Is Your Posture Controlling Your Health and Politics? w/ Matthew Spearman
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So we're going to have a good discussion with Matthew Spearman, our guest today. How are you doing, Matthew? I'm doing great. How about yourself, David? I'm doing good. So I wanted to have you on because, you know, you always have something fascinating that you're cooking up. And I wanted to also talk about your sub stack. How long have you had the sub stack? Because a lot of the posts that I see from you are Twitter threads, but you also have a sub stack. Yeah. Oh, I guess I just started it. Let me check. I want to say...

Less than six months ago, maybe six months ago. I just wanted to take some of the stuff I talk about on Twitter and, um,

because Twitter is inherently limiting and the detail can go into, uh, this just gives me an opportunity to go, uh, to spur out a little bit more to, to, to go into more depth on some topics. Uh, so it's, uh, the sub stack name is Vitae Aether, uh, Vitae Aether, however you want to pronounce that. There'll probably be a link down below. I'm assuming, uh, you'll put it in there, but I, I just like writing about these things and, uh,

Yeah, you're talking about metabolism, hormones, and posture. They are all one. How are they all one? Well, it all comes down to… You have a picture of a weird guy and then a guy with black outfit and a guy with red and green pants.

okay you're looking at that one yeah um so it's all just expressions of one uh organism and i think um science and or reductionist science likes to try to break things down into their individual parts but at the end of the day they're all again expressions of one uh of one thing so in this article i just kind of talk about how

your your metabolism your your energy your hormones are going to affect how you stand how you move how you sort of operate in the in the physical realm um but it's also a two-way street so how you how you do move how you how you breathe how you again exist is going to have a feedback or it's going to provide feedback to your hormones um to your metabolism uh kind of go into how

That occurs with the fact that your cells, each individual cell is actually bound to the extracellular matrix and eventually into all other tissue in the body. So physical movements, positions are sensed by the cells and those can actually make changes, make genetic changes, metabolic changes.

You're how you again right now, depending on whatever you're doing, however, you're listening to this. Your individual cells can sense what you're doing, how you're doing it, and they will change. They will alter their behavior based on whatever mechanical stimulus they get. So how the heck do you know what your posture is signaling to your darn self? You know?

Well, I think that that comes down to your just just your own, I guess, intuitive feelings. So if when when you're doing something, when you're moving, if you're moving in a way, say walking, right, everyone walks and it kind of feels awkward. Maybe you have a hitch in your gate. Maybe it feels stiff.

Those are things that it's trying to communicate to you. Again, it's a two-way system where that part of the body or whatever is kind of desynchronized, is trying to communicate to yourself what's going on. I kind of summed up Asher's

which, you know, posture isn't just, oh, sit up straight and, you know, have a stick up your ass sort of thing. It comes down to feeling good. Again, it should feel good. Like you should just existing, just breathing, walking, whatever you're doing should feel good. It should feel effortless. It should feel stimulating and not like a wired way, but like, okay, wow, like this feels good. I want to do more of it. It should look good.

right and and intuitively you can tell when somebody has bad posture um it doesn't always do uh them much could just tell them to sit up straight or something uh which is kind of what i get at in this this article um but it should look good you should be able to look at yourself and say oh okay you know i'm standing up nicely and and if you analyze your gait you should say wow the gate looks looks good um because you can again you can tell that with with other people

Um, and then lastly, it should, uh, you should have performance. You should be able to perform whatever it is you need to do. If you're an athlete, you should have, uh, excellent power, efficiency, speed. If you're, I mean, honestly, whatever you're doing, a lot of people, you know, they need precision, they need precise movements with different parts of their body. Uh,

I don't know what you're doing, but I'd imagine even if you're not doing anything that's physically exerting, humans have a lot of dexterous control over their hands and such. So that would be another sort of marker of good posture. So all those things, they're going to look different based on who you are, your background, what you do.

But that's sort of the gist of it right there is feeling good, looking good, and performing good or performing well. And that communicates to all your cells information, huh? Yeah, your cells. And it does so not only mechanically with the cells, but also with the nervous system.

Again, in the fascia, you have a sort of fiber optic network of light, right? And the bio photons that these cells give off regarding their status, regarding their metabolic status and such travels back.

through the fascia, travels through your connective tissue and go again, different positions. And it's often not necessarily one position. It's more of a chronic thing that if you, if you do something, if you move in a way that causes certain tissues to adapt pathologically to try to make up for protect against whatever either poor movement or injury or, or whatever, or whatever it is that can disrupt again, that the flow of bio photons, the,

the flow of blood and lymph and everything you can possibly imagine. Because every time you walk or every time you breathe, you're...

You're pressing down on your gut, right? So the contents of your gut are being squished and sort of massaged. Helps get it through there. You have your two biggest blood vessels. They're sort of right behind, right next to your lumbar spine or sort of in front. So every time you breathe, every time you walk,

that's helping to pump blood uh through the body so again if there's any sort of discrepancy any sort of major asymmetry in movement all those things are unfortunately going to be affected and again it's not a thing that's going to really make a difference if you do it for a minute five minutes it's more of a okay over the days weeks months years that this sort of builds on itself and um

can can cause issues and it's not necessarily that the uh this is a this is the the driving issue itself this is more more so an adaptation to usually something in the environment or something in the internal environment maybe um maybe your gut maybe just your your metabolism and your your hormones in general and that shoes play a big role in your um posture don't they

Yeah, and most people's shoes... Do you wear the Spider-Man shoes that go to your toes and everything? I don't. I'm not brave enough to wear those. I do wear the clown shoes, though, the ones that are really wide. And, you know, normal shoes are like... And your toes are like that. But the barefoot ones, you know, they just... They allow your toes to breathe. And I think once you try them, if you've tried them before, you can't go back.

You go, wow, how did I ever do that? It's kind of like wearing a straitjacket. If you had a straitjacket on, you had to go about your day. It's not just that. It's that they put arch supports in there, which ends up ruining your arches, right? Which ends up ruining your posture and everything else. Bernard Herzog, do you know him? He lives right next door to you in L.A. He does? Wow. I don't know him. He says every young man needs to move a ship over a mountain at least once in their life.

