We're sunsetting PodQuest on 2025-07-28. Thank you for your support!
Export Podcast Subscriptions
People
F
Fred Kaufman
M
Mary Roach
T
Tim Howard
W
Wim de Vole
Topics
Mary Roach: 我亲身参与了将手伸进活牛胃部的实验,这让我深刻地体会到胃部肌肉的强力收缩和内部环境的特殊性。胃部内部环境的温度、湿度以及食物的物理状态都给我留下了深刻的印象。这个体验与我在太平间或其他地方的经历完全不同,它让我对胃部的运作有了更直观的感受。 此外,通过对William Beaumont和Alexis St. Martin的故事的了解,我更加认识到早期对消化机制研究的艰难和突破。Beaumont的实验虽然在当时看来有些残忍,但却为我们打开了一扇了解消化系统运作机制的大门。 Tim Howard: 我将手伸进活牛胃部时,感受到了胃部肌肉强大的收缩力量,这让我对胃部作为消化器官的强大功能有了更深刻的认识。胃部内部环境的温度和湿度也给我留下了深刻的印象。 Jad Abumrad & Robert Krowich: 通过对William Beaumont和Alexis St. Martin故事的讲述,我们了解到在19世纪初期,人们对胃部消化过程知之甚少。Alexis St. Martin意外受伤后留下的胃部瘘孔,为Beaumont提供了前所未有的研究机会。Beaumont通过对St. Martin进行长达数年的实验,最终发现了胃液和酶在消化过程中的关键作用,并推翻了当时关于‘生命力’的理论。这不仅是医学史上的一个重大突破,也体现了科学探索的勇气和毅力。 此外,我们还探讨了人体消化系统的整体运作,以及肠道细菌在消化过程中的重要作用。 Fred Kaufman: 我认为胃是人体内神奇的转化中心,它将食物转化为我们自身的一部分。同时,人体是一个环面结构,因此胃部看似在我们体内,实际上却始终处于我们体外。这个独特的视角让我们对自身有了更深刻的理解。 Wim de Vole: 我设计的这个巨大的机械装置模拟了人体消化系统的运作过程,从食物进入到排出。这个装置清晰地展示了食物在各个消化器官中的变化过程,以及肠道细菌在消化过程中的重要作用。通过这个装置,我们可以更直观地了解人体消化系统的复杂性和神奇之处。

Deep Dive

Key Insights

What is a fistulated cow and why is it significant?

A fistulated cow has a hole in its side, called a fistula, which allows direct access to its stomach. This is significant because it enables researchers to study digestion in real-time by inserting their hands or instruments into the stomach. The practice began in agricultural schools and has provided valuable insights into how cows digest food, which is crucial for improving livestock health and nutrition.

What did Dr. William Beaumont discover through his experiments on Alexis St. Martin?

Dr. William Beaumont discovered that digestion is a chemical process driven by enzymes, not a mysterious 'vital force.' Through experiments on Alexis St. Martin, who had a permanent hole in his stomach, Beaumont observed the secretion of gastric juice containing enzymes that break down food. This was a groundbreaking revelation in the early 19th century, as it provided the first direct evidence of how the stomach digests food.

How did Alexis St. Martin end up with a hole in his stomach?

Alexis St. Martin was accidentally shot in the stomach in 1822, leaving a hole that never fully healed. The wound formed a fistula, a permanent opening that allowed Dr. William Beaumont to observe and experiment on his digestive process. This rare condition provided a unique opportunity to study human digestion in ways that were previously impossible.

What were some of the foods Dr. Beaumont tested in St. Martin's stomach?

Dr. Beaumont tested a wide variety of foods in St. Martin's stomach, including raw salted fat pork, corned beef, stale bread, cabbage, pigs' feet, animal brains, eggs (hard-boiled, soft-boiled, and fried), whipped eggs, baked custard, and carrot. He meticulously recorded how long each food took to digest, providing some of the first detailed data on human digestion.

