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cover of episode How Chinese EVs Are Powering Africa’s Mobility Revolution

How Chinese EVs Are Powering Africa’s Mobility Revolution

2025/5/23
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The China in Africa Podcast

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E
Eric Olander
专注于分析中国在全球南方的技术创新和影响的媒体人物和分析师。
K
Kobus Van Staden
N
Njenga Hakeenah
S
Sarah Asefa
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@Eric Olander : 我认为中国正在参与整个移动领域,从两轮车到三轮车,再到四轮车和18轮车。非洲现在移动的任何东西,大部分都附有中国电池或中国技术。与美国和欧洲不同,中国的电动汽车价格更低,这使得它们在非洲更具吸引力。我们CGSP在YouTube上发布电动汽车相关内容时,获得了惊人的关注,这表明人们对这个话题有浓厚的兴趣。 @Kobus Van Staden : 我认为非洲从下往上发展电动汽车的方式非常有趣。非洲正在使用电动汽车来解决现有的工人阶级的交通问题,而不是将其作为一种精英的炫耀,来表达他们对地球的关注。与中国不同,非洲在电力、充电站和关税等方面面临一些结构性问题,但企业家们正在克服这些障碍并进行创新。 @Njenga Hakeenah : 我发现非洲人正在为他们遇到的问题创新解决方案,他们正在创新以应对他们所经历的挑战。非洲电动汽车展关注非洲国家的电动汽车、可持续交通和清洁能源发展,讨论电动汽车在非洲市场面临的挑战和机遇。我们还将采访比亚迪和吉利等汽车制造商,了解他们对非洲国家潜力的看法。我们还提供消费者指南,重点关注非洲的经济承受能力、维护和所有权体验。 @Sarah Asefa : 我认为2024年2月,埃塞俄比亚完全禁止进口燃油汽车,这无疑推动了电动汽车的需求和供应。埃塞俄比亚与中国有很多合作项目,许多埃塞俄比亚商人前往中国进口汽车。由于人们害怕尝试新事物,以及对充电、备件和汽车质量的担忧,电动汽车的普及速度并不快。燃油价格的上涨推动了市场增长。电动汽车仍然比许多燃油汽车便宜,而且把钱花在汽车本身上感觉更好,而不是花在税收上。

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Hello and welcome to another edition of the China in Africa podcast, a proud member of the Seneca Podcast Network. I'm Eric Olander, and as always, I'm joined by CGSP's managing editor in beautiful Cape Town, South Africa, Kobus Van Staden. Very good afternoon to you today.

Good afternoon. Kobus, before we get into our topic today, and we're going to focus on Chinese EV mobility in Africa, an absolutely amazing topic, and we're going to dive into it deep today with our climate editor in Jenga Akina. But I just got to ask you, Kobus, I mean, what we saw in the Oval Office yesterday, it was just remarkable. Another one of these just

Again, things that you would never thought you would see, but it was a dramatic showdown. So for those of you who were not paying attention to what happened this week, Kobus's president, Cyril Ramaphosa, went to the White House in a bid to try and repair relations with Donald Trump and the United States government.

And just as it was with Zelensky from Ukraine, he was ambushed pretty aggressively with videos and pictures and using a lot of debunked conspiracies about the plight of white farmers in South Africa. Kobus, what was the reaction, your reaction, and then more broadly in South Africa to what happened?

You know, kind of on the one hand, I think both me and the South African reactions that I've read were roughly breaking down in two sides. Like one is that it looked bad, like it looked rough, and that it was clearly an ambush. It was clearly pre-planned. It was clearly aimed at humiliating Ramaphosa.

That said, I think, and I think a lot of observers in South Africa have also said that in general, I think Ramaphosa did a very good job. I think he remained calm. He kept, you know, kind of restating the actual record. He didn't blow up, which of course, you know, kind of Zelensky famously did. And that, you know, kind of just made stuff worse. And he used his team very well.

You know, so an intervention by the DA politician John Stianason, for example, you know, kind of correcting Trump on some of these issues around rural violence, for example, worked very well. And also the entourage that he brought, which included two very high-level golfers and also, you know, kind of like South African billionaires who are also Afrikaners, you know, ended up kind of, I think, you know, even as they were hit

being hit by this barrage of misinformation, their very presence, you know, was a kind of a counter to that, you know. So I think it kind of went as good as it could go, but the entire situation was really bad. And, you know, kind of clearly and clearly it was set up to humiliate South Africa.

Well, reports came in after the event that said that at the working lunch that the two presidents had, apparently things calmed down and there was more substantive talk that started to happen. And that, of course, is what also happened with Zelensky as well. There was this performative blow up. And then later, a few weeks later, remember that famous picture of.

of Zelensky and Trump in the Vatican talking, and apparently they did make some progress on their relationship there. It just made me think though about two things. One, it's ironic that this came a week after Trump was in Saudi Arabia saying how we're no longer going to lecture you about what happens in your country.

which I, you know, but again, you know, Donald Trump sees himself as the protector of the aggrieved white person around the world. And that is very much part of his base in the United States. And certainly the campaign he's taking up in South Africa as well. But also I'm just wondering that we got word a couple of weeks ago that there's going to be a U.S. Africa Leaders Summit in

Do you think this kind of thing will have any impact on other African leaders and whether or not they want to come to Washington? And will there be any solidarity with Ramaphosa from other African leaders who maybe saw this and said, this isn't right? Or do you think they're looking much more narrowly to their own interests?

So far, I haven't seen much, you know, kind of said by other African leaders. And similarly, I know other African leaders, for example, commented on the fight between Kenya and the US recently. So I think in general, it just shows very low levels of solidarity among African countries. I think...

