E33: Apple’s hypocrisy, America’s math failure, crypto’s regulatory correction, Clubhouse’s future, UFOs & more
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Free fiber. What's up? IT seems like give a piece of shit on the side of your mouth.

Or is that a birth mark? Oh, no. It's birtha catching.

Sorry.

did you record that?

Yes.

look at this guy. He takes a shirt off for one fuck in cells. I, and now everybody whose fat and pile on the show, the other three of us is gonna be ridiculed.

I'm having stake tonight as T, A, K.

tonight. I am lifting twice a week. Now, come on, sex. Come get some. That's fucking go. three.

two.

Rain man, give.

The resources to .

the fans and.

Hey, everybody, everybody, welcome to another episode of the all in podcast with me again, the dictator himself to off Polly, hopeless, a rain man. David, sex, definitely with us. Definitely a great driver is dad let some drive in the driveway. And of course, everybody's favorite, the queen of kin wah, the science conductor himself.

David, queen.

queen, the queen. And a lot of activity online. It's been a little bit of chaos since we all got together here. I guess we should talk about this apple story with, uh, antonio Garcia Martinez. You may have heard that he was hired by apple to, I guess, run their ad efforts. And I have a little bit of information on kind of what he was going to do there in terms of ads, which is really interesting.

Um but tell us, tell us, tell us.

tell us, okay well, anyway, you know how were basically .

and people don't know .

who I Martinez was a facebook developer he is some really smart guy, uses a lot of big words and wrote a book called k monkeys which is a great book where he takes um a very jack Carola what approve and he wrote this book about his time at facebook. The problem is he said some things in the book that would be five years later problematic at the time.

They were actually a considered problematic by some folks and um in the full quote maybe uh less problematic but he was essentially ousted because of the following problem of quote um the quote is most women in the bay area are soft and weak, costed and naive despite their claims of worldly ss and generally full of shit they have they're regarding entitlement feminism and seriously ly want their independence but the reality is come the epidemic, plague or foreign invasion they become precisely sort of uses baggage you trade for a box shock on shells or a Jerry can of diesel um and they short that quote to be that most women are soft and weak and uh for that so in in context in this book he was contrasting the barry women he dated with the mother's kids who he describes as strong and tall and tough and amazing um but still the quotes a little narrow and the quote out you know when it's out of context becomes particularly nearly and of course um this LED to uh a petition at apple which then LED to him being fired uh which now is gonna ad to him probably getting a ten uh million dollar settlement uh of course there is a lot of hypocrisy being brought up here because apple has allegedly been using or apple supply chain has slave labor or in IT from the wagers and other ethnic minorities um and obviously apple gave doctor tray billions of dollars uh for beats by dry and he has a even more massaging tic um series of lyrics and was also accused of physically assaulting um I believe his wife and other people he dated who doctor doctor dray uh so anyway. Um what do you think. Okay, there you go. Next story.

No, i'm happy to jump into this. I think in James, I think you're you focus a little bit too much and I saw you you're pob with zoo on this um a lot of good takes, but I think you're a little to focus on what agm as I think easier to come by initials what he did as supposed to what the employees at apple did. And um there is at least four things that apple did or five things that apple did wrong.

I mean, number one, I think there was a really good reason not to hire this guy, which is that he wrote a best selling tell book about the last big tech company he worked at. So if you're a big tech company, why in the world would you hire him? So that was stupid decision number one, but they did decide to hire him. Once they hire him, they ve got a dream, like any other employee give a chance to show what he can do. And so that leads to mistake number two, which is these two thousand employees who sign this petition really distorted and took out a context, that passage, and I know the passage is cringe, okay, and orally and I could, you know certainly pear sexes, but you have to put in its context and the the larger count, this is a work of literature.

This a best selling uh book, is one one hundred and fifty thousand words are taking one hundred and fifty words out of context and the context was, like you said, he's describing the mother of his children, the love of his life as this sort of Linda hamilton ask in terminator type figure or sharlee thorn in mad max and this passage is not in there to describe all women, is just basically a literary flourish to contrast the woman that he loves being such a bad as compared to every other woman and and you. When her swisher interviewed agm five years ago, he bought this passage. He explained IT and SHE said, yeah, okay, I get IT.

So you know, it's certainly the case that people can understand the context if they choose to, and they simply are not choosing to understand the context. Which brings me to mistake number three, which is these two thousand employees alive in their petition by claiming that their safety is threatened by apple. Hiring a em that is simply untrue, is physically impossible in the era of zoo when everyone's working from home.

But this guy is not a threat, anyone's safety, but they, but they use that claim. They make that claim because they know that if you accuse someone of threatening your safety, IT will trigger the machinery of hr to remove that person from the workplace. This is the language of safety ism.

And it's a specific tacti C2Basically get som ebody can celled to rem ove fro m the wor kplace. okay. And then that leads to the the the next mistake, I think mistake number, which is the bosses.

As apple caved into this pressure, they were total cowards that everyone gave him the chance to explain himself. They never asked him, what did you intend by this passage? What are you trying to do? And by the way, they knew about this book.

yes, to say it's even works. They knew about the book. They had veit. And they talked to many people as when a big, a big tech company hire somebody for a major position like this, they call all the report, of course, covered and dealt with course.

They knew about IT. And then when the mob complains, they fire him severely without subjecting the decision to proper hr process. This is A H R. By mob rule, it's totally y an acceptable. No company should be run this way.

And then finally, that brings this number five is that in explaining their decision and trying to justify their cowards and giving into the mob, they said that fired him because of his behavior. Agm never had a chance to engage in any behavior. He barely started at the job.

This wasn't because of his behavior. This is because of the book that he rote five years ago. So what they're saying is that if you ever publish a written work at any time in your life, years and years ago, that that can somehow concentrate present day behavior, and that other people in the workplace can have a problem with that, that this is not behavior. And this is why he's going to have a giant deformation suit and settlement ment because they are making him unemployable in the tech industry by claiming that he was fired for some, some sexy behavior. He was not.

What do you think you'll get paid in .

A I put IT at ten ten million.

Well.

I was just thinking he's a half million dollar employee to a million with this R. S. U. So let's to put out a million unemployed for ten to twenty years because of this or the damages to .

his reputation and present .

value that back so and yeah so .

I think ten millions in number my curiosity and this was just um did those two thousand employees feel the same way about doctor dray, of course.

What do they do they feel the same way about some of the movies that they sell uh in the itunes store or do they feel the same way about some of the games that they enable um in the after or some of the subscriptions that are so um right do they care do they care that much about what's happening in their chinese supply chain? Um I I think IT seems at least on the outside the answer is no. But I would be interesting to get an explanation of that from the same H.

R. people. Um I don't know whether the guy should have been fired or not, but I do think that you should have a predictable standard and every company is allowed to do what they want if the standard that apple is that we are going to hold you accountable for everything you've done in the past irrespective of whether you've disavowed or not.

So be a that's the right. And I think that the employees of that company have a right to do that. I think is that if you start to arbitrary enforce IT um you go down this weird place, which is like basically, I think what they are saying is if it's good for business, we're going to ignore IT. If it's not obvious that it's good for business, will act because it's a low cost way of keeping the masses um you know that the medicated and I think that's what's even scarier er to the two thousand people. It's not that maybe they should feel proud to take out their pound of flesh, but they really should figure out how they want to stand on all these other points because the Cherry pig puts puts a whole company in just a weird posture that's that's not .

scalable free berg.

Uh, i'm less interested in the hypocrite y in the values debate, which is obvious as kind of the first order point with all this stuff. It's like, do the employees have the right values? Is their hypocrisy y by management.

Is their hypocrisy y by the employees. What what strikes me though is um a failure of leadership at these organizations. You know you guys think back to bryan armstrongs kind of person ing of the woke mob and the political discourse that was happening at point bed a few months ago.

He took a point of strong leadership um to a new level. And I think that highlighted when the leader steps up and says this is how we're going to Operate. These are how we're going to make decisions and puts its foot down. Uh, people will leave and you evolve the culture.

