I Choose...To Be Formless with Jenny McCarthy Wahlberg
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Do you remember what you said the first night I came over here? Ow goes lower? From Blumhouse TV, iHeart Podcasts, and Ember 20 comes an all-new fictional comedy podcast series. Join the flighty Damien Hirst as he unravels the mystery of his vanished boyfriend. I've been spending all my time looking for answers about what happened to Santi. And what's the way to find a missing person? Sleep with everyone he knew, obviously. Listen to The Hookup on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

You're listening to I Choose Me with Jenny Garth. Hi, everyone. Welcome to I Choose Me. This podcast is all about the choices we make and where they lead us. My guest today has had a longstanding career since the 90s. She's my OG girl. You know her as a judge on the massive hit, The Masked Singer.

which airs right now, Wednesdays on Fox. It's such a fun show to watch. She's also an author, an actress, a TV producer, and she's the founder of the clean beauty brand, Formless Beauty. She's hilarious, beautiful, and I absolutely can't wait to chat with her. Please welcome Jenny McCarthy-Wahlberg to the podcast. Hi! You are such a feast for my eyeballs right now.

Ditto, ditto. It's so good to see you. I haven't seen you. When's the last time we saw each other, Jenny McCarthy? God, was it on a talk show? I feel like possibly I could have, or my podcast, or somewhere like we crossed paths. I'm not even sure. But do you recall that we did act together? How could we forget that? Okay, good. I was like, I wonder if she remembers I played a lesbian plumber on her show. Oh.

You were a plumber? I knew the lesbian part, but I didn't know the plumber part. Yes. I didn't recall plumbing. Okay. I just remember you were a lonely lesbian who had the hots for Val Tyler. That's right. God, it could be based on a true story. How did that happen? So funny. When they called me to do that role, I was like, hell yeah. And then I got the worst flashback.

It was like norovirus of my life or something terrible. So I couldn't do it. They had a replacement come in. And then literally the day before you guys were about to shoot, they called me and like, do you feel any better? Because we don't like the person that replaced you. So you have to come in and take your rollover. And I'm like, all right. And it was so great. You guys were so welcoming. I did so many sitcoms back then. I was like, I was that guest that used to be constantly on the love boat or fantasy Island back in the day. I just went from sitcom to sitcom to sitcom and,

And you guys were so lovely to me. Because you're a genius. You were just kind. You're just a good soul. And I felt lucky. I was so happy to have you on the show to begin with. I just felt so, just, I'm so comfortable with you. I think, I don't know why. Is it because, do you remember we used to get each other's mail? Yeah.

Yes, I do. And by the way, you guys, Jenny, people is like, who do people confuse you with? I'm like, always it's Jenny Garth. Like I've signed so many autographs with your name because I'm like, I don't want to disappoint the people. So I'm always very nice. And they're like, oh my God, I love you on 90210. I'm like, thank you. And I'll just sign. They're probably going home going, the signature doesn't match, but I don't want to be a disappointment. And I'm like, I'm very nice to them. So I figured you wouldn't mind, but it happens a lot, which is a compliment.

I know. I think it happened so much that we actually, I don't, I don't know how this could have happened, but I feel like we got each other's mail at one point. We did. We did. We did. We definitely got each other's mail. How does that, how did the post office know?

I don't know. That's a really good question. I can understand some like fan mail or something like that, but it was very bizarre. Well, there's nobody I would rather be confused with than you. I'm very comfortable with it. Ditto. I agree. Thank you. Oh, my gosh. We have so much to talk about The Masked Singer.

your journey to love, your beauty brand, Formless Beauty. I want to get into all of it. But before we want to get into that stuff, you are such a multi-hyphenate. You're a host, you're an author, you're an entrepreneur. When you were growing up in the best place ever, I will add the Midwest, specifically Illinois. We are fellow Illinoisans. I want to know, what did you want to be when you were little?

So when I was very little, I grew up wanting and pretending to be this famous Hollywood starlet.

So I changed my name when I was probably around seven years old with my in my inside of my family. I said, you have to call me Rhonda from now on because watching Laverne and Shirley back in the day when Laverne and Shirley moved to Hollywood, they had a neighbor named Rhonda and she had big blonde hair and big boobs. And I was like, that's what I want to be. Go figure. I'm like seven years old.

And so I walked around as Rhonda. I would have, you know, the only script I knew growing up was from church because we went twice a week. So I would perform mass because that was the script I knew. I'd make people sit down and listen to me do homilies and

Then I used to do talk shows in my basement. I tried to imitate Oprah. So there was always a connection of me wanting to get into the business. I just didn't know how because, as you know, when you grow up in Illinois, we didn't have much money. So it was kind of like, yeah, that's like telling your mom and dad you want to be an astronaut. It's that far away. Right. And nobody in your family had any history in entertainment, right? Like me. Same. No one. No one. No one. No one.

So when I went to college, I went to be a special ed teacher and then I kind of switched over to be a nurse. But then I had to drop out because I went broke. I literally had no money to pay for myself. So that's when I was like, OK, I have nothing to lose. I'm 19. Why don't I go to L.A. and try to just see what happens?

And so when I went out there, I went on the heels of Playboy because I was $20,000 in debt from college. And I didn't know anybody. And I felt like it could be a little bit of a sorority or at least an organization to kind of be there for when I got there. Little did I know at that time.

