June 22, 2025 "Cutting Through the Matrix" with Alan Watt --- Redux (Educational Talk From the Past): "Memory, Muses, and Intelligence Artificial; Alan Watt with Greg Szymanski"
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This is Melissa, and it is the 22nd of June, 2025. I should start out by saying that your support is greatly appreciated. Those of you who do support what I'm doing, thank you. And if you don't, I would love it if you did. So you can go to the new Substack, cuttingthroughthematrix.substack.com.

And you can get a subscription over there monthly or yearly or even a founder's subscription, I think they call it. And there are also the newish flash drives that I have done. And that is all of Alan Watt's work, his videos and audios and some extra things in there, the Christmas compositions that he did and played on his guitar.

That is all part of the seven flash drive series. They're beautiful. It's a great way to have all of his work except the two books, which are available separately, and that's Waiting for the Miracle and the Cutting Through Volumes 1, 2, and 3. So thank you so much for your support. Also, just want to mention that we had a good discussion

unrecorded conversation on telegram about waiting for the miracle boat mostly concentrating on interview seven today and next saturday on the 28th we will be talking about interview eight there and then we will have a recorded discussion from or a

a talk actually from Neil Foster that we'll have on the 5th of July and those of us who are there live will listen to his recording because he can't be there with us that day and then we can add with our comments and questions and discussion these are really interesting conversations that we're having there so it's good

So thank you for your support. Thank you for your participation. And thank you. All right. That is out of the way. I've said before that in the post-RBN days that Alan's preferred method of working was to return to his night owl ways. And he would record Saturday night and then I would be editing on Sunday and post it on Sunday evening or Sunday night.

And he'd make a joke that some major event, some cataclysm could strike us. We'd go into World War III and he needed to report about it. So here you go. I've gone to bed last night. While the video was rendering, I got up this morning thinking I'd be posting first thing. But I did think that I should comment. As you recall, last week's Redux was...

Trump, Trump, Trump, the boys are marching. Will or won't we hit Iran? Resurrect WMD, fuzzy photos, let us see. Then send us all the refugees you can. And that's where we are this morning. That is exactly what has happened. I went to bed last night and I woke up this morning and one of my

Email notifications, my news feed said, here are the three Iranian nuclear sites the U.S. attacked. The U.S. struck three key nuclear sites in Iran overnight on Saturday, joining Israel's war against Iran and potentially triggering a more dangerous phase in the conflict. Well, what they've done without potential is they've joined in officially. So...

I will post a couple of articles on this. President Trump claimed in an address shortly after the strikes that Iran's nuclear sites had been completely and totally obliterated. And they don't give us any fuzzy photos. We get drawings. I always love the drawings. Oh, hey, look, maybe there's a fuzzy photo or two. Yay.

It's just, it's a devastation to be right as he was. It is the time of the summer solstice, the beginning, the kickoff to summer. So I hope you're all well.

I received an email this week a few days ago from Torben and Torben sends me interesting things from time to time and he suggested for a Redux that I put up Alan Watt on Investigative Journal with Greg Szymanski and this was from July 31, 2007. And I knew when I saw the date and the name that

that I had put it up before. I couldn't remember when, but I knew that I'd already played it for you. And I had in April of 2022. It was a re-dex. And I thought, well, no harm in putting it up again. This was a two-hour talk, and when I put it up before, I did not make an introduction. I hadn't made any introductions at that time in the spring of 2022.

and I edited it just a little bit. I don't know because I didn't re-listen to what I did, what I edited, but I have decided today to give you the first hour complete and I'll link to it so that you can find. That's how it was broken down on the website anyway and the transcript for it is both hours so you can dig in.

But it kind of fit together with other things, other communications that I received from you and things that were on my mind. And Greg starts off, he said, you talk a lot about hidden history. I guess we can start from a point. Where would you like to begin? And Alan said, just the fact that because of man's basic needs to get in touch with something he thinks is out there bigger than himself.

which is their deity, their God, their creator, whatever, that in all times, especially in the ancient times, priesthoods arose using their knowledge and distorting the truth and saying they had the truth. And because of that, they became very dominant over the people. They control the people's minds through religion.

with them wherever they went they brought the money system with them and that's very important because The money is a form of slavery Once you get people to accept money you can tax it back from them You can hire armies and go and conquer other countries we're really seeing a culmination of thousands of years of this very technique of

Coming to an end with the Middle East and they're put under the exact same system for global domination The agenda has been on the table for an awful long time So yes, I thought indeed that that that's a good one to relisten to because he does go into religion as Torben pointed out he said Alan talks about religion and

may be worth putting up for a Sunday talk because so much of the way that this is presented to us what's happening and with Israel and Iran and Israel and Palestine etc is presented as it's just unfolding and really nothing is further from the truth whatever the mechanism whoever did what

This is a long time in the planning. I was thinking of it this morning as we're way beyond Plato's cave. See, in Plato's cave, they had a fire and people walking by the front of the cave, so the outside of the cave, and they had their backs turned to the outside world. So all they could see was the shadows that the outside cast on the wall of the cave.

But that means that the people inside the cave are actively engaged enough in present time so that they're seeing real-time shadows cast by the real-time fire in their cave. And I think we're past that. It's almost as if people are in the cave just looking at the drawings from

a thousand years ago and making up stories about them. Well, bad man and heroic hunter kills bull. It's, this is how far behind we are when we talk about what's going on. So, I mean, there's always something that could be said. I saw some footage of Keir Starmer, uh,

exhorting his soldiers in Cyprus. I think this was around Christmas time of last year, you know, saying, you can't tell the outside world. You know, I understand how frustrating it must be for you because you can't tell anyone that you know why you're really here. It's kind of sinister, but, you know, rah, rah, rah. There's a piece of

paper that I found. I'll just tell you that I was looking through a couple of Alan's books earlier in the week for something unrelated to anything of today, but I picked up a book of his on Freemasonry, and it had a lot of bookmarks in it, like post-its and scraps of paper marking a page. And when I opened it up,

a chopstick fell out of the book. And unfortunately, the way that I was holding the book and the way the book kind of collapsed on itself after the chopstick hit the ground, I don't know what page the chopstick fell from. And I thought, okay,

I've never seen him mark a book with a chopstick and that's not great for the spine of the book. And did it mean that it was really important that page and I can't find it and I look to see did the chopstick warp the spine in such a way that I could... So it was lost to history where the chopstick came from. And later on that day, I was looking in one of his old dictionaries for something.

And I found there was an envelope marking the page and it was right around what I was looking for. I thought that might be covering it up. So I started to move the envelope and I realized that it was stuck to the page. The glue part of the envelope, you know, the sticky part stuck.

had become attached to the page. And you know how thin and delicate dictionary pages are. And this was a very old dictionary, so it was even more delicate. And I realized that there was probably no way that I could get it off without hurting the dictionary. And I tried very carefully. I had a couple of ideas. But anyway, I did slightly damage the dictionary in removing the envelope.

So all I could see from the envelope on the outside was that it was very old and yellowed and kind of dingy at the top where it had stuck out of the top of the dictionary. And it was addressed to a Toronto address. And I knew that Alan hadn't lived in Toronto in many years. So it was old. That's what I'm trying to tell you.