How does that fit in with what you said about posture and metabolism? Like a literal shift? Yeah, like he did that in one of his famous movies where he literally had a whole army of natives in the South. Okay. So the natives did the work. Well, he was involved with it. He was yelling at them, as Germans tend to do, and

Fitzcarraldo is the name. Have you ever seen that movie? I have not. Look up the cover of it. You'll see the ship going over the mountain. He literally did that as part of the movie. What's the title again? Fitzcarraldo. F-I-T-Z-C-A-R-R-A-L-D-O. Fitzcarraldo. And then look at the Google images or whatever. Oh, wow.

This is like, what is this? Is this in Africa or something? This is the Belgian Congo. South America. Oh, it's in South America. Wow. See that picture? Do you see young Werner Herzog with the parrot on his shoulder and the ship coming down over him? Yeah, I feel like they're asking him to use your way to do that thing. He has to do it the existentially beautiful way, right? Yeah. He sits there and yells at the natives. He had a crazy...

Crazy experience on that. A lot of people were having a hard time. The boat slid down the ramp. Klaus Kinski was his main actor who was a nut. He had to direct him by gun where he had to put a gun to him and said, if you don't continue to do what I'm asking you to do. Herzog had to take matters in a direct sense there. But you have to wonder what happens between

That era where people like Herzog could still run and gun and pick up a camera and film and shoot and move across South America. And now, today's world is all digitally mediated, sedentary, and travel is even being ruined by the digital world because now every little nook and cranny that used to be this cool little spot that nobody stupid and touristy would be there is now overrun. I have that effect about...

Like Japan, I went there in 2003, and it was still Japanese. And now I hear from folks who live over there that there's tourists everywhere, every little town, they're just with their little selfie sticks and running around these little ancient villages and just trampling everything, trampling on the moss and bringing that run-down vibe back

that global uh tourism produces right where it's like everything's dilapidated and just spent it all feels spent you know why do you think it happened and how does that relate to our metabolism and posture because japanese people have fantastic posture they do they do and they used to i don't know if they do anymore but well i think a lot of that it's uh

is maybe culturally, you know, with Bushido and everything. But how that relates to, you know, how, I mean, just in general, any sort of degeneration of society,

is an attempt to compensate for a lack of travel. Something like that for traveling. Maybe nowadays, I think most people travel not to travel, but to tell other people that they traveled and to take pictures of it. You know, when I go to somewhere and I don't really travel a lot or anything, but when I go somewhere, I don't take any pictures of

I don't take any video. I don't have any social medias. I mean, aside from my Twitter and everything. I don't share my personal life because it's like I'm there to enjoy what it is for the moment. But then you have people, if you're metabolically decrepit and deficient, you kind of

rely on the approval of others. You rely on the system in general. And so that's one way to, you know, hopefully either cement your position or maybe move up in sort of this hierarchy by saying, oh, you know, look where I went. It was expensive and I went to this trendy place that everybody talks about.

And then, you know, it all just gets commercialized from there as a result of just having a deficient metabolism where you're not there to enjoy it. You're not there for the end itself. It's a means to an end. So when you go to a beautiful waterfall somewhere, they're there to take a picture because then the picture leads to, you know, likes on Instagram. And then the likes on Instagram, maybe I'll get a wife or a husband or something, or maybe I'll get some clout versus just,

Being able to go there, not take any pictures, enjoy, be present and enjoy. It's cliche, but enjoy the moment.

and enjoy the beauty and wonder of life and God's creation. I think that's kind of what it is. At the end of the day, it's metabolism. God art one is when you have a decrepit metabolism, you're essentially being disconnected from God and everything that really goes with it. And so you try to find God in these just convoluted, inefficient, and just kind of disgusting ways, really. Yeah.

Now, when you hear that, the average person, let's talk about how they might interpret what you said, just for a second. Decrepit metabolism means fat people, right? Therefore, the fat people are the ones who are creating all of this misery and destruction and vapid tourism and social status approval. But yet, we all know that it's not just that. It's also people who are fit people

you know, athletically built and thin and all of that, who are also posting selfies and Instagram posts that they went to Cambodia or whatever. And, you know, that's a universal thing. So the average person, maybe you could clarify or whatever, but like the average person would kind of, like the way they hear about metabolism, they would think, okay, the worse metabolism you have, the more fatter you are, like a dial. So if you have,

You know, like that's where they associate the word messed up metabolism with. Right. But then you also have the stereotype of the jovial fat guy. Right. So how does all of that fit into what people conventionally think about what metabolism is versus the fact that there's this universal, you know, kind of vanity that is not really correlated with

to uh way size as people would think of metabolism maybe you could help clarify people what what you're talking about yeah so uh metabolism is just uh is biology and biology takes many forms depending on the environment that it's in and it shapes itself to the environment to the demands of the environment in an intelligent fashion

So people with decrepit metabolisms, often some of the worst ones are the ones that are very lean, like a slave who's been working in the fields or the mines for 12 hours a day for years. He's not going to have an ounce of fat on him, but his metabolism is probably destroyed. Really? Even though they're out in the sun and everything? Yeah.

I think a lot of it is the psychology of being a slave and having no freedom and no hope. Your brain, again, your brain eats up a lot of energy. And that would be my thing is the brain, someone's brain, someone's personality, someone's aura. You know, I think that's what the kids are saying these days. That is much more indicative of metabolism than body composition, at least up front.

So how does that work? How can someone have impaired metabolism as it relates to, say, weight, but have an aura of high energy? Like Donald Trump is a classic example of that. I mean, the guy's got endless energy, whether you like him or not. Someone showed a photo of him. I don't know who it was that said it, but a few people said it. But they showed a photo of him talking to Zelensky at the St. Peter's Basilica during...

Francis's funeral, you know, and they were saying, wow, he just has a way of creating an aesthetic vibe in almost every photo every week. He's doing something. He's got this energy. But, you know, he's a heavy guy. He's a big guy. And he's not eating, you know, he's not drinking orange juice and milk, low-fat milk, and eating a carrot salad. And, you know, he's probably not having three bowels a day. He doesn't have time. He probably does not have time for three-bowel movements a day. So how in the world

Can one have blocked metabolism in one manifestation of their life physiologically? And he's starting to hunch over and all that's just aging and stuff, right? But at the same time have boundless energy compared to a 20-year-old lean person who's fit and goes to the gym every day and gets sunlight on the beach. What's going on? How can that be? Any thoughts on that?

