We're sunsetting PodQuest on 2025-07-28. Thank you for your support!
Export Podcast Subscriptions
cover of episode What a break from sex can teach you

What a break from sex can teach you

2025/6/30
logo of podcast Life Kit

Life Kit

AI Deep Dive AI Chapters Transcript
People
A
Angel Suarez
M
Marielle Segarra
M
Melissa Febos
T
Trevor Hines
Topics
Marielle Segarra: 性和对性的追求可能会让人沉醉,导致不健康的选择。禁欲可以帮助你更好地了解自己,发展新的行为模式,并与伴侣重新建立联系。要考虑你的意图,想想你希望通过禁欲期来改变什么。定义对你来说禁欲意味着什么,包括规则和时间限制。预计在禁欲期开始时会感到不适,并理解你可能会打破自己的规则。欣赏禁欲带来的礼物,并深思熟虑地结束禁欲。 Melissa Febos: 我从15岁开始就对爱情和性着迷,这些追求影响了我对自己的看法。对性和诱惑的渴望有时会让我们到达一个需要后退的临界点。禁欲期让我变得更加感性,情欲能力在其他地方得到表达。我意识到我过去经常因为不想让人失望而发生性关系。禁欲是审视和停止这种行为的好方法。通过反思过去的恋爱关系,我意识到自己需要承担责任,以及自己在浪漫灾难中扮演的角色。即使在恋爱关系中,禁欲也可以提供一个重置的机会。当我对性的思考变得狭隘或出现很多“应该”的想法时,我和我的妻子会暂停性行为,专注于其他形式的身体亲密。禁欲让我更清楚地意识到自己的选择以及我真正喜欢和想要的东西。禁欲让我学会了说“不”,这曾经对我来说是不可能的。我感到非常满足,如果与他人在一起会危及我在禁欲中发现的东西,我不愿意放弃。 Trevor Hines: 禁欲可以帮助你重视和爱自己,超越表面的联系,追求更深层次的连接,并吸引真正欣赏你的人。禁欲可以帮助你发现性吸引力之外的自身优点,比如善良和创造力。我决定不进行性行为、不谈恋爱、不手淫,以便将注意力完全转移到其他地方。我选择禁欲一年,这对我来说是一个挑战。我在禁欲的前45天打破了自己的规则,这让我意识到我需要酒精才能发生性关系。我意识到我需要酒精才能感到与人发生性关系时感到自在,这表明我对这种经历并不舒服。打破对自己的承诺能给我们带来信息。我直到遇到真正感兴趣的人才结束禁欲。结束禁欲让我感到害怕,担心自己是否还能正常进行性行为。与尊重我的旅程的人在一起,并高度尊重他们的思想,这让迈出那一步变得更容易。 Angel Suarez: 时间限制可能让你感到更安全,但也可能给你带来压力。当你未能实现禁欲目标时,请善待自己。当你做出最健康的选择时,你就知道你准备好结束禁欲了。

Deep Dive

Chapters
This episode explores the benefits of taking a break from sex, including self-discovery, improved relationships, and breaking unhealthy patterns. It emphasizes the importance of understanding your motivations and defining your boundaries.
  • Celibacy can be a tool for self-understanding and changing unhealthy behaviors.
  • It's important to consider your intentions for taking a break from sex.
  • Breaking unhealthy patterns related to sex is a potential benefit of celibacy.

Shownotes Transcript

Translations:
中文

This message comes from Whole Foods Market. Hosting a barbecue? Save with everyday prices on 365 brand meats, salad kits, and sparkling waters. Look for yellow sale signs in-store and online. You're listening to Life Kit from NPR. Hey, it's Marielle. Today on the show, we are talking about sex. It's a part of life, and this is Life Kit after all. Now, sex can be amazing, obviously, but...

It can also be intoxicating. Not just the act itself, but the pursuit of it and everything that comes before it. The courtship part, the seduction part, the feeling that's generated in you knowing that you're desired. All sorts of delicious chemicals flood our brains throughout this process. Like once those little chemicals get released, suddenly I'm making different choices because I want to feel more of that. I want to keep the party going inside of me.

This is Melissa Phibos, author of The Dry Season, a memoir of pleasure in a year without sex. So this craving for sex and seduction, it can sometimes lead us to a reckoning point, a point when what makes the most sense is to pull back.