And I removed it from the dictionary, and I didn't think much of it at the time. It had a couple of things at the top, like a shopping list for the pharmacy, and then some other things that I didn't pay attention to. It was numbered 1, 2, 3, 4, 1 through 10. And I didn't even read it. I saw the top said, hide peroxide, like hydrogen peroxide.

And then it said antifungal. And then it went on with that. And so I just left it on the desk and didn't look at it for a few days. And I picked it up yesterday and I became fascinated by this envelope. Here's what it said. I'll try to take a picture if I can, but here's what it said. Below the hydroxide and antifungal, it said daughters of...

And I, you know, was looking at it and I'm like, oh, okay. Daughters of Zeus and Mnemosyne. And in parentheses he said memory. Daughters of Zeus and Mnemosyne. And then he listed the muses because the daughters of Mnemosyne are the muses. Cleo, Calliope, Erato, etc.,

So I started to look up the different muses. Alan had made some notes. Cleo, the muse of history. And Calliope, heroic, poetry, and eloquence. And then he went on in that way. The ninth muse, with the number nine by it, Urania, of a poet to uranium, astronomy, heavenly one, surname of Aphrodite.

I'd have to get some stronger glasses for that one. And then below that was number 10. And I couldn't figure out why. There were the nine muses and then 10. It said, new now have Trollope's warden. Well, that's not a muse. New now have Trollope's warden. So the whole thing was really kind of a mystery to me.

And yes, okay, so new and then now, Half Trollope's Warden. So The Warden was a novel by Anthony Trollope, and it doesn't seem to have anything to do with the muses. Harding, the character, is a meek, widowed, elderly warden of Hiram's Hospital.

and the pre-center of Barchester Cathedral in the fictional county of Barsetshire. So the Hiram's Hospital is an almshouse. So it's a place where they're providing the hospital services to poor people. An odd, so I don't understand it. Why does he have the word new and now? Now have Trollope's Warden. The way we live now...

was another novel of Trollope's. So I thought, what a mystery. What a mystery that is. And I'll set it aside for now. Then I received another...

from someone and they said, I recall Alan describing in a few talks, but particularly in his talk with George Norrie, Hour One, past global purification through fire and water with the elites taking shelter deep inside various mountains around the world. And this writer went on to say, of course,

Fire and water in Latin is ignis and aqua, or to reframe it, aqua and ignis, that is a aqua, water, ignis, fire. I look at the major areas of armed conflict just now and see the role of AI in the purification process unfolding.

and wonder if the unfolding will extend over the face of the earth, bringing a form of water and fire to all. And I thought that was interesting. Just the other day, I had put up from Neil an image, but he described it in our conversation, but he was trying to explain to someone COVID-19.

Break it down. He said, just look at it. It's C-O-2-I-D-A-I. He's telling you how he gets there, the first and ninth letter of the alphabet. But it's the thinking processes of people that are so interesting to me, that how we as individuals come to make sense of

of things for ourselves and how Alan thought that that was so important. It only has to make sense to us. So in that talk from 2006, when Alan was a guest with George Norrie on Coast to Coast, he said...

He's talking about the Hindu legends and previous times and flying machines and zapping each other with different colored rays. And he said, if we go to the Druidic histories, they were recorded by Tacitus, the historian for Nero. And he claims that the Druids said there had been three previous ages that they'd recorded Nero.

where their own elite had survived deep inside mountains while the earth had fire passed through it, followed by water, a deluge. We can find the same legends in ancient Greece where they lived in Mount Parnassus. That's where the wealthy elite went for the same thing. It was fire followed by water and it's interesting to see today with harp technology.

knowing that Nikola Tesla stopped using that technology because he claimed it would superheat the atmosphere to such an extent that it would explode, it would ignite and cause a fire around the world which would melt the caps causing flooding and then it would rise into the sky and cause clouds and you'd have rain and flooding. Fire and water, same thing again. So it's very possible this has been done before. I did a real history study

I had a very long conversation with Sigrida, who's a lovely young woman, and I really loved especially the part about her saying how she got to find Alan, how important that was to her, how she'd been seeking truth. Sigrida is from Lithuania, and so she was talking about that. And I received an email from Sigrida.

Janice, which is John. And he said, Dear Melissa, if indeed you read this message, please accept my gratitude for carrying on the cutting through the matrix. I used to be an avid listener from at least 2005-6. I still have several gigabytes of downloads, transcripts in my archives. And only a few weeks ago, I discovered the Alan Watt C2TM YouTube channel. So glad I did.

And at this very moment, I'm listening to your conversation with Sigrida from my sister country of Lithuania. Thank you very much and happy solstice. And I wrote him back and he said sister country of Lithuania, but I went down the thread of the email exchanges with Alan. And so I knew that he was from Latvia and I said, greetings, Sigrida.

to you in Latvia and I, you know, blah, blah. And thank you for reminding me of solstice. I tend to lose track of time. So Janice, John wrote back and he said, Oh, splendid. This email address has come alive. Never in my dreams.

Midsummer is a big deal in Northern Europe, especially in the Baltics. Latvia is probably the only country that celebrates solstice with two public holidays, June 23 and 24. Besides, the 24th is St. John's Day, so My Name Day.

These we also take quite seriously. And he put the smiley sign on there. We'll be celebrating with my family in the countryside. My dad, also Janice, is already 90. So who knows how many midsummers we have left together. Heartfelt greetings to you from Latvia.

And he sent me a YouTube song, which was a beautiful celebration, quite a majestic, I'm going to share it with you, celebration of the Midsummer Solstice celebration. And I wrote back and said, oh, thank you so much. And there was a thread earlier in the email exchange with Alan from back in 2010. And I asked if I could use that. I told him what it was. And yes.

He said yes. So Janice had written to Alan and he said he managed to transfer over a donation to Alan and sends greetings and respects and thanks for carrying on. And he said, Canadian dollars hold a certain sentimental value for me as I have a check for one million Canadian dollars lying around somewhere at home in Riga, Canada.

given to me in jest by one of my closest souls ever, a Canadian chap in the early 90s. His brain was the size of the universe and so was his heart. In a month, it will be exactly 10 years since he threw himself out of a Berlin hotel window. Sorry for this digression. There's infinitely more joy and happiness in me for having known the man than sadness and selfish remorse.

And Alan wrote back and said, thank you, Janice. It's much appreciated. Good for you to have known your friend. There really aren't characters anymore since everyone gets the same programming. All the best, Alan. And that was very important. I remember telling you that Alan had told me early on in early days that I was just a composite of my programming. And I'm like, oh, I'm not. I'm not.

