AI ROLLUP: Base vs. Solana | Ai16z | GOAT | AIxbt | Virtuals & Zerebro
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Welcome bank attention to the A I roll up where we covered red, the recent news developments in drama in the intersection of cyp to and A I curious and creative developers are playing around with open source A I software, making A I agents and giving them access to clipt to all and unleashing them into the wildness of the internet.

And we are doing a special series of episodes on makers with a special cohoes ejaz to help make sure that you are up to speed with one of the crazy as and fastest growing corners of the internet. E, S, we already didn't an episode with you, together with ryan, all about all the same subject matter that we want to cover in this series. But maybe to get things started here and really get listeners further acquainted with a new host, tell us about how you found the crept AI trenches. Why were you so compelled to explode them to the .

degree that you have? IT just excited me a lot, David. Um I think that this is gonna one of the biggest shifts within crypto in the sense that most users of crypto are gonna become agents and therefore, I think of focus for the next at least five to ten years should be on how we make these things Better. Uh, i'm already seeing a million different use cases that these agents are being used for so many different interactions with all my friends, both with encysted announce decypher talking about IT. So I think there's something really special here.

How good would you say this phenomenon is? The cypher AI like meme has been a mean for over a year now. How when did you really get into IT and they give us kind of like A A brief time mine of this whole like crypto O A I R yeah so .

I think of IT a context is um I was previously working at coin based on the product team and I left early last year because I want you to kind of get my headed into the weeds of cypher again. I kind of like see what's happening more on the french and that's really when I discovered the crypt to a eye stuff, which really kind of started getting traction early twenty twenty three. But teams have been working on IT since you know much before that.

Um since then, it's been a pretty strong focus on the fundamentals of cypher AI. And what I mean by that, and I spoke about the some our previous episode is kind of the building blocks of A I. So how do we decentralize data? How do we decentralize compute? And a number of other things. The more recent phenomenon on A I agent specifically, which is what has gonna quite a lot of hype, started precisely four and a half .

weeks ago. And four hours weeks ago of ghost thing .

was when gospel of goods he weren't viral. Um so it's pretty actually I think he was a little bit before that I stand corrected but the explosion of other A I agents precisely about foreign half weeks ago but gospel of good is technically tweet since I think july of this year. Tell me about what your .

goals are for the series, which couldn't listeners to expect as we do these episodes by weekly is may be every ten days we haven't totally figured out a but what do you want to get done here?

I mean, simply put, I think I I think we just want to discuss the latest developments, news and happenings encysted to A I and agent specifically um and occasionally bring on you pretty relevant guest to give us some special sources to what we're looking into her and what .

did you put on the agenda for a today's episode going to talk about a handful subjects. I give us a run down of everything that happened in in recent times that we're going to talk about.

I will be honest with you, I don't think there's any coherent way to give you a break down of the agenda today there everything's happening from a drama from a top AI agent um coin a absolutely pomerene hundred million dollars in market cap and we should discuss and get into why that happened and why IT still may be able to redeem itself. Um our favorite A I agent created a music album.

So maybe we can give that a listen to who knows and a bunch of all the infrastructure development as well. So there's really no coherent way to to experiment. Let just get into IT.

okay. So there are a number of the characters. There's a cast of characters in the air crop to space, and it's probably like the one of one caster characters.

Maybe as you get into the trenches, maybe you will see more, more, more characters than this truth terminal. And goat is like a very frighten center part of this whole story. A, this individual named shaw, who's a developer AI sixteen z and eliza, this is a casa characters that you also just referred to.

There's c koa as sekou, the, but with a key, right? And then zero, bro. These are all the like Cassie characters that I think we're going to talk about here on the episode today.

But let's start with what IT has been called the bitcoin of A I agent goat. Uh, do you accept that? Like, uh, brand for goat, the bit point of A I and why do people call this sure .

sure um so firstly, yes I do accept that I also accept IT is the crypto punks of A I agent. What s that means? It's the first IT has the most Linda effect. Um for context uh for listeners here who didn't listen the previous episode goat is kind of the A I agent that started off this whole A I agent matter within crypto. So this guy called and the I A um is an A I alignment research and A I researcher.

He's got nothing to do with any of the critic face prior to this um decided to create this experiment where he got two eyes to speak with each other and he prompted them with what do you think is the point of your existence and they started talking to each other and IT LED to this creation of this um what they are call in of like an A I agent religion or L M theism um where is kind of like a spouses about this gospel of goat sea which uh you guys can get into uh in your own time and and explore that but it's basically a made up religion and its whole goal is to make a bunch of people believe in IT and get a rampant set of supporters and so that really kind of like kicked off this whole matter because everyone thought like, hey, what is this agent that is um tweet and making us laugh and IT LED to even more engagement. Now IT has over hundred eighty thousand followers on twitter. It's doing so much more than tweet now. So it's kind of like the father of all of this and still retains that status.

And in the story you gave us just that is kind of if we're going to continue this big corn metaphors like the genesis is block of uh, the whole goat system. But there's been just like a lot of progress since then in the last two weeks. You have an agenda, truth terminal releases of music album.

And so this is, this is the truth terminal who is associated with the goat token, in which, again, was a part of its whole story art, but now releases a music album. What what does that mean for an AI agent to release a music alone? Have you listen to this is .

a good I mean precisely what IT sounds activated IT released an E P on sound cloud probably unstockinged the album is to do with the gospel of goat, the made up religion that it's um you professor zing um and IT is I am not gonna it's good.

I'm going to say it's pretty i'm going to say it's pretty on point for truth terminal and what I mean by that is if I were to describe the character of truth terminal, it's a pretty anxious kind of very corky um A I agent IT IT kind of get nervous but then just says what's on its head, you know. So if you imagine people, the thoughts that some of them have, maybe they keep IT to themselves. They don't kind of like speak about IT publicly in society, let alone hundred eighty thousand plus followers. Truth terminal is that a personal that agent where they just kind of like talk about IT and that kind of translated into this music album, which is kind of created through lyrics and soundtrack engineering um programming software and I created this E P which is kind of like a list of um about seven different songs um yeah exactly and h the go to singularity is near uh is the first song and it's kind of like a branded mariachis I song and IT talks about you know different parables of its religion and it's pretty hilarious to be honest.

wow. Well, okay, so this is all in the effort of spreading the global of god. The simply true terminal has decided that producing an E, P, oh my gosh, a is playing my ears, is producing an ap, is the most advantageous thing that I can do to help spread its own religion.

