U-Turns for Automakers, a “Big, Beautiful Bill,” & a Nike Billboard 4/29/25
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Automatic protections for who can contact your teen and the content they can see. Bring in show music, please. Hi, I'm CNBC producer Katie Kramer. Today on Squawk Pod. New Trump tax cuts coming. House Ways and Means Chair Jason Smith. We're going to provide that certainty to the markets, the certainty to the small businesses, the certainty to the families that they're going to have a very aggressive pro-growth tax bill.

And a U-turn in the auto sector. GM and the rest of the car industry are facing crippling tariffs. Former Ford CEO Mark Fields joins us. The automaker is going to look very closely on moving very fast to automate as much of the processes as possible. But the bottom line is, yes, it will add jobs back here in the U.S.,

Plus, Canada votes, the division of labor between the DOJ and the FTC in antitrust issues, and Nike's in hot water with a shareholder over a billboard. Not a good ad anyway. Whoever wrote this copy was so ignorant. It's Tuesday, April 29th. Squawk Pod begins right now. Stand back, you buy in three, two, one, cue, please.

Good morning, everybody. Welcome to Squawk Box right here on CNBC. We're live from the Nasdaq market site in Times Square. I'm Becky Quick, along with Joe Kernan and Andrew Ross Sorkin. Here we go on a Tuesday. Excuse me. Water went down. I caught you off guard. Side of my mouth. Not the side of my mouth. Down my, you know, the wrong pipe. I've heard you have a drinking problem. Water drinking problem.

No, I mean, drinking anything. Drinking anything. The White House is saying that the Trump administration is going to be moving now to reduce the impact of auto tariffs by lightening some levies that were placed on foreign parts in U.S. manufactured cars and by preventing tariffs on foreign-made cars from stacking on top of one another. So the reductions expected to take place today when the president will travel to the heart of auto country in Michigan for a rally.

marking his first 100 days back in office. The CO is a Ford and GM both praising the planned tariff changes. And so it's going to be interesting to see him in Michigan where all of this has had, I don't know, probably the biggest impact so far in terms of just how much anxiety it's created. And it's a mixed bag. It's a mixed bag because some of the union people like it and other people hate it. Foreign automakers, like so many of these things.

Journal's got a pretty good piece. First one, summary of the first 100 days. Basically starts with second terms are usually totally unsuccessful. And this one, in their view, is starting out in that direction. It'd be tough to do to change a lot. They say a couple of things are good. Seems like energy production is up quite a bit.

and the border, but then some of the negatives. Biggest change since Bretton Woods with Nixon, which brought in wage and price controls. And Doge, disappointing, didn't really change the trajectory of federal spending like it was promised, but interesting piece. The Journal's never been

totally behind the line. They're anti-terrorists. Totally anti-terrorists. On the editorial page. Yeah, top, top. Yeah, but it's, you know, tomorrow's 100 days. Yeah. If you can't get Rupert's business-friendly paper on your side for things, who's going to be, you're not getting it from the Washington Post or New York Times. I'll tell you that much. ♪

Top Republicans are working to chart a path forward on budget reconciliation on that package to pass President Trump's big, beautiful bill of his top priorities. Treasury Secretary Scott Besson held a meeting yesterday afternoon at the Capitol with other members of the so-called Big Six. That group includes House Speaker

Mike Johnson, Senate Majority Leader John Thune, the Senate Finance Chair, House Ways and Means Chair, and the National Economic Council Director Besson said he's hoping a reconciliation bill can be done by July 4th. But key in the timetable will be the date on which the government hits its borrowing limit. Some people are talking about October or November for this bill being more likely.

Then you've got elections and everything else. The Treasury Secretary said he doesn't know yet that exact date, but should have a better idea by next week. Separately, the House Judiciary Committee has proposed transferring the FTC's antitrust work to the Department of Justice as part of a budget reconciliation package. Those two agencies have shared federal antitrust jurisdiction for more than 100 years.

The idea has been proposed before, and it's unclear whether the plan will make it through the reconciliation process. But I've always wondered why you had the FTC and the DOJ working separately. Some of the arguments that have been pushed back have said that it would weaken the nation's antitrust reviews. But I would think from the perspective of business, it would probably be good to have one organization, one place that you go to find out if you get the thumbs up, thumbs down.