For Melissa, that moment came in her 30s. She'd been in back-to-back relationships for most of her adult life. Basically, when I was 15, I started being preoccupied by romance and love and sex and those pursuits and how they made me feel about myself. And that was a huge preoccupation of mine for the next 20 years.

And then she went through a devastating breakup, which was really a devastating relationship. Where I had become so abject and obsessive and really kind of

Some friends had suggested she take a break from dating and sex. And she says eventually, she was in enough pain to try it.

She started with three months, but then went a year without having sex. And the gifts that emerged from this time were bountiful. A dry season it was not. Everything else became so much more sensual. It was like my sensual and erotic capacity became expressed in so many other places. On this episode of Life Kit, I talked to Melissa and others about the practice of celibacy, specifically taking a likely temporary break from sex.

This episode isn't intended for people who are celibate for religious reasons only. Although, if that's you, you might find some wisdom here anyway. Melissa says celibacy can help you understand yourself better, develop new patterns of behavior, and also reconnect with a partner. I could never have foreseen how profound that change would be. I could never have foreseen how it would literally change the entire course of my life. That's after the break.

This message comes from Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center. 100% of participants in a recent colorectal cancer trial saw their tumors completely disappear. That breakthrough happened at Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center, and it's giving new hope to people with cancer. This MSK Giving Day, be part of the next groundbreaking discovery and help raise $1 million. Donate at msk.org slash give, and your gift will be triple matched.

This message comes from NPR sponsor, Dana-Farber Cancer Institute.

Breast cancer cells multiply faster because of CDK4-6 proteins. But what if blocking those proteins and stopping runaway cell division was possible? Dana-Farber scientists laid the foundation for CDK4-6 inhibitors, new drugs that are increasing the survival rate for many advanced breast cancers. Dana-Farber's momentum of discovery keeps finding new ways to outmaneuver cancer. More at danafarber.org slash everywhere.

This message comes from NPR sponsor Zendesk. Introducing the next generation of AI agents built to deliver resolutions for everyone. With an easy setup that can be completed in minutes, not months, Zendesk AI agents resolve 30% of interactions instantly, quickly giving your customers what they need. Loved by over 10,000 companies, Zendesk AI makes service teams more efficient, businesses run better, and your customers happier. That's the Zendesk AI effect. Find out more at zendesk.com.

This message comes from the Nature Conservancy. People from all walks of life depend on nature for the food they eat, the water they drink, and the air they breathe, for strengthening their communities, powering their livelihoods, and safeguarding their health. Nature is common ground for everyone, and uniting to protect nature can help solve today's challenges and create a thriving tomorrow for future generations. Discover why at nature.org slash NPR.

When Melissa Phebos was in her 30s, she went to something called a cuddle party, where people get together and plan to engage in some sort of non-sexual physical affection, like hugging or lying next to each other. There was a workshop on consent at the beginning, and they said, don't cuddle with anyone you don't want to. And yet...

She cuddled with people she didn't want to. I thought, what the heck happened here? Like, I'm a queer woman. I'm a feminist. I know all about consent. Why was I saying yes to spooning with strangers that I don't want to? And I sort of followed that question all the way back to my early, like, social education in sex, where I got all of this explicit and implicit messaging from

that it was just bad to disappoint people when they wanted something physically from you. And like, I've had a lot of sex over the course of my life that I didn't really want to have because I felt like I should. And taking a break from sex is a great way to sort of look at that and try to stop doing it. So one reason you might consider a celibate period is if you have patterns or behaviors that you're trying to change.

Takeaway one, consider your intentions. Why do you think a period of celibacy might be in order? If you're hoping to interrupt certain patterns or behaviors, what are they? And what role do you play in these dynamics? Journaling or making an inventory could help you figure that out.

During Melissa's celibacy, she made a list of everyone she'd ever been with, sexually or romantically. And she asked herself some hard questions, like, where was I dishonest? How was I self-centered? Like, what happened here?

You know, I had a story about who I was in my past relationships, and it was much more heroic than what I saw when I did the inventory. Doing the inventory really showed me what I had to be accountable for and how I'd been complicit in every sort of romantic disaster of my life. ♪

For a lot of us, our patterns involve some form of self-betrayal. Doing things you don't want to do or that don't align with your values. Or having intimate relationships where you're not getting your needs met.

