Part One: P. Diddy: A Life in Crimes
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Welcome back to Behind the Bastards, a podcast being recorded on a shockingly good week. We've all been in a real downswing since the election, but some great news lately. A thing happened that we probably shouldn't joke about, but you know what it is. Bashar al-Assad fled Syria, Nick Fuentes got arrested, and our guest today is one of the

one of my favorite people, someone that the audience has not met before, but someone who has been a friend of mine for like 15 years. Great human. Very excited. I have told some stories about this person. Hold on on the great human stuff. Great human. My humanitarian friend, Greasy Will. Uh, Greasy with a Z. Uh, Grammy award winning, uh,

Audio engineer. Yes, and proof that you can accomplish great things with half of a brain. For the album, you win that Grammy for the album Michael by Killer Mike. My audience will also know you as the other person in that story where I had a light bulb fight in Santa Monica.

Oh, man. Amazing times. Good times. You and I had some adventures. Yeah, and you know what's cool is like, I mean, you know, I'm going to have my best etiquette today because I am a Behind the Bastards fan. Because, you know, I listen to this show because it's like hanging out with my friends still. You know, it's like every day that we've ever been together is like Robert gets them like, hey, man, you guys ever heard that story about the Egyptian guy? No.

No, tell me more. Tell me more about this fucked up dude. And we had a lot of conversations about when we were going to introduce you to the Behind the Bastards audience. And I have made a request for three separate topics. And I have never told people those three topics that I have requested Robert to write about. But one of them is today. And I desperately wanted you on these episodes. So I'm very, very excited about it.

As a representative of the hip-hop industry, it's appropriate that we are gathered here today to talk about P. Diddy. Oh my God. Sean Puffy Combs. It has been an amazing opportunity to be here for this because, you know, there is a certain thing, and I'm going to try and be careful today because, like, when you're in the industry as deep as I am, I'm 15 years into doing this, it is...

It's damn near impossible to miss the rumors, right? It's like – and I actually had a huge viral TikTok right at the beginning of all this when the first lawsuit dropped, when the Cassie lawsuit dropped. I had a viral TikTok that got like 10 million views because I was like – immediately I was like, damn.

Diddy's going down, dude. Because there's certain people in the industry you've heard so many things about for so long that when that thing comes out and like the first damn breaks, that first little, the Dutch boy pulls his finger out or whatever, you know it is going to start uncovering ridiculous things. And I even said at the moment, I was like, if the tabloids are starting to run with this stuff, it is only a matter of time before the feds get involved. Like the feds don't like looking stupid. Yeah.

No. They don't like looking bad like that. And when somebody is sex trafficking across-

I'm not laughing at the sex trafficking. I'm just happy that he got caught. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's like you got to know. It's like this was coming. It was going to happen. And when it opened up, when the dam opened up, it was like, oh, let's see what happens. Let's see what happens. At one point, Robert was like, he had new baby goats. What kind of goats were they? That is the story that opens this podcast.

Oh, great. Yeah. Cause you started by being like in the industry, I've been hearing fucking rumors about P Diddy for years. Well, roughly a year ago, my goat had little baby goats and one of them was a hybrid Nigerian Angora mix with the softest hair I've ever felt on an animal. That's not a chinchilla. Beautiful animal. Uh, uh,

Previously, I had gone with the rubric of naming my livestock after famous historic dictators because it amused me to have to, for example, cut the shit out of Joseph Brodstito's ass dreadlocks. Like, that's just kind of funny, right? But this particular goat was really cute, so I decided I wanted to give him a mirthful name. And I told Sophie, my producer, I'm going to call him P. Diddy.

Now, let me say here, I'm not a pop culture guy. I didn't know anything other than like P. Diddy was like a rapper. I actually didn't realize how into gangster rap he was because, again, not super aware of all this stuff. I was just like, oh, he's like a Snoop Dogg type figure. His image has never particularly been gangster rap. Not since he was having people killed. Yes. He definitely took...

More mogul. Yes, absolutely. That is a great way to say it. He was the guy who has companies, the alcohol, Ciroc. He's got this. He's got shoes. He's got clothing. He's got all this stuff. He definitely shifted like Ice Cube did to Disney movies. It was like that immediate, oh man, you can get away with not accusing Ice Cube of anything, but you can get away with so much more if you look a different way than the guy who's involved in multiple deaths and shootings. Yeah, sure.

And yeah, so like that was, I was like, oh, just name P. Diddy. That's a fun name, right? Anyway, Sophie did her job, which is to dive in front of bullets for her host as a producer. It's called the Wednesday. Yeah, and said, no, you cannot name your goat after Diddy because he's a monster. And I was like, oh, and I looked into him and there wasn't a ton out at the time. And then he got righted by the FBI a few months later. And I was like, oh, Sophie was right. It only took a minute.

It was only going to take a minute. Did not take long. It was a well-known secret most of my entire life living in Los Angeles. I had missed it. Everybody, if you're in a certain kind of scene around the world, in the industry in LA, it's like you will always hear that like,

It's like the caterers. It's the people that are like the service workers of the world, the engineers, the white dude in a room full of rappers sitting at the desk that's like, oh, shit. Really? They just say this out loud? And it's like sometimes it's secondhand, sometimes – but it's like you'll hear these things and it will be like some older like grizzly dude that's like, yeah, man, don't ever work for Kanye, man.

Or famously, don't go to a Diddy party. Don't go to a Diddy party. Don't hang out with Diddy. I had even watched earlier this year that movie Blink Twice. And I was like, oh, this is kind of interesting. And then I find out later, oh, it's supposed to be about Diddy. This was a veiled way of talking about this guy. Right.

So if you're like me or if you're someone who knows more about Diddy, you know, the question is, how did how did all this like how did this guy get to where he is and get to do what he did for so long without having a downfall? And we are going to answer that question and more this week on Behind the Bastards, a podcast about people I almost named goats after after. And we're back.

