'Skeleton Crew' Episode 4 Deep Dive
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begins on October 1st, 2024, ends July 1st, 2025. Multiple entry periods. Visit mcglobalture.com slash courtside for free entry, entry deadlines, and official rules. Message and data rates may apply void where prohibited. Come with us, Hannah. My house has plenty of room. I have to add in this peaceful. No. Perhaps someday, when I'm leader of the Troik, I will remember your ways. I see now. Your weakness, it makes you kind. And my world could use some kindness. Leo,

I hate to interrupt, but come on, move your trunk. Greetings and welcome to House of R, a Ringerverse podcast on the Ringer Podcast Network. I'm Mallory Rubin, and it is my absolute pleasure to invite you to the fallen sanctum and back into the House of R. Joining me today to see if I'm okay after hearing that I fell on the credenza and sprained my trunk, it's Joanna Robinson.

Malar, even quick question. Can you briefly explain to me the rules of the ball game that Neil is the best at? I think it goes a little something like...

Something like that? Man, I don't know. Can I explain it to you? It depends. What flag do you fly? Great question. Joe, we are here to dive into the mealtastic fourth episode of Skeleton Crew. But before we initiate babysitting sequence, some quick programming reminders. Over on The Ringer Voice. It just became Oz Cobb for a minute. Boins! The Ringer Voice! Boins!

Boids? Talking about boids? Bring a voice. Soit, soit, soitantly. Over on the Rigorverse. I miss Oz. You miss Oz, truly. Over on the Rigorverse. I am definitely coming down with something, and I don't know if that has anything to do with why I'm slipping into OzCob. We'll find out as the rest of the pod goes. Who can say? Let's discover it together. Let's discover it together. Exactly. Beautiful journey that we're going to share. The Midnight Boys. Pew, pew.

As we pod in real time right now, they are also podding. They are breaking down the brand spanking new Superman trailer that just dropped this morning. You will have a Midnight Boys breakdown on this highly anticipated teaser trailer on the Ringerverse feed, on the Ringerverse YouTube channel. Obviously, that's going to be a must watch and a must listen. So check that out.

Junior Mint also has something to look forward to because Mint Edition will be here at the end of the week with...

Sonic 3 pod. As previously mentioned, this is a movie that Jomie was anticipating so seismically he delayed a holiday family vacation to ensure that he could see it and pod about it. That's wonderful. And there's news of Sonic 4 this morning that has Jomie. The group chat is blowing up. Yeah. Yeah. Thrilled. Wonderful stuff. Here on the House of R, we will be back in mere days to

conclude our conversation about Dune prophecy. And that is a thing we are doing. We're going to wrap that up. After Christmas, there's a little scheduling update, a little holiday scheduling update. We're getting ahead on banking our top 10 moments of the year pod, one of our favorite annual traditions that we love. We're really looking forward to recording that. And then that will be waiting for you after Christmas.

There will not be a Skeleton Crew episode five pod next week because of the holiday. But the week after, we will be back on the Onyx Cinder with our faves to talk about episode five and six together in one pod on Thursday, January 2nd. So the Skeleton Crew pods are not ceasing. Just a brief one-week holiday break. You can watch full episodes of The House of R and The Midnight Boys Pew Pew on Spotify.

And on the Ringerverse YouTube channel, we did a team-up pod this week. The whole gang got together. It was a house of midnight. Yeah, we Brady Bunched it. On Kraven, we did. We all had our little boxes to talk about Kraven and say farewell to this particular era of Sony superhero cinematic experimentation. And you know what? We had a blast. A time was had. A time was had by all.

Check that out if you haven't yet. Jo, how can everybody follow along during the holidays? How can everybody follow along in general? What recommendations are you here to provide? What a great question. And I have an answer for you. It goes something like this. Why don't you subscribe to the pod? Our pod, House of R, The Ring of Voice too, if you prefer. The Ring of Voice. The Ring of Voice, but mostly, no, everyone.

Also, follow us on socials. I think that's a good thing to do. We're over on Twitter. We're on Instagram. We're on TikTok, as long as that's still a thing. And we're on Facebook. So follow us on all of those. You can also email us, hobbitsanddragons at gmail.com. We'd love to hear from you over the holidays. I think that sounds like a delightful thing. And that's about it. Back to you, Mallory Rubin. What's our spoiler warning today?

Spoiler warning is as follows. Skeleton Crew Episode 4, everything that's happened in Skeleton Crew to date, and anything that's ever happened in Star Wars. It could come up today. Some other shows might come up if you hear them mentioned, and you don't want to hear anything that happens in them. You know, you hit the fast-forward button once, but broadly, it's just a Star Wars episode.

a Star Wars spoiler warning for everything and anything that's ever happened in a galaxy far, far away. So that's, that's that. Yeah. Joe, how did you like the Superman trailer? We're, we're, we're not doing the breakdown pod. The midnight boys are, but give me your, give me your 30 second. You go first. You go first. Cause you're really, really excited. And then I will go first with my caveat. Uh,

I loved it. I really thought it was great. As you know, I'm very much looking forward to the movie. It is one of my most anticipated releases of 2025. I will not let it fall far in the House of R Hype draft, though I don't know that I'm going to have as much competition for it as I might for some other properties given the crew we've assembled. I'll have to factor that into my strategy.

But yeah, I thought this trailer was really fun. I love James Gunn's movies and superhero fare. I am really excited about the cast. What a genuine delight to see our shared wife, Rachel Brosnahan, Midge Maisel herself. She looks great in her little, like, t-shirt and vest situation. Genuine No Notes territory. Also, my husband Nathan Fillion is here. There is a starring teaser trailer role for Crypto the Dog. Yeah.

You know, a lot of patrons, aides of House of R, are in this trailer featured prominently. Our guy, Nick Holt, just crushing it as Lex Luthor. So, yeah, this was a teaser trailer. It was mostly a vibes trailer. Obviously, the next trailer that we get will be a more narratively driven, detailed, this is what the movie's going to really be about trailer. This was really like establishing the –

tonal and visual template for what this film is going to do. And you know what? That Clark Kent mop of curls, everything got me hyped. Really mopping. Really mopping. Yeah, mopping it up in the streets. Dude, I'm jazzed. Like July 11th, I really can't wait. I'm excited for the new DC era. I'm excited for this movie. Yeah. What about you?

I thought Nick Holt looked great as Lex Luthor. Give him a Bond franchise. It's like Nick Holt or Dev Patel for me. Oh my God. You know, like put them in suits and give them guns and I would watch it. What is it? I don't care. I'll watch it. Yeah. Like Nick Holt is to me as Crypto the Dog is to you and Van, I think, is how I responded to that trailer. I don't know.

I don't know. I have a lot of question marks around this movie, but it looked, I liked how colorful it looked. And I did, you know, above and beyond Crypto the Dog, the shots before of Superman just like,

and winded in the snow was quite effective, I thought. I was just sort of like, here's the strongest. With the electric guitar coming in on the score? The most overpowered, you know, character in every comic book ever is just like defeated in the snow. What got him there? Tune in to find out. Yeah.

Okay, so what I'm taking away is I will have to battle you to the death for Thunderbolts in the hype trap, but I don't really need to worry about you or Superman is concerned. No, no. I mean, I'm not giving away any strategy. Okay.

but you've known this about me for like ever since this movie was announced. We'll see. I'm, I'm open and hopeful to be pleasantly surprised and blown away. I'm not going in saying this is going to be bad. I hope it's great. I hope it's everything you and Van want it to be. I, I hope it's everything Superman fans want it to be. I have some questions, comments or concerns and you know, I,

I've been wrong many a time before, so here's hoping I'm wrong in 2025. What a year of content we have ahead of us, Jo. Can't wait to share it all with you. Genuinely. Fantastic Four? I can't wait. I can't wait. Really? Night of the Seven Kingdoms? Last of Us? Yeah. My God, what a time to be us. White Lotus? Severance?

I just can't believe we get to watch Goggins and White Lotus together. It's just going to be the thrill of my fucking life. I just honestly can't believe it. I don't know how we were going to survive. And a promise. I don't know if I extracted this promise from you, but I did already extract it from Rob that we're going to podcast every episode with the Goggins goggles on. The goggles. Yeah. It's a lock. It's a lock. It's in. Yeah. It's in. It's an absolute guarantee. Cocktails in hand.

Goggins goggles on face. Do you think we can get Bill to wear the Goggins goggles? No. No, I do not. Okay. A goal for 2025. All right, Joe. I see you train with spirit, my boy. Let's pod. It is time for the opening snapshot. Joanna Robinson. As in real time, I succumb to whatever.

about to claim me. Are you saying the air is kind of ashy? Is that what's happening? Oh, God. Episode four. Can't say I remember no Ad Atten. Listen, I want you after this podcast to go on Instagram, repost the reel from last week, and just say flex. Just flex on them because you nailed it. As soon as I saw the episode name, I was like, fuck.

As soon as I saw the episode title, I was like, yeah, it's good. Let's ride. We did it. Written, again, by John Watts and Christopher Ford. Directed by the Daniels. Checking in at 38 minutes, including the credits. Again, these episodes are all similar-ish length. That's been a nice part of the experience, actually. They all feel very consistent and well-calibrated. Joanna Robinson, what...

are your opening thoughts. Just give us a little taste before we go scene by scene on episode four.

We had both been watching a thing that was challenging for us to watch. Yeah. And I was complaining to you about it over text. And you said, I have good news for you. Yeah. The palate cleanser at the end, the light at the end of this tunnel is a Neil episode of Skeleton Crew. Yes. And I was just like, oh my God. Yeah. I was mere moments ahead of you in our shared dual watch. And so I knew that a salve and a balm for the soul awaited. Thank you.

I was tearing my hair out by the roots. So, um, more Neil, who could ask for anything else? Like we are thrilled. We love Neil. The world loves Neil. Everyone agrees. Like this is a divided world we live in, but everyone loves Neil. And that's what matters most. Um,

Um, I, and this is sort of exactly what I asked for. I can't remember if it was like in our episode three Potter or our first pod, but this sort of Mandalorian esque planet hopping adventure. We have like an adventure of a week on a different planet.

And at this point, I'm wondering if we're just going to like bounce around at planets until we get home. And that gives it an almost like Rick and Morty feel of like, this is our universe, but here's what's different in this one or sliders if you're a fan of 90s television. So, yeah, I really loved it. Is this, is it like...

I don't know. Some people are calling it a slighter, a thinner episode, but I think all of the episodes are going to be about this depth, and I think that's fine. This is just an adventure show, and I think that's wonderful. Yeah. How about you, Myla Urban? I am in active mourning that we're already halfway through the season. Yeah. The passage of time. It's a wild thing. As is...

Literally always the case when we're covering a show that we're loving, I am confronting the fact that it will end in a predictable timeframe that has been presented to us on a schedule. And I'm struggling with that. Don't worry. Because I don't want to say goodbye. It's not going to end until next year.

That's true. That way. It can bridge the years. That's a nice way to think about it. For the rest of the year, you'll have a skeleton crew. Yeah. Great way to think about it. And Neil lives, I can say with confidence already, forever in my heart. I think Jod also likely to live forever in my heart and maybe some other places. Maybe. Oh, boy. I thought this episode was great. The Mando-esque...

Adventure of the Week, planet hopping, nature of the pacing of the story is really working well for me. And also, I think it just has, like, on the Mando front, it is very reminiscent of Mando season one to me as well. Just the charm. And, like, it's very...

confident sense of mission and intent and sense of self. It's like, this is the show we're making and we're making it well. And the only thing that feels different to me about the Mando 1 experience versus this is Mando was like billed very much as like that darker, grittier Star Wars. I was about to say. I couldn't wait for it and then it like kind of wasn't that. And this is the opposite. We were like, oh, is this going to be like –

For everyone. I want everybody to even decide to watch this in the first place. And it really has just been an incredibly wonderful Star Wars experience that people seem to be loving. I hope more people check it out and catch up with it over the holidays who maybe haven't opted in yet. Because I'm hoping that the word of mouth is starting to really get the Star Wars fans to tap in. You're talking about Chris and Andy, right? You're talking about Chris and Andy. If you were not able to convince them this week –

I'm doing my best starring role and connection to the Bureau. I don't know if anything will. We did not get a fourth name for Jod in this episode, Jo. We did not get a lot of Jedi stuff that we have some Jedi theorizing to do in absentia. Point of order. Would you not say baby, get on the ship, baby, come on, baby is in a sense a new name for Jod? I will allow it. I will accept it as a formal entry in the new names for Jod. Yeah.

