John Fogerty: The Suitcase Behind The Microphone
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That's right. Discover automatically doubles the cash back earned on your credit card at the end of your first year with Cash Back Match. Now that's a real crowd pleaser. Everyone knows how it ends. Double the cash back. See terms at discover.com slash credit card. Hi, John. It's Rob Lowe. How are you? I'm good, Rob. How are you? This is a dream come true. That's how it is for me. Ha ha ha.

Welcome to Literally, everybody. Oh, boy. John Fogarty. Credence, Clearwater Revival, great solo artist, Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, Songwriter Hall of Fame. You know, I don't even know where to begin. I'm such a fan of his music. I think maybe the greatest American rock band. Think about it out there as you guys are listening.

I mean, there's the Stones and the Beatles. They're British, but American rock band. Who else is it going to be? I mean, is it, you know, it's not Aerosmith. And I love Bruce Springsteen and the East Street Band as much as the next one. I don't think it's them. I think it's CCR. I really do. And this has just been a dream come true. I just this is fanboy central. I'm warning you. There's a lot of fanboy about to happen. Let's get at it. John Fogerty.

I want to check it. You have so many chapters in your life. What's how's John Fogerty today? That's a fair question. I think the best. Really? I feel the best I've felt probably in my whole life. Yeah, you're not anywhere near.

The calendar that I'm on, Rob, but a magical thing happens. I've read about it and I never knew because there are, look, I'd like having a career, right? But as you know, it's work. They call it work. They don't call it play. Supposedly, it looks like play. Right. Yeah.

But there's always a bunch of stuff that's kind of hard, you know, and then there's scheduling. You know, you've got to be doing three things at once and be in three different places at once, all that kind of thing. And I allowed that to really kind of drive me or get to me at times. You know, there's stuff of the three or four things. There's probably one you'd really like to do and the other three are a chore. Yep. Yeah.

But at some point, it was getting me again here in my middle 70s, trying to do a bunch of things. And I finally realized, well, wait a minute. You know, if I'm not here next year, it'd be a shame if I blew all my time on something I didn't want to do. Yes. I'd rather be with my family, be with my kids, which has always been the driver. Yeah.

And that's very freeing. I don't know that you're allowed to do that yet, but I have. It just means, well, what are you going to do, send me to Vietnam? I mean...

Yeah, yeah. I didn't go there, but that was the catchphrase. I was in the military, of course, and when they wanted to put pressure on you, that's what they, hey, we're going to send you to Vietnam. No, sir, I'll do it, whatever you want. Yeah, that's true. It's a much better life that you're living today. And I just have such admiration and

You know, you look at your peers, even though you're a musician, I'm an actor, but I look at people like you who are still doing work they love, still as inspired, you know, still out there doing it, albeit now on your new terms.

And it's inspiring, not just because of the work, but because of the mindset you have. And I'd like to learn that mindset earlier. I'd like to learn it earlier than my 70s. Like, you know, if there are three things out there and I want to do one of them and the other one's like, eh, do the one you like and the rest of the time spend time with your family. It's a great, great, great lesson. We've started this interview with the best part. Here's the lesson. Yeah.

Well, you know, Rob, of course, I mean, if you're trying to have an active career, I mean, you're on fire. So like here I am talking to you on your blog, right? Yeah, yeah. You know, you can't if you want to have an active career, there's a bunch of stuff you kind of got to do that, you know, so don't misunderstand what I just said. You don't always understand.

If that's the discipline that you're operating under, you don't always get to choose. No, for sure. Because you got to get on the horse and hold those reins and maybe you'd rather be fishing. But if you want to move the career along, you've got to do that horse thing. I was always glad that I didn't learn or have any interest in surfing.

Until my 40s, because if I had wanted to surf or fish, as you say, when I was young, I wouldn't have been grinding like you did. You were how you started your first band at what age? Eighth grade. Jesus, that's really young. How could your fingers even press? And I'm not kidding. How did you even have the finger strength to play the guitar? I was probably better than, um.

It's a funny thing. I met a few musicians at that age and ended up forming a little instrumental trio called the Blue Velvets. But it was with Doug and Stu who later were with me in Creedence Clearwater Revival. And of course, my brother I was with, too. So it it all started pretty early. Yeah.

The big, you know, that was in the 50s, the late 50s, probably 1958. I was in the, I went into the eighth grade in 58. And I would go up to the music room. Mrs. Stark was a wonderful lady. And she, uh,

Actually validated and was interested in my rock and roll. Really? Yeah. I mean, one day she had me bring a bunch of my records to the class. It was a music class, but she wanted me to play, you know, just bring the stuff you like. And we played them in the class and I got to talk about music.

why I liked them. I do remember one of the songs was I'm walking by Fats Domino. Sure. Uh, I'm sure I had a Jerry Lee Lewis record in there. I probably was maybe trying to find one that might really upset her, but she was not to be provoked. She, you know, and in that class after school, I would sit and play the piano and I'm a shy kid. I'm still shy. Um,

But somehow I had gotten enough self-confidence doing sort of, well, I could play Do You Want to Dance by Bobby Freeman, some kind of shuffle boogie woogie stuff. I mean, it wasn't great, but to a kid's ears, it sounded at least like rock and roll. It didn't sound like classical music or something, which...

I mean, I really appreciate now, but I'm sure I had sort of a stance at that point. Yeah. But anyway, different kids would wander in. Eventually there would be a little crowd of people, you know, 10 people, 15 people, just because there was nothing else like that going on. Now that I look back and when we formed the band in high school, El Cerrito High School, we were the only band in the school.

So, wow. I mean, it was really precocious. Actually started representing the El Cerrito Boys Club. A fella I've never been able to remember his last name. His name was Bob something. And he was doing he had a role in the El Cerrito Boys Club, which was just on the corner from the junior high school. It was just right down the street.

And he got us to start going around playing these different events representing the El Cerrito Boys Club. And at those events, it'd be kids from all over the Bay Area representing their town's boys club. And through that, I met a few people, one of which was a guy named James Powell. He was in his middle 20s.

