Alex Berenson
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In two thousand, two, you may remember, all the smart people in washington assure us, in fact, commanded us to believe that museum processed weapons of mass destruction can buy maybe nuclear. And the next year, in the basis of those claims, we invaded the rock. But IT turns out those clams were false, so that I did not possess those stockpiles.

But here's the interesting thing. The people who told us that, who commanded us to believe them never apologized. There was no condition.

There was certain no punishment. And because there wasn't, those people continue to ascend the higher key within washington. They not run the federal government. And as a result of that, the same unwise people have let us down the same unwise pads again and again in the twenty years sense.

So that as a work, as a management strategy, letting people get away with massive screwups and then promoting them, you would hate to see something like that happened after covet. You would hate to see the people responsible for the lockdowns and the vaccine strategy dividing the nation on the basis of medical things. You hate to see those people go unpunished, indeed, be rewarded.

And so in an effort to prevent that from happening, we're going to speak today to someone who called IT, right, and was not rewarded for IT, in fact, was revived for IT, but hasn't stopped. His name is our experience and joins in sunset. Now, all experiences.

great to see.

to see that I think the guilty should be punished, not merciless, but fairly, in the way that you would bank a child, and that the virtue should be rewarded. And this topic, you were the virtues. So I just want to frame this conversation or on a conversation that we had in january of twenty, twenty two. And that conversation was described by the washington post, is the most dishonest and dangerous segment ever to air on our show. Here's what I looked like.

I have not said this to you before because i'm pretty careful and i'm pretty careful with the data. But these vaccines, these mra vaccines, the mra cover vaccines, need to be withdrawn from the market. now.

No one should get them. No one should get boosted. No one should get double boosted. They are a dangerous and and effective product at this point against omicron. Despite that they make your body make that you then produce any bodies to is not the omicron Spike. And earlier today, tony found you said we're not going to give people, Monica, anybody products because the first generation products because they don't work against on Spike. The same logic applies these M R N A vaccines and giving people boosters even if in the very short term in knocks down infection rates, there's a boomerang effect and that's what they're seeing in all these countries.

just honest and dangerous. That was the washington post assessment of that climate there. Given that has been almost two years since you said that, how would you assess .

the accuracy that statement um IT was quite accurate IT turns out that the overall patient a bit worse than I thought because even when you give people uh you know what are caught and code uh targeted M R N A vaccines that are still be targeted to the new variants, which is the strategy we fall now bill is not really work very well in terms of making your body produce antibodies to new variants either.

So there's really no mra product that you can give at this point that is gonna useful probably at all, certainly for more than a couple of months. M and also come with side effects that look worse than they did at that time when I said that to you in january twenty twenty two. And there is something that we didn't know about at all um which is really the long the biggest auto my long term risk with the mrs, which is that they appear to make your body produce a kind of anti body that I Normally only produces in response to algan like like b vum.

There's a specific sub class it's called the I G G four antibody that people who've been repeatedly given M R N A IT looks like three shots is are where the where the where the switch comes on um if they're then infected, a number of these people will produce uh this I G G for in volume. And Frankly, I would say even immunologist and biology have no idea what that means long term. Now I don't want to overstate the risks here because we don't know what they are.

And omicron is very mild in general for most people. Most people shake IT off you know, after a few days, certainly a couple weeks, even if they're not particularly healthy. But this is a real risk.

Has there ever been a an effective and safe mra product the year where no.

no, I know these these progress were nowhere near uh, reaching the market before covered uh, they were rushed onto the market supposedly is the answer to cove IT in you know in december of twenty twenty on the basis of large, let's acknowledge at very large clinical trials. But clinical problem that had only lasted a few weeks only generated a few weeks of safety data after the second dose. Um they appeared to work in early twenty twenty one.

They certainly do cause the body to make a lot of Spike protein and that's a lot of antibody to the Spike protein. And in the short time you get a decrease and infections, um to me the real I also say mistake because I don't want to you I don't want to say input te uh anything more than that. But let's say the real mistake was made in the summer of twenty twenty one when IT was very clear that the vaccines were not working as promised and infections were starting to go up.

And we saw this and you know you we talked about this a lot in the twenty and twenty one um we saw this in israel in the summer of twenty and twenty one before anywhere else because israel had vaccinated more of its population more quickly than anybody else with the fir M R A vaccine. And so what happened was instead of everybody pausing and saying, you know, let's take a breath here and let's see what we might need to do next, should we should we try a different type of vaccine? Um do we need to do we need to move away from vaccines because this is a respiratory virus that mutates quickly.

And maybe that's not the maybe maybe an international asal vacation. Maybe there's something we can do. The bite administration um in most of us, the world, but really LED by the bike administration said two things. We're going to give people a third shot, a booster which had not been which which had been tested on, I believe, at that time a couple of thousand people worldwide um and there was no not even meanie term safety daily about the booster. And that said, two of the senior scientists at the fda who regulate vaccines so much that they have their tirely within a few days after they buy the ministration um you know said we're going to do this booster and made August and the second thing which to me he is even more incomprehensible and wrong was they said we're going to have minds. We're going to a force essentially all working in americans that we can reach them to be vaccinated.

