Hermes Homerica: They're Making an Odyssey Movie & We Have Thoughts
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with the personal price plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability, amount of discounts and savings, and eligibility vary by state. Well. Hi. Hello. It's uncomfortable. Thank you. That's helpful. Well, listeners, this is a New Year's Eve special episode that will almost certainly be on video if I can stand it.

And also is recorded on my phone's microphone, so bear with us. Because Mikayla's in town, and so we decided to try video. But we're here for a really specific reason, and that is... Moment of silence? To talk about the Christopher Nolan Odyssey announcement. Okay.

This episode is an experiment. It is on video and we're going to record it or release it as a just audio. Yeah. Uh, the video will not go up at the same time as the audio. So if you're listening to it and you want to watch video, wait like two days because we got stuff to do and we're recording this like 10 hours before it has to come out on the podcast feed. So the video will be a minute. Um, but Michaela just happened to be in town and then they announced Christopher Nolan's Odyssey and I am trying to be kind and

In general, I would say, okay. I don't know quite how to begin this because I just don't know. That's okay. I understand. So many opinions. Let's begin with... Yeah. It's exciting that The Odyssey is being remade in a big budget movie. That is specifically The Odyssey. The Odyssey. The book itself and it's not sort of like a...

Or, like, a little subsection. Like, it seems to, it seems like it's, they're going to try to do the whole thing. Yeah. To an extent, in whatever way that Troy, I have a feeling it's going to be like Troy. Yes. That Troy was the Iliad. But it's not sort of, like, inspired by the Odyssey. No. Or, like, it is, it's an Odyssey. They're calling it an Odyssey adaptation. Yes. Which is exciting. Mm-hmm. And Christopher Nolan, I would say, broadly, is exciting. I saw somebody comment on some article I was reading. Mm-hmm. And they commented that, like, also we're drinking. Mm-hmm.

Thanks. They commented that like the Odyssey generally is a really perfect Christopher Nolan movie because it plays around with time and unreliable narration and all of this stuff which I think is so true and like I think therefore it has the potential to be really interesting. Like I do think generally other than my own now I have so much trouble with all Western Hollywood like I just feel like it's so whitewashed and this is not making that opinion any less. And so just generally like

Just having this movie attached to, like, just deeply Western. He's British, I think? Christopher Nolan? You know what? He's British or American. Either way. If you were going to ask me to name a Christopher Nolan film, I couldn't. Really? I don't watch movies. So I don't even. Like, I know the names. But, like. Yeah. I probably have seen a Christopher Nolan. You've seen his Batmans. Those are good. No, I haven't. Oh, those are actually good. Which Batmans are they? The Christopher. I was going to say the Christopher Nolan ones. The Christian Bale ones.

I've seen the one with Keith Ledger. I've seen that movie. That's a Christopher Nolan movie. Okay, I haven't seen any of those. Okay, well all of the Christian Bale Batmans are good, I will say. Okay. However...

But it would be nice to see. Did he do Inception? Yeah. Okay. Which is very, like, I think Inception is the one where people are connecting it most to the Odyssey because it's like, yeah, playing with time and unreliable narrators and all that. Like, Batman is a bad example of a Christopher Nolan movie because it was Batman. But, like, Inception, Interstellar, like, those ones. I feel like Oppenheimer was also him, right? Maybe. Maybe.

Frankly, I don't care. But it'll be really interesting because that's the thing I like about The Odyssey is that it's set up as... Yeah. You know, you get the beginning where you see Talmac is dealing with all his business, his drama, his woes. And then you meet Odysseus and it is... You are given the story of what happened through his lens. Yeah. And that's what I really enjoy about The Odyssey. Well, and it is unreliable narrator, which I really think...

I think overall, it would be really, really interesting to see a Christopher Nolan adaptation of The Odyssey. And you can hear the butt coming. Because overall, that's a really, really interesting concept. Generally, if the announcement was just Christopher Nolan is adapting The Odyssey, I'd be like, ooh, actually, I'm interested in that. Actually, I think that could be really good. Actually, I'm really interested. But then they cast Matt Damon.

They might not. It may have been a lot. Matt Damon might not be on Odysseus. Maybe he'll be Athena. Oh, he did make it worse. Maybe he's not. So the speculation to anyone who hasn't already read this news. The speculation. So the cast has announced. It seems like the cast is official. What they haven't announced officially is who's playing who. So we just have these actors. And so there's been a lot of speculation about who's going to play who. But the number...

The number one male actor who's been cast is Matt Damon. Yeah. I think it sounds like someone was like, what if you decided to make a joke, satirical cast of The Odyssey? Who would be the big Hollywood actor who's the least appropriate to play Odysseus? If you were to guess the least appropriate...