I'm a real person. And, you know, later on over the years, a time or two, something I said or did, he called me a real character. And of course, that made me feel good, made it all better. So I wanted to dig in a little bit because of the email exchange that I had. That first one was from Scott in Scotland, who told me about Ignis and Aqua. And I wrote

got back and said that's very interesting and it kind of ties in with what I'm just now thinking of today because of the email that I received from Latvia about midsummer and the solstice and you know so I may think about that because when I was talking to Sigrida she told me about how the Teutonic warriors had come into Lithuania and

And they had Christianized it and gotten rid of all of the different pagan celebrations. And I also remembered I had done a Real History with a longtime listener, David, who's an artist and musician. And he's from Finland, or his family is from Finland, and he was talking about the

midsummer celebration, the bonfires that they would have. And here it says right here, in the Finnish midsummer celebration, bonfires are very common and they're burned at lakesides and by the sea. And you can see sometimes they take a little wooden raft that they've made and they set it on fire out in the lake. So the water, fire, water, fire. Lithuania, where Sigrid is from, it says that midsummer is commonly called John's Day.

and it's known as St. Jonas Festival, celebrated on a large scale by most Lithuanians, and they do different things. They tell tales and find magic fern blossoms at midnight, and they jump over bonfires, and then they greet the rising midsummer sun and wash their face with the morning dew. So again, water and fire. So the Lithuanians celebrated rituals associated with the summer solstice,

involving fire and pagan customs, and the Teutonic Knights considered it all pagan in an attempt to suppress it. And then in Latvia, it says, Latvia, this is where I heard from Janus or John, and he said it's the most celebrated festival in Latvia, outranking even Christmas. So it is...

coinciding or has been given the Christianized celebrations of St. John's Eve and St. John's Day. Well, who is St. John? Well, he's St. John the Baptist, right? Baptism in water, and yet so many of these celebrations have to do with fire. So interesting. And I looked a little bit more at this

And I found this. It's from something I've never been on this website before, but it's called themasoniclight.com. And it's a little article called The Holy St. John's. And it tells us about the saints, John the Baptist and John the Evangelist, are made known to Freemasons in several places in our catechisms.

their placement and use in our rituals have been questioned for many years. When looked at together, St. John the Baptist and St. John the Evangelist serve to represent the balance in masonry between zeal for fraternity and learned equilibrium. And remember, Alan would always say, you know, they give masons, you know, at the lower levels, pretty low level explanations for things. But it's, it's,

says here that for non-Masons, the festival has been called the setting of the watch where ceremonial bonfires are lit after sunset. Tradition says that men, women, and children across Europe would jump through the fires for luck. This holiday is celebrated in many ways. It goes on to talk about some of these. The link is

was made at some point to John the Baptist. It is thought that these festivals have been linked in character and content with the birth of John the Baptist. The online Catholic encyclopedia points to the birth of John the Baptist as six months before Christ, placing that event on the summer solstice. The two dualistic groups

figures as one, the Holy Saints John, balance each other in the Masonic year, but also in other areas too. One unique aspect that some have found is in the application of the alchemical symbols of fire and water.

Alchemy has long been thought of as an early component of Freemasonry, and using the alchemical symbols here may help the representations of the St. John's look more familiar. St. John the Baptist represented as the inverted pyramid, the alchemical sign for water, representing the spiritual and emotional love.

St. John the Evangelist representing the pyramid as pointing up, symbolizing fire that is the drive and will of action. When placed together, they symbolize the perfect balance of darkness and light, life and death, passion and constraint, will and emotion, winter and summer,

Together, both represent the interlocked star of Solomon, or the square and compass. This is an entirely open analysis and made for the purposes of comparison, but it does offer a unique analysis of the juxtaposition of the Holy Saints John. So one last little dive here on the email from Scott in Scotland regarding the

Ignis and Aqua or Aqua and Ignis for AI. It made me think about Ignatius, Ignatius Loyola. And I looked up the meaning of Ignatius and it means fiery. And then I looked up Loyola and it is thought to come from the Basque word which means mud or swamp.

So once again, with Ignatius Loyola, we get fiery water or water that is fiery, AI. So what is going on in the world? I mean, well, there's always something going on out there, right? And G7, we had a bit of theater. Trump arrived and then he left and he had issues to do. He said things to take care of around Iran and Israel, right?

Things that were talked about at G7. Here's something from Forbes. Leadership falters as climate costs soar and time to act runs out. London Climate Action Week is set to start, showcasing what urgent, inclusive climate action looks like when cities, financiers, and citizens unite.

But the energy and innovation on display in London are being overshadowed by growing inaction from global leaders. Just days after the G7 failed to deliver any meaningful policy progress and as the EU backpedals on its green regulation agenda, a troubling gap is emerging between local ambition and failures of international leadership.

And it comes at the worst possible moment, they said. Climate damage costs are skyrocketing. Climate science is sounding red alerts. And economic evidence points to a clear win. Green investment can grow economies, create jobs, and protect communities. So I'll post this piece of rubbish for you if you want to take a look at it. And a couple of other things, too. This from the Jerusalem Post that was quite interesting.

critical of the G7 leaders for the failure to come up with a definitive, united statement against Iran in favor of Israel. And Iran has issued a new grave warning to Trump. This was just yesterday, saying that if the U.S. were to get involved in the Israel-Iran conflict, the result would be very, very dangerous for everybody.

And I'm sure you don't need me to tell you how divided people are. Anytime I look at some social media or people's comments on videos or so forth, you know, there's just so much beating up of the common person. Oh, you idiot. You know, you're brain damaged by reading the Schofield Bible and you have no idea what's going on over there. And, you know, so it's...

divide and conquer, turning us, the little people, against one another for an age-old, ancient, ancient agenda. Remember, Iran, Persia, is considered the cradle of civilization. It's a place where it has been at least two or three times in the history of that area. The

birthplace of the highest of literature, philosophy, mathematics, astronomy, medicine. So we're more or less kept ignorant and the little fellow just gets, oh, it's a theocracy and, you know, bad Ayatollah needs to be replaced and so forth. So I was thinking again about AI, Aqua and Ignis, water, fire, fire, water, fire.

And I've been reading more about AI, just nothing particularly. I may share a couple of things. There's a Rand paper that I looked at, When AI Takes Time to Think, Implications of Test Time Compute. This is different. For those of you, I'm not one of them, but those of you who are engaging with things like

chat gpt you get these answers that are super fast they come back to you and then you can engage with it and so forth but test time compute is it's a it's a series of things that is basically training the ai to reason so they say

So it means that your answers that you get may be quite delayed as the AI is taking time to compute. And it may spit out pages and pages of documentation before it delivers a reasoned response. Now,

Remember that those of you who are engaging with AI and having conversations with your grok or chat GPT, this is very low level. You wouldn't need all of these data centers, all of the massive amount of data centers that are going up if it was just so that you could have a chat with grok.

That's not what this is about. It's about the technology being used for a variety of national and supranational agendas that will completely shape our economies and so forth. And there was something else that

that I was looking at as a Homeland Security paper, Emerging Technology and Risk Analysis. And this is what was interesting to me. It says metaverse concerns about crimes that involve targeting and exploitation of children. It's always about the children, isn't it? You know, there's it. And yet nothing ever changes. So I wanted to go back a moment to that envelope I found and Mnemosyne.

the goddess of memory and the mother of the muses. It says, in Hesiod's theogony, kings and poets received their powers of authoritative speech from their possession of mnemosyne and their special relationship with the muses. Zeus, that was who fathered these, at least in one way of

one person's compilation. I think other people give different parentage of the Muses, but Zeus was the, in the form of a mortal shepherd, slept with Mnemosyne for nine consecutive nights and delivered, she delivered the Muses. Mnemosyne also presided over a pool in Hades and

a counterpart to the river Lethe, according to a series of 4th century BC Greek funerary inscriptions. Dead souls drank from Lethe, so they would not remember their past lives when reincarnated.