And I think that indicates to me that certain companies, as they've gotten really big and really successful like apple and even alphabet and various other kind of large tech companies, the leader is no longer lead the employees lead the narrative on culture and the narrative on values. And um you know IT speaks to two things. One is that there perhaps aren't founder leaders running those organza anymore, that there are managers whose job is ally important, whose job is to keep the wheels on and keep the wheels from falling off.

So they have more to lose. And they are constantly trying to protect the downside, that they are trying to be aggressive about growing to the upside. Um and then I think it's just, uh, you know secondly, this kind of um you know failure uh to kind of define what your values are from a leadership perspective.

And the boy gets filled by the employees, the boy gets filled by the mob. And so well, it's this one kind of you know debble point today and this one kind of hypoxia point today is really interesting to see that this isn't happening at other companies that are found or LED. And if IT is the you know, the culture gets steps would have handled this completely difference the of his employees and a really clear point of view about who we hire, why we hire them and how we make decisions and not let the demolition craic kind of rule .

or all employs take a vote. How much of this tramp has to do with the codling of silicon valley employees for two decades via v you know, you get driven to school on your school bus, you sit on, you know, you get your lunch prepared for you. We do your dry cleaning every friday.

You get to come and ask chAllenging questions to the leaders. And this concept of, like everybody has a voice at work as opposed to this, is a company control by shareholders and or a founder. And you work for IT, and there is a trade of services here VISA.

What toby had to say, a chop fy, which is, this is not a family. This is a sports team. You are here to perform. We are here to perform for our customers the end.

So the in fact, if you if you had a chance and maybe neck, we can posted in the show. But the email that toby Lucy wrote to sharpie y employees was unbelievable. That to me is like that's a tour of force that should be basically like that should be minted and all as an N. F. ty.

What's an we got about those?

And IT IT was just an incredible email, Jason, to your point and the way that that started, if I I may be getting these facts wrong, but there is an mog of a news inside of a slack channel. Um and then and then folks got quite upset with IT. And so I think toby's response was to basically shut down the whole channel and say, hey guys, you know, we're losing the script about why were here.

And you know, I think brian armstrongs esa was a version of that. The question is, why are we here? If I had to guess, I think it's because we've pumped so much money in the silicon valley companies, they didn't know where to spend IT.

And so I actually think that what we've really done is over hired far too many people and to many of these companies. And so they kind of our very smart people. Sitting around tootling their thumbs and so obviously they're just gonna distracted, meaning um I remember like you know had facebook, there was barely enough people to keep the light song for a while.

Then I remember red by the time I was leaving. I was like, well, there's way too many people here, a lot of them, and most of them all really, really smart. But IT wasn't obvious to me what many of them did. And you know, people would look at me and then say, oh, you know, that's a really urgent thing to say and that's not true and everybody's valuable. I don't know.

Um you know if you look at google, I ve always thought like that company could probably run by two thousand people, but they know there's two hundred thousand people so the hundred and ninety eight other thousand of them need to find something to do. It's probably the same at apple. It's probably the same at all these big tech companies.

And that's the leverage that you get from technology. It's naturally massive vely deflationary. So but if you keep pumping billions and billions and billions of dollars into these companies where the APP experiences is written by fifty or a hundred critical people or managed by five hundred or thousand critical people, um this is the natural by product.

I think which of all of them, by the way, freeburg said, organizations want to grow, right? How many organizations say, you know, we should be smaller? We don't.

There's many people. You're seeing something really important, not enough found. Ers and boards understand the difference between growing a business and growing and org. Those are two totally different things. And the reason is because we've lost sight of very simple financial metrics and silicon valley, meaning if you go to any other industry where there is a cost of capital, people understand what return on invested capital means. They know how to measure IT ah, they know what Operating leverage means, they know what margin expansion means.

We have valuation and .

they seek that out here. We think about exactly, as you said, evaluation. And so this idea that having a hundred people do the work and see margins lift is antithetical to the silicon value culture. It's oh as margins go, let just keep running the same profit business but instead have a five hundred people.

What do you think you're an Operations machine? People would say on a COO basis, you're one of the top three to five in the history of the valley. What do you say? COO men.

um yeah, I me look chitra moths right that in a company that's well run and well LED, where people people don't have time on their hands to engage in these sancian. Um so yeah, I mean, I think I think that's absolutely right. I think companies in sordust are increasingly to choose whether they want to be apple or whether they want to be a coin base or a shop line for that matter. And this this week at apple, there's a new petition circling now there's a petition called by thousand of employees calling for a tim cook to denote as release and dorsey alex ini inside conflict yeah.

that work well, have a position on abortion is where abortion position well.

But but now theyve given into the the woke mob. There's no reason for the mob to stop. There can be circulating in petition every week.

And that kind of the point is so, and actually agm himself had a really good quote about this. He did a great interview with mattie b, and he laid out the choice that companies face like this. He said, it's interject.

This is internet. g. Martino saying, is interjecting the whole fucking twitter cesspool with all the dog piles and all the performance is signal and all that crap into a corporate setting and replicating those dynamics and calling IT work.

That's basically what happened is happening is these employees are performing twitter at work and they are on on slack and they're pretending like it's really work and is not. And I think, you know founders are gonna to make a decision. Do you stand up and take a brian armstrong ing light position or a toby position? Or you eventually degenerate into some sort .

of a base camp away or even base camp. The most woke e virtual signaling founders on twitter decided to take that the most liberian or Spark approach, you know, stuvic approach of toby to give you, uh.

toby amp. Camp thoughts to a base camp, try to accommodate this sort of like woke mentality. And what they found is that they got pushed so far, IT became so distracting, they eventually had to move to the armstrong position. And that kind of my point is .

once you eve to that, I mean, and if you don't believe what I what I said was application, if you believe that a organization that allows political speech and this kind of stuff as a primary function inside the company, will they go build a competitor to base camp and show that, that system works Better? Here's tobie h to help you make this more clear to team members here. Some pointers about what shop wify is not.

Shop fy, like any four profit company, is not a family. The very idea is proposed ous. You are born into a family. You never choose IT and they can n family. You IT should be massively, obviously, choosier y is not a family.

But I see people, even leaders, casually use the term like shoppy FM, which will cause the members of our teams, especially ju ones that have never worked anywhere else, to get the wrong impression, the dangers of family thinking in quotes, and that IT becomes incredibly hard to let poor performers go sharp. Fy is a team I tol size, not a family. We literally only want the best people, the world.

The reason why you join shoplifting is because I hope while other people you met during interview process, we're really smart, Carrying and committed. This is magic, and he creates a virtuous magianism on talented people, because very few people in the world have this in themselves. People who don't should not be part of this team.

I mean, when I was, when I was a face from when I was a facebook, we used to convene the scene or team, and, you know, I was like, I, I, I really want to fire the bottom five or ten percent of the company for you, and we would force stack rank. And we did IT for about three or four years. And then the excuse was is too big and there are too many people and the rules are too diversity.

You can't rank. I actually don't believe that even to this day, I think it's pretty obvious who the real thousand x kind of employee contributors are. And by the way, they exist in every function.

There's thousand x sales people, there's thousand x you know, product managers there. There's a thousand people that work in facilities. They exist in every job function. And companies, I don't think, do a good enough job of figuring ing out who they are.

And so instead, what happens is people that are not even a hundred x or not even a ten x are really more like a one or one point one. X can basically hide in all of that noise. And I think that if you could separate H R into two things, but there's really three things. One is like benefits, which is critical. The second is actually like safety and the the ability to whistle blow if there's something really in a furious or bad that's happened.

And in the third, that's really valuable, I think, is organisational design, right? How do you put people in good jobs and how do you allow them to have a huge amount of autonomy to run and build career? But all of this other policing stuff, to me that seems like um IT cottons to the lowest twenty five percent. I don't know that. And this is my intuition to the lowest twenty five percent performers of everything.

of course IT does. And just to a close, the story up and rap to our next, uh, in tone, A G M announced ed that he is going to take a year, wait for IT to write for subset so he is going to get get paid ten million dollars. I I would to mate in a settlement by apple. He's gonna get A H half million dollars and over I take.

I bet on this.

H I said, such a good lit t on IT. I'll take the OK.