Spirit. Spirit. Okay, they're not going to say Spirit. Spirit the horse is going to be a disuse. The only frame of reference apparently for Matt Damon is Good Will Hunting and Spirit the horse, which I think says a lot about her connection with movies over the last 20 years. I just learned today he played Spirit. Yeah, I've never seen Spirit. I know nothing about it except that it's about a horse. A hot horse? It's a hot horse. It's complicated. Well, I mean, I've seen Robin Hood. It's fine. Yeah, fair enough. But Matt Damon as Odysseus, truly, I really...

If you are working with this movie and you're listening, I promise I'm actually really excited. I will take your money. I will. I will promote it. That would be great. I'm with the premiere. That would be fine. I'm extremely excited for it, though, I will say. But in the way that I was also so extremely excited for Gladiator 2, knowing that my...

degree or like my what i study is not actually going to help me as much as i'd like to think but do you mean that they did not historically put great white sharks in the coliseum no they absolutely did are you kidding no they did not they did in our modern world i know this is not about gladiator 2 but it could be um this was emperor for 10 minutes official sponsor of the show gladiator 2 no but for real gladiator 2 was actually pretty enjoyable it's just that there were great white sharks

In the Coliseum. And what's funny to me about this particular fact about Gladiator 2, and then we will go back to talking about the Odyssey, is that my knowledge that makes me so furious about that scene is actually completely unrelated to the ancient world and entirely related to sharks. But to this day, in the year 2024... God bless us all.

Never have humans been able to successfully keep a great white in captivity. No, they have not. So you're trying to tell me that they did it in the Colosseum? Look, we didn't know how to make Roman concrete for a very long time, so it's very, very possible that they know about the secret to the great white. It is absolutely not. I'm just saying, what do we know that the great white empire didn't know how to make Roman white sharks? I'm offended.

in any case this is not about what i'm saying which was again a pretty good movie australia oscar isaac he's not invited or two pedro pascal was incredibly cast he's still my beating heart him as a vicious oh my god yes that would be delightful oh my god it was good but like the thing that i like about these movies is how

fun they are. I mean, the thing is, I find that with Troy, because Troy is so old that it can be like that, but when it's coming out now, it's like this fresh whitewashing of the ancient world in a way that's like, okay, so we haven't even gotten into it because I'm so worked up about it. So the official cast, as announced from my memory, because I read like one article and then honestly, like my friend...

Somehow, the first person I heard this from was actually a good friend of mine and not a listener. But then, of course, I opened up my Instagram and people were like, Laith, if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all. And I'm saying stuff anyway. But, like, this is the official announcement. And again, they haven't assigned, like, who's playing who. They've just announced these actors. So we have Matt Damon. Tom Holland. No, I like that one, though. Yeah, well, we'll get into that. We'll get into why that could be okay if it wasn't for Matt Damon. Zendaya.

Which is great, cool, they're in it together, that's nice, except for when we get to speculation and then you go, oh god, weird. No, Anne Hathaway I think is going to be Penelope and Hathaway's the other one. But what if? No, people are speculating that she's going to be like Calypso, which is so weird, and then like one's partner is like sexing with his dad? But wouldn't it be worse if she was Penelope and that was his mom? Well, but age-appropriate is she literally couldn't be. Yeah, but it's Hollywood. I mean, I guess it's fucking bad. It's Hollywood. Like, it's...

Anne Hathaway, Lupita Nyong'o, who's amazing, great. And anyone else? That's who I can remember right now. That's who matters, quite frankly. Because the speculation is that magic with Odysseus, which again, like, shoot me off into the moon! I'm sorry, Matt Damon, if you see this. I'm not sorry, Matt Damon. You can handle it. You're fine. You're fine. I loved you in spirit.

I loved you in absolutely nothing. Um... We got this. Like, I just... I'm excited this is video, honestly. We're the first video podcast of this... The first Let's Talk O'Bits Baby episode that's on video ever. It's just me going, I want to see it. No, it's so fair. But, like, it's funny, because, like, this is a cast that if my life were different, I would just be like, okay...

But the thing for me, the reason why, and I, when my friend texted me this, like I, it, when I say that it ruined my night, like I'm only being like this dramatic. Like most of that is true. It honestly, like it brought me down to this degree where it's just like. It made me laugh.

Yeah, I texted Mikayla and she was just like cackling at my discomfort. Because you sent me a whole voice message. I sat on the same bed for like three and a half minutes and I was just crying. Oh, I'm glad. Yeah, I recorded a three minute voice note to Mikayla because I didn't know how to tell her this news in any other way. Yeah, I loved it. It was great. Maybe we could include it at the end of this podcast.