What was the significance of the 'gastric juice' Beaumont observed in St. Martin's stomach?

The 'gastric juice' Beaumont observed was a clear, acidic fluid containing enzymes that break down food. This discovery proved that digestion is a chemical process, not reliant on a mysterious 'vital force.' Beaumont's experiments demonstrated that enzymes, which he called gastric juice, are the key to transforming food into nutrients the body can absorb.

How did Beaumont's experiments impact the understanding of digestion?

Beaumont's experiments revolutionized the understanding of digestion by proving it is a chemical process driven by enzymes. His work debunked the idea that digestion required a 'vital force' and laid the foundation for modern gastroenterology. His findings were published in a book in 1833, making him a pioneer in the field and earning him widespread recognition.

What was the relationship between Dr. Beaumont and Alexis St. Martin like?

The relationship between Dr. Beaumont and Alexis St. Martin was complex. Beaumont initially saved St. Martin's life after he was shot, but later exploited his condition for scientific experiments. St. Martin, who became increasingly irritable and resistant, eventually left but returned due to financial need. Beaumont saw St. Martin as both a patient and a scientific opportunity, while St. Martin was treated more as a medical curiosity than a person.

What is the significance of the mechanical gut at the Museum of Old and New Art?

The mechanical gut, created by Belgian artist Wim Delvoye, is a 40-foot-long reproduction of the human digestive system. It simulates the process of digestion, from ingestion to excretion, using a series of jars, tubes, and chemicals. The machine highlights the complexity of digestion and serves as both an artistic and scientific exploration of the human body.

Chapters
The episode starts with a playful introduction, then delves into the history of stomach research, highlighting the unusual methods employed by Mary Roach and early scientists to investigate the workings of the stomach. The human stomach is compared to a mysterious black box in the body.
  • Mary Roach's experience reaching into a fistulated cow's stomach.
  • The stomach as a site of magical transformation.
  • The human body as a torus.

Shownotes Transcript

Translations:
中文

Radio Lab for Kids is supported by the New York Hall of Science, a hands-on science center and STEM learning lab in New York City. Looking for summer day trips that make you feel like you are traveling through time and space?

Visit the Hall of Science for a stellar day with the whole family. The Great Hall, an iconic building created during the space age, gives the feeling of floating in deep space. Outside, see real NASA rockets, a Friendship 7 replica, outer space-themed mini-golf, and more. Plus, there's lots of hands-on exhibits inside, including a Mars rover. Visit nysci.org for more.

Radiolab for Kids is supported by IXL. IXL is an online learning program that helps to enrich homeschool curriculums, offering practice in math, science, social studies, and more. Their programs are designed to meet kids where they're at, helping them develop curiosity and determination all the way through 12th grade, no matter your child's learning style or knowledge level.

Ixl has built-in tools like video tutorials, detailed explanations, and learning games to guide your child in the way they learn best while meeting them at their level. Make an impact on your child's learning. Get Ixl now. Radiolab for Kids listeners can get an exclusive 20% off Ixl membership when they sign up today at ixl.com slash rlkids. Visit ixl.com slash rlkids to get the most effective learning program out there at the best price. ♪

Listener supported. WNYC Studios. Wait, you're listening? Okay. Alright. Okay. Alright. You're listening to Radiolab. Radio Lab. From WNYC. See? Yep. Hey there, Lulu here. Today we have a story about...

A cow. Only, it is a cow unlike any you have ever seen before. That is all I'm going to say, and I'll just move out of the way and hand it off to OG Radio Lab hosts, Jad Abumrad and Robert Krowich. Here we go. Hello. Hello.

We're going to start this show today with Mary Roach. Hey! Tim here. Hi, Tim. Hey, let me see if I can... Mary is one of our favorite authors, mostly because she kind of writes about stuff that's... Yucky. Gross. I'm the kind of person, if I find myself in an operating room for whatever I'm reporting on, I'm the kind of person where they'll be like, miserable.