And he wanted us to back him up making a record. So we actually went into a studio with James when we were all 14 years old and we made a record that was actually played on the R&B station for a little while in the Bay Area. You were just off on the radio for the first time when you were 14 years old?

Yes. Wow. That's right. I mean, that's amazing. You know, Billie Eilish, you know, what is she, 15 or 16? You know, with 19 hits already or Taylor Swift, you know, they were. But back in those times, it was so unusual to be that noticed so young. And I always say, you know, I graduated high school in 63. So we were all through those years in high school, the only band in the school that

Then the Beatles hit. The next day, there was 100 bands in our high school. That's right.

I mean, how many times have you heard the story from, you know, I'm sure some of your peers where their lives changed when that Ed Sullivan show came on in the living room? I know Springsteen talks about it. I've heard everybody talk about it. I mean, there must have been, just think of the viewership. Think of the people that were watching that broadcast of the Beatles. Well, I was, obviously, yeah. And what was your take on it? Was it as earth-shattering for you? It was the beginning of the world.

I mean, I was at that point, I was about 18. I was out of high school a few months. And it just how can I say it? Here's where this was a group rather than Elvis or singular people like, you know, Fabian or something that became rock idols, pop idols. This was a band like I had. And I could really identify with that.

And yet, you know, they were a band. Earlier, there had been people like Johnny and the Hurricanes and, you know, Bill Doggett or the Ventures, you know. But there was always some sort of a little bit of a blanket in front of them. It was kind of mysterious. They were not quite...

Fully known. Certainly not a household name. And the Beatles changed all that. You know, I mean, actually on the screen is Ringo, John, Paul, you know. So was it the notion that they had identities, separate identities, but within the concept of being a band? I didn't really think it through. I just knew I really loved it. I mean, I've...

I was crazy for it. I had actually heard the Beatles on the radio when I was still in high school, the prior May, May 1963. Wow, that's really early. They played in the Bay Area. First, they played a song called Please Please Me for about a week. And it was like the pick of the week or the state, you know, the...

Can't remember the call letters. It was K-E-W-B or... Anyway, it was their highlighted song for a week. And every day driving home... I was on my way to the gas station to work. Driving home from... Or driving there from after school, I'd hear this thing. And I thought the guy was saying The Shields. I didn't pick up Beatles, right? They played the first song for about a week and I guess it didn't happen. But...

Then they started playing the other. I didn't know it then from me to you, which was the other side of Please Please Me. And I really, really like that. That was just oh, my goodness. Listen to this thing. It was because that was that was the Beatles already kind of going off on, you know, their wonderful sort of different take on rock and roll. Yep. And then they went away. You know, it's just we went.

We went back to our American way of life. Of course, in November, JFK got assassinated. The whole world just turned upside down and we were all sort of pretty morose for a few months. And suddenly in January, that's two months later or less, here comes the Beatles all over the radio and Ed Sullivan and

I don't know what adults were doing, but kids were suddenly really happy. It's funny. I've never really thought about that element of it is that, you know, context and timing is everything, as you know, in a career and that that Ed Sullivan show aired within months of the country going through a tragedy that it had never, ever experienced anything like it up until that point, really. Um,

probably had a lot to do with the, like the euphoria and the, the release of having something happy and something different and something everybody could get together around. I bet I never, I'd never really put that together. I did later. Of course, I've even written about it, uh, in some of my songs. Um, yeah, because it was all I, I experienced the euphoria. I just suddenly was on the roller coaster with all the other kids. Um, and,

and enjoying the Beatles and couldn't wait. I didn't get to see them that first year, but the next year, 65, I saw them at the Cow Palace. And in 66, I saw them at Candlestick Park. And that turned out to be their last. Was that their last concert?

In America? Yes, except for the rooftop at Abbey Road. That was their last concert. Okay, so Candlestick Park, and I know that you're a longtime Bay guy, so I don't want to say anything blasphemous, but Candlestick was a notorious hellhole. Nobody liked playing in it. I don't care if you were the Niners or the Giants. I mean, look, it's legendary. I have to say, every time I drive past where it used to be, I'm sad.

I look out at that little promontory and I missed candlestick, but the acoustics must have been dreadful. What was it like to see the Beatles in those tiny little amps in Candles' windy, freezing candlestick park? Could you even hear them? Well, you know what Mark Twain once said about San Francisco, the coldest winter he ever spent was a summer in San Francisco. And it was...

even more true at candlestick park. I had been, you know, when I got a car, right, I think I had just turned 17. First thing I did is I took my youngest brother, Bob, to a day game at candlestick park. I mean, I could, you know, uh, I'm, I'm changing gears here for a sec, but we, I mean, I, that's what I wanted to do. And we got to the game and

We were in the bleachers. Willie Mays is in center field. And we hollered at Willie through the whole game. Willie, Willie! And we're jumping up. I mean, it was a day game that wasn't full or sold out.

So you could hear us. I'm sure you could even hear us on the radio, probably. And Willie's standing there in center field and Willie, Willie, Willie, come on. You know, first inning, second inning, third inning. He just kind of we got to talking to each other, my brother Bob and I. Bob, see, I was 17, so he's about 11 or 12. And we're going, man, look how Willie conserves his energy, right?

Yeah. How does he keep, like, walking? I mean, we finally figured it out. He's so smooth. He doesn't do anything unless he really needs to. Like when somebody hits a ball and he goes running after it, cap falls off. Other than that, he just...

Very low key. He's saving his energy. How old is that guy? And we started working on it. He was 32. We had him in a wheelchair, man. I mean, you know. Who'd have thought, by the way, just as an aside, that that's you would be writing about that moment.

you know, about the Say Hey Kid in center field in the album Centerfield with that song. I mean, that's the moment you just described. Yeah, probably why it was so special. And finally, about the seventh inning, he turns around, takes his cap off like that and kind of motioned to us. And me and Bob were jumping up. Yeah, Willie, yeah! That's amazing. Yeah. I mean, that was so cool. But the Beatles, okay, so...