I always thought there was some argument talking about competition, competition inside government. To see who can be the tougher regulator? Well, that and just different... No, but there was always this idea that if you had different agencies that could compete with each other a little bit, maybe some would be better than others. It just feels like it's probably tough to get the rules of the road when you're not sure. It's always been the case. The prime minister who will make Canada strong and Canada poor. Who's ready? Who's ready? Who's ready?

Who's ready to stand up for Canada with me? Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney's Liberal Party winning Canada's federal election yesterday. The Liberals are projected to win more seats in Parliament than Canada's Conservatives, but they're short of an outright majority of seats. Many believe the Liberals would lose yesterday's election, but vocal attacks from President Trump in recent months drove a surge in Canadian nationalism ahead of that vote.

As late as yesterday morning, Trump posting on Truth Social that Canada should become America's 51st state. So that continues to hang over a lot of the folks in Canada. No, no, because I've talked to a bunch of them and this is something that, you know. Well, he would have beat Trudeau. And once Trudeau resigned, all bets were off. Yeah, but there is a Canadian nationalism. There is. There is. And they think Carney might be a better way. They think it has. But I think you can see the.

on the poly market when it switched. The Trump administration announcing investigations into Harvard University and the school's law review. The probe comes from the Departments of Education and Health and Human Services, which said that they were in response to potential violations of the Title VI

of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. It bars recipients of federal funds from engaging in race-based discrimination. Harvard says the school's committed to ensuring programs it oversees comply with all applicable laws. The developments came just hours after a federal judge agreed to expedite Harvard's lawsuit against the Trump administration, which has frozen more than $2 billion in federal funding for the school.

Me time. This is a fascinating story. Billionaire investor Bill Ackman saying that he has now spoken to Nike CEO Elliot Hill after the company received blowback for a billboard along the route of last Sunday's London Marathon. The advertisement featured the phrase never again, which is used by many as a reminder to heed the lessons of the Holocaust. Ackman's

Pershing Square is one of Nike's biggest shareholders. In a post on X late last night, Ackman said that Nike's CEO had apologized for the ad. Ackman said Nike is in the midst of a turnaround which makes mistakes more likely to occur with talent turning over, etc.

Elliott is the right choice to fix the company, and he clearly has a lot of work to do. I'm confident he will get it done. In a statement to CBC, Nike said it did not mean any harm with that ad and apologized for any that it caused. It said that the copy used in the billboard campaign was based on common phrases used by runners. That red back.

It's not a good ad anyway. I mean, just irrespective of any of it. But they admitted it. Yeah, they admitted it. Yeah, but they didn't admit that they tried it because the United Colors of Bennington, do you remember? They tried the clickbait idea. A lot of places. Oh, you think that was clickbait?

I just think that it was to get attention. You didn't have any idea that that... I don't know. I don't know. I wasn't there when they planned it, but just hard to believe. Oh, I don't believe. No, no. I genuinely believe... Everybody in the world knows what never again means. I believe that whoever wrote this copy was so ignorant that they did not know what was really going on. And the truth is...

that I imagine, and I have heard marathoners say after they finish a marathon, they're like, I'm never doing this again for the rest of my life. Like, once and done, this is it. And I'm assuming that in sort of a runner's world, and maybe they're not focused on the geopolitical issues, I don't know what their religious background, I don't know anything. We are very focused, and as a result, it matters. My slogan would be never for the marathon. True. Because a body's not supposed to do that. Well, that's a whole separate topic.

But I do think it was an accident. They screwed up. They admitted it. Black, red background. It just looked very austere. If you put it in context with the rest of the campaign. Maybe I'm not being cynical enough. I don't know. I hope not. That would be, I don't know. Maybe I'm too cynical.

So I know you're going to do the teas. This is it. We're early. We're early. Andrew. It's good. I just-- my question, your drinking problem, is it rare? Is it rare that that happens to you? Is it not-- have you noticed it happening more?

I'm asking you for an age thing. That's what I'm talking about. Because the water goes down the wrong. Yeah, I just looked it up and I have I definitely noticed. I mean, I have definitely noticed. And it's very disconcerting because you're sitting there minding your own business and you've been doing this the right way your entire, you know, it's pretty easy to drink.

And it just goes down the wrong way. And it's like, whoa! You have to be careful. You can't talk and drink at the same time. And I looked it up. And it happens more and more. You're not 50 yet. Yes. And over 50, it starts. Over 50, it starts. I didn't have that. I felt it was just I was drinking. I was trying to drink fast before I was up on the screen. With you, it's not related to that. I'm just telling you.