Well, I think that goes back to what I was talking about with that article that I had written, where they're all just expressions of the same thing. And where metabolism with your diet, with maybe some parts of your environment, are certainly incredibly influential. But as a human, and I think all living beings do have some level of consciousness, but your spirit and your will...

is probably that, that is there to, to bring it all together. Now there's might be certain limits. So let's say if, if Donald Trump, uh, if you got food poisoning, right, would he be able to will himself out of feeling bad? I don't know. Uh, maybe not. Um,

But for himself, obviously his psyche and his spirit is incredibly strong and strong enough to possibly even outweigh some of those other sorts of transgressions, if you will. And then you think about his background, he probably doesn't have a whole lot of...

stress in the way that a lot of people have stress. I mean, he certainly has stress, but not necessarily in a survival sense. Like he's not trying to just kind of make it through and put food on the table.

And then if you listen to some of his interviews where he talks about things not mattering, he says, oh, you know, 100,000 people could die in an earthquake in Indonesia. That's maybe a big number. And it wouldn't matter. Like, doesn't matter who cares. And that's just, I guess, his mindset of he there's nothing that seems to get him down and bother him and allow him to sort of enter into that slave mentality of hopelessness.

Yeah, essentially. When you look at Zelensky, that looks like learned helplessness on his face. He's always stressed and always, you know. Same with Biden. He had that learned helpless face. He's just desperate for where's his instructions, which he's supposed to look at. He's just totally lost. All those people sort of have that same appearance or demeanor.

And not only the big figures, but a lot of the people that support them support those people. And you can tell politically, politics is very much a biological phenomenon where you can tell the different sects, if you will. There's ones that are obviously just, they're slaves. There's no other way to put it. They're slaves and they're helpless. And they sort of defend their chains and will fight those who try to remove their chains at all costs. And then there's those who are

We're free. And again, it's not the metabolism thing doesn't just purely come down to food or, or your, your, your blue blockers or something. I mean, those are certainly important, but your, your will and your spirit and your connection to God is, is, is what I would say to be the most important because you can do everything right. You can have the perfect diet, perfect exercise routine, perfect environment. But if you're, if your mind is,

I don't want to say he's defeated, but if you've been sort of tricked by the devil into doubting...

your own connection to God. If you're doubting that, that God loves you and wants the best for you, you're, you're probably not going to be particularly healthy, even if you can kind of get it in a vain way. Maybe. So metabolism is not a meter that goes one way. It's either full or half full or depleted. It's not like that, right? I, I, that's not how I think of it. I don't know. I like to think of it as a, uh,

I guess a light, either a candle or a light bulb. So it's like charisma, like spirit, right? Yeah, yeah. And the brighter that light can wane, that light can get brighter. But what's powering that light, I think there's a lot that ends up powering that light and making it shine. That's at least how I think of it.

Do you feel like it's collectively dependent on the rest of humanity? Like even if you do all the right things and have the right mantras and look at yourself in the mirror every day and say all kinds of positive statements and affirmations like people are trying to do and do the right booze and do all the right stuff, but if you're born in an age where there's a collective stupor and low energy vibe, does that kind of hinder most people from ever magnetically...

thinking out of that, you know, decoupling. It's certainly hard, uh, at times, especially if you live with people, if you live near people that are like that, it takes somebody that is very strong to not necessarily be affected by that. I don't want to say it's impossible, but if you can, you would want to remove yourself from those situations if possible. Again, um,

I don't think it's a death sentence. Like if you live with somebody who's toxic or you live with somebody who's just negative all the time and, and sort of, you know, their light is very dim. You can, you yourself are, can have a positive effect on them. Energy is, I mean, it's magnetic, it's contagious and you can affect them. And, but I do think that you also need to protect yourself when you're

possible you don't want to go out into a huge crowd or or be with um be amongst people who might uh or aren't really um conducive to to your light shining your own metabolism your own energy connection with god so it again it does vary based on the person and um

But I don't think it's a death sentence for some. A lot of people in the bioenergetic community will talk about, you know, well, that behavior pattern is indicating. I mean, I know these are just armchair people, but, you know, say, oh, that's estrogenic or that's serotoninogenic or whatever the word would be for that. Or that behavior is indicative of high cortisol. How do people, where does your take on that

Obviously, it's not like these hormones just are coming up on stage from the backstage. It's like, and now it's time for estrogen. Cortisol. You're feeling estrogen on your body. And then he walks out, and now it's cortisol time. It's not like that. These are this very complex, interconnected signaling molecules going all over the place all at the same time.

But do you believe that you can isolate the feeling, so to speak, of these different kind of stress hormones? And how would you know what's what? Because it just feels like people are just throwing those words around, almost like insults, almost like they're sending them. Oh, you're a Sarah. That's excess Sarah. Because I remember hearing...

Georgie and Danny and Ray, and they would talk about, oh, this tyrannical authoritarian impulse is serotonin. And then I would hear people say, oh, that's a sign, the way you're acting is a sign that that behavior pattern looks like that's estrogenic or that's, you know, what is going on with all those things? Is there distinctions between these stereotypes of endocrine molecules? Yeah, it's

There definitely are some bigger patterns that you can look for. I think just kind of judging someone's behavior, um,

acute leaves or maybe judging someone's behavior over the course of five minutes that might be difficult maybe over the course of somebody's life and then you can get kind of flus based on their appearance again based on how they go about life that the choices that they make in their life I think you can have a better idea firstly I don't think that it matters much I think a lot of people hear that and they go well what do I do to lower my serotonin

and not understanding that serotonin is all of the rest of it. Those are responses that keep you alive. They're not boogeyman themselves. They're important signalers as to things within the environment or within yourself that need to change, that they shouldn't be demonized. You don't want to necessarily demonize them because demonizing them

and giving say estrogen, serotonin, cortisol, giving them any sort of weight, but any sort of attention creates a problem in itself. And so if you tell yourself,