We get there and there's a couple of, this is 66 at Canal 6. There's a couple of opening acts. I think Bobby had played Sonny. And then there was a band called Circle. Because Brian Epstein, their manager, managed the Circle. And they had a hit called Red Rubber Ball. Pretty bubblegum pop kind of stuff.

And all the time we're wondering, I was there with my wife and my brother Tom and his wife. I can't remember if there were more of us there from family. But the whole time we're wondering how the Beatles are going to arrive. Yeah, they're going to come by helicopter. They're just going to, you know.

Well, it turned out finally at the appointed time, just a big black limo or some kind of car, I think a limo, pulls up about as close as you can get. And the Beatles get out of the car. You know, they got their instruments on and they walk around.

If in from the side and they're walking, oh, the stage was set up about where the pitcher's mound would be. So we're in the stands. You know, there's nobody down on the ground. There's no people. That's it's security. But there's a bunch of PA. There's a bunch of speakers and and horns and, you know, PA stuff there.

all just laying on the grass. I mean, if you can picture this, you know, they had those high frequency horns that put out nothing but that squawky here in the... Like a tsunami warning horn. Yeah, like that. And they got a bunch of those and some other speakers just laying on the ground, right? Jesus. And so the Beatles walk in from that car

They walk across the grass and go up the side steps and they're on stage and we're all freaking out, you know. You know, it's a typical screaming sound. Then they start to play. He loves you. Yeah. Yeah. And then the wind blows. Yeah. Yeah. She loves you. Yeah. Yeah. Every time the wind would blow, the sound just disappeared. Right. And so we're all screaming, but we're just watching. Yeah.

And they literally played. I thought it was 20 minutes. And it's OK. They're going to leave by helicopter because they think, nope, car drives up right by the stage. This time they get in. Boom. And they're gone. The number one hit right then was Yellow Submarine. But they didn't play that.

I was so disappointed. But they did play Act Naturally, Ringo Sang Nat. I was going to say, they were trying to screw over Ringo. That's unbelievable. What a play. Who else was your – what was your relationship with Dylan, who was the other titan of the time? Oh, I was a fan. You know, Bob Dylan came along.

I started to hear his name because of Peter, Paul and Mary, because of blowing in the wind. Of course. And then I worked a lot of times graveyard at this gas station I told you about. And so one night I think it was Russ the Moose, the

played this, you know, and I hear this kind of gnarly guitar and this guy singing. He sounded like he just fell off a plow or something. And I said, wow, what is that? And when it was at the end, Russ DeMoose says, well, that was Bob Dylan's recording of, you know, and I'd never heard it. This is before, this is pre-Beatles, really. It was blowing in the wind? Yeah. Yep. And he, you know, he hadn't become in quotes here, Bob Dylan yet, but

So I started to become aware of this folk singer guy. And I don't know how how much more I was aware of Bob until like a Rolling Stone. Yeah, I want to talk to you about that song. That song for me. I mean, it's just unbelievable. Yeah.

I mean, Bruce, and I know you're mutual friends and fans of Springsteen as am I, but he has a great quote about that first drum hit in Like a Rolling Stone. He says, it's the sound of the door to the world being knocked down. And it really is. That song is just unreal. I got to go consult with Bruce and get some of these cool phrases like that down. Isn't that a good one? Yeah, it's good. Hold that thought. We'll be right back.

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I have so much to talk to you about. So I'm just going to jump into like various things I've thought about. Okay. Sure. First of all, I need to know why the intro to Old Man Down the Road is such an earworm. I might hum it every day of my life, John. I'm not kidding. Wow.

Yeah. I mean, what the hell? What have you done? What have you created? What havoc have you wrought? Well, you know, you...

You look for those and you hope to have those. I mean, I call them riffs or licks. And especially the ones that go with a particular song that are unique to that song rather than, you know, playing the blues or something or a blues scale. An actual unique phrase or, you know, musical phrase or notes that you know means something.

That song like that. And by the way, I had a an 18 month old that could do that. One day she just pointed at me and she started going, yeah, yeah. And she's standing there, you know, barely walking, pointing at me and I blew my mind. That was awesome. What's the simplest stuff is the stuff with the resonance, but like finding the

I mean, on Who'll Stop the Rain, it's the last three notes of a G chord, right? Oh, listen to you. Yeah. Right? Yeah, that was a cool one. I didn't know that was going to be on the song. I remember everything was all done and I said, okay, I want to add a little, you know, guitar stuff filler there.

And I thought it was just going to be the chorus. And suddenly started playing those notes on acoustic guitar. And I went, wow. You've asked, you used the phrase earworm. And I'll go back to Old Man Down the Road. There is a process there.

that, at least for me, you recognize it. You know, when I hear other songs, you know, like... I mean, you know, there's the ones we've all retained that we love. And for some reason, not every musician, even writers, recognize those when they play one themselves. Because I've watched people...

Go right through it and on to the next thing. And I'm going, whoa, whoa, whoa, stop. What did you just do there? Because, you know, there was some magic for me, for instance, old man down the road. One morning I came into my little recording place, you know, all those years ago.

and kind of turned on things, turned on a light, turned on a tape machine. There was a cup of coffee sitting there next to it. You know, I was kind of going to start my day, and I picked up, I mean, it's the very first thing, and it usually happens this way. Let me tell you, nothing in my brain, you know. So I pick up the guitar, and I just kind of for a second get a little bit

you know, reaccustomed from the day before and suddenly play and it had that tone because it was that guitar. It had that tone and I immediately, I froze because it was like, whoa,

OK, and the point of this story is I was so far down the road that I recognized it was a hook that I'm standing there going, OK, OK, what's the finish? What's the backside? You got to have the backside. And I've always told this story this way. You're standing on a tightrope and you realize if you get it right, it's forever.

But if you play something mediocre, the whole thing probably just goes away. And I know all this. Like in a nanosite, you... And I'm hanging in the air this thing. And I go, goodness. I just like was so happy. I played it over and over for probably 10 minutes. So I wouldn't forget. And it's forever. Feels like it. It's forever.