And it doesn't happen to everyone, but it's a shocker, and it just seems to happen more. I've got a lot of wisdom to impart to you as you, since we're different ages, but as you go into the, not the twilight, but the... Tease will be next.

Coming up on Squawk Pod, House Ways and Means Chairman Jason Smith is the most influential lawmaker when it comes to tax policy. It all happens in his committee. He says Trump's new tax plan is all about revenue, but the markets are more concerned about another metric.

Will it expand the deficit? The House budget version is much different than the Senate budget version. And in fact, we are going to expand the growth in the economy. What the GOP wants in the next big, beautiful bill, plus an announcement from Amazon, all that is right after this break.

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Welcome back to Squawk Pod. Up in Andrew, Q. You're watching Squawk Box right here on CNBC. I'm Andrew Ross, working along with Joe Kernan and Becky Quick. We've got a lot going on this morning. Amazon is launching its first batch of Internet satellites into space. A United...

Launch Alliance rocket carrying 27 of these Kuiper satellites lifted off from Cape Canaveral last night. Plans call for the satellites to separate from the rocket about 280 miles above the Earth's surface, at which point Amazon will try to confirm that they can move around independently and communicate with the ground. Amazon aims for Kuiper to compete with Elon Musk. Starlink can go into commercial operation later this year. Starlink currently dominates

The space-based internet industry has about 8,000 satellites in orbit. How did you know Kuiper? Do you know how to say that before? Do you want to know about Kuiper or does it waste time for you? Do you think it's good to know? You know, we had the head of Kuiper on. But do you know why it's called Kuiper? I don't know why it's called Kuiper. Okay, do you want to? I'm not going to waste your time. Sure. Okay. The Kuiper belt was named by an astronomer, Gerard Kuiper. It's past the last planet.

Some people say eight, Neptune. And it's a belt of icy bodies that goes around. One of his students that's famous, that Gerard Kuiper mentored was Carl Sagan. So he was a Dutch-American astronomer. Carl Sagan taught at Cornell.

He's Carl Sagan. One of the greats. It brings it all back. One of the greats. Brings it all back home. Now, see, I think that's interesting info, but I don't, you know, there's times where you look at me and I know you did, but I'm going to ask him from now on. I'm going to ask you before I waste time. I'm much more focused on the idea, though, that if this works, you're actually going to be competition to SpaceX, which is going to be a great thing. You're looking at the money side of things. This guy revolutionized the way we look at the solar system and made it much more rigorous. And so...

This is how we make my compliment each other. But we're different. But I'm going to ask you from now. Tomorrow is 100 days into President Trump's second term in office. His top negotiators met at the Capitol yesterday to discuss what's next for the Republicans. Mega bill and tax cuts. There are the what did it used to be a.

Group of seven. What were those? The gang of the gang of six or the magnificent seven magnificent six. And we've got one ways and means committee chair and maybe the best of all of them. Jason Smith, who was part of that meeting. Chairman, it's good to see you.

It's good to see you, as always. I want you to tell me everything, you know, because everything that I want to ask you, I don't think we know anything. We don't know what's in it. We don't know when it's going to be doable. We don't know when the write ups are, when the final votes are. Is there anything you can tell us definitively right now or at least give the handicap what's happening, what's in it and when it's going to be?

Absolutely, Joe. I will tell you that when it comes to markup and seeing bill text and legislation moving forward, we're days away, not months. We're going to provide that certainty to the markets, the certainty, the small businesses, the certainty to the families that they're going to have

a very aggressive pro-growth tax bill that makes permanent Trump's expiring tax provisions from the 2017 Tax Cuts and Jobs Act, but also delivering on his campaign promises when it comes to no tax on tips, no tax on overtime, tax relief for seniors. These are all things that will be in this bill moving forward.

Some of that pay for was going to be letting the top rate go back up. Now that's off the table. Is there any other way to make it less, you know, causing less addition to the deficit?

First off, Joe, let me say that as the tax writer, the ways and means chairman, I've been reading a lot of news reports talking about we're going to do X, Y, and Z, whether it's a top bracket, whether it's SALT, whether it's various IRA credits. And I'm like, wow, that's a lot of news.