It might be. If WhatsApp saved it, maybe you'll hear it text on the end. It's definitely saved. It's definitely saved. I definitely have it. No, yeah, the Matt Damon of all is questionable. Truly. Because also, like, so the speculation, like, I read this article on Gizmodo. And so there was some speculation on Gizmodo. And I honestly think that the speculation is I can't actually think of an alternative. Oh, Shirley Starr is the other one.

Shirley Serrett. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Is the name I forgot. So the speculation of this, specifically the Skizmodo article was like matching. I can't say it without laughing. Tom Holland as Telemachus. Where did they go? What? Yeah. Well, we don't know. But do you want to know? Okay, so hold on. The guy who falls off the die. He would kill it.

be really good. I would legit, if that, honestly, if Robert Pattinson was cast as the guy who falls off the roof and then comes to Odysseus in the underworld, I'd be like, dude, fuck off! Like, I would be thrilled, actually. That would be brilliant. He is great. He's so good. For sure, no, like, honestly, the thing about this cast is I'm not mad about it overall. I'm mad about Matt Damon. I will, I'll never come around. That's fine. I'm fucking furious. I'm letting you have it.

Not even so much furious as I am, like, just so disappointed in Christopher Nolan for not having sense. For not having... For any... Like, if I was to guess a satirical cast of The Odyssey featuring, like, Hollywood's top actors, like, only then would I cast Matt Damon. I've been joking with my friends that the only person worse is Ben Affleck, but they are interchangeably...

They were interesting people. But then, yeah, McKillop made a really great point that, like, what with the Phoenix statue of a doll. This is a man with a Phoenix tattoo on his back. Like, he actually would be a better Odysseus. And so the idea of saying that Matt Dane, or that Ben Affleck would be a better Odysseus than the man cast as Odysseus is, like... I just think of those pictures of him where he just looks tired and he's supposed to be a singer. No, 100%. That's the thing.

And I think that that is, like, makes it all so much sadder. Because that's the movie we're gonna get. Like, again, Ben Affleck, apparently, I'm hoping... If Ben Affleck gets attached to this movie, I'm honestly going on strike. Like, I don't know. Maybe the show ends. Maybe. No, I'm saying if they add Ben Affleck. Oh. Because there's been a lot of... I've been told...

Laura Jenkinson-Brown of Greek Myth Comics, who's also been on the show, and she's going to come back to talk about the Odyssey more than this, actually. We had a whole plan to talk about Stephen Fry's Odyssey, and then this happened, and I was like, well, I guess we have to talk. Anyway, Laura and I were talking, and she kept mixing up Ben Affleck. I jokingly told her that, like, if the only thing worse would be Ben Affleck, and then she kept mixing up, like, who was actually cast, and we went, like, back and forth with, like, because they're interchangeable white men. But, like,

To me, Ben Affleck being cast as Odysseus is, I mean, it's stupider even than Brad Pitt as Achilles, which, because Brad Pitt, like, owned that at least. No, Brad Pitt was kind of the good, at the time, though, in Hollywood. Yeah. That's what I'm saying, because he was pretty boring. He was top-notch. He was that character even in Hollywood. He's not even at his height. Like, even if we're doing Christopher Nolan, like, it sounds like he's, you know, he's cast it with, like, his favorite people, right? Like, most of these people are repeats for him. Yeah.

And even still, like, I can think of Christopher Nolan-related actors who would be better. Like, I could think of a bazillion of them. Like, there are just...

So many actors better for Odysseus than Matt Damon. Literally all of them. No. But in seriousness, this cast is horribly depressing in terms of, like, broadly whitewashing. I realize I didn't actually get where this is so rambly because I don't know how to handle it, but this is a New Year's Eve episode and I'm thrilled we were able to provide it. But...

So yeah, so the other casting that this speculated was Zendaya as Calypso, which again, unhinged! But who else would she play? There's no young woman. No. Other than presumably Calypso, who's, you know, an imp. I mean, you can vaguely have, like, Athena played as a young woman, because she... Yeah, but then the speculation definitely, like, Charlize Theron as Athena, if we're doing, if we're putting gods in it, which...

Jenks Laura of Greek Myth Comics, she speculates that it'll be like the Iliad or like Troy where they don't put the gods in, which is horribly depressing. The Schismodo, getting back to the Schismodo, so they speculated again that Charlize Theron would play Athena, that Anna Hathaway would play Penelope. I actually could see that, but I could see it. So here's something about... I think Charlize Theron would do a better job as Penelope than Anna Hathaway. Absolutely. I think Charlize Theron might be the best casting in this movie. And like,

And again, Tom Holland as Telemachus without Matt Damon is great. I actually think he could play an amazing Telemachus. But with another actor as Odysseus. It's about a dad. Yes. About a daddy. But truly, this casting feels to me like we've gone back in time. Like...

like all of the growth we've had maybe is that I've believed we've had as a society in terms of classical reception, like that all of that is gone. Like this makes gladiator to casting lily white British guys as Syrian Tunisian, Syrian Libyan emperors, like the whitest men you've ever seen in your life. It makes that look like not so bad because these, the casting is like,

I want to say it's so American. I recognize that a lot of these people are not American, but it's so white colonial. It's just also very, very the who's who of Hollywood. Exactly. It feels more like let's put these names into a movie versus let's find an actor who will play this role. It's like Mad Libs of Hollywood actors. It doesn't feel to me like serious casting based on the roles. It feels like casting based on fame. Yes. Yeah. And I wish I was surprised, but...