In Orphism, the initiated were taught to instead drink from the Mnemosyne, the river of memory, which would stop the transmigration of the soul. So Lethe is the river of forgetfulness, and Mnemosyne is the river of memory. And I thought that that was interesting that they could go on. One could go on.

to something beyond this world if you drank from the river of memory. But you're kind of doomed to reincarnate here forever when you drink from the river of forgetfulness. And somewhere else I saw lethe was described as strife. So forgetfulness is basically the mother of strife. But the good comes from memory.

And so what I wanted to leave you with is I have no idea why Alan made that list, why it included at the very bottom, Anthony Trollope's warden. New now have Trollope's warden. And what I realized, you know, he is a mystery to me as I sit next to him and he remains a mystery to me. And if I had every scrap of paper that,

and every memory of him, and everything that he ever said, and I could put it into some kind of artificial intelligence, it would not be Alan. And this is the thing, you know, Alan says the characters are what is so amazing to him, the people who are individuals. So when I wrote to Alan,

Janice and asked if I could use this remembrance of his of his friend he said oh dear Melissa pleased you I'd be touched and honored so would no doubt he says the gentleman's name and goes on to tell some personal and some personal things about memories of his friend and I I

I don't want to tell you all of that, but he did eventually have a farewell to his friend, and it involved going to a sea, to a river, Daugava, our longest river. And our longest river has many epithets and nicknames.

Liktenupe, the river of fate, akin to the Styx, that's the river in Hades, right? Being the most widespread.

And the song I sent you yesterday mentions another one, Sapju Akal, the nurse of pain and sorrow. And then he sent a translation of the lyrics. And I thought how interesting that is. The river is so similar to the letha, the forgetfulness, the nurse of pain and sorrow. Thank you once again for gently weaving the threads in the loom of living memory. My sister is a textile artist and

and text and textile being cognates. I'm very fond of weaving metaphors. Woke up this morning just minutes after solstice that allegedly occurred at 5.42 a.m. local time. So if indeed memory allows us to go on to communicate with the muses, to share our memories in meaningful ways with other people,

and then to leave this world and have no need to transmigrate down into the river of forgetfulness. That's a nice thing. I like that. So as Alan said in this talk with Greg Szymanski, and I will just say this, and I'm sure everyone has something, some place, we all have some place that we tend to get stuck. And so...

You're going to hear a lot about those bad Jesuits. There's a place for everyone to get stuck. But at a point in this conversation, Alan said, I think that people can find the higher truths beyond the base truths. The laws are given for the base public. I think the individual who is truly seeking. So in this talk, Alan said,

It says a few things. He says that we'll be unified together, North America. This will happen by 2010, and then we will be unified under the United Nations in 2012. It's not happened exactly in that way, and yet sometimes I ask the question, or has it not? Has it not? It's just because we don't have a...

and announced unification and we have still been probably because we're still over hammering away at the middle east and so we need to be kept distinct as nations so that we'll go off to fight for our country when keir starmer says you're going to war and and donald trump says you're going to war then we go yeah we're going to defend our nation and so perhaps this is why we haven't had those unification announcements but it's interesting

at a certain point here in his conversation with the host, and I will just say that you'll hear a lot about the Jesuits, the bad Jesuits. People tend to get stuck in their understanding of what's behind all of this. And so don't get stuck. Just keep flying high. Alan said, I think that people can find the higher truths beyond the base truths. And the laws are given for the base public.

I think the individual who is truly seeking will find it if they seek hard enough, and they'll even go beyond whichever religion they've been given on the base level, a common religion. Very few do.

But some are able to do it and use that like a stepping stone to get up and come in touch with something far greater than themselves, far bigger than the basic Yahweh character with the human characteristics of the battle-angry old man. There's something much greater in the world than that, and some people can go.

Even I've talked to people from Islam who've gone beyond Islam on the same path too and come to the same conclusions only because they've done the journey themselves. They've left the dogma behind, the dogma given to the general public who need those basic rules at a certain point in their history. So let's all drink from the river of memory and decline a cup

from the river of forgetfulness. And take care and be well. And happy solstice.

Greg Szymanski, I'll be here for the next two hours. Hopefully in the next two hours we're going to have on today Alan Watt. He is a person that talks about a lot of new things. He's got a website called Cutting Through the Matrix. At this point we're trying to wait for Alan to get on the phone, but we'll be with him in a minute. We'll spend the next couple of hours discussing...

Many different things with Alan, including the Vatican's connection to the New World Order and much, much more. Alan, are you on the line yet?

I guess we're still... Alan, are you there? Yes, I'm here. Oh, good. I didn't know if you were there. I'm glad you're here. But anyway, Alan, you have a website called CuttingThroughTheMatrix.com. Why don't you tell the people what you've been working on lately? I've been very busy doing my talks that I give every week on the histories of the system that we live in and how we got to where we are now.

and all the different agencies and religions involved in controlling the people down through the centuries up until this point, into the new scientific dictatorship that we're moving into now, the world run by experts and professionals.

taken over from the old priesthoods, but they still use the old priesthoods to their advantage. So you talk a lot about hidden history. I guess we can start from a point... Where would you like to begin? Just the fact that because of man's basic need to get in touch with something he thinks is out there bigger than himself, which is their deity, their god, their creator, whatever...

that in old times, especially in ancient times, priesthoods arose using that knowledge and distorting the truth and saying they had the truth.

And because of that they became very dominant over the people. They controlled the people's minds through the religion. And with them, wherever they went, they brought the money system with them. That's very important because the money is a form of slavery. Once you get people to accept money, you can then tax it back from them. You can hire armies and go and conquer other countries.

We're really seeing the culmination of thousands of years of this very technique coming to an end with the Middle East and they're put under the exact same system for global domination. This agenda has been on the table for an awful long time.

and it also takes the cooperation of all existing religions to go along with this. If you notice, not one of the major religions or religious leaders is warning the public about the future and what it has in store for the general public, either in the cloning field, the genetic engineering field, the eugenics field, and the depopulation programs that they've been putting forward for a long time. None of the religious leaders...

who have the power and authority to tell people, look, start thinking about this. None of them tell them to even talk about it or even discuss it. Which tells you they're all in on this together at the very top levels. Right, so you're not just talking, you're talking about all the major religions at the top levels perhaps working together.

to mislead the masses and this goes back a long long way can you give us any kind of history that you uncovered throughout the centuries that lead you to believe this is true? it's not just coming to believe it it's when you stumble across major figures in history like Alexander the Great for instance now Alexander the Great was taught his mentor was Aristotle the philosopher

And Aristotle was married to one of the biggest international moneylenders of his own era. And the same moneylenders from the Middle East funded the Macedonians and the Greeks to go into Persia and take it over. They paid for the war, in other words.

And all the people who were taken over had to pay it all back through taxes to repay the money sharks. But you find the same thing all down through history. Money lenders, the leaders that teach and put up front men like Alexander the Great or maybe a George Bush in our time,

It's all the same old con game. They're all interrelated, we find, through their wives and through their mentors. They're all intermarried, interrelated, and this is their world as far as they're concerned. John Kerry is the same with his wife who's involved in the Heinz industry. They said they'd take over the food industry 40, 50 years ago because when you take over the food industry, you have war on the people.