That's interesting. And so there's been a lot of reporting and a lot of hysterical releases that's been out there that's just simply not accurate. When this bill comes out, Joe, people will see exactly what it is. We're going to have a pro-growth tax bill that the markets will love.

and that the markets will appreciate, which is small businesses will love. The small business businesses will appreciate because it's going to be extremely pro growth and it's going to be led by pro growth tax policies. All right. Then I mean, that would hurt small businesses if you went from 37 back to the president. Can you say that that's that's been put? That's not going to happen. President Trump said that's not going to happen. Can you tell me that at least?

Joe, what I will say is, is the tax bill is all about growth and people can extrapolate what pro-growth is. But we are going to deliver real tax relief for businesses, small businesses, working families and farmers. It is going to be pro-growth and the markets will love it.

Chairman Smith, we had Libby Cantrell here from PIMCO yesterday, and she said exactly that, that this is going to be a very pro-growth bill that is put forward. I asked her what that meant, if it means that there's not going to be pay force for these things if it expands the deficit, and she said yes, she believes that's the case. Is that what you see it as as well?

There's absolutely going to be provisions that eliminate bad tax policy and replacing it with better tax policy. We did that in 2017. We're going to do it throughout this process. But will it expand the deficit? We're going to eliminate a lot of different loopholes. Will it expand the deficit? It will.

The House budget version is much different than the Senate budget version. And in fact, we are going to expand the growth in the economy. And that's the key. If you look at the revenues coming into our country right now under the current Trump tax cuts that are current policy, current law,

GDP towards revenue is 17.2%. If you look at over the last 50 years, it has averaged 17%. We are going to maintain and grow that. My question, though, is will it expand the deficit? Because you described pro-growth as market-friendly. Markets definitely want to see lower taxes. But if it expands the deficit, that could be something that worries the bond market.

Well, let me tell you, the deficit is only expanded by spending. If you look at over the last five years, when you look at spending to GDP, it is averaged 26% of GDP. The 45 years before that, spending to GDP averaged 20%.

20%. We have a spending problem. We do not have a revenue problem. What I'm working on in the tax bill is in regards to the revenues that go into our coffers. Since we passed the 2017 successful Trump tax cuts, the corporate revenue receipts, even at a 21% rate when we went from 35 to 21, has only increased dramatically.

We are going to have pro-growth policies that's going to increase the revenue for our country. I understand that, and I get what you're saying. I agree with your math on that in terms of how we spend. Well, how will it be scored? It'll be scored that the deficit goes up. Will it extend the deficit? It'll be scored that way, right? Congressman, you can do fuzzy math. It'll be scored that way, that the deficit goes up. Let me just say how...

congressional scorekeepers are just eliminating the $22 billion that is left from the Inflation Reduction Act for the IRS. Remember there was $80 billion? There's $22 billion that has not been spent. Just to eliminate that, a

According to those congressional scorekeepers, it would cost us $65 billion. So the scorekeepers sometimes just don't put apples and oranges together. What I'm saying is, is the revenues are going to increase and the growth is going to be exponential. You would hope, but those are, you know,

Whether they're right or wrong, when it is scored, probably you're going to see that go. What about Medicare and I'm sorry, Medicaid? And the numbers thrown around, do you have a better idea of what it's going to be somewhere around 900 billion? What is that over over 10 years? And then there's arguments about whether.

It's a cut in the projected growth of Medicaid, not in the program itself. But then there's others that say you'd have to cut or do some, I don't know, right to work or whatever. You'd have to do some things to get...

Existing payouts would have to be cut, not just future growth. Can you explain that? And how do you get all the Republicans on board with that? Some of the ones that might want to cut more or some of the ones in districts that are at risk that might want to cut less?

Joe, you hit the big challenge at hand. It's threading that needle because we have some members on various different issues, whether it's spending cuts, whether it's different tax provisions.

We have to thread that needle. We have to get that balance. There's 11 different committees that is part of this big, beautiful bill, as the president would say. And the committee that is completely over Medicaid is Energy and Commerce. Our committee, of course, is completely over the revenues, the tax provisions.

There's a lot of things that the Energy and Commerce Committee is that they can look at and that they are looking at. One thing that could be a revenue raiser within energy and commerce space is selling spectrum. This is one thing that's within theirs.