It was, you know, it's hard to go from Playboy to comedy or even anything. Who knew? Yeah.

And, you know, and I kind of I kind of did know that, but I didn't have any other options. So when I start when I when I went and did it, then I said, what would be great for me to break out of this mold to show my personality? I'm like, you know, MTV would be a good opportunity to kind of show another side of myself. And that's when I saw this open casting call for Singled Out.

was an mtv game show at the time for all you young young ones out there and so they wouldn't even let me audition jen they said no we don't want to play mates i'm like what do you think i'm going to do i'm going to take my clothes off in the middle of a game show like now playboy seems so tame compared to what you know only fans and all these things going on it was like right rated pg practically so i crashed the audition i actually went to the cattle call which there was like 400 people waiting in line

And I didn't even have a headshot at that time. So I drew a picture of Lucy from Charlie Brown and then signed my name and did my audition. And I kept getting callbacks until the final, like, three. And wound up getting the job. And it was a great transition because then people go, wow, she's anything but kind of a pinup. So I got to show that other side. And then I had to pound my way into trying to getting some acting roles. And then I started writing books. And then I just...

I love the business so much, but I also get bored very easily. So I need to be stimulated constantly. We are so much alike. It's freaking me out. Like the whole story, minus the Playboy part, I didn't do that. But...

We're so much alike. Like you worked hard to get where you are. Yeah. Hustler. You know, it's like I think it is when you're determined and you know that there's really nothing else you want to do. There only leaves one road. But, you know, this business, as you know, is tough. It's tough. There is a lot of rejection. I remember all the articles going, oh, my God, you have 14 minutes left.

you know, it's like, you can believe it or you can believe in yourself. And I just said, I believe in myself and keep going. And now, you know, I've written 10 books, nine books or something like that. And, um,

I've done a little bit of everything and that's the way I kind of like it. I want to keep going. I even ask myself now, I'm like, I just started, just started to miss acting only recently. Like literally like I did it for so long. And then I got into hosting. Like Oprah assigned me to do a show with her for a little while. Then I went over and hosted the view. Yeah.

And then I did my own podcast at Sirius for seven years. And then I transitioned to The Masked Singer. And now I'm like, you know what? I kind of miss doing like some comedy. The problem is there's nothing going on. Like actors right now in Hollywood, it's very difficult to get work, especially the sitcoms are dead. There's no sitcoms anymore. Right? So sad. There's nothing. No, no. I...

You know what they say? I read this somewhere that persistence is the key to success. And you are a vision of persistence, your vision of talent, like just born into you. And you tapped into that, all of that and made your way to have this incredible career, a long lasting career. Albeit it's had its challenges. You've had to work really hard. You've had to reinvent yourself a million times.

But you've always stayed true to exactly who you are. And that's what I admire the most about you, I think. Thank you. I mean, that's what really keeps me, I think, alive and sane in this business. When, you know, you can easily fall into being the scandal girl and doing a bunch of late night mishaps. And I just stayed focused on that.

And staying true to myself, like you said, like really, really, you know, and it also really helps being a mom and then being a single mom.

Because you also have that motivation to pay the bills. Like, you know, when my son was younger and diagnosed with autism, and I literally got the autism diagnosis and we filed for divorce within the same week. That was a tough time in my life. Yeah, it was. Oh, I mean, I just remember crying so hard my butthole was hurting. Wow. Yeah.

the shower. You have really good like mind body relationship that, you know, you know, that your emotions caused that. I was like literally going, Oh my God, I'm just crying so hard. But it just, it also just motivates you, you know, because you're like, I have to pay for speech therapy. I want to invite you. There's a lot of jobs. I probably never would have said yes to if I didn't have to pay for the speech therapy and things like that. And so, but, um,

I'm grateful for that because it did motivate me to keep going. And then as things got a little easier, I got to choose things that I wanted to do. And as you know, it's just like with your podcast, I Choose Me. It's like to be able to choose what you want instead of what maybe people around you or by necessity. It's just it's a whole game changer, especially at this stage in our life. It's like I understand now when I was younger looking around.

People at our age now talking about this being the best time of their lives and it's just so much better. And truly, it really is. It really is the best. Yeah. We never believed them then. But now being in it, it is the best. And-

You can really have such an appreciation for all that you've been through. And like you said, you probably took jobs that you didn't want to do. And I can so relate to that because you had to pay the bills and you have people depending on you. Yeah. Just you. Exactly. And there's no one to lean on it. I didn't come from a rich family, you know? Right. So it's like...

And I was not about to, you know, sleep with any guy for money, maybe for a great pair of shoes, but never to lean on. I'm very dependent. I'm independent. You are independent. When I first went out to L.A. and people were like, you're going to have to sleep your way to the top. I was like, oh, really? Watch me not do that.

Watch me earn every dollar for myself. Watch me become an entrepreneur. Watch me write books. Watch me do everything I possibly can. You know, I'm coming out of a divorce. I didn't get any money. I had to pay it. You know what I mean? So it's like it's it was very challenging. But looking back, it made me who I am today. Stronger, much stronger. Yeah.

I didn't think I could love you more. I love you more. And this is just the beginning of this podcast. You're so sweet. I want to talk about Masked Singer because it started in 2019. And I got to be honest, when I heard the concept of the Masked Singer, people singing in ginormous, crazy costumes, I was like, hmm, is this going to work? What was it that told you that this was the right choice for you?