But, no. But we also need movies like this every once in a while because they're ridiculous. It's just... I'm sorry, it's the Odyssey. That's the thing. That's my thing. Is it could be literally any other ancient Greek thing, probably. And I wouldn't be so upset. And, like...

I honestly can't think of a Matt Damon as a enthusiast without laughing. And the thing that is affecting me so personally, and this is me very selfishly complaining about my life, is that I am going to have to spend the next... Oh, also it's coming out literally on...

It's coming out like almost my birthday to the day. It's coming out like two days before my birthday, which is also like the eight year anniversary of this podcast. I think so. Yeah. That's so soon. I know it might, maybe it's 2026. Okay. Either way, it's set for July 17th. Happy birthday to me. Literally my friend who was with me when I got the news, she literally just turned to me and said, happy birthday. Um,

No, but like it's, I don't even know where I was going with that because I'm just so horrified. Oh no, my personal complaint is that I'm going to have to spend the next however many months fielding, like I love listeners interacting with me about this stuff, but it tends to be that I get asked like 30 times every couple of months, like when this stuff is coming out.

Have you heard about this? Yeah. And like, and that's fine. And normally I'm like, yeah, I have like, that's fine. Thank you for telling me again. But like, this one is just going to be a constant reminder of how sad I am that Matt Damon is playing Odysseus. I truly, truly don't think like, I think I'm so lost in how poorly cast Matt Damon is. And I can't imagine a worse actor to play Odysseus. Matt Damon as Odysseus.

I just love how incensed you are. I know. Like, it's, like, truly upsetting to you. Oh, yeah. I know. I think it is so funny. I'm legitimately upset. Like, I'm laughing about it because I...

It's so funny. I've wanted an Odyssey adaptation forever. I have spent eight years of this podcast, like, joking about a Sean Bean Odyssey, about how, like, the Odyssey we never got after Troy, about how, like, the Odyssey would make, like, an incredible epic. And then we get it and it's Matt Damon? Yeah.

I take back everything I ever said about wanting an Odyssey adaptation because that is a joke. And if we really do have Zendaya cast as Calypso, like, that's unhinged. It's, yeah, it's a little too... Like, those two should stop and be like, let's look at the work we're doing. Let's think about these characters a bit beyond... Especially because if they're going to play up the fucking...

um unreliable narrative about it all like Matt Damon is like too reliable Kierke get so like oh that was something yeah Lupita Nyong'o is the one they're speculating as being Cersei which also having the two women of color play these like seductress divinities on these islands like that's gross and then and then the white American of Anne Hathaway and Matt Damon is like

They're the least Greek-looking people ever. And I know that Hollywood has this complete inability to wrap their heads around the fact that if they look in Greek mythology, they should probably look at Greek people or at least Mediterranean people and not like lily-white Americans. But even if they have to go for lily-white Americans...

on Anne Hathaway. I have no complaints against Anne Hathaway. She's a good actress. She's not Penelope, though. No, she's a little too... All the women in the Odyssey are some of the... I mean, like, generally, women we get in Homer are very intelligent, well-rounded, complex women, but we are seeing them through this male perspective. And especially when we look at the Odyssey, like,

Calypso and Cersei, you thought, is so... I mean, Calypso is a bit... I don't... Goddess of it all. But Cersei is... She's so complex. Yes. And she's so much more than just this... Well, and Lupita Nyong'o as Cersei would be incredible if they weren't...

making the women of color yeah these characters like like if there were a but if it was an actually diverse cast as ancient mediterranean should always fucking be like if it was actually diverse and you know lupita nyong'o was like one woman of color amongst many playing cersei she'd be incredible yeah like i'm actually in terms of casting amazing but when you look at the casting of women of color maybe as only these like divine seductresses that's when it gets ick this is

but I think she would actually make an amazing Penelope.

This is it.

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Because Penelope is. Oh, she would make a great Penelope. Smart, intelligent. She could be Penelope. I would love to see her as Penelope.