So Sean John Combs, which is kind of Sean John, which is the name of the clothing brand he's going to make later, was born on November 4th, 1969 in Harlem, New York. He was the son of Janice Combs, a former model who worked as a teacher's assistant most of his childhood until

Uh, his father, Melvin Earl Combs had served in the air force, but later in life became a drug dealer. Uh, he also, he worked for a guy named Frank Lucas. And does the name Frank Lucas mean anything to y'all? Hmm. No, he is. If you've seen American gangster, that's the guy Denzel plays an American gangster. Sean's dad works for a very serious gangsters played by Denzel serious, right? It's,

As an aside, if your goal is to make a movie about like crime is bad, don't have Denzel play the gangster. That's just going to make me want to be a gangster. Everyone wants to. Yeah, it's the Aaron Taylor Johnson of situation, you know? You got to get like, you know, the right kind of feel for people. Yeah. Denzel is so handsome.

What are they doing? It was like the Gladiator 2 movie really wouldn't like, it would have been a totally different film. I thought he was a good guy the whole time. Yeah. I was like, no, I'm on board. I watched the whole movie and thought he was a good guy. Get him. Oh, I guess we weren't supposed to like this guy. Oh, is he bad? I'm so confused, man. It's Denzel. He's wearing purple. What's not to like? He looked regal as fuck. I was just like, oh man, I just. He should be the emperor. Yeah. Yeah.

This seems fair. Yeah. So, tragically, Melvin Combs was never played by Denzel in a movie. Instead, he was assassinated, shot dead in his car in Central Park when he was 33 years old. Yikes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That is Diddy's dad. That is a young one. Yes, yes. Sean is two years old at the time, so he never really knows his father.

As a little boy, his dad's death served as a constant reminder of the consequences of crime as a lifestyle, or at least that's what he would say. I don't know how true that is because, again, very involved in crimes. You know, it seems more like it was like a lesson on like don't be the guy in the car getting smoked at 33, you know? Be the guy who Denzel winds up playing, right? Yeah, yeah. Be up a couple levels. You know, you got some more wiggle room up there. Uh-huh. Yeah, don't be a private, be a general. Yeah. Yes.

So his mom moved the family out of Harlem not long after Melvin's death, taking them to Mount Vernon, a suburb in Westchester County. Now, as an adult going by the name P. Diddy, Sean would make a lot of statements about the poverty he was raised in, because if you are coming up in hip hop in the way he did, you want to like act like you came from a really hard background. For sure.

I mean, this is, we will probably talk about this, I'm sure, eventually at some point, but like, this is the Tupac thing. Like, he went to, he went to like a performing arts school. Like, he didn't grow up, I mean, his mom was a revolutionary, you know, activist or whatever, but he came up in a pretty decent kind of lifestyle and it wasn't until he got into that East Coast, West Coast beef that he gangstered up hard. Yeah, yeah. Whereas, I mean, we're going to talk about Biggie. Biggie does come from like...

A rough background. Right. Selling cocaine instead of making record deals. Yeah. Now, and obviously Sean is massively exaggerating how rough his background was. I don't want to minimize like his dad getting shot when he's two. But his mom is like Tupac's mom, one of these people who works incredibly hard and is very responsible. She gives her kid a good degree. Kids a lot of stability and comfort.

Sean goes to a prestigious private school, Mount St. Michael. It's a Catholic school. His family is very Catholic. He wears a uniform. He plays football. His mom describes him in interviews as having been an entrepreneur from a young age, starting his own paper. And not in the way that you often mean that in Hip Out. He starts a paper route as a kid, right? Right, right. Yeah.

in order to make money. She told the New Yorker, we had a Cadillac car and a house and he liked life like that. Right? Huh. So, yeah. Was the actual quote...

That he was an entrepreneur at an early age. That was a direct quote. Yeah, there will be. Some Conor Roy ass shit. Conor Roy was interested in politics at a young age. There will be a lot of other stories like that. It's again, I mean, this has been brought up many times on the show. Kids show too much aptitude for something at a young age. You got to worry about it. When your kid says he wants to be a CEO. Look, I'm not saying you should do this legally, but maybe get him into drugs. Yeah.

Slow him down a little bit. Slow him down a little bit. Look, I got two kids now. You know, it's not, you don't just give them drugs. You leave them around. You just leave them on the street. They'll figure it out. Yeah. Yeah. Put them outside and don't watch them enough. Like my parents did. Yeah. Yeah. That's...

And we all turned out great. Your children could also be having light bulb fights in the streets of Santa Monica. And winning a Grammy. And winning Grammys. So one story Diddy likes to tell is of the time his aunt babysat him at her home, which was in a public housing project called the Patterson Houses in the Bronx. So again, his mom gets out to the suburbs. They own a home. Other members of his family obviously are a lot less comfortable living

And the story he tells us that he wakes up, sometimes he'll say, I woke up with 15 cockroaches on my face, which you didn't count the cockroaches. Nobody would in that situation. You can feel it. You can feel a dozen cockroaches, but you can't count them as fat. You don't know the exact number, man. And in other recitations, he's less specific. I'm not saying this didn't happen. I think it probably did just knowing the other stuff about his life.

But he also placed it. I've lived in decent places where cockroaches are on my face. I too have woken up with some cockroaches on my face. This apparently inspired him to seek wealth and success. Quote, and this is from him years later, I was like, no, I'm not going to do that. I'm going to get out of here. I'm going to be somebody. I'm going to own something and be able to take care of my family. I don't want to live in these conditions no more.

And again, you know, I'm not, maybe something like this happened. He also does bring it up exactly the way you would if you're trying to like throw out in interviews scenes that people will put in a biopic about you, right? Yeah, for sure. That one sound bite that grabs you at the perfect time and they're like, yeah, man, like that's it. You're never gonna be anything, P. Diddy. You'll never make it, kid. You're gonna go down just like your father. Dead in the back of a car. Yeah.

Now, Diddy would later claim that the memory of this harrowing event inspired him whenever he made a change in his career. It was something that just kind of snaps on you. Don't take less in life and fight back. Those roaches still to this day, whenever I get comfortable, I just remember them. I remember living in a situation where babies weren't changed for two or three days and everything smells and there's no food. The memory is the thing that really fuels me to make sure that one day none of us have to live like that. And...

