Can we expect a huge rebuild from Manchester City this January?
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Chris, Manchester City's misery goes on and Pep Guardiola has come over a bit. Jose Mourinho holding fingers up to the Anfield crowd after defeat at Anfield on Sunday. Six fingers for six league titles was his message to the Kop as what seemed like the whole of Anfield suggested he might be getting sacked in the morning. A bit Norfolk that, the six-fingered salute, wasn't it? LAUGHTER

But I didn't mind that, Ian. I didn't mind that at all. A show of defiance, a bit of pride, a bit of passion. I'd sort of get where Pep's coming from. I mean, Manchester City, the run they're on is just incredible. They look miles off against Liverpool, but he's a proud man. I don't know what's the alternative there.

walking off, dejected, head down into the tunnel. People would then question his body language. Is he up for the fight? So, yeah, I think it's a difficult one. How is he supposed to act? I get it. Certainly his own club supporters would love it. That's for sure. I just think sometimes...

You rise above it. When Mourinho did it, it was when he was getting the stick at Manchester United and he did it at a press, he actually did it at a press conference. And his point was, you know, I've won more titles than the rest of them put together, which at that point he had because Klopp hadn't won one and Pep hadn't been there that long, etc.

But it looked, when Mourinho did it, like the kind of the last wave of a dying man, really. Whereas nobody presumes for one minute, no one who knows anything about football presumes that Pep Guardiola is in any kind of trouble in terms of his position at Manchester City or indeed in terms of his reputation, his legacy, his standing in the game. He just doesn't need to do it. His team are just on a bad run.

everybody knows he's the most successful manager we've seen for a long time. We know, we all appreciate his genius. Everyone standing on the cop, whether they like it or not, appreciates his genius. I just don't think he needs to do it. Just rise above it. That's all I would say. And what did surprise me, sorry to interrupt you, what did surprise me was his subsequent comments saying he was surprised by

that the Liverpool crowd would sing that to him, you're getting sacked in the morning. Why? Why would he surprise football crowds across the country? You've got to sing that song. Why would they not sing that song? You know what I mean? They think, oh, it's Pep Guardiola, we can't say that. Well, you can. Yeah, and it's only a bit of banter, isn't it? Football banter. Yeah, but...

I actually quite like the fact if that was my manager, I like the fact he has a fire in his belly and, you know, he's obviously agitated about it. And I didn't, I really didn't have a problem with that. As I say,

I mean, the Manchester City players know him inside out and know his personality inside out. I think the rest of us, you know, we look at him, I mean, you must have interviewed him many, many times over the years and would know his sort of traits and personality sort of better than most. But so in that respect, you know,

He was perfect. He's perfectly entitled to be fired up. And as I say, as long as he doesn't, as long as he doesn't change within, within the dressing room and his messaging doesn't change. I like that in a manager. There was a comment after the game by the city standing goalkeeper, Stefan Ortega saying,

He obviously was given the nod by Guardiola for the game that City lost 2-0 ahead of Edison. Big call, that one. Ortega made a slightly derogatory comment about Liverpool as a place. There might be some fallout from that going forward. Wasn't the cleverest thing to say. But in terms of Guardiola... Why would he say that? Yeah, I don't know. Look, look...

All I would say to you is that we've all said things, you know, we say things that we regret on this podcast, but we're fortunate in that it's not recorded live. So sometimes if Henry's feeling generous, he'll edit them out. If he's not, he'll leave them in. But, you know, I think that any, you know, footballers get TV cameras and radio mics and tape recorders shoved in front of them all the time. And look, I think he said something that he would immediately regret. At least I would hope he would regret it.

saying, for those who aren't aware, that he'd been told that Liverpool wasn't the nicest of places.

given that there's so much enmity between the two football clubs, that isn't going to help. But there we go. I'm not going to kill the guy for it. I think he's made a mistake. Back to Guardiola. Interesting what you said there about if you were playing for him, you'd like to see that. Because I was going to ask you, I am going to ask you, if you look at the way Guardiola's behaved in the last couple of weeks, all that kind of angst and face scratching when they were losing. Was it? Can I just say the face scratching? Was it?