S S R. Didn't s IT was clear.

IT didn't work, as ever said, that are best you're going to get a few months of protection.

So that's the point at which what i'm willing to believe was a mistake looks much more like a crime.

IT was an aggressive policy decision and and one of the names that i've included is that one reason the administration may have done this is because uncle joe, as I like to call him, looks so terrible in the aftermath of the botched withdraw from afghanistan. So if we that's the other thing that's happening in the summer twenty, twenty one, we leave.

And you know, a month later, the taliban are in and the afghans hang off of airplane s and the united looks as bad as IT has since probably Jimmy Carter and you know, nineteen eighties in one thousand nine hundred eighty. yes. Okay, so so, so job.

I needs to prove he's doing something. Now the reason that that I reach this inclusion is, let's take the bad ministrations theory about the vaccine at face value, which is not enough. Americans are being vaccinated um and that's why we're having this delta Spike and the unvaccinated may be a danger to the vaccinated, which by the way, is not a great argument for vaccines of it's true.

But so so you're the by administration, you think you've got to get americans vaccinated. Okay, who dies from covet target very old people and you know people who are really sick if they're Younger OK the vaccine Mandate or workplace Mandates, they only covered americans who are healthy enough to be in the workforce. Almost definitely ally. Those people are very, very low risk from covet the people making this policy or not stupid. They knew that they they had to know that even if the vaccines work as advertise, which they knew they didn't work as advertised, you weren't going to be able to reach whatever tiny rump of unvaccinated elderly people .

there were with these, Mandy.

And there were few, very few. And that's one of the great lives of that. There were a lot of unvaccinated elderly people. Red sites is not true. The differences til isn't people mostly under sixty five.

So so even if the vaccines had work as advertised, and even if the man is had been on constitutional and wrong, they wouldn't have reached the people. If you'd wanted to save people using the bad administration theory, this you should have been. If you want a social security check, you need to be vaccinated. That's what we've gotten whatever you know, few unvaccinated elderly people there were. And so when you make a decisions that that bad, even taking your incorrect policy assumptions in to account, there's gotta another reason.

Do we know before we get to what that other reason might be? Um who made that decision? Who drove that decision?

We don't. We don't we know that for most of early twenty twenty one the administration was saying no mind is no vaccine passports you know there is a discussion of of private vaccine passports, of state .

vaccine sport. They attack anyone. They might that to including me, remember that very, that's correct.

Meanwhile, the states were sort of pushing them. There was this idea, the federal government gonna, hands up. I was certainly not going to require, I mean, biden said that.

And at some point in in july twenty, twenty one, this started to be discussed in a matter of weeks without a congressional hearing, without uh, you know a policy round table that anything that went from this is not something we're going to do. Don't we're just going to know we're going to give people a shot and a beer. There are ridiculous theory of ridiculous incentive programs, which to me, we're completely wrong too because you you essentially trying to bribe people into taking a pharmaceutical product.

But but those are Better than Mandates. IT went from we're never going to do this to we're doing IT. We're doing IT to that mean by and say punch. But he did say i'm frustrated with the unvaccinated.

IT was a pandemic of the vacation. IT was the americans for a chinese virus.

Yes, he did that too. So so he um so so in this period of weeks, this enormously important consequential policy decision um both from a health point of you inferences from a constitutional, civil and liberties point of view got got pushed through with no public discussion at all. Buying just comes out on september knife and says I am going to oppose workplaces metics you think this .

was an effort to divert attention away from a foreign icy failure? Ah I think .

that's part of the reason why I think they wanted to show him doing something something sitting and an mpt table in the situation room looking .

at screen would be Better to do. Construction of useful licence firming is that hard? no.

But like here's a massive screwed up in southwest asia. We're going to have a massive screw up here. You don't think about IT.

IT was also very popular, not just with the democratic base, with the media, the people member. For the six months there are being the unvaccinated or stupid, the unvaccinated. Then IT became the .

unvaccinated, get you sick. So there was dirty.

kill to die. There were ethics seriously arguing whether unvaccinated ted people deserve to be so pushed to the back of the trio line .

if the hospital is overflow of court denied also true .

because .

they weren't factions.

So this was a popular decision. Dude never you know he got popular yes.

Um so in should not I mean, it's almost hard to hear all this. Maybe that's one of reasons most people are talking meter because it's so painful to hear IT. But has there been any concerted effort by big media organizations to figure out what exactly happened and talk with this honestly?

No, I can't. I'm laughing because, you know, for two years i've been saying to people, look, you know, you don't know, you don't want to be smear the way I was smear. Fine, you don't want to you don't even want to write about vaccine advocacy.

Fine, here's a story you can write. Literally billions of vaccine doses, and any vaccine doses were paid for and never used. IT was a billion billions.

By my best guess, about five billion doses were made by five or maDonna. About three billion were used. And all those other doses were paid for. Or you or will be paid for when there there may be a few more still to be delivered in the next couple years to the eu. So that's two billion doses, probably about forty billion dollars, just literally pour down the drain.