I'm so glad you asked that because I was doing my Sirius radio show at the time was really doing well at Sirius. I was there for almost seven years and I would get offers to do little stuff here and there. And I was always like, and then mass singer rolled around and my agent actually turned it down a couple of times. He's like, this is too weird.

So he came back to me. He's like, oh, I got to ask you because they keep bugging me. This is the show. And I looked at the Korean format. That's where it came from. And I saw something special in it, much like I saw Singled Out, which was it was different. It was different enough. And it checked a lot of boxes, which was you got the singing show. You're very entertained.

It's got a who is it component. It's got these clues that you have to kind of put together. And it wasn't going to be an evil judgmental show. We as judges got to give flowers. I am not a confrontational person. That's why I did not do well on the view fighting. I did not want to fight. Like I'm the middle child. I'm going to keep the peace.

So I love the fact that there was goodness in this show. I love the fact that you can watch it with your kids. And that's something I hadn't done in a while. Like I haven't done programming that, you know, is family orientated. So it checked all of those boxes. And I told my agent, I'm saying, yes, I do believe this show has potential because it's that weird and different. And listen, I am a little weird. Like it's on brand for me to be a little bit going to take those weird choices. Yeah.

And when it hit, I was so grateful because it is fun. And I love the parents that come up to me to this day and go, this is the only show where I get my kid leaves their phone or they get off the computer and they sit down on the couch with me and we watch it together. And and it's been great. It's been really, really great.

So lucky. I hope it goes on for like as long as American Idol. I'm so happy for you. I mean, it's already been on for 13 seasons. Hello. Yeah. Who knew it would be such a juggernaut? I'm hoping for 80. Oh my God. It just looks like a lot of fun to be on. I've passed a number of times.

Not singing, not my thing, but it, it's fun to watch. So, and you're so good on it. Oh my God. You know, they ask, I'm with a panel of singers. Cause Ken, even though he pretends not to sing, he can sing. So they make us open a show with a singing number sometimes. And literally I don't get nervous about things. I am a wreck because they have me sing a line and I can't sing. I sound like Peter Brady on my break. I'm like, it's time to change.

So the episode that we just did this season, which we're doing all of these awesome now themed episodes. So,

they had me come out and sing a line. And they called me when they were in post-production and they're like, Jenny, we have been laughing in the editing bay because you sound so bad that we have to have you rerecord your singing. And I was like, I told you I can't sing. And literally I get like nauseous. We did a Muppet episode where everyone had to sing a line. And when the camera posed to me, I literally am like this. Rainbows on the moon.

I'm just terrible. I'm like, I'm not a singer, but it also makes it fun, you know? Oh, God. What a ride, right? Totally. Hi, it's Jenny Garth. Now that I'm in my 50s, I'm all about skincare that delivers real results. And that's why I choose Perricone MD. Perricone MD's award-winning formulas combine the highest quality ingredients with decades of research and expensive clinical

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Do you remember what you said the first night I came over here? How? Go slower? From Blumhouse TV, iHeart Podcasts, and Ember 20 comes an all-new fictional comedy podcast series. Join the flighty Damien Hirst as he unravels the mystery of his vanished boyfriend. And Santi was gone. I've been spending all my time looking for answers about what happened to Santi. And what's the way to find a missing person? Sleep with everyone he knew, obviously. Hmm.

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You and your husband, Donnie, you guys have been married for almost 11 years. Is that it? Yeah. Similar. I'm just under you at nine, maybe 10. I can't remember. But like me, we've finally found what it appears is.

to be a lasting love. Oh, I know, right? It seems like you have had a fairy tale kind of romance with Donnie. 100%. Which is the cutest. Boy, we really are a lot similar, aren't we, Jen? We both are crazy. So with Donnie, it truly is. I feel so lucky because when you're in the dating pool, especially as a single mom, especially in Los Angeles, you have very limited choices. Yeah.

And you're famous, which is another. It's really, really hard. It's like almost if you're 40, you have to date 60 because the 40-year-olds date the 20-year-olds. You know, it's like that's how it felt like in Los Angeles. In LA, the 60-year-olds are still dating like the 20-year-olds. Yeah, that's what I mean. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, right. It's horrible. So if you're a 40-year-old woman, like...

No one wants you with another guy that's 40 doesn't want another 40-year-old. They want their 20-year-old. So it's like, it was really difficult. How do you find him? I wound up moving. I woke up one day after being in LA for, I lived in Chicago 20 years. I went to LA for 20 years. And then I woke up one day and I said,

I don't want to raise my son here. I want to move back, buy a house down the street from my best friend and raise our kids together. And that's what we did. And so when I was out here, I did, I would fly to New York and do, you know, talk shows. And then I did my own talk show for a second. And I, he, he came on there in New York as a guest.

So we actually met on Watch What Happens Live, Andy Cohen's show. He was the second guest in the second chair and I'd never met him before. And I thought he was married, so I didn't really flirt with him. I was just like, oh, you're a really nice guy. Like, I had no idea. Andy Cohen was like, you got to ask her out. You got to ask her out. And so then I wound up doing my show and like six months later, he came on as a guest. So I'm doing my homework and like, OK, who is he dating? He's not dating anybody. Still wasn't thinking anything.

Then he sat down and I started interviewing him and I was like, oh, he's very smart. Oh, he's very funny. Wow, he's really cute. And then I, the interview was supposed to be nine minutes. It was 90.