You'll take you, uh, well.

go go give you give a different bit, not get a different line, set a different line, have extends a good line. Could you got to think like if they offer him submarine, you I mean.

it's going to be something like that. No, what .

what? Fifteen.

six hundred.

And wow.

4 is a say .

under fifty。

Yeah, that. Five leg .

gets up .

under.

Can I just tell you why if you look at the last four year compounding of apple stock, right? And so if you think about reasonable number of grants, is his level of unity pu pute counting plus .

what would be part of his team? But because that's the argument.

I I do think you get end up .

getting to probe and to include .

get a out yeah you get to buy .

de now Price at fifteen and also make the argument they rendered .

him unemployable the and then there's .

forgone mental suffering. What about suffering? He is going to suffer.

He's going to need to be on mads. My client is suffering his and therapy twice a week. He can get out of bed. He's not gonna able to be in functional relationships, and he's too scared to leave the house.

He should wait on the sub stack because he's going to make so much money on sub stack, it's going to mitigate his damage.

I don't .

take the help. So on.

The guys know what? Apple's market cap divided by employees. Apple is apples, marty.

seven million and employee.

anyone else where thank scarce one .

hundred thousand employees and it's worth two trillion okay.

there's one hundred and fifty thousand employees, two point one trillion. So it's fourteen million and employee so the other way to think about IT is if apples like gona lose one or two good employees over this um you know they are they happily pay up to get uh to get to get to be quiet. So it's worth one employee to pay forty million dollars well .

no I mean well you you're not dividing by all the slave labor in china.

and. They they actually cause zero. That was bad, sorry, but it's true. I mean, this is a hypocrisy of apple. They've literally got slave labor in their supply change, not that they wanted in their supply change.

How you know you that just go through this because like this is a common narrative but has anyone .

actually gotten to the boat that I said reported again?

I don't like I I like pushing .

narrows something that came from I think a pretty valid source um that author from the atlantic who I think is pretty legit also I just think .

just in terms of his quote, if he had taken the word woman out of the quote, most people the bay hair soft and week is on my apocalypse. I don't think you're recruiting from the bay area but related to this story in terms of treats point about you know uh one thousand nine performers uh amErica is uh really doing a bad job at math and gary ten uh the venture capitalist retweet and and participate in a tweet thread about immigrants um who know that standardized test is probably your best shot at getting somewhere uh your money socialize can take you the rules are well standard zed and he tells the story about this. But there is a persue article um about us felling math and that they're going to be in california getting rid of the gifted programs for math because it's unfair to the kids were not gifted as a kid who is was not gifted uh and to the three kids on the program who weren't gifted programs or at least two of you were I have no problem with are being a gifted program. But any thoughts on this?

I think it's shameful.

Yeah I mean.

like we are we are really doing our level best is completely fuck our population. why? I mean, why is this even how could this even be possible? It's like like just is like it's it's kind of like the equivalent it's the moral equivalent of actually saying, you know what, we're going to eliminate welfare for the bottom forty five percent.

Like our job as a society is to kind of like find the brought a set of solutions for the most number of people and solve for both extremes. So when you dealing with education, you both need to understand that there are folks that need some kind of structural support. Look, when I came to canada, I had E, S, L, write english as a second language.

You take that so that you can learn the native language of a country. IT didn't mean that I was stupid. I just meant that I was behind.

You know, if I had this lexi or something else, I would need some kind of support. One of my children had a speech impediment. We had a speech therapy. This is what you do. But on the other side, if you have a kid who's an incredibly high performer who has a potential use completely crush, hey, like you should be able to give that kid a pathway to achieve and give back. So the idea that you would eliminate anything at the extremes is kind of completely uncompassionate and stupid, just totally fuck and stupid.

It's in the me of having a more equitable math class. Again, I hate that work. Please don't .

use that word. That that is the way.

I mean, this goes back to the point of a few of isolated o that you know you can have progress or you can have a quality, but it's very difficult to have both. And you know if you want to trying make every one equal and give no one the opportunity to have more or get more than anyone else because of whatever the circumstances may be, whether it's earned or that's no. But this is my point. Like, you know, you limit the ability for everyone to progressed as a group because we're now limiting the ability for folks to take calculus.

I know equality. Look, I use a video game example. Equality means we all get to play, granted of total.

Not that we have a somebody who actually plays for us and gets to the same answer and just gives you a ticket that's a sult don't become the same score. That is what equality means is that we all get to play and we all get a change. Equity, which is leveling everyone. Equity is leveling everybody in saying, here's your result.

by the way, is the same as everyone where no one can be ahead of anyone else by too far. Uh, obviously limit as a group our ability for the top desi to to increment or the top cortile to incremental.

I got to think, look, let's let's again use let's again use our friends because instead of hours. But you know we know a lot of really smart people um who have really, really smart kids. We also know people in general that are in tough circumstances who also probably have really smart kids.

Just purely selfishly for me, I want those kids doing the best they can to figure out what they have they can invent for us in the future. Why would you slow those kids down? You know, it's kind of like saying, you know what? Like how about a black athlete proposers say, you know what, you don't have a right to go to the N.

B. A and make money for your family. I'm going to slow you down because there's another White kid that's gonna through four years of college. So you know what? You're going to have to go through four years of college and you're going have to pay for.

well, actually what I would propose when I go up to dunk that we just the rim automatically lower tupi. yeah. So I like dunk. Then when you go home for a life will just raising inches. There would be more more .

people for me to another layer to this.

So I I agree with you, with you guys that what we should be thinking about this opportunity, we've always be asking what increases opportunity for the most people, and that's how we should measure political programs. And we're not doing that here. We are sort of leveling down.

But I would say it's even more inferior than that, which is I think what's happening is that the education establishment is completely fAiling our kids in our schools. And what they're trying to do is destroy the evidence of that failure. And so they're hiding.

They're hiding the results. Now this persuading piece, yes, this persuading piece lays out the statistics, which are pretty grim. okay. So according to these, like global measurements by oecd, okay, math proficiency in the U. S. We rank thirty seven in the world, okay? And there's only thirty seven develop nations in the world according to the develop.

Our last among developed countries, china, which is our main global competence, is number one, okay? And we achieve these horribly results despite ranking fit in the world in poor people spending. So it's not a spending problem.

okay? And as we know to accept, we do have hyperfine asus in the U. S. A huge majority that are actually foreign born. And so we're actually kind of cheating our our numbers little, but it's even worse than IT appears.

Now what is the education establishment doing about this? How are they hiding the failure? Well, when school comes back in the fall, they're planning to eliminate accelerated math.

Okay, that means that there is no more algie for eighth graders who are ready to take IT on. There's no more calculus for high schoolers who want to, you know, do like the ap classes and getting a jump on stem for college. The entire idea of gifted students is now under attack like we talked in, the name of equity has become a catch of every bad idea.

And university california system has now abandon the S. A, T. And A C.

T. So they temporarily got rid of those requirements during the pandemic. But now.

anyway, crises, the way crisis.

And now they say they're not bring back the requirements until at least twenty, twenty five and you can, but it's never going to return at all. And so here's to think they're trying to get rid of measuring how bad we are at mass. So we want have to think about IT. They just want to give everyone a gold star in a part on the back and say.

how know this reminds me of sexes when you throw away the the digital scale. I got .

you right. I'm not fat because i'm not measuring IT great.

perfect. Oh my god, it's like we're really, it's the movie idiocracy. Literally, we are doing the movie. Have you guys eliminate .

all admissions programs at every university and just one global emissions board where every campus is the same? What is the difference between M I T. Um and stanford and caltech and the university of arkansas?

In my opinion, there shouldn't be. It's more equitable to just have somebody go close to home because you can save money. You know, carbon emissions are lower, right? You can just take the bus to the local computer, teach you anybody basic course. I an if I said this, you think that I was a crazy person. Except that's basically what we're now telling.

All of our high are also getting rid of stars. And i'd like you up to take off there review system because it's not equitable like we should not have mission and stars anymore every year .

around the same every restaurant to get three quarters of a star. We should not the health department should not give ranks of letters and they should not be forced to post because that's an equitable absolutely you know yeah .

also you can game, you can gain the health test.