One version of this is the person who wants to find a serious, committed partnership but keeps having sex with people who don't want that. If that's you and casual sex doesn't feel good to you, Trevor Hines says a period of celibacy could help. I think at the end of the day, it's going to give you the tools to value yourself, love yourself, and look past that initial lust and surface level connections and go for the depth. And it also really repels everybody who's not interested in you for you.

the ones who are for you, you'll be able to identify. Trevor is an artist in Canada, and he uses celibacy as a tool in his life. He once went celibate for three years.

He says celibacy can also help you figure out all the things you love about yourself outside of your sex appeal. I think when I was younger, like in my early 20s, I kind of like led with a little bit more ego and talent. But when I was celibate, it allowed me to identify with other qualities of myself, like being kind or compassion or my creativity. Another reason you might consider celibacy, it gives you the time to explore other interests and platonic relationships. There's a quote in Melissa's book where she says,

Time had always felt in short supply, and it began to appear that it had simply been splurging it on romance. During celibacy, she started spending more time with her friends and family. Her other relationships flourished. I was going out dancing. I went out dancing more often that year than any other year of my life. And I was also having these long, rambling phone conversations with my friends, kind of like when I was a teenager. She also got to know herself better, what she likes, what she doesn't.

That I actually sometimes like to eat dinner at 11 p.m. and have a plate of like pickles and cheese and dried fruit like some ancient Greek person or something. And that I actually liked to be alone a lot. I had no idea how much alone time I needed to be happy. And I think I had needed it for years that I'd actually been starved for it.

So far, we've been talking about celibacy for folks who are single. But if you're in a romantic relationship, you can take periods of celibacy too. Melissa says those can offer a chance to reset. Even if you think about, like, if you're having technical problems in your computer, restarting it is the solution to most things, right? And that's been true in life, and it's true for a lot of people in life.

Melissa is married now, and she and her wife have done this when she felt her thinking about sex was getting narrow or she was having a lot of shoulds pop up in her mind around the topic. They'd take sex or certain parts of it off the table and focus on other kinds of physical intimacy.

So these are some of the many reasons why you might consider celibacy. But yeah, let's say you're curious. You want to try it out. Takeaway two is to define what celibacy means to you. The first question to ask yourself here is what are the rules, right? What do you consider sex? Are you going to participate in any kind of romantic touch? Is kissing off the table? Masturbation?

Trevor decided no sex, no romance, no masturbation. I wanted my focus to completely go somewhere else and not go to sex at all. So anything that really came under the umbrella of sex, I got rid of it. And even like romance, really for me it was about focus. I wanted my focus to go inward instead of outward to women.

So for me, like, those were my rules. Your rules might be different. During her one-year celibacy, Melissa quit sex and romance, but not masturbation. She asked herself early on, is masturbation part of the problem for me?

And the answer was no. The behaviors she wanted to change were ones that she exhibited with other people. My sexual relationship to myself was totally cool. I had no problem with it. It felt very healthy to me. So I do think that, you know, sex is one of those areas where people have to define abstinence for themselves. They have to really get honest about where the issue is and where it isn't. Another question to ask yourself is do you want to set a time limit?

Trevor chose to be celibate for a year at the outset. I think a year is just like a cycle. And I felt like when I mentioned it to my friends, for some reason, they thought a year was crazy. So I felt like, okay, a year is good. A year seems like a good challenge.

Melissa, on the other hand, chose three months at the start. That was as long as I could imagine not having sex. And I was trying to work with myself, you know? I knew if I picked longer than that, I probably wouldn't stick to it. Then at the three-month mark, she extended her celibacy for another three months, and then another three months. And then at nine months, she stopped setting deadlines.

At that point, I was really comfortable, really happy with where I was. And I honestly had begun questioning if I would ever want to be in a relationship or have sex again. And then, you know, things got interesting. Then she met her future wife. But we'll get back to that. Her advice for you? Give yourself some sort of structure to start with, but also start modestly.

Angel Suarez is a licensed marriage and family therapist and a sex therapist in New York. They have some thoughts on this, too.

One is that time limits might make you feel safer, but they also might stress you out. So I think based on the personality type, if you know that you need an end date or a deadline for yourself to feel more in control of what's happening with you, then I think that would work. But if you actually want to just be celibate because you're feeling like, I want more connection with an individual, and that's when I'll know if I'm ever going to engage in sex again, then I think having a time structure will actually put more pressure into finding someone.