Now that's that's an estimate, but it's an estimates are based on the publicly available data because what happened was in so rever, the initial course is two doses um in April of twenty twenty one the jane j vaccine um which is a different it's a different delivery system ah it's not mra ah, it's a different biotechnology comes under pressure or people that you know you can cause this very unusual a uh but terrible side effect that you where you get blow clots in your brain and you know that no one wants blow glows in your brain. So so jane j which was gonna, which was used such as the an easier vaccine to administer only one dose, a didn't need to be refrigerated the same way. You know, there was this idea for, lets say, for homeless people, for people who maybe you couldn't, you're going to have a hard time convincing to take a second dose.

Or for poor countries where the figuration was an issue, J J was going to be a good alternative. J J sort of came off the table after April twenty, twenty one, and there was a huge push. We're going to get everybody in the world two mra doses and then the booster.

We're going to get everybody in the world three r doses, even, even after, became obvious to me that this wasn't working. They were the fights in the fall of twenty twenty one. Or should the U. S.

Get a booster before, you know, some african country gets its first dose, right? This is such a great technology. You know, who's gone to get these these supplies? So the companies wrapped up and they made IT on and they sold IT. They basically said the governments that wanted IT, if you wanted, you've got ta pay for IT before we make IT. Um you know not like you to cut the whole check, but you have to agree contractually .

the downpayment .

you exactly you you want IT, you agree that when it's done we deliver, you take IT. And so and so that's what the governments agree to, not just the U. S.

This, this was only the E. U, and then there was a thing of coax where, uh, where the companies are sold vaccine you to poor countries that the U. S.

Paid for in some ways, or or or other organza paid for. Okay, the point is after late twenty twenty one, after became clear that the boosters had stopped working, demand basically fell off a Cliff. People said, you know, for me, for me twice. Shame on you.

But where? But i'm not taking a second booster. And ever since the spring of twenty, twenty two, there's been a basically you know outside of the like the deep blue states, even in europe, there's very little demand, pediatric demand solo. So the point is these companies theyd ramped up. They made IT and they placed we have contract with you, you're gonna pass and the government's paid.

Why did the government I M sorry, your process doesn't work.

Well, that's not that was one of the contract dots.

There was no. So you're saying that all of this proceeded for a full year in the face of overwhelming evidence that IT didn't work and that had harm people because IT was a political diversion that may be try no of knowing. I do, however, have sympathy for the people who say, wait a second, there's something else going on. I mean and I know it's they're easy to mock and but .

like you .

a lot to take a attention from afghani. No.

I mean, I wouldn't say I wouldn't say the evidence the evidence that the vaccines don't work has been around since, you know depending on know how you want to argue that into the summer or fall of twenty twenty one, the evidence that they're dangerous, you know, it's slower to develop and the risk are more subbed than the people.

It's guide of a heart attack in january of twenty twenty one and was told and his family was top of the doctors. That's vaccine death right there. I know two other people who I am really close to who had our tacks after taking in. And that is my little world, which is very small. So like, so what?

Definitely out. So what people would says people have heart attack.

yeah, but not. I mean, i've lived here for fifty four years. I've never you had three people and no other taxes like a short period days after take a the vaccine .

that the reason that I pushed back on this is if the danger was more obvious, IT would be easier to make the case that i'm making that this technology is, you know, is not safe or effective, right? Like I don't see this is where I guess i'm a little different. Then maybe then you are I don't believe that this entire regulating apparatus would ignore screaming danger science OK. I we and I don't think doctors would I know I think that the problem.

that the danger that seems like there are screaming dangerous. I mean, maybe I just totally imagining, you know, not an epidemiology, but I mean, that's that's a lot for the smog people I know. And moreover, IT does seem like there is has been a Spike in unexplained death.

I mean so so let me give you account there a there is a military um you know the military obviously was very highly accent ated and the military reports on its health care statistics and by year like you know pretty pretty grand at a pretty granular level and IT and i've looked at those okay because once I found I was like, well, there is a signal it's gonna pop out here yes, and he doesn't pop out.

Okay, but i'm not saying you the vaccines kill people that they don't have mune, that they don't cause all omne problems, in some people that they don't cause strokes, in some people that they mean now now evidence they seizure in some little kids, which in which which I wrote that story about three weeks ago in the on my on on reporter truth on on my website, you know, my subject and two, about a week later, the new or times of the story, and they quoted people saying, quoted doctors saying, oh, well, you know, the vaccines are gona cause fevers in some kids so we would expect this. You would expect this. You didn't tell any parents this until the F.

D. A published a paper where everyone, where they had to admit IT. So this is, I mean, I guess i'm arguing in my.

yeah, you are pretty stacie ly.

but but there are signals, there are things .

they turned out, they like, why would IT fault you to look at the data? Why would I fall to me to, like, make guesses about where is the national, federally LED effort to get to the bottom of the effects of these vacuum population? How can I do not be?