Wonderful. You're right. The streak continues. We obviously did not go to Ad Aten and spend any time with the adults there, but there's plenty of Ad Aten still present. So yeah, I just thought this was delightful. And like, in addition to once again, really heightening and moving forward the mystery in a way that I love, this can be the point in a season if a show is not

well-made where you start to get, you, the collective you, like, starts to get annoyed. All right, you're showing us a statue and there's no face just so you can keep this, like, keep kicking the can down the road longer. But it was perfect. It made complete sense in that context that that would be one more clue with another, like, mysterious element around it. So it's just like a smartly well-made show on the mystery front. The intrigue is building really compellingly and naturally. And

The characters are wonderful. They are just wonderful. And the ability to, like, week after week, with Kim last week, with Haina and Strix this week, to introduce new characters who, in a very limited time, really make an impact on us without it compromising the time that we're getting with our main character set, like...

This Neil experience was genuinely meaningful and wonderful. It reminded me of the conversation we had around the episode of Agatha all along where they introduced the Kaplans in such a short time. And it's just sort of like you watch Ford and Watts or whoever else is crafting some of these episodes give you an unforgettable character inside of one episode. It's something that Lost could do really well as well. And you wonder like

I feel more emotional attachment to this character in like, you know, 10 minutes of screen time. Yeah, 10, 12 minutes. Yeah, than I do some characters in like a season of television. Yeah. You know? And so just for lovers of story, just really like breaking down what do they do. Like Tyrion Lannister? Yeah, you know, what's more important than breaking down story with the House of Arr? But like, what do they do to make...

like a, a character we are emotionally invested in. Well, like have a character we already love be emotionally invested in her. That's, that's a good shorthand. So, you know, it's a,

it's it's a real accomplishment and i think to your mando point i think that's so i was thinking the same thing where it's like mando took itself has always taken itself a bit more seriously than it really ought to um and that's okay like i love that for fab or fab was like i'm making the great intergalactic western look at these storyboards and it's like i have i'm having a great time with it for the most part in mando but like

Yeah. Watson Board are like, guys, we're going on an adventure. A real adventure. Let's go. What a time. I received a box of Neil merch. Yes. This week, Jo, and I immediately texted you. I thought you were responsible. What'd you get? To the person in the world who sent this to me, I would just like to say thank you. This is

Wonderful. I got a Neil pop, a Neil action figure, a genuinely beautiful Neil print. I got laptop stickers. I got a Neil pin. Oh.

I mean, I don't mean to nag the box. The box sounds amazing. No plushie, though. No Neil plushie. Not yet. It really feels like that's something I would most want is like a Neil plushie. Were any of the stickers or images, the poster, were they the shot of Neil in this episode when he's looking back and the wind is blowing through his little elephant hair? I did. I did.

Okay, so I'm not going to lie. I rewatched that to see if it was just like the force of the EOP herd moving past him that lifted his hair or if an EOP had farted. Like, you know, this is like a prominent part of the EOP canon. They stink. Obviously, who could forget the fabled stretch of cinema where Jar Jar responded so memorably to the gaseous omission.

But that was just that Neil moment was so darling. The quivering trunk is the one that just sent me. I marked the exact timestamp in the doc in case anybody wants to go back and look at the quivering trunk when the kids are hiding out in the bus. It is at, I believe, let's see, the nine minute and 42 second mark on Disney Plus. If you missed this in real time, check it out. In his terror, Neil's little trunk is just this quivering.

It's perfect. Everything about Neil is perfect. If anyone wants to make a GIF of this and send it to Mallory, HobbsandDragons at gmail.com. My GIF making days are slightly behind me, but I might make an exception for this. Okay. A very important order of business we have from the inbox today is that we put out a call for folks to come up with a pirate name for Mallory. And I have a few candidates here that I would like to hear your favorite. Okay. I'm thrilled. Okay. We've got Mallory.

Maelstrom Rubin, you know, like I love it. Yeah, I love it. Maelstrom Rubin, not Maelstrom Mel. Yeah, I like that a little better. I think the alliteration of Maelstrom Mel is good. But yeah, I always love a Maelstrom. Maelstrom, one of my favorite Battlestar Galactica episodes. I'm into this. I like it. Okay, what's next? Promising start. Malicious the Vicious. That's your drafting name.

Would you not say so? You know, I think it's fair. It's tough, but fair. I do think that the other Star Wars nickname the listeners have already presented of Darth Mal maybe has us covered there tonally, but it's an acceptable and reasonable submission. Okay. What's next? Randy Mal. I mean, yeah. I mean, that's a great one.

I really like this one. I like it. Like Malicious Ruby and then just then Ruby Mal, like sort of like as a short for Malicious Ruby. I like it. Yeah. It's – I think we should – these are great submissions. I think we should keep the inbox open and keep on the hunt. Randy Mal and Maelstrom Mal are both really good. They're all great. Those are my two favorites so far. Sounds great. Fantastic stuff.

We also got a lot of emails actually from listeners that there's a new Hobbit themed cafe in Maine. When are we going? Called Elevenzies. When are we going? I also would like to know when we're going. You let me know. Under what pretext can we get ourselves to Maine? Let's think about it.

Sarah, our listener Sarah, sent us another Nosferatu sarcophagus pose with the email subject line, Nosferatu meet you. And no notes for you, Sarah. You're the best. Wonderful stuff. Thanks so much. Keep them coming. We've got several more days of the

of the year for you to send me photos of you next to a cardboard sarcophagus in the lobby of a movie theater. And last but not least, a sort of like yes and correction we got from a few listeners, but I'll read the one that we got from Willoughby who said, a fun fact about the character named Benjar Pranik. He

He is named after two hosts of the Star Trek recap podcast, The Greatest Generation, Benjamin R. Harrison and Adam Pranica. The writers of the Skeleton Crew wrote into the show to let them know that there'd be a Greatest Gen Easter egg in episode three as they're also listeners of the Star Trek podcast and Ben conferred it on Blue Sky after the episode dropped. So my question to the universe is when will there be a Star Wars character or a Marvel character or a guy?

damn rings of power lord or house of the dragon character named after us wow we're waiting we're waiting okay

I don't mean to sound hubristic. I normally wouldn't say this, but if other podcast hosts are getting skeleton crew characters named after them, I would like a Maljo somewhere in the, in the, uh, rings of power season three seems like the most likely. Okay, great. Right. Yeah. Yes. If you're listening, uh,

JD and Patrick, probably Patrick. We would love to see it. Thanks so much. All right. That's it from the mailbag. We have a few more mail letters to get through in the rest of the outline today. Delightful. Sensational. Our listeners are the best. The bad babies. Another great year. Another great year for the bad babies. The bad bunnies. They're the best. Bad bunnies. That's right. All right, Joe. We all have a place in the great work. It is time for the deep dive. Deep dive.

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Home? Heavy air coats? Big question mark. Our beloved Onyx Cinder, guided by the coordinates stolen from Kim. Okay, quick question. And I don't mean to drag us down. We've got a lot to get to. You both wrote it here and then you said it with your own mouth. Beloved Onyx Cinder. Yes. Yeah. Yes. Would you make your home on the reeky, rattly Onyx Cinder? No.

am at war with myself over this one because like Wim I love a ship you know I love a Lego set there's already an Onyx Cinder Lego set the idea of of

inhabiting a starship in Star Wars is a thrilling one. But I am also obviously team Neil on the hygiene and stench front. I don't really want to be sleeping among the rancid and dead. Personally, that's just not for me. So I guess my question would be, what do we think the supply of Clorox wipes and Purell products

On the onyx cinder is and what sort of shape could we get that in? Yeah. Knowing that you don't wear outside pants indoors. The first thing I do when I walk inside is take my clothes off. I know that about you. It made me feel like the reekies onyx cinder wasn't for you. But listen. Yeah. You know, in a couple of scented candles.

Who knows what's possible? That's only going to put a sickly sweet bug over the stench of the cinder. Okay, anyway, we've landed somewhere. Yes, in our maybe, but it's too soon to say, beloved onyx cinder. We've emerged from hyperspace. We are in front of a planet that looks like, from a distance, Ad Aten. Some, I thought, beautifully colored gaseous blooms, like a nice, dark, rich turquoise color.

But Joanna, there's also just a fuckload, an absolute fuckload of satellites surrounding the planet. Now, we are showing these, obviously, for a reason. Early in the season, when Ben joined us, he speculated, you know, could the tech that we had glimpsed

on Ad Aten be generating these nebular gases that are hiding the planet? So seeing these here, that's something that's obviously still on our minds. Are these monitoring stations, are they here not only to track who's coming or going on planets where that is not allowed, not supposed to happen, but also to just monitor activity on the jewels of the Old Republic? Are they

Fail safes are these Operation Cinder, Palpy Contingency-esque satellite weapons there to destroy the planet.

Will you tell listeners who aren't aware what Operation Cinder is? So this is a part of Palpatine's contingency, which you've heard us chat about on other pods. But the very, very, very quick version of a complex bit of canon is that Palpatine, this will shock everybody to hear, was like, listen, if you all fail me and let me die, I'm going to take a lot of it with me. Right? That's like...

Very, very reductive logline of a complex contingency. If I can't have it, no one can. Yes. And so these satellite weaponry positioned around certain planets are

could eliminate the planets. And the question we've already been, we were speculating pretty heavily by last episode, by episode three, about potential future ties to Exegol, to the Sith Eternal, to the rise of the First Order. That's obviously on our minds just based on where we are in the timeline. The question of whether there's some prior tie to the Sith with the jewels of the Old Republic and, you know,

The great works. This is this is just such a visual match to something that that Palpatine was behind that it's like difficult not to wonder if this was there to eliminate these planets if they they if they got out of hand.

basically. It is interesting because it's not as if operation center is like a main, which is not to say it can't be this, but it's not like a main in the main films or anything like that. Star Wars thing. You find it in like novelizations or comic books or video games, or it was like mentioned in the Mandalorian, but not sort of appearing. So it would be sort of one of those like,

extended canon details that they would sort of develop here but you're forgive you're a star wars fan you're forgiven if you're like i'm sorry what is operation cinder but it is interesting to invoke something like that that like hardcore star wars fans know in a in a property that has a ship called onyx cinder like i'm just trying to figure out for myself whether that makes it more likely that that's what this is or less likely right i don't know if i have an answer for

Yeah, yeah. That's a great call. And also just in general, this question of like, okay, eight of these jewels were destroyed. How? Like we're on the grounds now on one of them in this episode without Akron.

We leave the episode without – we leave the episode knowing that things are a mess there, but not knowing how it got to that state. Was this an external force, an internal matter? Like, did the – No one really asks either. There's the – they're not like, what happened here? Slightly shocking lack of curiosity around – because we're like, why are we fighting? We'll get into the war in a second, but like, why are we fighting? Well, this is the current reason. What started it? This battle. Yeah. What started it? Would be a good follow-up question. Fair enough.

Fair note. How long have you been fighting? We are working our way toward Neil getting a kiss on the cheek. And so there's other stuff to focus on. God damn it. Great point. Joe, Jod, our guy Jod, is so awed by briefly, very briefly, thinking that they have arrived at Ad Aten that he invokes, we're not ghosts. And we don't really need to talk about this, but it's like one of the, I just wanted to quickly mention it because it was a little, literally two word thing that felt like

emblematic to me of why I love the show, right? It's like a, just a, it gives the world texture. That's a legend in the pirate world. That's a person that someone knew at some point, like we don't know who it is, but it doesn't matter. It's just like these little bits of depth and

mythology and like the kind of thing people say to each other that would be normal for someone else to hear. It just helps make the world feel full. The common sort of Reddit theory, though the creators have not confirmed this, is that this is a little nod to Richard Donner, Renata's Donner backwards, and then it's like a little Easter egg for Richard Donner who directed Among Superman, also The Goonies. So, you know. The Goonies. I'll be out of it, lads! Yeah.

Did you know that they're doing a riff on the Goonies in this show? Some great Goonies references in this episode. They see houses. Neil is absolutely thrilled. He shouts home, my heart melted. Melted. Not for the last time in this episode. But Wim.

He says, just when things were starting to get fun. Wim has not arced out yet. He's not yet ready to go home. That will be, I suppose, where we end with Wim. But right now, he's like, oh, man. We're having an adventure. I have more character development to do. Come on.