- Whoa, okay, that was like your first date. - Totally, totally. And literally there was so much sparks and chemistry that everyone in the audience was like, oh my God. And then backstage, I'm like, I haven't given my number to a guy ever. And I had my assistant run over there and be like, here's Jenny's number. 'Cause I'm like, I don't know how to do this.

So he wound up waiting for me in his dressing room to see, to say like goodbye. But I was so flushed, like a little high school girl. My face was red and I was like, I can't walk past him. I can't walk past him. I'm like too scared. I'm too nervous. And so I wound up waiting an hour and he was still in the room and I was still scared. So I ran past his room, got in the elevator and I'm like, I just hope he calls me. Two weeks go by and he doesn't call me.

He thought I just gave my phone number to everybody. That's why I didn't want to see him when I left when really I was like a 12 year old little girl, like all freaked out. So he saw a commercial of me asking a psychic on my talk show if I'm going to marry Donnie Wahlberg. And the psychic was like, yeah. And this is before we even went on a date. Okay. But it was right after that episode. So he wound up calling me. We went on our first date and then it was game over. He was just

I was so worried I was going to fall in the trap of men that were uncooked. I call them uncooked. Like I didn't want to bake because they come uncooked and you just stick them in the oven, teach them stuff, and then they're fully baked. And then you're like, and I just wanted one that was,

Because this is what happened. I don't know if it happened for you in the dating world. We tend, sometimes us ladies who are, I feel like women are more involved than men sometimes. Sorry. It's okay. And we tend to downshift. Like I'll do the spiritual growth. I have to end a relationship. I'll work on myself. I'll get to this next level. Then I'll meet a guy and I'll have to downshift my energy. It's almost like playing dumb in a room. It's like,

You'll sacrifice parts of yourself that you kind of built up yourself. You'll put them as the priority instead of yourself. You'll give them the first choices instead of you. So I wound up kind of kept downgrading each, downshifting like a car gear in each one of these relationships. And I was like, F that. I'm not doing that anymore. So I took a one-year break. I was like, I'm not going to date anybody. I'm not going to sleep with anybody. I'm not going to flirt with anybody. I'm just going to work on me and stick there.

And then that's when a year later I met Donnie. So he came into my life and we walked together side by side, holding hands, looking forward and not trying to clip. I call it clipping each other's wings.

Because a lot of times you get into relationships and you want the other person is a little jealous. Ego gets involved. They don't want you to be successful. They're afraid if you get more successful that you might leave them. So they'll clip your wings. They'll give you a little insult here and there to keep you, you know, grounded. Very familiar. Yes. Right. And then you recognize those patterns. And sadly, sometimes you believed it in the past, you know.

And I just wanted to make sure that I was with a wing fluffer, not a wing clipper. And Donnie was one of those guys that would just support me and be there with me and want to celebrate the successes, you know, and he still does it to this day. That's the best, again, similarities. That's how I feel with my third and hopefully final marriage. I'm glad that kind of support.

I'm so happy for you too. Well, you know what? It's been, it's been almost 10 years for you. You'll, you kind of know at this point if they're a wing clipper, wing flipper. So obviously he's doing something good. He's doing, how did you recognize that he was the one you don't mind me asking? Honestly, it was that kind of support that I had never experienced before. That acceptance of who I was and his need almost to let me shine. Like,

And I remember after my divorce, I was like, what are my non-negotiables? Wrote down the things that I had learned about myself that I wanted to do differently. And on the top of that list was I want somebody who is not afraid to let me shine as bright as I can. I love that. And then just be there to support me.

Yeah. And that's what it was for me. And he makes me laugh a lot. So there's that. I love a good laugh. Me too. Humor. I'm telling you guys, humor is even better than a six pack, guys. It's even better than a six pack. Oh, so much better. It's so much better because also guys that are interested in being funny are not that like...

self-obsessed that they have to have a six pack. Totally. They're more about like experiencing you and letting you do your thing and having a good time. It's just such a difference, such a difference. It is such a difference. And you know, one little tool that me and Donnie do to keep things on track, we do a lot of work on a relationship, is that we do this thing called questions sometimes. So it was like, if we're on a plane ride or we're like taking a long drive, we're like, let's play questions. And questions will be

Maybe something in our mind that we didn't like had time to really get into a topic. Right. Or what can we do to is there anything I can do to improve this relationship? Is there anything you're noticing? This is part of questions. Is there anything you're noticing that I can do or that I'm not doing that would help you in our relationship? Right.

That is such a beautiful thing to ask because there is always something. So for instance, one of the things that, um,

came up really recently, not actually not recently, but maybe a year ago, and we're playing questions that Donnie implemented so beautifully. I said, I would love even more curiosity, like, because sometimes when you're in a relationship for so long, you tend to not get as curious because you know all the answers to each other. You know, so it's you kind of get like, we always have that spark, we always have that fire. But

you tend to sometimes lose a little bit of the curiosity. So I said, I would love it if you got a little bit more curious, like a talk show host when, I don't know, a news event happened or something even like that. Like, hey, what do you think about that thing that, you know, so-and-so just said on TV? Or what are you thinking about the, you know, whatever. Whatever it is to spark like my intellect and to like,

bring some conversations or go deeper or things like that. Just go to a plane curiosity because we tend to forget to do that a little bit. Yeah. That has been really, really fun. I mean, I'm going to use that later today, honestly. Yeah.