Did he didn't do anything to make sure none of us had to live like that. And you didn't live like that. Right. Yeah. Yeah. He, he, he, he made sure you didn't have to live that way, but, um, yeah, fair enough. I mean, like that is often, you know, uh, whether true or not, you know, I like, there's definitely probably essences of that, you know, like, uh, of being true because like, you know, like, like,

Like, that is the story of a lot of people in America right now. It's like going through some really tough times and like seeing... Sure. Trying to like get through... And like, that is often the story, especially when it comes to successful people in the music industry. It's like, hey man, I came up hard. Used to be anyways. It's more nepo babies these days. Yeah, it's more nepo babies. Used to be...

Music was the great equalizer, you know? It was like you could be poor and from nowhere and become the biggest in the world. That's what music used to be. Yeah, and it's, I mean, like everything, it becomes more oligarchic as it fucking ages and gets sclerotic.

But like, it's also not weird. You know, I can say I didn't I wouldn't say I had a hard upbringing. My parents were like poor when I was a little kid. Financial stress is like a lot of my earliest memories. And that's definitely part of why I have gone after money as an adult. Right. Because like I didn't want to have screaming fights in front of my partner about the fact that we couldn't afford rent or whatever.

You know, that's, that's absolutely like that. Absolutely. A lot of people have had that experience. A lot of people deal with that now. It sucks ass. Like, so I, I don't doubt that some version of this is true, right? That he encountered a lot of poverty around his family and was like, well, fuck that shit. Right. Yeah. Yeah.

And I do think it's interesting that like his connections with financial desperation are not direct. They're family members. Right. So he always there's always this sense of like I'm separate to from this from the hardship. Right. Like it's not direct to me, which is interesting.

Now it's worth noting that Diddy as an adult told lots of inspirational stories about moments from his childhood that inspired him to later greatness. And maybe all of these are bullshit, but you know, let's hear them out. That's definitely a market he has is like the inspirational I climbed out of this. Like even in his verses, it's often that. But that's not also, that's not exclusive to him. That's a lot of rap as well. You know, like, so, you know, it is, it kind of goes hand in hand. It's a, it's a bit of that, like that,

that tale of like rising up out of the worst situations that makes like so many people respect and understand you as a, as a rapper. So, and I'll, I'll even say that's not, you know, that's a thing that rap gets from the same source that a lot of other, cause you see that in evangelical Christianity, the whole, like I was, you know, down and out low, high rising and low sliding, popping reds and busting heads, kicking indoors and banging whores. And then I met Jesus, you know, that sort of fucking deal.

Praise the Lord. It's this thing everybody gets from like, you know, power of positive thinking, like hustle culture where it's like, okay, you got to have like the down and out story. And then I had my realization and like, you can do it too. It works for everything. It's not just MLMs. And just to tag onto that,

I literally was just making fun of Nepo babies because it's like, so it's like the opposite is literally when it comes to most of creative culture to be considered the worst you can be to have privilege and everything that's considered like the worst. Cause it's like, Whoa, well you, you don't have to learn guitar for on a guitar that only had three strings and like, you know, it was given to you by blind Willie down on the corner who definitely had tuberculosis and left us early type of shit, you know? Yeah.

Yeah, that's just the way you frame things if you want Americans to... If you want to be a fucking mogul. Anyway, here's a quote from something he said later in a CNN article. Cool. One day when he was a child, he asked his mother for a new pair of sneakers, but she couldn't afford them. He recalled in a 2016 CNN interview that his mother almost began to cry upon hearing his request. That day, he said, my hustle was born.

And he's got a lot of, that day, my hustle was born soon. That day, yeah. That was the one day. His mom being like, we had a Cadillac. Maybe she's exaggerating because she doesn't want to admit that things were harder than they were. But I kind of think it might just be more that he wanted expensive sneakers. And his mom wasn't like, no, we don't have the money. His mom was like, no, you don't need those sneakers. Yeah. I'm not going to spend $200 on fucking sneakers for you. Like.

It wasn't my mom being like, we could go to Goodwill and find you a nice pair that you'll grow into type thing. It was like, oh, you want $300 Nikes, like hard pass. Yeah, it's a lot less inspirational to be like my story, which is like, I wanted a computer that could play Starcraft. And my mom said, no, you don't need that.

I was like, well, I want to be able to buy my own computers when I grow up, right? Like, that's not an inspirational story. That's not, like, yeah, nobody's going to put that in the biopic. You know, the music swells and you get a fucking razor. Ha ha ha ha!

So, yeah, one thing that we can definitely mark as a turning point in his life was a football injury that he acquired while playing for Mount St. Michael Academy. He will always say, I was going to be in the NFL. I was good enough to be in the NFL. He'll kind of insinuate he was being scouted by the NFL.

I don't know that he was. I'm not entirely sure, but I'm pretty sure he's like 5'9 or something, right? He's not a big guy. He's not a big guy, but there's positions for shorter guys. Sure, for sure. Just to say, for the record, the amount of men that have told me I was going to be... I could have been a contender. I was going to be an insert professional sporting league here forever.

Yeah. You're like, sir? Yeah, for sure. When I was in the Marines, there used to be a joke about, you know, everybody was going to go to a great college. They had a full ride to go to a great college and they were all varsity, whatever. And they were going to... One of the dudes in my platoon...

It was so funny. He started off saying that he was going to be, he was scouted to be the quarterback at USC. And when everybody was like, dude, you were not scouted to be the quarterback. That's a prestigious position. We could have, we would have seen that. You would have been like in the news and shit. Like, that's a big deal. And he was like, I didn't say quarterback. I said cornerback. That was his way out of it. Sure, man. Yeah.

cornerback. One dude, I remember he used to, he had like one of his pecs was bigger than the other. And he said, yeah, man, I was, I was going to play quarterback. And, and then my coach always had me benching one side only, you know? And that's why I was like, what? No one would do that. No one would. So that,

Every guy in the entire world, if they played sports for like five seconds, has like a, oh, I was almost, you know, story. Could have been great. Could have been great. Then I broke my leg. Yeah. I ran for 12 touchdowns. If you've ever done that to me, just know I was like, bullshit.