You can literally just follow the counter point question, which uh, standardized testing, for example, benefits people that can afford to ters and special you know classes to get ahead about .

more two days. Therefore.

therefore higher income people that can always the point is they can always lay er on additional two in the way .

on additional classes for the of that a freeze, you can only get eight hundred.

I i'll be somewhat um flip poppy here. I don't believe in standardize test that much. I never did well, particularly in standardize that.

I do think that they can be gamed, but that's different from what we're talking about. What we're saying is if kids show aptitude, we are explicitly choosing to not give them a chance to develop at their potential. And the problem is we do this in other areas.

We do IT in athletics, we do IT in music, we do IT in the arts. But we're not going to do IT in stem. That's what we're choosing to do.

That is what's crazy. So choose to get rid of the S, C T 和 A C T。 what? Everyone, I don't care. But if you are the lebron James of physics, jesus, cry like, let that kid become the lebron James.

I I am. I got unto you see berkely, because I had great standard zed tears, because I an aptitude. What was sure? I A T fever. Let's do this. Um I got a student and eight hundred math, and I think IT was a twenty verbal.

You o you ve got to fifteen twenty out of sixteen hundred at the time I got was and .

I got to eight hundred on the map.

I visited seven, fifty miles. Seven, twenty, verbal .

fourteen.

Are you writing down?

This is three inflation.

There was a big, I was fifteen h we .

were OK. So I walk up for one hundred, five hundred.

hundred of you in canada. Just kind like we didn't even write, but I goo didn't you .

said you work in a test so what you talking.

you're in the top three percent.

Yeah yeah I know. But generally like I was an equitem. I C. I was in probation and color academic sti c but look.

the reason why these test got invented was actually to prevent discrimination, I think was back in like the fifties right now. I think he was like in at that time, I was jews being kept out the ivy league. And one of the ways that they correct for that was I made everyone take the same test as you could see the scores and IT would shine some light on you know making sure that people didn't just get in because they were legacies that they got in because um you know they they are good, good scores and there's been decades of work since then to try to eliminate bias in the test. And so the claims of bias now, the test really aren't supported.

Now to freeze ks point, obviously that if you take some rich kid who lives in the suburbs who gets a fourteen hundred, and you compare that to a kid in the inner city who doesn't have, who grew up poor, doesn't have the advantages, and that he gets a thirty one hundred, well, with scores is Better, probably the thirteen hundred. And so you can take that into account, in my view, in the emissions process, but eliminating the scores all together. Why would you want to have less information to make a decision?

There's no reason not to get rid of these. I would just think more holistically about how you accept students. I mean, isn't more competition and having Better teachers what we should be focusing on here is supposed to even stanistreet testing or got for big cancelling programs. Let's just invest in more competition for schools.

Also in canada, we had this thing where when I was graduating, we had specific different kinds of math contest and computer sign contests and other things that you could write. The partner um is sera. And those things were actually really instructed because they were purely vertical zed, things that could test your attitude.

And the school that I went to university, waterloo, would look at a lot of those things and adjust for, because my grades were decent. But my some of those one, this one specific math test I took was pretty good, I remember. And then they would adjust that exactly, as David said, to what is this kids background and the circumstances.

And they called that a french factor. They would just adjust my Marks and that's I got into waterloo and I didn't think I was going to. So um there's all kinds of ways where you can be smart about IT.

But again, we're talking about guys still lose side of what you're saying. We are actually gonna cut all these kids off at the knees, starting in great eight. So forget about all of the stuff. By the time that these kids graduate, they're gonna be, I honestly.

they are gonna be like, really dumb. Isn't measurement the denial of opportunity to learn? It's it's about getting rid of the learning in the classes. That's the biggest problem.

You have to move to a state with the gift of program. Now if your kid is really smart.

you to have a public education which doesn't have any anybody, I mean, literally schools don't have to do we? We put IT. We've now designed a system to summarize, schools don't have to compete for students.

Teachers don't have to compete for jobs or for their employment. And now we're saying students don't have to compete. So if you remove competition from the human condition, uh, you're just not going to have any performance.

There's going to be no progress. And as a species, we need progress. We need to solve global warming. We need to solve a lot of issues.

And do we want to live longer and Better lives that where is the optimistic nature of the human species? Competition is at the core of excEllence. And to just take IT out of everything, the whole step.

that's the smarter thing you ever said. Way smarter than eleven twenty A T score.

Thank you. Thank you. Very eleven twenty.

How name is that? They were still talking about our S A T scores.

like three, twenty points above average day.

S A B S D. What's name is the four of us all remember .

down to the fifty. I gotta look IT up. Um alright. Um do we want to go to the cypher l melon or talk about inflation? Or do we should we do tell those together or just want to go straight UFO?

Well, bright bikes just, uh, they they just press release, just hit the wire and they just cut the infrastructure bill from two point three trillion to one point seven trillion.

So we're doing our job here are bogus.

And A I I I had heard from somebody that there just is not the broad base support um for uh the capital gains tax. So that's not gonna en um and IT looks like the corporate tax will probably go to twenty five percent um not even up to twenty eight percent. And interestingly, I didn't realize this but one of the biggest features of the bill that has the most popularity is that they're closing this loophole around IP that sits outside the united states and that more than the corporate taxes will raise almost a trillion dollars of I agree with that.

And why should you put your wise apple? I mean, we will talk about hypocrite is putting their p ireland so they don't pay tax.

Connect everybody doing that.

What does that exist? It's so unamerican.

Well, it's a subsidiary that has different taxation on IT than you know kind of the capital and that the uh and that earning that .

I P was made in california IT was not made in double in nor offense to, you know, my home country.

I remember a facebook. We did, we did this exact thing. We signed over all the IP and then the I R S. Suit, facebook. And remember, like I was called either to, I was a pea and we went through like a whole multiple trial may still be going on.

And I was around this issue, which was the irs said, hey, facebook, how come you you know, you ported this over there? And I think facebook answers, yeah, we paid the tax. And I think they did. They don't think they did anything wrong because the laws allowed, but IT effectively help shield then tens of billions of dollars of future taxes.

I mean, I remember reading about this, and i'm like, how does this pass the sniff test? Well.

it's where the revenue is. Recognize J, K, L. So you basically can produce the IP here, then transfer to your subsidy when you transfer to your subsidiary, you can recognize the earnings in that subsidiary and that subsidiary pays taxes in its local jurisdiction. Um the I think the issue facebook add was that they transfer the I P, and they undervalued what the future value would be from that I P transfer. And that's why the irs to them is this accounting snp fo in terms of like what do you value IT out at .

the moment you transferred IT? Here's another idea. What does what do they look at as part of this I P licensing? Where does the consumption of that I P A car? And where do the employees who maintain that I P A live?

J L, it's a very smart idea, the promise that the supreme slope that then gets to local taxation. You know, the thing is, we have all these global tax treaties where these large corporate cities can basically play this game and they're not subject to local tax.

But that's the thing that's going to really start the undoing of the big mono because if you start to abandon these global tax treaties and you're starting to see IT, france is trying to do some stuff. The U. K.

Is trying to do some stuff. States in individually in the united states are trying to do these companies or tax and more. That's the that's the first way to chip away at these monopoly is to basically say fucked your global tax free. You need to pay x amount dollars to be here and IT already exists because of these you know real uh sorry, the retail tax nexus and how e commerce companies have to pay local tax in the areas um but once IT sort of touches a whole bunch of other industries um and countries, uh, I think that you're gonna have that.

That's why I think yelling Janet elen yesterday said that you know she's in support of trying to have a global minimum tax of two percent, basically trying to get to the n state until every country let's all circle the wagons and agree that we'll all just charge everybody to 2 percent and then we won't go all our separate ways。 The problem is that if you have a lot of usage in a country, you know that country doesn't care what the taxation is in zimbabwe, right, or canada. They're like, give up the U.