I'm just reporter.

No, i'm serious. Like, where's the cdc?

This is promoting this. They're still promoting them for children, for a virus that can touch healthy children that all kids basically had had by now. When I say can touch, i'm almost going to say that would know, you know you know, again, one in a million, right?

There's a light slight change that but IT kate touch healthy children. Every kid has had IT. And we know now these vaccines can cause or there's a strong signal that they can cause seizure.

What are they doing all over the rest of the world? They're not doing this. okay.

So yeah, I don't know what we're doing. okay? I don't I think. I tend to believe policy gets that people are in love with that. They just won't admit they've made me.

So there no ethical people at city like known. I think what you're describing and just using your descriptions, which are highly informs, once you do this for living, you're describing like something a horrifying and evil. And like why isn't just the fact that you stated I I D say that evil? So where the cdc employees are saying, like i'm not participating in this.

so I don't know. I guess what they're saying is nobody, no kids are getting the shots anyway, so doesn't matter. So we're just going to here's here's what here's what they say publicly, which is, yes, we know there's a risk differential here. We know that this is much you know more interest to older people cove IT.

I mean, but if we offer differential recommendations, that will confuse people because you know this, they do think they do think everyone is stupid um so so we if we offer differential recommendations, IT will make the old people less likely to take if we tell a two year old, the mother of two year old, not to have her kid get IT, then IT makes an eighty old less likely to take. And we want the year old to take IT. That's basically what the excuse they use. I IT doesn't like a very good no.

IT doesn't. IT doesn't. And you do feel like this against something else going on here. What is this doing to the population's attitudes about vaccines more broadly?

Interestingly, it's not changing as much as people on either side would say because americans, I think, generally feel they've had good experience with vaccine. P, M, R, A. Now course is there is a group of americans who, you know, children developed autism and they blame that on the vaccines.

I don't see strong evidence there, but I know that's a very controversial topic. I I will say I don't see strong evidence, but in general, americans, again, despite what what both the you know the anti I vx community and the sort of vaccine fanatic community says have been generally over the years, pretty going to listen to the cdc s recommendations. Now there's some evidence that the mrs uh, what's happened with them has made overall accent ation a little bit less common. But what is really made is mn a vaccinations a lot less common. So people, one of my corporations, that people are not stupid, and people differentiate between these two new vaccines that came out from Fisher and maDonna based on months of testing and we're promised to fix cover IT and didn't and everything else but .

people may not be do with doctors, obviously are and unethical, because I know for my yi would never go to a doctor who pushed R N. vacations. Would say about you if you're a doctor, is your job to know what these things do you? No idea.

Push them. So how many people are deciding? Again, speak for myself. I'm i'm not going to any doctor who did that. I've contempt those people.

I don't want to be around them and told changed my view of medicine. Are a lot of people reaching that conclusion. And I just like an insane person.

I think there's been a it's hard for me to I haven't seen data on this. I will say this. And yeah, my wife is a physician, I think, and g never like. But I think that I think that doctors right now, we're not pushing this at all.

But why is no one apologized? That's what I don't understand.

Report for anything, tucker.

but nothing gets. But this is science, and science is based on truth, period. That's what is a prosued truth.

And if you get something wrong, we had to immediately the legal losses. Not science, but they are not an admitting and immediately leader for it's not science. Therefore, it's like some weird witchcraft thing that I don't want a thing to do with fair.

So what these people would say is, in twenty twenty one, the accent es did some good. Since then, we don't know so much, but they all point to charge. This is one part is the bin of my existence that appears to show that vaccinated people you know die from cover, even now at much lower rates than on.

The problem with that is the two groups are not comparable. Okay, this is. And and I don't want to spend fifteen minutes boring you, your audience with the science behind this, but the two groups are not comparable. The reason we do clinical trials, a clinical trial is an artificial experiment, but IT generates the only data you can truly trust. Okay, you take two group, you take a group of people, you split in half, you have a computer, make sure that the two groups are completely equal as closely bluto.

You know, if you're in one, then you know then someone who is just like you in terms of smoking status and age and gender, and you know the history of parties, whatever goes in the other group, okay, you split, you take a big group, you split them up. You give, you give one group the vaccine or the drug. You give the other group a placebo, a super pill or a sAiling shot.

You follow them. Nobody knows who got what. And at the end you can say, OK, this benefit came from the, you know, vaccine or this injury, you know the safety problem came from the vaccine.

You need that data. The truth is we never really got that data at the mrs, because we blew up the clinical trials much too soon. And so we're all arguing on the basis of incomplete information.

And the people and and the people who understand this are mostly on the pro vaccine inside. They mostly either indirectly or directly get money from Fisher or the federal government or people with a giant stake in vaccines. And and so I am arguing a lonely battle here you certainly are.

but where? okay. So leave the and I should just remind our viewers, who maybe haven't follow your career in the detail that I have, that you waited a long time before even addressing questions about vaccines. I mean, you originally were just pointing out the disparities between what they were claiming back over to what the data was showing. Yes.