I have high serotonin, I have high serotonin. That in itself is an affirmation that you sort of accept and just thinking, just interacting with people has a tremendous effect on your hormones. And so you can essentially hypnotize yourself into these sort of feedback loops, these stress feedback loops, just by either accepting or

them uh it's true for yourself or giving them any sort of power rather than looking at it as information to say well why is my serotonin high it's like well maybe it's because I don't have enough uh so my sodium to potassium ratio is that a way great salt open your cortisol is high yeah

So there's a lot of different things that instead of focusing on the negative hormone itself, focus on what you need to do to eliminate that response. Do you believe like Pentecostals do that you can have instantaneous healing of hormonal dysregulation? Because you said that if you tell yourself you have high serotonin, you start to believe it. Can you instantaneously heal something like excess this or that?

spontaneously through like a truly deep belief that takes over your whole being like an ecstatic moment of surrender to the faith that this is not the case anymore because a lot of people feel like it's a slog to say positive things when they feel like you know they're not there yet and it feels like a lot of people think about like affirmation stuff like it's kind of like it's like more work it's a stress in and of itself right like you have to say things that

You're like, I know if I went and got blood work today, it wouldn't say that that issue is resolved, but I've got to still say it anyways, which kind of makes you feel like you're insane or deluded, which your left hemisphere brain will say that when you do that. But there's also another angle of spontaneous declarations of healing taking place, which are documented to have happened, obviously, but can that happen when it comes to something so complex as...

you know, stress mechanism going around? That's a great question. I think it, again, depends on the strength of the spirit of the person to where maybe if that, if, if that spirit is, is strong enough and can orient itself in a negative way, given various circumstances, you could possibly shift it over to a, in a positive way. It's, it's certainly possible. And then you hear the things about people,

um i think it was joe dispenza he's a popular guy uh talks about how i think it was him who broke his back or something in some sort of accident and the doctor said he'd never walk again and he kind of willed himself uh to to heal um and i hope i'm not wrong here i read his book is the you are the placebo so if you you're interested in this sort of stuff uh that's a good book you are the placebo by joe dispenza

um now for something like a back injury i mean are you gonna be able to snap your fingers and go oh it's healed probably not but you might you know instead of being wheelchair bound for the rest of your life you'd be able to heal in six months and and be able to walk again um because it is kind of a constant thing because affirmations are are something that that is supposed to be uh

reiterating what is sort of obvious or what should be obvious or what should be known. Like I am sitting now and speaking to David. It shouldn't necessarily be something that's painful or feels like work. Yeah. It reminds me of, I want to ask you, are you familiar with professor Michael Levin of Tufts university? He's a biologist. I've heard the name. You'll see him promoted in the algorithm. He's on Lex Friedman and other shows.

talking about bio. Oh yeah. Yeah. And we had him recently on our show with Dr. Weeping you, who by the way, has just been doing so phenomenal ever since his viral appearance with, um, Patrick, but David and Terrence Howard, he's over 45 million views, all the clips of that show altogether. So he's going on another show all the time. Now the doctor use a change in the world. And, um,

By the way, I think it's interesting that his birth name, Wei Ping, means world peace. Wow. Just saying, you know, I think he was destined to change the world, in my opinion. But, yeah, there's this guy, Michael Levin, that we had on, and he talks about how cancer, in his mind, he's totally against the chemo and radiation.

And he's at this, you know, it's interesting whenever you hear someone at a university of reputation allowed to say something like that. It tells you where the room is. You know, the reading of the room is changing rapidly from when I started this. I was criticizing the, you know, I was talking about the metabolic view of cancer years ago on radio and like 2016, 2017 on podcasts, 2018 on radio.

And it was such a, it was still such a bizarre fringe thing that was not, but now you're having people like him come out and talk about it. And, um, but he said that, you know, that cancer is like this, your cell, the cell that's cancerous is like decoupling from is becoming isolated from the, you know, the, the bioelectrical signaling hive mind of all the other cells.

and it knows its place and it knows its role within the hive mind of cells. But when it becomes cancerous, it decouples itself.

It loses its sense of self as being in relation to the rest of the bioelectrical signals of the cells. It's like family. And it becomes isolated and it starts to operate on a more ancient pathway, amoeba-like type existence where it sees itself as its own entity in isolation from everybody else. I find fascination, I find that fascinating because

as it relates to my ongoing work to synergize Rene Girard's anthropological work with bioenergetic biology and other areas in that field, in the sense of when the scapegoat mechanism occurs, a human being is isolated as not of the rest of the hive mind for some arbitrary reason that makes them stand out psychologically amongst everybody else. So if we're all metabolic beings and we all have a spirit,

and we all have a thought process, and we can resonate together collectively in antithesis to excluding and isolating a scapegoat. And by expelling and exterminating that scapegoat, we have resolution temporarily, a kind of cathartic relief. And I have thought, because of how cancer operates, it's also somehow a pattern of reality that's also understood at the social level, because scapegoats, are they not...

called cancer. People always talk about people in the workplace as cancerous, and that's the scapegoat, right? Or your hated politician is a cancer on the nation, and his movement is a cancerous thing, or her, whatever it is. There's this language there that I think betrays a deeper reality, a pattern that human societies, sinking their

their mimetic aura, whatever word you want to use, their mimetic energy together operate in the same way that their own individual cells operate. When stress comes about, stress is what creates cancer, right? Is that true or not? Stress mechanism, would you say? Hans Selye type stuff? You would agree with that? Definitely. So stress creates the scapegoat mechanism in human history. That's a fact.

that human societies, whenever they're stressed out, when their resources are limited and they're not eating healthily because there's a famine or a plague or there's a crisis of bad blood and there's tension, if we think of the human beings in the tribe as cells, they start to have tension amongst each other, stress. It is then resolved with that energy being excluding a common enemy through murder or sending them off to die in the wilderness, just like the cancer cell. Is that not interesting to you or what?

