So it's just about time on keyboard. And the nice thing is that I am taking on as many roles as I can, but you know, without ever trying to sacrifice the quality of the performances, but it does mean that I can iterate quickly. And so if I don't like something, I can rerecord it. And then, um,

I get to really, even though I'm doing really fast work, I am, um, I'm able to revise on the fly. And then once all that's together, it gets moved over to the, to the audio program for mix and master. Um, but it's, yeah, working in Premiere is actually, I've found to be

really beneficial because you, you, you just edit a different way in a, in a video editing system and you can really craft the way you craft a drama or a film. And that's been helpful. Uh, two follow-up questions on that. And I'm going to put your feet to the fire cause those socks are hideous and I want the honest answers. Uh, first of all, did you know that on average it takes 142 licks to get to the center of a Tootsie Roll Pop?

I did know that one. All right, cool. Someone's got higher education. But there is a polish, a panache, a quality that you have established in episode one that unfortunately now you're going to have to maintain. And I mean this as no disrespect to my other podcaster and brother and sister or whatever you may go by. But is the level of professionalism what you're looking at to set

this apart from other podcasts beyond obviously the storytelling itself? Like, do you have any particular goals out there when you're putting this together of, you know, having that upper echelon, having that polish? Because I mean, to me, when I listen to it, this doesn't sound like a podcast. It sounds like the audio track of a film.

That's exactly what I want it to be. I want it to be seamless. Well, then nice job. You got that one right. Well, thank you. I mean, that's the goal. I mean, I think it's, that's the bar that we're going to keep trying to set on the show is that, that people can sit down and they can listen to these stories and that there's no, there's none of those little things that just reminds you that you're right.

not watching a movie or not immersed in a complete and whole experience. It's not limited in the fact that it's audio only. It's actually enhanced because, um,

If you do it right, and I love great audio dramas, if you do it right, they're bigger than movies because your mind's eye is so much more powerful than the most expensive special effect. And if you let someone fill in the gaps, I actually think that it's more immersive than film storytelling sometimes because...

In film, you say that, you know, your audience leans in, they become a part of the story and they kind of lean in and become part of that screen. And in great audio dramas, you, it's instead of leaning in, it's an out of body experience. You literally leave yourself and become the story. And that's what I want to do for people. I want to create that. And I think that there's

No limitation in what you can do in a basement in Reseda when it comes to being able to deliver something like that. Now, with that said, following in the mindset of a Ricky Gervais or Jimmy Kimmel, I would like to propose that, you know, fast forward five years, hundreds of thousands of dollars in sponsors, over a million followers, something like this in the broadcast quality of the audio. It's rife for puppets, claymation, music.

I agree with you. We should never go cinematic in film actors. But if we don't start shooting some sort of animated video for these, I think we'd be missed on our next step in the podcast. Ladies and gentlemen, Matt Hopen works in television. Always five steps ahead, baby. His instincts go there. Mind you, too. I don't know. I think that I have no... I just love puppets. I just love puppets. I love puppets, too. I have no agenda for this other than to be

these immersive stories. I just want people to love Curious Matter and enjoy it as much as I do. And if I can do that, that's it. If there's a thousand listeners, if there's a hundred listeners, if there's a million listeners, that has nothing to do with it. It just has to do with getting these stories out there and telling them the way I want to tell them. And I want to film and record at least a season in Prague.

So one more on the tech side of things. There was something that really hooked me as an additional little sprinkling, seasoning, whatever you want to call it in this. Tell me about the planets. There was a very specific crafting...

to the score of this. And it's something that you don't come across at least. And I admit I'm not as avid of a podcast listener as you are, but rarely do I hear a classical score in the middle of a podcast. Can you tell me more about the planets and what that is? That was a lucky coincidence. I mean, so... Because it was free. Well, it was free, but that was beside the point. I was putting this together and...

Robert Block, in his short story, mentions Gustav Holst's The Planets. And, you know, I knew of it, but I don't think I'd ever really paid attention.