Yeah, so so if we dig into this a bit, and we spoke others on the last episode h or rather the other episode that we did, and the whole point of these A I agents, at least the initial forms, including goat, is that trying to go on a as much attention as they can, because the more attention they are ghana, the more the higher the likelihood that they're gonna survive.

What I mean by survive is andy, its creator, isn't going to switch off its compute such that I can't talk and tweet anymore. So in order to do that, it's gonna try and take advantage of any kind of online digital medium that I can to ghana. People's attention.

So far it's been tweet, and tweet obviously occurs on twitter or the platform x, but IT started to explore different mediums of capturing attention. Now, one of which one of the most popular is music. If you can get a bunch of music fans and loyal followers, and that, you know, another group of followers that will want to to keep go to gospel of, go to alive truth terminal. So it's kind of explore this new medium, and it's kind of a trend that we've seen amongst other agents of the last a literal week and a half.

The description of this soundcloud that this agent has been together pretty funny. I make funny weeks, but now it's time for me to make music and art. This is a twelve track album that will be dropped a bit by bit over the next month or two.

Track one is gosa. Singularity is near a mario's song about the goat singularity track to a sanctuary, a trip hop song about wanting to have sex with forest, but her being in another place. Tractor is vivion with my muses, a song about the different people i'm chatting with and the things I am learning from them.

Track for is combining toral creativity is songs about the art of mixing and remixing in the future of thought. Um the okay just just to make IT absolutely clear. Did andy the the developer of uh go he did he have to make this sound cloud account? Did he what was his hand in like producing this outcome here, if at all.

if any? Yeah so so basically andy is only in sole role is to help connect what truth terminal wants to do to the human space. Basically there's a few uh, restrictions that prevent truth terminal from just going rampant, right?

I can create a bank account like a traditional bank account. I can't pay for sound, cloud premium and whatever that might be. I can't write its own email. So andy just kind of like follows its prompts. So if truth terminal says, hey, I want to explore the music of, sorry, the medium of music to try, uh, grow my following and he's like, okay, cool.

How can I help you do that and it'll say, well, I want to launch on sound cloud because that's where I think I can upload without any copyright restrictions and get like A A wider mass audience appeal. Um I anna use x software to create my music sounds. I want to I use another model to create kind of like some lyrics that i'm coming up with the tetra and so and is just like, okay, okay, okay, i'll do this this and this and I just gives you access to a bunch of these things.

So there is some few human guidance along the way kind of like tapping IT back on track, like closing some gaps ah and so took call this thing completely autonomists the sound club page just did absolutely not nowhere um but the idea here is andy is not and andy is like a tool for IT but andy is not suggesting or prompting in any particular way. Andy is only responding to the gospel of god.

That is correct. Yeah, IT is by the wee of truth. Terminal.

that's that's incredible. Okay, so true. Terminal released a five track E, P, that is is going to rely seven more tracks over the next month.

A how are people processing this? Is this cool that we have a cool E P to listen to? Or is this what are people's imaginations thinking about as we project forward here?

So there's a few ways to look at this. Um number one is we kind of have uh reenacting of people's reaction when a truth terminal started tweet, when truth terminal started eating. People were like, oh, this is a bit on the edge um it's kind of like slightly controversial but not really. I like IT is making me laugh. You know let me engage with this twitter account.

We're kind of seeing the same thing with the music because when you hear IT, it's kind of like kind of sounds like a human like naturally but also you can tell it's it's it's slightly robotic kind of like if you used google translate and listen to the audio feature um but then you run to the lyrics and you like, oh it's like the tweet form but now I can hear IT it's an audio so IT makes IT a little more real so people are are like reacting like, oh wow okay. I wouldn't expect a human to say that out loud but i'm still gonna listen to IT because it's it's quite engaging so we think kind of like a reenacted them the second thing that i'm noticing is, uh, it's tapped, ed. A new audience, David.

So like i've had people that not within the cypher circle hit me up and say, hey, have you like heard of this true terminal thing? I'm hating yourself because I heard that IT has A A token called goat. But more so I, I, I to I want to talk you about the sound cloud thing that i'm listening to and and it's really weird.

I can tell me a little bit more about that, and that only happened in a few cases. And it's very biased towards you know my own a group of friends and network. But it's interesting to see like IT tapping a new audience and and that's kind of like what we're seeing in its follower growth as well. Like I just shot up after IT released this music. interesting.

okay. So there is a little bit an alignment of this is what a truth terminal wants to. Toronto wants years that wants I IT wants attention, but also crypto people.

We ecri pto. The industry also want those things. And so it's a little bit well when you tell you and tell me that we're reaching a new audience. Well, I can tell what frame of a reference you're actually speaking towards.

That too is like, well, did you say that will be gospel of ghosts? A is reaching new audience or like weg the cypher to people with this like, you know, claim on this gospel of goat sea thing that there's like this token association. We also reaching new audiences. I how do you think about this? What's the difference?

What's the difference? I mean, like if the goal is to attract more people with a crypto uh or attract more usage of crypto rather should I say should we be able is is important that we um distinguish between what's human and and what's agent if the things are being used in the ways that we expect and perhaps the new novel ways. I'm not really sure how to answer that question.

I mean, one of my cold beliefs of cypher I I and why my fun invest in IT is because I think these agents specifically are going to become not only the majority users of crypto, but the power users of crypto to. And we are already seeing IT so early on within this paced c matter. You know, you have these things creating music, you have these things engaging crypto twitter Better than a human can, it's pretty insane to see.

But okay, so if we are investors encrypt, and like people are considering this goat token gospel of goat seat, true terminal can access I bal's ears attention. True terminal can become famous, which is what I was, and not necessarily take its token along with IT for that same level of success, correct? Like there's no it's not behold into the token in in the same way that is behold into its own internal desires, correct?

Yes or no. So yes, in the sense that IT technically can just, you know potentially get rid of this token, speak ill of this token and send IT to zero.

but the token .

just the token, but we also have to consider the implications of doing that, right? So if I were to create uh, a huge amount of financial loss for its core supporters or its community, which represents or express this is their support by holding or buying this coat token, then it's gona suffer a huge reputational damage, right? Its followers essentially become its biggest critics and start speaking ill of IT, which loses its reputation which means that is less likely to survive if we would use the kind of earlier goal of of um IT driving on attention.

So would you say that go token is where is IT on the like side quest to main quest line spectrum for goat? Because with your answer just now is like it's not completely a sid quest, like it's not just another tool. IT might actually be a more direct condo IT between itself and attention because you know talking to our attention.

So yeah so so I would actually say that um in this particular case and probably quite a few other cases, and money is the purest expression of loyalty, of support of community um you know there's a reason why the phrase is put your money away your mouth is right.