And war in all times takes into account economic war, food and water, all the basics. When you're having a war on a city or on a whole country or on a world, you go for those primary things. And it's just a coincidence, of course, we have John Kerry, who is married to the Heinz dynasty, who I'm sure have been modifying those foods since they created the company called Heinz.

modification of the food to the modification of the people

Yeah, exactly. And you know what? I'm looking here on your website, and you have three books available, correct? One is Cutting Through, number one, and then Cutting Through, number two, A Glimpse into the Great Work, and then Cutting Through, number three, Esoteric and Veil in the Meaning of Revelations in the High Masonic Tradition. Why don't you start with your first book and tell us what's that about? Go ahead.

Really, hermaphrodite has different meanings in the occult industry. In ancient times, they talked about the perfection of the human being, where the left brain, left and right brain would be working together, emotion versus reason. It would come to a harmonized point, and that was the perfected man or the lumined man, as they called it.

You'll find the same thing hidden behind major religions. In Genesis, the deity splits himself, he makes a double of himself, and from that double, he then redivides, subdivides Adam and Eve from it, meaning that the deity himself was male and female. That's the meaning in Genesis.

You also find the same thing in the writings of Plato. The deity they worshipped was male on the front and female on behind when they walked the other way. They're talking about the ultimate perfection is going to be a creature which is neither male nor female, which can self-reproduce.

and it's an odd agenda to have you might think but it's always been here for thousands of years now they have talked about the creation of the perfect worker human being

that would be both male and female and could self-reproduce. That way there's no conflict. The world they want to bring in has to be conflict-free, free from conflict of nations or races, ethnic groups, but also no conflict of gender conflict. That's what they call their utopia, their peace on earth.

However, the elites themselves have said they will not alter themselves. They will only alter the worker bees to be more perfect. And one day, if you serve the system of the state very well, the honor you will have is the right to reproduce yourself, an exact model of yourself.

And that's the first book. You talk a lot about that, correct? Yes, and also how it's all done through the Masonic coding, hidden in the language, right through so many different words that we use commonly without thinking of what they really mean. Our language itself was given to us to contain coding, as all the high Freemasons know.

Before we get into your other works, the second and third books, give us your thoughts about religion, about the Bible, about the Koran, about how all these things fit in in your thinking, and whether it's important to follow one of these groups, or whether you feel that a person can find the Creator without any of it.

And just give me your thoughts about religion, the Bible, the Koran, and all the Jewish books that tell about ways to find the Creator. What do you think? Well, if you go through, the mainstream religions all have, for the West in a way, all came from basically the Hebrew versions and split off. The Christians would say it was the culmination or the completion of Judaism.

to have a messiah uh... most jews think the messiah is still to come and and you can have many messiahs within judaism anyone who furthers the cause is called the messiah

And Mohammedism was slightly tailor-made and altered to suit the Arabic peoples, the desert peoples, and give them strong laws, basically, to be more cohesive as a society. So they all come from the same root. You'll find in every region of the world there's always a trinity of religions which are associated from a main root.

And so for the West, they gave them Judaism, then Christianity, and Islam coming from the same source.

You find in the Far East, they give you Shintoism, a form of Japanese Buddhism and another mainstream religion, or Taoism as well. So you always have a trinity of religions for each region of the planet and that's how it's set up. Slightly altered for the mentalities of different cultures. That's all. That's the only difference there is. Now looking back at the Vatican's control over the centuries, do you

Do you think they were involved in creating any of these religions? I know it's been said they've been involved. However, the Vatican, well, Roman Catholicism itself, you have to look at it through history's eyes to see how it even evolved. Yeah, go ahead. We've got to realize that what you had was a Roman Empire that knew it could not, it fell towards the end because it could not

tax all of its colonies sufficiently to keep Rome in the lifestyle that they accumulated and was used to. So they thought that religion was a better way to dominate the minds of whole people more cheaply, more effectively, especially if you could indoctrinate the young, you will never lose them when they grow up. So the Catholic Church, remember, took someone else's religion, the Gnostic religion, really,

And the Gnostics had a Jesus-type figure who they said was mythical. He was a myth of a perfected man which they all hoped to emulate. So it was almost like a mascot, you might say, of a perfected man, not a real person. And so they were arguing with Constantine when he had the first great meeting in 325 A.D. to form this new universal church.

as it was called at the time. And because the Gnostics wouldn't go along with the Vatican saying, well, Jesus was a real person, Constantine sent out armies to try and kill off all the Gnostics because they knew, according to them, that it was not a real person that had existed. Now, in Judaism, you have references to Jesus in the Talmud, and in other writings of Judaism,

which would make you think there was at least one character who could have been called Judah or Yehuda or whatever but probably not Jesus. We know it meant the fish from the Greek, Iisous, and it was for the age of Pisces, the fish that it was created. Correct. And every era, it's the same long before that you had the Ramesses line.

for the pharaohs in Egypt because their lineage began in the reign of Ares, the ram, you see. So they always give you a religious figure for the particular constellation that rules for two and a half thousand years or so. So the Jesus was to be meant to fulfill a period for two thousand odd years and then you're into the age of Aquarius.

which we're coming into now, and then he dies off, the new one takes over. Everything is stellar occultic, lunar occultic, and solar occultic in the world's history. And the priests down through the ages simply change hats, as they did for Rome. The high priests of Jupiter changed their hats overnight when they were now called the universal church.

And then after hunting down all what they called were the pagan priesthoods, the Roman Church then began to adopt those very tenets of those priesthoods back into their own religion.

And so we have that battle between Constantine and the Gnostics, the Gnostics saying that Jesus was a mythical figure, and then we have Constantine's new religion who is going to the Roman Catholic Church who is going to say that Jesus was an actual man. Now, he is translated in the Bible as an actual man. How did that come about? I guess what I'm getting at is

Let's deal with firm Bible believers and then firm believers of the Koran and move on. But what would be your answer to a Bible believer who says, this is really the only way to God. The words in this Bible have been written by God, and as they're written, they should be read and believed. And this is the way to heaven. What is your thoughts? Well, in a sense, they're right in that...

Very clever people put the Bible together, giving you the simple rules that would give you a really workable society if everyone followed the rules, including those who lead your countries, you see. But never in any age have the rulers in this system followed the religion they make the people adopt.

We know that by history itself, the leaders have never followed the same rules as the public. So yeah, it would be workable for the people if everyone did adopt and follow simple rules. But however, these religions are very Hegelian because there's always a truth contained within

The falsehood is well contained within, but the truth is that they're supposed to be stepping stones to much higher truths. They're not meant to stay static and become dogmatic as a religion. They're supposed to progress onwards and upwards and carry the person who is truly seeking into a higher realm of understanding towards a creator. If you notice that the main deity of Yahweh,

for the Hebrew, the Old Hebrew, is very much of a human character, very much of a human god with his failings, his anger, his temper, his favoritism. He can also change his mind when he wants to and kill you if he has a sudden rage.

So it's really a projection of a human, oriental-type despotic king that you would find in the Middle East at that period. It was something that people could understand. The Greeks now talked about the Demiurgos. The Demiurgos is the base god at the low level of godhood, claiming there's four levels.

and that the base God is in charge of the world. He is the Lord of the world. And he, because the people are base, has very stringent patriarchal-type rules to make their system work. He's unforgiving. He puts you off guard. You're never sure if he likes you or dislikes you.