I don't know. I've heard a lot of people say this. You've got to be careful what you say, but was it face-scratching? I think so. He seems to suggest that himself. He seems to suggest it was his fingernails. Don't think there was a possible dust-up there, no? I don't think so. And I think if there was, secret...

What, with one of his own players? Would he give himself a fat lip? Well, that's a big call. I haven't heard anyone say that. And I think we probably better say for the sake of it that there's no evidence of that. It's not been suggested. I see your point. I see your point. But I haven't even heard that mooted. And there are enough...

very, very good journalists out there. One of them, Jack Gorn's about, we're about to hear from our city correspondent. I've a lot of very good journalists out there with a lot of very good contacts. If that had happened, I'd be amazed if there wasn't a sniff of it out there already. So I think we'll take that as a no for now. Um,

but nice to see that you're thinking out of the box. But to go back to it, Guardiola's behaviour, his behaviour, his scratching of his face, brackets, fighting with his own players, close brackets. I didn't say who it was with. The stuff he said about not sleeping at night, the stuff he said about other...

club's not fearing them anymore. I just wonder whether he's sending the right messages to his players. That's what I'm getting at. And if you're a player in the dressing room and you're looking at your manager at the moment in Pep Guardiola, Chris, what are you seeing? Well, what am I seeing or what I would like to see are two totally different things. And, you know, I'm not...

Well, tell me. I don't have knowledge of the Manchester City dressing room. What I would say, over however many years he's been at Manchester City, and if I'd played for him, I wouldn't like to see the messaging...

I would like to see the same consistency in the way that the manager acted. And as I say, I actually, you know, his passion is fire the way that he is as a person. I think he's always been like that. He's always been highly competitive. But as long as the messages within the dressing room and the analytical side of it stay the same, because, you know,

I mean, you could strip everything back and there have been a lot of managers over the years who are very, very passionate and forthright. But I think that we all view Pep as a manager who's changed the game in this country and he absolutely has. And as long as he's still consistent with that, which I'm sure he is, there's absolutely no reason why he wouldn't be. I just think we do have to scratch beneath the surface now and maybe there are...

There are players who have been greats previously who are just aging a little bit and not quite what they were. If you...

I'm in a dressing room. When you were in a dressing room at Norwich and Blackburn and Chelsea and Celtic, et cetera, and you play badly or you're on a bad run and the manager's on TV or back in your days, he's in the newspapers. Do people in the dressing room ever sit there and say, blimey, have you heard what he said? Did you hear what the boss said or not? Yeah.

Good question, that. Yes, I can't remember anything which has been absolutely startling. But I think that they will...

Do you notice as players? That's what I'm asking you. Yes, but you notice more if there's anything outrageous. I don't think Manchester City players would look at Pep Guardiola's actions while this poor run has gone on and would have been...

would have been startled by anything which he said. I think they would have quite liked that. And there does seem, I know the wheels have come off in terms of their results as one bad month in 60 months, whatever it is for Manchester City, but there does seem to be that togetherness there still. I mean, there's, you know, why wouldn't there be? They have been

so, so successful. It's just they seem normal now. And in many ways, that's a little bit sad, isn't it? Yeah. Human. It's interesting though, because part of management, I guess, or part of management is not just how you manage when things are going well, but how you manage when things are going badly. Absolutely. Pep's got hardly any experience with that.

Yeah, he had a difficult spell at Bayern when he didn't do what he thought he should do in the Champions League. He had some toe-to-toes with Mourinho when Mourinho was at Madrid and Pep was at Barca, which seemed to vex him rather. But he's not particularly experienced at, luckily for him, at this type of situation.

But that's why, as a player, I think that they'll like the six-finger salute, the fight thing. You know, I'm up for this. And I think the supporters like that. You know, that's far better than a guy who's won everything, done everything, turning around at the end of the game, shaking hands with Arne Slott,

not acknowledging his fans and just ducking down the tunnel. Point taken. So the shoulders are slumped. So let's get into the weeds of the Manchester City situation right now. Apologies to Liverpool fans, by the way. We haven't even mentioned the fact that

We don't like mentioning teams who are doing too well. This is a crisis podcast, that's what I like to call it. This is a podcast that thrives and feeds off disappointment and failure. We don't care about the people who do well. But anyway, for positive Liverpool fans, you are streets ahead at the top of the Premier League. We should acknowledge that. Another fabulous performance from Arne Slotts

team. But let's get into the weeds of what's wrong at Manchester City and the guy who knows, as I mentioned earlier, is our Man City correspondent, Jack Gawne. I caught up with Jack last night, Sunday evening, and posed a few questions to him. The first thing he asked Jack was, what is fundamentally wrong with Manchester City? The fundamentals of what is wrong at the moment is that they can't score goals and they can't keep it out of the net either and the stuff in between isn't great.