I love Anne Hathaway. But maybe she could do it. She could be outside of what we normally see her doing. That would be good. Anne Hathaway as Penelope is predictable in a not interesting way. But that could play on our expectations really well. Penelope is such an amazing character where she is this woman that is

just handling her shit so well and having to deal with all these decisions by these men around her and she has to live in this world and she plays it so well and that she is really running the show in a lot of ways and it's amazing and I would love to see that Penelope Lupita as Penelope would be incredible

But the thing is that I think we can be fairly certain that's not happening given they've cast Tom Holland as we can only assume Telemachus because who else would he be? Oh, that reminds me of the fucking ADHD of it all. The Gizmodo suggested because they seem to believe that the gods would be involved which would be really cool but also this person for Gizmodo I'm not certain has read the Odyssey just like maybe Googled who was in it or like broadly because they suggested that Robert Pattinson could play. Are you ready? Take a guess actually.

I'm guessing it's a god based one are you guessing? Yeah. So if I have to guess what god Robert Pattinson would be, I would want it to be... But also think about how many gods are in the Odyssey. Oh no. Because the answer is zero.

Yeah, I know, that's the problem. That's like, we have Athena. That's the issue. That's it. And we have her just in the beginning being Telemachus' dad. Yeah. But if I'm just thinking of Greek gods and what god I'd want to see Robert Pattinson as, and this is not me being biased, but I'd love to see him as Hermes. Interesting. I could see that. I could see him being a really good Apollo. Oh, yeah. But like, Hermes is such a silly, goofy guy. Well, and I think he could be a really good shitty Apollo.

You know? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like he could. But this person is like, that's Zeus' son. Exactly. Yes, yes. The speculation was that he would play Poseidon, which is hilarious because Poseidon is not in the Odyssey.

he's referenced in the he just kind of like makes some waves he's a concept yes he's almost never personified in anything what if robert pattinson plays on the cyclops i don't know that would be great that would be absolutely down if they like cgi'd robert pattinson with one eye and enormous and just make some polyphemus and make him like really sympathetic because polyphemus is legit sympathetic like that would be great

The thing is, is that like based on this casting, I don't think they're going to do anything creative. I think it's going to be exactly as you expect. I think it's going to be the most predictable Western whitewashed version of the Odyssey. I would love to be wrong, to be clear. And like, yes,

I this is funny that we're even recording this because like there are so many pieces of reception that people ask me to talk about all the time. I as a rule don't like to shit on reception because I think all of it all of it is worthwhile and it's interesting and I don't like to insult other people's work or just like I don't want to ever like be a.

complain about another person's art because I think that that's just like wrong or but like and I think there's a lot about art that is personal so what touches you is is is something that's inside of you exactly it's why I don't call it on books because I don't want to ruin it for anyone who likes it if I don't like it that doesn't matter if I don't like this you know another person who hears it is like oh they don't like something that

Yeah, and I don't like to do that. But I'll tell you where I'm sitting right now. I think Matt Damon as Odysseus is unhinged. You know, if you identify as Matt Damon as Odysseus, maybe you should talk to some people. I don't know. I think you should read The Odyssey. I think that if you think that Matt Damon could play a good Odysseus, you need to read The Odyssey. Now, if you think it's funny, I'm all for it. Absolutely. If they were playing this for comedy and he was going to be like a doofy Odysseus, like,

who is, like, a messy loser who lets all of his men die, then, like, maybe Matt Damon could be good. But I am willing to bet a comfortable hundred dollars that that is not how they will play this. Because it's Christopher Nolan. Because it's Matt Damon. Because it's, they want to turn it into this big, epic, and, oh, they want to play up the CGI and the jumps and the rows of it all. And the idea of Matt Damon playing that Odysseus? Yeah. No, that's really the only reaction. I love it!

Was in We Bought a Zoo. Do we all remember? Well, with Scarlett Johansson, he bought a zoo. It's a terrible movie. Okay, you know, it's fine. It's based on a book. It's fine. It's not a good movie. I just think Matt Damon is the most basic white man. I just think he is. He's a blank slate of a white man.

And he's the least Mediterranean looking. Yeah, that's, like, that's, yeah. He's so not Mediterranean. Odysseus is, I don't like Odysseus. I think you know this. You know how I feel about Odysseus. Odysseus is a bad dad. He's really bad. He's a piece of shit, but that doesn't mean we get back to him and to play him. Anyone who says that, oh, circumstances, no. He created those circumstances. It's his fault.

Yeah. And then he comes back home and then he immediately leaves. He's a bad dad, okay? Michaela only cares about him as a father. I just think generally... He's a shitty dad. He's interesting. Absolutely, he's a shitty dad. But also, his son was shitty, so here we are. But that's his fault. His son is shitty. I disagree. Well, that's fine, but I'll prove you wrong. That's provided I read your dissertation. You won't read it. Anyway, no, you don't. I literally won't. Okay. But I will also joke about not doing it. But...