Yeah. Done. It's like into the zeitgeist forever. In my head every day, like it just pops in. I mean, there are certain riffs that just pop into my head. And that has always been one of them. And the guitar lick for Who'll Stop the Rain, which is just so simple and so just cuts right to you, I think. Yeah, it's a happy...

Kind of an accident. A lot of those come to me that way. That's why I try to have a guitar in my hands a lot. So I still get up early, you know, quite early and play the guitar. These days, it's about two hours every day. Wow. It used to be for years and years and years, it was four hours. Really? I was getting up at 4.30 because I want to be better. And it's something, it's hard to...

And it's also hard to even justify that.

let's say to your significant other. And that's why it's so early. I figure if I'm doing this at 4.30 in the morning, nobody can complain that I'm taking time away from the family. So I did that for years and years and I've gotten very, very close to the thing. I mean, the last month or so, every now and then I actually have it and then it

Our bodies are funny. The next day, it isn't quite as good. What I'm working on basically is – the country guys all know this. It's called hybrid picking where you hold the real guitar pick, but the other two or three fingers also pick strings. And I want – the guys that are very, very advanced can –

How can I say it? They can pick any note at any time with those other fingers. That's insane. Because they have the strength. But it took me forever to develop the strength. That's a whole other conversation. But I sometimes wondered, was it harder because I'm, you know, 70 years old trying to do this instead of 11? Yes. The answer is yes. Has to be, right? I guess. You know, here. All right. Here's a thought.

Because I've spent 20 years on this. And certainly the last 10 years, I mean, you could go to my house anytime at 4.30 and there I am sitting in a chair with, all right?

And not very good because there's other stuff I know how to play. But the thing I want to be able to do, I wasn't good at all. So I don't know if you imagine, you know, look at your own hand and your fingers, these little muscles in their tiny, tiny little muscles that.

Probably most of us, you know, we learn how to pick up things or in school we can throw a ball or something. But that's about it. We're not real, real coordinated with them the way Sandy Koufax was with his fingers or, you know, people like that or guitar players like Albert Lee, let's say. But it's a tiny little muscle I've had, you know, in that same 10 years, you

Some kid, let's say Arnold Schwarzenegger, would go to the gym every morning and spend the same amount of time, you know, bench pressing, 400 pounds or something. And he looks like that, you know, gigantic arms and chest. And I'm looking at this stupid little hand spending the same amount of time on a muscle that's probably the size of an amoeba. But it took that long. Yeah.

That kind of picking is insane. When I finally saw Fleetwood Mac in concert and I saw Lindsey Buckingham, right? He's an amazing guitar player in that respect, don't you think? Yep, I would say he can do that, yes. Yeah, it's just, I'm just in awe of it. Your guys' sound, when you recorded the...

famous and green river. Did you go, Oh yeah, that's, I think that works. You know, uh, Rob, when you're, when you're young and really on top of your game, kind of on fire and getting you express yourself for the first time, uh, me, well, I guess what I mean by that is I, you know, I started loving music probably before I could walk, uh,

and at some point knew that that was my friend and that I was going to try and do something in music. And so you're spending all your consciousness and your energy trying

trying to get to wherever that is. And you don't really know what it is other than you get a few examples here and there like Elvis or the Beatles. And oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's what I want to do. It's a pretty big, wide net that you're thinking about, but you love music. You just want to be somehow in music. And so, yeah,

Then, lo and behold, you record a thing called Suzy Q and you start to have real success for the first time. You know, you're really being noticed on the big radio station. And then you start to write your own songs. You discover, even though I've been writing songs since I was probably eight or

Um, you know, they kind of sounded like that too. So, I mean, you, you, you're trying to gear everything within you. You know, I'm sure an athlete is doing the same thing and you're trying to get advice and mentorship and, um, things to practice and work on. You're trying, you know, trying to do as much as you can to further that journey that you think you're on.

And one day, you know, I'd started writing. I mean, I'd been writing all along, but suddenly I wrote Proud Mary. And you sound like I'm digressing. But anyway, that was the first time. I mean, I went, oh, my God, this is good. It was the first time that something was good. And I recognized it immediately. So.

You know, that euphoria lasted for a day or two, maybe a week. And then it was, oh, God, now what am I going to do? I mean, listen, just just I just had to say is because I do this because I'm a fan. I do it like I get to talk to people I admire on my best days doing the show and.

listening to you say, and yeah, and then I wrote Proud Mary has made my fucking month. I mean, Proud Mary feels like a song that's always existed. Do you know what I mean? Like there are just songs that it always was, it always will be, and so it shall be. But you wrote it. Yeah. I think what happened there is

was, you know, all the things I'd been just in my own personality, not necessarily the stuff to further a career, but just the stuff I was interested in. And I want to give people credit, like Pete Seeger, who was – I loved Pete Seeger. By far the best entertainer I ever saw. Really? Oh, yeah. And I saw –

Frank and I saw Dino and Sammy and, you know, that sort of thing that we consider in quotes entertainers, you know, that sort of thing. Later in my life, I saw Elvis. I mean, it was after I had already started to have a career. So I saw quite a few shows at the Oakland auditorium and these were, these were my heroes and,

But Pete was magical. And it turned out that there was so much more to that package. This folk music that was so American and so much of the people. And then you knew what his politics were because he talked about it. But I never thought...

I never saw anything other than here's a guy trying to stand up for the people. That's the way I looked at it. It was kind of poor people against rich company owners. You know, that was sort of what the stance seemed to be. And, you know, as old as I've gotten doing this, it still kind of looks like that to me. You know, it's management versus labor, if you will. Yep. Yeah.

And so I loved Pete. And another guy I loved was Mark Twain. And there was just – and the old black and white movies I would see back in the 50s on TV, you know, back when there were three channels. Yep. After the 11 o'clock news, because I was a kid, just like my kids, I'd stay up late, you know, until 3, 4 in the morning sometimes. Or until the TV went off. Yeah.