Okay, you figured out your celibacy rules and you're ready to get started. Takeaway three, expect some discomfort at the beginning of your celibate period. Understand that you might break your own rules. That doesn't mean you should stop. Early in your celibacy, you might be tempted to go back to the same patterns you're trying to break. This can be a really powerful urge, especially if you don't know what to do when it happens. For instance, if you've decided not to have sex or to masturbate, what do you do if you get turned on?

Trevor was reading a lot of spiritual texts during his celibacy. And one idea he came across that really resonated with him is that sexual energy and creative energy can be the same.

So what he did, and what he suggests you do, is expect that your body might feel cravings. You can identify that just as like energy. And now you can ask yourself, well, where do you want to place this? It doesn't have to go to the sneaky link or it doesn't have to go to a website because most likely there's studies you'd like to focus on or a creative project you'd like to do or a business you want to build or whatever it may be. Maybe it's your body. You want to take a boxing lesson. It's like all that energy goes

can truly just be transferred into another activity. Here's the other thing to know. You might break your own rules. Trevor did in the first 45 days of his celibacy. He was out partying and saw someone he knew. And then we ended up having sex. And I woke up and I remember I just felt...

Which brought him to a realization. A lot of the time, he felt like he needed a drink to have sex.

You're not even really comfortable that you need liquor confidence to even go there with this person. So which means you're not comfortable with this experience at all, but for some reason you feel like you have to. And I didn't realize that until I was celibate. He decided to quit drinking, too.

Trevor says there's nothing wrong with failing at your celibacy and feeling regret. Because those broken promises to ourselves give us information. Any goal you set, you're going to stumble and fall. And I think it's just important to identify, like, how did you sway? And that will teach you more about yourself. Angel Suarez asks that if you do fall short of your celibacy goals...

you show yourself some grace. Really, you know, everyone else in this world sometimes is very critical of ourselves. We're growing, and so how do we act with love for ourselves when we make mistakes or we go against our value of what we're trying to work for in celibacy? All right, time for Takeaway 4. Appreciate the gifts that celibacy brings. ♪

One reason I think that people enjoy sex is that it can be, at its best, a moment to slow down and appreciate the sublime. To touch another person's body, really look at it. The beauty mark they have that looks like a thousand stars exploding across their back. Or the scar they have that tells you some story about their life or the way their eyes sparkle. It's like they become a work of art and you become a work of art and you get a chance to play and appreciate each other.

It's easy to forget that there are other pathways to those sensations. When you take sex out of the picture, at least momentarily, you realize, you know, I could get really into this raspberry that I'm eating right now. That ability to slow down and marvel at things and cultivate curiosity for them and appreciate the intricate design of a raspberry or a hydrangea or whatever.

my own hands, you know, or my pet. We all have the capability to sort of slow down. It is maybe the most beautiful application of our self-consciousness that we can appreciate other things. In her book, Melissa says, I had been thinking of this time as a dry season, but it had been the most fertile of my life since childhood. Another gift that celibacy offers is it can allow you to detach yourself from what other people think about your appearance.

Melissa says she'd been wearing heels since she was a teenager because she's short and she thought they made pants look better on her. And by better, what I meant is they made my body look more like I had learned would attract other people slash men. Even though I wasn't even trying to attract men, that was still buried in there. And buried beneath it was this belief like if I...

Without that pressure, she started wearing sneakers every day. She stopped wearing makeup. That doesn't mean she never wears those things now, but she feels more aware of her choices and what she actually likes and wants.

Yet another gift of celibacy is that over time, Melissa learned that she could do something that once seemed impossible, saying a firm no. A warning here, we're about to talk about an instance of someone pressuring another person to have sex. Melissa was at a conference with a fellow writer who wanted to have sex with her. The writer was drunk and didn't want to take no for an answer.

What Melissa might have done in the past would have been to cave and give the writer what she wanted to avoid embarrassing her. But she says in the book, I knew that the alternative was also a kind of mortification, a submission to something that would hurt me.

And right up until the moment I did something different, in my mind, I was like, oh, no, oh, no, oh, no. Like, I'm definitely going to do what I've done every other time. But there was this little scrap of gumption that was like, no, we don't want to. And then the moment when I do something different feels in a way like a moment of grace, like something becomes possible that was not possible before.