What makes him interesting, and generally this is the lovely thing about Homer, is we're given heroes that are not shown to be morally good. Yeah. And Odysseus is generally just not a good person, but he does interesting things. He does beautiful things. That's the thing. That's why he's my problematic fave. Yeah. Because I think he's inarguably a piece of shit. And I think he is presented that way in Homer. Exactly. I don't think they're trying to say, wow, look at this guy, he did all these amazing things. They're like, look at this man. It's like how the Iliad is not about the glory of war. Yeah. It is.

But people read it as about the glory of war. And, like, I feel like people, even though the Odyssey is not about Odysseus being a good guy, people read it as if he's a hero. Well, and then, you know, it's all in the first line of each of the things. You know, like, the thing that's about the Iliad is the main end. It's the rage. It's the anger. It's the wrath. It's, you know, it's this war that encompasses all that. And then the thing with the Odyssey is the, you know,

The man of many turns. The man of many turns. The complicated, the twisted. It's like, that is not being shown as like, wow, look at him. He's so tough. It's like, no, this is someone you can't trust. Yeah. And so now we're given this narrative by him. You can't trust that man. But you want to trust. I think that's where the complicated comes into you. It's thriving. There's something about it where there is real depth and like, you can't put your finger on it.

Yes. Your gut feels... I just feel like Matt Damon is a person you can put your finger right on and it'll never move. That's how I feel about Matt Damon. Which, you know, that power to him, that's sweet. Olivia acts like Matt Damon. Do you? He's doing okay. He doesn't need our support. He should not be Odysseus. But what if he feels this and suddenly he's like... Maddie, boy, drop out. You are not Odysseus. Do bad...

I need you to be a good white man and I need you to drop out and recommend that they cast a Mediterranean man. If your dad's still alive, I can convince him to go down to the corner store to buy a pack of smokes and just never come back. That might give him some edge. He needs a little trauma. We can traumatize Matt Damon. Mikaela said it, not me. And we can traumatize Matt Damon. Make him a little more twisty and complicated and interesting. Not interesting. I know. With Matt Damon, you know exactly what you're going to get.

not a bad thing. It's not, but it's a bad thing for Odysseus. Yes, yes, yes. It's the opposite of Odysseus. What if they play with that and then he actually, they actually manage to If I'm wrong, I would love to be wrong, to be clear. Like, I am open to being wrong. If Christopher Nolan proves me wrong, I will be thrilled. If this ends up good and interesting, like, I will eat my words and we'll come right on here and I will talk about how wrong I am because I, I, I

I so want an Odyssey adaptation to be good. Like, I want that more than anything. I want a true adaptation that features all of Odysseus letting everyone die and fucking shit up over and over and over again. Yes.

For his own gain. Yes. Like, unabashedly, too. Like, that's the thing that makes Odysseus so conniving, is he does not care. No, he thinks about himself. Yes, and it is, that is, what is it, conniving and maniacal, and like, that's scary. That is scary. And I do, I actually think you're right. I think that if they were to actually play it that way, Matt Damon could be interesting. Yeah. But it has to be done in a very specific way for him to be interesting, and I...

words and if you did that'd be cool i would be so thrilled to be wrong honestly tear rolls down your eye at the end of the film they proved me wrong now take it back matt damon like i truly i really would love this to be good like yeah if we had a good audacy adaptation i i would be so fucking happy but also if it is campy and horrible i will also love i'm so excited for this

the thing the thing is that I think in today's world and today's technology today's filmmaking they will it's they will not make it campy and stupid in like or like if they do it'll be because it's clear they have absolutely zero grasp on the original text which is a fucking bummer so just great too no and again like if this wasn't my career and if I hadn't

built my myself around loving the Odyssey and if I didn't love the Odyssey as much as I do like I would not be so horrified um

Yeah, but... Like, if they did this with, like, the Argonautica, Matt Damon could play Jason. Oh my god! Is Matt Damon the perfect Jason? He's gonna be great! Oh my god, he would be a great... If they did the Argonautica and Anne Hathaway's playing Medea, I mean, there would be major whitewashing, obviously, but, like, I would actually be down for that. I'd be down for that. Lupita as Medea? That'd be fine. I'm so happy you thought... Honestly, Matt Damon might be the perfect Jason. I'll send Christopher.

one. Yeah, well let's just send them a note. Chris, if you're watching, Chrissy boy. Honestly, I love your idea. I love your enthusiasm. Love some enthusiasm. Love it. I want that enthusiasm for the ancient world. I need you to make Matt Damon Jason. Yes. He's a better Jason. And make sure to keep Heracles, Heracles, excuse me, Heracles' boyfriend in it. Oh,

Heck yeah. Yep, yep, yep. Okay, just take that note. I can tell you right now, and I say this with confidence, Christopher Nolan, I am more of an expert in the Odyssey than you. And I'm just going to need you to go ahead and just take it all back. Just tell the studio, actually, based on the casting, if you can't take Matt Damon back, if you can't take Matt Damon back, then you need to take the Odyssey back and you need to replace it with the Argonautica. Unless you can force Matt, unless you can traumatize Matt Damon. True. Can you traumatize Matt Damon?