K. Or friends. I like, I look at the top twenty apps in my country and I like, wait minute, these guys would be paying me fifty billion dollars a year in tax. It's hard to get away from the incentive to not want to a taxi companies .

right now sex and that yeah I don't have a huge thought of the I P issue um IT IT seems like I know that the republican proposal on the infrastructure was six to eight hundred billion um bindon's proposal nursery was two point three eh months right now there down to one point seven. I think that the markets have been choking on the size of all of this tax and spend and the either been all these reports of inflation spiking.

And so the gross stocks that just spend hammer because we're all expecting big interest rate increases to control this future inflation. So um violence has been horrible for gross stock so far. And I really I guess that what IT shows is that what our gross cks growth cks are our future investment and IT shows the way that the government can crowd out when you have access government spending. I because you can call an investment if you want. But when you have access government spending, IT starts a crowd out private investment because IT raises interest rates and that you decreases the value of growth stocks and there's less money that flows into that.

Yeah does seem like the market reaction to the infrastructure bill h and to inflation has made bitten reconsider his approach and maybe he just came out too hot. I I don't .

think biden reconsidering. I think it's people like joe and remember ma three for modern democrats in the senate who I think are receiving the message amount that really well. The last pod that the markets are sending a message to washington, I think some of those centers democrats read the message.

I don't think, but is aware I don't know what he he doesn't seem too aware of anything to meet. But I think the modern democrats are getting a message and they're in the White house. The package is too big and the there and I think that's why .

is the other thing that I think people um maybe getting their heads around, here's what's change last week. There is a growing body. If I to say like you know, the beautiful thing about the the markets is that IT isn't extremely elegant voting mechanism in the short term, right? I mean buffs, it's it's a voting machine in the short term and awaiting machine in the long term.

But if you look at sentiment and how things are voted on in the public markets in the real time, it's incredibly illustrative. So um there's a body of people mouth that are voting a very different scenario than inflation. What they're voting for now is this idea that by the fall, a lot of this short term pent up demand will have worked its way through the system.

And instead, we will be back to this realization that we've had for the last twenty years, which is, wait a minute, people don't actually want to buy more of these physical goods. They're gna go back to consuming the way they did before. It's gonna reflexively push towards technology companies again.

And we're gna have this rebirth growth. And you would say, well, how would you know that that vote is likely? And this one incredible thing happened this last week, which I just want to throw out here. A one thing that I look at is the thing called ten year break events, which is basically a thing that the federal reserve of santa Lewis publishers and what IT basically shows is like what people think collectively trillions of dollars, what the ten year break even interest rates going to be. And IT peaks last week at two point five four percent and it's fallin thirteen uh basis points um just in the last week that the two forty one and I don't know whether it's sustained or whatever, but there is a growing idea that the worst may be behind us. And if you lay er on top of this now by and pulling back right on a stimulus because he can't get IT done, pulling back on cap gains, pulling back on for taxation um and a more measured policy of investment, we we can all be back by.

So we're basic taking the medicine and getting back to where we were. But we still have massive asset inflation ment we're seeing in houses, cars and other things.

Well, we may have just pulled forward demand, meaning, you know people are like, okay, on flash with money to savings rate. United states has been, you know, going at an incredible clip. People may pull forward all that spending and say, I wasn't to buy a car eighteen months from an hour.

I was just going to buy a house two years from now. Fuck IT. I'm going to do IT now because Prices are going up too fast.

I don't want to miss out, but then they're out of the market now for the next many number of years. And this is what i'm saying where you see this short term speak of demand and then things get back to Normal. If that's what we see. Good times are back in road star.

Go high again. I literally I did like two or three early stage deals recently and I had members of cynics say, like how does this valuation makes sense and I said to them, you know IT IT actually. Does that make sense?

Um if you're looking at IT with the traditional metrics s, but all valuations are higher at all stages. So I am going to selectively you know overpay compared to what we were paying a year two ago. You know if I really love a company, but I will sit out a lot of i'm sitting out a lot rounds right now that I just can't get my head around the valuation. So hopefully, some there's .

always a trickle down. There's always a trickle down from grow stocks in the public markets to venture, right? Because the last private investors like the big funds who do the super late state stuff there is doing an arbitrage on what they pay versus what the company's going to list for publicly.

So when they see those valuations go down, they adjust. And then IT works this way all the way down the stack. So you know, gross socks have just been a hammer. And especially all the recent listings, the ipos and backs and everything and and that's going to trickle its way. I think the venture is .

I think we the I I think we have the lead indicator on that is clubhouse, right, which will be the canaries in the coal mine. I don't know how you .

guys recommend explain what's going on with clues just for those explain what IT is.

okay. So clubhouse is a casual audio space. You go into a room and you're immediately take into a live conversation with people speaking on stage and an audience. Audience members can be promoted to .

the stage and start talking on is in an APP and it's an o so there's a, is an a you go. And so it's .

like amateur united, a strip club. But for words.

more common club, whatever you to bring popular, it's kind of champion room. But a so anyway, I really more from the the apple two thousand natures from apple to remove all in from the city. We just lost three legs in the apple power sing up.

So what's very interesting about this APP is that had a massive number of downloads during the pandemic because people were home and people are not doing anything at night because they were sheltering in place. And they had in, you know, two million dollars in january, nine point five million in february of this year and then came crashing down two point seven million in march, in nine hundred and twenty two in April. But at the same time, their valuation over eighteen months went from one hundred million in their seed when they had like three or four thousand users to a billion to four billion in the last round of financing for a company with zero revenue.

And h let's call IT a couple of million people using the APP. And what's really interesting is the same venture firm that all three rounds, all of scores, investment in what up where they did all the private funding. You have no outside capital marking this valuation, a four billion dollar valuation, four billion dollars.

Well, they got a, they got an acquisition offer from twitter for four billion .

and turn confirmed.

I've heard that was real. So so but so based the reason why the four billion prime round happened was so that we keep going as independent company, they could basically take some chips off the table through secondary ary and kind of go for the bigger outcome. But yeah, they could assume to twitter for billion. So they may end up regretting that.

But like is this really a function of a broader the evaluation inflation? Or is this just a function of there was a company that was a social network with hyper growth, and then IT turns out that the product had no stickiness .

and hyper growth went away, collapsed.

Can I just point out, like, and forgive me, if any any of you guys are investors in this company or anyone that's listening cares. But like, if this thing came out before youtube, people would say, you know, this is interesting, but IT needs an a synchronous killer. IT needs a thing where you can, like, record a conversation posted online, and people can come and watch and listen to when they want.

IT was always so crazy to me that you had to be logged to be up, listen to what was going on. And if you didn't, you miss the conversation and there was no way to like, go walk to the recording of the conversation. Like, am I crazy to think that this was just like, I .

know I and actually know .

to make .

care .

what .

what the.

所说 所说 对， breaking news story. okay. So I think I understand what a club house did wrong. Asking is a huge part of IT.

But rather than tell you exactly, i'm going to show you because i've been incubating a new yes, that were where we're on test fly right now. And you guys after this product, I can I can demo IT for you. And if you guys if you guys want to invest, i'm going to close around this week because getting wet.

And so if you guys want to get value.

what's best of .

what how much money they're raising?

Ten million box and we already have commitments and .

but i'm creating room for you guys.

Five hundred K H, O, K, sounds like five .

hundred k line. The I ready to launched in a few weeks. Yes, now also it's called call in call .

in call thought I thought going to call club bouse.

Does this have a pocket? I like we to do the podcast on IT. We absolutely .

do the cast on IT. And that would be awesome.

Nick would be out of a jobs. I don't think you would like. Good for that.

Yes, I would be great to do exactly. That's why it's called calling is because the ability for you to take callers is obviously a huge feature but also like we could host after parties for our fans to like you know chop up the latest episode and talk about .

IT yeah these fans are getting you guys see that all in stats. Twitter handle I don't know the twitter handle off the top of my head, but somebody yy these kids are doing um uh they're using machine learning or something to know what percentage of time we each speak on the pod and how many monologues they're doing. All these statistics is crazy.

That's really cool. Um I was going to say uh, in defensive clubhouses for second I don't I don't know the upper say, but I think like why and Jason did all of that in my opinion is because they're pressing a hot hand, which makes a on a sense from their perspective. It's like, you know, I think that they're gone for the kill shot because I think they're basically set up.