I find that fascinating. I want to hear an audio book about that. I just have to be the one to write it because nobody else has done this. I haven't gotten to it yet. I think sort of adding to that is when, let's say, if you cut off the leg of a salamander,

and you apply a very low voltage electric current to the limb, it regrows the limb. It doesn't regrow another salamander. So it knows it's operating in conjunction and coherence with the rest of the organism that, hey, we need a leg here. And so we just need a little energy to go and build that versus like you said, with cancer, it's a energy deficiency so much so that you're sort of shifting from

the multicellular mitochondrial base energy systems and going back to the single-celled amoeba glycolytic glycolysis, hyperglycolysis sort of energy system because there's an energy deficiency, and it only knows to replicate and make itself bigger in sort of like a –

a cancerous fashion, sort of out of control growth. And it is a scapegoat, like you were saying, where that's why it doesn't really make a lot of sense. Like, oh, you got a tumor. So we're just, the tumor's the problem. There's nothing else is the problem. The tumor's the problem. We got to get that tumor out at all costs. We're going to cut you open. We're going to cut your brain open, cut your whatever open, or we're just going to burn you, or we're going to poison you to get that tumor out. Because that tumor, again, is the

the scapegoat rather than looking at, okay, well, maybe the body is, there's a lack of coherence within the entire body. There's a lack of energy that's allowing for, for everything to, to operate as it should. So, yeah. Hey, do you think it's not only that we as a society scapegoat the tumor and our procedures? That's true. But would you not also say that in some sense, the intelligence of the cells of the body collectively decide to scapegoat the cells designated to be the tumor?

Insofar as there's this, I can't do it justice, so you can help me out. I'm feeling out in the dark here because I've heard other people's explanations, but I haven't internalized the knowledge to fully articulate it confidently. But it seems like the cancer is a kind of redirection of the desire to grow in a relatively safer way than allowing the stress to permeate the body

For example, let's start with this question. Does the local cell that becomes cancerous decide to make them cancerous in isolation of the collective? Or does the cells, and I know we're using these words like intelligence stuff in a different way, but do the cells collectively determine that this is going to be where we're going to allow this cancer to develop as a kind of healing defense mechanism of allowing the stress to remain there

collective you you target it into a place because it's a lesser of evil so to speak yeah and i think that makes sense or you don't agree exactly there well i think when you when you have a cancer in uh in somebody it's again it's like a canary in the coal mine but it's usually um based on wherever the most amount of stress or the least amount of uh

of energy is and those are pretty much the same thing so in a sense yes it is sort of wherever there there's stress being experienced that's where the tumor develops doesn't necessarily develop somewhere you know it doesn't just spontaneously uh

come to be. You don't get a tumor in your leg if you have a problem with your colon or your pancreas or your brain. It's very much located where everything's going down in a stressful sense. Whether or not it's protective, I think it could be. I don't know the exact mechanisms, but I think

When you sort of look at the body in general, living organisms in general aren't going to do anything on purpose that's destructive. Life and energy beget life and energy. Doesn't it seem like the cancer cell is redirecting the energy in a safety valve mechanism to not allow it to...

It could be because the glycolytic metabolism itself is...

It's toxic, at least to higher organisms, more complex organisms, when you have lactate accumulation. And lactate isn't necessarily an issue. It isn't the issue, again. It's kind of a response to metabolic changes. It's more of a signal. But in a way, yeah, the tumor would be protective of those surrounding tissues from that reversion to the...

to the ancient metabolism, to all the byproducts of that. Now, have you seen my interview I did recently with Georgie Dinkoff and Thomas Seyfried? Did you see that by chance? I did, I did. I don't think I watched the whole thing. Oh, it's really good. You've got to watch the whole thing. There's no advertising. Okay, okay. All right, all right.

You have to. Buy now. Okay, I'll do it. I'll go do it right after this, I promise. But, you know, I don't know what your thoughts were on the whole thing, but I thought it was interesting because Georgie was representing, if we're going to use this analogy I'm making, right, that cancer is a scapegoat, both on the treatment approach, but also in the body's system. It's a kind of stopgap measure to, it's a lesser of two evils, instead of allowing inflammation to...

attacks the body, you direct that energy somehow into forming a type of pseudo-organ or something, you know, until you can deal with it, until you can hopefully deal with it. Now, the two ways of dealing with it, Thomas Seyfried's approach kind of keeps, and maybe I'm, again, not doing this accurately, but just from what I've understood, Thomas Seyfried's approach is kind of like a more healing, a more healthier way of killing the tumor, like a scapegoat, right?

kind of like the protocols of standard cancer treatment are, which is to eliminate radiation, chemo, surgery, and so forth. This one does not use that so much as it used ketogenic therapy to starve the tumor of glucose and also to use some other drugs to inhibit glutamine temporarily to allow it to starve out.

So if you think of it in the sense of Christianity, you have law and grace. Law comes down and says, you know, we're going to crack down on this drug dealer. We're locking him up. We're going to isolate him. And, you know, if he's a murderer, we're going to execute him. But grace comes and finds a way to restore the demon possessed to his right mind. Right. And so I think about the approach that Georgie was scouting out as kind of like a Christian way of dealing with

cancer in a biological sense. Because just like with Christianity, Christianity says to redeem the scapegoat. Christianity does not say to continue to excise and exterminate the scapegoat to keep society functioning. Christianity says that that doesn't work anymore. So you have to redeem the scapegoat. You have to find out how to reintegrate the scapegoat back into the bioelectric hive mind in a healthy, functioning way.

And that's kind of what Georgie's approach is with the B vitamins is like not killing the cancer cells, but restoring them to right mind so they can sync back up with the collective.