Yeah, there's a certain inner bullshit detector I feel like you definitely have. It's like the Sophie eye roll where it's just like, huh, yeah, like just, yeah, yeah, that right there, the smirk and the uh-huh. Yeah, it's a crucial life skill to develop. Sure, you've won a Grammy. I bet you have. That's why you keep it directly behind you. Oh, man. Now, I will say,

Whether or not he was almost in the NFL, his team was very good. They won the division title in 1986, I think, when he's a junior. So, like, he does play on a very good team. I'm sure he was not bad at it. I just don't know that he was in the NFL. That said, he does break his leg in his last year of high school badly on the field, which ruins his pro dreams. Now, as a fun aside, Will...

Well, I was reading. You're going to love this. Well, I was researching these articles. I found an old 2012 interview in The New York Times with Diddy. This is back during his, you know, mogul, you know, generally popular phase. And the article was about a movie that he had helped produce called Undefeated. This was based on an Oscar nominated documentary about a real life high school football coach named Bill Courtney, who was apparently pretty good. I don't know much about high school football coaches.

You're from Texas. How do you not know much about high school? I fucking played high school football for middle school. I forget which year I was in football, but I played football. I did a sport once. Yeah. I was not almost in the NFL. It wasn't as fun as drugs. So yeah.

Now that I could have gone pro in, Will. Yeah, absolutely. I really could have been in the NFL of drugs. Absolutely. I still feel like I have a chance. I feel like I got a Field of Dreams chance. In fact, you know, like...

I do want to see the field of dreams of drugs. It's like they put up a table in a field and just like drugs start materializing. Fucking John Belushi walks out of a cloud. Willie Nelson is like, he's not even dead, but he's the guy that gets to walk back on the field and get younger. He's the Ray Liotta. Andy Dick pulls himself up out of a sewer. Oh my God.

If you build it, they will come. The biggest bong ever and just like a table of cocaine. Oh, we could make this movie. I feel like someone is going to rip this off from us. We better act quickly. Back to this story. So Diddy produces this movie or helps to produce this movie about this high school football coach named Bill Courtney. And he's interviewed in the Times about it.

And in the interview, Combs talks about his own football experiences in high school. And he laments, I didn't have a coach like Bill Courtney who stood by me and helped motivate me in everything. I was envious, to be honest. And he's kind of insinuating that a better of coach might have helped him overcome his broken leg or whatever. Anyway. He could have healed me with his witch doctor ways. Right.

Right, right, right. Anyway, the best part of that interview, though, is that Combs was working as a producer on the remake of that documentary with the Weinstein Company. And the interview with him in The Times includes this line next. Quote, Combs said he and Harvey Weinstein had been trying to do something together for seven years. And yeah, bro, I'll bet you guys were. Yeah. I'll bet you had a couple projects you were in on. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.

It is almost like, I hate whenever people start, like, because, like, every time some of this stuff comes out, you know, that, like, a certain person's, like, a greasebag. A massive sex criminal, yeah. Every person that's ever been in a picture with them is suspect, you know? And it's like, oh, this person, this person, this person. And it's like, yeah, but, like, not all those people are actually doing bad shit. Some of them are just taking advantage of somebody's, like, status to up themselves a little bit or meet people or whatever. But also...

Yeah, a lot of times they are all together. Yeah, a lot of times. The whole Harvey Weinstein connection maybe should have been a sign. Yeah, a lot of times they're absolutely running a fucking little circle jerk over there with each other, you know? Yeah, yeah. Now, it was during Sean's high school years that he first acquired... Oh, actually, you know what? Speaking of Sean's high school years, you know what'll help you get through high school? Drugs? Well, and the products and services that support this podcast. Fair enough. This podcast is sponsored by Better.

Better help. There's some dark stuff going on in the world right now, but it's also the holiday season. This is my favorite time of the year. I love going out to Christmas markets. I love going on cold hikes. And when the weather gets crummy, I like staying inside and watching movies. But when you're cooped up inside sometimes in these long, dark winters, it can be easy for some of the stuff in our heads that's dark and less pleasant to bubble up and trouble us.

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And we're back. I hope you've all graduated and you are ready for the rest of the day. And don't join the military like I did because it is not going to be a good idea. When you graduate, man, do anything else. But the recruiter said, I can even pick my MOS. Did I ever tell you that I had a friend that thought he was joining the Marine Corps snowboarding team? No.

His recruiter literally showed him pictures of dudes on snowboards and was like, yeah, man, if you, he was like from Colorado and he thought he was joining, like, he was like two weeks into being in the fleet. And he was like, so. When does the snowboarding start? Is the guy from the snowboarding team going to like hit me up or like, how do I get over there? Like, bro, we are deploying for Iraq in like seven minutes. Ha ha ha.

You are not going to the Marine Corps. There isn't even a Marine Corps snowboarding team. There ought to be like an Olympic for military recruiter lies. Oh my God, dude. The snowboarding one's up there. Oh my God, there's so many beautiful... I had another friend who literally, the recruiter, he came in and he was like, yeah, man, I want to be in infantry. And the recruiter would slow play to me. He's like, well, I don't know, man. It's pretty exclusive. Yeah.

And he got on the phone with his master sergeant in the back room. He's like a car dealer being like, my boss agreed. We'd never do this. We're going to do what we can for you. We're going to hook you up, man. You seem like a pretty wise individual. You belong up in infantry, man. We can get you in, man. Fuck it.

So it was during Sean's high school years that he first acquired the nickname Puffy. And we have two different stories for how that happened. Here's the first as related in an article on Hip Hop Insider. He used to puff out his chest to make his body seem bigger, which is where the name originated. Maybe that's true. That's what his mom said. I remember seeing his mom in an interview that said the same thing, that that's where it came from. Because he wasn't a big dude, back to the point earlier.

And there's a slightly different story that he told in 1998 to Jet Magazine. Whenever I got mad as a kid, I used to always huff and puff. I had a temper. That's when my friends started calling me Puffy. Right. Yeah. But, you know, they're not necessarily exclusive. I mean, you know, they're not at odds with each other. They might be both the same. He likes to puff. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's like he's like one of those fish. Yeah. Yeah. Anytime he's threatened, he gets.

big oh man and puffer fish infamous sex criminals do not let your friends go home alone with a puffer fish I remember that in Finding Nemo that was one of the subplots of Finding Nemo is that puffer fish were sex criminals yes yeah at least pests they're sex pests sex pests yeah

So with football out of the way, young Sean leaned into the other less discussed aspect of his personality, which was that he was kind of an artsy theater kid. Diddy had a reputation at his private school for being neatly dressed, you know, and in college for wearing designer clothes, which he funded through a variety of legal entrepreneurial ventures.