So when you add all those together, it's not a massive surprise they're losing games. Obviously, they've had a lot of injuries this season. They're not the only club that have had injuries, but they can't seem to keep players fit. Even the ones that have been playing recently are obviously not a match fit. You can see that with your own eyes. Then the Rodri thing is massive for them. They can't...

They can't replace him. He's the best player in the world, isn't he? So he's irreplaceable. They've tried Kovacic in there, but he jumps from his position too much and they get turned over quite a lot. And then when Kovacic isn't there, you lose the legs because like an Ilkay Gundogan plays. So they're trying to find...

solutions for things all over the pitch. It's not as if it's just one problem that he's having to fix. And what about Pep Guardiola, Jack? I mean, he is acting like a man who's a little bit stressed, like a man who is under pressure. And it has crossed my mind that in his own way, at least public facing, don't know what he's doing behind the scenes, public facing, he might be kind of making things worse for the players.

Pep's obviously feeling the strain of a really, really bad month because he's someone that would ordinarily have bad weeks but would never have a bad month. And for them to have gone this long without winning a game a full month is practically, well, it is unheard of, isn't it? So he's obviously struggling. We saw that last week with the scratches on his face and things like that. He's

I had a bit of soul searching after the final game on Tuesday night. He was locked in his office for a long, long time after that. And it's all the problems that he's trying to fix at once, which is a very, very difficult thing to do. But having said that, if there is one person that can fix it and get him out of the slump, it is him.

But it's been interesting to sort of observe him over the last few weeks where he's become more philosophical, I'd say, over what's going on and sort of reverted back to how great they've been over the last few years. And, you know, you can't really forget that aspect of it, that they have been absolutely superb for a long, long time. And it's, you know, the last...

few games have been a massive shock to the system. They certainly have. And I think one of the things that really struck me watching the game on Sunday was not just what was happening on the field or what wasn't happening on the field for City, but what was sitting on the bench. And I look at the City substitutes and I see Jack Grealish and I see Kevin De Bruyne. And I think to myself, they're two of Manchester City's best players. Why are they not in the team?

A casual observer would probably look at the starting XI on Sunday at Anfield and say, yeah, no De Bruyne, no Grealish, what's he doing? But, I mean, Grealish had been out of favour for a while now. Had an injury, then was sort of out of the team, hasn't been able to get back. And actually, you look at that game and the way they played, where they wanted to contain Jack Grealish on the left wing, that's made for him, that's perfect for what he has always done for this City team. So, yeah,

They need to find a way of getting these players back in the team. De Bruyne, yeah, when you take De Bruyne out of any side, they're going to be, you know, the creativity is not going to be as high and the way they play is not going to be as fluid. And he spoke quite honestly last week about his injuries and

How he wasn't able to kick a football without feeling pain until a day before the Tottenham defeat, the 4-0 defeat the other week. That was the first time he did a training session and wasn't feeling pain. So they obviously don't feel like he's physically able to start games at the moment, which is a massive worry for them, really. I mean, there's got to come a point. He's been training for a while now. There's got to come a point where he's like, right, you've got to play because...

we need to get results. So whether that comes on Wednesday night against Nottingham Forest remains to be seen. But they are, you know, they're missing his spark and a bit of guts in midfield to go and take a game on. And finally, Jack, one of the things that big clubs traditionally do when they're struggling is

when they are down on their luck and down on numbers with long-term injuries to key players, is spend money. The landscape has changed a little bit these days with the Premier League spending rules, etc. But the question a lot of City fans will want answering is whether Pep Guardiola will have money to spend in the January window. Yeah, I mean, they've got to get the transfers right starting in January with however many they sign. I think it'll be at least one. And then they've got to get it right moving forward because Guardiola said that

I mean, he's mentioned for the first time over the last week or so that, yeah, there's a rebuild that needs to be done. He's always sort of shied away from that, but has now mentioned it, which I think is quite significant. I think the transfer business over the last few years has been easy-osey, been kind of average.