Yeah, and I think the only time you'd really need to come in and lay down the law would be if the tumor was doing something that was possibly immediately threatening to your life. If you have a tumor in your throat and it's closing off your airways or it's closing off your esophagus or it's obstructing your bowels or it's blocking out blood flow in your brain, I think those are maybe the times when you can really look at

focusing on removing the tumor itself, you know, sort of like in a justice sense, if you had a serial killer out and about, sometimes you just want to, you know, take care of that or any sort of violent criminal. You want to take care of that. You know, if he's doing something that obviously is probably not going to be redeemable and potentially even more threatening down the road, maybe you don't show him grace. But if, you know, if you catch it early in that process,

I don't like the word catch it, but you know how they do with tumors. You say, well, we get screens so you can catch cancer early. The whole mindset behind cancer is ironically cancer is. But, but I think Georgie's point of, of,

restoring the metabolic function so you can get away from that hyperglycolysis and allow your cells to breathe because that's what's going on is your cells there's oxygen there where your cells can't breathe and your mitochondria those are the lungs of your cells so the what allow your cells to take in oxygen uh with the glucose with the b vitamins the magnesium all the other the copper all the good stuff the infrared light and uh and and breathe um

So again, if there's something that is physiologically a danger, yeah, I think that doing sort of that meeting in halfway with a keto diet to starve the cell or other methods similar to that of focusing on starving the tumor, getting rid of the tumor physically, yeah.

But I think more often than not, you want to be more graceful. You do both. That's what I didn't want to. I didn't want to. When I was doing the interview, a lot of people were not a lot, but a few people said, why didn't you talk about the elephant in the room about how, you know, George is pro sugar and Thomas Seyfried is going to say, you know, reduce sugar for the tumor die. But I wanted to build a coalition that's broader than that. You know, those people who want to fight about everything are internet amateurs.

but you have to build broad coalitions you have to connect people together build a relationship with them this is what leaders do so you have to do the bigger picture then you can work out the particulars you know behind the closed doors or whatever and in that sense though i wonder could you do both you know could you do high dose be i'm just thinking theoretically for people who maybe this can be looked into down the road right it's like could you do because i think about how

Most Americans who are going to have this disease are already so metabolically broken. They're already burning fatty lipids all the time because of the standard American diet and the excess PUFA and the endotoxins from processed grains and everything, poor sleep, all the usual suspects that we talk about. So they're not necessarily going to function well running hard, straight,

lots of sugar while they have cancer, it may be best for them to do a kind of ketosis if they have a serious issue, serious, you know, and they're seriously sick. They might respond to that shrinking the tumor and arresting its growth and then zapping the B vitamins to kind of hopefully maybe restore them. I don't know. I don't know if they, I don't know if those two approaches would actually be contradictory. The both of them didn't seem to indicate as such in the conversation, but of course it was just a brief talk. So

Yeah, there's definitely a lot of overlap between there. And I guess firstly, it comes to the psyche of the person and what they're willing to accept as true. But you could certainly do both. Again, if you were maybe in dire straits and you wanted to, whatever the cost may be, to get rid of

the tumor. Cause like you said, if you tell that to somebody, let's say somebody's, you know, 50, 55 year old American boomer, I think that's telling to crank up the orange juice in the milk while they have cancer and they're not going to lower their fat enough. I mean, are they going to be in a bigger problem? Yeah. And then you throw in, okay, they're probably being exposed to all sorts of EMF and blue light and mold and all the other garbage in the food. Uh,

Doing all that, it might take too much time. And if they, again, like if they do have something, a tumor that's growing in somewhere that will cause a physiological issue will stop blood flow or digestion or breathing, um,

That might not be enough, but I think you can absolutely do both. If you went with somebody, somebody said, I got to get rid of a tumor now, and you wanted to go with the keto protocol, you'd still probably give them B vitamins and magnesium and tell them to get out in the sun more. And they, well, George's was B1, B3, B7, and aspirin. Do any of those things indicate that they would disrupt the therapeutic effects of ketosis?

from your understanding of what's going on with those? Uh, I don't think so. They may, um, they're going to block fat burning, which is kind of, what would that do to the person? Uh, I, I'm not, I don't know too much about the specifics of that. Um,

I mean, you'd think that I know I'm coloring outside the lines right now. Yeah. It's a great question. Uh, I don't want to have, I, I, I'm not trying to interrupt, but I just, I don't want to have, and that's why we talk. I don't want to have tribalism get in the way of saving lives, you know?

In the sense of, it seems like everybody in this young online sphere picks tribes about, you know, it's got to be this way or that way. It's got to be a high sugar way or a high fat, low carb way. And I think there may be multiple approaches. Like people, like we said, who are already metabolically wrecked and they've got a very lethal form of this cancer. They may not do well telling them to load up on sugar, right?

When that, you know, without really monitoring the protein and the fat and everything else, that might cause worse problems for the tumor to grow because cancer cells love the sugar. And all cells love sugar because sugar is the primary, is the preferred fuel. We can agree on that principle but still use temporary intervention.

like a ketogenic approach to at least give some halt and stoppage to an out of control growth while you load up on B vitamins and aspirin and everything, whatever else. And again, we're just talking theoretically here, but this type of stuff needs to be worked out, right? We go, you know what I'm saying? Is that like in the end, it may be that young people,

And I could see an era where we say, okay, we're going to use interventions of ketosis or lower carb for people who are already of certain age and of certain health defect. But then for younger people, we're going to promote the bioenergetic approach because they haven't been metabolically wrecked to that degree yet. So their body is metabolically flexible enough to do well and thrive foundationally as the creator intended, primarily off of glucose consumption, right?

And then, you know, so it's like a stopgap measure. Maybe for, like you said, the boomers and up or Gen X or whatever, you kind of give them the best form of ketosis with the other interventions that are bioenergetic to get them out of their disease state like a cancer. And then for, you know, the youth, the 55 and under crowd, we want to promote a bioenergetic for people who are still able to adapt before they get to such a disease state that they can't handle.

you know, a higher carbohydrate lifestyle. What do you think of that? Yeah, it's again, any sort of online tribe is going to be based almost entirely on ideals and idealism rather than actual real life. And a lot of those people who do stick to those tribes, they have a very limited experience with people. And so that they think that they're,

Whatever their protocol that maybe worked for them, maybe worked for one other couple other people, whatever is going to work for everybody. But that's just not the case, unfortunately, and especially when it's a life or death measure and when things aren't ideal. And that's sort of the theme of life is life is never going to be ideal anymore.