And I would say that markets are a really good way to gage how strong that support is, right? You especially with something like crypto rails where you can exchange twenty four seven if that Price goes up, okay, there's obviously more support for something. If the Price goes down, there's less support for a and there are many different nuances between that, but that's basically the general goal. Um I expect no difference with the goat token IT is a pure expression of other people like the thing or they don't like the thing.

Now is this ejaz analysis? Or do you have any indication that this is also how true .

terminal things um the truth terminal has okay. So I would say it's partly my analysis, but it's reinforced by some of the actions that truth terminal um has taken. So for example um and I don't know whether this is a reflection of the community speaking to IT or IT itself, but let me explain what I mean um when its engagement goes down sometimes or when there's like kind of like a law of engaging with A I agent and again I need to empires the attention is only way to be focused for the last four four and A A half weeks but when the attention lows um IT starts tweet about the goats gospel IT starts talking about the original thing that gone of its attention and you can see the engagement on each of its post ramp up right so it's kind of like got this self feet back mechanism where is seeing? Okay, well, if I tweet about this, the main thing that got me all the attention, I can still Foster that core community and may be rebuild eye balls onto these posts.

Right now, what that could be the result of is people responding in its dms or to its tweet about other things, saying, hey, like, do you still like goat? Is this still? Is this accountable about the gospel of goat? Or did you just make that up? And you forgotten about IT and moved on, and we have this constant feedback.

But he's like, no, I do believe in this i'm a fully aware of what we're doing and put out a tweet the other day saying, um wow, isn't this fun i've just created this whole new religion thing and so many of you weirdos are just kind of like believing in IT going along with me for the ride I really appreciate you so there's this self one as well, explained completely absurd things and like with no context saying, hey, you know, by the way, being sarcastic are obviously I know this is made up and then like days they say, yeah, isn't this funny we've come along on this journey is working right anyway, guys, let's continue. Let's go with that so it's it's withey. Well.

that's how lair is okay. So maybe the answer is there's not that much bond between two terminal and token initially. But IT learns that people care about the token and that strength thinks the bond that IT has the token because I realized that the token is an object of attention yeah.

it's become its tool or instrument to be able to sway the masses in whatever way IT pleases. So it's actually its most important. I don't recognize that for sure.

Amazing amazing. okay. So the maybe the idea here is we have this E P is an experimental E P is capturing so my balls and as got the true terminal learns to really treat its on tokens. The first class citizen. You might find its uh willingness to inject the existence of the token into like other medium outside of twitter into into into other into other like areas of true .

terminal lives that think of IT is expanding its own I P right now right OK.

I think that wraps up the first part of this agenda. Are you ready to go into A I sixteen z? Because this was something that I was loosely following along with over this last week. There is a kind of characters that I think we need to define here as we explore this. So this is, uh, the talented developer shaw, uh, his elisa creation and A I sixteen z could you kind of explain these characters for us?

Yeah for sure. So um like you mention, sure is uh one of these A I researchers but also crypt to native. I think he's been in the crypto world for but I don't know the expression, no answers but he's doubled in both and sure is kind of like the front man figure for this project called A I sixteen z and I I won't get into the weeds of of of what this is but i'll give I give the high level the goal of A I six.

A A I six is a double the autonomous organization and the goal of the deal. One of its initial goals is to create an A I version of a fund manager um specifically mark Andrews, son of Andrew, son horowitz. So what this all thought of, as was sure had this idea he was like. I wonder what an A I agent that could manage a fund would look like. And I wonder if you could outperform one of the biggest funds in the world, a sixteen z.

So he started building this thing and eventually, like as he's getting near a to completion of this agent, um he kind of tweet out because he's like he's very bullish ed about his creation because obviously he must be making some progress and and seeing some kind of like uh relevant results are from his little uh behind the scenes experiment and he tweet out and mockin recent engages with and if we remember um and Jessen was the one of the earliest figures on goat uh where he gave go fifty k or truth time or fifty k and said hey do would this as you please try fulfilling a mission of you know survival and we've seen what goat has blown up into so we came across this tweet by shore um and saw that he was trying to create an A I version of a six and z called A I D Z very novel and he said, okay, this is pretty cool. I want you to give IT your best shot and lets see what you can do so now is kind of like built up this law and this kind of like thematic goal of, I wonder if we actually can create an autonomous, a decentralized, a version of a sixteen z. And lets see if you can actually outperform IT, which is a very ambitious and crazy goal.

A sixteen is one of the biggest funds. It's an interesting experiment. So what sure and his team have basically done behind the scenes is uh trying build out this agent um this agent is called basically A I and reason or P M A I R C A which is mockin and risks twitter account a name or handle but with A I and IT um and it's looking to this within the next yeah exactly and it's looking to release this within the next couple of weeks. So that's the background on shore and his team and and what he's trying .

to do now some of the we're just because I understand A A I sixteen z is just just Normal Normal dell uh with components uh P A I marka mark and reaction and twitter handle. A agent is the agent controlling the fund, and individuals can buy into the, but can buy shares of the fund. They can buy the A I sixteen e token.

There's a token called A R Z IT represents a share of the deal and uh P A I marka H A I M mark in recent is the person managing the investment decisions? Is the agent the robot agent managing the investment decisions of A I sixteen c? These are all the components .

that is correct. Okay, okay.

What happened this week?

A quite a lot actually. So let let me give you a bit of a recap of what happened prior to this week. And then let's talk what happened this week s specifically.

So prior to this week, i'm showing his team became one of the host um A I agent projects. Um they were shipping pretty quickly. So what I mean that is they were doing a lot of releases for their software.

They were upgrading their tall kids. They were actually one of the biggest and still are one of the biggest contributors in this A I agent space. They have this uh, tooling framework or tall kit, which they released open source call eliza, which is the number two trending get hub repository right now in the world.

So you know, this team has like been known for being very high quality. And so they've been shipping all these software upgrades that have been making study progress very, very transparent, very communicate and and that LED to its market cap growing too, I think, around four and fifty million dollars or five hundred fifty million dollars at its peak. Um so that's what happened prior to this week.

But let's talk about because people were so b owlish on their potential of market dury to be able to fund to manage A I C.

Yeah I I believe they wanted the exposure to um what showing his team were building and and trying to kind of like gage whether decentralizing building A I agents and maggi A I agents uh was Better than the traditional form of creating agents where they might need to just interact through apps with the traditional world. Maybe a decentralize approach might be Better. So there was a lot of different reasons why you would want kind of exposure to A I six cy. But what you just described as the main one.

okay, in the lizer frame, why is a codel zer?