I think that's largely down to the fact that the players that are now deemed a little bit too old have been performing at such a high level that it's quite difficult to replace them. So they've signed backups that they hope would then integrate into the system and then maybe they haven't. And it's kind of caught up with them a little bit.

I think they'll go and get a centre midfielder in January. I've written about Zubbermendi at Real Sociedad and Edison at Atalanta, who have both been watched. And then Sammy Mott-Bell's written about Adam Wharton at Crystal Palace. I just wonder whether Wharton might be a little bit difficult to do, particularly in January.

because of the fees involved, because City haven't, you know, they haven't gone out. Cavalio is the only one since Grealish where they've gone out and spent, like, really, really big money. So it's got to the point now where maybe they do need, like, three or four, like, real statement signings. Obviously, they're not all going to come in January, but it just means that next summer is going to be...

going to be a big one. For your four statement signings, says Jack Gawne, our Manchester City correspondent. That is a statement in itself. There we go. There's some important detail there from Jack. The ins and outs, the whys and whores of what is going wrong at Manchester City at the moment. Chris, before we move on to another topic, we're

We like to do questions for Chris on this podcast and there are some on the way from our listeners. But I've got a question for you, my question for Chris. We're not going to keep that in the questions for Chris section. This is my question for Chris. Who is the second highest scorer from Manchester City in the Premier League behind Erling Haaland? That's a trick question, isn't it? It's a hard question. I wouldn't necessarily expect you to know.

It is. Don't tell me. No, it's a question. You've asked me a question and you want to answer it. My wife does that a lot. So Foden hasn't scored. I know that. This must be a defender. It must be a defender. Gvardiol. Very, very good. Although...

I suspect that you may have been hamming that up a little bit in you all along, but that is a very good get. No, I didn't. Fair play. But he has scored a few, but do you know how I know? Because I've had him in my fantasy team. I know you're not interested in that, but he did well and then Pep did what he normally does and left Guardiola out and cost me points. I'm going to hit the fantasy football clacks and if there's much more of that. But yes, it is. Josco Guardiola and Maciej Kovacic have got three games.

Foden, Grealish, Gundogan, Silva, Nunes, Savinho haven't scored a single league goal between them for Manchester City this season. And it's almost gone.

Christmas anyway quick mention of somebody just go a lot of girls most Sally was at it again for Liverpool what is what a setup for the first goal for Cody Gatpo scored the penalty for the second one he does continue to poke Liverpool a little bit salad with his comments and

After Sunday's game, he then said, this could be my last game against Manchester City. That comes a week after the Southampton game, which was followed by Salah saying that he thought he was more out than in, in terms of his future at Liverpool. This will become a problem if it carries on, Chris. Oh, come on. And I'll tell you why. Come on. I mean, he's told the truth, hasn't he? It could be.

his last game against Manchester City. He is stating a fact and you're reading into that too much. What I would say, the longer this goes on, the longer Salah is in form, this whole situation with Salah and Van Dijk, there's a situation which...

If things do unravel at Liverpool, people will look back to the fact that they haven't got this deal done. I just think now he's made his point.

A couple of times, we know what the situation is. I think for the good of the football club and for the good of Arne Slott and teammates in that dressing room who are trying to win what would be an absolutely extraordinary title in Slott's first season, when people like me thought they had it all on to finish in the top four. I think if he's not curled for salary, he's going to undermine that. He's going to undermine it. We know the situation. We don't need to hear it again. I think...

He's going to undermine it. It's not all about you. The ball isn't in his court. The ball isn't in his court. For the good of the football club, the football club should get the deal done with Mo Salah and keep him happy. This is not all about Mo Salah. And if he's not careful, it's going to start to sound like that. And that isn't going to help anybody. Right. I was at Old Trafford on Sunday and

Manchester United beat a team by four goals for the first time in the league since 2021. Beat Everton 4-0. Standout performances from Joshua Xerxe, from Marcus Rashford, particularly from Armand Diallo. We'll get to him in a little bit. But I have to say that was one of the strangest 4-0s I've seen for a long time, Chris. Everton were the better team for half an hour.

and then fell apart on the back of individual errors. Two from Gerald Brantwaite, one from Tarkowski of all people late in the game, a collective failure for the third Manchester United goal. There are times when I look at managers and just feel a bit sorry for them. And that was how I felt as regards Sean Dyche at Old Trafford.