That can bring in a lot of money that's not being projected. The president has been crystal clear. When he's looking at this bill and spending cuts, he wants to make sure that he protects individuals' benefits. He said that you would not cut Medicare, Social Security, Medicaid. But are there efficiencies that can be put in there? Absolutely. You know, one thing that has been raised numerous times is work requirements.

But this is all within the energy and commerce space. I'm not an expert in it. I'm focused on the four and a half trillion dollar tax bill. But it's all going to add up in the ultimately end. But just that it was a big ask. Sounds like I'm saying something else. It was a it was a big ask to be able to extend. I mean, there's a reason that those.

The 2007 team bill wasn't permanent. Jason, you remember that. It's because it was a deficit buster. And everybody's been worried. How do you extend it? And not only are you extending it, but you're getting all these other tax cuts that you're putting into. And you're still saying that it's not going to be...

a deficit buster. And the numbers are just troubling for for. And, you know, I know no one worries about the deficit. You look at how how Biden spent and we know we can with a reserve currency of the world, we can get it done. But do you not worry that, you know, history is going to look back and say, there they go again. Both parties just blow out. I mean, you're counting on growth, but the numbers probably don't lie.

So let's just look at this show. Just in the four years of the Biden presidency, he added more than 10 trillion dollars to the deficit. That's almost a third of what we're at. But the markets wasn't talking about that. You're opening yourself up to the same issue. When will it actually be signed? You think it's in the summer or all the way out into the fall?

You know, I don't have a crystal ball, but what my goal is, my goal as the chief tax writer is to have it delivered for the American people by July 4th. I think that that's very doable. And as long as we continue to work hand in glove with the United States Senate, which we have been, we'll be able to accomplish this. The American people are expecting this. We're going to provide

imminent growth and tax policies that are transformational. When you look at the 2017 tax cuts, Joe, that you were talking about, there was numerous provisions within that that were permanent, such as the corporate tax rate was permanent from 35 to 21 percent. In this tax bill, there will be numerous things that are made permanent. Not everything, but numerous items will be because we're looking at the debt

the deficits. It's extremely important. The House is more focused on that than the other side of the building. Will the top, the 37 will be permanent then on the top right?

We're going to have pro-growth tax policies that you're going to love. Oh, my God. Let me ask you one more. See if you can do it. Chairman, let me ask you one more. I know you can't tell us exactly what the final bill is going to look like. That's still a negotiation. Can you tell us where the toughest sticking points are? Where do you have the hardest sell? Where are the things that are on the margins?

Yeah, without a doubt, I think there's three areas that are going to be major significant sticking points. It has been throughout the process. It's going to continue to be. One is to make sure that we cut enough spending that puts our 15 to 25 members that are very concerned about debt and deficits, that this is what they wake up every morning thinking about.

We have to thread the needle there, make sure that everyone's feeling good. When you look at salt, salt is another thing that's very big to our members from New York, New Jersey, California. We have to thread that needle. We have individuals within our conference that wants an unlimited salt cap. We have others that want no deduction on salt. We're threading that needle. Another item is within all the IRA credits. We're looking at every provision of the tax

tax bill. And so there's some members that want to rip out the entire IRA by its roots. And there's others that want to use a scalpel approach. So it's a balancing act, act threading the needle. But we're going to get this done. I think you're not listening to President Trump. I mean, I heard him say it, Chairman, Mr. Chairman. He said he's publicly said there will not be a top income tax bill.

rate going back up above the 37. It would be very disruptive. Are you trying to talk him into it? He's got members who want to cut the debt and deficit, and that's a big part of it. He's in charge, isn't he? If you write it into it, he might... Yeah, go ahead.

Joe, just let me say, I have a great relationship with the president. I talk to him. Don't talk him out of that party. He is going to love the tax bill. And we're going to follow through with his priorities. That's what we're going to do. 77 million people sent him to Washington. We have the House and the Senate because President Trump was elected president. We are going to deliver his priorities. I'm his biggest advocate. I'm not trying to talk him out of anything. I'm delivering what he is asking.

Yeah, you've got members you have to appease. We just got this list. So the ones who want to cut the debt and deficit, 15 to 20 members, they're going to speak. Get that 26 percent down. That's how you got to do it. And I don't know how you do that either. But that's what you're not that you don't got to do the 17. You got to do the 26. Mr. Chairman, thanks.

Next on Squawk Pod, General Motors is reassessing its full year guidance in light of potential tariff policy. But even more changes may be coming down the road. How automakers are dealing with what the White House wants from their industry with former president and CEO of Ford, Mark Fields.