And you'd see these great old black and white movies like there was one I especially love called The Devil and Daniel Webster. Oh, of course. Yeah. That's kind of what inspired Bad Moon Rising. And I'm sorry to be getting off tangent, but I guess what I'm saying is with Proud Mary,

Something escaped from my inner soul, and I'm saying that jokingly. I had spent all those years trying to sound like, you know, Dionne Warwick or Sam Cooke or, you know, The Beatles or, you know, whatever other songs were being written, searching by the coasters, you know, just singing.

Listening and watching and trying to write a pop song or maybe even a Hoagie Carmichael song, you know, people I really admired. And what Proud Mary, it jumped out of me. And what jumped out was a deep love of America, American history, our country, our culture is probably what I'm trying to say.

Not that it's exclusive only to the United States of America, of course, because it turns out to be kind of a generational thing, too. But the images in my mind of the people who had influenced me, like Mark Twain, let's say, or Pete, were different.

Kind of subliminally there in Proud Mary. And I think that's what you're saying. It just seemed like that song had been there forever. I've heard people tell me, yeah, it seemed as old as the dirt. And I would, you know, I mean, I was profoundly... When I finished it in that little 20 minutes of inspiration, I was shaking. I had the little piece of paper I'd written it on and I knew it was really good. And so...

much more than anything I'd ever done.

I realized I was on to something. I guess if you had a mentor paying enough attention, I didn't really have that. The only person in the whole world that knew this was me. This is really good. I was too young and shy to actually run outside and go, I've written a great song. I didn't do that. But inside, I was just freaking out because I realized it was good.

far and away better than anything I'd ever done. Who did you play it for first? Wow. I probably played it for, I didn't play it right away. Really? Wait, you said, I've written a great song, but I'm not going to play it right away. I'm going to play some of the other songs that aren't great first. Well, the situation then was we would rehearse every day, the band, and if we were gearing up toward the next recording,

I would show them kind of slowly. I'd show them the chords to a song and get the feel going instrumentally first. As a matter of fact, I think we, as was usually the case, right, in that period of time after Susie Q, you know, I mean, everybody else in Creedence at that point after Susie Q could kind of see, you

there was something to this. I'm not sure that it was believed by everyone, you know, at least to the same degree. After Susie, you know, having a song on the radio be a pretty massive hit, wow, gee, we might be able to make a go of this thing. They were probably in that mindset. I was in a panic mindset, you know,

Because what Susie Q meant to me was, wow, it's kind of a novelty song. Here's, you know, we've done a cover song. We've had this hit, you know, we're like the guys that did Louie Louie, you know, or most other one hit wonders. And I was after all this work of a whole lifetime, you know,

And our first song, rather than being the remarkable Wooly Bully, one of the greatest rock and roll records ever. My first favorite song. There you go. It was more like, oh, man, what are we going to follow this up with? Because this is going to run its course in a few weeks. And I mean, here was the actual thought in my mind.

We're sort of famous right now. The spotlight's shining on us. We got a few minutes and it's going to shine on us. And the sort of collective audience is going, well, in other words, what do you got? What now? If you do something great, you get to stay on the stage. But if you do something lame, you

It seems to be worse than never having had that hit because now with all that attention and you do something lame, you are massively...

identified that you don't have the goods. You're out of here. Next, you know, bring them in here. And I was terrified of that. I didn't want to go back to the car wash. That was the phrase we always use. Oh, my God, we're going to end up back at the car wash. And Proud Mary was where in the timeline, though, after Susie Q?

Well, Suzy Q came out on my birthday, May 28th, 1968. Right. And at that point in time, I was still committed or how can I say it? I still had obligations to the U.S. Army Reserve. I was still in the army. Wasn't out yet. But anyway.

I started writing actually before that album came out. The album that Suzy Q was on came out on May 28th. And I immediately started trying to write songs for the next album. And I had already started to have little thoughts about Born on the Bayou. But Proud Mary wasn't there yet. Somewhere, I think around in July...

It could have even been late June of 68. I got my honorable discharge. It had been sitting on the steps of my apartment house in an envelope that said official U.S. government business that I promptly stepped over for about three days.

um, not realizing that it was for me. I mean, it looks so official. Who's, I don't know what that is. It was my honorable discharge inside. Anyway, when I finally opened it, Rob, I was, this memory, this is the height of the Vietnam war. I was overjoyed. I was, wow. I mean, I was euphorically happy. So happy that I actually looked at the little

I don't know, five by eight patch of grass they had in front of the apartment house and did a cartwheel, you know, even though I was 22 then, I think. I went right inside the house, put on the guitar, and that's the circumstance that I wrote Proud Mary in. That first line being, left a good job in the city, that's what I was referring to, being in the army. Wow.

So that summer I was writing songs to to be recorded to be our next album after the Susie Q album. And the and Proud Mary and the others got recorded in October of 68. But they didn't come out till January 69. Did.

There's that great, there's one of the billions of documentaries about the Beatles. And there's one, this is the Imagine documentary for just John Lennon, where they, he plays Imagine for the band, for that band at the first, for the first time to gather around that white piano. And he finishes it and it's dead silence, dead silence, dead silence.

And nobody quite knows what to say because it's fucking imagine they just got played for the first time. And and John Lennon goes, I don't know. I think it's pretty good, actually. And I just have that sort of that sensation of like thinking about you playing Proud Mary for the band. They did. They did. They know it was as good as you knew it was. Ah, sing. Sing.

Things were not always a straight line. Yes, I intuited that. And well, you know, and in life, there's a lot of that. I mean, by the way, my declaration of freedom in my middle 70s is trying to only be on straight lines. You know, I mean, it's another way of expressing that because you realize that.

Well, I have no reason to be bashing Credence or anything after all this time. I mostly, especially for the early days, have pretty happy memories. So please don't take any – I'm just being honest rather than – but there was a bit of tension because –

For one thing, my brother and I, Tom and I had written songs together earlier in our lives, or sometimes he would write a whole song or I would write a whole song. You know, it would happen in those three ways. And I imagine even in other ways, too. And that was just between my brother, Tom, and myself.