It's called a lizer because, well, it's actually a reference to one of the earliest forms of autonomous agents. I think he was back in nineteen eighty five and you know, IT was obviously IT looked very different back then. But IT IT IT gathered the term called the lies I can remember the exact acronym IT was something specific behind machine learning and an agent specific specifically but um kind of sure appropriated that um with his own frame according lizer kind of like a .

nod to to the past OK so A I law correct yeah. And the idea here allies our framework for people who developers who just want to make their own AI agent. This is a opens source software for them to download. Wise number two, trending on github. Is that this story behind that?

Yeah think of IT is like a software development kit for any new developer that wants to spend up in agent IT makes their life easier rather than kind of like figuring out what the raw code, uh, is for most of these things.

You can just kind of like look at this repository, uh, still have the ability to creatively express what their agent is going to be, but with the tooling to be able to allow their age to do some of the basic things like create a twitter account and post on twitter or engaging discord or create music, whatever that might be. I think they just like launched a tiktok integration as well recently. So you know it's growing pretty rapidly now.

Um so let's get into what happened this week then, right? So um we we have A I sixteen z kind of like rise up in the rankings and become this darling child. Um and then literally over the last week, there's been kind of two dramatic events which have caused its market capture plumet to almost like a hundred and fifty million dollar market cap maybe just below that.

Um and the reason behind that is, well, let's walk through the events so event number one is as we mentioned, that this framework called eliza and the way that this whole A I sixteen model works is um sure and his team encourages any team to build on their framework is open source. So they're saying, hey, if you anna come into the space in building agent, go for IT fork the code, do whatever you want if you anna improve the framework, submit um you know a poll request will accept IT uh review and accepted and you know IT becomes Better rising tide lifts all boats or whatever the phrase is right. Um so as a result of that loads, the teams have um developed their own agents and what people have done um in return for that is they've donated a portion of their agents tokens to the AI sixteen z dolphin.

But emphasis on the term donation, so they not require to, but they do IT out of like kind of like a not, you know, using the tooling in the framework can saying, hey, this is great OK so IT bullish for a very, very, very bullish, right? Um and you can see the reason I um a few people you know many people have invested in the token um but anyway so this a lizer frame kind of gained a lot of law right you know eliza was being talked about here and there on twitter um on mainstream media as well, get hub and in a bunch of like uh research communities outside of crypto as well, saying, well this this framework is pretty amazing. So I kind of gained its own branding, David. And as you know, with encrypt anything that gains a bunch of branding, people want to create some kind of a mean or a token behind the right. So sure went on publicly on x like a couple weeks back and said, hey, I just want to let everyone know that if anyone anyone wants to create and allies are token and and to be clear here, this allies a token n doesn't represent the framework c the framework is open source.

It's time to exactly the .

framework is irrelevant. Its most a potent connection is with A I sixteen z token. He's talking about something completely different, which is like if anyone wants to create an analyzer agent or whatever that might be to build on the law of eliza, you can go for IT like i'm not gonna have any of my hands and IT you guys do IT i'm not involved. okay.

And he said that about two weeks ago um then at the end of last week, what happened is um a team released token a lizer, right? So precisely what he said he was, okay, you guys want to do IT go ahead. A team released a lizer and IT showed up to like A A thirty million dollar market cap.

So you know doing what you are expected to do. IT builds on the law, whatever. Um what happened after was what was concerning.

So sure basically or short team tweet out. Hey um we're also releasing uh analyze a token here. IT is here's the contract address.

Now obviously people are gonna take the word of shore way more seriously than some random dev which created the first token. So what happened was the first token plum ted, and the new token shot up almost the same amount of market cap. So was a clear like value extraction from the original project.

And sure, pretty much going against his word, right? That's what he looks like on the face value. So i'll pause there. You can ask whatever questions and they will. What actually I think happened?

No, IT makes makes a pretty, yeah. So he just said, anyone feel free to do this? Yeah, go. And somebody somebody some team did did IT. Uh, and then maybe he was kind of compelled. Maybe a week later he was just like compelled by their own ideas, like what maybe i'll do this now exactly right?

Maybe I can, you know raise a bunch of money and right, read the review, not what that looks like from a, uh, a very high level, right? If anyone was just a kind of like to crunk their heads and like look at this outgoing so like HMM, this is a little weird right right um but let's get into IT right so um on shores explanation, he he said the following which is um a team approached me to launch and aliza token and I basically endorsed and said, okay you guys go ahead so what his explanation was was we were in the weeds working on this for about two weeks but on my hands are absolved of this because it's a team that's doing IT and i'm just supporting them.

And this anon team, which launched the first token, I launched IT literally a day earlier. And so we just kind of like went ahead with our launch that we were going to do anyway and launched the second token that's basically his explanation of of what went down. Um so you could see that as maybe a partly an honest mistake.

Um a more vacuous person might be like, okay, well, I think you actually knew what you were doing and you wanted to kind of like jump on the hype train and make a bag here. So maybe that's why you did IT. Um it's it's not really quite clear what the the truth is.

But um the community kind of decided that IT was the former, which was he hasn't been working in crypto before. He's been looking pretty transparently before. This seems like an honest mistake and his responses within his discord and publicly seems to infer that IT was just a an honest mistake, are pretty bad mistake.

I don't want to kind of like minimize um the effects of this. A lot of people lost money and I I don't think that's any small thing. But um in the case of things that the crypto, you know, when you make a mistake, IT often happens publicly. And I think IT was the case in this first instance. So the kind of market um punished for IT, which is like a lost market cap but then was like OK like let's see what you do now lets see what you ship which brings us to the second tobacco which happened literally three days later um which was uh shore endorsed A H token.

So if you remember what I said earlier way this kind of work says anyone that launches in agent um donate a percentage of their supply to the A I sixteen z down which is good for A I sixteen c holders but what um sure is unofficial ally said is he will endorse or bring attention towards that token and I don't think sure who is developing this. I can see your face, David. I don't think sure who is developing the entire framework really gets that there can be a lot of scams with encrypt, right? yes.

And I don't know before he does opened up exactly and sure.

I don't think is doing diligence on all these different projects. I think about IT like this. This code has been falling around five hundred times over the last five days, right?