Yes, I think so. But they can't score Everton, which is a huge, huge problem. And, you know, it's always the same story with Everton. I think the longer this season's gone on, there are disgruntled fans, you know, with Sean Dyche, with the club, with the team, with everything which is going on. And he needs a result or two. But...

Like you said, I saw the highlights on Match of the Day and the analysis, and you said you were there for half an hour, Everton were the team in the ascendancy, and then they just shot themselves in the foot. But that's becoming too regular an occurrence. Yeah, I just...

Why does that feel so sorry for Sean yesterday? I think it was because I looked at the teams before the game and I thought, blimey, you know, he'd taken Calvert-Lewin out, Beto was playing, James Houston wasn't playing, who I think is a good player, but I think has not been playing well this season. And I looked at them, I thought that team can't hurt United and United will score, I would imagine, at least one goal. You know, I was going to lose this game. And then I watched them for half an hour.

I thought, you know what? That looks like a really well-coached football team. They were aggressive when United had the ball. We know that makes United feel uncomfortable. They were defending reasonably comfortably. They were making inroads down either side. Beto was, he's certainly not a great finisher, but he was troubling the two United centre-halves.

And then they chuck it away. Then they chuck it away. Van Vliet's unlucky for the first one, deflects it into the goal from a Rashford shot. Second one gets dispossessed, 2-0 down. Game's over. And yet at the end of the game, it's the Everton fans that were left. Most of them went home after the fourth goal. The Everton fans that are left are giving, you know,

trying to keep it clean, abusive gestures, should we say, to Dyche. And the players are getting away with it. The players go over and clap the supporters and the supporters clap back. Dyche claps the supporters and they give him the you-know-what gestures. I mean, that's just not right, is it? Well, it's, you know, we're all in this together and, you know, it clearly isn't like that. And

Oh, you know, I don't know. I do think that there's a large element of the Everton support who have made the mind up about Sean Dosh. And I actually think it's quite unfair with what he's had to deal with since going in. I mean, I'm labelling the point and I'll move on in a minute, but it looks to me like he was a coach who'd done his job in the week. He set them up well and for half an hour it worked really, really well.

And then the players didn't do their bit. If you're, if you're Jared Banthwaite, you're supposed to be worth 40, 50 million quid and you get dispossessed, dallying on the ball. Tarkowski's got God knows how many Premier League appearances behind him for Everton and Burnley does the same in the second half. The start of the second half, the Everton left back just goes missing. What's the manager supposed to do? Anyway, I'm repeating myself, repeating myself. Um,

Diallo. Just quickly, you mentioned a klaxon for if I mentioned fantasy football again, but some of your pronunciations today. What folk were they? Ahmed. Ahmed. Ahmed, yeah. Tarkovsky. Tarkovsky.

I mean, that's totally different. And you keep saying gundagun. I mean, if I had a klaxon. Yeah, there should be a gundagun klaxon. You're better than that. Well, I'm not better than that, am I? The proof of the pudding's in the eating. I'm not better than that. I always get basic pronunciation wrong. It's one of the reasons why, you know, I'm not a broadcaster, Chris. People who listen to this podcast regularly will have worked out by now. I'm not a broadcaster. I'm a written journalist. I can spell. I can spell. I just can't speak. Ahmad.

We criticise United a lot for their recruitment over the years. They got one right with this boy, took him from Atlanta in... Atalanta. Atalanta in 2021. I've taken him from Atlanta, that would have been a coup. Taken him from Atalanta in 2021. They've got one right with that boy because he looks a real player. And I'm not just saying it on the back of yesterday, I've thought it for a while.

Have you? Yeah. Yeah. Well, do you know what? I shouldn't admit to stuff like this, but I had to – he was on loan at Rangers. He was, yes. Not for long.