I didn't think you wanted .

to get into the vaccine stuff, but you can't have no choice. yes. right? So you were not like some entire extra grown back Bobby. Thirty years no at all. So um but one common sense question that I was ever adequately answered, in my view, is why weren't physicians in the public health community encouraging people to be healthier, especially when IT became obvious like the first week that fat people aren't a greater risk of dying. What could possibly account for their closing gyms, not at promoting obesity in the middle of copy pandemic?

What is that? So the endemic, I came in occasion for social scientists to try a lot of public health measures that they wanted to try. And you know, one of those was sort like what signals are there that this is a serious unless I mean, that was I think masking was a huge part of that that pushing for asking um we don't want to stigmatize so so although it's okay to sigmar ze .

people should not be vaccinated cigarettes .

I if we don't want to stigmatize, uh, obese people, people who you know who don't take good care of themselves. So what lie about where the result we're going to pretend that some twenty five year old is at real risk. coffee.

And I think the other the other argument that they would make and did make at the time was we think there's a real risk of hospital overrun. So if this spreads too quickly, remember, wait two weeks flat in the curve. One of the things that I think wasn't why they understood was the people promoting that weren't saying we're not all gonna covered because at the time, they didn't really have quickly they could rush a vaccine to market course.

We will get cover anyway because I actually didn't work. But the idea was we're gonna get covered over time. So you know, when people the hospitals won't be overrun.

And like that was of the number one concern back in march twenty, twenty was hospital over. So to do that, you to convince everyone to stay home in their view, you'd to lock down everyone. And so that mature to lie about who is at risk. That was the original thing, yes, right? The original scene of COVID was that the raining vaccines was pretending that they had been properly tested.

Okay, I get all that. But IT went beyond that mean, they actively prevented people from getting in Better physical shape, cardy, vascular health, and then all the women's magazines, which are still influential, decide to put fat women on the cover and say, this is your the new body ideal.

And the soap companies, the makeup companies, this was clearly and orchestrated attempt to make people think that was okay to be fat in the middle of a pandemic was killing fat people. So that's the point where I am, like, actually our tranquil people. Because like what? No, i'm sharing, right? What could if I if I encourage my children to smoke science rett, maybe i'm trying to hurt them.

or maybe you trying to sell cigarettes. Maybe if sixty person, the country's fat, and your dog.

you want to sell soap, maybe. But like, you'd never try that before. There never .

been a time try to.

of course. But being fat, you know, no woman wants to be fat. And all the women's magazines spent decades telling women, you know, you shouldn't be fat.

That's where they don't want to be fat. And then during cover, it's like, you know, be fat. I think exact time we're being fact to kill you, I think that I see now is like, well.

I think the trend was happening before. I do like the D E, I stuff on obesity, which I agree like obesity is this is terrible for people in general, mean.

even if he doesn't personally, i'm not judging and physically .

terrible .

for public health authorities to be promoting IT and stopping people from getting .

on the tread mill. I don't know. I don't closing people from god. Yes, they were good closing gyms.

but keeping lictors open, but keeping licensor and weed dispense stories so that's the point where it's like, look, i'm not some cookie internet conspiracy guy, but how many signs do I need that you're trying to kill me before I say you're trying to kill me.

I think people make bad decision.

They're all consistent. It's like they're all pro death. It's like, oh no, what I was made any time working on their apee tics at .

all or they did they came up but when they didn't work at all and .

deserve but came up in all different stuff. And like me immediately, do you do that how you try something, the vacine. And then, you know, I weigh in the gym or in the I twenty times, and he said, I just want people to work out because that might help up creal.

And so I don't know, like I think it's important be more like your dog. Your dog can speak english. He is no idea what you're saying. He just watches you and then he knows your intent. I'm watching them and I can tell their intent, which is to kill me intinded is to make .

you feel good about yourself, even if they cut you.

I don't see those are separate categories. They are.

They are. I don't know.

my O P O O D one feels good, the other doesn't. But they both kill me, right?

I, I, I can I you're not going to get me sad. No, I really, really, really.

really I don't understand what happened during covin, but I at all, and i'm lasting, was gonna cult. The same .

thing was time I do.

But on this like as to motive, that always makes me comfortable to speculate. But of course I do do IT and I regret IT every time I do IT because you can't know one of the person's motive, but you can watch what they do.

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Now I got about what you talk her.

I'm ready. This.

this is one of a kind. These are, these are four of the great villains of .

cover that camera. You tell me what this sense of what I mean.

OK fought and got leave, and slave and bolly .

who tony.

though he also the head of the world's largest, or what was the world's largest in twenty twenty two pharmacy company, andy levet was the senior advisor for covet response under the by administration from in early twenty twenty one god got leave is the former head of the fda who left the fda and three months I believe three months of the day later, which was the earliest he could join the pfizer board where he is a senior uh board member of visor. He also is on cbc all the time um where he always manage to say something good about visors products. Um so these three of these four men, not tony fauci, are defendants in my lawsuit against the bite administration and fissure for their uh on constitutional events to silence me and get me thrown off twitter in twenty twenty one.

