Jocko Underground 171: Does Jiu Jitsu Ruin More Lives Than It Saves??
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this is the jonko underground podcast number 171 sitting here with echo charles getting ready to answer some of your questions and provide courses of actions things to consider perhaps some immediate actions to take to send you down the prap the path in a very positive way so let's get to it before i read this can i tell you that i wish i had this outfit when i was younger yeah you and me both would have helped

All right. Hi, Jacoaco. I love the podcast. I've been a long-time listener. I got started in jujitsu because of your podcast. Oh, yeah. Currently a purple belt and have dealt with some pretty gnarly injuries, including a torn ACL and multi-level disc replacement in my neck.

Every time I get injured, everyone tells me I need to quit. And the argument makes sense. I lose time from work and training or when I get injured. I also have spent probably $20,000 on medical bills between surgeries, PT, and other ways of recovering from jiu-jitsu.

Can't seem to pull myself off the mats and love training maybe more than anything, but can't help but wonder if Craig Jones is right, that jiu-jitsu ruins more lives than it saves. Should I stay on the mats and keep training or find a more safe activity? If I stay, how should I change my training? I love working stand-up, but wondering if I should become a guard puller. Well, so there's a lot of variables here.

that we don't have all of them because we don't, yeah, there's some details missing, but you know what? We can make some assumptions or provide some overall guidance. First of all, can you keep training? The answer is yes, you can keep training. But it does sound like your training may need some adjustment. My guess is, and this is an assumption, my guess is you need to chill. That's my guess. My guess is you need to chill

You probably need to get more chill training partners. My guess is you need to drill more and train, roll live a little less. Maybe play more games in jujitsu. Maybe a little bit of that ecological approach. Maybe, yes, absolutely become a guard puller. But more important, don't train a bunch of stand-up because your chances of getting hurt increased quite a bit.

adjust your game to protect your neck, you know that inverted roll that you do, you know that sacrifice that you make and your head pulled when you go under for the deep half guard and all that, you got to make some adjustments to your game. So those are my immediate thoughts, right? Now, if you are already super chill and you already rolled to protect your neck and you already don't do stand up and you already don't roll hard and you just

and you're still getting hurt this much, you need to take all that stuff down another level. Now maybe you're just learning the techniques, right? I've had people over the years that did not train jujitsu, but they learned the techniques. They couldn't train jujitsu for a variety of reasons. Maybe they had, you know, whatever, just a variety of reasons.

They can't actually train. They can't actually roll. They want to know the moves. They appreciate the game. And so they learn jujitsu. You could get to a point where that happens. Would that be hard for a jujitsu junkie like you to do that and keep off the mats? Yeah, but also if the alternative is being all dinged up, then...

where you can't do anything else. I love jujitsu. I absolutely love jujitsu. But if it meant I couldn't like work out, couldn't surf, couldn't ski, couldn't run, you know, like there's a point where that rest of that physical activity I want to be able to do. So, but again, I don't think I'll ever have to make that sacrifice because I think I can train in a way that I don't have to sacrifice my body. So that's what I would think about. I would think about chilling more.

I think about using more technique. I would think about playing some of these ecological games where the goal isn't to submit the other person and rip their head off. The goal is to get the underhooks. The goal is to sweep, right? The goal is to get the sweep. The goal is to not get swept. The goal is to get the inside leg entanglement. Like what? Play some games and have some fun. You don't have to freaking go crazy every time.

And then, yeah, if you're training a bunch of stand-up and you've already been injured, you've already hurt your ACL, it might be time to chill on the stand-up a little bit. What did I miss, Echo Charles? To be honest, I don't know if I could put it better, that chill part. Because in a nutshell, that's really... And chill training partners, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, maybe. I mean, it is hard to avoid training partners mentally. You know, when someone asks to roll and then you say no to one guy and then...

30 seconds later you say yes to this other guy. It's like that. I understand that that's a little bit. Yeah, until you get injured a bunch and you're like, you know what, dude, I'm not training with this dude. Like, let your ego go. Hey, look, you don't like me? Cool. You know, I got hurt with you twice and I'm not doing it anymore. Yeah, that's real. There's another little note that I have here, which is,

I've known people that have never trained jiu-jitsu a day in their life and gotten neck surgery with disc replacements or fusions. Never trained jiu-jitsu. I've known people that have never done anything active, didn't play football, didn't play rugby, and got disc replacements in their neck, disc replacements in their lower back, fusion in their lower back, fusion in their neck. I've known people that played soccer, basketball, surfing,

squash tennis bagminton just any sport that got ACL surgery I've known people that got ACL surgery after they got out of the car and step funny on the curve after they stepped on the dog toy when it's walking down the stairs and I like there are things that happen now in my opinion I don't know how much this dude is lifting and doing mobility because if you're not lifting your chance of getting hurt or a liar that's that's

Across the board. That's getting out of your car, stepping on the curb. That's stepping on the dog toy. That's playing a pickup game of basketball. If you don't lift weights and you don't do pull-ups, push-ups, dips, and squats, and deadlifts, and overhead presses, and overhead squats, and kettlebell swings, and snatches. If you're not doing these things, your body ain't ready for this. And I'll tell you what, dude.

Can tell you like this is fresh in my mind. I did squats today Getting under the bar right now Getting just just getting the shoulders warmed up I used to not even think about you'd get on the bar do a squat but right now there's a there is a one minute to 90 second stretch to get in position, you know to get loosened up to get in position under the bar for a regular squat if so if I wasn't doing that I

What when would my shoulders get stretched out when I got freaking put in an Americana or when I got put in a in a Kimura, that's when I would get stretched. So you have to keep moving in order to keep moving. Thanks, Dr. Luke on that one, right? You've got to keep moving if you're going to keep moving to to just do jujitsu. You can get away with it when you're 20. You can do everything in 25. Yeah.

But you're not going to get away with it when you're 29 and 32 and 35 and 40 and 42 and 47 and 50 and 53. You got to lift. You got to work out. You got to train. So interestingly, in this question, unless I missed it.

Nowhere does he say I trained you jitsu. I lift I do calisthenics I do Sun salutation every morning and I measure my progress, you know what I'm saying? I'm not seeing that in here makes me a little bit nervous Are you do have it? Do you have a stretching protocol? Because if you don't you need to have one are you lifting? Because if you don't you need to be if you haven't you need to start so I will throw those out there but all that being said ACLs get blown out and

neck issues happen shoulder injuries happen and that's regardless if you're doing jujitsu playing basketball playing soccer anything picking up your kid throwing your kid up in the air boom I'll turn my tore my labrum that stuff happens to people especially people that ain't getting there that is a little excerpt of what we are doing on the Jocko underground podcast so if you want to continue to listen

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