And I looked it up and I read about it. And for those of you that don't know, it was written in the late 1800s. And it is very much what John Williams was inspired by for Star Wars. It's inspired many, many fantastic scores. It is cinematic and it is what it was meant to be. It was meant to be a way to go to the stars when all you had was audio. So it's fitting that it...

was part of our first episode. And it just happened as I was doing my research to find out there is actually a Creative Commons, not public domain, recording of... Dodged a bullet. ...of Gustav Holst. It's pretty amazing. That was recorded by the United States Air Force Heritage of America band. Gustav Holst's actual catalog is in the public domain, but the recordings are very different...

are a very different beast when it comes to copyright matters. So I found out that it was usable, and then it became the perfect score. It's not played end-to-end. It's very much edited and chopped up, and I use it to create the themes that I need to get through the story as opposed to just letting them play out. But it was...

for me, I hope the audience feels this. It was just like this magical addition. And I'm hoping that we can keep that level of score up. It's a goal, but we're going to be, it's going to, it's, um, we're going to be looking at other resources potentially as we go through the season. Episode two and three, um, are a little bit different musically. Um,

But I think they're still completely enjoyable without that just amazing piece of music. I mean, I could use it again, I guess. But, you know, I think that people will get bored of hearing that same thing over and over again. We got to bring new and interesting adventures every two weeks to this podcast. So the music in episode two and three are going to be a little different. As someone who looks up to a lot of bars, good luck. Fortunately, you did use my favorite Gustav. So we have that going for us.

Um, I guess, uh, I just, you know, kind of heading toward the finish line. So I want to take a step back for a second. Um, big picture. What, I mean, you kind of, you, you were sounding very, uh, I don't know if gregarious is the right word, but I appreciated your focus on the moment, but obviously there are goals. Um, so I'd like you to talk to your subscribers and more importantly, your potential subscribers. What is your goal for this podcast and what, what, what,

Why? Okay, forget the fact that I'm the guy on the other end of the microphone. Why should I subscribe to your podcast? What am I going to get out of it? I don't want to do a sales pitch. Not a sales pitch. I'd rather have you talk for the hire. I'm not talking about goals, financial goals. I'm not talking about all the other stuff you're going to edit out of this conversation right now. I'm really more just curious about expectations as a listener. What do you want to tell your listeners? I think that

You know, be patient. We're going to be bringing this as fast as we can to you guys that it's going to be worth it. I know, you know, we're all fans. We're all fans of something. And I think that...

This is the perfect thing that I... This is what I want to listen to in the car on the way to work. I sadly am the one making it, so it doesn't have the same luster. But, you know, that's how I am with all of the things that I try to spend my energy creating is that I want to create the things that I want to find in the world. And I hope that other people feel that way and that...

And, you know, Curious Matter just becomes this thing that people like. It's, you know, we're going to be bringing you stories that are pretty unique and pretty interesting and have influenced the world of storytelling, but just also are great stories. And some of them just need to be given a little bit of a modern twist and brought to your ears. And, I mean...

I hope you guys love it. I just hope that I can continue to be in service of these stories and bring them to you guys in their best form. I don't know. Not too shambly. Last one for me. Just tell me, you know, we got the next episode coming right around the corner. What do we have to look forward to with episode 102? 102, well, episode two is Haunter in the Dark Part One. It is...

HP Lovecraft's last story, as we said, and it is awesome. It is everything that you want out of supernatural horror. You guys are going to love it. It's broken into two episodes, so it has a fun point at where episode one ends, and I think everyone's going to really enjoy it.

So just stay tuned and subscribe on whatever podcast platform you love and check us out on the website. Review if you can. Give us five stars. Share if you can. You can find us at www.podcast.

CuriousMatterPodcast.com. Let's try that again. You can find us at www.curiousmatterpodcast.com. We are on Instagram and Twitter at CM Anthology. We are on Facebook at CM Anthology. And yeah, just come find us somewhere in the world and please share your thoughts, share your suggestions. If you have a story that you love that you really want to see us adapt, send it to me and

We'll do our best to bring you great stories. I could not agree more. John Pez, I want to thank you so much to everybody out there listening. Again, get on, subscribe, send us your questions. My name is Matthew Hoban. I'd just like to leave you with the little-known fact that the American female ferret, if it does not have sex at least once a year, it will die. The Fable & Folly Network, where fiction producers flourish.

You wake up startled in the middle of the night, convinced that there's something out there in the darkness. Your brain tells you that there's nothing to be afraid of, that the inhuman shape in the corner of your room is just your laundry piled on a chair. But as you hear the ghostly, ragged breathing that doesn't belong to you, you realize your brain is dead wrong.

If you love the mix of horror, mystery, and comedy in shows like Buffy, Ash vs. the Evil Dead, or Supernatural, you'll feel right at home on The Crit Show, a Monster of the Week actual play podcast where the players, playing as themselves, are tasked with being the last line of defense from the forces of evil that go bump in the night. Join us every Wednesday and learn the games we play while the gang tries their best to solve the mysteries, hunt the monsters, and solve the mysteries.

and protect the innocent. Their intentions are good. Their dice rolls, not so much. You can find The Crit Show at thecritshowpodcast.com or wherever you listen to podcasts.