I had to check it was the same player. I mean, I'm not blaming him for the spell he had at Rangers at that particular time, but he disappointed. But it just, you know, it just shows you. I think we have to judge over a longer period of time. I get why you're excited about him.

I do. He's always seemed such a talented player, certainly with the ball. I think what may have gone against him in the past is stuff around his work, great, and his discipline. But watching yesterday, everything seemed to be spot on. We need to judge him over a longer period of games. He's one of those players who...

if he's playing against my team, when he gets the ball, he makes me feel nervous. And I think that's a reasonable barometer. Very brief request. But there was a protest before the game yesterday. United fans protested against some ticket prices, 66 quid minimum cost now for a child to go watch United in the Premier League, which is quite something. But what struck me walking to the ground was the number of people I saw in half and half scarves. You know, United and one half Everton on the other half. People...

people take the mickey out of people who buy those but the people who buy those scarves tend to be what you might call tourist fans people who are just there for the day want to make a want to make a take a memento home with them they might come from abroad different type different part of the country but they're only there once and the bottom line is that those scarves

are the punters that these big clubs want. And it sounds really harsh, but those are punters that they want because they will come and they'll come and they'll spend on the game. They'll probably buy good seats if they're only there once. And then they'll go in the mega store and they'll spend money. And then they'll have a drink and something to eat. And those are the, you know, big clubs these days, I don't care. I don't think a lot of them, it's a sweeping statement. They don't care who sits in their seats as long as their seats are full. And if it's not a kid,

from Stretford or from Trafford or from Sale or from Chorlton and all those areas around Old Trafford, I don't think Manchester United and other big clubs care about it because how much money do they spend when they come to the ground? Probably not that much. And the problem with... I get why supporters protest. I get why they make their views...

but the bottom line is that people who own Premier League football clubs know that for the foreseeable, unless there's a massive shift in the popularity of Premier League, the seats in their stadium will be full every week and they don't care who sits in them. They don't care who sits in them and

Football's always been a working class game as far as... Well, it's not anymore. And there's no point pretending that it is. That was my point. So it vexes me. It vexes me. And I'm absolutely not saying for one minute, by the way, that somebody from wherever United fans are coming from, somebody from London or Dublin or New York...

or Hong Kong shouldn't be allowed to come and watch Manchester United. Of course they should. But if people think that these clubs care that they're pricing the working class or the younger people out with football or the older people in terms of concessions, then they absolutely don't.

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Right, questions for Chris. All these have come from X. Let's get into them. Goldsmith. Have Leicester made a mistake in hiring a novice like Ruud van Nistelrooy?

Interesting appointment. I mean, would they have hired Van Nistelrooy had he not had that little period as Manchester United manager that month where he beat Leicester twice? I think that may have been a large part of the thinking. I worry for Leicester. I hope things go well, but I do worry for Leicester City and Rood because of that. Not experienced, is he?

Tom Colamossi, our excellent Midlands correspondent, has already said to me a couple of times and written that the problem at Leicester are the people inside the dressing room, not the bloke in the manager's office. Jimmy Knuckles asks...

Can we rate all pundits after a round of games and then relegate them to regional TV at the end of the season? Chris Sutton, RU Desert for BBC Radio Norfolk. You might be. Well, if that's a dig at me. Yeah, I'm surprised I've lasted this long. So yes, great idea.

Tell you what made me laugh this week. I've had an email from someone called Footy Accumulators and they've been putting together a list of their top 20 most attractive pundits on TV and I'm sorry to say, Chris Sutton, that you're not in it. And Glenn Hoddle is, which surprised me a little bit. Wow, did he model for top men? Peter Crouch was number one, by the way. Dan Thompson asks, Will Manchester United finish higher than Manchester City? No. Scott asks, Can Arsenal catch Liverpool?

No. I think they can. I absolutely think they can. Well, they didn't ask you. It was questions for Chris. Very good point. We can edit that back out. Very good point. And Mark Clark asks on X, is it time for Ange Postacoglu to go? He's tactically inept. Tottenham drawing with Fulham, of course, at the Tottenham Stadium on Sunday. Not this again. No, it's not, Mark. Get a life.