So we had now discussed with, especially after I got back from active duty in 67 and we were kind of making a new push with our collective career as a band. We had discussed the idea of sharing the songwriting equally and all of us being songwriters. Okay. And you, and please understand that at that point in time, I,

Was a team player and really thought, I mean, that's all like, okay, yeah. I mean, I was, nothing else had really worked before. You know what I'm saying? So you keep trying things till something works. So that's what we had, what had been discussed. And so there was a tension about if I showed that, well, yeah,

I can only imagine, to use a phrase, if I had walked into that group of people who we had just come to the decision that we're all going to write songs and I sat down and played Imagine all by myself, the way that sounds on the piano.

I probably wouldn't have a band anymore. I mean, that's a very good point. I might have left the room myself. We'll be right back after this.

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Qualifying plan required. Wi-Fi were available on select U.S. airlines. Deposit and Hilton Honors membership required for 15% discount terms and conditions apply. You're in the Songwriting Hall of Fame. You went in in the mid-2000s, deservedly, obviously, goes without saying. Paul Simon, another, I think,

He might be great songwriter. One of the great songwriters in the history of the world. He's up there with Dylan and you, I mean, he's up there, but you know, he talks about writing bridge over troubled water in the same way you talk about it. It's almost the exact same description. He's written a gazillion great songs. Then he wrote bridge over troubled water and he went, he said he was shaking and he knew immediately that this was something other than

So I love, it's so interesting for me as a massive music fan to look at somebody's body of work like yours. It's just one monster after another, just one beat down after another. And then here comes Proud Mary in the same with Paul Simon. It's wild.

And I know what was different. You just got discharged from the army. That was that made that one happen. Sounds like to me. That's exactly what it was. And you and also understand I was at a different place in my career. I was I was at the very beginning. I had written songs. A few of them had been on, you know, radio.

how can I say, small radio stations out in the Central Valley, like places like Merced. We were the gollywogs then. And some of those got played. I don't think any of them were in the category of Proud Mary. A couple of them are kind of neat rock and roll songs, but they don't have that extra little, you know, that thing that it's bringing something with it

That's not necessarily in the words or in the recording, you know, in the musical arrangement. Although with a great record, you sense that. I mean, you know, you just like you mentioned, imagine or bridge over troubled water or even something like satisfaction or gosh, I want to hold your hand, you know, or like a rolling stone. I mean, you just you just sense that.

There. Yes, this thing's right here. I'm watching this or hearing it on this car speaker. But you're also aware of there is a whole bunch of suitcases just behind the microphone full of all kinds of other stuff that this song is referencing subliminally. And most of the time we I think we all understand it.

You know, emotionally, even if we can't quite verbalize it, kids more so than adults most of the time. Yeah, I look at my daughter now and the people she's 19, the people she loves and she's, you know, been paying attention since she was about 11. It's that she's.

It's like the people mover at Disneyland. You know, she's been on the people mover all that time and is totally plugged in to the current contemporary artists. I am not. I tend to be that guy that, you know, I'll notice a song here and there, but I don't know all the artists like that.

Cardi B and I don't know, Sizzy and also SZA. You know, she plays them for me and I love a lot of them, but I don't know them intimately like a kid does when they're in their own time. Yeah, it's I've been trying to think about this a lot is like what because you can get in the argument about what the state of music and things like that. But at the end of the day, it's important to remember that when you're

you know, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19 years old, whatever it is, whatever music is being played at that moment is going to be the soundtrack of your life. And that, that will always be, um, the same thing for Saturday night live casts. They always argue, which was the best version of Saturday night live. It's the version that was on when you were young. That's the answer.

And yeah, it's I think it's the same for music. I need to ask you, what did you think? I'm sure you've answered a lot when you heard Ike and Tina Turner's version of Proud Mary. Oh, I was very excited, I guess, over the moon with the phrase. I was driving in my car is about 630 to seven o'clock and it was dark. So it must have been in the wintertime.

In the Bay Area. I've been a fan of Ike and Tina since the 50s. In fact, at various times, I played some of their songs live, especially the one, I think it's going to work out fine, which was a really cool song.

A guitar song and also had the eye cats in the background and Tina just belting it out. And I was a big Tina fan. I was waiting for Tina to be discovered. You know, I was very aware that she she was.

It was a gaping hole. There was something wrong with the universe because she wasn't discovered yet. And, you know, it was something that kind of irked me. Even more so a little later when the gals from the San Francisco explosion all, you know, took off and became very famous and kind of left Tina Turner behind. And I'm going, well, wait a minute. This is not right. Because, you know, it was just one of those things. So when...

I can team his version of Proud Mary came out and it was so stunningly original and different, you know, and fresh. I just I absolutely loved it. I just thought it was great. I didn't see it as any kind of.

A threat or competition or even remotely like my version. I thought of it as a brand new thing. Well, it's it's the rare confluence where, like you say, when people redo a great song like that, for me, it's either it's just like it's never as good. They're like it's like a it's like a hamburger and a pizza. They're both fucking amazing.

And yet they're really different. Those two, the versions of that song there. I mean, they're both amazing. It's kind of stunning. They were able to do it. Well, do I get to be the hamburger? You get to choose. Well, here's the thing, John. And I thought long and hard. Am I going to be the pizza? Well, here's the thing. I've thought long and hard about whether I was going to bring this up or not in this conversation. But you know that Proud Mary has a very special place in my life.

Of course. You do know. Yes, Rob. Yes, of course. You do know. God damn it. Yeah. Okay, I'm, this is the most mortifying moment of my life. I desecrated Proud Mary in the Academy Awards. You didn't desecrate it. I'm just, you sang. See, I have the story a little, I'm a runner, right? I run all the time, jog all the time. And in those days, I was running in the dark, running,

just before dinnertime, you know, six o'clock, seven o'clock, something like that. And I always have sports on, you know, I had the radio. If I can, I'm listening to a game. Yep. Or else I'm at least listening to sports talk. Yep. So I was doing that one night jogging in the dark when somebody came on the news blast and explained that Rob Lowe had just sung Proud Mary and

At the Academy Awards, right? But this part I get messed up. Did you sing that to Snow White? John, the thing is, it's a very complex situation. Well, then I'm close. Oh, you're close. You're right on it. I didn't know if I was garbling up two different stories. Oh, no, no. We garbled it up plenty on our own. So the theory is...