African leaders would probably still want to come, probably betting on what I think is probably true, that South Africa is the only country in which Donald Trump has any kind of opinion or even knowledge about what's going on in their internal affairs. So I don't think it'll affect...

them coming to the summit. I think it may affect the choice of being caught in an Oval Office press conference with Donald Trump, because that's clearly bad news. Yeah, if I was a communication advisor to any president or prime minister that has even the slightest contentious relationship with the United States, I would say we are not going into the Oval Office with the press available. I think that's one of the key takeaways. Okay, let's kind of shift gears here. And that is an intentional pun here.

We're going to talk about Chinese mobility technology in Africa. Now, this sounds a little bit like a technical thing. And why am I saying mobility technology instead of EVs? And we hear a lot about Chinese EVs all over the world. BYD, Zeker, Geely, all of these brands, some are familiar to people, some are not. Here in Southeast Asia, they're becoming increasingly ubiquitous. But one of the trends that we're seeing in Africa is that, and Kobus, you mentioned this

many years ago actually, when it was just starting off, that the Chinese

are engaging the entire mobility, I don't think supply chain is the right word, but the entire mobility sector from two wheels to three wheels to four wheels to 18 wheelers, all the way, anything that moves now in Africa for the most part, oftentimes has a Chinese battery attached to it, Chinese technology put to it. And one of the things that we noticed at CGSP is that when we started putting content out there about EVs, particularly on our YouTube channel,

It just took off. I mean, our shows normally get, oh, sometimes 5,000, 10,000 streams on YouTube. And we had shows that when we talked about this topic, it went to 100,000, 150,000. And it just shows there's so much pent up interest. And Kobus, I think it's so interesting because going back to what you were talking about a couple of years ago, where in contrast to the United States and Europe that provide EV technology at the highest levels,

price point. So a Tesla, for example, is $50,000, $60,000, $70,000 depending on where you are, cheapest ones. The Chinese are coming in sometimes at below $10,000. And you can get Chinese e-bikes and scooters for sometimes a few hundred dollars.

And I think that's what's really interesting. In South Africa in particular, Kobus, you are seeing a lot of Chinese e-mobility around town, even when I was there the last time, delivery vehicles in scooters and whatnot. And that is now spreading elsewhere around the continent. It's just an interesting trend. And it's one of those places where e-mobility technology is taking off much faster than other parts of the world.

Yeah, and it's really interesting. And I think, and the fact that it's taking, as you said, it's taking off from the bottom up, I think is very revealing. You know, like, for example, food delivery in a city like Cape Town is now largely done with, you know, electric scooters and e-bikes. I assume most of those would be coming from China.

And similarly, you know, for example, bus services in Cape Town have also started switching over to electric buses, again, coming from China. So it's very interesting that Africa is following the Chinese model in the sense of, like, using EVs to address existing...

like working class mobility issues, rather than kind of like selling it as, you know, kind of something for an elite, you know, essentially virtue signal, you know, kind of their concern about the planet. So I mean, they do that too, but it's, you know, it's across the entire range, which is very interesting. But unlike in China, there are some structural issues in every African country that the Chinese don't have to contend with, most importantly, power and charging stations.

and also tariffs and all sorts of obstacles that a lot of entrepreneurs are overcoming and yet still innovating. And that's the focus of a brand new podcast that we launched, taking advantage of the momentum that we had on YouTube called the Africa EV Show. It comes out every week and it's hosted by our colleague in Nairobi and Jenga Hakina.

who is CGSP's climate editor, and in many ways just kind of stumbled into this story when started covering a lot more EV activity in Nairobi in particular, and then we took it across the continent. Njenga, welcome back to the program. Great to have you on the show, and congratulations on the new podcast.

Thank you so much. The Africa EV show is focusing on the things that you've just spoken about, Kobas, and so much more. And I think what I found out was that there's so much more in terms of just beyond the tech, because what you find is that Africans, Kenyans, Nigerians, Rwandese, everyone that is using this tech is innovating for a problem that they have. So they are innovating a solution to meet these challenges that they have experienced.

And so if I may give a little bit of detail of why the Africa EV show. We are focused on electric vehicles, sustainable mobility and clean energy development across African countries. We cover topics on EV adoption in these African countries where we discuss the challenges.

And the opportunities, because there are many for EVs in the African markets. We also look at government policies. We look at incentives and infrastructure, which includes charging networks and also the industry innovations where we spotlight African EV startups creating solutions to these local mobility challenges. And they are using new business models and also embracing battery technology for these mobility solutions. Again, in the coming months, we'll also focus

be interviewing some of the automakers like BYD and Genly and everyone else that is in this market about the potential that they see in these African countries. And because renewable energy is the key really for driving EV adoption, ideally we also look at how

solar, wind power can support EV charging and also the transition. And also we look at the successful case studies where we focus on success stories from these different African countries. In Kenya, we know we are innovating wheelchairs, we are innovating mobility for differently abled people or people with mobility challenges.

And all this is happening across the continent, but it is local solutions to local problems. But then again, the approach is international because we have to embrace a Chinese tech. And in most of these conversations, we also offer consumer guides, which are focused on affordability, on maintenance and ownership experiences across Africa. Just in terms of looking at the spread of EVs from my perspective, you know, my work for CJSP is frequently quite complicated.

high level in the sense that you know like we do all of this kind of like scanning of different kind of industry publications and so on to put together like high level trends and one of the trends that keeps coming up is just more and more announcements of new assembly plants in Egypt particularly

There's been two different announcements this week. And so I was wondering what you make of these announcements and of the centering of Egypt in this activity. In the non-African press, it's usually fully framed as only serving export markets in Europe. So I was wondering whether you also see a larger continental presence for those facilities for the continental Africa. Yeah.