We've talked a lot about the Jedi-specific stuff with Wim and how it feels clear that part of what Wim is going to have to confront is that the Jedi are flawed. Being a Force user doesn't necessarily make you a hero, et cetera, et cetera. But this also clearly feels like it's going to be part of Wim's journey, right? He couldn't wait to escape. He felt trapped, misunderstood. Wim returning to his family and, like, embracing the idea of home. And for Neo— Would you say there's no place like it? Is that what you'd say about home? There's absolutely no place like it. I don't know if I would say that about Adat. No.

Well, and I think also this is going to land on Wendell as well. Like, what home is he coming home to? Is he coming home to a father who has gone on his own arc and learned, hey, maybe work-life balance is a good thing and I should look into it. You're never too old to hear an appreciated bedtime story. Wendell!

And then for Neil, who we love and adore and cherish and want to cradle and protect at all costs, he's got a journey to go on, too, stretching out beyond his comfort zone. So all of the characters, they're on a shared journey, but individual ones, too, and that's just really lovely. The ship is rested out of 33's control. They are locked in an autopilot sequence. It does seem that...

33 is able to break out of that and land the ship where he wants. But in addition to the just genuine high comedy of John's terror, is that normal? Is it normal? Do you know? This is wonderful. We have this, okay, the jewel planets thing.

against unwanted comings and goings. If a ship enters, it's going to be pulled in where we can control it. I mean, and even, and that that is in place even in a place where everything has sort of fallen apart. Right. But that still lingers is fascinating to me. And fuel, certainly, for your theory that like,

Or an auto program. AI, a computer, a program of some sort is behind this, right? That that would linger beyond whatever human life force might have left. It made me wonder if this is part of what led to the Cinder's crash on Ad Aten. And we still don't know exactly when that happened or what caused it. We get some interesting insights from 33 in this episode, but we have a lot of mystery still. It happened.

an entire body's decomposition ago. That we do know. We're skeleton crew. Enough for dirt to settle and grass to grow. And bodies to become skeletons. And hillsides to take shape. Yeah, yeah, yeah. When they disembark, when they leave the ship, they see just immediately that this is not in fact home. It's wrong. It's smoky. It's empty, though, with the alarming presence of an explosion in the distance. Rubble everywhere. A creepy playground. Right?

just to freak everyone out. Not Wim. He's like, I'm ready to go. It's

a no for me. Creepy playgrounds are always a no for me. It's simply get back on the ship and go time for me. Would you have left immediately or would you have continued on to explore and look for clues? You're there to find clues for the path home. I would have been like, I'll babysit John. You guys go ahead. You take SM. I'll stay with Hot John. I'll do Operation Baby. And you guys go ahead. This is why you're the best. You're an innovative thinker and a problem solver. Thank you.

It's a real win-win for me, honestly, if I have a Jod babysitting duty. Speaking of, Jod emerges slightly on delay and looks around, takes it all in, wipes his hands together, smacks his lips, and says with absolute disgust on his face, John? So, this is At-At-n. Tastes like ashy dust. It's a lot like my home planet, actually.

Wonderful stuff. I love that you could hear. I'm like, thanks for prepping us about the rubbing of the hands and the smacking of lips because you can hear both on the audio track. And the rubbing of the hands, you and I both. John is like so...

like obviously wearing gloves in weird circumstances inside of this episode that you and I had the same exact though distinct from each other instinct to wonder, have we ever seen his bare hands? Because why is he wearing the gloves? Like when he's like fumbling with sort of intricate things, he's got those gloves on. We were like, why? And then you and I both looked at different parts of earlier episodes to see. Yes, indeed. We have seen.

his beautiful naked hands. And so what, what's up with the glove work in this episode? I don't know. I don't have a good answer. Yeah. I like that. We both immediately went to a different scene to check. I went to the mixing of the bowl for the meal.

And you went to? The key grab. The key grab. Because I was like, we're doing hand force stuff. Yeah. Yeah, hand stuff go. Hand stuff. Hand stuff go. One of my favorite subgenres of the Harrison Ford acting canon, hand stuff go. That's Blade Runner, in case you're wondering. So, Jo, in addition to the comedy, we get a little morsel. Tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny. You are on one today, and I love this for you. Another kernel. Another kernel.

We're not ghosts. Where are they from? Of an insight into Jod's history. Looks a lot like my home planet, actually. Do you take this to mean that his home planet was a dusty, ashy wasteland or ruin? Or smog central? Could it be that he's commenting on the city planning? No.

Could it be that? You know, this would-be utopia that didn't quite work out? My home village also has creaky, deserted playgrounds. It seemed more weather patterns to me, weather pattern-based. Everyone and their uncle has been looking up, like, what's an ashy, smoggy, dusty, choke-your-trunk planet. There's a Mustafar theory, which I find...

Wildly uncompelling, but it exists out there. I don't know why it would be interesting that he's from Mistafar, but, you know, could be. Yeah, I don't think – that seems very unlikely to me for a number of reasons. I just thought I would say it out loud with my mouth, but I also don't believe in it. Yeah. Okay, so it's not home, actually. And sweet.

Smart Neil. Clever Neil. Who is not only a capable detective, but an observational journalist who seems like he will win a Pulitzer one day. Yeah. And a leader and a mover and a shaker and a thinker. He's the one. He's like,

I see a clue. Let's run toward it. I'm about to explain to you why I know for sure this is not home. And the gang follows. Jod very feebly yells after them. No, no, don't go off. Don't run where I can't follow. Ed Fern tells SM-33 to keep him here. This is shortly after she told him no adults allowed in the cockpit and he humored her with the, yes, Captain Fern. Their dynamic continues to be delightful. This is where we initiate babysitting sequence. Were you thinking? Come on, baby. Baby. On to the ship.

Don't make me count. I hope Nick Frost had a great day when he recorded that. How could he not? Babysitting sequence being initiated for the one adult in the story and not any of the kids is a great little touch. Did this make you think of our beloved nurse droid IG-11 who has sparked some of the fiercest debates in the history of House of R? I'll leave that to you and Steve. Steve's not here to join me discussing IG-11, so we'll move on.

He's always on my mind, though. Did you have any laments watching this episode for the first time that Jod and the kids were splitting up so quickly? I mean, it was a good adventure for the kids. We're a little Jod-lite in this episode, but he makes up for it in how he returns. So I will save my thoughts and feelings for that. Oh, boy. The kids enter a house.

It's covered in foliage. It's covered in... It looks like a log cabin has been placed on top of a metal structure. Detritus abounds. Structurally unsound, as KB notes. Everyone's cautious except for Wim, who just charges right in. Neil points to the tree in the middle of the living room, and he is like, first of all, I have been to Skylight Books in Los Angeles, and I am an enthusiast of this particular style. And I said, Neil, same. Same! Then, Neil said...

This is just too big of a tree to be our home. Like, it's in the middle of this living room. Clearly, whatever happened here happened long ago. And I would like to tell you, in the interest of candor, I am not too proud to admit that I, very briefly, just a second or two, like Wim, was like, well, I mean, you know, could they be pulling an interstellar? Like, space. Time.

thought, but my brain went to the Flight of the Navigator, which they have already, you know, maybe they're making Nolan references, but they've definitely already made Flight of the Navigator references. And that is a story, spoiler alert for Flight of the Navigator, where a boy hops on a spaceship, accidentally goes out into space, finds his way home, and a lot of time has passed. And

The tree is a helpful timeline for us, though, because if the question is how long ago did the Onyx Cinder crash on Ann Atten? Well, they had to come here first. Right.

Was it already war turn when they got here? Were trees already going through houses when they got here? Or was there a riot? It was that pirate ship. Was Yannick Sander arriving there? The inciting incident for the collapse of the civilization on this particular planet. We don't know the answer, but if it was that tree has been growing for a while. So it meant that was a long time ago in a galaxy near, near away. So, you know, SM 33 has a lot to work through.

It's got a lot to process. Got a lot to tell. Yeah. Obviously, this is not in this stretch of the Star Wars canon how space travel works on the time front. So very quickly, we all moved on. Also, it's very clear we're going to go to all of these planets, or at least a good chunk of them. So.

Here's what we see. First, we get a quick Tales of the Knights mention from Wim. And we've been tracking, like, what are we seeing on his iPad? What's he mentioning? How many of the stories that are stories in Wim's life are also going to prove to be stories in our lives as Star Wars fans? So it was like, is he talking Knights of the Old Republic? That was very fun. I did not enjoy Fern calling him a dummy and saying this isn't a story, which is very reminiscent of

Wendell saying that he's too old for bedtime stories was not a fan of that. Quite rude, quite mean. Wim points out that this looks exactly like their home planet. And KB agrees, but also reminds them helpfully of what Kim shared last episode, which was, no, no, you got to read this. You got to do the Kim voice. Treat us to it. So maybe this is another planet co-founded with Atatürn. Is that what we're talking about? Yeah.

Continue with the quote below from last episode. Take us back. Oh, okay. There we go. Sorry. Okay. No, this scroll depicts the jewels of the old Republic. Planets of wonders kept hidden for their protection. Long ago, they were all destroyed except for one at Atten. Now only remembered in children's stories, pirate shanties, and rumors believed by fools. But I've always believed. I hope we

I hope we find an excuse every episode of the rest of the season to get your Kim voice in there. It's just wonderful. Absolutely wonderful. I was reminded the way in which it's like the exact same house made me think about like, because we already got that shot of the sprawling suburbs in the first episode, made me think of like the 1980s, like,

housing developments, planned communities, these like cookie cutter homes on different planets. I mean, obviously we're dealing with something else entirely because we've got the same tower. Like we're dealing with like exact same layout. Same school, same tower, same bus. Yeah, same school, et cetera. But yeah, I was thinking about that, about like, you know.

Which also makes me think of Back to the Future. Okay. Not for the last time today. Nope. On the Back to the Future front. This question of like reminding us that these planets were destroyed all but at an eight of the nine. This will be on our minds throughout this entire episode. Destroyed when and destroyed by whom?

Like, did this planet kill itself? You know, we're witnessing warring clans. Did they tear the place apart internally? Did the leaders of this Old Republic jewel great works mission decide to eliminate eight of the nine? Did outside forces come into play? Here's a promise from me to you, okay? If we ever encounter an owl cat or some other wise being that is giving us a little, like, download of something... You're going to ask a follow-up question?

And they used passive voice. They were all destroyed. I will say, by whom? By whomst. Like, you've got to tell me. And Kim would have at least some insight, some action. Kim's a cat owl librarian and collector. Nothing could be more wise. Oh, man. We see Joe, speaking of notable historical documents...

The exact same mural that we spent a lot of time remarking upon and discussing in previous pods. It is in the background of this sequence. It's like everything else kind of battered and destroyed, but we see the same figures in this mural. So we wondered, we speculated last pod, okay, were these the founders of Adat? And now it seems like are these the – we pan back.

Right? The people behind all of the jewels. All the planets, yeah. Whatever the great work proves to be, old Republic forces, et cetera, do each of the planets, did they have their own individual leadership? Is the supervisor a figure who loomed over all of them? Can't be.

Can't wait to talk about King Nohead. Yeah, there's King Nohead. And then there's like, it's not a corresponding statue, but there is a statue of Niels Reiss's extraction on Ad Aten, like a big statue. And so I don't know if like, it's not exactly the same, but in terms of like a huge figure statue, there is one, I think it's around like eight something minute mark in episode one of Ad

on at Atten. So yeah, we're like, did each of the figures in those murals are the founder of a different Hogwarts house? Who's to say? Wonderful stuff. Wonderful stuff. Joanna, what else would you like to say about this here? Well, we don't want to spoil the core premises of a few shows, so skip ahead if you don't want to be spoiled by potentially a show you've never seen. Hit the button two to three times. That should be sufficient. But

Silo, a show that you and I both seen. Incredibly difficult to not think about Silo throughout this entire episode. Or Fallout, a show that you have seen and I plan to catch up on. Yes, the Fallout vaults were very much on my mind. I plan to catch up on. Our listener Jake wrote in and says, "...people trapped slash kept in a mysterious place, prevented from leaving by mysterious unknown powers, only to find there's life outside the Silo slash barrier slash Lumen offices."

which is more dangerous slash confusing than anyone anticipated, especially now that we discovered there are other mysterious planets, silos outside of Ad Aden that were once the same, but have progressed in wholly unexpected and horrific ways. So Jake was like,

like noting the silo reference and the, and the severance reference. Uh, so I thought that was interesting. And also like the characters, um, at least, um, in, uh, you know, the, the band of warriors that we find ourselves with the, the Troiks, um, they've got these seven dot sigils and I'm just gonna, I'm just curious. I was curious about the seven dot sigil that they're all wearing because I'm like, which is presumably what their flag is, et cetera. Um,

Why would it be seven and not nine? Because we're talking about the nine planets. Is it seven because they're the seventh planet? If we go to other planets, will we see similar sigils with different numbers based on whichever planet they are in the system? That could be kind of fun. But that made me think about the Lost and the Dharma Initiative and the different sigils for different stations. Different stations. Yeah. Love that. Love that. Yeah. And we had talked last week about the – because it was actually like –

branded as a numeral and we were de-layering and decoding the numeral when we were with Kim, like that question of, okay, if that matched, that was pulled from Fern's badge, top of class, does that mean it's one? Like is that at planet number one? So we have now a couple bits of

potential evidence to support this idea. So that's, I mean, I think if we get it in a third planet next week, it'll be, it'll be a lock. That's, that's just, yeah, really, really fun. Have I ever told you? I'm sure I have. I know that I have because we've been podcasting for years, but my high school English teacher always used to say three trees make a row. Like when you're trying to prove something is true with supportive evidence from the text, you want three, at least three examples. Cause that's what, that's how you make a row. Three trees make a row. So, um,

I love it. If you just have two, you could be going in any direction and you don't know which direction. But if we have a third next week, we'll know. I can't wait. We'll have to wait another week. We will have to wait. I will have to. I can't wait, but I will have to wait to talk about it with you because we won't be potting on Skeletor next week. No, we won't. But we can send each other podito voice memos to tide ourselves over. Podcastitos. That'll be nice. Joanna Fern, you know, deduces, hey, somebody here might know about our home.