That we were going to do an homage to old time Hollywood. And I was asked by the Academy to come and do it. And I was like a 20 year old. I was like, this is great. Marvin Hamlisch. Oh boy. Did the arrangement of your song. Awesome. Right? Thank you. Thank you. That's what I thought.

And I still think that, well, it's a feather in our cap. Thank you. See, you know what? This, this is the final word. We collaborated here. Hey, see, this is it. You've done more for me coming to terms with this than, than 30 years of therapy about it. John, honestly, this is, you've been carrying it around that long. I've been carrying around my shame for 30 years and you've, you've, you've absolved me. Um, that I will say the lyrics, um,

You get discharged from the army and write the amazing lyric, left a good job in the city. Marvin Hamlisch's version was having Snow White say, used to work a lot for Walt Disney. They're not exactly... I don't think there's so many suitcases behind the microphone on that one. I get it. I don't think that...

takes it down at all, you know, in any way. I think the idea that you got to sing a song like that and sing it, I get the context now that that's why there'd be Disney because there's Snow White. By the way, talk about in our era of cultural appropriation,

The Oscars, they said, no, we're not interested in Ike Turner. Let's have Rob Lowe. And we don't want Tina Turner. We want Snow White. That's talk about that version of it. But, you know, there you go. Here's one of those examples of where you do something that's a little uncomfortable because it furthers your career. Yeah. Right. I'm speaking of our this idea of Tina being Snow White probably would have been she would have said, yes, I would think.

Um, you know, it's the, it's something, it was fun to do. I actually had a really good time doing it. And again, it was, I was like, are you kidding me? Sing a Creedence song? Hell yeah, man. I was always, I, I, I, like I said, I love doing it. And the fact that,

I get to go. You did. I go to the Godfather himself and said, all I know is that the two people who have loved my Snow White and these are all the people are going to write their Oscar most embarrassing lists every year. I am a number one or two. They do it every year. I don't know why they do it. Notwithstanding the fact that. Oh, man, that's not right. I know. Can you believe this, John? Notwithstanding the fact that three years ago, they couldn't even figure out what picture really won best picture. I'm still the problem. Yeah.

You loved it, and Lucille Ball loved it. And to me, that's... Awesome! Yeah, there you go. That is the...

And we're still talking about it and we still remember it. So there you go. That's boy. You said it right. When when is the tour starting back? I know you're right in the middle of it. And then COVID hit. When are you coming back on the road so I can come see you? Well, we're right now. We've been in rehearsal this week. I have a few shows this weekend and it's kind of gearing up throughout the rest of the summer. And, you know, it's great.

We'll soon get back to normal, I hope. You know, it's interesting. I had a thought back there with talking about how the Beatles came on Ed Sullivan, and it had been right after a time when the whole country was in such a low mood because of JFK. And I mean, not that they're similar, let's say. We've had a pretty horrible time this past year and a half or so. For sure.

So many families have lost family members. And for those folks, it's, you know, it's horrible. And there's nothing's going to fix it. But I think collectively, our country, America, and generally speaking, the rest of the world, we're poor.

And tenuously kind of realizing that we might be able to smile again. You know, I'm sure we're kind of testing the dirt to see if it's quicksand or not, you know. Or when you laugh out loud, you kind of wonder, oh, well, I hope I didn't offend anybody who maybe doesn't feel like laughing out loud right now. You know, it's going to be a process. Yeah.

But isn't it interesting that we've gone through a collective trauma like this? And it has, I mean, the medical trauma and the political trauma was bad enough. And then I've never had to worry about this, wondering when it starts to be okay again, because we don't really know. Yeah, and I think it's going to be great for

you to be playing those that your amazing catalog out there with people who are going to be so glad to be out and so glad to be sharing your

art again with with other people where you're starting to see it already in the movie business with people coming back into the movie theaters and our our boy bruce is back on broadway packing them in and you know it's like people are hungry for the communal experience of of sharing this kind of stuff together so i i think i think it's going to be good timing for you guys do you have dates actually set up are you in the process of still figuring out what's going to work uh no we there's uh

This weekend I'm playing in Sioux City. Amazing. And also Minneapolis. So you're out. I love it. You're out. Yeah. And a couple weeks later, some more dates in the Midwest. Finally ending up near the end of August on the East Coast. I think Boston and New York City and, you know, starting to get normal again. I'm in Las Vegas in October. Okay.

And you play with your kids now. They're in the band, correct? Well, I think for me, yes, the answer is yes. And you see, I have an extra thing. I mean, realizing that getting with my band this past week or so and playing loud and playing live and getting to scream out Fortunate Son, you know, it just feels so good. It's just, here we go.

But also I've got my kids there. And, you know, we've there were times when I showed them things on guitar and piano and other times when I didn't. And they would just go off on their own and learn things. And now they're grown up and they play really well. Part of what we're doing, especially this weekend, you know, is.

Last summer, because we were in lockdown, we really couldn't leave the house. So I couldn't play with my band. Everybody was in their, you know, in our...

What were they? Shelter at Home mode, right? Yep. So we kind of formed our own little family band. My wife called it Fogarty's Factory. That's your YouTube channel, is it not? Yeah. The album Cosmos Factory by Creedence turned 50 last summer. Jesus. And so Julie, my wife, got the idea to replicate that album cover, but with our family.

Right. And so it's, you know, which I thought, hey, that's cool. And we had to do it all. It's like found art, you know, that we had to do things we just found in the house. We weren't allowed to leave and go down to the, you know, five and dime because you were supposed to stay home at that point. What's the drum kit? Pots and pans?

