Massachusetts Senator Elizabeth Warren Talks Tariffs, Federal Reserve Monetary Policy
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Bloomberg Audio Studios. Podcasts. Radio. News. Democratic Senator Elizabeth Warren of Massachusetts, who joins us live from Capitol Hill. Senator, it's great to have you back. So here we are with our first economic contraction since 2022. Are we already in a recession?

Well, some economists think we're already in a recession, and the overwhelming majority say if we're not already, we are certainly sliding into one. The damage done by the chaos around the Trump tariffs has really delivered a body blow to our economy. And, of course, we've seen it in the stock market. We've seen it in the bond market.

Look, where we really are on this is that families are struggling and they're delivering that message. Remember how Donald Trump won. He said he would lower costs on day one. Those were his words on day one. He gets elected. He immediately says that is one of the main reasons he won.

We are 100 days in and what has happened, the economy has shrunk and the price of groceries is up for families all across this country. That's a bad economic outlook. Well, when we consider that outlook then, Senator, knowing we are a week away from the Federal Reserve's next rate decision, if they choose not to cut next week to wait to June or July or even after that, would President Trump be right that Chairman Powell risks being too late?

You know, the problem now is the crisis that Donald Trump has created. Chairman Powell said as soon as Donald Trump started announcing these red light, green light tariffs, that we were going to have tariffs across the board on virtually every nation, on virtually every product, that the consequence of that would be to do two things. One is to drive up prices, in other words, an increase in inflation, and two, to drive up unemployment.

And you all know what that means. That's stagflation, and it neuters the Fed's only tool, and that is changing the interest rates. Because if they increase the interest rates, that will help push down inflation, but it will drive up unemployment. And of course, the reverse is true. If they lower interest rates,

they run the risk of setting inflation aflame at this point. So Donald Trump has created a crisis, and now the tool that the Fed would use becomes much less effective for the Fed to actually be able to use it. This is Donald Trump's problem, and he has created it and now compounded it.

We want to get to your reaction, congressional reaction, democratic reaction to the tariff policies, Senator, because shortly after this interview, you're going to force a vote that our audience should know about over the president's tariff authority here. I know you have a couple of Republicans on board, but this appears to be going nowhere in the House. And I wonder, is there anything that Democrats can do beyond a symbolic gesture to become a check on the tariff?

on the president's policy here. So let's just remember, just so everyone understands, why is it that the president of the United States can wake up in the morning and announce one tariff policy and by mid-afternoon be in a second one and by evening be in a third one?

It's all because there is a statutory provision that says in an emergency, the president can impose sanctions, but Congress can say, "Hey, there's no emergency, so we get to roll that back." And that's what Senator Wyden and I have now proposed. This is the bill that will be on the floor later today, to just roll back Donald Trump's authority.

to move in and say tariffs up, tariffs down, exception for you, higher tariffs for you over there. The significance of this is, look, all the Democrats support it. That's not an issue. It's really to put the Republicans on the record. You understand what kind of damage this tariff red light, green light is creating Republicans. So you have the opportunity right here

to take a stand and say we're actually going to put some curbs on what Donald Trump does. They can vote for the resolution. Or they can continue to say, nope, the only power in Washington is with Donald Trump. They can bend a knee to Donald Trump and say to all Americans,

Americans who are suffering because of higher prices and a shrinking economy and to all of the world that says the United States is not a reliable trading partner, we have the opportunity, if the Republicans will join us, to put some curves on Donald Trump and to reverse the damage he's doing. We'll find out if the Republicans are only here to take a knee to Donald Trump or if they actually are willing to stand up for the American people.

Well, last we spoke with you, Senator, you argued that it was not just about Republicans in Congress, but about others in the Trump administration, including the Treasury Secretary Scott Besson, who should be taking action here. We know that Besson is testifying in the House Financial Services Committee next week. Do you expect him to appear before the Banking Committee? And what will he need to answer for if he does?

So look, Secretary Besant is going to have to explain. He's out here as the number one apologist for Donald Trump. And some of the things I want to know from Secretary Besant is what is he doing going in front of a closed-door group of well-heeled stock traders and people who are active in the market and giving advance information about where tariff policy is headed?

I just want to make sure that Secretary Besant understands

He doesn't just work for a handful of Wall Street investors and how to make them richer. He's actually here to work for the American people and to provide stability in the stock market. And part of that is to reassure people that it is not corruption, that it is not a rigged game. I'd like to hear from Secretary Besant about that. And in fact, I've already sent him a letter about that. But I'd like to get him in a hearing and just be able to ask him a little more about that.

Sounds like you want to talk to Jeff Bezos as well, and you did send a letter to him this morning, Senator. You're calling on Mr. Bezos to disclose information about his conversation with President Trump following reports that Amazon was going to itemize the cost of tariffs

on products for consumers. Of course, Amazon is not doing that. The White House called that idea hostile and political. So here we are, Senator, should publicly traded companies in the United States assume that Donald Trump is the de facto chairman of their boards?

I like the way you have put it. That certainly is how he wants to behave. But listen to that underlying message. What Donald Trump is saying is if the American people can see clearly what his tariffs are costing them,

That creates a real problem for Donald Trump and for the Republicans in Congress. So his solution is not to do something more sensible on tariffs. His solution is to try to end access to the information and to persuade Jeff Bezos that he needs to erase that information. And yes, I want to hear about that conversation. In fact, I want to hear about it.

I want to hear about all of the conversations that Donald Trump has with his million-dollar donors and what it is he is both promising and threatening as he tries to create even more chaos and corruption in our economy.

Senator, I'd like to ask you about something else as he's working on making deals with trading partners or at least his administration is they're also working on a deal with Ukraine suggesting a minerals deal specifically could be signed as early as this afternoon if Ukraine is willing. Should that be taking the form of a formal treaty? Should the Senate have a chance to weigh in on that?

Yes, the Senate should have an opportunity to weigh in. Look, the Senate has, and the House, long supported Ukraine. It's Donald Trump

who has persuaded a handful of extremists that somehow this country needs to be on the side of the aggressor, on the side of Russia. That is fundamentally wrong. The Ukrainians are fighting on the front lines for democracy. And understand this, if Vladimir Putin can get away

with an invasion of Ukraine, it's not like he will be full and he will stop there. He's going to continue to come after more and more of his neighbors. That is a threat to all of Europe, but it is also ultimately a threat to the United States of America. I know that Donald Trump seems to have some kind of love relationship with Vladimir Putin, although lately they seem to have had a spat.

But at the end of the day, the interests of the United States are with Europe and with Ukraine. We need to be, once again, a dependable ally. That's what matters most.

All right, Senator, we know you have that vote to get to that we were just discussing, but we appreciate you joining us. Democratic Senator Elizabeth Warren of Massachusetts, the ranking member of the Banking Committee. We appreciate your time.

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