And so you need to use your brain that God gave you and weigh the options and make whatever decision not only you think is best, but what feels best. Like if you try to get somebody on the keto and they just they felt worse, that might not be the thing for them versus like the flip side. If you try to have someone slam carbs or

in that situation with the B vitamins and magnesium and aspirin, if they feel just, if they just don't feel great from that, then it's probably probably not going to work for them. So it's, it's almost entirely individual because you think about every single person has an insane complexity and incomprehensible complexity of their background, of their environment, of their mindset, of their genetics, of everything that's going into them.

And so there's never going to be a exact protocol, which people don't like because everything, science, modern scientism is all about reducing the number of variables and having an exact protocol that you can measure and neurotically chart out. But life isn't like that, unfortunately. I should say, fortunately, life isn't like that. Well, if your body is burning fat because of the standard American diet, it's been induced to be more efficient at the survival backup fuel systems.

Right? Yeah, yeah. I think a lot of Americans... So therefore, a therapy that leads into that may actually be the more effective approach than trying to reverse course and go back to the idyllic childhood version of yourself that's long gone from stress, right? You see what I mean? It's pretty simple to me, and maybe I'm misunderstanding that. I'd love for someone to correct me if I'm making this a little bit... If I'm getting this wrong. Well, when the ship's on fire or something and you want to change course...

You want to put out the fire. You want to deal with whatever is immediately a threat. That's what Ray Peet famously said to many people when they're overweight. He'd say, just stop eating, which is ketosis. If you do that long enough, how many days does that take before you're into ketosis? The whole modern world that we know of,

The world that we enjoy was built by ketosis. Jesus Christ entered into the wilderness for 40 days, fasted for 40 days before he launched his ministry. It's on the foundation of whatever he discovered there. And he was tempted by carbohydrates because the Satan, the accuser, accused him of being hungry for bread. Remember? I don't remember that part. In the story, Satan means the accuser.

So the accuser comes to him and says, if you are hungry, you can turn these rocks into bread. You've got all the power in the world. Eat this bread. Turn these rocks into bread. He says, don't tempt me. Don't tell me to misuse my power for magic tricks. Did he turn the rocks into cheese? Yeah, he said you could do that. He said...

Technically, you could have done that and been okay. But no. But the point is that, I mean, I know that sounds weird, right? But it's true that Jesus Christ launched his revolution on a ketosis state of mind for 40 days and 40 nights. He fasted in the desert. You know, Jesus did it.

Anybody can do it, I think. Well, look how it changed the world. I'm not saying that, therefore, that's the ideal state we should promote. I'm saying that to make a point, because I know a lot of bioenergetic people listen to this show, that we need to stop trying to think of things ideologically and think of things as they actually are. It's a fact that Jesus Christ changed history.

It's a fact that that's recorded by multiple people that he did that. Now, you can say it's a myth or whatever, but if it's only a myth, it certainly has a mythic truth to what it's saying by the spiritual benefits of fasting for such a long period of time. But I don't take it to be a myth. I take it to be true. So if he did that, he would have been in a state of severe starvation. So in other words...

You can look at that high-stress state providing some kind of epiphany ready to go to launch the most important mission in human history that changed everything. In a similar sense, when he's on the cross, he's on the most severe stress state in the world, and that changes the world for good. So again, I'm trying to show you that that which is bad in the short term or in the acute isolated sense can also be that which redeems and changes everything. Yeah.

interesting to think about. Yeah, well, those are learning experiences a lot of times and they can definitely shift your psyche. How Jesus broke his fast, did he get some milk and honey and bread and everything? He just poured the honey on there and just ate up after those 40 days. I don't know. But I think it's a testament to the adaptability and survivability of living organisms, of

of living beings of God's creation um and like you said there there are some things to to kind of come out of uh out of the out of the quote bad and in regards to cancer you know it could be a wake-up call for for somebody or could be a learning experience for somebody to sort of see um

Maybe see where they went wrong or see maybe where their their shortcomings were, their sins were. And I don't want to use the word sin as in like, oh, you didn't eat organic grass fed beef. So that's a sin and you're bad, like in a punishing sort of way. But more of like a disconnection from God. You know, I think a lot of healthy things.

And you should do things that are healthy because of them themselves. You should get out in the sun because it's healthy. You should, or cause it feels good. You should eat good food because it feels good. Uh, so on and so forth. Um, rather than doing something as a means to an end, um,

again, sort of tying back into the healthy people that do something because it's healthy. Oh, I starve myself because it's healthy. Or I do this because it's healthy as opposed to doing it because it helps you get closer with God. You know, eating, you can't tell me that eating a

A slice of sourdough, toasted sourdough bread with some nice butter on there isn't like a religious experience where you're really hungry and you're really craving that. In a sense, that's sort of communing with God. You're having just that moment of where everything's kind of coming together in that sense. I don't know where I was going with this monologue. Because that fear makes that Pharisee spirit of

religious rules creep into anything, even something cool like a bioenergetic field of knowledge and thought, right? It becomes a tribe. It becomes a religion. It becomes don't eat that piece of bread that's endotoxin or that's whatever, you know? So it's this fear of like I have to live forever in this stressful way, so therefore I'm going to stress out about every thing

Every moment of potential stress inducing activity including eating sourdough bread every day, you know like that. That's ridiculous, right? Yeah Going back to what you were saying

It's ironic because they do that and they say, well, I don't want to eat the bread because that's going to raise endotoxin. And then that's going to raise serotonin or that's going to raise cortisol. When just that thought, having that thought and imagining that scenario in your head and trying to avoid it out of fear is arguably just much, much worse than just having the bread.

you know, ideally you wouldn't really deal with any endotoxin, but let's say you were, your gut wasn't a hundred percent perfect. Oh, well you'd be, you'd be better off just eating the bread, enjoying it and then going about your life. Then you would sort of try to micromanage and analyze all these things and avoid these things because it does this and it does that. And does that. It's crazy. If the bioenergetic approach,

to solving everybody's metabolic obesity and everything, if it requires exact minutiae monitoring of every macro and every intake and every half a teaspoon of whatever you put in your body every day, it will never succeed in saving the world from the massive metabolic approach of the metabolic disease

dysfunction that millions and potentially billions of people are in because of the American Standard Diet being pushed on everybody through subsidy and everything. So it's going to have to be something more creative and intelligent that comes along and figures this out. Luckily, we've got Matthew Spearman on the case to do that. He's over there. I'll do what I can. You're transmuting seeds into...