Ms. Roach, you need to step back. Your head is actually inside the body cavity. And for her latest book? Called Gulp. She got really, really into and inside cows. Yeah, the fistulated cows that the agricultural schools have. And what's a fistulated cow? A fistula is an irregular anatomical passageway. And a fistulated cow has a hole right in its side. Sort of a

So that you can actually stick your hand into its side and reach all the way down. To the stomach. This is a living cow, right? It's a moving... This is a live cow. And you've done this? Yeah, it was. It was this amazing... Because really, you know, a cow is... She did it at the University of California, Davis. You're just... You're standing there sort of normally. And for some reason, I've worn...

a skirt and kitten heels. And my hosts are wearing manure-encrusted muck boots. And it's a source of great entertainment that I'm here. And it's packed really tightly. You got to really work your arm. The guy I was with, Ed DePeters, he's like, no, keep going, keep going. I'm like, I don't know, Ed. I'm not sure, really. Go further in? Yeah, keep going, keep going. And I'm literally up to my shoulder inside this cow.

I so want to do that. Where are you guys? We're in New York. Yeah, I know where there's one out there. I can get you a fistulated cow. You want to walk them down towards the barn and I'll go get the group? All right. I didn't actually get to do it, unfortunately, but we sent our producer, Tim Howard, out to Rutgers University. Come on in closer. Where a bunch of high schoolers had come to see Lily, the fistulated cow. Okay, let's give it a go. I'm going to pop the cork. All right.

Did he say cork? Yeah. You have to uncork the hole in the cow. See all the steam coming out? Ready? All right. This is Tim reaching his hand in. Go straight across the top to the far side. Okay. Oh, my God. It's powerful in there. Oh, God. I mean, I was a little worried it was going to break my hand. You mean like pressure? Yeah.

It's a very muscular organ. It's squeezing my arm. Mixing and... Wow, I can feel the side of the stomach pushing against me. Squeezing and contracting and... Wow. It's really squeezing. It's groping you back. I'm stuck. So I'm just going to try to go a little bit deeper. And it's hot. It's steamy. It's bubbly. It's physical. It's very...

Yeah. And she is so calm right now. I can't believe it. The cow's bored, and I've got this look on my face like I've seen God or something. I'm like, whoa! Mary says that for all her times in morgues and all the places she's been, this one was really different. It was the expression I was wearing I'm sure I've never had cause to use. And here's why.

If you think about it, the stomach is a center of magical transformation. That is Fred Kaufman, who wrote a whole book about the stomach. You take something outside of your body, you put it in your body, and it turns into you. So it's like this conduit between what's outside you

And what's inside? The other thing that's weird is that the human body is a torus. We're donuts. We've got a hole going through the middle of us, all the way through us. So what seems to be inside us, what seems to be inside our stomach, actually is always outside us. Oh, this is getting so deep.

You don't like the doors? No, I think it's great. I think I'll go with it. Because I was thinking we could start that way. Because that's what we're kind of doing this hour. We're going to take this thing that's deep inside us. And turn it inside out. Yeah. I'm Jad Abumrad. I'm Robert Krowich. This is Radiolab. And today, guts. That mystery that lies between our mouth. And our butts. We are these sacks of guts.

And these skeletons, and we walk around, and we never even see them. And for centuries, nobody really knew what's going on in there. But then something happened that opened up a window. Yeah. Do you want to start back at the beginning of it? Yeah, let's once upon a time it. Okay.

So, once upon a time, it all begins. And when is this? They first met in 1822. Once upon a time in 1822, there was a guy named William Beaumont. William Beaumont is a farm boy from Lebanon, Connecticut, five brothers and six sisters. And William clearly is the smart one. He was the one with the big dreams.