For example, in between classes, this is again when he's at college, he's at Howard University, he would operate a shuttle service to the airport. And he would also sell his old term papers, T-shirts, and soda to his classmates. So again, entrepreneur, but not exactly a gangster. Yeah. Roe Ronan's book, Bad Boy, which covers Diddy's influence on the hip-hop industry, paints a picture of a young man who was beyond everything else an opportunist.

At one point, while he's at Howard, there's this massive protest campaign on the campus over the presence of Lee Atwater on the University Board of Trustees. And again, Howard is a historically black university. Lee Atwater is the author of the Republican Party's infamous Southern Strategy, which I cannot relate directly to you without using the N-word repeatedly. You had me at Republican Party. Yeah.

I was there. I was there already. You're just edging me from there. The basic idea of the strategy that Lee Atwater helps put together is that you can't campaign in 1968. Before 68, you can campaign by just screaming about black people and saying you want to hurt them, right? By 68, you can't do that. So you have to instead campaign on issues that will hurt black people, but that you can pretend aren't racist, like fiscal conservatism, cutting programs that help black Americans without calling them slurs, right?

That's Lee Atwater. So obviously, Howard University students are like, the fuck is this guy doing on the board of trustees? Hey, bro, you forgot your hood, man. Let me set you up. Yeah. That is essentially the tenor of the protest campaign. Now, Sean's peers rightly thought it was fucked up for this guy to have a seat on the Howard board. And they do win. I'm going to spoiler. He winds up stepping down. Every now and then, plugging a CEO in broad daylight on a city street does something, you know?

Right. Protests work. Protests can work. So there's this big protest campaign. There's like clashes with riot police. They occupy buildings and campus. It's a whole thing. How far you have to go to get one white man fired from now. One white man fired. Yeah. Yeah.

In the book, It Was All a Dream, culture journalist Justin Tinsley writes this of sophomore Sean Combs' involvement in this protest campaign. For Combs, the student protest in the spring of 89 presented an opportunity to unite the student body and put some money in his pockets at the same time. Combs took images from the protests, photos of students and police clashing and students being whisked away and printed up some posters. And he like sells posters based on this. Oh my God.

So he's like, he's a profiteer. Yeah. A write-up by Chris Malone goes further. Future producer and co-worker of Diddy's Derek D. Angeletti was at Howard at the same time as Diddy and saw how he made a quick buck from the protests. In the 2003 Notorious B.I.G. documentary Unbelievable, he spoke about Diddy's photo enterprise during the protests.

He made hundreds of them and sold them for $10 and $15 a piece, Angeletti said. That's the type of guy I saw. All this protest shit is well and good, but who's getting paid off it? He was ready. Yeah. This is the 80s?

Yeah, 89. Yeah, so, I mean, yeah. So 10 to 15 bucks, that's a lot of money, too. That's not cheap. Like, we think of 10 to 15 bucks now, but in 89, 10 to 15 bucks, like... Yeah, it was like 700, 800 dollars. Yeah. It's a lot more money. Whatever the math works out to, but yes, absolutely. This was back when a dime bag cost 10 dollars, and that wasn't cheap. There used to be... I remember. We used to be a country! Yeah!

We had onions on our belts. It was his style at the time. At the time, yeah, yeah. Amusingly enough, in 2009, Diddy made statements in support of another protest movement at Howard, promising, I got y'all back, and saying, do what we did and take it over. Let's go and do it in a peaceful way, but do it. And again, he...

you did not take anything over. You sold pictures of people doing that. We were looking back through a lens so it's easy to see, oh, he probably was kind of like... But you want to believe that when you heard this earlier, Diddy telling this story, you were like,

like yeah man good for you speaking up for the kids yeah yeah you did it man but like and then like hearing it in retrospect you just like uh you know you know everything that he did was slimy yeah he was just always pulling an angle he was not facing a riot line to get at water fucking fired um right if you're one of those if you or your parents did good for them

That's pretty cool. Yeah, good for them, man. Yeah. So a good deal of our knowledge of college age Diddy comes from Derek Angeletti, who I quoted earlier. He's the guy who described young Puffy as a flashy guy. Quote, he was always out at the clubs and the young girls loved him. That's a creepier line and...

modern context. He'd be in the middle of the floor doing all the new dance moves and his style of dress was a little more colorful, bolder. Everyone took notice of this cool, overconfident young dude. I was DJing at the time and one night he came up to me and said, I'd like to throw a party with you. You're pretty popular. And that's kind of how Diddy, Diddy's really good at recognizing people that other people like. That's his primary talent. He becomes a billionaire off the basis of that.

You will definitely see, especially in the music industry, there's so many, there's such a wide-ranging culture of that being the thing. It's like the Lou Pearlman or the Diddy or the Jay-Z with Rockefeller. It's like Rock Nation. It's like...

All these different organizations, that's what they're looking for all the time is like who is the thing that other people can look at and be – because that's what it takes. You have to have a stable of people for everything. To have a party, you've got to have the best caterer in the world, but you've also got to have the best DJ. It's like that's what all those people are the best at is collecting a whole bunch of the best ofs that they know.

Yeah. And that's like, I mean, honestly, like that's, that's also just an entertainment industry thing. Like, you know, Sophie and I, that's a skill we have in a different way. Right. Like I got a stable of really cool podcasts. I'm reading this Ed Zitron guy and I'm like, I bet he could be a podcaster. You know, like that's just, that is just kind of the industry too. That's like how you, you know, and, and he's going, Diddy's going to be one of the best at it. You will unify the entirety of all podcasters in the world.

Take over. Or start an East Coast, West Coast podcast rivalry. Get Ed shot in a fucking conflict with one of the NPR guys. Oh, my God. Oh, man. Another movie idea. You guys are welcome. Yeah, great movie. I'm making Ed the Biggie Smalls of podcasting here.