All these similarities, right? Let's go looking. But before we go on our little excursion with the kids, we got to pop back to the Onyx Cinder. We're going to go slightly out of order here just to put these two mini-Jodd SM33 scenes together here before we go back to the kids. Jodd is...

Just immediately going through all of the kids' possessions. Gloves on. Gloves on. He finds the little, the hollow with the holiday special circus that we saw Neil's siblings enjoying in the first episode in a different form. He finds the batteries. He does the little, like, let me test it by biting it classic pirate move right there. But I had to ask, Joanna, you've been enjoying some seasons of Survivor.

Did this give you the palpable going through a tribe mate's bag the second they're away vibes that it gave me? This was so like looking for an idol in somebody's backpack to me.

It didn't ping that for me, but I do want to say I do know who won Survivor and I'm not going to say it on this podcast. I haven't watched last night's episode. Don't tell me. I'm not going to say a single thing to you. Okay, cool. Don't tell me. I'm like living in terror of spoilers and the penultimate episode last week was so good and I'm terrified. I'm going to get it spoiled for you before I watch the finale. What if I had spoiled you on Survivor? I would have been

What a bulldoze. I have had survivor outcomes split for me before, and it has not had an impact really necessarily on the dramatic tension inside of the finale, but I would prefer not to. I'm not going to get to watch it just because of the workload this week until Friday night, and I'm like –

so scared it's going to be spoiled for me. If someone finds an idol in someone's bag, are you like, why didn't you hide it on your body, you fool, or tuck it under a rock somewhere? Plenty of crevices to shove it in on the island or your own person. Sometimes people are looking for, like, it could be a clue, right? It could be a piece of paper, an advantage, an idol, anything. Just anything to tell you what somebody has. But yeah, if people are leaving things in their bag and then leaving their bags at camp, it's difficult to take them seriously as a player of consequence. Great, great, great, great.

Oh, man. SM33 shows up and he's like, you're a thief. Stop stealing shit. And John's like, it's me, John. That does not mean, to be clear, though, that he is not a

thief who was stealing shit. I thought that was so funny. Yeah. Joe, take us through what we hear from 33 here because we start to really dive into the Joanna is right. We are going to see quickly that we've got some program to lie, malfunctioning memory stuff going on with our guy 33. So he knows we're not at At-At and he knows we're at At-Akron, at Akron, Ohio. And he's like, it's a dangerous place. I know it well.

And he's like, oh, Ad Atin, this place does remind me. And then just then, the rat that lives in his head sort of like, not just emerges and squeaks, but also maybe like Fs around with his circuitry. Yeah, like pull the wire or something. And then he says the classic, can't say I remember no Ad Atin. So listen, the rat that lives in his head, a clear pal of ours, whose name I guess canonically is Snowball. Delightful. Is he...

to make sure that SM33 doesn't give up the goods? Let me say this. I can't handle it. If that's what happens, I'm not prepared to cope. Anyway, Can't Say I Remember No at Atten is the name of this episode. Sure is. And as it turns out, we were right about something. That's so exciting when we are because sometimes we're wrong. Okay. And then we see Jod

gingerly leading SM33 out of the ship being like, all right, anything look familiar? Holding his elbow. And treasure. Yeah, so. I love too, we're going out of order with the scenes, but we got in the actual order of the episode, the cut from Strix like pounding his staff to SM33's foot. That was great.

But he's like, there was a tower. That's what SM33 remembers. Warriors, warriors like these, are they so like, and then we're about to get the warriors emerging from the fog, the Hattans. But like when he says we encountered warriors like these, snuck past them, we did. Was that on this planet at Akron or did they sneak past him on at Atten? We don't, we don't know.

I just thought this was wonderful. I thought Jude Law's acting with a droid was fantastic. The angling of the head, like up to kind of encourage him and look at it was so funny to me. I loved it. Yeah. And then can we hear one of the greatest lines in all of Star Wars history when the Hattons confront John, please? You there, what flag do you fly? You know what? Just shoot me.

Astonishing. Jude knows exactly what his assignment is in this project, and he is completing it with gold stars. With grace and dignity. A plumb, honestly. Um...

You wanted to point out that Jod doesn't use the Force here, right? Well, we don't see actually what happens. We hear what Jod says happens when he shows up with the OVC. He says he spent the dayteries on them. Did he? Does he still have them tucked in his boot, though? Like, did he kill a bunch of people? Did he dupe them with the Force? But in this moment, he doesn't use the Force. He's just like, go ahead and kill me. And I think more crucially...

He was taken by surprise by people who were mere feet away in a thin layer of mist. SM33 clocked them and he, allegedly force sensitive, Jod did not. So I think that's fascinating.

Very notable. I mean, obviously he's quite preoccupied with the, despite saying last week, you know, just a small reward, still very preoccupied with the prospect of treasure. But yeah, just the, again, like the lack of instinct to try to use the forces is very, I like what you're pointing out though, that we don't know what he does after. Does he use the force to attack? Does he Jedi mind trick people? Conveniently, we did not see. We have no clue. We have no clue. We don't, we just, we don't, we don't. Well,

and I think what's interesting is this question of like, we've been talking about like, okay, was John a Jedi or not a Jedi? Was he once, was he a Padawan? And like a lot of characters that we know in the star Wars universe sort of like ran off around order 66 and went into hiding and that sort of stuff. Or was he never a Padawan at all? And was he just like a force sensitive kid with like a teeny tiny M count? Uh,

who nonetheless hate his ability because any M count at all is enough to get you snapped up in this era. I don't think there's anything – I like the idea that he could have been pre-Padawan, like never – those skills were never cultivated. But tiny M count, I don't know. Nothing tiny about Jad. Like this is BDE central and this is –

Maybe he's compensating for like a micro-em. His micro-mitty. His mini-mitty, you know? I just can't believe it. I can't believe that Ratty is a narc and I can't believe that there's anything micro about John. But who knows? Just asking questions. Oh, man. All right, Jo. Let's meet the Troik.

We're back with the kiddos. Wim is, of course, playing lightsaber with just like a rusted metal rod. Neil is wheezing from the air quality. The smoke is clogging his trunk, Joanna. And if I had stronger lungs myself, I would offer them to Neil to take. But you're asthmatic, so it's a no. The allergies and the asthma. It makes me ill-suited as a source of aid for Neil. Yeah.

But if you could, you would. In this circumstance. But if I could, I would. The kids have not seen any people yet, despite hearing some fairly alarming sounds in the distance. But they do happen upon this just super normal, totally chill and cool giant headless statue that we recently discussed, King No-Head. We love a mysterious, looming, partially missing statue, Jo. Were you thinking about Lost here? Of course. Always thinking about Lost. Same.

Same. How could we not be? Lost. What a great TV show. You should watch it if you haven't. Anything else that you want to say? We already talked about the statue a little bit. Do you think this is the planet-specific leader and supervisor? Could this be a front, a false figurehead for the machine that is actually in control and in command? Anything else on the theory front here with the statue specifically?

I will say that there was, you know, they're sort of, someone fires a shot at the statue and they're all sort of standing there and they duck for cover and KB is just standing there and still staring and a really interesting, like a zoom in on KB kind of shot. And, you know, I've seen some people interpret this as like a lack of special awareness from KB, but like KB who is currently like clocking and calculating everything that like seems

Seems less likely to me than like some sort of echo of a recognition or analysis that will come to fruition later is my question. And that takes us to, is KB actually for sensitive theory quarter? We got a number of emails about this. I won't read them all out, but shout out to Chris and Declan and Trevor, who all brought up this theory of like,

KB is wearing this device. We have heard from her parents that she has, you know, a serious medical condition. Right. And that is seemingly the reason that she has this device on her. But, like, is she being... Does she have...

let's say a massive swinging M count that would put a jaw to shame. And is that, is, is she being suppressed? Has she, have they put a force dampener on her in some way? And they being whoever the, the, the supervisor, the droids, the power that be, why would you do that? Uh,

Would you dampen a Force-sensitive child because it's too dangerous to have someone who's Force-sensitive? They would figure out things that are going on. Would you do it to block anyone from seeking them out in the galaxy and finding them and kidnapping them? Right. Would it be something that was done for protection but becomes kind of insidious over time? Because...

the true reason for it is not being given. I think this is really compelling and interesting as a theory. We don't have to have strong force sensitive characters in a Star Wars story to make it that exciting. You can get by on a micro midi like Jod, but...

But I think it's really compelling, this idea of dampening, blocking her force powers. Because we see things throughout, like later when the kids are doing target practice, KB is a crack shot. The other kids are swinging wide and she is just like... That could be like the visor. It could. It absolutely could. And a lot of her stuff can be chalked up to the visor and her ability to sort of like calculate things. But like, I don't know. The other thing is...

our listener Dan wrote in to mention that KB was the name of a toy store in the eighties. Sure. And I just, I just need to let you know and to let Dan know that every time someone says KB, I do in my ear, in my head here, KB toy store where a kid can be a kid. Yeah. So yeah, we're on the same page with that. So are you, where, where like scale one to 10, where are you on this? Is KB force sensitive and being sort of,

clamped down and controlled in that way. I really like this. I'm also quite compelled by this for a number of reasons. I think, yeah, the tech does give us a lot of cover for the various things that happen, the heightened senses and awareness and precision that we see from KB. But, you know, first of all, it would be a very fun little payoff on the prior Fern job. KB, like, I guess, KB can use the Force 2 moment. I really,

really like the idea of Wim in terms of Wim's journey, having to confront the fact that a person he knows, a person who has become a friend, can use the Force, like that this was maybe around him on his planet all the time. But in terms of that sinister suppression from Wim,

the controlling forces on this planet, that just feels like so of a piece with what they are stitching together here. The lies that they are telling the inhabitants of these planets about the

the place they live and also about themselves, like the truths that they are depriving them of about their role, their place in the galaxy, about what the galaxy looks like, what happens in it, who they are, what they can do. It feels like this would fit in quite in a way that really enhanced all of that because it would be not only so, so personal and direct for one of our now primary characters, but

But it would connect to just such an obviously central primary thing in the Star Wars canon and then really amplify, I think, the –

the horror of it. So I don't think we need one of the kids to be force sensitive. I agree with that. But I do think this would really feel like a way to heighten the story that they're stitching together. I like this. It reminds me of there's a story Harrison Bergeron by Kurt Vonnegut where

everyone is made quote unquote equal by various like handicapping various things. So like if you're a graceful, beautiful ballerina, you had to wear like weights and a mask on your face to like hide your beauty, hide your grace and stuff like that. So it's just sort of like this equalizer. We're all equal under the supervisor. And if you've got the force, you've got this gear on your head to sort of hold you down. Yeah. I think that point about like the threat of detection feels really intriguing to me, but then also just on the sinister front, like,

Okay, it would be bad enough, horrible enough to stifle and dampen somebody's force power, but then you tell their parents they're sick. They have a medical condition? Yeah, exactly. That is horrific. All of it would be horrific if that's what's happening. I'm intrigued. Great theory, corner fodder. Wonderful stuff.