They're putting these, you know, probably big analytic groups in their purchasing areas and deciding, looking at their parts footprint and their suppliers and saying what parts are best for automating so that if we have to bring these kind of parts back, we can spend the capital expenditures, automate, reduce the amount of labor. Plus, what to expect from President Trump's Motown announcement today. Is he backing off on tariffs for Detroit? We'll be right back.

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You're listening to Squawk Pod from CNBC. Here's Joe Kernan. This should be good. GM is out with its earnings and we'll see what's happening. Given all the backdrop, Phil LeVeaux joins us now with the numbers. Hey, Phil. Hey, Phil.

Hey, Joe, this is a beat on the top and the bottom line for General Motors in the first quarter. The company earning 278 a share. The street was expecting 274 revenue coming in slightly better than expected at 44.02 billion, about a billion dollars more than was expected.

All in, adjusted EBIT of $3.49 billion, better than the estimate of $3.42 billion. The adjusted margin is 7.9%. For North America, GM made $3.28 billion. That's less than the first quarter of last year when they made $3.84 billion, and they brought in about $45 million from China. That's an improvement compared to just an awful couple of years in China. Remember, they took that huge rebound

right down and charged last year, I think, what, several billion dollars. So they made $45 million in the first quarter in China as they restructure that business. Average transaction price, $50,700. That's up about $1,000 per vehicle compared to the same quarter a year ago. And here's the news that people will be focused on. General Motors is reassessing its 2025 guidance.

due to the potential impact of tariffs. There will be an impact. They just don't know to what degree. And as a result, they are not sticking by the guidance that they gave in January for 2025. And they are now reassessing, that's the word they're using, their guidance on tariffs. We should get more details regarding how General Motors sees the landscape, especially in North America, with regard to tariffs when the company does its conference call, not

today, but on Thursday. And we'll talk about why in just a little bit. We'll also have a first on CNBC interview with General Motors CEO, Chair and CEO Mary Barra. That will be on Squawk Box Thursday morning. And the reason that they are delaying the conference call and this interview with Mary is because the president will be in Detroit tonight, where he is expected to announce the

the modifications and the offsets for the tariffs that should provide a little bit of relief to the automakers. Exactly how much remains to be seen in terms of maybe not stacking the tariffs like steel and aluminum on top of the 25% imported auto tariff.

Also giving some relief in terms of supplier tariffs, which are supposed to kick in starting on Saturday or Sunday. So the bottom line is this, guys, we'll find out on Thursday from General Motors how it is planning to offset these tariffs because they're still going to face higher costs. The question is, do they have a better sense after the president's announcement?

Did they say anything? We used to wait for you to tell us what they said about EV production until the tariffs came out. Anything at all about that? They're just on track or where were they the last couple of times? Are they paring it back significantly or?

No, no, they continue to ramp it up. They have stood by their projections in terms of EV production as well as EV sales. Now, the interesting thing, Joe, there's more than a few people who are out there saying you've got capacity at factory zero, which is being tooled to make electric vehicles available.

in the Detroit area. Do they change that? Do they say, look, we've got to move some production and therefore one of the steps we're taking is to move some production into factory zero and scale back EV production there. But in terms of EV production in Spring Hill, uh,

and cell production. We were there last year during the annual meeting for General Motors. No, they're sticking with that as of right now. But let's see on Thursday. You know, they could say something completely different come Thursday after they get a better sense from the Trump administration tonight about these offsets and modifications to the tariffs.

I was going to joke around and say, have they sold one yet? But which ones are the, it's the Equinox. They're number two in the U.S., Joe. Okay. Joe, they're number two in the U.S. From the Equinox? Equinox is a big one, yeah. What else? It's not just the Equinox, but they've got some other vehicles as well. I mean, there's an electric Silverado now.

Chevy Blazer. I mean, they have they have more than just one electric vehicle. Now, they're a distant, you know, number two in terms of market share or number three. I think Hyundai's technically number two. But General Motors, as an automaker, has dramatically improved its EV sales dramatically.

Relative to where they were, Joe, I know you're going to sit there and say, how much are they? Exactly. But relative to where they were, they've improved their EV sales. And Ford, the Mustang, is that an EV now? That little crappy looking thing? Well, they make both the traditional internal combustion. Because that used to be a muscle car. And now it looks like a, almost looks like a. And then they make the Mach-E. There is an electric version of the Mustang, which is built in Mexico.