Get a life, Mark Clark. Tell you what though, Chris, I did, it is extraordinary that Tottenham can't manage to win two games back to back. I mean, only they can win, only they can win 4-0.

4-0 at City last weekend and have two home games one against Roma one against Fulham and not win either of them because they're both they're both terrible teams I mean Solanke Solanke went home he was unwell they don't have the best centre-back pairing but Fulham are hopeless aren't they I did like this quote from Postacogu afterwards there aren't too many teams playing with both centre-backs out but

But I love the fact we're not seeking excuses. Well, that is an excuse. That is a direct contradiction. That is an excuse. I think it's probably a valid excuse.

I think that's tongue-in-cheek, Ian. I think it's a valid excuse. Don't say you're not making excuses and then make excuses. I'm sorry. Look, we're not going to go deep into it. We love Tottenham. We love Anz. But it does... You know what? If I was a Tottenham fan, I would look at that league table and think we should be in the top four. I would think that. Just quickly, how many clubs are in crisis then? Are we going crisis club from Forthdown, Brighton, all the way to Bourne? Well, we can't say Bourne was a crisis club to...

to Villa in 12th, where there is, what, four points, four points covering them all. They're all in crisis. I'm just saying, I didn't mention there were crisis in connection with Tottenham. You did. If I was a Tottenham fan, I would look at that league table and think to myself, goodness me, we probably should be in it. Given the number of points that they probably should have had on the way they've played, we've talked about this before, I would look at that table and think, blimey, we should be in the top four. We should be, we should be in the top four. Top scorers in the Premier League. I'd love that as a Tottenham fan. We're the entertainers.

Anyway, there we go. They're home to Chelsea next weekend. I will be at that game. Oh, what I didn't mention, by the way, before, and I should have done, Everton's fixtures, by the way, I don't need to go into it. Everton's fixtures. Before Boxing Day, Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea, Man City.

Who's the next fixture? They've got Wolves at home on Wednesday. Goodness me, I hope they win that one for their sake. For Sean Dicey's sake, I hope they win that game. Merseyside Derby. Apologies to the Wolves fans who listened to this pod. Merseyside Derby next weekend. Goodison now. Former Goodison favourite, Wayne Rooney. Talking of crisis.

I wouldn't want to be in Wayne's shoes this week. I wouldn't want to be in Wayne's world. And I wouldn't want to be... Well, because Colleen's away. And I wouldn't want to be in Wayne's dressing room this week, by the way, because he's had it out twice now with his players at Plymouth in the championship. And I don't blame him. 6-1, they lost against Norwich. That can happen. That can happen with Hofball. That used to happen when you played for them.

6-1 they lost at Norwich last week and they followed that up with a 4-0 defeat at Bristol City where the Plymouth chairman was in the away end. So that ain't great. Wayne himself says, we've got to get to the bottom of why this keeps happening. It can't carry on. I think for his sake, Chris, it probably can't. Listen to this statistic.

In his two spells, since he came back from Washington, D.C. just over a year ago, at Birmingham and Plymouth, Wayne Rooney has managed 33 games in the championship and he's won six of them. He's won six in 33. Now that, that asks an enormous question about whether Rooney has got the credentials to make it in a job that he clearly wants to make a success of.

I think there's no doubt he underachieved at Birmingham. I think with this Plymouth job, I think if we're being fair to Wayne, I think we both said on this podcast that we admired him for taking the job because it was a difficult job. The expectation is to stay in the championship and that's it. And I'm not saying it's been a great week, but I still think there has to be a bit of patience. They're false bottom of the championship, but just staying up would be success and that's

you know, that, that's the goal. So, you know, let's just, well, that's the pragmatist view. And I, and I get it. Um, and he has got some injuries. Um, uh, Plymouth do have some, some key players missing. And I know that, but I think, and this may not be fair, but it's just a fact of life that if you hire a big name like Wayne Rooney, um,

just staying in the championship or staying in the division that you're in isn't really good enough. They stayed in the division last season. So they hire Rooney for improvement. Yeah? They hire Rooney for improvement. And I've said to you before... I think you're wrong here. I've said to you... No, I'm talking about perception, Chris, because if you go on Plymouth message boards that I was having a look at on Sunday night, you look at comments that have been made

about Wayne Rooney by the Plymouth fan base, then they're not saying, oh, it's okay just to keep us up. And that's the problem. That's all message boards. They're a terrible barometer. Well, they're the punters who pay to go and watch the games. Well, I know, but it's like, you know, go on social media after a game and, you know, look at the reaction to Pep, you know, last night on social media. You know, people...