They're basically set up to become so koa, if if they really I think I think if you think about like which two firms are really crushing on all cylinders right now, obviously coy has always been the prentice number one. But if you think about the the heater, that and reason is on its incredible. And so from their perspective, the four billion dollar valuation is less important than what is the real capital at risk.

And that's probably one hundred, one hundred and fifty million, which in the grand scheme of having forty or fifty billion dollars of A U M. If you considered the value of all their public positions as well, that's a really reasonable risk to take. So I think if you in that way, it's kind of like they're taking a shot to .

try to just go IT does become more ten billion or fifty billion. If I get sold for five hundred million, they get their money first. So what is the matter?

What is the matter? They are going for a hundred billion dollars. Come I meyers ve seen that instagram sold too soon. They saw that snap turned down a three billion dollar off from facebook and out worth eighty billion. So they're going for one hundred .

billion dollars point six billion.

Yeah, now it's worth hundreds of billion, so they're hoping it's going to be like that. But moths is right. Look, if they had taken what, say, twenty percent of a four billion or outcome eight and a million, that is even pay back their fund, right? But if IT ends up being a hundred billion dollar outcome, they make twenty billion now is like a coin base for them.

What do you think they gave to the founders to keep up in the game? Because four billion failed, eighty percent, they took the .

chips off the table. But here's the thing, all those decisions were made before the recent collapse and engagement at the house. I'm not sure anybody would be paying for a billion for IT now given everything that's gone wrong. But you know who knows, is still pretty .

early adjust for people who are curious. There is a twitter hand to all in underspend stats and um yeah it's all in stats that com I don't know there. We're not affiliated ated with these mini acts, but we we love the stance and we're going to do something in person in september.

Congratulations to the stance for losing their minds. I think it's pretty good uh, way for them to capture a bunch of uh, attention on the twitter all right. Um cyp pda is getting absolutely hambard and I it's the chinese have once again said that they're basically saber rattling about crypto currency. They're obviously gone to do their own.

Um and I think you have to talk about china in a slightly broader lens and just what's happening in cypher because I this is the same week where they based they they force you know jack, I mean to resign from bite tense. I mean, you know last last week I was or last month I was the C E O.

Just, I just and they're .

going for the juggle. I mean.

why are they taking out all their top CEO? This would be like putting you on and just those on the bench is they just don't want any heroes. Ah I don't know.

I mean, I I guess maybe the specular part of me would say they're showing them who really in charge of these companies. I mean, that would be crazy to your point if the government of the united states force soon arpel I and tim cook and mark za and ella mask to resign it's like, hey, sorry, i'm sorry you need to leave right now and put somebody else in and either way to .

wait their badgers yeah real lentz sly. Criticize them, right?

But but yeah yeah, we just demonize them. We just .

try to cancel. They deserve that level of scrutiny they matter of power they have. But but yeah, put him in jail or house arrest or drive out of their companies.

And that is a big advantage for the U. S. economy.

The treasury department here in the united states is doing a little sabor addling. They want to know anytime there is a ten thousand dollar transaction in any kind of digital token. And ah they're talking about A C B D C to do their own crypto currencies.

So they're putting out a White paper for feedback this summer. Um and um we are now seeing a pull back on bitcoin from you know um mid sixties to uh you know now into the thirty six thirty seven thousand per bitcoin. Do you think this is the end of the beginning? Beginning of the end?

It's the beginning of the beginning. David Robert in was on C N B C today and David rumsey for those you guys know know is um was a cofounder of caralog group. No more blue chip and blue blooded you cannot get and very connected in washington and you know he said at best way said no.

Effectively the people want this and the government will uh have no choice except to support IT because you can't take something like this with this much institutional and retail demand away. So we have to go to the place where now crypto needs to be like everything else. And maybe the crypto stands get upset with that because they don't like IT that you know, a bunch of their parents are all of the student gona be buying tokens and stuff, but they got to get over.

And then this stuff should be, you know, transacted in the same way you are transacted anything else. You buy IT, you sell IT. You get a taxi turn, you pay your taxes and you move on.

This reminds me of the transition that we all went through with, I don't have remember, gaza and napster and bittorrent like everybody, all the we a lot of our contemporary in their thirties, whatever, ten, twenty years ago. Like, you can't stop IT, you can't stop IT IT got stopped, you know, like you made IT illegal in your prosecuted people and then you came up with solutions that were regulated like spotify or you know, netflix, and you gave the consumers what they wanted. So David, I think this is a similar path right now that we're going through, which is the clipt to salts and the in the in the stands are going na basically have to get used to us trouts saying their parents buying IT and encrypt or not beings underground, ding, but being regulated in in a major way in the united states and is not a good, bad thing.

I think the thing that that happening quietly behind the scenes is that major wall street players, institutions and downs and so forth over the past year have decided that bitcoin cyp to is a legitimate ask class and have allocating to IT huge, huge pools of capital baLancer capital than allocating to IT. I don't think that's going to a change. This is probably a pretty good buying opportunity.

We've seen these crashes and bitcoin many, many times over the years. IT plum, its down, and then he goes back up and IT eventually goes back up, reaches a new peak. So this is probably a pretty good entry point for the next rally.

We don't know when that's gonna be. The whole point of bitcoin is that its censorship resistance and china can do its best to try and stamp IT out. But I don't think there will be successful that you don't are are .

so wrong about that. That is the most that you've take worse.

take you ve ever had to. O, H.

how do they stop? V, P, S, they put people in jail. How do they think people in jail.

they may make IT incredible for chinese citizens to get a hold of bitcoin? I agree with that, but they're not able to stop bitcoin.

They're not going to stop bitcoin in the west. But they will stop IT in china. One hundred percent for up. And you know how many servers are in china? I mean, go talk to the people who were to anthem .

and square the to move, the have done.

And then if you will be an underground, that IT would be like having a VPN, which is five years in jail for selling VPN.

What do you think about the I R S requirement that you have to report any bitcoin transaction over ten thousand dollars to think that that and americans can be prosecuted for not reporting, right? So I don't like.

fine, what do so get over.

But I get percent of transact .

might legitimate use for crypto .

or twenty.

Okay, fine. But so maybe that makes that that small fraction of illegible ate .

or a listen use cases fires no sex.

I think the point is um that they're trying to chase down. It's not about illegal use cases. It's about not reporting a taxable gain on your bitcoin before you use that money to buy something.

So the is about salvation. But look, but but that's not that's gonna stop IT going the usage. You smart people who've been training bitcoin been paying taxes on IT for years.

That's not I don't think that's really an issue. If you are in china, you equate your wealth in china or many, many other countries all over the world. And there were currency restrictions and controls and the government was a thirteen more more power.

And we're putting business leaders under house arrest and seeking to put them under their thun. You'd be trying to convert as much your nett orth into bitcoin as possible, so that all you have to do is, if you ever had to flee the country, you ouldn't have to have dollars in your suitcase or gold bricks or diamonds. You'd simply have have a password in your brain that you could access at any computer terminal when you got out of the country.

And so that I think that sort of digital gold is a phenomenal use case of bitcoin. And the more oppressive. All these countries become, the more they increase the value of that use case.

What do you figures the black swan event in crypto, in bitcoin particular?

Taxation in the united states, taxation like you do on a cigarettes, that would be for me, the united states putting attacks on IT that makes IT less competitive with our our national coming crypto currency, the CBDC that the united states will launch in the next two or three years. If they are going to say if you wanted use any these other currencies, there is a ten percent tax on them. We want you using hs legitimate .

one is a very negative black swan that obviously has never occurred um but if anyone ever manages to counter fit a bitcoin, or this is the double spend problem, right? If you could ever if you could ever double spend or or figure out a way to create bitcoins more counter fit than whatever that worn in the blockchain.