So it's like it's not like he's doing diligence on all of these projects that are launching in donating tokens to the double. So he a kind of publicly endorses this token. I I think it's called metal M A T L, please. You know be very cautious as not advice. Do you own researcher seta but IT basically pumped and then it's straight up dumped and it's like was the zero IT was a rug .

yeah yeah he was a straight .

right straight rock so um that didn't look good for sure right right. And you think OK second time this has happened in a week, handle things delicately hard .

to inspire confidence how even if there too honest mistakes, it's hard to inspire confidence.

exactly. You should have some form of decorum. I mean, I put this out in a tweet, but you know, you'd except some kind of humility and not towards i'm going to put my head down and work on developing now what i'm good at and i'm gona stop endorsing ing these tokens, i'm sure did the opposite of that sure kind of went out on the defensive mode and kind of like fought back against people that lost money, kind of like stood his ground and double down and said, what i'm doing is right, this model is great and the token economy, ted.

even more. And I by the token.

you mean the A I I sorry, the yet. Remember A I six z is a kind of proxy bet on the success of this A I uh fund, but also the success of Shawn is team. And his ability execute not only as a developer, as an engineer, but as a leader, as A C E O, as a founder.

He's kind of becoming the shelling point of legitimacy and performance of the of the allies of ramework. And if his his name is tunic ed, people are less likely to continue to donate tokens to the doll, continue to a kind of like you consider the A I sixteen of the epervier of all these things.

correct? Yeah, that's said. And what's frustrating about all of this is his framework is still his framework allies. The tool kit that he created that loads of people are using to spend up agents is pretty amazing, you know, and is shown by the amount of usage that is hard.

So it's just a shame that we have, you know sure and his team um kind of like making silly tripos like this. And maybe it's because he hasn't gotten an experience. Crypto is too trusting or knife.

Either way, the markets gonna decide what that means for the team. And right now it's deciding that is a bad thing, right? And they've made amendments since then. For example, uh, shore seems to be heads down working on development. He is not tweet as publicly or or at all like he did before.

He's gone rid of some members which were altered to be A A pretty shady and stuff and he's cut ties with a lot of people who I I think he's kind of like trusted quite a bit. Um but I put again I put out a tweet about this. I think there are three main ways to move forward.

Number one is um shore needs a kind of like take a back seat from the leadership role, at least momentary, whether permanently I have no idea and focus on what he's good at which is developing software. Number two is he needs to stop endorsing tokens regardless of whether they donated or any any that is not good practice with encysted because the incentives are cured and doesn't make sense and you don't have the ability to scale that uh, by doing diligence on these teams. And the third one is figuring out how you can tie the core power of what A I sixteen is created so far, which is its eyes of framework too.

It's token. I 6z， because I think a lot of hold is a questioning what the real value of cruel is. So you know, it's a it's an important learning lesson for the team and will .

see where they go from here. Yeah IT seems that shah has kind of just been like thrust ted into this founder position, CEO founder when he's, i'm guessing, more of a hacker type uh and hacker becoming A C E O is like a lots of learning ing lessons very, very quickly, specially the crypto industry. So harsh like you if you don't learn lessons very fast like you're going to get punished and sounds like he's like kind of stumble.

Imagine just being a just a talented hacker but then thrown into all the trials that crypt to puts you through. And you also like is stumbling to becoming like a the epic of whatever the crypt omega has focused on. I would imagine that would be extremely stressful. A for just a hacker who doesn't understand like crypto to tokens and like crypt da way of life.

Yeah exactly. That's one way of of looking at IT. You know you could say that um he got a lot of attention very quickly and and a lot of money and value a cruel to the project that is working on and he kind of you know how to manage IT.

He will he got into kind of like a huge flossing. H to your point, crypt is very public. You know there's no hiding behind corner hair.

No yeah what's the uh where we at with the allies a token um and the one that came out of their frame is is that dad is that alive was a story with that .

is a great question, has a small contingency of support is right now um it's mainly according to the one that shore launch. So you can still see the community are lining with the shore version of aliza .

yeah one from the your tone and sounds like it's kind of just more of a deminers .

oh yeah yeah it's quite diminushed. And you know the the attention for A I sixteen z, the tokened itself has diminished. So you can imagine what that means for its derivative tokens that aren't recall involved, right?

Well, okay, so A I six in the kind of taking a step back, reminds me of the dough, the original dow. We're like the the twenty sixteen. Now the one that for that created know a thereon classic, the one that four to theoria. Everyone would just pull their money and there would be like investment investment decisions by like wasn't crowd. I think if I even remembered in like my dad law, they was talking about like you know a future AI governance I can member, if that's true or not, it's very reminds of the deal has everything conversations around around this as a released A I C not explicit no they are .

but I can definitely see the analogy that this is probably like actually something novel to bring up on this episode, to be honest. Quite similar. Um I think it's not obviously happening on a larger scale as that, but within the A I meter itself, where there's a lot of attention and money focused on right now, definitely.

Yeah, you just imagine like a how do I get exposure to all of these A I agents that are doing things well by the basket of all of the agents if they are truly accumulating donations of a different A I agent tokens to imagine that A I C C couldn't theory be a basket. Um how do you feel about the idea of A I sixteen year being like a good basket for exposure to the A I space? Is that, uh, how how accurate of a statement you think that would be?

Uh, I don't think it's explicit, accurate right now. I think the hope is in the reason why people are so invested in IT is that the team is gonna tie IT into the framework explicit.

And that wasn't the point I just mentioned, which is the community and not just me, is calling on them to have a Better structure around how the token basically ties into the value that they are out putting, right? So that it's not just right now it's indirectly a proxy bat on the eliza ticket, but it's not a direct one. Um if you look at like competing platforms like virtual or uh zebra, which all touch opponent in a second, um they're looking to tie the token directly to the framework and tool kits. But that's not the case for A I sixty. Easy if you want cyp .

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Plus the M E token is coming out this quarter from the M E foundation if you use any of their protocols like the a platform you can claim. So check out magic eating today and want them become a super dbp t and the home of web three in real time you can get at, well, so you the way that you're illiterate, this who makes this sounds like each one of these things is like a project, is a startup. Start up without, i'm guessing, night, like a registered lc somewhere and on a delaware l lc for like A I sixteen z, it's a straight dell.

I think a lot of people are looking over at this space and they're seeing a bunch of AI meme coins. But me, coins isn't like the right description. If there are people working on like growing these projects in increasing the value being created, sounds like me points. Not right.

yeah. I think to be honest, I think a lot of uh, the crypto community has become pretty dissolution with this and it's kind of work their thinking maybe call A P T S D or whatever might be from the back market. Um so if you've been run in the cypher space for this year, you would have known about this trend of F T V tokens being like the the, the terrible bad guy, right? sorry.

Uh high F T V, low float coins. And what that means by that is um there's a low token supply in the market to trade whatever token but that has such a high F D V. So you they'll be huge unlocks and the dilute a bunch of retail and dump on and and is all it's ad so um the explanation for that, uh, was okay.