It is for now. OK. Hey, Phil, how much of of GM's the production comes from either Canada or Mexico? And how do you figure that out with the parts that are coming across, too? Well, with the parts, that makes it a little bit trickier. They do not have as much U.S. based production as Ford.

um ford has the most uh in this country but what they're doing is they where possible becky they are shifting some production good example is they make the full-size pickup trucks uh some of them down in mexico what are they doing they're shifting some of that production up to the plant in fort wayne indiana where they also make full-size pickup trucks and they're going to increase their production i think annually by something like 50 000 vehicles

I'm trying to take up some of the excess capacity there. Those are some of the steps that they're taking. All right. Thanks, Phil. More to come, obviously, on Thursday. Join us right now to talk about it. Mark Fields, former Ford Motor Company president and CEO and a CNBC contributor. Tell us what kind of sigh of relief may or may not be taking place in Detroit this morning, Mark.

Well, I think, Andrew, the OEMs get a partial win, but at least what was reported, these tariffs are going to alleviate some of the duties on some of the imported parts and also for keeping tariffs on cars that are imported into the U.S., different tariffs stacking on top of each other. So I guess the net of it is it's a pullback on the margins. As I said, the OEMs get a partial win, but it's not a wholesale elimination of the tariff.

And I'm sure, Andrew, there was some kind of "prid quo quo" with the Trump administration in terms of the OEMs either committing to moving some production back to the US

or also alternatively advocating very strongly on their supply base to move some of the parts manufacturing, particularly for those less labor-intensive parts to come back to the U.S. So a bit of a sire relief, but the bottom line is those tariffs are still there. It's going to increase the automakers' costs, and they're going to have to make a decision on how much do they pass on to consumers versus how much do they eat themselves.

Of course, the president has promised to try to bring manufacturing back to the U.S. When you say that the OEMs may have promised to bring things back or to push on suppliers to do the same kind of thing, how quickly do you think that happens and what does that do to the cost base? Well, in some cases, it could be quicker than others. Let's use GM as an example. They produce full-size pickups down in Mexico and they have a plant, I believe, in Indiana, and they've said they're going to pull in about 100,000 units per

of the 400,000 units they make down there to Indiana. So that can happen relatively quickly. But in other cases, when you're looking at products that are made outside the U.S., and let's say you have some capacity, open capacity here in the U.S., it's going to take at least 18 to 24 months at least to refacilitize those plants to allow that particular product to come back into the market, particularly if it's on what they call a different platform.

And then secondly, if you're looking to build a plant, let's use an example. Hyundai Kia imports about 65% of their vehicles from outside the U.S. And with this 25% tariff from vehicles coming from Korea, they'll build a plant and they're just –

bringing online, for example, a plant that they started back in 2019, 2020. So you're looking five years there, but it's going to be a combination of short timelines, but also some medium to long timelines. And then there's two related questions. What kind of jobs does that mean? Do you think that we're going to be seeing in the U.S. are most of those factories humans? Are those robots? What does that actually look like? And then what does it do to the cost base?

Yeah, well, first off on the cost base, the cost base is going to go up, right? Because, you know, when you're using, you know, labor costs that are much less than other parts of the world, you know, that's going to increase your cost base. But in terms of the labor, this is what's most interesting, Andrew, and it's a great question. You know, a lot of times in the automakers, we used to look at the labor content.

And we used to say, how much of that could we automate? And we'd look at the cost of what it would, the capital expender cost to actually automate and buy the machinery versus just making the production overseas in lower labor cost areas. So I think what the automakers are doing right now, first off,

they're deciphering you know what do these changes mean and you know they'll come out a little later today so they have to understand that the reality then they're putting these you know probably big analytic groups in their purchasing areas and deciding looking at their their parts uh footprint and their suppliers and saying what parts are best for automating so that if we have to bring this these kind of parts back we can spend the capital expenditures

automate, reduce the amount of labor. And that's a more compelling business case than it was, let's just say last year.