After a while, Melissa felt that she might be celibate forever. I really felt so fulfilled. And I thought, if being with other people is risking what I have found in my celibacy, I'm not willing to give it up. So I just sort of like stepped into the future as a celibate person. ♪

Then she met her now wife, a poet, who she started a correspondence with after loving her latest book. Their connection wasn't romantic at first, but it turned out to be. Takeaway five. If you want to end your celibacy, do it thoughtfully.

Trevor had a similar experience in that he didn't step out of celibacy until he met someone he was really interested in. It really just kind of happened naturally. Like I just met somebody and it was through conversation. I was just like, I want to explore this person. And I was really interested about their mind. They're a very beautiful person, but like I was just really interested in this person. The way I'm talking about all this might make it sound easy, seamless, like a fairy tale ending.

It was hard. They were both afraid of what ending celibacy would mean. Trevor was afraid to have sex. Am I even going to be able to have sex? Am I even going to be good at it?

There's so much fear around it. But like being with someone that one who I told them like my journey and everything and they respected it. And then also just highly respecting this person for who they are in their mind made it a lot easier to take that step when like we did go there. And Melissa, she didn't want to lose the beautiful life she'd built or all the gifts that came with celibacy.

In the book, she talks about the first time she and the poet had lunch. She was acutely aware of her attraction to the poet as they walked to a cafe. So she turned her attention to her surroundings. The trees, the people, the smell of french fries wafting through the air. I was here, in my body, in the city of Washington, D.C., walking down the sidewalk beside a tall stranger, she says. Choices all the way.

Holding onto herself within this committed relationship has required some work. She's had to find aloneness, even in the company of a loving partner, and to protect the space she built for herself without pushing her wife away.

Now, no one can tell you when the right time is for you to end your celibacy. But Angel gives this rule of thumb. I definitely think that when people know they're ready is when they're making the healthiest choice for themselves. They say if you have a lot of doubts coming up, that could be a sign that you're not ready, that you have more internal work to do. One thing Trevor cautions is that we shouldn't stay in celibacy out of fear. Because you can sit in fear and then the journey's going to

Okay, time for a recap.

Takeaway one, consider your intentions. Why do you think a period of celibacy might be in order? Are there patterns you're trying to break? Are you hoping to reconnect with a partner? Journaling or making an inventory could help you figure out what you're trying to change. Takeaway two is to define what celibacy means to you. What do you consider sex? Does kissing count? What about masturbation? And do you want to set a time limit?

Takeaway three, expect some discomfort at the beginning of your celibate period. Expect that you might break your own rules. That doesn't mean you should stop. Takeaway four, appreciate the many gifts that celibacy brings. And takeaway five, end your celibacy thoughtfully and when you're ready. ♪

For more Life Kit, check out our other episodes. We've got one on how to know if you're in a codependent relationship and another on how to have conversations around consent. You can find those at npr.org slash life kit. And if you love Life Kit and want even more, subscribe to our newsletter at npr.org slash life kit newsletter. Also, we love hearing from you. So if you have episode ideas or feedback you want to share, email us at lifekit at npr.org.

This episode of Life Kit was produced by Margaret Serino. Our visuals editor is Beck Harlan, and our digital editor is Malika Garib. Megan Cain is our senior supervising editor, and Beth Donovan is our executive producer. Our production team also includes Andy Tegel, Claire Marie Schneider, and Sylvie Douglas. Engineering support comes from Simon Laszlo Janssen. I'm Mariel Segarra. Thanks for listening.

This message comes from NPR sponsor, Shopify. The commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world and 10% of all e-commerce in the U.S. Get started with your own design studio. Sign up for your $1 per month trial at shopify.com slash NPR.

The House of Representatives has approved a White House request to claw back two years of previously approved funding for public media. The rescissions package now moves on to the Senate. This move poses a serious threat to local stations and public media as we know it. Please take a stand for public media today at GoACPR.org. Thank you.

Decades ago, Brazilian women made a discovery. They could have an abortion without a doctor, thanks to a tiny pill. That pill spawned a global movement, helping millions of women have safe abortions, regardless of the law. Hear that story on the network, from NPR's Embedded and Futuro Media, wherever you get your podcasts.