I'm going to play questions with Dave. Yeah. Because I think that you're so right. We learn, you know, there's so much we can always be working harder to improve our relationship. And sometimes you just get complacent and comfortable. Yeah. And those things aren't important. So that is a great tip for me and all of our listeners. Yeah.

Let's play the question game. Okay. I like it. Yeah. I call it check-in as well. You know, let's do a check-in question, but we do call it questions because it's fun and we take turns.

Yeah. Yeah. No, it's so good. You, he just recently kind of completed his very long run on Blue Bloods, right? Yep. You have them all to yourself now. How's that working out for you? You know, it's been, he would go from Blue Bloods to his tour, from Blue Bloods to his tour. So we, thank God we have a solid foundation because I also shoot my show in LA. So there's a lot of flying back and forth. There's a lot of not seeing, especially when you're in COVID. Yeah.

It was hard. So this is the first time we've been together like 24 hours a day. And now I'm scared because I'm even more addicted to him. I thought I was addicted to my husband before. Now he just went out of town and I was like, we're both going, what are we going to do? Like,

Even if we're not speaking to each other, our energies together is just makes everything calm and wonderful. So now he's going to be filming again. He's doing a spinoff of Blue Bloods. Okay. You know, so I'm just I'm like, well, I'll be visiting you a bunch there. And what about the show that you guys are doing together? The true crime specials, Very Scary Lovers. He does a show called Very Scary People. We just did a Valentine special of Very Scary Lovers.

But we're talking about rolling that off into a series because there's a lot of, I don't want to say amazing. That's the wrong word. Insane couples who are very scary, do a lot of bad things. So diving into this, I love like psychology and thinking and figuring out, because especially with couples, right?

Usually there's one sane person to talk the insane person out of doing something dangerous. But when you have insane meeting insane, it's a whole other ball of wax. Yeah, that's a bad mix. Yeah. So we'll see if we spin that off. But it was really nice working with them. I was like, I bet. Maybe we could do even more together because it was really nice. Because it didn't feel like work then. Then we're like, we're going together. We're going to work together. I've always dreamed of working with my husband like that.

He's a restaurateur and I don't have any interest in serving people. So like food. So that's not worked out yet, but maybe someday, but I hope that happens for you because I can see how you light up. Yeah, I do too. I really, I enjoy him. I love him. I want this to work. When you're so...

I'm not going to say obsessed, but you're so happy in your relationship. You love this man and you love Evan, your son. Like, how do you find time to love yourself? That is, you know, that is an age old question, but everybody needs to figure out, figure out the balance. Yeah.

Totally. And, you know, I really believe balance comes with time. I think we have to screw it up a lot in order to put the oxygen mask on ourselves. And sadly, that comes with a lot of depletion and exhaustion. So what the best thing that came out of my life was a horrific relationship I was in in the past.

that I lost myself so completely that it's kind of like, there's a quote from Game of Thrones, which is hilarious, but I'm always like, yes, he says, chaos is a ladder. And it's true. So I had so much chaos going on in a certain relationship that this ladder was the only way out. And that ladder was each step of self-love and getting out of it

had the most, the biggest epiphany, the biggest shift in everything. And I was like, wow, if I didn't go through that chaotic relationship, I never would have learned about self-love and self-care. It made me realize how important it is that I come first now. That doesn't mean, of course, ignoring other people, but the freedom to have the balls to be like, nope, this is what I want to do was so hard for me. Really hard. Yeah.

It's really, really hard. You know, it's like I always was a people pleaser my whole life or like a caretaker and like just want to make sure everyone else is happy, making sure that everyone's upset. I mean, when I used to throw parties, my friends call me the most annoying person to party because I'd go, are you having fun? Are you having fun? Even a good time? Are you having fun? Are you having fun? Instead of going like, wait, am I having fun?

It wasn't until I turned like 48 that I was like, I don't give a shit if anyone's having fun at my party. I'm having a good time. That is a real like shift in life as well because I was also taking care of my son's health that let my health go. So now my health is a priority. And even when I met Donnie, I taught him, I said, listen, one thing you're going to learn and see with me is that my definition of hell now is doing something I don't want to do.

That's what I believe hell now on earth is. When you say yes to things that you don't want to do, it's your fault for not using your voice. So you might see me a lot say, no, I don't want to do that. Like there's things where he's like, will you be my date at so-and-so thing? And I'm like, I love you and no. Yeah.

I love you and nope, I don't want it. Right. Which before I'd be like, okay, okay. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. You said at 48 that happened for you. Like that became clear. And I, honest to God, not just to go with the same Z's thing, but that's when it happened for me too, my late 40s, when I started to really understand who I was and what I wanted and what I didn't want.

How can we do that earlier? Like say for the next generation, how can we help younger women, maybe their mothers, maybe they're losing themselves, like you said, in their children's health or taking care of somebody. How do we encourage that for younger women? Because I feel like if we had known this younger generation,

I don't know. Who knows what would have happened? I actually thought about that, you know, because I've written a lot of books. And one of the things that I've realized is when we're younger, we don't want to listen to our older parents or older generation. It's like, imagine a Gen Z trying to listen to a boomer. They're like, bye. And it's almost like, and I've learned, you can't learn to drive a car if you're always in the passenger seat. Right.