Sorry, man, you're cooked. Enjoy the next couple of years, buddy. So Combs took things a few steps further than most people who throw popular parties on campus by sometimes successfully convincing or paying celebrities to show up.

He included his name on flyers with their name, which is part of how he would brand himself, right? You're attaching yourself to celebrity. You're also just making sure everyone who goes to this huge party with like 1,500 people knows that's a diddy party, right? Yeah. Reputation is everything. That and he's good at reputation management. He prints business cards for himself that he hands out. They have his name engraved on them as Sean in parentheses Puff Conrad.

Just one F. So he's still working on the nickname, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a bad process. It's a process. I'm workshopping some stuff here, guys. I'm doing the best I can. I knew you before you were Greasy Will. Yeah. His friends are like, Puff? Puff? P-U-F? There should at least be two Fs. It's like damn near poof, bro. I don't know, man. It's going to be confusing. Just a boardroom of guys? Yeah. Oh.

Oh, man. That's one of my... By the way, speaking of wasted old people are lying, one of my... Because this comes up periodically when people will lie about having been in the military or special forces. If anyone ever tells you they served and they had a really cool nickname, full of shit. Yeah. Nobody gets called the Avenger or fucking killer or whatever. It's always like sack. Yes.

Or like two thumbs. Yeah, shit stain. You're like, oh man, there's nothing about thumbs that could have been a good story. Yeah.

So these parties with Diddy grow to be sizable affairs, but the biggest of them was a homecoming event at a Masonic temple. 1,500, which actually does sound pretty cool. Yeah, it sounds banging. Yeah. 1,500 attendees were expected, but Sean's marketing of the event was so successful, more than 4,500 people showed up, which causes a problem when three times as many people show up. And this is going to be a continuing problem for him.

Angeletti later claimed the DC police shut down the whole block and brought out the dogs. We had to get on our knees and beg them not to lock us up, which again, not super gangster. Yeah. Getting on your knees and begging is not exactly the police. No, no. Biggie wouldn't have done that. I'll tell you that much. Tupac would have shot those cops. 100% Tupac would have shot those cops. And he wasn't even that gangster, man, but he would have shot them cops. Tupac would have shot them cops, man.

We forget, man. This guy's hosting New Year's celebration and shit, but that guy would shoot some cops. That guy was hardcore. That was Martha Stewart's friend. Weekly parties were all well and good for getting attention, but Sean wanted much more out of life.

and he quickly decided a business administration degree from Howard wasn't going to get it for him. So he drops out, and he starts begging record executives in New York for jobs, using his party planning career as a resume. This did not work, but when he reduced the request from job to unpaid internship, he got a yes from Uptown Records' Andre Harrell. Now, this is not a guy I'd heard of before,

but Sheila Flynn for the independent describes him as the man who quote famously coined the term ghetto fabulous. Um, so yeah, that's, uh, that's Andre Harrell. He's a big guy in, in the industry. Um,

She describes his time interning for Uptown this way:

So he goes very quickly from unpaid intern to paid executive. He's very good at this. He works like crazy, and he's got an incredible eye for talent. And this is also 91%

Rap is exploding. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Perfect timing for it all. So just for the, there's an actual term for that in the industry called a runner. It's literally because you are in fact running for everything you do. You go and get things all throughout the day. It's the first job you do in almost any like music industry position. So it's like, this is what I did. I was an intern and then I became a runner and then an assistant engineer and then an engineer. But that's how you like work up with, and it's crazy. Something that people don't,

It's not like being an actor, right? Doing some of these jobs, like what Diddy did here, some of these jobs, it's not like being an actor. You get out here and you're competing against just everybody working at every diner in all of Los Angeles, right? Doing some of these specific jobs like A&Rs or producers or engineers, you can get into the industry and be one step away from the top immediately.

There's so many stories of that. It's like, you get it. You're for my first job. I lived in Texas where we met in Texas.

I was playing in a metal band and then I was like, oh, I should maybe do music for a career. I went to school for nine months, graduated from a tech school and started at the biggest studio in the world as a runner. But I was so good because my background in the military and all the stuff that I was in. I was a runner for like three weeks before I was like working for the studio as an engineer. So it was like you're only –

A very, very short insert. It's like attacking the industry from a secret angle because you can do things like it's so fast. It's like your first job might be working for the president of a label. You know, if you have the right aptitude for the type of stuff, it could happen just like that. Now, it's still competitive and everything, you know, and it's really hard. But.

It's a different thing from being an actor or a musician where you're competing against thousands and thousands of people in the same proximity trying to do that job. It's kind of like a hack to get into the industry. Well, there you go, folks. You could have your own Grammy. You're welcome. And maybe even be a guest on this podcast. And more tips like this on my TikTok, Greasy Wheel Music. Ha ha ha!

I don't have any tips for becoming a journalist or a writer. It's very hard and it seems like no one's doing it anymore. Yeah. I don't know how it worked for us. Get ChatGPT and just plug a subject in and then post that on a website. There you go. You're a journalist. Type the Lord of the Rings into ChatGPT and you too could be a novelist. Yeah.

or sued by the Tolkien estate. Either way, same diff. Yeah. So he's, you know, by 91, he's an A&R executive. So he's doing, like, while he does that, he continues throwing parties. He understands that that's, number one, that's how I'm going to meet people. That's how I'm going to run into DJs, the people that I'm going to, like, poach, you know, as talent. He would throw what is described in one source as racially mixed daddy's house parties for street kids and preppy students from Columbia University and New York University. Nice.

And this is where that's a Ronan who wrote a book about, you know, his role in hip hop says, quote, that's where he saw what fans were dancing to and wearing. So this is also how he stays plugged in. Now, you know, it's I should say it's also how he's going to be committing a lot of his sex crimes. But we'll get to that in a minute. So, yeah. Yeah. Daddy's house parties don't go great for a lot of people. He's a drug. Oh, yeah. You brought your soundboard. Two choices.

And he makes the choice next to kill nine people. So he's 22 years old. He's going as Puff with one F. He's a college dropout and an employed record executive. And one of the acts that Sean helps bring to prominence is Jordaki. J-O-R-D-E-C-I. I don't know if it's print. Jordash?