So at an early age, he leaves home and gets himself a job as a doctor. An army doctor. Up north. At Fort Mackinac, which is this, it's a trading post, basically. So Beaumont, he has a little doctor's office at the top of this hill. And at the bottom, there's a general store. One day. June 6th, 1822. Normal morning. All the fur traders come in and are unloading and loading. Getting their coffee, salted meat. Supplies to go out. Traps and fur. When all of a sudden, boom!

Right outside the shop. Somebody's gun went off. Somebody calls Beaumont. Beaumont dashes out the door. Runs down the hill. Finds this guy. This 18-year-old kid. Really in bad shape. He's a big guy. Muscular. But he's covered in blood. And he has a hole right below his ribcage. About the size of the palm of a grown man's hand. This is what Beaumont sees when he shows up. This is what Beaumont sees. And the other thing Beaumont sees is food.

coming out of his stomach. Meat and bread and coffee. Yeah. Basically the remnants of his breakfast spilled out. On the ground, right in front of him. You can kind of see the gears turning in Beaumont's head as if he's thinking, well, there it is. Digestion in action. Which was kind of disgusting, but it was also something of a revelation because in 1822, the stomach was an area of mystery.

Just like today we're aware the brain is an area of mystery. And for centuries, people believed that the stomach, more broadly the gut,

was in a very real way the center of our beings. Yes, in Puritan times, the bowels are the seat of human sympathy. You know, where our deepest feelings come from. If you have bowels for somebody, that means you sympathize with them. Oh, is that something people would say? Absolutely. Oh, we should bring that term back. That's very interesting. Yeah, I have bowels for you. Point is, medical science was pretty fuzzy in what happens down there. I mean, they knew it was important, but they had no idea how it worked. Like, how does food work?

us. Nobody understood it. Because they can't see. You can't directly observe it without opening the person up. But here was a guy open right up. But of course, Beaumont is a doctor, so he's like, wait, I've got to save this guy. So he starts sewing him up frantically. Pretty sure this fellow's not going to make it. And he was surprised that two days later the guy was alive.

Really surprised. And as the months passed, this kid... St. Martin. That was his name, Alexis St. Martin. He gets better, but... A year later, he still has this hole in his stomach. The hole never closes. What happened is he grew a fistula. Just like the cow we talked about earlier, except in this case, he didn't have a cork where he was wounded. He had a flap of skin covering the hole. If you wanted to, you could just pull back the flap and look inside. And we don't know if Beaumont left it that way on purpose...

What we do know is that he sees an opportunity. To make the body give up its secrets. He sees he's got something that nobody else has. Maybe he even thinks. This man could be my ticket out of being a lowly Fort Mackinac doctor. So Beaumont kind of hires him as a man around his house. As a manservant. You know, he said, oh, it was a charitable thing. I wanted to help him. Yeah, because it couldn't work. And I'm thinking, oh, maybe, maybe not. And so about a year later, he starts. Come on in.

he starts his experiments. Oh my Lord, this is straight out.

While reporting this story, we ended up visiting the rare book room at the New York Academy of Medicine, which is pretty much the coolest room ever. It's all mahogany, and they've got ancient skulls sitting on top of bookshelves, and the books are hundreds and hundreds of years old. In any case, the librarian Arlene Shainer showed us around and then put on some white gloves, disappeared between some stacks, and came out with a little purple book. Beaumont's Observations.

Experiment one is on August 1st, 1825. So at 12 o'clock, I introduced through the perforation into the stomach the following articles of diet. So what he does is he takes different foods. A piece of raw salted fat pork. Some corned beef, you know, like a one-inch square of corned beef. A piece of stale bread. And he attaches them to a silk string and he inserts them. Through the artificial opening into the stomach. Into the stomach. And I help the...

For an hour. And he takes it out and he records, you know. So it was an hour later. How much was digested. Withdrew and examined them. Found the cabbage and bread about half digested. The pieces of meat. This went on for hours. Returned them into the stomach.