If the number of big points ever grew beyond the twenty one million that just built into the way that the whole thing works, if that ever happened, bitcoin is instantly worthless. That would be the black swan. On the negative side, I think the black swan.

how could if IT didn't happen in the first eleven years, what do you think basis that IT happens in the twenty?

exactly? It's too expensive now and it's too visible like the the way that I would have happened IT would have happened in the first two or three .

years or the argument could be may be opposite that now so valuable that it's were investing time. Yeah, yes. And and and rather than have to be about a diminishing probability, IT could be an increasing probability over time, which is that the pathways to get there start to get resolved. Where is in the past, you didn't have enough time to resolve those pathways. Highly irregular here, but certain that .

doesn't take to account that is open source and that everybody see IT. So you would think that everybody would discover the vulnerability at the same time, right in an opening s project.

Well, no, I think I think the issue, practically speaking, in this would be that you would see these resources getting organized, meaning you'd see silicon being bought in volume by some centralized player, and then you'd have to see water and power come together as well.

And this is what I think is just not realistic where today that I think the horses left the barren because if you try to basically capture enough hash rate to kind of like overpower this network, it's like the scene in Austin powers where he's screaming in front of uh, a steam ler. But the steam ler is moving at like one foot a minute, right? You see it's just like you just see a coming.

What would do you have a black one, freedman? G, you ask a little question. And so do you have one .

I think about of a lot? I don't really. I mean, it's a black song. It's because it's a black swan so you don't really see IT coming. But like you know, the thing about bitcoin, which has always given me pause, is the fact that the only weight works is if everyone believes that more people are going to believe in IT tomorrow than .

believe in IT today that's the .

only way appreciate yeah but the for variety of reasons is also the only way that IT works because um if IT starts to depreciate, IT becomes almost like this unwinding circumstances and there are moment to red on wines. But then people kind of say, well, you know what more people going to get on this? There's the chinese argument. There's the argentine an argument. There's all the reasons why people will try and store wealth in the system and that becomes a rational for continue to bet on IT. And my observation is so many people that are active Victorin compare bitcoin to the Price of the dollar, which to me seems like IT doesn't make sense relative to the intention of bitcoin, which is to not be part of the monetary system that uses the dollar as kind of the defect to, you know, uh, system of value uh and so why have the comparison to the dollar as the objective for bitcoin? Why is the objective not transactions use cases, number of people that are active on the network and set at sea.

Nobody buying IT is buying IT as a substitute for they're buying IT check.

So yeah, that's right. So that IT becomes this rational that it's like it's an investment that you put money in, in the form of dollars or your local currency with the intention that you will be able to get more of your local currency out at some point in the future. And the only way that works as if you expect someone else will buy IT from you at a higher Price in the future. Therefore, it's all about propagating the um you know the marketing around the bitcoin whether if your objective was really about making this become a replacement currency system or replacement monetary system, you would ultimately care less about you know what's the dollar value per coin and you would .

care more about how many people are using IT you know how how active the CBDC and americans currency you know starts to move towards a bitcoin blockchain like experience what would amErica start to look like if ten or twenty percent of your dollars instead of being held in a bank .

or on A A blockchain A A blockchain does not accomplish anything. People are IT centralized and only is centralized, but also is still prone to the basement, right? Ah and so look, human beings have used everything from gold coins to see shells as money.

We can make anything money that's easy to transaction. We all agree on IT. That's the sense in which bitcoin is the bubble that becomes true if everyone believes IT IT provided provided the number of bitcoin day twenty one million and that the technology enforces the scarcity.

The problem we have with the U. S. Dollars is the government can dip .

as many of .

us they want and change. Yeah and so I think this a positive black swan as well for positive for biton, which is standing ly drug. Miller thinks that the next fifteen years the U.

S. I will no longer be the world's reserve currency or what's gonna place IT. The positive black swan would be that bitcoin becomes, if not the a world reserve currency and unofficial al world deserve of currency.

why? Because people trust IT. They trust the desensitization more than they trust any government. And that that .

would be a is, is the united states in china, are they going to let bitcoin become the worlds reserve currency?

Well, it's not a choice that they have you. sure. So yeah, there's nothing they can do.

What about the law and guns and jail and tax? I don't I don't know what that means there.

There's nothing that they there is nothing that they can do to stop IT before. There's nothing that they can do to stop IT now.

Well, you can't get the new york times in china. You can practice religion there. So they have a pretty easy system. They put you in jail. They want to stop, think, and they could just put you in jail.

How by finding .

out that you have bitcoin and just, well, because they have a hundred percent of view into the internet there, how on? Because they have riders. That's how they capture all the wagers as they her location because they have mobile phones. And when they use signal or any other encrypt technology.

they catch them. No, I I don't think that that works.

but that's how they catch all the dissidents. There is they have them and they also have apple's entire center is controlled by the chinese government.

There's no leger somewhere that says this pacific wallet address equals David sacks, and there's not going to be one anytime soon. Um and so you'll have these centralized wallet authorities that actually you know have a lot of account information. But the reality is the sophisticated actors you note use tumblers.

They washed ed, sort of like their their paths in a way where it's very difficult to figure who these people are. Now if if you don't, if you use the site that doesn't have K, Y, C, that's always going to be the case. And you know people with huge amounts of bitcoin are sophisticated enough to know how to stay anonymous if they want to.

For everybody else who doesn't care because for them, it's sort of an investment asset class and an you know a hedge, then they're not going to care either. And the point is when enough people owe IT, governments aren't in a position to track record of them. Just waking up one day and pulling the plug g on anything is zero.

That's not will help people do things you have to have like centralized policy and support. And I don't see IT one where the other of all the things in china and the united states will face over the next thirty or forty years. This is like fifty .

of ambuLance and sacked reading and closing dots.

I mean, I think we've set IT. Um so yeah I mean, look, I think I think if you're gna stay in a place like the united states, you need to comply with tax law. You're absolutely to report your bit on hold if its required. But if the reason you're buying bitcoin because you're feeling a country or you're worried about feeling a country, you're obvious ly not going to report IT. And that's the that's the advantage of IT is that is supported money supply that again, you can just um you don't have to Carry anything with you, you just put a password in your brain wallet.

Tell me about U. F, S. Before we leave. I mean, can you believe this thing?

This is the craziest thing. I I there was a, yeah there is a sixty minutes episode that just happened. Deputy assistance, uh, secretary of defense intelligent literally said the crash were seeing are and then in quotes far beyond anything that we're capable of, there's nothing we could build that would be strong enough to endure the amount of force and acceleration. Imagine a technology that can do seven hundred g forces, fly thirty miles per hour, evade or and IT has every no obvious science of propulsion, and yet can clearly defy the effects of earth's gravity. That's precisely what we're seeing from the director advanced space through .

identification program. I mean, is this real? Like is what what do we do?

What our government says there are a craft that our trip are arsenal by at least one hundred years to a thousand years at the moment and we're like my what do you think .

freeburg or the scientist here there is a if you read the original um uh treatment written by artha Clark for the movie two thousand and one a space auto c which was written before the movie and then the book was written after the movie um he makes a really compelling point and the point he makes is that when civilizations achieve um a sophisticated enough level of technology, there is no longer a need to physically transport yourself from star to star and try support yourself around the universe.

Think about this for a second. Take what we have from virtual reality today and fast. Two hundred years and then take what we have in terms of you know the ability to print and create anything we want on demand.

And fast forward two or three hundred years, those two conditions alone might give us the ability to strap on something to our brain. And literally, and remember, our brain is simply sensing what our body is given. And if you can control what your brain is sensing through some strap on device or whatever, you don't actually need to physically be in the place where that happened. So if we can remotely sense what's going on somewhere else in the universe or some other part of our planet, and we can remotely pick up those signals and view them or experience them, just you don't need to physically be there.

And secondly, sorry, all this will trap up.

okay? Yeah and that's secondary. I can use, I can use the turn and it's secondly.

if you could predicable yeah think think about .

if you guys ever watch the T, V show carrer next generation, which I would guess maybe one of plica or or the replicator, the holiday. And you can watch one number three on my list of star track. Yeah, serious. You, what if you walk? You could literally recreate the physical space that you want to be in to accomplish anything, the holiday, and then you could print anything.

Why would you use all the energy and all of this work to transport physical matter from one part of the universe to the other, when all matter transmutable? And the only thing that differentiates things is the photon coming off that matter, which is just a sense IT. So if you can sense things remotely while you're physically here, go through the trouble.