Jordache. The jean company? Yes, yes. He discovers that. Jordache. Jordache is an R&B duo who are blowing up by 91. Oh, Jodeci? Wait, what are you saying? Is it Jodeci? It's J-O-R-D-E-C-I. It can't be, right? I'm so confused. Oh, you're saying...

Is it Jodeci? I'll look it up. No, no, no, I can't. No, no, no. It's not. Oh, my God. It's not. Okay, so hold on. What's the name? J-O-R-D-A-C-E? No, no, no. The way that Robert has it spelled, there's an R in there, but I think Will is right that it's Jodeci.

Is it Jodeci? Okay. We'll say it's Jodeci. If that's an R&B duo, yeah. They're an R&B duo, yes. Then it's called... Look, I don't know these. You know me and fucking pop culture. Yeah, it's not Jodeci. It's a Jodeci. There's a D in there.

Yeah. I mean, you know, it could be, I don't know. Jodeci. No, no, no, it is. It is. Yeah. Combs decided a good way to increase Jodeci's visibility was to throw a charity basketball game, pitting two teams of rappers against each other while fans watched.

The event was to be held in the City College of New York gym. Once again, Diddy did what he does best, which is promote. And so a shitload of people show up. In fact, several times as many people as can fit in the actual gym itself. This becomes a problem because Sean doesn't do anything but promote the event.

And he doesn't set up any of the safety measures, any of the staff, any of the bathrooms, none of that. He has two of his assistants who have never run large gatherings do that. And he does not inform them, by the way, every time I do something several times as many people as we can actually support show up could be a problem. He just has his it tells his assistants to handle it and then forgets all about it.

it, largely because his attention is occupied by executing fraud to the tune of tens of thousands of dollars, because the game had been advertised as a charitable event, but like, he hadn't told anyone what charity, and in actuality... Yeah, yeah, it's just a charity, yeah. What kind of charity? You know, it's like kids with stuff that need stuff, you know? Yeah, kids with problems. Yeah.

As someone who has been that assistant that had to organize, like, I've been this guy. I've been this guy that had to put together a house party with three bands and, like, 500 people show up and the LAPD is circling with a helicopter. And then I have to be the representative of white people to go out and talk to cops so that it's okay. You know? Like...

One of the artists I used to work with, he used to always be like, yo, hey, man, the cops are here. So, yeah, you want to go talk to them? Oh, yeah, man. He's like, you know, you speak like cops and like white people and stuff. Like, all right, I got it. I got it. Go outside. I mean, that's kids. Hey, gentlemen, how are you doing tonight? Oh, yes, sir. Absolutely, sir. You know, like, oh, the dogs. You don't need those. Yeah.

So there's no beneficiary actually selected for this party and for the more than $24,000 in 1990s money that had been raised for the event. Further blame for what's about to happen goes to the police on duty. Sean's assistants had only coordinated with

Pinkerton security guards hired by the university. Yeah, there's Pinkertons in this. Everybody legendarily protective of people and safe and never hurt nobody than Pinkertons. And the university had increased the number of security guards to 23 because they started getting worried before the event about

But the NYPD just sends a few guys. And when it becomes clear that more than twice as many people as expected showed up, the sergeant on scene doesn't call for backup until it's too late. Eventually, there are like 60-something officers in attendance, but it takes a while. And the sergeant on duty also ignores repeated calls by the university being like, there's way too many people. There's way too many people. You need to do something. There's going to be a riot. And it's...

In fact, there is. Yeah, they ignored the neighbors at our parties too, man. They just did not listen to them. Um, so once it becomes clear, because they have to tell this huge crowd, most of you are not getting in. And then the crowd gets rowdy and violent and a riot begins. Uh,

The NYPD officers who were there are as useless as the NYPD tends to be when they're ever there actually needed for something. And things go very badly. At 7 p.m., with far too many people crowded into the venue, the single door they had been using to funnel people in was shut.

Since that door was steel and at the bottom of a stairwell with the crowd basically pushed up against it, it creates a solid barrier in a room that has four more people than are supposed to be in it. People panic and a crush develops. Dozens are injured and nine young people are crushed to death, literally asphyxiated by the weight of the crowd.

Medical examiners will note that none of them had broken bones. They are just suffocated by the mass of people. I mean, for those of... I have been to a lot of concerts. I've been into metal music. Sometimes it feels kind of like, how could you be killed by a bunch of people? But if you have never seen a crowd or been in a crowd, even I is like... I mean, I'm a fairly large person myself. I'm not huge or anything, but I'm...

pretty okay with like bad situations. I've been in some crowd crush situations that have terrified me where I'm like, this is like scary. Like this is bad. If you've never been in those situations, it's really easy to understand if you have like what, what that's like. It's like, it's like even a few hundred people can be like that. And you're talking about three times the capacity of a venue, you know, that's like,

So easy for a crowd to just crush the shit out of some people. It is like one of the best survival advice pieces I can give you is if you are ever in any kind of event and upon entering your like your only way to get in is to push through a crowd of people with absolutely no gaps in it.

and you immediately have the hair stand up on the back of your neck and wonder, are there too many people in this room? Fucking back the hell out. Get out. There is. Go. Leave. There absolutely is, and it is not a good idea. Don't fuck around with situations like that. Next thing you know, you're going to be...

surrounded by a bunch of juggalos at an ICP concert at the electric factory and feel really uncomfortable. So this is a horrible, again, nine people die because of this thing that Diddy has orchestrated. One EMT shows up. This is early. This is episode one for Deaths. Is there more than one episode of this or are we one episode in? There's two episodes. There's more deaths to come. There's two, but Robert, I kind of feel like we can do this as a three-parter.

I don't know. Maybe we'll see. We'll see what happens. One EMT who showed up on scene described the result as a plane crash without a plane. There were bodies all over. People calling for help. That's a very bad way for your party to be. Although, you and I have both thrown parties that I would describe as looking like a plane crash afterwards. Yeah, for sure. But a cool plane crash.

Yeah, it was a very cool plane crash, man. It's like, you just feel like you're dead. It's like where people are like, man, that was the best night of my life type plane crash. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like the plane crash in Yellow Jackets. I haven't finished Yellow Jackets. I assume it goes well for those girls. It goes well. Yeah, yeah. No cannibalism. Yeah.