Now, just a light trauma. It can't be something too serious. No. Because, you know, you've still got to be a person who is functional and doesn't, like, you know, get, like, a drinking problem, a serious drinking problem, or, you know, a drug habit. He probably already does Hollywood, but, you know, like, nothing that will ruin his life. But just enough. Just enough to make some, you know... Just enough to make him interesting. To give it a little bit of darkness behind the eyes. He's the least interesting man. You know. I'm sorry, Matt. I'm not really. You're so rich. I don't care what you think, but, like... But also...

It could be good. It could be hilarious. So that's the thing. It could be so funny. The problem, the problem is, and I want to, I want to go that way. I do. Yeah. But for me, I think I couldn't, even if it's funny, bad, I will be so caught up in the fact that like they ruined another opportunity to do a legit adaptation of a great mess. And on top of that, the, the, it's just the whitewashing of it. Like I am so tired of, um,

Like, British, American, whatever. Deeply, deeply colonial actors playing these characters. Like, I don't want Matt Damon to put on a shitty British accent. I don't want him to still be weirdly American like Brad Pitt was. Like, just cast a fucking Greek guy. Turkish if you gotta. I mean, we're going to Troy. That's fine. That's fucking Turkey. Like, give me...

Mediterranean actors it is a bizarre thing to to but it's Hollywood man look at this point it just kind of I just I mean biggest thing I've been disappointed by Hollywood my entire life no I know the problem is these days I just have so much trouble looking past it and all I see now is the propaganda of Hollywood and the Odyssey as Western propaganda like that's what he's making based on this cast sorry he's making the Odyssey as Western propaganda

To go back to this fucking Hollywood, like, you know, a couple years ago, Taylor Lautner was like, turns out guys are not First Nations. And I sat here and I went, I know. He never said he was. Oh, they were, like, really pushing it. Because every other Indigenous character within that whole... Yeah, was Indigenous. I know. I was asked, because they filmed where I went to school. So they were like, any, you know, oh, I can't, this is the internet, I can't say what I want to say. Any First Nations people...

Mikayla was ready to use a slur against her own people. It's fine when I say it. Yep. Yep. And also in America, it's not even a slur. No, it's not. It's not a slur. I love that for you guys. I just think it's funny. That's my problem, but everybody else feels differently, and that's... You feel differently. I understand and feel your pain, and I'll watch my mouth. Anyways...

But I just love that everybody else was, they made that effort to mention they were First Nations. And the one main character guy who was First Nations was like, now get a little white boy for that. Like, so Italian. Yeah, yeah. And all of us were like, yeah, no. Okay, just put some, like, long hair on it. I like that we went to Twilight. What was it? We got to Twilight in this conversation. Bella, how you doing? Get me out of here. I hated that. Anyways. Anyways.

It's not about Twilight. It's a little bit more interesting. But it's Hollywood. That's just what they do. I just keep wanting things to be better. But I should have, I mean. I don't have expectations for Hollywood. Yeah. I learned long ago not to. I think Gladiator 2 was actually pretty fun. Gladiator 2 had me laughing the whole time. It was pretty fun.

I went to a VIP seating for it so I could like lay down because I didn't have to watch movies. So, you know, if I go once a year, I'll spend an extra money to go sit there and drink. And the whole time I was just like, what is happening? I smoked a bunch of weed.

before it, which was pretty great. Yes, yes. But I loved it. Yeah, no, honestly, Gladiator 2 was great. I mean, Pedro is like, he's still my beating heart. Nobody else in the theater was laughing, and I was just cackling. There was like three people in the theater with us, and I just kept turning to Dina being like, did you see that? And then Denzel Washington's American accent. Anyway, sorry. The one part, he goes, I don't know why, I don't know why that sticks in my brain. It's just the way...

Do you like how many times they said Prince of Rome? That's not a thing that, like, they, I mean, the emperors were kings, but they would never say that. They had convinced themselves that they were not a monarchy. We're not kings, we're just emperors. What's the difference? And also, like, it was often not about familial lines, so the idea of calling him, like, the rightful, that's major spoilers for Vadiator, I apologize. Yeah, sorry. Well, it's been, this is about the old days.

they've already seen it all hopefully if not um that's fine i didn't give away what it actually means but i'll like it but that's great anyway i am i'm really just like i think that my biggest issue with with the odyssey casting is i'm i'm in awe of it yeah i know i was actually shocked yeah like i really did expect that we'd come like even

this much farther since Troy. But to me it feels like it's equivalent to Troy's casting from literally 20 years ago. It is not even a lick more progressive than Troy's casting. And that's fascinating. It doesn't surprise me. It doesn't surprise me but I think I want to be surprised because it's been for one, it's been 20 years since Troy which makes me very uncomfortable. Don't say that. No, I know but it's fact. Um...