Yeah, I think Egypt, because of where they are in terms of industrialization, they have kind of a number of these assembly going to them. And then some is coming or happening in Morocco. And then you would be interested to know that South Africa as well, from as far back as 2016, they have been talking about with BYD, talking about establishing an assembly line, a manufacturing line, whatever it is that you would have in that space.

But it has not materialized yet. Johannesburg seems to be the perfect place for this. And the conversations are continuing between the government and these Chinese automakers. However, like you're saying, the assembling or the building happens to be happening a lot in Egypt. But also we are seeing outside of...

Egypt, Northern Africa, South Africa is playing that role. Then we have some small bits here and there in Kenya, in Rwanda, in Uganda, that is happening. So it is not concentrated in one country. But then, like Eric has mentioned earlier, and I think yourself as well, when it comes to power reliability, Egypt seems to be, you know, ahead of many of us other African countries.

And so whenever investment is going that way, then it is because of probably the reliability of the energy that they would require to make these industries work. But when it comes to beyond, you know, assembling for fully built units, South Africa is leading the pack. They have hundreds of dealerships that are dealing in, you know, Chinese brands, different Chinese brands. There is BYD, there is Haval, there is GWM.

And everyone else that is coming from China, you will find that they have some space in South Africa in a dealership. And so I was surprised that when I was collecting some data on this EV is that if we were to put Africa on a scale, South Africa would tip us off or

I mean, it's half of all African new car sales are in South Africa alone. Imagine that. And then looking at the map, the dotted spaces where these are dealerships, whatever, GM, GWM, Haval, whoever it is, everything is like seemingly happening in South Africa. So beyond assembly...

which has or is speaking very well in Egypt. South Africa is also at a prime spot in terms of even legacy brands that have been assembling there. And so they kind of have a foundation. But then we are seeing a shift in countries like Ethiopia. Ethiopia, interestingly, last week, there was that story about, you know, some garment factory now shifting to be

assembling Chinese EVs. And so with the policy that came in Ethiopia a few years ago, like two years ago, three years ago, whereby they slashed all the tariffs, and now we are seeing a shift in all this. So I think even when it comes to assembling to manufacturing, in countries like Ethiopia, it may be unexpected in terms of like where it has been in terms of manufacturing, but that is where we are heading. We need to keep our minds open because we

the Chinese will go where we least expect them to be. Well, let's stay in Ethiopia, and we're going to give everybody a little bit of a sample of the kind of show that you are producing. And I'd like to kind of have you set up this clip in this particular program with an Ethiopian journalist, and we did a story on Chinese EVs in the Ethiopian market. Ethiopia, again, is special in part because it's been very progressive on the import duties.

And it's brought down the import duties when, as we look in places like Kenya, the import tariffs on these cars are upwards of 25%, even higher in many cases, forcing the cost of the car to be just almost prohibitive. But yet in Ethiopia, they've gone the different direction. Tell us a little bit about this program that you recorded with a journalist in Ethiopia and that we're going to listen to very shortly.

So I met Sarah Asefa from some of the works that she's done in the renewable energy space in Ethiopia. And when we spoke about the shift, that was like last year, even before we commissioned a story. I was like, I would be very interested to know about what is happening in the EV space in Ethiopia. And she was like, there is some reluctance because people still do not understand what these EVs are, what they can do, how to maintain them, where to get the spare parts.

But fast forward to March this year, and I was surprised. She was like, people have totally had a complete mind shift about EVs. From having limited number of established Chinese automakers or brands in Ethiopia, in Addis Ababa, in the showrooms and cards,

to getting, you know, like tens, hundreds of these vehicles in different cards and the different brands, including the Xiaomi. I was like, what changed? And she was like, people have started to realize that they can make savings. And apart from the savings, they can also get the spare parts. They can get the resale values of these vehicles are also going up.

Because the biggest fear that they had before this kind of shit was, if I buy a car today and I need to dispose of it, I may not get a market for it and I may have to sell it at a loss, a huge loss, if I need to dispose. That's a big problem. That's a big problem. And so for a secondhand market vehicle like Ethiopia, having seen the kind of trend whereby it's in public service, it's in private cars, and it is all the brands across the manufacturers, the automakers,

then I think this has built confidence. And again, the affordability, because before that, the only way you could buy a car in Ethiopia was if you bought a car that was over 10 years old, and then it was at premium. But now when the government slashed the tariffs, everybody was getting these new cars at the same price they would have gotten for the second generation

And so I think when it comes to maintenance and looking at taking care of these secondhand cars, it becomes cheaper and it became cheaper. And so everyone or most of the Ethiopians are now shifting to these new electric vehicles, apart from the fear that they had.

about, you know, these cars, are they durable? Can we rely on them? Then we can see that when governments play a role, that even the people themselves, they get to change and see that we can adopt this, we can take this on, and we can have our lives moving on, you know, better and more affordably. Well, let's take a listen now to the Africa EV show featuring an interview between Ndjenga and Ethiopian journalist Sarah Acefe.

I think we'll just get into this conversation. And we are looking at Chinese EV imports and market growth in Ethiopia. And you guys have seen a surge in Chinese EV imports over the past few years. There is the policy that I've just mentioned. How is this and the import market impacting the industry or the sector in Ethiopia?

So as you mentioned in your introduction, in February 2024, there was a complete ban on the importation of fossil fuel cars, vehicles. So that definitely like drove up the demand and supply of electric vehicles. And naturally, you know, Ethiopia already had like a lot of projects with China. A lot of business people in Ethiopia do travel to China to import cars like

into the country anyway. So, and then also like China is a leading player in this sector, like globally as well. So I think that's like what caused the fact that like most of these imported cars are coming from China.