So you have to get in the car and drive it and get tickets and, you know, do maybe get a car accident review until you learn. And it's like, you know, the younger generation doesn't really want to listen. Now, mind you, there are some that will listen to the wise spiritual teachers. They might be into those books and they'll get it. I do feel like the younger generation is much more awake now.

Yes. So I do think they have an advantage there. I do feel like there's a spiritual shift in our consciousness where I can see that they're wise beyond their years. So that to me is more of a hopeful thing than them actually listening to us.

and waking up. I think it's more of a collective consciousness shift. Yeah, that's so true. And I see it happening with my daughters. Maybe you see it happening with Evan, but it is so true. I always think, wow, you are actually so far, so much more advanced emotionally, intelligently at your age than I was. Completely.

Completely. He's so emotionally intelligent that he teaches me sometimes. Yeah. It's so beautiful though. I mean, it's the best thing when they like shine that mirror on you, you know, and they, they teach you something. You're like, Hey, is this, is this how it's supposed to be? But I think it is. I think we've been through everything. We've had so many experiences, great and bad. And we've learned so much and,

but there's still always more to learn. Always. And our kids, if you allow your kids to be your teachers as well, you learn so much because you can see yourself also in everything that you're saying to your child. Like notice the words you're using, notice the rules you're putting on noticing. Are you projecting your own fears onto your child? Cause that's what, you know, that I've had to stop myself going like, wait a minute. Um,

I'm projecting the shit that happened to me onto him. I do that too. Right. And you have to be very awake as a parent to learn to not project, but we're doing it out of love and fear, you know? And also this is our first time doing it. Like I, I,

I'm always reminding my girls, like, you guys, I don't know what I'm doing. I've never done this before. Like, this moment, I've never done before. So please be a little more patient with me. Totally. And lower your expectations just a smidge. Exactly. And then you say to yourself, I try not to be like my parents because you want to parent differently. Then you find yourself falling into that same trap. But...

It's like... It happens. It happens. You have to forgive yourself, you know? Like, I just apologized to him this morning. I kind of, like... He wanted to go visit his girlfriend at, like, 10 o'clock in the morning this morning. And I was like, no, there's a snowstorm happening right now. You're not going there. And he's like, I'm 22. And I'm like, I don't care. You're under my roof. And then I was like, I'm so sorry. I shouldn't have... Like, if I was 22, I would have been like, you know what you can do? You can go yourself. I'm going...

And instead we both apologized to each other and hugged, but I'm like, I have to, you know, be careful. Literally last night, apologized to my youngest daughter who's 18 because I didn't think things through enough when I was talking to her. I didn't, you know, I didn't, I didn't look at it from all those angles. Correct. Exactly. I looked at it from like, yeah, this is my house. You'll follow my rules.

Ew, I hate that part of me. I don't want to be that person. It's big of us that we can say sorry. That's right to feel like our egos might get trapped sometimes. We're like, I don't care if I show, if I say sorry, then they're going to know I'm not the boss. No, no, no, no. It has to be, you get so much more respect. And I learned, they've learned to apologize. When you can apologize, they learn to come back sometimes that they've been snotty or snooty or whatever to apologize. At least for my son. I've noticed that. It's so, so true. Yeah.

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Join the flighty Damien Hirst as he unravels the mystery of his vanished boyfriend.

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I'm Mark Seale. And I'm Nathan King. This is Leave the Gun, Take the Cannoli. The five families did not want us to shoot that picture. Leave the Gun, Take the Cannoli is based on my co-host Mark's best-selling book of the same title. And on this show, we call upon his years of research to help unpack the story behind the Godfather's birth from start to finish. This is really the first interview I've done in bed.

We sift through innumerable accounts, many of them conflicting, and try to get to the truth of what really happened.

And they said, we're finished. This is over. It'll only stop going to work. You gotta get rid of those guys. It's a disaster. Leave the Gun, Take the Cannoli features new and archival interviews with Francis Ford Coppola, Robert Evans, James Caan, Talia Shire, and many others. Yes, that was a real horse's head. Listen and subscribe to Leave the Gun, Take the Cannoli on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Okay, I want to talk about Formless Beauty. Yes. That you created. Did you do this with your sister? Because I know she's a makeup artist. I didn't do it with my sister. My sister was so busy. She moved to New York and became like another world-renowned makeup artist. And so I was like, all right, well, I'm just going to dive in myself. And the reason why I did it, because there's so many beauty brands out there. Right. Celebrity beauty brands out there. I'm like, do we need another one? But the problem was I didn't have an intention of doing it.

I've gotten, as I went through perimenopause, I started getting so much shit wrong with me, excuse my French, but I would have autoimmune issues. I've got leaky gut, candida, celiac disease, Hashimoto's, MTHFRG mutation, just a lot of stuff and sensitivity.

to chemicals. I learned so much with healing my kind of own son going through things that I learned about toxins. So I said, okay, you know what? Time to put the oxygen mask on myself. I did a lot of healing with everyone around me. It's time to heal me.

So I said, I'm just going to look for a super clean brand. I was horrified and shocked that the last time the FDA truly regulated makeup was over 80 years ago. And makeup companies are allowed to use the word clean without any regulation. So what they're touting as clean is certainly not clean. That's like saying, oh, this is vegan. So that means clean. No, it just doesn't mean you didn't use animal.

Okay. That doesn't mean clean. So I was like, shit, I got to do this by myself. So I said, how am I going to do this? Because me, Jenny McCarthy doesn't know what's clean and what's not clean.