This would mark the first time that Sean Combs drew media attention in a big way. New York Newsday was one of the papers who first got reporters on scene, and years later, one of them recalled being told by a colleague, the organizer was some guy called Puff Daddy. In the days that followed, it became clear that a substantial amount of the blame for this disaster lay with Puff Daddy.

Puff Daddy, Pup Daddy. A report compiled afterwards by the mayor's office read, Mr. Combs spent little time making the actual preparation for the game and delegated most, if not all, of the arrangements to Lewis Tucker and Tara Getter, both of whom claim to have no prior experience with such events. I found a fun article in the Columbia Journalism Review by one of the reporters who covered the crush. And this is, you know, him writing after Diddy has been disgraced.

His piece ended with this line. I do remember thinking, man, this Puffy guy can't have much of a future after this. Let me tell you about America, my brother. This is the thing, though, too, is like it's like, you know, that happened. Right. But I can't tell you how many events, how many things I've been to that have been like, you know, thrown like this, like concerts, like like, dude, I've been at a riot fest, which is like a major concert that felt like nothing.

this where it's like they didn't plan this very well there's not enough things here it seems dangerous and the fine line between man we just pulled off this crazy party and nine people died is it's razor thin you know there is sometimes where it's like this is the coolest party I've ever been to and then and it doesn't go completely wrong but it could have at any time one of those house parties we had we had 200 people and they were

raging in the living room. And I thought for, I started standing closer to the wall because I was like, this floor is going to give out, man. There's no way. This could end badly. This house could not be designed to have this many people jumping up and down like this. Yeah. And you know, I, a lot of being happy, especially like being happy about how you spent your twenties is getting as close to that line as you can get without crossing over into the killing nine people at city college. Yeah.

Yeah, risking it. Yeah, I've been on the edge. Yeah, the edge is a place, but it's also a place that's called the edge for a reason because sometimes nine people fall off of it. It's a place where legends are made, Robert. You just, you know, hey, man, you know, sometimes you got to get right up to the edge and just live and laugh, man. L-F-V-I-N. Yep. Hunter Thompson wrote eloquently about the edge and also died unable to hold in his bowels. So...

You know, that is the consequence. It's not a long life. It's not a long life. Not a long life. So because this is America, getting a bunch of people killed due to your own staggering negligence does not mean that you don't have... None at all. And Puff Daddy proves immune to consequences for his actions, even though, again, every review of the disaster is like, he's to blame for a lot of this. Now, again, I don't want to say all of it because let's not forget the NYPD. Yeah.

Yeah, of course. They also got those kids killed. Look, there's never a time where the NYPD hasn't been a little bit negligent in some people dying in New York City. It's like, you know, it's what they do best. That's part of their, that's what they get paid for, of course. Yeah. Um, the NYPD operates one of the largest surveillance apparatuses on the planet so that they can know more places to get kids killed. Um,

So Puff Daddy winds up testifying in court about the disaster when the families of the dead and the survivors sued the college. After a 1998 court appearance, he told reporters... Oh, so they didn't go after him at all? They just went for the college? No, no, go after the college. I think at this point, the college is who has money. He's not rich. Yeah, yeah, yeah, he's a kid. Good point. No reason to go after him. He's got nothing. Yeah, what's he going to do for you?

After a 1998 court appearance, he told reporters that, like, I think about it every day. I think about, you know, the dead every single day. You know, I'm always, my thoughts are always with them. Quote, but the things that I deal with can in no way measure up to the pain that the families deal with. I just pray for the families and pray for the children who lost their lives every day. So he literally wrote, I'll be missing you, like, I'll be missing you.

About the people he got crushed to death. Yeah. Like right off the, every day, man. Every time I pray, man, I'll be missing you. Yeah. He hit him early with that. He did. He did. Right away. It's a thing that always works for him. Yeah.

Get the hits, man. Play the hits. I can't wait till we have our first dictator who takes a note out of, who like fucking like uses chemical weapons on a crowd of protesters and then gets in like a studio and sings I'll Be Missing You. I can't wait till I'm a dictator.

Pro tip for the future dictators who listen to this podcast. There's got to be one of you. Have a banger ready to go. Have a banger ready to go. And look, if you do succeed in becoming a dictator, just give me a province. Just one province is all I ask for. Oh, hell yeah. I mean, let me, you know, I'll make a golden house for my...

of course I'm going to make a golden house, you know, but like, it'll be, it'll be gold plated. I'm not that much of a crook. As one does. You can bring your Grammy over to my gold plated house, Will. Yeah, man. We'll take shots out of it. Hell yeah. Now, speaking of I'll be missing you, I'm going to be missing you all because this is the end of part one, but don't worry, folks. We have a lot more coming. This is, this, this whole week is going to be diddy week here at Behind the Bastards. Diddy week. Well,

Will, my friend, you have a TikTok to plug. I have a TikTok. I am GreasyWillMusic. I have a podcast. It's called That Sounds About Right. I have a Instagram that you can find me. I'm GreasyWill, G-R-E-A-Z-Y-W-I-L, one L because...

The second one wasn't pulling any heavy weight, and I decided I was wasting time doing it. Fuck that L. Yeah, fuck that L. But I am highly Google-able. I am all over the internet. I can be found almost anywhere. You could even send a telegram to me still. I accept telegrams, as long as they are Western Union and contain money as well. Yes, yeah, yeah. I send you telegrams, but entirely about our oil business.

Down in the Arizona territory. I drank your milkshake. That's right. That's right. That's how you and I spend our free time. Being old-timey oil men. It's a great time, everybody. Well, until next week, folks, become an old-timey oil man.

yourself, you know? Start an oil rig somewhere. Next week. Next part. Next part. Yeah, next part. Not next week. We'll be back tomorrow, probably. Minutes from now. Just hold your breath. We're gonna keep recording. Yes. Anyway, I love you all. Go to hell.

Behind the Bastards is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more from Cool Zone Media, visit our website, coolzonemedia.com. Or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Behind the Bastards is now available on YouTube. New episodes every Wednesday and Friday. Subscribe to our channel, youtube.com slash at Behind the Bastards.

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