So all this did not actually start in February 2024. So the ban happened in February 2024. But in November 2022, the government's first initiative to encourage people to switch to EVs was to slash the taxes like...

drastically. So for those who don't know, like Ethiopia does have one of the lowest car ownerships, even still as of today. So in 2022, before there was like all the incentives to switch to electric vehicles, according to studies, there was less than like one in 1000 people only.

owned a car. There was just 1.3 million cars in the streets. And by November 2022, we were well above 100 million people. And more than half of these cars were service cars. I mean, buses, taxis, not privately owned cars. So there was two things to tackle. First of all, there was to encourage the adoption of newer cars, more environmentally friendly cars.

And stuff like even before the whole like EV encouragement, like the government also put higher taxes on cars that are more than two years older than the current time. So once there was the tax slashing in EV, so basically an electric vehicle would just be have like 15% custom duties like to pay, you know.

Whereas like a fuel car could be anywhere from like 100% of the car price to like 300% depending on the engine size. Wow. Yeah. So basically like a car that like you would...

You wouldn't even like look twice at, you know, in another country, like over here, it's like sold for millions, you know. And also because there was a shortage, like, you know, the car was basically considered a very valuable asset because it holds its price. If anything, it actually increases in price, the older the car gets.

the more expensive it keeps on getting because it holds on to the price and fights the devaluation of the Ethiopian people. But yeah, like once these incentives happen, like it changed everything. It completely changed the whole like vehicle scene. So the population was skeptic in the beginning. EV adoption was not as fast, like even after all of these incentives.

because of a couple of reasons. So first of all, people, they're scared to try something new, like naturally. And like there was like a lot of concerns about like where are we going to charge it? What about spare parts? Nobody knew how, like even let's say if the cars have like an eight-year guarantee, a 10-year guarantee, like,

There has been none of these cars haven't even existed for eight years. So like there was also like skepticism on like how good these cars are. They didn't hold their value, of course, because nobody knew like what the resale value is going to be like, you know, because it was still new. And there was even like words of like,

you know, like people, you know, just like the battery going bad or something like that. People didn't even know like how to gauge things. But still, there was more and more and more adoption happening. And then, yeah, the main thing that drove the market growth, except for like the ban on electric vehicle, was the increase of fuel prices. Nice. Wow. Because we are seeing this is a street on one of the streets, is it one of the streets or avenues in Addis Ababa? And you

And you can tell that like the car behind is a Volkswagen and most likely an electric. It is, it's an ID4, yeah. And then you can see the trucks and then the others ahead there, you can tell they are petrol. But then you were mentioning about the petrol price increasing. Yeah. People had to shift because of the price increases in fuel.

Yes, yes. So basically, I think it was around 2021, the government did announce the fact that they were going to reduce the subsidies in fuel. So first of all, the whole reason that this ban happened was also to save foreign currency that they spent on fuel, which was around 7.5 billion a year. And half of that went into gas stations and stuff. So that was an incentive. So prices just kept on increasing. So for reference...

In January 2023, fuel was, gasoline was $0.4 per liter. And as of January 2025, it has already hit the $0.8 per liter mark. We're heading to basically like a dollar per liter. It's crazy.

It's a big, because that's 100% increase on fuel pricing. And it's going to keep on increasing. Now it's like monthly increments. Since I released my article with you, by the way, it has already increased as of last week. So it turned from like 0.6 something to like 0.7 liter now. Yeah.

And you can imagine how much if Ethiopia was to stop importing this fuel, how much in savings it would make. But I know we are getting to that later in this conversation. But first, let's focus at local assembly and how do Chinese EVs compare to traditional fuel powered vehicles regarding affordability, performance and maintenance even before we get to the local assembly? I know you have mentioned a bit of it, but other

Are the price discrepancies now so noticeable between ICE vehicles or internal combustion engine vehicles and EVs?

Okay, so again, the market of vehicles in Ethiopia is a bit more complicated and like funny to a certain extent, like even to understand. So as I said before, like fuel cars really held their price in the past for some reason. Like, I mean, there are many reasons. Like, you know, people like, for example, I don't know if you have it in Nairobi, but then have you like the Toyota Vitz? Yes, yes. 2004 model, for example, is up to,

like one, like depending on the state and everything, it's like up to 1.8 million births, which if you even convert it, my bad,

but yeah it's very important it's like ten thousand dollars they are about or above that yeah exactly 13 more than more than 10 like 13k basically like you could for a 20 year old car literally literally you know so because people just liked to yeah thirteen thousand seven hundred dollars because there was a lot of factors you know like the spare parts for these cars is like

just it's dirt cheap you know like your car it could be completely smashed and then like it's going to be you know fixed like in a week you know like so there was that people were used to it they didn't like eat up that much fuel and again like fuel was not that expensive in the past so yeah like while electric vehicles was the opposite you know electric vehicles despite the like the tax incentives the original price of these cars is on the higher side

just generally speaking, you know? So even before, like all taxes, even before they come here, before the transportation costs and everything, the price of this car, for example, like the price for fossil fuel cars, what made them expensive was the tax. Whereas for electric vehicles, it's the opposite. It's the actual price of the car that is a bit on the higher side. So, you know, in the beginning, it took some time for like the prices to even like

be like similar but currently the demand of fuel cars is just like falling so fast so like even like people who held their car just for it to like as I said keep its value and keep getting more expensive now they're just like they just don't want to sell it at a loss you know they're just like even if I sell it for the price that I bought it it's okay so and then whereas the electric vehicle stock is it so when they first started coming here and being introduced to the market and everything there wasn't

many of them and at the same time also like the private importers and public importers were selling them at a more affordable price and now because demand is increasing as well by the way even the price of these electric vehicles is like the markup is just like even getting higher last year for example the byd seagull which is like a very common car for oh even even the one that's like shown right here this is this was i forgot the name of this car yeah what's