Our group has been detected. Neil gets a little poke in the bum from a blaster. And then on the other side of the group, Hannah arrives. We are treated to a very amusing little exchange about the name of the group. We're, we're, we're like, uh, none of our kids can understand the accent, the French accent that Hannah has. This was very cute. Very funny. Um, our listener, Olivia, uh,

when, when Hannah shows up with her thick French accent and her, and her gun, uh, and her, and her sort of, uh, scraggly beauty. Um, Olivia said, please tell me I'm not the only one who saw the badass blaster toting French girl in the woods. And immediately thought mini Rousseau. That's another lost reference lost. It's a great show. You should watch it. Um, I do want to say on the accent corner front, uh, this actress is, uh, American. She was in venom three, uh, among other things. Uh, sure. Um,

I can only presume that they cast Matthew Kasowitz, who is a French man, and then asked this actress to sort of match his accent. But I have seen this accent described in and around the interwebs as Russian, Israeli...

French is pretty – anyway, it's a wild little accent, but listen, they're space French. So who's to say what they actually sound like? But it did sound somewhat Israeli from time to time, I will say. Oh, man. She did her best, and she was lovely. She was wonderful. And she's with another character who I will be referring to as just a little asshole based on a subsequent scene that we'll get to in a few minutes. But, you know –

Demand the names. Who are you? Wim, as usual, is not only not afraid, he's excited. Are you guys like an army of kids battling the adults over control of the planet? What do you think Wim is going to make of Andor when he finally gets to catch up on newer Star Wars stories and he's like, Canary, this seems dope. Frankly, I think it's going to ruin all other Star Wars stories for him.

Oh, it changes the iPad consumption forever for when after he gets to partake in Andor. Yeah. There's a sound. Hannah tells them to take cover and she just unloads this sick swinging kick move to load into a bus. She will later slide down.

But later when she flips away for no reason, Hannah's just like, if I can parkour it, I will. And that feels like very love Daniels of her. Oh, yeah. That's a real Daniels touch. Every time she did one of these things, Wham shouted, whoa, and got...

Frankly, so did I. The hiding out in a dilapidated bus was real Stranger Things season two. For me, I was like waiting for the demodogs to show up as our pals huddled in their bus. What did this ping for you? Yeah, I can't tell if it's because I'm 72 hours away from our annual Lord of the Rings watch party, but I was thinking of our hobbits cowering under the tree. That's usually what happens when people are cowering and someone walks behind them. I'm like, that's crazy.

Dark Riders. Fewer scary bugs and insects in this sequence, thankfully, though the Hattans, the enemy patrol as it passes, they've got like a fucking tank. They're armed. It's genuinely scary. A lot of their gear is like old Imperial gear, which I guess backs up this later claim that they do trade occasionally on this planet. Yeah.

Got to get those munitions somehow. I have so many questions about that General Strick's reveal. That bus sequence is where Neil's trunk is quivering in the most precious thing I've ever seen in my life. If anyone, again, missed that and would like to check it out, nine minutes and 42 seconds. All right, let's go meet General Strick's. Haina uses hand signals to gain entry to the Troik base, which is Joanna the school. Mm-hmm.

They're not taking assessment in this school. All kids left behind. All kids left behind on that acronym. Fertile. Whether it is the camp in the entryway, the camp up on the roof, it is rough stuff for Troik HQ. Mm-hmm.

On your knees, little asshole says, you kneel before General Strix, the leader of the Troika, the one true king of Westeros. No, sorry. I did get Stannis vibes here. I did. Titles, titles, titles, titles. The one true ruler of Akron. Joanna, please tell us again who we are seeing here.

And why it's a meaningful moment for you and Chris and Andy. Okay, it's for different reasons. So this is Matthew Kasowitz, who Chris and Andy know best from the Bureau Le Bureau, the French version of The Agency. This guy is basically in that show played the Michael Fassbender role, the lead. So it was my bait to try to get Chris and Andy interested in Skeleton Crew. Ongoing. They both got excited, though. Yeah.

I mean, they are obsessed with the Bureau. Their obsession led to a specific version of the watch logo made in the image of the Bureau at one point in time during COVID. I missed that entire thing. I will send it to you. It's amazing. I'm going to send it to you. Fantastic. For me, when I saw his telltale Gaelic nose, I was like, I know that face.

um matthew cassavis is also the male lead in amelie he is the nino kakampwa the uh the like original manic pixie dream boy who works at a porn shop and also at the carnival and is uh just the dreamiest french boy of uh the early aughts ue kwan indeed but yeah he's here uh in a wild like i don't know it's a wild casting choice for this like

surely microscopic role and again i think most actors anywhere in in the global cinematic space if you say will you come to a star world they'll say yeah sure oh what um anyway uh magic has a vince i should also say directed a wonderful french film called the hain so um just thrilled to see him here what a what a joy

He was sensational. Delightful. You know, I dream of you always. So here he is. I'd make a plum cake for you in a second. It's fine.

Joe, was there anything about the language of Troik-Hattan that you wanted to delve into here? Well, I was just curious. Like, they're so distinctive and Hattan is so close to At-Atten that it's just sort of like a Troik-Troika or Troik-Trio. I was just sort of like, what, you know, often when you, and we'll get to sort of this trope of this like ongoing war kind of sci-fi plot we've seen before in certain things, but often the names of the warring factions are,

Yeah.

Yeah. And the language of the planet names is so interesting too with that Akron and that Atten and the others we eclipsed in this episode. I saw someone, I think it was on Reddit, say like they were wondering if AT stood for like artificial terrain or something. You know what I mean? Like if there was just like a, you know, a

a prefix to these planets that meant was an acronym for this, whatever this project was, you know, at acronym. Fascinating to learn that they all start with that. Hatton is giving me Hatfields, but Troik is not giving me McCoy. I don't know.

McCoy's? McCoy's? I can see the vision. Oh, I like that. That's my favorite thing I've heard so far. So I support it. The half-hills of the McCoys. Great stuff. These offworlders little assholes have offered their meaningless names. But General Strix is

He likes the energy. When Fern is like Captain Fern, actually, he bangs his staff in what we will learn is signature fashion. And he wants to know, hey, small, strange children, are you warriors? Like... Normal. Neil is, of course, incredibly alarmed and points out that they are kids, kids.

Strix is unfazed. He says, we treat our kids like adults here. We acknowledge their strength, he says. He adds, if we didn't honor our children, then my daughter Haina never would have saved you. And I thought this was a fascinating mix because on the one hand, this is like

Kind of what Fern and Wim are after, right? A parent who lets you be independent, who takes you seriously. Yeah. Who respects you like an adult. But then obviously what is the – we swing quickly into like – and then deploys you as a child soldier, which is obviously just objectively –

And we've had this note for the Jedi Order for some time. It's just not good. Yeah. It makes me think of Coraline or there's other versions of this in sci-fi fantasy of like the other mother. Like what's the bizarro version? You meet the like bizarro version of your parents. Right.

often played by the same actor, who is like exactly what you've always wanted and then you find out, oops, that's not actually what I wanted. Yeah. Exactly. What I really want is a workaholic father who shames me for my desire to read fantastic stories. Hands me a wad of batteries and sends me about my day. Honestly, not bad. The life of a Lachie child. General Strix, he calls them brave. He goes down the entire line. He pinches Neil's cheek. He asks them what they seek and they say,

Home. Directions? Home. Strix tells them, this is what you referenced a few minutes ago, sadly, we do not concern ourselves with off-worlders beyond trading hides for munition. I thought this was so interesting because obviously that is not the same as what we see on Ad Aten, which is you cannot go beyond the barrier. Nobody can leave. They've never seen stars. They don't know what's out there. They've never interacted with anybody outside of their planet. Right.

The citizens of Ad Akron are trading hides for munition. They are engaging in space trade. That means they have some means of contact with the outside world. My theory is that

The Onyx Cinder broke the seal on the barrier here. And then, like, a bunch of pirates. Because it doesn't sound like something you would get from pirates. We trade hides for, like, random war bric-a-brac junk that they've collected from various, like, you know, from Jakku or wherever else they're finding this stuff. I don't know. It's very interesting to me. Yeah.

This is absolutely fascinating. Fascinating. When mass after maps, star charts, anything that could help. And Haina mentions the knowledge hidden in the Fallen Sanctum. Capital F, capital S, Fallen Sanctum. Fallen Sanctum. This is the supervisor tower from at Atten, as we will see. Coordinates to other planets await. And her father says, Strix says, it's too dangerous.

of a road to travel. But if you all train with my warriors and prove your worth, if you can... For at least a few hours. 20 minutes. At least one meal. The time it takes to secure and consume one daily ration. Prove that you can be of use, which of course means as weapons of war. Then we'll consider taking you to the sanctum.

So it's time for some tiny warrior training. And Fern, KB, and Wim are moving through this training course, but not Neal.

He is uncomfortable with this. And Haina calls him wise for not wanting to join in with his friends. And initially, we think that we're going to have some sort of tender moment that we will eventually build toward. But here, at this moment in time, it is just because she thinks he wants to see a bigger gun. She pulls him by the trunk, and frankly, this was outrageous. This is a relationship that I was very won over by very quickly, but the pulling by the trunk was not acceptable. The trunk is so interesting because when John says, move your trunk, right? So it's like, move

Move your ass, right? Is the trunk. Can someone plug his trunk? I don't talk with my trunk. My trunk is clogged by the air. Like what appendage is the trunk at the end of the day? You know, but it's a very intimate moment. And Neil didn't seem to mind. Oh, man. She takes Neil to the roof, Joe.

There's another encampment up here. We see an Ithorian yet again. We get to see a little bit of the rhythm of life here. Somebody is like hanging laundry to dry on an old pipe. There's a meal station for the daily ration. And Hannah takes Neil over to secure that daily ration. And as they wait for their portions, Neil shares a very important observation. He says, this planet is so different from mine.

Why are you in a war? And I just really loved, like, in this episode, tracking how each of the kids is processing what they're confronting here because Wim is like, it's exactly the same. And for Neil, he's like, okay, the thing that matters when we're assessing what's the same and what's different is not what buildings are here. Is there an RX series droid on the bus? It's

How are people living their lives? Yeah, yeah. And so to him, it's not the same at all, right? It is radically different. And that just told us so much about him. So I really loved that moment. On the second part, though, why are you in a war? What does Hannah say?

She says that they stole their Aeopes, right? That's the current battle. And then they'll burn down their granaries in retribution. She says, quote, the old ones say each generation grows weaker, but when my father dies, I'll be the one to lead my clan to victory, right? So the old ones say generations grow weaker. We have questions about what happened in Ad Aten and the older generations and memory and how it works on these planets. My grandpa says, yeah. And I, um,

I have questions about this as it relates to a couple shows we love. Because I was reminded of an episode of Doctor Who and an episode of Avatar The Last Airbender. Yes. And an episode of Doctor Who, The Doctor's Daughter. The Doctor and his companions crash land on a planet where there is a war, an ongoing war. And they've been warring for, quote, generations. And then...

what it turns out is that they're clones and it's many, many generations of cloning. And it turns out the war has only been going on for about a week. Now that's not,

what's happening here, obviously. Right. This has been a long time, but in terms of like many generations in time and since time immemorial and we can't even remember how the war started, there are House of the Dragon-esque sort of big ideas you could assign to that in terms of like who knows what started the war. You know, that's certainly worth thinking about. Rhaenys would love Skeleton Crew and so would Sir Simon Strong. But,

But in a sci-fi fantasy world, is it possible that the war started, you know, or were they manipulated into war? You know, can they not remember for more insidious reasons? In Avatar The Last Airbender episode, The Great Divide, when they meet two factions of the Earth Kingdom that have been warring for an incredibly long time, they have this whole story about how the war started. Right.

And Aang, who if you don't know in Avatar The Last Airbender has been on ice for a very long time, is like, actually, I know this story. It was a game. It wasn't a battle. You're talking about a game that two kids played and you've crafted this whole generational war around it. Yeah.

So again, I'm curious. I don't know if we'll ever know because I don't know. I presume we're leaving this planet quite quickly. I feel like we said goodbye to characters on this planet already. So I don't know how deeply we're diving into the source of the war here, but I just think it's worth...

Thinking about in the context of memory and generations and forgetting and all of that, you know, and what is the story you've been fed? Right. All of that is interesting to me. I love that. Those are both great comps to consider. And like, especially in the context of the story where in general, there's this looming specter of like how little awareness there is, right? Missed the war? Yeah.