However, he's not supposedly the only one. He's one level. So he's a demi-urgos, and Jehovah fits that level perfectly well. If you notice, for instance, the story of Jacob. Jacob cheats his brother out of the birthright and the blessing by pretending that he is the brother, and he fools his own father, who's blind or half-blind. So he lies. He cheats.

and he steals the birthright and disobeyed his father, he broke all the rules and yet the God blessed him for being so crafty and cunning and made him the father of Israel.

Now that's how the Mafia would work. And so you have to understand there's high Masonic rules in there too because they do believe you should get away with things if you do it craftily and enough cunning and get your way. The rules of the high corrupt system is also contained in that Masonic Bible, the Old Testament, if you understand them.

Now what deity that's for justice and all the rest of it would ever allow that to happen and actually bless the criminal?

Exactly. Now, you know, getting back to, we were talking about the Vatican's role in the creation of all these religions. What have you learned through your studies regarding that, whether the Vatican was involved in the creation of Islam, whether it was involved in the creation of Christianity, in a sense, as we know it? And what is their role in the Bible? Have they been involved in rewriting that?

What have you learned? Yeah, the Bible's been written many times, always for political purposes, including the King James Version was written to make the people obedient, because King James thoroughly believed that he was God's representative on earth, ordained by God. And he even wrote a big speech about that.

King James said, "How dare the people inquire as to his decisions?" He says, "Don't they realize that I have the power of God given to me by God to do and say and do as I wish?" That's how he truly believes. So in the King James Version, he had all the writers stress that point that the government was put there by God and they should obey it. So it was written for a political purpose.

with a lot of high masons at the time working on that very project Francis Bacon and others helped to write that together. And what about that... If you go back into the ancient Middle East, into Zoroastrianism really, and that was the start of all these religions, the Zoroastrian religion is the first one to come out talking about a good deity and a bad deity.

Later on in Judaism you have a God and a devil, even though the devil, if you read Job, worked for God. God told him to go and torment people. He was a worker. He was employed by God. But Zoroastrianism seems to be the one that they've all taken their cue from and created Judaism from it and Christianity from it as well. And how far back are we going?

It's a very mythical figure, but it's hard to put Zoroaster. It's also called Zarathustra. And Zoroaster, in the old, old system, meant seed of Ishtar. That's where the name comes from, Zoroaster.

Zoroaster, Zoro also means the man with the mask like Zoro. And you also have the same thing in the Old Testament with Zorobabel, which means the seed of Babel. Why would anybody who'd been a slave in Babylon call themselves the seed of Babel? You're looking at coding in there for the wise to understand. And of course the profane are never taught the reasons, as they call them.

You're looking at very clever people running a system down through the ages with an exoteric for the public, be it Judaism, Christianity, or Islam, but teaching a high esoteric tradition for the ones in the know at the top who laugh up their sleeves at the public all the time. Have you ever had a chance to see that video Zeitgeist? No, I've heard about it. I haven't seen it, though.

All right, I wanted to get your thoughts about it. Yeah, I recommend you take a look at it because it goes back and talks about all of the astrological symbolisms that are contained in all the different religions and how they relate to the zodiac regarding what we were talking about earlier, the age of Pisces and coming on to the age of Aquarius. It's even in the New Testament, if you understand what you're reading,

Because... And I wrote that in the third volume. I went through the whole Zodiac a few years ago and explained what each one of them meant in the higher esoteric meaning. And...

you'll find that, yeah, even George Bush Senior said everything is going to the heavenly divine plan. What he was referring to was the zodiac and what they mean. Because the zodiac to them is a timetable. Each part of the zodiac is part of the system that must come into play at a particular time according to an old, old plan.

The Aquarius is even in the New Testament where Jesus says to his disciples, go into town, find the man with the mule, and ask for his mule. He'll be carrying a pitcher of water. And what he's telling them is that Aquarius, the man with the pitcher of water was Aquarius. The whole thing is astrological. Right. And...

What happens here, we have a, you know, once we begin talking in these terms of the astrological similarities that religions use, you know, December 25th, and then we get into the virgin birth and the other things, the resurrection, things like that, and many, many different things.

Jesus figures throughout history have had the same characteristics. It begins to upset people who have this strict belief that Jesus was an actual person put here, as the Bible says, God's son put on earth.

And I wonder how you reconcile that. How can there be any reconciliation? Let's just say, for argument's sake, what's the difference if I believe that God is a myth or Jesus is real or Jesus is a myth? Can we get to the same place, and that is an understanding of truth and finding some type of meaning in life or Creator? What's your thoughts? I think that people can find truth

The higher truths, beyond the base truth, the laws that are given for the base public, I think the individual who is truly seeking will find it if they seek hard enough, and they'll even go beyond whichever religion they've been given on the base level, the common religion. Very few do, but some are able to do it and use that like a stepping stone to get up.

and come in touch with something far greater than themselves, far bigger than the basic Yahweh character with the human characteristics of the bad old angry old man. There's something much greater in the world than that. And some people can go through, even I've talked to people from Islam who've gone beyond Islam on the same path too.

and come to the same conclusions only because they've done the journey themselves they've left the dogma behind them the dogma being given to the general public who need those basic rules a certain period in their history

Exactly. We're going to take a break shortly. We've got about a minute, and then we'll come back for a second half hour. We'll be with Alan Watt for the next hour and a half. You can find him at his website, www.cuttingthroughthematrix.com. You can find there a whole bunch of different works and articles. I can see you've been doing a lot of radio shows lately. You've been on many, many different broadcasts.

And I'm wondering in this last minute, what are you finding people want to hear? I mean, you have a very broad scope as you go back into history, but what topics are you finding that many people are wanting you to discuss?

What's getting them eventually is, I'm trying to get through to them that even though they're sort of waking up to what's happening now in their lifetime at this period with the big changes that are underway,

What they want to know is how we got to this point. And then they're realizing what I've been saying is, you don't understand, this has been going on for thousands of years. And what you think of as normal, meaning your culture was not normal at all, it was one of many cultures they could have given you.

and that they change culture from the top and the people simply emulate it and copy it. The America of today is vastly different from 20 years ago or 40 or 100 years ago. It's constantly being upgraded as you upgrade a computer program and the public don't even notice, they simply adapt.

Yeah, and I think what we'll do after this break, we'll go back into history and really try to trace how we got to where we're at with Alan Watt. We'll be back in three minutes after these short messages.

Okay, I'm real happy to be back for this second half hour of the Investigative Journal on libertyradiolive.com. I'm your host, Greg Szymanski. This is the Investigative Journal. My guest today is Alan Watt, a website called www.cuttingthroughthematrix.com, a website that I recommend you go to and read. You can learn a lot about lost history, and Alan's trying to bring us up to date with that. Before I get back to him, I just want to mention that...

On my show yesterday, I had John Levy, attorney for the Croatian victims of the genocide. That is in a case called Alperen v. Vatican Bank that's going on in the federal courts today. I want to mention, go to my website and you can read all about that case.

and it will give you a little insight on really what the Vatican is up to and how they really play an important part in our geopolitical world. They're not to be left out of the picture when you start talking about who are the real spiritual controllers of the New World Order and how they are trying desperately to turn this into even more of a fascist country. They want total control, and I say to people,

Beyond all the understandings and wisdom of religion, we must deal with actual people on this planet right now. We cannot forget about the Jesuit general, Fr. Peter Hans Klugenbach, probably one of the most powerful men in the world, who works out of Borgo Santo Spirito Cinque. That's right next to the Vatican where the Jesuit headquarters are.