There's so many of them. The BYDC gun, for example, the price of it was 1.7, 1.8 mil as of last year. And then right now, it has climbed up to 2.6, 2.7, depending who you're buying it from, in millions. But that's also because of the bird devaluation, by the way. There was...

in the evaluation in the past year as well but yeah like the cars definitely but at the end of the day they're also like still cheaper than a lot of the fuel cars you know for example like even the luxury ID4 ID6 and stuff they're like you know cheaper than like the

the few, like, Tucson cars or, like, the Toyota, like, RAV4 and stuff like that. Like, they're much cheaper. And then I feel like it also feels better when you're, like, spending your money on the car itself than you are on, like, taxes, you know? Because this is, we're talking about, like, brand new cars, you know? At the end of the day, they are...

I can't compare a brand new car with a car that has been around for years as well. Naturally, the brand new car is going to be a bit more pricey. And they're still not more...

than the fuel cars. So that's definitely more like making them more affordable, you know, also like for future, you know, like now there are like more insurance companies offering insurance on car batteries. There have been like official importers and assemblers for like Chinese EV vehicles here as well. So like spare parts is not going to be a problem anymore. And also like the importing of spare parts by companies, the government has completely like eliminated all taxes, right?

There's zero tax on importing spare parts as a company, not as a private person, of course, as a private entity. Also, the tax on importing semi-assembled electric vehicles is just 5% as well. So the incentives are there. It's more affordable. And then also, just as a comparison, it costs 20 bir, which is not even...

Like five cents. It's not even a dollar. It's not even a dollar. It costs 20 more to charge, for example, an ID4 even, like let's just hold like an ID4, from 20% to 80% to 90%. It costs 20 more. Wow.

fuel prices, as we have said, is $0.8 per liter. You know, so just like make the comparison. Like people are, like fuel prices really, really like, yeah, they're like, I mean, EV owners like are saving hundreds and thousands of per on fuel.

which is thousands of dollars. It's like saving from like charging up, you know? And then like, besides that also, there's a few shortages as well. So, you know, there's usually like queues by like fuel stations and stuff. So like, they're also like saving time as well. So I would say definitely it's unaffordable. The cars are like more affordable than the internal combustion vehicles. And at the same time, they're like, these are, we're talking like brand new cars, you know? So yeah. Yeah.

And I think the car that you said you could not remember, it's a Chang'an Benbar. Yes, East Tang. And this is one of the taxi drivers that you featured who had to shift from an ICE vehicle to this EV. And he was telling you that the savings he's making are enormous, that huge.

there was apprehension and kind of fear at first until he was able to provide comfortably for his family. And then he was like, oh man, this is the way to go. 100%. So this is Solomon. Yeah. He was one of, yeah, he was the main subject for my article. And yes, as you said, he bought the car on bank loans as well. So he's also being bank installments, which is around like $500 a month. And he,

has still been like able to comfortably provide for his family so you could only imagine like how much this car is saving him because also as a ride hailing driver you also need to remember that time is also like very precious you know so like let's say if you spend like hours lining up for fuel every week even like it really does like affect their work a lot sometimes because of lack of fuel they would stay home and like not work on that day as well and stuff so he was telling me like

There was huge hesitation in the beginning. He was also like an electrician and he also like has a family and he had like a decent IC car. It wasn't like it was breaking down and everything, but he just decided to make the shift. He knew it was a good idea. And then like also, as I said, as the demand increased because the supply cannot like fill it, like, I mean, you know, like catch up as past.

the prices of these cars have been increasing. You know, just like naturally, like the dealers and the brokers and they've been like increasing the price, like the players in this EV market see. So he knew like the prices, like since he bought this car, which was six months ago, and compared to today, like the price of the car has already increased by like around like,

600 to 700 dollars wow yes exactly like just in the six months because also because of the devaluation of the the bird as well you know like i mean yeah the bird against the foreign currency so yeah he knew that like if he keeps on waiting like eventually this has to become the move you know because also he spent all his profit like he had no profit because he's spending all of his money on fuel so and then which is only projected to increase like you know in the coming like it's like literally increasing in increments now of like

A month, two months, I think. So he just knew that like, you know, it's a race against time and like he had to get this electric vehicle. And now all the stakeholders around him as well are just like, yeah, it was a great idea, you know? It is. And I think it is. And of course, if you'd like to hear more, you can find the show on our website and also on YouTube as well. And if you want to read Sarah's article, it's open, by the way, not behind the paywall. Ethiopia's middle class ditching gasoline vehicles for electrics.

with Chinese EVs dominating the race. Let's just continue a little bit because part of what you're talking about, and again, we keep coming back to cars, but I really want to emphasize that cars are potentially a pretty small part of this bigger mobility equation that the Chinese

are absolutely transformational in Africa and across Africa. It's happening again with e-bikes and scooters and tractors and tricycles and boats. You've even did a show on electric boats made from Chinese tech. Give us a sense of the broader mobility landscape

that this Chinese green technology is being now used by some very enterprising individuals in different African countries who are taking it and innovating with it and creating all of these new business models as well. Let me start by a community that is mostly overlooked when it comes to innovation, and that is people who are

mobility limited, people who use wheelchairs. In Kenya, a few weeks ago, I got to know of an organization, actually two organizations, two companies, two startups that are working to ensure that people who use wheelchairs in Kenya have a better means of moving from point A to point B or within their houses using motorized wheelchairs. And what you realize that motorized

most of the focus when we talk about EV tech is taken to vehicles, to buses, because we have BusyGo and all. But very rarely do we talk about these people who are in this space whereby they would need someone with them all the time for them to move. But when they get the independence because of the kind of solutions that e-bikes Africa and Ace Mobility are creating, you see that the solutions that are coming for them are something that

have not been thought out in China or in India. You find that these are solutions that are being created nocantly because there is a real need that needs to be addressed.