You know? Coruscant, Alderaan, like, so little awareness about the state of galactic affairs. Like, these characters are even more ripe to just inherit and accept something without...

truly understanding the root cause of it. And so just like, I agree with you. I think we're, we're, my assumption is that we'll leave this planet at the beginning of the next episode. Maybe we'll already be in transit and we will go to another one of the ads that they did discover coordinates for and on the pillars and basically go planet to planet to see our, okay, are the ad at and coordinates blasted off on all of them.

or can we find them on one of them? That's my assumption about the ensuing travel. And so I think the question of whether we will learn exactly what the origin of the conflict was

On this planet, on Ad Akron, I don't know. But the question to me is like, is the answer different from whatever the circumstances are on all the others? Or is it the same across those eight? So I do think we'll get that, like, well, what led to the destruction of the eight? And then is there specificity inside of that? I don't know. I have a theory. I have like two theories that ping off of this as we let Theory Corner bleed into the episode, I will say. In terms of what happened to Locke at Atten Down...

So no one can come in and no one can come out, whether it's an algorithm or droids or whoever running this, or it's an insidious, a human with an insidious plot, who's to say, but there's a possibility if we're analyzing data constantly on that, and if that's our job for constantly running scenarios and that sort of stuff, is it, is the question of like, how do we build a utopia? And is the question is the answer. If you break the seal on the planet, like,

war is inevitable. It's human nature. There will always be a star war. And the only way to have star peace is to just completely isolate ourselves via the algorithm. That's what the algorithm has told us is true. That was just sort of the theory that crept up in my mind is, is the war that is, is at Akron and cautionary tale of what can happen if we let outsiders into the planet. And so in order to preserve our, our,

but utopian suburban existence. Yeah. We have sort of blocked ourselves off from everyone. Yeah. I think that seems most likely

Likely to me as well that the nine jewels are intended as like a reserve. Yeah, an experimental, isolated, separate society that will be kept free of all of the other things more than otherwise that plague the rest of the galaxy. Yeah.

Like the other shows we mentioned earlier in the episode and told people if they didn't want to hear, they should hit fast forward. So I won't mention them by name again, but that's like why it's most on my mind with those shows. Totally. The other possibility that's on my mind after this episode, though, is like, and these are sinister in different ways, on the experiment front.

Could one of the planets have been intentionally set up to test like warring tribes, clans, factions? You know, the idea of munitions being so central on this planet, that massive roof cannon. Now we both think like, okay, Chekhov's school roof cannon is probably on at Atten too and going to come into play. That seems most likely to be clear. It's very convenient that Neil got to see how you pull that up out of the roof. Crank that out. Yeah. Yeah.

That seems most likely, I think, for sure. But it's not, like, impossible to me that the heavy cannon fire is, like, specific to the setup of this planet, and that's one of the things they're testing here. Like, on the language front, at Akron, Akron being similar to, like, the Greek, you know, river of Hades, the idea that this could have been, like, a hellscape planet and part of an experiment, and then, like, what are the tests maybe that are specific to each? Like, if at Akron,

Aten is like the finance center, et cetera. Like we speculated, like does each planet have a specific purpose or a thing that the great work is testing about society? I think the former thing that you're outlining seems more likely to me. But this doesn't seem impossible. It's like, this is the banking planet. This is like war planet. This is the, I don't know, agriculture planet. Can't wait to go there and have a snack. Speaking of snacks, Neil gives away

way like neil in like the most uh i'm not trying to impress you but i've just really impressed you i can't help it yeah gives away it's just who i am

Gives away his meal, even though he's a little cute boy who loves a meal and a snack. Gives away his meal to these starving kiddos in a true riffraff street rat Aladdin move. Loved this from Neil, our guy. This was so cute. I do believe that Neil should rule the galaxy. I don't think it's too soon to say that. Maybe that's.

Maybe that's the end of the social experiment. Maybe Neil is actually the giant statue on Adat and it's supposed to be Neil as an adult and he is the Kwisatz Haderach of this experiment. I'm in. Bring out of life. Let's go. Pairs wonderfully with some onyx cinder space gruel. It's the Lisan Al-Gaib, Neil. Amari!

We see the cannon. This weapon still works from the old days. Capital O, capital D. My goodness. And Neil wonders if this is fair. And it isn't, Joe. He says, this isn't fair. You shouldn't be at war all the time. He looks over. He points to the neighboring building. He's like, that's where on my planet my mom works. And he says, quote, when I'm done with school,

The supervisor will give me a job there, too. It's peaceful. And this was an important moment in the episode. Yeah. Because, you know, again, we're mostly, like, so in the bag for Neil, and we're really awed in this episode by his courage and his bravery and the things that he knows. He's willing to say what he believes is right, and that's a hard thing to do. Mm-hmm.

But this moment, it's like a push-pull thing. Wanting that, accepting that, longing for that, like, controlled existence is not – that's not true peace. That's false peace. That's peace because you don't know that you have anything else on offer to you. And so Neil breaking out of that really, like, sheltered, contained existence, I'm excited to see the rest of that journey for him. Yeah. Sweet Neil. I love him.

We get kind of a, like, tell me the waters of your home world, Usul. A Johnny moment from Haina here. She's like, I'm at it. And like, no conflict there. What's up with that? This is where Neil explains slap ball. It's an incredible moment. This kid is so good.

absolutely love that he's like, you can't fact check me on this. And so I'm just going to say that I was the best. I thought this was fucking great, though it was pretty tough when she's like, your clan must be very weak then. However, it did lead to a wonderful moment. Yes. Can I just say really quickly before we do that? I was looking up interviews with Robert Timothy Smith, who voices Neil, because I just find him so darling. And I was just sort of like, this kid is so good. And he...

was clear to credit Casey Barrowman who is like the performance so similar to the Mandalorian I don't know how often we're seeing Robert Timothy Smith as Neil and how often we're seeing Casey Barrowman as doing like the movements for Neil but whichever one of them did the slap ball gestures 10 out of 10 no notes but sensational stuff if that was you Casey great job if it was you Robert Timothy Smith even your name is adorable great job

That is a cute name. Isn't it? Robbie Simeon. Darling. Oh, man. Neil sits on the edge of the roof and he reflects. And we just need to hear this entire thing. John. We never have to fight for anything. We have always had to fight just to survive. We fight for food. We fight to protect our friends. We are strong. Fighting is... Fighting is bad. Fighting is bad.

If you just keep rating each other, do you think it'll even ever end? Yes. If it was me, I'd just say I was sorry. No more fighting. But that's probably just because I get too scared because I'm from a weak clan. Never mind. You shouldn't listen to me. Chill and assume and hold me. My god. I mean, this was... I honestly could barely handle this. This was so...

So, so sweet. We got this email from our listener, Kevin, who says, to quote-slash-paraphrase the great Mallory Rubin, the preeminent television historian of our time, quote, is the moment Neil scooted over on the bed... It was a ledge, but sure. Scooted over on the ledge a bit just to be slightly closer to his crush, the greatest moment in TV history. I think it might be certainly the cutest. Yes, the little scooch. Unbelievable stuff. It was the way that...

Neil sits down on that ledge cross-legged, which does not look like the way a child sits to me, which made me think it was the performance artist. There was something quite adult about the way that they... But the scooch over, the little minute scooch over to be closer to her. Oh, yeah. It's so cute. Well, Neil is very emotionally mature.

So perhaps that's why it seemed like an adult-like gesture. This was just wonderful. I just thought this was so sweet and heartwarming. And like Neil knowing that this fight is bad and wrong and saying like, let's just make peace and say sorry, but also like having to learn to push for peace.

what he thinks is right is just like an incredible thing to watch. It's just beautiful. That was like not even the most emotional Neil moment of the episode, which is really saying something unbelievable. We get the story about how his little brother knocked him into the credenza and he sprained his trunk. Do you think that it's too soon to formally inform Runa that Neil and Haina will be getting married? What do you think? A little child soldier stole your man, Runa. I'm so sorry to tell you this bad news, but it's over.

My very favorite comment I saw on the red boards this week was someone wrote, no one's going to believe that Neil has a girlfriend on Space Canada. Oh, man. Incredible. How many people saw the little peck on the cheek? That's really... I don't know. That's what we need to know. But I feel like only Wim will really back him up. Maybe KB. Fern won't. Oh, man. God. Speaking of Fern, KB, and Wim, they are training below.

When Neil and Kena return, they're like, where were they? Great little moment there. Real middle school energy. Wim can't wait to show off, you know, adjusting the strength on the blaster setting, immediately knocks himself on his ass. Great stuff. Strix is like, you guys are ready to go to war. To war, then! To war, then! It's always nice when Aegon can join us for the pod. You know, Fern's like, thanks for the generous offer, but no thank you. And Strix makes it clear that that is...

not an offer. No, no, no thank you is not an offer today. So that's alarming. And one of his lieutenants is like really happy to point out that even talking of desertion will get you shot. So, you know, all that like, hey, yeah, you let us go to the mall on our own cool dad energy really recedes in a, with a quickness in this episode. Tough stuff from our guy General Strix, particularly

when he is menacing toward Neil, right? He growls at him. He pressures him. And his own daughter, Hina, moves forward to stand by Neil's side. Neil tells her she doesn't have to, and she says, I thought you might be nervous. And he replies, I'm terrified. And she says, when I feel that way, it's better to be with a friend.

I just like – I might cry. I was actually genuinely moved to tears by their parting in a few minutes. Like I was so touched by their relationship in the episode. I just really thought it was lovely. But like his little monologue, right, as he's walking forward, it is better to be with a friend. But let me just say as a friend, this isn't right.

I'm not just saying this because I'm scared, even though I am scared. But I mean, fighting in a raid, I don't want to hurt anybody. The really brave thing would just make peace already.

He's the best. He is the best. He's obviously right. I loved the filming of this sequence where he is the reluctant party, but he has walked without even realizing it toward the front of the group. He's a leader. He's embracing his role as a leader, and that's so, so, so cool to watch.

You said earlier that hearing John say, like, just shoot me already was one of the most important things that we got to hear in this episode, but I know it was second on your list. Please take us through what happens next. I think we should just hear this without any setup. John, will you play it? Yes, yes, yes, yes! Yes, yes, yes, yes!

Wow. Sometimes we hear something without the visual accompaniment when we're potting, and it is even more astonishing than we remembered. Holy shit. That is two-time Oscar nominee Jude Law fully committing to the role as he calls the AOP, right? He emerges from the... First, we hear that in the distance, and we think it's something menacing coming for us, when in fact it is jawed,

And SM33 and the herd of AOPs coming out of the mist where John says like, here's the AOPs you were looking for. And, you know, Strix is like, you can have everything you want. He's like,

these four the little ones the little ones I need them and it's just like so charming the boys come and like hug him the girls stay behind which felt like a really nice echo of earlier when he asked them their names and the boys are like wham Neil and the girls don't he's like now we know each other right but even first she's like jad you you came like you saved us the Neil hug

Here's an email from our listener, Mark. They all just want to be you, Mallory. Mark says, I'm not prone to hyperbole, so I feel confident saying that when our new best buddy in the whole world, Neil, gave space daddy Jude Law a hug in this most recent episode, I believe we witnessed the greatest moment in Star Wars history. I know what you're thinking. That's crazy. But of all the great moments in the galaxy far, far away, has a single one included a kind and understanding elephant who will support your desire for adventure, come up with a secret handshake,

Play fake lightsaber battles whilst making the whoosh noise, even though all he really wants to do is homework, graduate and go to work. Hugging Jude, quote, once put glasses on in a movie and made the entire audience moan, law, see the holiday. Spoiler alert. No, they fucking don't.

Oh, did I mention the hug is the result of Jude, quote, literally received an Oscar nomination because I am too hot to handle law, saving Neil from people who want to turn our sweet boy into a soldier? I rest my case. Mark, a compelling email if ever I heard one. Yes! And the fact that you included an allusion to Dickie Greenleaf, the hottest human has ever looked,

Earns you extra points. So thank you so much for that email. Fantastic email from Mark and a fantastic moment in the history of story. Of cinema, of our culture, our lives as interior thinkers. John, can we hear it one more time before we move on?

I think that needs to make it to the soundboard. That needs to become a permanent staple. Let's get that memo to Steve. That's a must. So good. Joanna, it is time to head to the Fallen Sanctum. I'm sure everything will be fine there. Do you think that's going to be what they're going to call the next Jurassic World film? Jurassic World colon Fallen Sanctum? Fallen Sanctum sounds pretty cool. It really does. Yeah.