So can I just that thank you for I will wear this with pride or without paying .

um but other way I have the sound is one .

of kind IT IT leads to my two question I wanted to ask you since we've had so many interviews of the years. But like two questions one you became very focused on a neural successful novel list your books are in myself ves at home actually um for your time report like you this whole life that had nothing to do with any of this and you just like basic throw all away to go after this story. Why did you do that and what have the effects been?

Um I did because I didn't have any choice because it's like take one step and one step. And I remember once being in right, you vel no no you don't have just if you're a certain type of percent or a certain type of reporter um I was once in iraq in two thousand and four um and like i'm not particularly physically courage in a wars and like and I was like to A A kernel the tenant kernel who who is like, you know tough guy and we serve out there and he said, you know, this is just what you do like you just all the time you're in the mail like you should take a step at a time and then there's kind of no go on back. And I pursue this story and the truth to the best of my ability.

You weren't even a reporter the time you give up.

I always been a reporter. I know I even even the novels would be Better if they were a little bit less reported and a little bit more flights of fancy. That's my one regret as a novels I could never know not that was, I mean, i'm writing about islamic terror. And you know, in various they are spy novels about modern events, but are really great novel, whatever the nominal category, has some magic in IT and that's something hard for me to put in my nose. I'm very fact grounded and so so when and I know i've write about this on unreported truth like we talked to time IT about you know the baby bus, which is something i'm now interested in um because because I look for stories that you know as an individual reporter is not working for the near times I I can do in in a credible, reasonable way you know be hard for me right now to go to israel because I don't have a big organization back in me up if I get shot in the head or right right um so so VISA covet believe or not is very dated, driven and is a story that know I I could follow. I look for stories where I think um I think I can add something to the conversation because because the mainstream media usually for political reasons, doesn't want to report on IT and and I look for story that are important and covered obviously was the most important story.

Do you look for stories that will make you super unpopular with everyone you .

have ever known? Of course, losing, losing three quarters of my friends messing up my marriage was just an added bonus.

But you can't knew that. I don't mean to pick in an open won, but you cannot knew that going in. Because anyone who asked, I can remember the first couple post you wrote on this were greeted with ferocity, ity people, very.

I don't like being told what I can. I can ask that's a spirit by anybody, and certainly not by the by administration or Fisher. okay? And that and that, you know, this lawsuit, you know, we have we have filed an initial suit.

They have filed a motion to dismiss all three of which of the federal defendants, andy slav IT is his own defendant. And then Alberta, who's again the chAmber of vizor and Scott t. Leave, have their own layers.

I guarantee, guarantee you that this is a good day for the law is right. But so they've tried to dismiss IT. We've now file a response to the motions to dismiss, which I think is very strong. Um and by the way, we are now asking for third party discovery, meaning we want twitter to turn over everything uh the pfizer or the White house said about me and elon i'm hoping elon, you will hear this and you will tell your lawyers to do this and not fight the third party sapa um but so if we can get past the motion to dismiss, and I believe we can, we will get the discovery on what the White house and Fisher were saying to each other about me and possibly somewhat more broadly in the summer of twenty twenty one about the vaccines and and that the world needs to know what was really going on, why everything changed, why the public attitudes towards vaccines, sp, things get so much harsher, why there was a push for boosters, why there was a push for minutes. I'm not really exaggerate this loss is maybe the only chance that that we're ever gna have.

Has anyone come up to you in your personal life to say, you know you congratulations, you've vindicated. You took a lot of crap but you turn out to be right.

One person um in in my town um has said to me, you know what you're right about the lock. No one's ever said about the vaccines I did people just want to forget the vaccines, whether most people were vaccine obviously um and they started want to forget what they thought instead to unvaccinated people.

Um yeah there's there's a fashion train ripeness the surface that I did not perceive until that the moment and I was very distressing.

I mean, one thing my wife said to me, I can't member when and he was right, he said there's a large part country spend twenty twenty one that if tony SHE set to them, this will just end if we just burn, burnt at mistake, just learn at the stake so you to do like there were people with pitch for on our doorstep um you know and she's canadian. I think he was he was all of the canadians have terribly well.

The canadians are very easy to control I mean that doesn't take much um but americans, I met what you you're from this country group here and were you surprised?

Yes oh, this is this is what I wanted to say you earlier when we're talking heard instinct okay, we again we are talking about the baby, yes, and how easy IT is and why parents don't chAllenge.

Let's say, as you mentioned, you know the ei stuff in classrooms that might not like for their kids just just go back three thousand years, okay? Ay, when somebody committed a crime, there were no prisons, right? So how did you punish that person? You left them, left them on their own without the protection of the heart.

And mostly those people died, right? We are, we think we're long walls, but we are heard animals. And if you can get, you know sixty, seventy much as eighty or ninety percent of population moving in certain way, IT gets harder and harder to stand up. Um and so um I mean, I think I think that force is overwhelming and IT doesn't and I think the U S. Actually has more people will understand that, but that doesn't .

really have a so given that, what's the next dedication of the I mean, we're moving into flu season?