You need to just look him up. Do some research about him and see if you agree with me and many of my guests who have come forward to say, we've got to check on the Jesuits. These guys are not going to let you go easy. They've been behind many, many assassinations, including...

The one we had C.T. Wilcox on yesterday who has documented the assassination of Abraham Lincoln, and actually the Jesuits were behind that. We've also talked with others who talk about their role.

in the Kennedy assassination and also their role in creating the Federal Reserve System, the banking system. And also, we can't forget that if we do not deal with this issue fairly, we will never get to the real nuts and bolts truth about the New World Order, who they are on this planet today. And so with that, let me get back to my guest, Alan Watt. Alan, thank you so much for your time.

You say this on your website, and we're going to get back to what we were discussing at the break, and that was...

How did we get to this point where America seems to be coming apart at the threads? Why are people in such a dilemma? You look at everyone and many, many people are just, "What is going on in this world?" they say to themselves. They feel something but they can't put their finger on it. Let me read this. You say, "In all ages, in all lands, there have been those who seek truth.

This seeking is an individual search for something more than self and much more than the confines of this worldly system that we live in.

It is the seeker who understands there is more than what meets the eye, who is not afraid and makes the choice to go into the unknown. The process of awakening has begun. The discovery is underway. You give a course of deprogramming, and I want to get into that, but let's go back. Can you give us a brief historical look back at how we got to this point?

and maybe that will help people be able to cope with it a little better. Go ahead. Yeah, well, we got to this point when money was introduced into civilization with cities. That's what civilization comes from, is a city. You're a citizen of a city. And if you look at the definition of a citizen, it says someone who is born with pre-existing duties to assist them.

Now if you're born with pre-existing duties to a system it means you're not born free. And they have the big talk about Nimrod being the first builder of cities. In a city, a city cannot supply itself with anything it needs to simply survive. It needs an artificial system and it is an artificial system. It must have this thing called money.

and can then hire people who don't work for food, they work for money, and you buy your food and then they can tax it back from you and create armies to go off and conquer. So even guys like Plato said that they would bring their utopia, their world republic into being by using the cities because in a city the culture is plastic, it is fluid, it is flexible.

You can shape it and direct it into any direction you wish it to go. And the public adapts so quickly in this system, it doesn't matter what kind of society it is, the public will adapt to it and think it's normal. A child born into a system where the parents don't know it's abnormal, it means that the child itself will think everything that exists in that system must be normal and they will never question it.

So that technique's been used for thousands of years to create a form of slavery. Charles Galton Darwin admitted this in the 1950s. He was the grandson of Charles Darwin. He was a physicist, and he said that they could actually...

You said, "There has always existed a form of slavery and we, meaning the elite, are simply creating a more effective form of slavery today." That was the 1950s. That form of slavery is already here. People are wage slaves. They work like rats work in a laboratory where they pull levers and get a seed. And that rat then begins to think that's normal and that's the only way that you eat.

It's the same with people working for money. They are wage slaves and if you add up all the taxes and hidden taxes that you pay, it's about 60% of your income. If you go back to the Middle Ages, the feudal system, the average serf who did not own his land had to give 60% of all his produce to his lord.

and he's left with 40% to feed himself, his family, any cattle he had, and any other labor. So the rates are the same from the feudal system to the present system, and yet today through propaganda they keep telling us we are free. How can you be free if you don't really own the roof over your head?

How can you live in a truly advanced society, what they call progress and civilization, when someone that you'll never meet in a city far away decides to send the tax men after you and they take that roof from over your head?

and sees it, that's called stealing, you see? They steal your property and through propaganda and through altering perceptions, the whole population is taught that this is somehow normal. It's incredible how they can distort perception by the use of words. The same thing goes with if you have a highwayman on the road

and he draws his pistols and holds you up and demands ransom money or you won't pass and you pay him off, you say this guy is a highwayman, he's a robber. If a cop does it and demands that he gives you a ticket or even cash, as some of them do nowadays for their bosses, he's doing his duty for the law. It's the same act. If the highwayman comes and steals your stagecoach,

You know he's stolen it. If the police impound your car, they call it impounding, not stealing. It's the same act. So perceptions are altered in this system to fool the public, and the public are trained to think this is all normal. That's how you distort perceptions.

Exactly. So we begin with this monetary system that creates us into slaves. But can you get a little bit, can you get into some historical sequences that bring us to this point with the people that, you know, in modern times, in a sense, from the formation of our country and how it's changed from the beginning till now?

Well, even the creation of the United States, there's no doubt about it. It wasn't a sudden idea to have a revolution. It took years of planning, and the founding fathers admitted that they had to do negotiations with countries long before, in advance, they could supply them with powder and ball and all the rest of it, and logistics. And they had the islands all mapped out and ready to go, where they would bring all this pirated stuff into.

They also had treaties made with France who would finance them through this war. It took a lot of planning and preparation to set it off, and it was a Masonic

That's why 33 of the 50-odd founding fathers signed the Declaration. It was for the high number 33 because the sun rises on the 30th degree and sets at 33, the same as Jesus comes on the scene at the age of 30 and dies at 33. It's the same old Masonic stuff down through the ages, and they do like to stick to their formulas.

Yeah, that's right. Go ahead. So the founding fathers, like all countries that's been created through this technique, England was the first we must remember because the English Revolution was before the U.S. Revolution. Everyone seems to forget that.

And the colors of the revolution were red and then had the blue lodge, so the color blue for open Freemasonry, because the sun is blue when everything is out in the open. And white is for the spirit that would really guide it. So that's the colors of revolution is red, white, and blue. So every country that had the revolution, Britain, the United States, and France, they ended up with red, white, and blue on their flag because it's Kabbalistic.

and only the founders understood this religion. The lower peasantry didn't understand anything about it at all.

When they got together in the convention hall, they barred the doors, they pulled the blinds, they put sentries on the doors to keep the public out. And that was a Masonic meeting they held in Philadelphia. Because they do it in the temple that has no windows. That's why no one could see in. It was a Masonic meeting. And they came out and then said to the people, we have given you a government. Well, there was no vote by the people, you know, to have that government.

And that's never questioned. The public had no say in the whole thing. And then they gave you the foundation myths that George Washington could not tell you a lie and all this stuff. These are called foundation myths that they always give every country to make them feel good about themselves.

So we definitely had a Masonic influence in the creation of America, the Revolutionary War. Can you tell us what was the real reason that you found for the creation of this country? Well, they had meetings in Europe before the Revolution, and they had the Concert of Europe, and they had different ones, they called them,

And they wanted a world society. The elite wanted... They knew that the way they were going, they couldn't war amongst themselves, the psychopathic crew that gets to the top in this money system. They're always psychopaths. And then they become inbred psychopaths and then hereditary psychopaths. They knew they couldn't keep on having wars without eventually having a global society because every war led to a takeover of other countries and amalgamations

that started with alliances that become amalgamated, that become empires, and they knew eventually they'd end up with one global empire, but they knew they couldn't do it quickly with the countries that were already known for plundering every country they went into. That was Britain, France, and all the Germanic countries and so on.