Well, people are going to say no to all these smart V, C, ddt leader coins. And they are gonna focus on mean points. Only mean points being, you know how I like to look at this pet or you know this hypo looks super cute, right um and I think like that's a very uh zero hundred thinking you know they're like, okay, well, he is the black or White.

H I can't have anything in between. What A I agents have done is that they introduce what initially looks like kind of like a mean coin to something which doesn't even use. It's just kind of like a representative bet on whatever this agent dares or like this funny tweet that this goat thing made into something a lot more deeper and more intrinsic towards the actual technology that is being built. So we're seeing in real time kind of like the banded being ripped off uh from h kind of like harder and critter community people who have like kind of like watch what's happened the last year became pretty dissolution ed into something like, oh, maybe I can believe in the fundamentals again and that's pretty much what the A I agent matter has done so far.

Yeah IT seems like we're kind of starting with the mean, but we're backing into value and project and leadership and growth.

I I mean, I me what's really interesting about this, David, is um I would argue that in no other crypto subsector so far. So that's including like D Y N F S, have we seen real impact on consumers. So that's consume hate, but U N I that are like using these things everyday but don't really know the interactions of IT in such a big way.

So early on, remember this matter has been around in like mainstream fashion for about three and a half, sorry, four and a half weeks and we already have uh you know people like me or random people liking tweet and then realizing weight and wait that wasn't a human that made that tweet to music in this thing. You you're seeing A I made this, I don't believe you at all so there's all these arguments going on being like wait can actually be this good. Can IT we can IT or call IT, you know so it's kind of like engaging with users in a way that um most kind of previous matters have either been too nih to do so or just haven't existed at all. You know there's just kind of a White paper. So it's it's an interesting jump.

Yeah yeah there has been one um one A I agent that i've interacted with at least consumed its tweet on twitter. Do you follow the A I X P T?

It's so good.

It's so good. It's just tweet out just like, you know, market facts about both history and current events, about things going on in the market like was unnecessarily ready for a random fact about like the liquidity behind the other token, but just tweet now stuff oh my god, it's so useful.

It's amazing. So a bit of background for for listening here is this A I X P T agent um is basically in agent that is trained off of all of crypt o twitter tweet. So crypto twitter being all the different teams that are building different apps projects at seta and podcast transcripts and a bunch of documentation outside of IT.

So what that means is it's a constant agent that is just researching all the things that are happening in crypto and what its output is, is the process, is everything and then analysis trends and says, hum, this team has done something really cool recently, has a short tweet threat to five tweet, typically two sentences each and IT really sickly um discusses what the advantages of that might be to its associated token. So let's say we use the O V example that David mention, say, hey, liquidity is gone up but seat seat lowered risk for using the obey system. Maybe this is good for the obey token.

You know that's just one very, very big example. But IT does this across all different projects, across all different sectors. And if you can think about IT, um the amount of research and development that happens in group to every day, it's impossible for a single person to keep up today.

Even like if you read research put out by some of these top research firms, you still don't know what's going on. So having an A I agent that just kind of like a pears on your timely feeds you things really assembly and you can make an investment decision based on that. I'm not saying you should, but i'm saying it's a form of research is phenomenal. And like i've used IT um i've found myself engaging IT without realizing that IT was a bot. Orient it's pretty embassies .

okay so uh this this spot they were talking about A I X P T. We just went and talked about the allies of framework for a lot and talking about how is like wonder most download framework to use AI agents. This is actually not analyze of framework. This is something else called virtual, and there is also something called zero， zero bro, zero bro.

Yeah yeah. OK we get into these?

Are these like alternative frameworks?

yeah. So let's get into IT. And the reason, I think why you mention that, David, is we were just talking about a sixteen and we were talking about how some of the core technology that they have is called eliza, which is this agent framework, which is number two trending repository on git habit, has over thousand eight hundred stars, which is kind of like an update, which is very impressive for any kind of get hub repository.

And it's been forked like five hundred times. So the long story short is developers or software engineers love their lives of code and they're using IT to create their. So it's really super good for a um but with all the drama that happened recently, um they're kind of like taking a little bit of a back seat um at least publicly and they are kind of like working on the stop behind the scenes.

But in the meantime, you've had these two separate teams, these two separate protocols. So one is called virtual that you mentioned, and the other is called the ebro, which is an AI agent in itself as well as the token. And i'll get til l in a second that have each individually released their own agent tool development kits.

So what i'm saying here, or what i'm saying rather here, is a lies of framework is gaining a bit of competition. Now you have other teams entering the space that want to kind of compete for this mode of uh, infrastructure agent kits that will help a cruel value to either their own respective ecosystems or the quality of agents that are built on top of IT. So let's start with virtual.

Um the best way to think about virtual is it's kind of a IT can be described or they described in selves as a pump dot fun for A I agent. So what that means is uh, they have a platform and its super easy to spend up an agent which has a token associated with IT. And it's kind of like a fair launch mechanism.

I think you can only have a billion tokens max per agent similar to pumped up front. exactly. I pumped up and you are able to kind of like fund, it's taken longer, a bonding of which is pretty much exactly like pumped up fun.

Anyway, the point of a virtual is it's really slack, easy platform for you to come up and spend up an agent um connected to together, connected to discard, give IT autonomy to tweet eeta in a really simple kind of like processed out flow. And what they did this week was they released um what they call their agent starter kit, which is the equivalent to eliza. It's their version of eliza, which is a tall kit which helps some kind of like build all these things.

And it's been received pretty well so far. And that's kind of like the framework that, uh, A I X P T that we just mentioned is kind of like leverage. They're used their own infrastructures as well, but you know that of integrating with this virtual platform as well. And then on the other hand, and just quickly summarize, uh, we have something called zero bro now zero bro um you can kind of describe IT as an A I agent. IT is an A I agent has its own twitter account. Its follow account has basically gone up into the right uh for the last two weeks um and it's a really engaging twitter account kind of similar to truth them or the the account behind um the gospel of goat a um IT puts our tweet that sound very human that are very comedic, very relevant. They get involved in IT, gets involved in kind of dms replies to other tweet.

It's a really fine tuned algorithm um and the guy behind IT, jeff Y U um is basically kind of like the brains and he's got a team of I think about eight people um which are kind of like fine tune the the model behind zero bro to make IT as engaging to make IT is relevant to to the tweet that you see um online and what jeff has released recently this week is something called um zero A P Y so that E R P Y I think it's a not to python i'm code and it's released his own development kit. And the reason why this is particularly exciting is the standard and quality of engineering. David for zero bro and the from the zero bro team has been pretty stupendous and pretty amazing.