At 2 o'clock p.m., withdrew them again. In hours. Returned them into the stomach again. For years. Over the next few years, Beaumont puts anything he can possibly think of into that stomach. Pigs' feet soused take an hour. Animal brains boiled take an hour and 45 minutes. Fresh eggs hard-boiled take three hours and 30 minutes.

Soft-boiled take three hours. Fresh eggs fried take three hours and 30 minutes. Look, it's just the totality of food in America at that point. Whipped eggs take an hour and a half. He's trying everything. Baked custard takes two hours and 45 minutes. Oh my God, that goes on for pages. Goes on and on. Alexis St. Martin is...

becoming increasingly irritable about this whole process. I would imagine. Because a lot of times the things that Beaumont would stick into his stomach would make him sick, give him... So in 1825, three years after this all started, St. Martin finally bolts, goes back to Canada, gets married, even has a few kids. All the while...

Beaumont is writing him letters, trying to lure him back. And he was offering him, OK, I'll pay for your family. OK, I'll give you $50 a year. OK, I'll give you $75. I mean, he kept ending. He's like, I'll throw in the land. Because, you know, he still wanted to know. All right, fine. It takes three hours and 15 minutes to digest a carrot. Oyster soup, three and a half hours. Or soup, whatever. But how does it work? How does the stomach do it?

And eventually, because he needs the money, Alexis St. Martin does come back. Beaumont starts his experiments again. And one night, while Beaumont is peering into the boy's stomach...

He gets his answer. He says he applies a few crumbs of bread to the inner surface of the stomach. Immediately afterwards, small, sharp papillae became visible. He saw little pimples form on the wall of the stomach. And out of the pimples? Exuded a clear, transparent liquor. Outsquirt some juice. Outsquirt some juice. ♪

And that was it. That's the magic juice. Clear, almost transparent. Tasted a little saltish and acid. Ooh. When applied to the tongue. Yeah. Tasting. A lot of tasting went on. And then... He would collect...

the stomach acid and see if you could digest outside the body. There was this theory that the body had this vital force and that that was necessary for the bodily processes including digestion. So if you took the stomach acid out, what would happen? December 14th, 1829, at 1 o'clock p.m., I took one and a half ounces of gastric juice fresh from the stomach

put into it 12 drams recently salted beef boiled. The theory at the time was it wouldn't work. You had to have the magical powers of the human body. But digestion commenced. Beaumont, one of his big discoveries was, no you don't. That actually there are no secret forces of sympathy and excitement driving things. It's a chemical. That's what it's all about.

Now, Beaumont didn't know it, but that juice he was seeing? Which he called gastric juice. Those are enzymes. And what enzymes are are like little chemical scissors. They break down food so that you can take something in from the outside, like this carrot, and absorb it. It becomes literally a part of you. The key to the whole thing, the key to life, are enzymes. In a way, they are the magical force.

Just in chemical form. That's it. That's the truth. He was the first to understand it, the first to see it, the first to figure out the method of how to prove it. And he proved it.

So Beaumont writes a book about this. And this book is published in 1833. And he becomes famous. People were fascinated by Beaumont's experiments. He would kind of go on these tours. He's called over to Yale University. Gets invited to speak in Europe with his, you know, wherever he goes, he brings his gastric juice and he lectures there. From the dude's stomach? Yeah, yeah, he travels around with it. And whenever he could, he would take St. Martin with him. St. Martin was his PowerPoint.

You know, he's like, I need you, man. I need you on the stage so everybody else can come up and stick their tongue in your stomach. For William Beaumont, this works out pretty great. He's thought of as this, you know, tremendous contributor to the understanding of digestion. As for Alexis St. Martin... He was a curiosity. He was a medical curiosity.

Thanks to Arlene Shainer at the New York Academy of Medicine and Fred Kaufman, who wrote a book called A Short History of the American Stomach. And a special thanks to Mary Roach. Her forthcoming book is called Gulp, A Trip Down the Elementary Canal. We'll be back in a moment.