And so when we talk about EV tech, the Chinese EV tech, because the batteries and some of the plastic components are coming from China. When we talk about this technology in African countries, in Kenya, where I am, we think about, you know, cars, we think about bikes, we think about e-bikes and things like that. But rarely do we think about this community that is largely locked out of mobility. And so coming back to what we are talking about, that we do not have to limit ourselves to just looking at mobility.

or thinking about EVs as being vehicles, buses and e-bikes and all. But it is cutting through the sector, the social strata or statuses of people and making life more comfortable for them. Because if you get someone who has been used to either pushing a wheelchair using their hands

And then they have one whereby it is mortared and it can move without having to be pushed. They can be able to do business. They can be able to be independent. They don't have to rely on anyone. Then these solutions are what really make a mark for this technology being adopted in Kenya and across other African countries. But again, I will come back to buses because mobility in Kenya especially is very limited and very unfriendly.

especially public transport. But we are seeing some changes with the e-mobility in buses in that there is more discipline, there is more in terms of profitability and also in terms of how the staff are treating commuters.

It is changing. Unlike the usual matatus that you have seen, some are clubhouses on wheels, some are rowdy, some are very disrespectful. But what is happening with the EV shift is that we are seeing a change, even in how the drivers and the conductors, the guys who help load these buses, treat commuters. So I think beyond just the tech, there is also like something that is being instilled in people that this can work for us and we can make it work.

So, and it cuts across all those sectors. So one of the very interesting aspects for me about this and your coverage about Ethiopia particularly, and I think Sarah's coverage as well, was that the introduction of EVs in Ethiopia was linked to the cancellation of a fuel subsidy by the government. Right.

And obviously, you know, fuel subsidies, petrol subsidies are environmentally very problematic. This has been like, you know, environmental activists have been fighting against state fuel subsidies for a long time, and they still are. And in South Africa, it's kind of the opposite situation because the state in South Africa has a fuel surcharge.

And so, you know, a quite controversial one that has actually just been increased. So I was wondering if you could talk a little bit about the use of EVs in these two ways, in a way to kind of get rid of a fuel surcharge without causing a huge political problem, or like a fuel subsidy without causing a huge political problem. But I

And then also, you know, kind of the larger issue of fuel costs and how EVs are used to avoid them. So it's interesting because like in Kenya, for instance, let me first come to Kenya before we get to Ethiopia, is that our fuel is all imported. And so 80% of whatever is made within that sector goes out of Kenya and maybe like less than 80%.

15% is retained locally. So most of all that goes out there. Money that would do better spending locally to develop and to grow our economy. But when you look at like even what you're mentioning in South Africa, the surcharges and, you know, making fuel expensive. That is what Ethiopia did when they introduced the EV policy. They

moved to make fuel expensive so that people could shift. It may sound insensitive that a government would have such a policy because not everyone will be able to switch to electric. But if you look at the kind of savings that they make in terms of like import bills when it comes to their fuel,

then it starts to make sense. Because for a country like mine, where all this fuel is coming in, if you look at the destabilization of that sector that we had last time, whereby we could not get the fuel, the economy comes to a standstill. But imagine if we were powering our economy on, you know, mobility on electricity, which we do not have to import from any other country, then it makes sense that fuel becomes expensive.

But then again, I am not saying that we do not become sensitive to the people who are relying on fuel or ICE vehicles. ICE is Internal Combustion Engine Vehicles. Yes, because also they have invested in that until now that we now have to move. And so we have to also be sensitive of that, that even if we are going to have policies like Ethiopia's, then we have to also think about these people who invested in multi-million value cars.

or trucks or whatever for transport, and now we need them to shift. So we have to be considerate. But in Kenya, we have also seen that even for these old ICE vehicles, people are retrofitting them and making them electric. While there are concerns about the stability of that car performing the way it was originally made,

And others like, you know, in Kenya, you have to go to the regulator and to the National Transport Service Authority and get to change that this car has moved from being ICE to being electric. And also in terms of insurance.

It is possible that, like we are saying, our solutions are local. It is a problem that we have. We need to move. So if fuel becomes expensive, then we need to move that way. Even though some of these are pet projects for some of these people because they are managed, they can afford to do this. I think that instead of, you know, discarding the ICE vehicles that we had, we can retrofit them and make them useful. And this will be cutting again out on waste because we know that there is waste that comes from discarding

But to your point on the affordability of EVs, because that remains one of the major obstacles, is that they're still very expensive, especially compared to second-hand vehicles. You can get a Toyota with 100,000 kilometers on it for around $10,000, $15,000, right? Even cheaper, maybe. And yet...

New EV cars are considerably more expensive in part because of these tariffs. And it's maddening to see why when you're talking about all the benefits that could come to a country like Kenya, where they have abundant energy and they could power their mobility and their transportation sector through more energy and wouldn't have to import as much refined fuel, that all makes sense. But again, the economics don't add up.

because buying an $18,000 tiny little Henry car, and I'm gonna talk about this Henry car. Again, it's a brand that nobody's heard of, and I'd like you to tell us about it. Doesn't make sense, but there are ways to actually make it make sense.