I don't know if you've ever heard of the Environmental Working Group. If you don't know who they are, you guys, it's ewg.org. They are the gold standard in what is toxic in your laundry, in your food, in your makeup, in your skincare. They have doctors and scientists that have done all of this science and research. So I sat with them. I took a meeting and I said, I want to create a beauty brand over your restrictions that you've done all the work.

Now, there's not that many people that can do this. That's why when you get their stamp of approval, there's no celebrity brands. Maybe one that got some stamps of approval. They gave me a list of over 900 pages of unacceptable, restricted ingredients.

to not use in a makeup company. Now that means it's a lot harder, it's gonna take me a lot longer, it's gonna be much more expensive. We can't use cheap cancer-causing chemicals, which would make the price margins a little lower, but I didn't want that. I wanna be able to

Know that I am offering a solution for people that care about their toxic load. So we've created this most, and I am so hands-in. It's made in the USA so I can be next to my chemist. My chemist hates me because I'm like, no matter, let's do it.

So we formulated skincare. We just look at them like a brag. It's beautiful. Your packaging is beautiful. Thank you. And like, by the way, let me brag and give you an example for our mascara. We are one of the very few without hormone disruptors.

Mascara is like the second biggest offender in makeup. There's foundation and then there's mascara because they use hormone disruptors and forever chemicals in there. So I was like, we're going to do it. Not only did that, we did it without parabens, without phthalates, without aluminum powder, without formaldehyde. And it's freaking amazing. So it's like things like that that I'm so proud of. We've got chemo patients that call and be like, thank you so much. People with allergies, people say, I couldn't even wear makeup anymore until I used your brand.

young teenagers who care about the toxicities, pregnant women. So if you have, if you're sensitive to the environment, if you care about toxicities, if you have allergies, if you have sensitivities, this brand literally was formulated for you. I'm finding my tribe of people. It's called Formless Beauty. Yes. Formless Beauty. I love that. It's formless. It's formless. You know, I got the name from, do you know who Eckhart Tolle is? Uh-huh.

Yes, yes. He always, I love him. He always referred to like our soul as formless. It doesn't have form. Of course, our human body does has form, but our soul doesn't. So when I was trying to create the company and coming up with the name, I wanted to put an intention behind it to remind people, okay, even though we're doing the beauty aspect, the external, I wanted to remind people that true beauty, real beauty comes from within and that is formless beauty.

So that stuck with me. And I just said, that is my intention that even though we're doing this, makeup is just the cherry on top people because real beauty does come from within. But I love makeup. I just don't want to die for it. So good. I mean, it's true. Some people probably don't understand this, but sometimes choosing yourself is just as simple as like putting on a little lip color or some cheek color, by the way.

I am obsessed with the little circle. I don't know. The cheek and lip blush. Yep. Dying for it. I'm so glad. Actually, I'm not dying for it.

You're not dying for it. I'm wearing it right now. I put on extra this morning just to impress you. I'm so glad. Thank you. And it's the, it's the ingredients are so clean. That's what's so good. I'm going to get all of my kids on this too, because as a mom, I really, really worry about what they're putting on their face, on their skin, which is rapidly absorbs into their bloodstreams. Yeah. Uh,

This is a big concern of mine. Daily. And you guys think about it. Most companies will import from China because that's how their margins are so cheap. Do you think anything's testing over in China? Hail to the no. No. No. So I want to ask you about the hurdles that you've overcome creating this because it sounds like that kind of quality control drives your price up. How were you able to do that?

Well, you know, by following the environmental working group and keeping it in the United States, it's almost impossible. Like I even thought there's no way I'm going to be able to make a beauty brand under those standards without charging people $150 for lip gloss. So we, we, and we were still a premium hire and brand for that reason. So I try to make it so we can still stay afloat.

And give people the highest quality makeup. I'm not rolling in the dough I get to make profits because I take the money and I roll it into more Products because I really wanted to build it as clean as possible But I feel like people are willing to pay a little bit more knowing that they're not contributing to their toxic load because let me tell you guys we are all having like imagine like a barrel and

Our body can handle toxins to a certain point, but when that gets overflow, that is your immune system dysregulating. That's when you start to see MS, allergies, leaky gut, Parkinson's, all of those horrible things. And what especially those parabens and those salis and hormone disruptors are the cancer routes. So again,

No one is regulating. That's why the environmental working group, I'm so proud to kind of be working with them because they've done the work. It's what the FDA should have been doing all along. And I wish it was more regulated. Like, I hope that I can be a trailblazer and showing people that you can be done. It can be done and it should be done.

So let's hope that we get there. Yeah. And the truth is makeup lasts a while. Okay. Let me ask you this. When you're creating a clean product, does it have a lot less of a shelf life? It does. So for instance, which I,

But your mascara, like our mascara is a year. You're going to go through this probably in like three or four months. The lip gloss is two years. Okay. It's not. That's amazing. It's great. And like our eyeshadow is talc free, which means no asbestos. We still have a shorter shelf life compared to, you know, brands that don't care where they're heavy, harsh preservative that will last 10 years. No, our shorter shelf life.