All right, we're back. On with the story.

No, no, I won't do that. While we were making the show, we ended up sending this reporter, Joel Reinberger. So when's the actual feeding going to happen? To Tasmania, of all places. Coming into the room now. To a museum. The Museum of Old and New Art.

It smells like maybe a toilet's backed up. Perhaps a small child has thrown up into a pot plant and nobody's cleaned it up. Because at this museum, they've got a mechanical reproduction of the human gut. Looks like a factory device. It really does. Made by a Belgian guy named Wim de Vole. Hello, Wim. Hello, hello. And the machine... Cloaca new and improved. ...is gigantic. It's 10 feet tall, 40 feet long, but it's essentially...

A series of jars. Six large glass jars. Like 25 gallons each. Pipes coming in and out of them. Surrounded by this tangle of tubes and wires. Motors and regulators. Like a giant chemistry set. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. Now, take us from the start. Tell me about the process that the food goes through. So here's basically how it works.

Climb up these stairs on one end, about nine feet of stairs, until you get to... Sort of a mixing bowl type apparatus. You get to this bowl which has got a hole in it. You can take, say, a sandwich and toss it in. In goes the sandwich, washed down with a little water. The sandwich then gets kind of chopped up by this garbage disposal. Yeah, that's just the churro. Just like with us. It's kind of the mouth of the machine, which takes it in and throws it to the first jar. First one's stomach. Where it meets a bunch of acid and bile. The edge control.

And the sandwich turns to mush. That is orangey or pinkish or yellowy brown color. Next step, the mush gets shuttled into the next set of jars. Next two ones are the intestines. Where it mixes with... A collection of so many different enzymes. That break the sandwich down some more. Next! On to the fourth bottle. What's happening in this one? This is the cola. Mmm.

Okay, if you want to talk about the real mystery of the human gut, it's right here. Not the stomach, it's the colon. Because in the colon you get... Bacteria. And this bacteria do unbelievable things. In any case, just to finish off the tour... Past all the glass jars... The other end of the machine... Is another large piece of apparatus, except this one, on a conveyor belt, rolls out very neatly what looks like to me maybe a St. Bernard-sized turd.

Now some lasagna. Oh, that's easy. Yeah, this one's fine. All right, that'll do it for today. I'm sorry we got a little gross there. I promised coming up next time we are not gross at all. In fact...

Real special, we've got a brand new terrestrials coming up just in advance of the Lunar New Year. We will be diving deep into the history and science of one of the animals associated with the Lunar New Year. So we hope you'll stick around on the feed and check back in two weeks to hear that story. I'm really excited for it.

Thank you, as always, for listening. Next thing you eat, consider the magical journey that that food is on and catch you in a couple spins for this lumpy old planet of ours.

Thanks. Bye.

Start of message. This is John Reiner. Radiolab is produced by Jad Abumrad. Jad Abumrad. Our staff includes Ellen Horn, Soren Wheeler, Pat Walters, Tim Howard, Brenna Farrell, Dylan Keefe, Lynn Levy, and Sean Cole with help from Matt Kielty, Rachel James, Brendan McMullen, and Rafaela Benin.

Hi, I'm Emma, and I live in Portland, Maine. Here are the staff credits. Radiolab was created by Jad Abumrad and is edited by Soren Wheeler. Lulu Miller and Latif Nasser are our co-hosts.

Dylan Keefe is our Director of Sound Design. Our staff includes Simon Adler, Jeremy Bloom, Becca Bressler, W. Harry Fortuna, David Gable, Maria Paz Gutierrez, Sindhu Jnanasambandam, Matt Kielty, Annie McEwen, Alex Neeson, Valentina Powers, Sara Khari, Sarah Sandbach, Arianne Wack, Pat Walters, and Molly Webster. Our fact-checkers are Diane Kelly, Emily Krieger, and Natalie Middleton. ♪