Yeah so so I don't know what's onna have cover if I can't stays this mild you know something know it'll run through nursing homes. Sometimes it'll hurt some people. Assuming the I G G four thing doesn't become a true problem, there will be, people will be sick.

You know, I personally, I get, you know, I get flag from this from some areas. I think pets, love actually works. I think they will come up with some more antivirals mean again, how do we get out of HIV not of accent? Um we got effectivity tive virus and and you know I think there will be some more anti virus for code.

I I IT should be manageable. The two big issues going forward actually are lesser with COVID and more to do with are they going to try to push mrs. For other respiratory viruses, which they clearly are a maDonna that's maDonna is business and maDonna s stock is down eighty five percent since its peak, which was basically the same day as the bite administrations Mandate, uh, in september twenty twenty one. But they still learn business. They're still a large powerful company and they .

want to sell you. Has anybody ever checked, I mean, as the S. C, C, for example, ever checked the borders from policymakers or their spouses who are aware that, that Mandate was coming?

That's a great question. I don't know that I wondered that it's probably not even visible, but, uh, but it's a great question to ask.

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In fact, american families are paying eleven hundred dollars in hidden White busy cheer. The fees, VISA and master card charge americans are the highest in the world, double canada, and eight times is more than europe. That's why I take an action.

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Do you think that um we ever have blocked towns again? I would have .

to be way worse. I mean, they're literally have to be people dying in the streets. I think I think I think in general, there are a lot of people who are much more suspicious .

of the public health. Em we been .

against as we should be so and the other but but here's another thing you know you say well I want or my position one it's not really true um here's the Violet gy community continues to push gain of function research. They continue to push these uh you know wandering into caves looking for the worst possible virus.

I mean, it's increasingly clear that the ology is toxic and dangerous, at least this part of IT, this emerging infectious diseases part of IT, because you're much more likely to cause a endemic than to prevent one, either by messing with viruses in labs to make them more dangerous, which is really the most insane idea possible, or just going to these caves like we're the bats are not bothering anybody and looking for dangerous viruses. And here's here's the like to me of one of the best pieces of evidence for this. Let's let's pretend that the uh that the chinese lab is not the source of by source.

I don't mean that I was fully created there. I mean, there were probably experimenting with IT and at least, okay, I want to be clear what. But let's pretend that, let's pretend that this didn't somehow escape from a chinese lab.

Let's pretend that people who say that this came out of A A farm in A A wet market will want to actually telling the truth. yeah. Okay, the best thing you can say that is that this effort LED by you, Peter daz ac, and funded by the U.

S. Government, that only though he was aware of, that the chinese were very invested in that was supposed to help prevent the next pandemic, did nothing to prevent the next pandemic, even though the next pandemic happened under their noses. That's the, that's the absolute best case for what happened in twenty twenty.

We funda tony research that did nothing to help us predict what the next problem would be, or stop IT when IT happened. So what on earth are we doing? It's just like the vaccines at a certain in, at this point, all downside. No, outside, the rational person stops gambling in that position, yes, but go to a casino talker. There are a lot of irrational people.

But if you are promoting that, and if you are at any point along the chain of covet policy that I think in arguably got a lot of people killed and rector economy, industry of generation of children who are now we litter IT IT set IT set to IT set IT. Has anyone ever .

been punished for that? No, no, no absolutely um .

because anyone not been rewarded for IT, they all seems like what can you tell us what these four guys .

are doing right now? Well, tony is no given talks. I I believe at six figures of pop I still .

a service protection production.

My neighbor and D.

C, D took a picture of him in our dog park in northwest washington. Follow by secret service detail.

Yes, he does know he still. He does cut .

service protection.

I have a have a couple dogs that work yes, perfect so that .

he works in George town.

Ah sky is still he has protection. Fisa pays a couple hundred and year for his because he is so much at risk um that security certainly .

does um you .

can find the details about IT in the visor, a proxy statement. Um uh he he's on all the boards he's on seen bc is never apologize for slender ing me or anything else. Uh he's doing just fine. Slavered uh runs a healthcare focused venture fund, uh that funds things like getting uh trans medicines to people, to Young teenagers and states, uh, where they aren't going to necessary need be seen by a doctor. True story. That's one of the that's one of the and I maybe exactly slightly, but that is the point of one of his venture capital investments uh and Albert la remains the chairman and CEO of vizor incorporated um you know and gets about thirty five million thousand years .

so other more fat, happy and continuing this present .

evil yes by the way, these two gentlemen god got leave in our bolt their lawyers accused me of being in IT for the money .

so from substance.

from my subject yes.

do you make more or less than thirty five million years .

on your substance? It's close by the west um so yeah so oh by the way one just go back to you know the five billion doses to two billion pour down the drain. The companies are paid for no reporter actually a few reporters in germany.

They were whatever variety is there are little more interested in like the federal perse have noted that you know hundreds of millions of doses in europe were wasted. But i've never seen a story like that in the united states. And ironically, you know, you can find tons of stories about how africa was gonna.