It's good branding. It is. Like, I don't want to go to the fallen sanctum when I hear that it's called the fallen sanctum and yet I can't stay away, which brings us to Haina helpfully reminding her father, we did make a pledge. Mm-hmm. They're heading, she is going to guide them toward the fallen sanctum and as they go, this is where Jod regales them with the tale of his bravery. Uh, uh,

freely telling on himself in the process by revealing that he went through their shit and stole their batteries that's why i like work from john that's why i have like some questions did he actually spend those batteries or does he still have them i don't know i like it seemed awfully sloppy so they're gonna discover in turn the horde that he has kept maybe i like it i like it

Haina points to the sanctum. It is the same tower as on at Atten, as we noted, the supervisor's tower. And KP reminds us like on at Atten, no one's allowed up there. Okay. Can't wait to go to the supervisor's tower on at Atten. Excited to find out what's waiting up there. Yeah.

Great and powerful. Sounds great. Indeed. A musical number, perhaps? Could be. Okay. SM33, of course. We get the little, like, can't say I remember no at at, and Fern is getting pissed. Like, we know her frustration with this repeating line is mounting. Anything on the...

Visual Frontier. The tower looks exactly... It is the identical tower on Annat and on Ad Akron, and they both look like the... I'm going to try to pronounce this. It's a tower in East Berlin. The Berliner Fernsturm? Wow, that sounded like a fancy term and a shitty accent. Anyway...

It's a TV tower in East Berlin. But I like if that is the visual reference that they were using because, and there's also some like brutalist architecture around in these sort of planned development areas. And I am, yeah, I wonder if they're going for that sort of like rigid lockdown East Berlin war sort of look. So, yeah. Yeah. Interesting. Interesting. It's a beautiful tower in Chalmany. Yeah.

Less so in its fallen sanctum state here, certainly. Hannah says, this is where I leave you. And Neil's like, run away with me. Plenty of room in my home. Wait till you see how big the bathtub is. We've got space. And we're treated to the clip that we opened today's episode with, which was perfection in every respect. She is determined to stay, but she makes it clear that Neil has had an impact on her. Perhaps someday when I am leader of the Troik, I will remember your ways. I see now.

Your weakness, it makes you kind. And my world could use some kindness. Joanna, Neil got his wear it like art.

moment. Like this thing that other people might make him feel bad about can be a source of not only goodness, but inspiration for others. Like this was so beautiful. And the way we moved right from that to the comedy of Jod cock blocking him by interrupting and the way that that felt so like seamless and natural was just the show in miniature to me so far. I loved it. It reminded

I don't need to get too personal here on a Thursday morning before our holiday break, but I will just say that like growing up, I was told again and again by like,

that I was too sensitive, which is true. But then I had a therapist once tell me that like the sensitivity was my strength. And even if that was just like a lie, she fed me really like did great things for me in my life to like be told that the thing that you think is like your biggest flaw, your weakness is actually like a strength. I was like, what? And she was like, yeah, she really convinced me. And I'm like, so I choose to believe it's true. And I feel like Neil got the same treatment. Your sensitivity is,

Your kindness is not weak. It's strong, actually. Your open heart, your empathy. And you get a little smooch-a-roo and a little flip kick from your crush on her way out the door. Absolute icon. Love it. Every other crush in Neil's life is going to have a tough time measuring up, I think. Bruna, I am rooting for you, genuinely. But we'll have to see. Yeah.

Our crew makes their way, Joe, to the tower. Jod hotwires the lift, and like everywhere else on this planet, it is a ruin. And when Neil asks if anyone sees a map to Ad Aten, SM-33 and Fern do their same little dance routine. Again, it is building, building, building, building. And then we find some writing on the pillars. Jod translate it. That says, at A2.

And these are galactic coordinates. And then they start going pillar to pillar at Akron, where they are, at Arisia, at Araven, at Akoda. So presumably the equivalent tower on all nine of the planets, all nine jewels, have these coordinates, right? This is like a network inside of the Great Work, we assume. When Neil finds the Adat and Pillar, though...

The coordinates are gone. They've been struck. And who struck them? Because we are asking follow-up questions. We sure are. And SM33 is just like, oh yeah, I do. It was me. Tough stuff. Take us to rep.

Fern also asks, like, when? Again, we're asking good follow-up questions. When do you do it? When I was here before with my old captain, is what he says. And then he gets confused and he gets, he's sort of glitching out. And KB's like, hmm, memory repair. Like, in her sort of tech savvy. And then Fern flips out. And she marches off. And she's like, this is too much, too scary, too overwhelming. And I love this sequence between the two of them. And, like, Fern...

Fern in the first two episodes, like I understood what they were going for. And I kind of, I love like a bossy tall girl in general, but like Fern was like coming in so hot in those first couple episodes in a way that like I didn't love, but, uh,

we loved a character on an arc and the way that she's arcing here is very satisfying and like her vulnerability and her tears here and letting whim of all people see her, see her be a scared kid. Again, that reminds me of the Goonies in terms of like, as they go through the caves and stuff like that, there are characters like Mikey or whomever, Andy, who have these like moments of like,

Where you were just like, you were really reminded they're just kids. Yeah. On this like extremely dangerous adventure. Yeah. And, and then she's like going back and forth with women. She's like, wait a minute. There was that moment in the first episode that Mallory and Joanna found extremely problematic. When I forced my nanny droid to alter her programming. That was a tough one. Um,

And it turns out it was there for a reason. And that, to me, is further fuel for your theory that everything that Fern says in that first episode about, like, the rumors and stuff like that is going to wind up paying off. Because, again, this is the kind of show where, like, nobody says anything unless it's going to pay off later. I can't wait to find out who the proctor sent down below the school. I truly can't wait to find out. I loved that, like, epiphany came on the heels of, like you're saying, the vulnerability breaking through the bravado. But then also, like, Fern saying...

in response to that, that just kind of astonishing level of praise from Wim, like, I don't want to have to be the one to figure it out all the time. That was so interesting and cool. Yeah. Like it's a lot, it's a lot for anyone to carry. She doesn't want to, and she doesn't want to be like top of the class hall monitor, like all the things that her mom puts on her. Exactly. Yeah. So I really, I really liked that. Like you want to be the leader, you want to be the captain, but also then that means you have to be the one who makes sure everyone else is okay. And like that,

That's hard. That's actually really hard, no matter how old you are. So I really like that. Okay. It's the moment of Joe's theory bearing fruit in real time. Can't say that he remembers. No, I added because he has been programmed such and not only programmed for that, programmed to rip limb from limb. Limb from limb.

Anyone, rend them limb from limb. Anyone who comes asking questions, poking around. I'm getting real big. I love your, if you're not watching some video, Valerie just made herself big.

roll bag, big Mal, you know, and again, that's a payoff for something we've seen before. We've seen him do this, make himself big to intimidate John, make himself big to attack the pirates. And so like to see him do it here against our kids, our heroes is just like, again, that's like a great payoff. Pull them apart. Lim from Lim.

We have questions. We don't know if SM-33 and his unnamed captain and the crew went to the other jewels or if this is the first place they went and they took these coordinates, struck them off the pillar and went straight to Ad Aten from there. Or if we're going to find similar coordinates struck off of the pillars, the corresponding pillars and the other planets that we presume we're going to go to. The captain killed any of his crew. That's right.

that saw the coordinates. Killed them dead. That's a Treasure Island moment. That's a Captain Flint and Treasure Island moment. So like, he makes himself big. And then if you're like, I wonder if the Daniels directed this episode. We get what's called the SnorriCam, which is this like rig that you can put on a character that we saw a lot in Everything Everywhere All at Once. You also see it in...

some of their other work. And so this is like an iconic Daniels visual of, and it's scary. SM33 looks very,

very scary yeah john is trying to save the day a bit uh but his blaster is not working the kids are scared they're hiding behind it's that micro mini god damn it john won't function john was tracking this whole exchange too with such interest like you know he's picking up every clue to try to he's doing he's podcasting right he's like what am i gonna find

Come on House of R. Come on House of R, John. Please. You can keep the gloves on. It's fine. So all this happens and then our beloved Neil, in case you were at any doubt this is a Neil episode, Neil hurls a bit of rubble over at SM33. A real Neville Longbottom moment for our guy Neil. Ten points to Neil! Yeah.

And then he gets in trouble. He's like, oh my God, oh my God. I'm just a small little elephant. Oh my God, oh my God. And then John does like a very like athletic lunge for the off switch. This was unbelievable. No, no. Like we're in the red zone. He dove over the goal line and didn't fumble. I know what all of those words mean. Like fully extended. Always go for the off switch. I loved when he stood up and he's brushing himself off feeling like hot shit and like waiting to be praised. And then all he had to do. Oh my God. Neil, like I want.

I was re-watching that clip a couple times. So good. The fact that the last line of the episode is like, oh, he fainted. And then it's just like cut to black. It's just over. Oh my God, sweet Neil. What an episode of television. It was delightful. Absolutely delightful. Had a great time. I'm really going to miss talking about it next week. I can't wait. But then we'll have the pleasure of talking about two episodes at once. Yeah, great stuff.

Joanna, it's Totally Wizard, a Totally Wizard episode. And you know what else is Totally Wizard? The Easter eggs. I just want everyone to know that Mal said it's Totally Wizard off pod earlier. It was great. It was the thrill of her lifetime. I felt so alive. Easter eggs. Did you have a favorite? So...

I think it has to be when Wim blasts himself backwards on his bum after cranking up the dial on the blaster that he's using. It's very Marty McFly in Back to the Future, blowing himself back by the amp. So that has – I think it's Back to the Future. Yeah. How about you? That's a good one. Yeah. I was thinking of you because there were so many like –

The treasures. Treasure Planet and Treasure Island references and Goonies in this episode. I think I just really, I'm going to go with an Easter egg just inside of this series. Like, I really got excited by the identical mural in the living room. That was thrilling. Yeah, it was really fun. It was really fun that this is all, like, your planet, but

a war a war to war then to war then yeah that's at my my mind like racing I really liked that um yeah Captain Flint Ben One-Eyed Willie One-Eyed Willie

Great stuff. Delightful. Oh, that was a thing, a Goonies thing that I was thinking about. Like, we have the looming threat of the other pirates. Space Urkel. Yeah. Brutus, et cetera, et cetera, like, are on the lookout. Bounty hunters, et cetera. And I was thinking about, and people have, they were talking about Ad Adnan spilling, you know, batteries all over, um,

Sloppy. You know, tough. So I was thinking in the Goonies, as our kids are going on this adventure, blah, blah, blah, there are the villains that are the Fratellis who are, you know, sort of tracking hot on their heels. Yes. And so this idea that like we've got the other space pirates as sort of the Fratellis who are like...

a few steps behind them on this adventure. Are they going to show up at Akron? Are they show up at Kim's and then at Akron sort of tracing them on their way? Right. Yeah. And if they make their way to that fallen sanctum, they're going to have a set of coordinates to consider for where we might be heading next. Exactly. Okay. Fun stuff. Joanna, due to a scheduling quirk,

As we bank 5,000 podcasts ahead of the holiday. Yeah. I am actually going to be doing our weekly Allure segment with Ben. Without you. Oh, give my love to Ben Lindbergh, who is the very best. And I'll see you later this week. I will see you very soon. I can't wait. I love you. Love you. Bye. Goodbye. Okay. Joe has left us.

But we have a new member climbing into the onyx cinder. It's Ben Lindberg. Hi. Hey, buddy. What are you here to talk about today? Can't say I remember, but I will do my best.

Here to talk about robots' repressed memories. And as with the Lost Planets lore from last week, this is something with a lot of precedence, not just in Star Wars, but also in sci-fi. Some that I'm sure come to your mind quickly, but robots being programmed not to know that they're human is kind of a trope. Battlestar Galactica, very dear to us, of course. Westworld, dear to Joe, at least some parts of it.

Probably Blade Runner. We don't have time to have the whole is Deckard a replicant conversation right now. But SM33s. Just call me whenever you want to discuss it. Yeah, sure. I certainly have my position on that one. But SM33s, can't say I remember. No, Ad Adden is kind of the equivalent of Westworld's It Doesn't Look Like Anything to me. It also reminds me of one of my favorite movies, The Manchurian Candidate, the original. Mm-hmm.

Frank Sinatra or Denzel in the remake has been brainwashed. And whenever he's asked about another member of his battalion, Raymond Shaw, he's compelled to say, Raymond Shaw is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful human being I've ever known in my life. So SM33 has, which is what I say about you and Joe. That's what I say about you. Yeah. Yeah.