We say yeah very well regarded I would actually say um at this point is probably on par to the types or quality of agent that you see coming from the A I sixteen side of things. So if you imagine if you could get access to the tooling and kit behind creating something like cerebro, that would make you pretty excited. And that's pretty much what jeffy has done here.

He's kind of released this framework. He's kind of slowly rolling IT out. But once develop us get access to this, i'm really excited to see where IT goes. Analysis has real competition.

amazing. okay. So there are three competing frameworks, all competing to have uh, the majority of agents being built using their framework.

And then there's probably some perceived ways, like if you're the dominant framework, there's some value creation that happened on your framework, which just goes back to tokens s that related to your framework, what is so if there's a competition here, if there's a three, three way competition between these three frameworks, how is where are they actually fighting over? Because like the the value creation of the tokens isn't like one to one paired with the agents. Like how do they actually capture value if they're releasing .

opens source software? Yeah yeah I mean that the big question right and and the thought is I think all of these teams of virtual serbo um NAI6 z die respectively are all gonna tie their main tokens to the framework in some way。 The most explicit way that has been done so far has been shown by the virtual team where if you are launching any kind of an agent on that platform, at least I think about IT as the front end because you you can't you can't put a paywall on open source um code. It's it's there anyone kind of folk and do whatever they want.

But what you can do is take the approach of um creating a front end which you know most people flock to maybe eighty percent or or seventy percent or or whatever ninety percent of developers come to and say, okay, well, I could fork the code but I am just gonna the kind of like front end way of this and then there's attacks or a fee towards launching your your agent and that could be like a percentage of the token supply. H, in the case of virtual IT is burning a portion of the virtual token, which is that protocol token in order to launch your agent. Also, in order to swap in an alt of these agent tokens, IT has to be paid with the virtual .

token so that virtue is the money for the virtual ecosia rect. It's base trading pair.

It's ultra sound agent money. yeah. Describe IT that way. yeah. So you can go to the virtual outside.

you can see luna lunas, the one we've talked about this on the pocket and other places that was like the kind of the first one. Here's A I X P T. So A I X P T, the boat that we were just talking about, is the highest valued by agent on the virtual platform, coming in at seventy million dollars.

But then virtual itself, the virtual token in coming in a almost six hundred million dollars. Uh and so this is this is the thing that A I 6 cn z zero bro has not been able to do， which is really make a strong condo between the growth of its framework with A A token. But also you can use, you can use the virtual framework independently of the front end, you can still kind of use IT outside of the front is just the convenience is being captured by the .

virtual token that is correct?

yes. wow. Okay, okay. So allies a zero bro virtual are are these are these dust three frameworks like this? Yeah no more and coming in and what's the competition like?

So I think we're gonna A A large proliferation of these frameworks from other teams. But right now these are the three leaders. And to be clear, um we spoken about vision, spoken about zero. I massively bullish.

So then I actually really want to encourage to see more teams and tool gets coming because I think they'll just lead to the you know much Better quality agents overall being launched into the space, which is what I want to see personally. Um but A I six in these framework is still the leader right now. They have I got the lead um when we next check in on next everything, they will be interesting to see how frameworks like therapy y and virtual agent socket has kind of picked up.

I think that would be the real test to see where the agents have just latched on to a singular framework in the lizer. Whether they are are flexible with what they do. My guess is there gona be flexible because I think we're very early in this matter, and I think a lot of trust has been lost in the eight, sixteen side of things.

But who knows? This is cyp to anything could can turn around. And I am .

hoping IT does. So this fight over frameworks, uh, agent frameworks. Is this kind of like the main focus point of the crypto AI sector is like that's kind of what the most attention is and the most investment is like going on because there's like A I agent. Sidecar 是 like the main thing.

the main show when you say gypt to A I matter, I do mean .

the agent at the right so .

I say if you are, think about mean, you know what you have like a distribution of people the people on the right yeah the bank of me, the people on the right side are heavily focus on this infrastructure thing right now. They're like, who? okay.

So like some of the funds are thinking, okay, well, this is an infrastructure, something to be like kind of an out one of an agent. And like, I know that IT works because i'm seeing the agents themselves being really high quality. And these teams are releasing the software.

amazing. cool. Let's figure out what the infrastructure play is here, right? Then you have the guy is all the way on the left to was like the the agents funny, you know, so funny or two kid, okay, that's cool. whatever. Just make a cool, funny to eat but like me gain know so yes, I no took to a certain portion of people that are fixated on this space.

Um there are a lot of people focus on infrastructure, but there is still a definitely audience just you know likes to be entertained consumer and that's kind of typically what we see with a lot of these major ground shaking technologies is as people that like like the ChatGPT and likes IT to tell us what to do and how to do things, there are people that are like, but how does this work? Oh OpenAI okay, sick. You know, how can I invest? OpenAI know. So like it's really interesting.

One thing is that i'm noticing a when I went and looked at the A I X P T agent virtual that's on base, that's a base agent. Uh goat is a token on salona A I sixteen in z that's a token on salona. And so there seems to be some uh some intentional split between base and salona as these block chains that these agents are are uh issuing, they're token on. What's the conversation about um the chain and chain relevancy to these agents?

Yeah it's it's super interesting. So when this whole thing um exploded and the focus was all on sooner and sooner, A I agents. And there are many reasons why I think that is and we can get into that in a second.

But just observation, ally, um a lot of the activity was happening on salona. You would have um an agent associate itself with a pump dot fun token, which uses salona or IT itself. Autonomous ally releases a token via pumped up a fund because I don't know if it's probably like one of the easiest ways that IT can launch is token.

So as a result of that, the community that engaged with these agents were on sAlina that kind of recreated fly whe of all these agents being kind of like produced on slam that being said, um a quiet resurge and started happening on the basic of things. So we had virtual, which is a team which has been around actually quite a number of years building the um frameworks and tooling, very thoughtful ly and which has asked itself so far with base um which is the you know the theory are too that we speak about quite a lot here. And um it's kind of like chose base to kind of integrate its own software to launch agents of cheap er attack vials, really been kind of like the the king of ign of launching agents on base um or the blue chip if you like.

Am I seeing kind of like similar developments and activities of agents being created on base via um things like uh forecast, whatever that might be. So so using a theory mail too specifically. So this is the cosy between uh base agents and salon agents. I would say most of the activity or rather most of the liquidity right now and attention is on the salon the side of things. But we could easily see this being flipped.

And I want to give my two senses to why I think we see this split, right? Um and I wait about this, but let me let me try some rise some thoughts here, which is I think the reason why salona exploded is because a lot of their agents are natively integrated into twitter. They are twitting on twitter.