full-grown trees in a day aren't you goodness uh i well that's the plan at least maybe not a day maybe maybe a couple weeks but uh i'm definitely working on some seed experiments yeah tell us about what we can look forward to seeing from you and and your website and everything else um well i do have some experiments going on uh

sort of in a mad scientist way with if you listen to our last uh our talk with Dr you I kind of went into the the phenomenon of these quote uh people some people call them infoseuticals but it's just a concept that um these our world is electromagnetically uh based and this

This is true for hormones, nutrients, any sort of chemical compound is more electromagnetic and that can be sensed, it can be recorded, and then that can be projected, that recording can be projected or imprinted, excuse me, into either living organisms or water or both. So I'm doing something with

Seeds because seeds you can't seeds don't aren't bound by the placebo effect. They're just kind of easy things to experiment with. I was kind of thinking of taking some tadpoles from a local creek, but that seems kind of unethical. Maybe that's like a second step after the seeds just to kind of display the effects of these things.

That'd be cool. Tell me how that goes and you can share it on our show when you get some interesting results from these seeds. Yeah. I, I, I hope to get some, I mean, I failed a couple of times and there wasn't necessarily that I did not, the experiment didn't turn out how I wanted it to. It was just, I was dumb and forgot a couple of basic things like seeds need sunlight. Who would have thought at least, you know, a little bit. And yeah,

And yeah, so I'll, I'll keep you updated on there. Maybe, maybe I'll make some posts on, uh, on Twitter or X, I should say about that. Cause I think if people realize that it, it kind of shifts consciousness in the sense that, okay, not only is this a potential therapeutic, um, intervention and something that we can incorporate into our lives, but it gets you thinking about all the things that maybe you're not aware of that maybe are affecting your life negatively, you know, sort of these, uh,

these directed energy weapons, uh, if you will, um, that, that we're not necessarily aware of. And, you know, this could be in any sort of form of media. Um, these could be potentially implemented or these can be potentially weaponized. Um, so something to be aware of. You're saying that media itself is a directed weapon. Oh yeah. But I'm just saying that these things you could take, uh,

Media and then let's say somehow with it through sound or whether through some sort of electromagnetic device, it could even be light based to where you could project stress hormones on the people where you could project stress.

on the people. You know, if you had a cyanide one or an anthrax one, maybe I'm going to get a knock on the door from the FBI and CIA for even just mentioning that. Or maybe I gave them a good idea. So guys at the CIA, FBI, if you do use that idea, at least credit me for the infucutical anthrax. I think that, you know, would be kind of, you know, kind of frightening for sure. But I don't think the average person would have to worry about that. That would just mainly be

something that, who knows, maybe that's going to be the future of warfare. You talk about putting sound frequencies in people's ears that are bad for them. Yeah, it's sound, it's electromagnetic fields, it's light, and it's not just these things. Obviously, there's consuming any sort of media that provokes any response in you.

a mental response, you see, you see something that makes you angry or sad or scared. That's going to be, you know, just as bad. Um, so not saying these things would be even necessary. It's easier just to, to scare people or demoralize people, you know, that has just as much, if not more of an effect. I'm just saying this could be potentially used, uh, in specific circumstances. Well, that sounds like an interesting subject. I, uh, I want people to, uh,

Think about what you said, that we're light beings. You know, like we communicate, our body communicates by light, you know. I think that's very interesting, you know. And it ties in directly to a show we did recently on the Shroud of Turin. Did you see that one? I did not, no. We had a nuclear... I'll add that to the list. It's on the playlist. It's after the, you know, the other one. I know you only watch your shows because you like to hear your voice back at yourself. Yeah, I just, I put it on a loop. Yeah, but...

In that show, the nuclear scientist and physicist and a nuclear engineer both examined the Shroud of Turin, and artifacts indicate nuclear exposure, nuclear charring on the micro scale, on the really tiny surface of it. So there was some type of great light event, electromagnetic and light event that took place on that cloth surface.

which would indicate very high metabolism at that moment, a very high energy level. Maybe, well, because metabolism, a result of metabolism is infrared light heat. If you took a thermal camera and looked at yourself, you'd be glowing.

And so that is literally your aura is that infrared light. You can't really see it, but you can kind of sense it when you're with somebody. And that's probably why saints and everything, they have that glow around them. What would make it nuclear char the burial cloth of a dead body? I don't know, but probably a lot of energy.

If that's the case, that would take a tremendous amount of energy. And if you're somebody like Jesus, you got energy coming out everywhere. If you're that close to God, because I kind of think of it as if there's infinite energy around us,

It's less about you generating it and more about you just being conductive of it, you know, sticking your fingers in the outlet. Maybe not that much, but that sort of idea. And so for someone like him, he was about as plugged in as anybody's ever been. And maybe that was just sort of like he went out with a bang sort of thing and burned the cloth. He had so much energy. Yeah.

Very interesting. Well, I appreciate your time, and thank you for coming on, and we'll do it again sometime, and it'll be great. So I appreciate you doing that.

Yeah, David, it's a pleasure. I know I got the playlist. I'm making the playlist right now. Are there any other ones I should add? Oh, every show we do. Okay, so I'm just going to be playing it. I'm going to be doing subliminals with your show. Oh, that's what we need. Yeah, we need that. We need somebody to put some music and frequencies to some of these shows we do. Maybe you'll be able to help us with that.

You could, I could, you know, you could put some things in there that to kind of either make calm people down or make people more receptive. Cause you talk about a lot of things that a lot of people go, Whoa, that's crazy. I don't believe that. But if you just calm them down a little bit, not that you're going to put tranquilizers in there or anything, but, but if you just make them open up their mind to the point where they're not in that stress state of trying to protect themselves, you know,

they would be able to possibly accept these ideas and get their brain thinking. Cause that's all you really can do is get people to think you can't necessarily change their mind or as you don't really want to. So that could be a cool idea. All right. Take care. Good to see you. Okay, David. It was a pleasure. Yeah.

Bye.