So it doesn't lead to more jobs? That's the question. Yeah. Well, incrementally, yes, it will lead to more jobs, but it's not going to be a one for one. I think the automakers are going to look very closely on moving very fast to automate as much of the processes as possible. But the bottom line is, yes, it will add jobs back here in the U.S. It will add investment because the automakers are going to be investing in capital equipment. But it's not going to be a one for one process.

trade-off between what's, you know, employment overseas versus employment here in the U.S. Real quick, we got General Motors, Ford, Stellantis on the screen. We probably should have Tesla on that screen as well. Who do you think is the winner of this little situation right now? Is there a winner and a loser? Well,

Well, nobody's a winner in this, Andrew, for the very fact, as we talked about earlier, the costs for the automakers are going up and it could be costs for consumers going up. But relatively speaking, particularly if some of these changes that were reported by The Wall Street Journal last night on auto parts come through, I think the biggest winner is Tesla because, you know, they they have all of their production here in the U.S.,

They're getting a lot of parts from overseas, but if these changes take into effect, they'll be a winner. I think Ford also, you know, they are also producing 80 percent or assembling 80 percent of their vehicles here in the U.S.,

I think GM and Stellantis are going to be more challenged. Stellantis imports probably over 50 percent of their vehicles into the U.S. GM about the same number. And importantly, you know, GM and Stellantis produce a number of their full size pickups, which are big profit makers in some cases outside the U.S. So that's going to hurt them more than, let's say, GM or

And finally, I got a sort of techie question for you because there's been a little bit of debate about it. We heard from Google last week. They talked a lot about Waymo and that earnings report. The first time they talked about Waymo, Tesla starting its robo taxi program in two months in Austin. Of course, Elon Musk has also talked about really having a massive robo taxi program where people are going to be effectively using their cars as robo taxis and sort of selling them or leasing them into fleets and things like that.

um how far do you think tesla is in that game versus where waymo is and what does that look like to you long term well when you look at the waymo versus tesla just look at permits and the ability to operate i mean waymo is way ahead of tesla in terms of getting the permits to operate their their their vehicles i mean when i go to san francisco i take waymo's all the time they're they're already in the market there they're in a couple other markets uh tesla still needs to get the permits

from, in this case, in California, from the California authorities. I think secondly, listen, Waymo has proven over the years, they're in five or six different cities now. Tesla has talked a lot about this. But again, they're using a different technology. They're using cameras versus LiDAR, which is Waymo is using. And so I think technologically speaking, it's still a big question mark.

how these Tesla vehicles are actually going to perform in some of these cities with a different technology, albeit they've mapped a lot of those cities because they have a lot of cars out there. So I think that's the big question. When do you think we'll know whether Teslas without LiDAR, whether Tesla cars can fully do it? I mean, do you think that this Austin experiment will prove the point or not? And you'll know after a month or two?

Yeah, I think you're going to know relatively soon because in each of those states, you're going to have to report incidents. And, you know, if you have Tesla that's launching in June and let's say Austin, you're going to know in a couple of months, are there incidents rates higher than Waymo? So I think you're going to know pretty quickly how they perform. OK, Mark, I want to thank you for joining us, as always, especially on this newsy morning.

DuPont announcing the name of the planned spinoff of its electronics business. Okay, I want you guys to look at this impromptu so you see how it's spelled. There it is. Can I buy a U? N-I-T-Y. Apparently it's pronounced Quinity. It says that the name is inspired by Q, which is the symbol for the electrical charge, and Unity. It says the name reflects...

Roll up, because I have no idea what it reflects. - Quintity? - The collaborative way that it works with customers. - Quintity. - Cunity. - Cunity. - Cunity. - God, no. - Just the letter Cunity. - No, no. - This is a very tricky one. - Don't do it. It's not too late.

I guess Unity's already taken. I looked that one up. Unity is taken by a company. Oh, Cunity? Unity. There used to be a computer company called Unity. And there's a 3D creation platform and software company that's called Unity. Well, Unisys. And then I thought there was another one called Unity. Because Infinity's taken, so it went with Cunity. How much did that cost? That's going to be really tough to pronounce. If this was us...

Because we have, we're a spin co right now. If they came up with CUNY, I'm leaving. I'll go. They're like, promise?

And that is SquawkPod for today. Thanks for listening. SquawkBox is hosted by Joe Kernan, Becky Quick, and Andrew Ross Sorkin. You can tune in weekday mornings on CNBC at 6 Eastern. Get the smartest takes and analysis and interviews from our TV show right into your ears when you follow SquawkPod wherever you like to listen to podcasts. We'll meet you right back here tomorrow. All right, clear. Thanks, guys.

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