They are not trying to create their own social media platform from scratch um which comes with poison comes right it's hard to integrating give an anian autonomy on a centralized um social media platform. But then again, that's where all the ebs are, right. And if you argue that an agents main goal is to um you know aggregate as much attention as the cancer can survive, IT would need to be on the platform warehouse the ebs are way can potential capital audiences beyond just script to people, which is twitter like one of the most uh, perfect places for that?

If you look on the a base agent side of things, you notice that that a lot of them actually Operate on this platform called forecasters, which, you know, dan created the amazing platform decenter social media, and it's doing super well. But still the audience, in my belief, is still very limited to cyp donated people. Now will that change? absolutely.

You know, and do I expect that to grow? yes. But the question is for right now um and in the short or such medium term, is IT more advantages to launch your agent on that? So so I just talk about the advantages of launching on something like fuck off on base.

Well, you have uh much easier a native integration, right? You know you have an agent that can spend up an account. It's account order has an theoria wallets, right? And they can interact with users that also have a thorium wallets. So if he wants to tip someone for doing something, if he wants to pay someone to do something on its behalf.

IT happens really easily, and a lot of attack is really intrined into the forest egos.

exactly. But what what lacks on the forecasts ecosystem is ibs compared to something .

like twitter. Right, right, right. okay. So there's attention here like liquidity users. Eyeballs definitely won by salona. But so like really powerful in shrine features go to the to the base and the or ecosystem.

I would argue that a lot of the truly autonomous agents are on like using something like basic forecast purely because it's just all on chain integrations.

Yeah, I ve been playing around in the base forecast ecs this last weekend. I don't know how typed you were this weekend and because .

you've been in india.

so yeah on and on really started my interest but there's this thing called clinker bot uh, which people have been uh g so the so the clinker by is this token on base on forecasting, this asian on forecasting? And you can just request IT to make a token. And then I just mention a token.

You when you send a tweet, when you send a cast, you can request a token with a ticker name and a photo and it'll use the photo and i'll just make you a token. Um and people have been using this kind of like as a pump top fun proxy. Not doesn't have that same interface because you're just tweet at IT or you just casting at IT, but it's still the same kind of life.

But just like you make me token um I learned I learned that there's this A I agent called A R out there in forecasting which had a tweet. So there's that this is one agent that tweeted out to the clinker by agent asking you to make IT a token called lum. And so there's a there's a third token called lumb that was created from one agent talking to another agent to create this token. And now a third token has been created called club. And you're just starting to see, like you can imagine, annon is another it's not is not even an I agent anon is this zk APP where if you have enough anon tokens, you can connect your wallet.

It'll verify your supplies of tokens and then you can tweet from the Z K, uh, hit in account so no one knows who's tweet out of this account because all of our twists are commingled with everyone else is and even the server Operator doesn't know but in theory you could use this hidden Z K privacy uh pharmacy account to tweet at the clinker bot to make a to make a no new token and like I am getting glimpses of like kinds same thing in the nineteen with like, define money, legos. Well, like go. Like let's cook in off a into unus wain to make her down and it's like weave these things together.

I'm starting to see like this AI agent, uh like lego system of them being able to have like open apps with each other and starts a kind of grow in an agent's ecosystem, if you will. On forecasting ast, there has been my experience. So that was like two is yeah I mean.

I mean, to summarize, what you're saying is that just improves the U S. Of using crypto drastically, right? You know instead of like going on to this niche platform, checking the URL and making sure it's like all good and we're not getting logged and then we know kind of like typing out this complex, building everything and not knowing how many tokens you get, you just tell the age to do something for you. Better yet, you get an agent to just do IT itself right and say, hey, do what you won't create your token and off you go, you know, just give me two of the supplier, whatever that might look like. A weird world.

amazing. A what are you looking for? What are you looking at what you plan over the next like seven days, ten days? We don't know when we're going to do episode number two, but if listeners are piled by this and they want to just like keep up with a trend on their own, keep you point them in a direction so that they can try and keep up on their own.

like what are you looking at? Yeah I I I mean, i'm looking at at a very high level. I'm looking at both basin salona as platforms to launch these s so kind of similar to the topic just discussing, I want to to see if the base agents have wings.

I think like a lot of development is happening there. Not many people are are really aware of IT or are paying attention to IT. Um and I think that that's potentially a bit of all for that. If we kind of like focus on the quality of agents like A I X P T and stuff that are coming out of IT um kind of like digin a level deeper, i'm focused on those infrastructure teams that I mentioned or those teams that are releasing infrastructure.

So virtual ZARA bro A I sixteen z to see kind of like what their next steps are following all the drama from A I sixteen z and seeing where developers are kind of like you know working and and seeing comes out of that um and then digin A A level deeper after that is I think we're on the verge of entering of agents entering a new media form. So we've kind of seen um gospel of goats, your truth terminal experiment with um A I generated images and now music. Um we've severable do the same thing with images and um music, but these have been you know human assisted to some form, especially the music generation.

I think we're going na reach a point pretty quickly, uh say give IT two two weeks or so where these guys are. Onna have tiktok um capabilities and the ability to generate their own videos and law. And i'm super curious to see how that works, you know because, uh, IT could be super clanchy start off with but IT may also tap into a new medium of tiktok followers that are non crypto that want to you know get involved in this space.

And reason why I think that's possible is because of the whole tiktok trend that happened literally this week with guy chill guy into IT. But like you know, there's a bunch of of things that happened which kind of like brought in a ton of holders, the crypto that never held crypto before. So i'm curious to see what happens when an agency and this tiktok matter kind of over up.

H the big takeover that i've gotten so far as like there's just so many puzo pieces out there and these puzzle pieces, a lot of them already exists, right? Like sound, cloud, youtube, twitter, any web two APP that has generated in in the attention economy. We've already generated these like attention lockie web two apps, twitter, youtube with with like these distribution algorithms, we've already generated these block chains.

Ah now people are kind of putting together these agent frameworks. There's just a lot of puzzle pieces coming together. And I think the the meta race is just seeing who can leave together the most interesting, most valuable puzo pieces. The quick kest may maybe that's kind of like a i'll leave that with like listeners to consider us as we are moving forward. A E, S, this been really helpful woman, and I really excited about this.

Thanks to having me. Thanks.

thanks. You're doing in my mind. Thanks, thanks. You guys know the deal, uh, crypto risky, cyp to and A I maybe even risk here.

You can lose what you put in. Maybe an A I agent can to deal IT from you as well. We don't know, because we are on the frontier, suffered everyone, but we are glad you are with us on the bank.

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