But we really, it has been 20, 20 years since they cast a bunch of British guys as Greeks and Turkish people. And we have, they've come nowhere. Like, I actually think there might, there, is there more Americans in the main cast of this? There are definitely more Americans than even in Troy. Yeah.

That's probably... Americans or British. Well, no, but the thing is, Troy Lee's had all the British people, so it's not more British, but I do believe there are more Americans. I'd have to look. I don't know. It's just... I mean, like, it's Hollywood. You know, I understand the wanting it to be more, but I always kind of like to... Maybe this is why I don't really watch movies. I just feel like they could put one Greek person in there. No, that's asking too much. What are you thinking? Yeah. Get it together. It's like how... And this is...

Maybe we're just gonna... I don't know. We'll go deep. Did you hear that they cast a Palestinian woman in a major role of Gladiator 2 and then cut her out completely? Are you serious? Yeah. Oh. Yeah, they announced her in the casting before the genocide. Well, the current active genocide.

They cast her and they hyped her up as a major role. And then when the movie came out, a lot of pro-Palestinian activists were like, where is she? Because you hyped her up as having gotten a major role. Yeah. That's really upsetting. I won't, I'm not going to go too deep into the other side of it, but they did, they did seem to advance a role of a woman who was from Israel.

Anyway, so once again, Hollywood does not surprise me and continues to disappoint me. And maybe that's just what we should expect. Yeah. Oh, fuck, man. Jesus. Matt Damon as Odysseus. Oh, I could be a better Odysseus. I could be a better Odysseus. What if I want to be Odysseus? What if you were Telemachus?

and i was a little he's a little i want to show up in my first moment of parenting is ripping off all my clothes and killing people in front of my son that's how i want to be a good dad okay i'm looking dead in the eye and be like call me daddy boom and then whoever's penelope will be in the background just shaking her head like oh my god marion's the second guy why isn't there ancient divorce just slip a little bit of something in my drink i won't notice

Someone put me down. Happy New Year. Oh my god. Let's leave Matt Damon in 2024. I thought we left him in 2004, honestly. Matt Damon? When's the last time we... We just learned this today. Oppenheimer. I don't remember what he was doing in it, though. I watched it. I didn't see it. I did Barbenheimer. And I don't remember. It was very fun. I actually liked Oppenheimer more than I thought I would. But I don't remember Matt Damon in it. I'm trying really hard. Yeah.

I can see him in a little military suit. Maybe. I don't know. I'm trying. The muse of a complicated man! This is how we're gonna finish it. Are you gonna read it? Can I read it? Yeah. No, I want to read it. She's studying Greek, but I can just... I'm on book 15. Don't hurt me. Show off. I'm not trying to show off. To those not watching on video, which is probably most of you. She's flipping pages. I'm getting there.

We're not editing this, so I hope it's gonna be fine. Cut him closer. Closer. Oh, line 45! There we go. Maiden. The first word is man. What was that? Meandra moi en en femusa politropon hos mala pola.

No, wait, no, that's wrong. Man. Well, I'm good. That's a terrible. I'm going to let Michaela translate it. I know all the words individually, but could I do a competent translation of them in order? It's like, like, tell me news about the man of many terms. Yeah. Whom, um, oh my God. Bad. So no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Hmm.

No, Mela, that's my French coming. Oh, yes. Yeah, I've done this. I've done this. Mela is like, well, it's like Mal. Yeah. Oh, many. But Pula is the term, is the many. Yeah. Oh, very, very, very many. No, I feel like it. No, I promise you Mela is not bad. No, I know. Well, trust me. This is how we end it. Well, that's the thing, because when we dance, we say, and we say, and we say, and we say, and we say, and we say,

That was Hieron. Well, that's not true, actually. Hieron is...

yeah I know I said I said I said hero to be clear about Troy and I was still wrong yeah that's fine I'm going to read you this tell me about a complicated man muse tell me how he wandered and was lost when he had wrecked the holy town of Troy yeah

We love Sack in a Sacred Citadel, I can say that. That was Emily Wilson's translation, obviously. Let's talk about Misfabies, written and produced by me. Nah, I'm not even going to bother with the credits. We didn't even do the opening. Thank you all for listening, because... Thanks! I just had to do it, and I don't... I really, like... I'd give you a cheers if I finished my drink, so, you know. Cheers to the worst casting I've ever heard of. Cheers to Matt Damon as a Disney...

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