I'm not even brainwashed. It's just how I actually feel. But 33 says that phrase five times in this episode. Some great meme potential. Fern is like, cut that shit out. We get it. Yeah.

He said it twice in earlier episodes, and it's kind of clever because, of course, the first time we heard him say it, it sounded colloquial, just, oh, I can't say I remember. But now we know that he's literally unable to say that he remembers it. He's been forbidden, which makes sense because, of course, he was on Ad Aten possibly for centuries. And even if he doesn't remember landing and being deactivated,

the crew must have been searching for the planet. So I was kind of confused about that. At first, I chalked it up to the fact that he has a rodent living in his eye socket, which seems like not factory specifications. So that's maybe done some damage. And that little stutter that he has at the start of the phrase suggests that he's malfunctioning somehow. But no, he's forbidden to share any info on Ad Adon. However, it keeps slipping out, maybe because of the rat live

living in his eye socket, maybe because he's very old and unmaintained and this is the droid equivalent of sundowning, you know, he's just losing it every now and then or maybe because Fern had her Captain Phillips moment and said, I'm the captain now and overrode his orders just like she did to the droids in her home in the first episode. So,

There's precedent for this in Star Wars. We've got a lot of memory wiping going on. And when memory wiping doesn't happen, droids develop quirks and idiosyncrasies. They get further removed from their factory settings. They start to possess a personality. Yeah.

Some of the droids who are nearest and dearest to us, Chopper, of course. Chop from Rebels. L3 from Solo, our favorite film. And the Empire, the First Order, wipe their droids' memories regularly and even do the same with stormtroopers who get out of line, like Finn, who is going to be sent for reconditioning before he escaped in The Force Awakens. And this is one reason why R2-D2

is the way that he is. His memory never gets wiped. Aside from that one time when Cad Bane, the bounty hunter, wipes a specific incident from his and 3PO's memories. But that's it. But this is why- Anakin was just like, fuck everybody's security protocol. Don't touch our team. Yeah, exactly. No, he matters too much to me. Yeah.

And this is why George Lucas has said that he thinks of R2 as the narrator of Star Wars. What we're seeing, what we're watching is actually R2 narrating events to the keeper of the Journal of the Wills way far in the future because he still remembers and was present for all these things.

And 3PO has plenty of personality, too, but his memory does get wiped a few times. Bill Organa, of course, has it wiped, which is good because it would be a pretty significant plot hole if not why. It does explain why 3PO doesn't remember being built by Anakin. So that would be.

Troublesome otherwise. And then, of course, in The Rise of Skywalker, 3PO's memory is wiped again on Kijimi so that he can translate the message on the Sith dagger. Yeah. He has to have a complete redacted memory bypass, which is, I guess, like jailbreaking an iPhone or rooting an Android. Just really get in there and do whatever you want. And fortunately, R2 has backed up his buddy's memory. So 3PO's memories are not lost. Yes. Yeah.

Rise of Skywalker couldn't take everything from us, Ben. I know. No, not entirely. And, you know, Chewie, he's not actually dead. It's okay. And 3PO, his memory is not wiped. It's okay. Sometimes they played with our emotions a little bit there. But I did just write about the five-year anniversary of the Rise of Skywalker at TheRinger.com. What a great website. I know. Yeah.

It still feels fresh in my mind. Unfortunately, we can't wipe those memories. Yeah, from our memory banks. But Star Wars is not usually the type of sci-fi that digs into these deep, profound philosophical questions about personhood and sentience and droid rights.

But when it does, it can be pretty poignant. And there's a one-shot Marvel comic from 2016 that explains how 3PO got the red arm he has in The Force Awakens.

And also some of these questions come up because he's talking to this other droid and they're musing about how they're on this side of a conflict. But for all they know, they could have been on the opposite side at some point in the past. And this droid that had his memory wiped, Omri, says, it is said that a being who loses a limb sometimes feels as if that limb were still attached to the body and can be moved, a phenomenon known as a phantom limb. Having had my memories erased is like having a phantom limb inside my memory banks.

So that gives us some insight into what SM-33 might be feeling here. And this droid goes on to say, it's the curse of protocol droids like you and me, C-3PO, that our tasks require an extra degree of sentience. I think that added awareness causes us to question flashes of past events.

He goes on for a while basically listing things from the prequels that

He doesn't really remember that we do. And he says, yes, I have memories too. And yes, sometimes I allow myself to wonder about them, but I also accept it is a droid's lot in life to be in service of its master. So that suggests that even if you had your memory wiped, even if you are under strict instructions not to mention something, it might surface sometimes. Those memories might come up unbidden like the memories of The Rise of Skywalker for us. Yeah.

And there are a couple other examples. By the way, Babu Frick, he's still out there in this part of the timeline because he's in his 80s in the sequel trilogy. He's in the blooming youth here. Yeah. So if they want to hunt him down and take SM-33 to Babu, that would be great. Maybe he can unlock those memories. Wonderful. And a couple other examples from the canon.

Of course, in the great game Knights of the Old Republic, there is a legendary droid named HK-47. And I won't go into detail here. I'm reluctant to mention the twist from KOTOR, even though that game is old enough to drink, because it is one of the best twists in gaming history. And there must be someone listening who's waiting for the remake or wants to play someday, hasn't gotten around to it, doesn't want to be spoiled. So I won't be the one to ruin that for you. But HK-47 is...

Memory core was wiped of all knowledge of his original master, and that becomes important at some point in the game. And you still retain some sense of your kind of core programming yourself as a droid, but you forget the specifics. And that comes into play in that game in a very important way. Yeah.

And even though HK is not canon anymore, in my head canon, HK is still very real to me. Yes, absolutely. And there's a book called The Legends of Luke Skywalker, a manga story called I, Droid, a construction droid named Zeta whose construction site gets raided and Zeta gets captured and taken to a mining complex where she's modified with an override ship that turns her into an enforcer droid. And the override ship makes her enjoy the suffering of other droids. Right.

But she's aware that her programming has changed, that she's being made to enjoy that suffering, which sounds sort of awful. And fortunately, she gets rescued by Luke, who removes the override and that's that. But there are some examples like that. You know, Eve 99 at Jabba's Palace, right, who's kind of a torture droid.

There's a story where R2 kind of frees Eve's mind and, you know, dissuades her from getting her memory wiped if she's a she. And that ultimately leads to her becoming a little less of a torturer, which is nice.

And I guess lastly, I'll mention that in season three of Rebels, there is a kind of infiltrator droid, the EXD series that camouflages its true nature. So Grand Admiral Thrawn sends out these droids to search for the Rebel base and it poses as a protocol droid. But once it's discovered, it enters attack mode where it sort of extends itself and reveals its weapons kind of like SM-33 does in the scene where –

limb from limb. Fortunately, he has an off switch conveniently located, which seems like a design flaw, I guess. Just one very graceful lunge from John. Yep. One little leap and an assist from our guy, Neil. Yeah.

who steps up in that moment. I still question why SM has a babysitting sequence. Was 33 a nanny droid at some distant point in the past? Was there daycare on the pirate ship? Was that one of the perks for the crew? It made me think of IG-11 and you can go from assassin droid to nurse droid if you want. Yeah.

Yeah. So you can get reprogrammed. And of course, everyone's familiar with the idea of the restraining bolt that prevents R2 or any other droid from doing what they want and they have to follow orders. And this is sort of a similar thing, except clearly there's a conflict here. You know, it's like Vader wrestling with the good inside and SM-33 pulled between two captains and, you

You know, sort of the steam is coming out of his ears a little bit and he doesn't know which master to obey in this moment. Sometimes you just need a friend, you know, like AP5 needed Chopper and that genuine bond to start living differently, you know? Yeah. So I don't know. It raises some questions, which I don't know if you and Joe have already considered, but basically who's this old captain who gave these orders? What's your current –

What's your current quick theory on this? People have speculated that maybe the old captain is the supervisor and maybe the captain installed himself. I think SM-33 refers to the captain as a he. We have talked about maybe it's a droid, maybe it's an AI, maybe this is the way that we call SM-33, a he, who knows?

I guess the flaw in that theory or one of the flaws is that if that old captain is still around posing as the supervisor, then they'd have to be pretty long in the tooth probably at this point, depending on how much time has elapsed. And –

I don't know. Could be some long-lived species. Could be that the captain set up a supervisor or something. So I don't know if I totally buy this, but it does raise the question of, well, where did that captain go? Unless the captain is one of the corpses on the ship, potentially. But...

SM-33 to kill everyone like a pharaoh, you know, killing all the people who built the pyramids or something to preserve the location of this place. And also having this sort of fail-safe where someone comes asking about Adat and it triggers this aggro mode for SM-33, which I guess it's nice that that didn't happen the first time they asked SM-33 about Adat. It took a little while for that to be activated, but it's

It's possible, right? So I wonder whether KB will be the one to maybe dig into those memory circuits and see what depths can be plumbed there because KB did open the hatch to the ship originally and has that cybernetic implant. Yeah.

Honestly, KB should be running the show for me at this point. KB seems like by far the most confident kid here. I mean, no shots at KB, but how can it not be Neil after this episode? Neil's like, let's just make peace and say we're sorry.

Neil had a very special episode, it's true. Co-rule, KB and Neil? Really rose to the moment. Yeah, when Fern tells Wim that he should have been captain, I'm like, why are we sleeping on KB as captain here? This is your friend, by the way, and she has her shit together. So that was, yeah, that was not who I would anoint at this point.

And I guess there's also the possibility that we could go galvanting around to these other at locations. Sure. We've got the coordinates. Let's do it. We've got to see if the at, at and coordinates were blasted off every pillar, right? Exactly. Exactly. Right. And maybe we'll find out the naming convention of these planets. What's the deal with this at? Is it some sort of programming like an at symbol or something? And this is some sort of network of planets. They're all just Instagram handles at the end of the day. Exactly.

And what happened to this planet? You know, we see at the beginning of the episodes some satellites, some – Yeah. Did you get Operation Cinder vibes? I did. Yeah. I was going to mention that too. And I guess not to be confused with the Onyx Cinder, the ship. Yeah.

Operation Cinder. Yeah, Darth Sidious is destroying the planet's system. Yes. And maybe it's not that, but maybe it's sort of similar hardware because we had speculated previously about whether the barrier is technological in origin. Seems like there's some blinking lights up there. And so maybe someone shot him down. Who knows? We'll find out. But yeah, the thought continues to thicken. It's amazing. The show's been great.

It's great. Yeah. And I'll mention one other theory, if you haven't, which is just the parallels to the Wizard of Oz here. I don't know if that's come up, but I saw this first on the Star Wars subreddit and credit to user inspectyourgadget.com.

who noted that, you know, we've got a bunch of people who are trying to get home and we kind of have a corresponding qualities where Fern is Dorothy sort of like the leader trying to get back. And then Neil is the cowardly lion, no courage, except that clearly he digs deep and does have hidden depths here and really rises to the moment. And then Wim, I guess, is sort of the scarecrow, like no brain. I guess that's a little harsh for Wim, but...

Hasn't distinguished himself in that area. And then KB maybe is the tin man, not showing a whole lot of emotion as of yet. And then I guess the question is, who's the wizard? Is it Jod, who might be sort of a charlatan in some ways, or is the wizard the supervisor? Supervisor, yeah. The man behind the curtain, the droid behind the curtain, the captain behind the curtain. Who knows? Yeah. Yeah.

It all kind of fits. Some strong Oz energy here, for sure. Yes, very much so. Okay, Ben. Thank you as always. What a delightful rundown of a frankly very distressing topic. A little bit. Memory wipes. We will miss doing this next week because we are not going to be chatting in real time about episode five due to the holiday, but we will be back.

right after New Year's for a double episode on five and six. So who knows how much lore there will be to dive into then, but we will- Twice as much to talk about. We will find out together. Can't wait. Thanks, buddy. All right, friends, that is a wrap on today's pod. John's asking, if that's normal, do we know? Thank you, as always, to our space pirates, our skeleton crew, Steve Allman,

and John Richter for producing and editing this episode. Arjuna Ramgopal for additional production supervision, and Jomia Deneron for the social media. We will see you on Sunday night to wrap up Dune Prophecy, and then we will be back after Christmas for our top 10 moments of the year, always one of our favorite pods. And then after New Year's,

A double Skeleton Crew dip. Episodes five and six in one deep dive. Until then, remember, you kneel before General Strix.