Why go through the trouble? And so for the same reason that we go to hawaii, not just watch a movie, no.

because we don't have enough of the sensing capabilities today to truly recreate being in hawaii, but magine, if we did and and we are very much on the path of doing that. And in two, three hundred years, we have the ability to physically recreate what it's like for our body to be in hawaii in every form, smell, taste, color, everything about being there physically, and our body experiences IT.

Why the hell would you fly to hawaii? You could meet people. You could socialize.

So in a, in a where that technology exists, which could, by the way, be neck, right? You signals directly into the brain. Eta, moving physical matter from one part of the university.

The other makes zero sense. All matter is transmute ble. You can convert one adam to another using a technology locally, so you wouldn't do that.

And so that's the premise of two thousand. And one is that you've got these local communication pods that just transmitted information from different parts of the universe. You don't need to physically transport yourself. So that that the the macro kind of argument against notion that UFO are aliens are in a physical spacecraft visiting is so old school technology that IT makes no sense.

It's like saying, you know, oh my god, all these people are coming over to the united states on horses from europe, you know, like IT just like, why would they do that? Why would they use s uh, so so I think that's the argument against U. F.

O. Is being aliens in spacecraft now is a really cool technology that has the advanced capability and there the these crafts that are in our sky and someone has that technology. Maybe um but I am not sure about this general piece.

I think my sax uh I you obviously don't care so I just .

like I I have no .

way for this to increase the I R R of my fun or to me home.

There really UFO would be like an even bigger story like we'd all know that .

you know.

it's not going .

to be some like weird friends. Every single photograph that's been taken in the last year is absolutely recognizably Better than the one taken ten years ago. And every single photo or video of these alliance looks like IT was shot in a on a camera from one thousand nine .

hundred fifty on film that was left in some basement.

Meanwhile, meanwhile, pixar movies can create the ocean.

are shot of this show of the alien and fork high .

A N and we the end like, why can we get a shot of the until then.

I will be travel between my homes, live to tell I .

am living like this life, not in france. C, we will get cha boot in recalled.

I will tell you sex. I don't think you need to heart on the chess point anymore because I don't hear anyone making the case on the other side.

Just .

more yes.

yes, nick, of the tweet. So I like because, look, they take off, so insert .

quarter.

Here is inserted function now.

no, look, we're taking all this heat from these stupid reporters are talking about our donations. You like asking what are we up to outlook? We're very public about what we're up to.

but this is and there are .

been these tech billionaire does most of its read his things and my krigger and they've been donating money to to chase a budding and gas good is .

disappointing.

horrible. So I asked, I just said why you do money the sincere and dusty so defending IT, he said, I am you now because didn't didn't want to way.

Just in fairness, let me pull this up dust's quote, as I live in the city and i'm not going anywhere, crime happens to me to trust me. We write extacy about why of our grants here. You know, here's the thing. I think dustin read hastings um and uh their spouses are very involved in criminal justice reform and what we have to do is give somebody like destiny read hastings to benefit doubt here and say we understand your donations were meaningful to you and you wanted to uh maybe lower the incarceration of black people in jail for crimes that were not violent and we agree let's this conversation because not give them .

the best of the delme explain why. Okay, so so this is a good example. This retained thing is a good example. By the way, just today was annecy donated three million to gave a newsome um in any event so he look, he's on that side of the spectrum. By the way, there's a little back story there. I don't if you guys remember when there was pressure on the facebook board to kick Peter tear off back in two thousand sixteen IT was really that .

was some read hastings, the board number .

who push Peter off because couldn't handle the fact that there might be another board member who disagree with him politically. So it's a very close minded point of view. But let's take, let's take this example of crime in L A OK.

So we had this election where George gascon, who is a failure as da in server cisco, he goes down to L A and runs against the the veteran da down their jackie lacy, who happened to be a black woman, a veteran season D A competent nobody had a problem with her. I think he is a democrat. okay? It's not like this is a right wing person.

And so George gascon basically fails his way out of servant to go goes down to L A. And he basically um dislodges her from that seat with fifteen million dollars, an impressive amount of the election. Where did that money come from? Five million came from source.

Five million came from retains. Five million came from B. L. M. Now you in any other context, the idea that you're gonna fire a talented, competent season veteran black woman and replaced with an incompetent White male that would be seen as institutional racism. But nobody complained about IT at all, but it's outrageous.

What is there is the most .

charities ble hind .

that what is the most charitable view of why they're supporting gash gone and chess?

Well, there is dearmer ation agenda. And so yes, you're right that they see mass incarceration is a problem, but the problem IT is, but the solution is not masked arteria that we need something in between. And the problem with gas gone and chase a booting, they just want to let everybody out.

They don't want to put the also to want to add anybody. So I think if their agenda is to lower the number, adding people is against that. There are people who need to go to jail.

Mu need to go to ja, people dying everyday in civil csco um by at the hands of repeat offenders who chaser boogey has made the decision, let them out of jail, even though they should be in jail. These are dangerous, violent felons.

The problem with this is, I think cheap. I would like to get your feedback on IT is, you know you when a person gives these kind of donations and they make IT their public persona and IT doesn't go well, how does one, you know, I don't know this, entangle or reconcile? They made a bet that had a bad outcome, because this is obviously a bad outcome. You don't want the city to evolve in the chaos.

I don't particularly care about safran, csco, and I think I the .

the two you guys can .

talk about. IT, no, I going.

I didn't. three. Berg, I got .

nothing to say. OK, I want to just one thing look.

so I care, because I live there. But this trend, this is not just to go, this whole idea of these radical, dear, certain, they are running for da in in every major city. This is going to be a national trend, and they're onna cause a lot of carnage, love, death and destruction until the people realize. And there will never be a backlash to this, and hopefully just .

not to be people. Enough me to flip in my point is it's a really important debate. It's gonna happen in every city, but folks need to get engaged in those cities and do something about IT.

If you want to hear the argument of why this is happening, you can go watch the ted talk youtube of adam fox. F O, S. S. He was the original like proponent of the D A coming in to drive the dearth ation dearmer ation movements um and you know I just think it's important to be informed of the other perspective uh uh evaluating where folks are coming from that there are proponents for this movement yeah .

i'm trying to be charitable towards their position. Dustin and read if you want to come on the pod and be a best tiguas Y I guess may .

be respond to me said list we don't know what the counter factual is if we had a more aggressive D A, that was his of that. So I, of course, so I posted a list of people of innocent victims who've died. Okay, because directly, because of a decision that chase a building.

Mate, that's your count of factual. Yeah, that's your of fact. Alright.

listen, it's been an amazing episode and no plugs, no ads, no nothing. If you like the show, great. And if you don't like IT, how the hell did you make IT to the minute seventy five four, the queen of kwa, the dictator .

resolve. Humani having .

stake tonight.

Ight, i'm having beers tonight.

you having beers and roasted explanation that you you never eat and fish .

in your life never yeah should .

actually talk about sexy health.

Where is your first, second, third dinner tonight?

I'm a see food diet. I eat, I see the food. my.

If we take out your post mates flash, we .

take out right now, do you? 我看。

oh, my G, I mean, the fact guy on this part, I don't.

I just the machine I be happening is happening go week and I just got the hydro. So now I have tono paton trade and I got the hydro. I'm going from a smart machine to smart machine. Hi, are you? I got a extra.

O H, oh, good question.

No, no, no.

no comment. Okay, sorry. And are some .

great people other things to do?

Yeah, I get a salad. Okay, we love you, my business, a salad. And of course, the dictator here to.

On the. When complete by social life, at point, you figure whether you actually want your kids.

Free and.

Thousand firing.

king. The little guy getting run over.

Because IT was easy, everybody will be doing the overtime. This one man for yourself is all about you, you can figure out, and that's just not real. Anybody who listen to this, who wants to go to the french country, state or a bunch assault on whenever you're going to eat, okay, take a Better in the Michael in the mind drink IT, and then basically take fifty dollars on fire.

you IT.

Everybody do all the time. This one man for yourself, it's all about you. You can figure out the rocket individualism. That's just not.