Tell us about the case of this Chinese brand called Henry in Kenya and what they're doing. And also tell everybody about how you and I both got the story wrong at first. Yeah, it is very interesting that, you know, in Kenya, whenever we see a car, we take it that it's being sold. And so this is the price. And so when I spoke with Henry brand, kind of the company that is dealing with them, Rydance,

My first impression was this car would be sold for like two million and something Kenya shillings, about $18,000, you know, like 16,000. - And you were thinking that it was gonna be sold to individuals and families. - Exactly. - And just so can people visualize what this is, it's a tiny little shoebox of a car. I mean, this is a very, very small car. Think a little bit smaller than a Mini, a Cooper Mini, if you will. I mean, one of these kind of small, way smaller. So it's a little shoebox of a car.

And so $18,000 and people on YouTube were like, this is crazy. I can get a Toyota, I can get a Nissan, I can get something for that kind of money.

But you found out that it wasn't targeted at families and consumers. No, it was for ride hailing. And this ride hailing is the company that is owning these cars. They are not selling them yet. So they own these cars. And what they do and how the business model that they have is they are leasing these vehicles to drivers. So if I go there today, I am...

a driver. I do not have a car. I do not have a job, but I can do the taxi business. Then I go to Rydance and tell them, I need your deal. I need to be driving. I need to make a livelihood. And so what is the agreement? What is the arrangement? And so Rydance gives me this car and I have to pay $25 a day. And then whatever else I make in that day, that is my money. And then for one day a week,

All the money I make is mine. I don't give them that money. However, for this car to be fully paid back, it is going to take about two years. And looking at the price that we are talking about, because I spoke with the Rydens later on, and they told me that if they were to sell this car, it would be at 2.5 million shillings. That's about 19,000 and something dollars. Bonkers. Bonkers. It's crazy. You would never spend $19,000 on this car.

But again, a lot of that to remember is not the value of the car. It's the value of the tariffs. And that's what's pushing the price of this car up. Exactly. Because in China, this car is going for between $6,500 and $8,500. So when it gets to Kenya, it's almost three times that amount. That's crazy.

And so the taxation is kind of crazy when you look at how the last price that you get them for, it's almost another car. Actually more than another car because if you add them up, then it becomes more than half even of all that. So I think for Rydens, their approach was like, because maybe it may be difficult to sell these cars, let's lease them and make this money as you know,

We continue contracting these drivers to work for us and give us the $25 daily. But then again, if we shift from Rydance and look at some other arrangements that companies are having in terms of like business models, we see there are those who are on pay as you go or pay as you earn, whereby I go get this vehicle. It could be a bike. It could be a

a vehicle. And then the difference from ride-ins for this pay-as-you-go is that at the end of my tenure, or when I have paid off the price of the car, the car or whatever vehicle be it, a bike, it becomes mine. And so for many in our economy, it's

It's very expensive to go and cough up $1,000 and say, I am buying this. So what happens is that these arrangements are made whereby there are daily rates that I pay. And then after maybe a year or two years or whatever number of years, I will have paid off this vehicle and it becomes mine. And then... This is what... Sorry to interrupt you, Njenga. And Kobus, what's so interesting about what Njenga is discovering in the course of reporting on this show...

is that it's not just the technology and it's not just the mobility, but it's the business models that are being innovative here. And one of the things that I've noticed is that here in Southeast Asia, again, very comparable level of development in most of Africa. So a country like Vietnam is right at the mid-level of development. The innovation in the business models in African countries that we're seeing with Chinese EV mobility tech, light years ahead.

of what we're seeing in Southeast Asia. I mean, just not even close on bank loans, on financing, on wheelchairs, on all the different things that Njenga has highlighted in his show. And it got me thinking that this is an opportunity where we should rethink about Africa and its role in the innovation ecosystem, because typically foreigners, white people and Chinese people go to Africa to say, we're gonna tell you how to do things.

Okay. What we're seeing here in Njenga's reporting is that Africa actually has the opportunity to tell everybody else how to do things. And that is what's very exciting about this. It turns everything on its head. Yeah, I think fully, you know, it's so inspiring, so interesting. And, you know, I think it's one of the situations where these developments have been going on and no one noticed.

until Ndjenga noticed. So I'm really glad that we're kind of highlighting this. Yeah, I'm blown away that there's not another EV Africa show. Honestly, this is the first of its kind in Africa. So, I mean, I'm glad that we're pioneering this, but I'm also surprised that there isn't more interest in the topic, at least on social media and in the podcast space. You would think there's a podcast for everything, right? But not yet. Yeah, not in Africa, but like the African podcasting space itself is exploding. So, you know, there we go.

Yeah, it is. It's definitely getting better. Okay, Njenga, let's kind of look forward a little bit. Let's remind everybody that while there is a lot of excitement about EV technology in Africa, it's still a very, very...

tiny percentage of the overall mobility space. I mean, so this is in the infancy of its growth here. Let's kind of look ahead about some of the topics that you're going to cover on the show and, you know, kind of entice people to subscribe to the podcast into what you're doing on YouTube as well and tell about what you've got planned. So looking ahead, we are going to be, like I mentioned a bit earlier, is that we'll be talking to even the automakers themselves who are coming to establish or to sell their brands here and

And again, like the innovations, they have been siloed for the larger part. And so, like Eric, you're mentioning that it is not out there, the interest seemingly not there, but it's because most of these countries have been operating in silos. And this is also something that I'm coming to find out that Kenya and Uganda or Kenya and Tanzania do not really work a lot together until you have gotten to a point whereby, oh, they are doing this. And so,

So basically, a lot of the growth is very siloed and very limited to the specific countries. But we'll be looking at some of the things that are happening across. In Tanzania, we have a story that is coming up, Eric, and it's on retrofitting tour vans or tour cars. The land cruisers, the Toyota land cruisers are very synonymous with safaris here. Safaris, right.