The next terrible wave, even is twenty twenty one, when IT everybody that, you know, the african demographic is so much Younger that there are basically zero is from covet. Um you can still find all these stars about how we have to get vaccines to africa. We have to the the number of uh M R N A vaccines or cover vaccine in general taken in africa is near zero, certainly outside of south africa. And as my joke is not really joke is the first time in history when rich White people have demanded to be the beginning pigs um for for experimental medicine.

national suicide. And speaking of last question, but you will looted to the second ago your new interest. One of your new interest is in the population and its decline because people are not having kids. What what's the overview?

So I mean, obviously, this has been going on for a while. We've been below replacement birthrates in the us, very little closer in the us in each stage. Western europe. But you know brother in general are turning down well why do you know muslim countries too? They're turn ning down um but cover IT seems to accelerate in this process.

And I first got interested in because my question was, you know where the code vaccines are, the mr accelerating this fertility crisis because we know they can have an impact on menstrual cycles and they seem to have at least the short term impact on I know it's production, but a production of healthy spur. Um my conclusion right now is you can't really find an M R A effect because this is happening in china too where um where uh you know what you didn't use the mra. So but all over the world and certainly in the U S.

In and in your is most visible in europe and in east asia, births have suddenly gone off a Cliff. I mean, the south korean birthrate now is is barely one third of replacement level. And there doesn't seem to be a bottom to this.

And I mean, it's really stunning and that it's happening across every culture or you know every religion, every ethnicity. The only thing of the country have common on attitudes. Women are different in these countries. The only thing that these countries have in common is .

that they're wealthy. So you're saying, and I know I think that is probably true, the birth rate in south korea is lower than the birthday in north korea.

That's a great question, but probably true. I I looked like, yes.

I wonder if there is a clear indicator of the health of society to his birthday.

Mean, it's certainly it's certainly hard to square that with a healthy society or you know not a lot of anxiety among Young people and and the idea that this is this have any wealthy societies. But he doesn't seem to be driven by economics because you there are still pockets of high for televisor thx jews and there is other know religious sex and those people are very rarely wealthy so so you know it's it's not a problem of lack .

of IT caused by a bus.

But I I mean the rich .

you aren't if you were kids.

you have although at the very time certain places like right you where there is a little bit luxury good at the very, very top but but not broadly. So you know, this is something i'm just beginning to explore. I know you want me to make some grounds really I find IT fascinating, obviously fascinating to readers um because I wonder .

what's more important than reproduced right?

Well, you know I mean, my joke is in the future of humanity doesn't take now. Obviously, we're not going to get to zero anytime soon. But but it's pretty striking and somebody says to me, yes, they are. Well, you know, it's about the art of caring capacity, and that's just nonsense. I mean, we can support far more than eight billion .

people with I wonder that you hear a lot of chatter about you know, a depopulation strategy. I don't know it's a strategy. I doubt that was him, or doubt IT. No double is certain thing, but clearly is a depopulation instinct.

Yeah, that's what's so right.

Clearly clear the effects. I if you're trying, if you care about your country, you d want people to have kids, right? Do you want your cheat? You want grandchildren, of course, because you love your children, right? So if you love your population, want our kids.

I mean, agree, IT seems like a very basic idea that a healthy society continue, at least retains its population. And you know, the cultures in these days are already been in shrink, amazingly tawana shrinking. I mean, it's and as elon said, this was a few months ago.

He said, know the day you can make IT very complicated demographically, but it's actually very simple. Multiply the level burst right now by eighty five, and that's what the population will be in eighty five years, assuming the trend doesn't continue. So for a county like taiwan, they have one hundred and thirty thousand years. This year they have twenty three million people, eighty five times one hundred and thirty thousand, about ten million. So so so that when I say they're not close replacement， I mean, they're not close .

to replacement going well IT.

I mean, if that continued at that level, you would be you know you'd be down ninety percent in one hundred years. I mean that it's pretty Sunny. I I look these things can reverse.

You look at, you know popular of the baby boom, know post war war two, there were tremendous growth and population in the U. S. In japan and other counters. So so these things can reverse, but there's no sign it's .

even stopping for one final thing. So the the conventional view has always been, well, this is a result of birth control come much more sophisticated and widespread in the past few years. But if you look at the rate which people are like having sex, they're not having sex.

They're not having sex, Young man not having sex.

So I think who saw that coming, but that's probably but the darkest thing I can think of.

What is that right? That's part of this. I mean, you know and it's funny, right? Because for a couple years in the in the house there was oh, the internet is you know it's going to like there's going tinder they are gondo screwing all the time, all the youth, and turned out that's exactly the opposite, didn't happen at all.

And in which is worse, the latter is worse. Not is worse. I think we worse, way worse. yes.

Well, I just wanted first, well, think with with the lovely switch which I will wear this afternoon and and also to congratulate you are not being indicated.

even if no one .

else noted I D I reported truth.

my friend.

dishonest and .

dangerous sports. Thank you very much. Thank you.