But it's still not too sure because you're still getting value because you're going to use this stuff all the time. You're going to love it so much. I'm telling you people. And also it really irritates me when they'll create like kids makeup, a little palette for little girls or boys or whatever. And it's full of crap. Oh, you can just Google the reactions that kids get. It's like,

Horrible. And again, no one is looking out into skincare and makeup. You are on your own. It's the wild, wild, I want to say West, but it's around the world because they're, God knows where they're getting the ingredients and no one's looking at them. No one. No one. You know what? Jenny McCarthy is. And that's all I need to know. Formless beauty, you guys. Oh, what are your three must have items that make you feel put together? Like when you're not in full glam for work, just in your real life.

Does this mean, is it makeup or other things? I think let's start with makeup. Makeup, a lip gloss, a lip gloss and a mascara I can get by. My cheek and lip blush gives me a little bonus because I can do this. Like if I'm with my friends, I can go...

Just even that. So mascara and a little cheek lip blush, done. I don't even need a lot of foundation at this point because I don't want a bunch of lines on my face. It's like, just give me a little mascara to make me look like my eyes are open. Right. You know, that's it. And then a good deodorant. You need to make one. I am. It's coming out. It's coming out. I'm so here for it.

We're the same age. We've been in the same industry. It's been all about how we look. What does beauty mean to you? Like, what does it mean to you to be beautiful? I mean, there's no doubt having to be in this business. You do have to care somewhat about the external, so you can't ignore that. But in this age, I have learned that the most beautiful women...

can appear actually ugly if they are not beautiful on the inside. And we've seen it. There's an energy that exudes you that surpasses, I think, wrinkles, weight, anything. I've seen the most beautiful radiating women who are not models, who are normal everyday people that I am in awe of their beauty.

So to me, the formless beauty radiates so much stronger on the inside than it does on the outside. But again, making yourself feel pretty on the outside does help you feel a little better on the inside. Sure. Absolutely. We got to take care of ourselves. I think, like we talked about before, you lose track of taking care of yourself. That's true.

Just getting a little gussied up once in a while. It does. It makes you just feel a little bit better. And you're right. When I have a lip gloss on, when I have a little cheek tint on, I feel like, I don't know what it is, but I feel like I'm more...

awake, alive, presentable. It's true. Cause sometimes it, you want it to reflect how good you're feeling on the inside. Sometimes too. You're like, you'll sometimes I'll pass in the mirror and I've been wearing sweats from college still in my hair, like, but I'm like, wait a minute. I'm so happy in the inside. Let me just make the external reflect a little bit of how good I feel on the outside. That is such good, good messaging. Okay. I have one last question for you. Yeah. Yeah. Jenny McCarthy Wahlberg, before I let you go,

What was your last I choose me moment? My last I choose me, I seem to do them all the time, but I can tell you a big one. The latest big one I did was I checked into an Airbnb and I did a three week cleanse where I didn't want to talk to anybody. I didn't want anything.

social media and it was a hardcore cleanse. It was like seven days of like no food. You just do water. Then you do the next day of like green shakes and then you have a colonic machine that you do all your own colonics. Oh yeah, it was hard. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. You do your own colonics?

Sounded like a crazy person. But yes, because I've got so many gut issues, but they have these home kits that are amazing. But in the stuff that gets out of you, like a parasite cleanse, like deep, deep cleanse. So to me,

That is the biggest I choose me because I feel like it's going to elongate my life and get rid of a lot of the bad stuff. But you've got to be alone. Like you've got, you can't be, because when you're detoxing, you're also detoxing emotions. You know, we store a lot of emotions even in our fat cells and ourselves. So when you're detoxing, all of that's coming out. When you don't have food, that's why a lot of religious sex, you know, they detoxify

They do fasting in order to get clarity. So there's a lot of things that happen during that time. So to me, it's like the best thing that you can do is like a once-in-a-year cleanse. Oh, this is such a good moment for you. Wait, if people out there are as crazy as you, and I'm one of them, where do we get this cleanse? Do you mind sharing? No, I mean...

let me try to think cell core has a great cleanse cell core is the name of the company they've got a great parasite cleanse there's one that you can tie up with the full moons because that's when your worms come out to play and that's when you kill them but they to me right now cell core has the best cleanses and then i've incorporated some of my old cleanses from the past with this because there isn't necessarily a water cleanse that goes along with cell core but um

I just think it's the best on the market right now. Cellcore. Well, you are clear-minded and vibrant and glowing. So sign me up. Back at you, sister. I love talking to you. I could talk to you forever. Me too. We're sisters from other misters. So...

For sure. I'm always here to take your mail or to sign an autograph for you. That's right. Me too. You're so awesome. I love you. Thank you so much for coming on. Thank you. And thanks to all your listeners for listening to me blab. I appreciate you guys. They love it. They love it. All right. Well, let's talk to you and keep in touch. Will you? Okay. All right. Bye.

Hi, it's Jenny Garth. Now that I'm in my 50s, I am all about skincare that delivers real results. And that's why I choose Perricone MD. Perricone MD's award-winning formulas combine the highest quality ingredients with decades of research and expensive clarifications.

clinical testing to back up their promises. Using these products exclusively, I've really noticed a dramatic difference in my skin. It's smoother, I feel glowy, and it reduces my fine lines. I feel like my face just looks softer and everybody wants to know what I've been using. Well, it's Perricone MD.

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Listen to The Hookup on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. I'm Mary Kay McBrayer, host of the podcast The Greatest True Crime Stories Ever Told. This season explores women from the 19th century to now. Women who were murderers and scammers, and women who were killed in the war.

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Listen to the greatest true crime stories ever told on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.