So we have that. And then there is like a shift in Tanzania when it comes to e-mobility, green mobility. Let me just stop you very quickly on the safari one and why e-mobility is so interesting because if you go out in a diesel car,

Toyota Land Cruiser, the noise itself can scare away some of the animals. So by actually going out in a silent EV car, it creates a better tourism experience for visitors to go to these parks and again, could then drive more business to the parks because people have a better experience because more animals come closer to the vehicles and people get closer to the experience of it all. So again, there's just all sorts of ramifications that come from this beyond just the environmental effects. Right.

Yeah. So in addition to, of course, the savings, because you find that guys who operate diesel vehicles like buses, I have spoken with some in Basigo and others in, you know. What's Basigo?

Basigo is the company that has been doing electric buses in Kenya, the BYD buses in Kenya. I've spoken with some of the operators and they're like, when they were operating diesel buses, they were spending 40-50% more on fuel than they are doing now. So you find that for someone who was spending probably $100 on fuel, they are now spending maybe like $60.

or 50 and yet they are doing the same number of trips that they were doing and also this money goes to them so basically they don't have to work as hard you know as when they were operating the diesels but like i was saying in terms of like even the tour the safaris tracks and all when it comes to uh

what you have said, there is silence, there is not as much disruption or noise that is coming from these vehicles, which disquiets the parks. And

And so the animals will not be startled or scared to be seen. They will be there. You will just happen on them. And so there are many advantages that are happening with this. So in Tanzania, they are retrofitting these trucks and we'll be visiting them and to see what they are doing. Then again in Tanzania, the three wheelers are very popular. And so we will also be looking at some of them as well. And two wheelers as well.

And also renewable energy in terms of like completing the value chain, the energy value chain, whereby there is a company that is doing renewable energy by installing solar. And so these solar installations are helping power these vehicles. So apart from, you know, the buildings where they are at, they are also being used to charge these electric vehicles, be it the tricycles, be it the bicycles, I mean, be it the e-bikes or even these safari trucks.

So there are many stories that are coming up because, again, we are getting feedback from people who are saying, oh, we are also doing this in this country. So can you be able to spotlight this? So I know that as we grow, we will be getting more of these stories from across the continent. Well, we hope that you will continue the great work that you're doing. And we hope everybody listening to this will sign up to...

Subscribe to the Africa EV Show with Njenga Akina. Of course, it's free. You can get it everywhere you get your podcasts, on Apple, on Spotify, anywhere else. Also, you can follow it on YouTube. We've got a playlist for it. And also, he's putting these great videos, these side videos. And one of the most interesting things about what's going on on YouTube is when Njenga makes these videos behind the scenes and shows the cars and things like that, it's sparking this incredibly robust discussion

In the comment section. And there's just a lot of excitement about this. If you like tech, if you like innovation, if you like development, if you like mobility, this show is for you because what Njenga is doing is he's introducing you to the key players in this space that you would probably not come across if you just were looking on your own. So these amazing CEOs and these entrepreneurs who are creating next generation mobility in Africa, very...

Just amazing work. So congratulations, Njenga. Thank you for joining us and for sharing more about it. And we're looking forward to showcasing more about what you're doing on the platform. So guys, we are doing a lot of great things. And what you need to do is so that you do not miss out.

Just follow us, subscribe, and we will make sure that everything that we discover, we share with you. There are so many things that we cannot discuss in this show, which are still coming up. So please make sure that you follow us, the Africa EV Show on YouTube. We are under China Global South Project. So you will get to get all this information being served to you hot because when we discover it, we bring it to you. And there are so many, many things that are happening, so many innovations happening.

So many creations that are coming with these collaborations. And so we will keep highlighting them. And of course, making sure that as an African or as somebody who is interested in e-mobility, you do not miss out because some of these are hidden in spaces you can not easily get to. But we will make sure to dig them up for you so that you get to know what is happening in this space across the continent. Eric, we cannot, you know, ex-host this. It's too big.

It's too much. - Yeah, it's a big space. And we're gonna put all the links in the show notes so you can sign up both to the YouTube channel and the playlist there as well as to the podcast. And this is really the first of a number of new podcasts that we're gonna be rolling out this year. Gérard, Auberte Boré and myself are gonna start launching a Critical Minerals podcast

that's gonna come out twice a month talking about the latest in African critical minerals mining, also in South America as well. I mean, there's just so much interest in this space. And so we've been doing a lot more there and there's been a lot of demand for deeper discussions on that topic. And it's just part of all the great work that Njenga and Cobus and Giro and Obert, Lucy are all doing around the world in Asia, Africa and the Middle East for the China Global South Project. But this work cannot be done

without your support. And the best way to support independent, agenda-free, fact-based journalism on what the Chinese are doing around the world is to sign up for a subscription at ChinaGlobalSouth.com. Go to ChinaGlobalSouth.com/subscribe. Subscriptions are very affordable. We try to make it accessible for everybody. We've got a fantastic reader community spread, again, around the world in governments,

academia, and we'd love for you to join us. And don't forget, if you are a student or a teacher, you get half off. Just email me, eric at chinaglobalsouth.com. So Kobus and I will be back again next week with another edition of the China in Africa podcast. For Njenga Akina in Nairobi and Kobus in Cape Town, I'm Eric Olander. Thank you so much for listening and for watching. ♪

The discussion continues online. Follow the China Global South project on Blue Sky NX, a China GS project, or on YouTube at China Global South and share your thoughts on today's show or head over to our website at chinaglobalsouth.com where you can subscribe to receive full access to more than 5,000 articles and podcasts. Once again, that's chinaglobalsouth.com.

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