So they had to create a new knight in shining armor that was going to go for freedom and democracy and all this stuff. And so they created the United States of America to lead the charge. They also knew by the size of the Americas and the natural resources that it had that that would be built up through immigration and manpower to lead the world, to be the richest country in the world. They could finance wars. Wars are very expensive.

And a global war would cost an awful lot of money and manpower for military. So they had to create this and they gave the world this new one that didn't have a history of plundering other nations when it started off and it led the charge. And of course even today when you go across the world, even 20, 30 years ago when you traveled across the world,

You'd meet people that were coming from Georgetown University and doing their work abroad to help the peoples. But what they were really doing was bringing the American business system with them and furthering American corporate interests abroad. That's really what they were doing. The U.S. has caused more wars and done more warlike things through international corporatism than any other way.

Exactly. And through the story that Americans are given about the Revolutionary War and the purposes for this country, I think are naive. And when we see the

When we see what's happened through the course of history and how our country has been subverted, how the Constitution now is gutted, how religious organizations like the Vatican have bound together with the secular world, with our government, to move in a certain direction which limits our freedoms in almost every area we look at,

It's high time we do something about it. Is there anything we can do at this point? Here's the dilemma. The people have come to this point thinking that the past was normal and that the money system was normal. Their industry has gone abroad. Most of them saw it happening and didn't recognize it at the time. They floated through the changeover to China as the industry was leaving shores.

you can't get America back to a phase because all the industry is gone. And under this economic system, if you don't produce products, then you're a service economy. Service economies, as the big economists tell you, are meant as stopgap measures between industry and something else. If there's nothing else that takes its place, the dog that's paddling will eventually flounder and drown. So it looks to me like the U.S.,

is going to be vastly depopulated in the future. And that ties in with books like Millennium by Jack Sattali, a man who helped spearhead the unification of Europe and who wrote about the next phase, which is the unification of Americas in his book Millennium, written about 1990. And he said that eventually when the borders were going down in the Americas, the Latin Americans will flood up

and for a while there will be mayhem as even the big gangs move up and he said it will be similar to Attila the Hun invading Rome etc. the Huns and the Goths and Visigoths invading Rome when they come in but eventually it will settle down however he said that America that they knew will never come back in fact the next boat people will be Americans going across the world looking for employment

So this has all been discussed at top think tanks at international levels for many years. And you talk about the depopulation of America. Tell us what you mean by that. How do they plan to do that? The depopulation on one aspect will be, let's say, mass immigration out of America eventually. But they also believe at the top that they don't want, and they mean this, they don't want what they call useless eaters.

These guys at the top want an efficient system where you're not born just to play yourself, enjoy yourself and eat, etc., but rather to produce for the system. I've said before, if there's no work for you to produce for the system, you are therefore a useless eater and they will not tolerate them to live. They mean what they say. They want to vastly reduce the population over the next 10, 20 years. If you look at all the agreements that have been signed

by every country in the world, even including the Kyoto Agreement. They want to kick back countries like Canada and America to the pollution standards of pre-1960. Now, pre-1960 had a much smaller population than today. And they want, I mean, electricity, your gasoline, all of those things, you know.

That's a China Express going by my house, by the way. Yeah, is that a China Express? Yeah, so we've flown up all the Costco stores across Canada. What part of Canada are you in, by the way, Alan? I'm right up where the Trans-Canada Highway in Ontario goes across the whole country from the east to the west coast. Okay. Go ahead, I interrupted you. Go back to what you were saying about depopulation. Yeah, well, as I say, people like Bertrand Russell and

and the Council on Population Control at the United Nations have put out these statements that they're going to have vastly reduced populations that will live in these habitat areas. The United Nations has websites up on these habitat areas. And what it boils down to is initially the habitat areas are the existing cities that are going to become tremendously overcrowded.

But they also have habitat areas with armed guards and perimeter fences with high-tech homes for the high bureaucratic class that will be running the United Americas.

This is modeled on the Soviet system where no one could leave their area. They all lived in a form of almost a British third rate level except for the bureaucracies that served the system. They had dash-hows in the country where they had servants and they could get away and enjoy themselves. Well, that was the model that we are now based upon.

So this special habitat here is high-tech ones. The pleasant ones will be for advanced professors and people who have control over parts of indoctrination processes, which is very important. Lenin said it himself. He says you must pay the police, the military, and the educationalists very well because they do the indoctrination and they keep the people obedient.

How do you think they'll get to that point, the New World Order? What are their plans? I mean, just actual plans. America living now, many people, just like nothing's happening, everything's normal. What do you think you'll see to wake up, I guess, the people that are sleeping to understand that there's a lot of big changes on the horizon? The people who are sleeping will stay sleeping. It's been the same in all ages if you read history.

that the populations, the vast bulk of them, will go to the wall rather than admit what's happening. They want to believe the propaganda. They want to believe the 6 o'clock news. They want to believe that the experts are running their lives for them efficiently. They don't want to know the hard, bad truths about the world. They're perpetual children, and that's what socialism is, you see.

So they'll go to the wall holding on to the myth and in a state of denial until they personally get hit or thrown out their homes or wherever it may be and then they'll start howling, then they'll form mobs and then they'll riot, uncoordinated mobs which will riot. And the governments are prepared for this, they've been preparing for 30, 40 years for this by building up big internal armies and rapid deployment forces

The British Department of Defense, a couple of months ago in the Guardian newspaper, released nine pages from the Department of Defense for NATO as well as Britain. And the U.S. is part of NATO. They all signed the same thing.

And for the next 20 years, they project from the top think tanks in the military, they project, they see nothing but riots and what they call flash mobs from the general population getting increasingly worse over the next 10 to 20 years. And they are preparing through their think tanks of every possible scenario that they must do to handle and control the public, including the use of neutron bombs,

on selected target groups within the population. This is from the biggest defense department on the planet. Now, what would take... What on earth is going to happen to make Joe Sixpack

get off his chair and actually take part in something, albeit rioting. But what it will be is the effects of things like Kyoto. They're going to stop giving you your gasoline. That's going to get rationed in the future. They want non-essential vehicles only eventually on the roads for the habitat areas. They're going to cut back electricity supply.

usage drastically all the things all the conveniences that you have and they're also going to give you less and less employment so you're going to get rioting breaking out uncoordinated riots that will be dealt swiftly with swiftly by by the police and the military type forces that are being trained to deal with this now and uh with your best of your knowledge how far away is this when they start

when these drastic measures start taking place. We're now in, what, 2007? What do you think? Once the United Nations is declared to be the sovereign government of the world, and the United Americas has taken place officially, the last part of the signaturing, the signing of the Americas, was done in 2010.

I think the second or third part is being signed this month, this coming month in Quebec with the President and the Prime Minister of Canada and Mexico. By 2010, the Americas have to be united completely with its own form of a Brussels-type government and even discussed creating the new capital of the Americas in Quebec

That was decided back in the 1990s when they did the free trade negotiations. 2012, the UN is to be made the official government of the world. That means that the US Congress will be like a provincial government and so will the Canadian one.

Right, and we'll be united with Canada and Mexico, correct? And Chile and a few others, yeah. All right, let's take a two-minute break at the top of the hour. We'll be back right after these short messages with Alan Watts. Woke up today, I was finally lost in the lost world, lost in the lost world.