Kitchen table, pillows, muffled pillows, any of that stuff? Well, in our band of us four people, we didn't really have a real drummer. Eventually, I had Kelsey, my daughter, play drums or play a drum. And she staggered me. She was so good at it. But it was basically the four of us. You see, my son Shane, who normally plays guitar, played bass, played

And then the rest of us played guitars, or I think my son Tyler played electric piano on a couple of the songs. And we just found ways of, again, because there was sort of an enforced or imposed discipline to this, we had to find a way to make it sound at least interesting under those conditions. And

For me, Rob, what I'm trying to tell you, it was a joy because I'd never really had the whole group of all the kids and me playing at the same time, making a performance. We had done it off the cuff, like in the car, you know, singing along to Louie Louie or something. Yeah. But never like we're going to present, you know, what do they call that?

recital, like a recital. Oh, boy. You know, and you're in sixth grade. And they, it was so much fun and they were so doggone good. You know, they all had the feel. I was very surprised to tell you that, you know, I was a little surprised. I can't wait to see it. But,

I have that ingredient now in our show so that I've got this extra thing like spurring me on besides just playing rock and roll music loud the way I love to do. I've got my family there on stage with me. It's so awesome. I can't even describe it really. What a blessing. What a just a I'm so happy for you. I can't wait to see you. You've been in my area a couple of times and I've always been impressed.

either shooting or whatever. And I'm always like, God damn it. But this I'm keeping my eye out for the, uh, West coast, Southern California, Santa Barbara area dates. Cause I, I can't wait to see, see you in concert, John. This has been great. Thank you so much for coming on the show. I've wanted you on it forever. You're one of the first people that I put on my list. Cause you're one of my heroes. And, and, um, this is, it's made my day. I'm going to,

Go listen to Proud Mary. I'm going to sing my earwig of I'm going to go to the Dodger Stadium and hear. There's one. Right. We all know what that is. Well, thank you, Rob. I've enjoyed being here talking to you. And you remember when you said that you thought that the Beatles were being called the Shields? Yeah. Yeah. I thought that the original lyrics for the old man down the road was the old man is Dan DeRoe.

That's his name. He's not down the road. The old man is down to row. Anyway, that's what I say. That's what I sing. Just so you know, whenever I hear it one day, you're going to, they're going to be a big music festival.

And you're going to go and you're going to check in at a hotel as Dan DeRoe. Well, dude, that's got to be your road name now. I'm giving that gift to you. Some kids will get together and name their band the DeRose. And one of them will be Danny DeRoe. And, of course, Johnny. The old man is Dan DeRoe.

I had to do it. I wasn't getting away without doing my Fogarty. That was not even a possibility. So great. That's my favorite podcast ever made. It's great being here. Thanks, Brad. Thank you again. Thanks, brother. All right. See you later. Thanks, folks. Thank you. Wow. That was so much fun. I hope you guys had as much fun as I did listening to John. And I just...

I'm feeling all warm and fuzzy, and I'm going to get in my car right now, and you know what I'm going to do. I'm putting some John Fogarty on, as he says, loud, the way he likes it. All right. It is time for the lowdown line. Hello. You've reached literally in our lowdown line where you can get the lowdown on all things about me, Rob Lowe. 323-570-5705.

4-5-5-1. So have at it. Here's the beep. Hi, Rob. This is Tessa calling from St. Thomas, U.S. Virgin Islands. I want to know from you, what's your favorite virtue? Such as, like an example is patience. What's your favorite virtue? What would you, what virtue would you like to

grow in and what we'd like to see more in the world. Have a good one. Bye. Wow, Tessa. See, that's what happens when you live in such a beautiful place like the Virgin Islands. You think about beautiful things like that. What virtue is the most virtuous? I'm thinking of like that David Fincher movie, The Seven Deadly Sins. Like, you know, you don't want to have... What sins? Sloth! See, it's the opposite side of that conversation. It's the...

Well, you mentioned patience. And I have to tell you, I did a little, in my morning meditation and my morning prayers, just this morning, prayed for more patience. So clearly that is something that I would use as to what I would like to have more of myself. Patience for sure is my thing. But what is my, but that's not my favorite. I don't go, oh, I met this guy. He was so amazing. God, you got to meet him. He's so patient.

That doesn't really work, right? I mean, it's a good virtue. Don't get me wrong. And it's the virtue I want more of, but it's not like a beacon of attraction. I don't think for anybody. So what would that be? What would be the beacon of attraction? Virtue? Well, listen, I mean, I don't know if it's a virtue, but I, you know, I like, I like funny people. I know it's not a virtue. It's not. Funny people are good. Uh,

My new made up virtue is funny. I'm selling it to you as a virtue. Hopefully you buy that. And as for myself, I would like more patience, which is actually a virtue. Thanks for listening, everybody. We will see you next week on literally. Don't forget, tell two people about the podcast. Let's spread the word.

Let's build it up. And don't forget to subscribe and give me some comments on the comment boards, on Apple in particular, because I always like to read them and I love the helpful criticisms and positive feedback and all of it. All right, ladies and gents, I will see you next week. Thank you. You have been listening to Literally with Rob Lowe. Produced and engineered by me, Devin Tory Bryant.

Executive produced by Rob Lowe for Lowe Profile. Adam Sachs and Jeff Ross at Team Coco. And Colin Anderson and Chris Bannon at Stitcher. The supervising producer is Aaron Blairt. Talent producer, Jennifer Samples. Please rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts. And remember to subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, or wherever you get your podcasts. This has been a Team Coco production in association with Stitcher.

At Ashley, you'll find colorful furniture that brings your home to life. Ashley makes it easier than ever to express your personal style with an array of looks in fun trending hues to choose from, from earth tones to vibrant colors to calming blues and greens. Ashley has pieces for every room in the house in the season's most sought after shades. A more colorful life starts at Ashley. Shop in store online today. Ashley, for the love of home.

All set for your flight? Yep. I've got everything I need. Eye mask, neck pillow, T-Mobile, headphones. Wait, T-Mobile? You bet. Free in-flight Wi-Fi. 15% off all Hilton brands. I'll never go anywhere without T-Mobile. Same goes for my water bottle, chewing gum, nail clippers. Okay, I'm going to leave you to it. Find out how you can experience travel better at T-Mobile.com slash travel. ♪

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