suggesting he should be sacked. I mean, come on. That's nonsense, obviously. That's absolute nonsense. We don't need to... Well, that's social media. That's message boards. But look, I've said before, I've written before, I really admire Wayne for...

to be a manager as badly as he does, right? You could say to me, well, what about all the other managers? Well, frankly, a lot of the other managers need to work, right? A lot of the other managers down the pyramid, they need to work for obvious reasons. Wayne doesn't need to work. He doesn't need this, right? He could do nothing. He

He could go and sit on, he could go and sit on Gary Neville's podcast for the rest of his career, come on hours if he wants. You know what I mean? He could be on Sky. He's an intelligent talker about football. He wouldn't be short, but he doesn't want that. He wants to be a coach. And that's why, hey,

And that's admirable. Exactly. Exactly. So I want him to succeed. I also want him to succeed because I think that if people like him and Gerrard and Lampard ultimately fail, I think that puts other high profile players off following them into management. But if so, our top players need role models as weird as that sounds.

They need role models to persuade them to go into management. And Wayne is one of them. So I want him to succeed. However, is there a body of evidence that is now gathering that's maybe just suggesting to us that he hasn't got what it takes?

I think that that's slightly unfair. As I say, expectation, the realistic expectation, Plymouth to stay in the league. He's had a bad week. That's it. Can I just say quickly something which may help Plymouth? We had a caller into 606 over the weekend, Alison, a Bristol City fan who was at the game, said that the Plymouth team are too small.

Too physically small for the league. Too small. I know you get angry about stuff like that. I'm not one of those. Then a Plymouth fan came on and agreed with her. I'm not one of those. Too small. Signs up to all the players, Wayne. A good biggin's always better than a good littlin'. I'm not an angry small person. I'm just an angry person. And you're small. So you're an angry small person. I'd be angry if I was tall. I'm just angry. I'm not.

I'm not angry because I'm small. I'm just angry. If you are an angry small person, you can't deny that. I'm not angry because I'm small. Is that not a fair point, though, to suggest maybe that a team isn't physically big enough for the championship? May Alison have a point there? I haven't seen him, so I don't know. I'll have to go and have a look at all that. They're heights. But anyway, there we go. I'll be looking down. So...

See, I wonder whether if Wayne Rooney wasn't called Wayne Rooney, if Wayne Rooney was called Joe Bloggs, I wonder if he might be getting sacked before this weekend. Oh, come on. You're better than that. Before this weekend's game at Oxford. And I don't want him to be sacked. I'm just saying. It's different when you're a big name manager in the champ. It really is. Anyway, they're at home to Oxford this weekend. It's probably not eating. Colleen's away.

in the jungle. And that, you know, it happens to us all. I mean, I, I, I cannot fend for myself when Sam, when Sam is away. It's, it's cereal, it's toast. It's awful. I don't think, well, Colleen isn't living down in Plymouth anyway, so I don't think she's sending him ready meals or, you know, batches of spag bol down. We, we,

We don't know what to do. No, you don't. You speak for yourself. Just because you exist on Weetabix and Cornflakes when Sam's away doesn't mean everybody else is like that. Some of us can survive. Anyway, there we go. Wayne Rooney. Wayne Rooney, what do we think will happen to him? Why don't you let us know? Or what should happen to him? Do we feel sorry for him? Or is he just another...

over-entitled former star player. Let us know. Find us on X. You know how it goes by now. I'm the one with the silly name and Chris is the one with the famous name. We've got an email address. Use it. IAKO at dailymail.co.uk. Find us on socials. Go to Malesport on Instagram and TikTok and X and Facebook. You can find X Search from the show there. Go to the show notes on Apple Podcast or Spotify, wherever it is you get the show.

find the rating bit, give us five big fat stars and hit the follow button. Come on, we need you. We need this community to grow and we need it to talk to us. Christopher, talk to me. Moments of the weekend, please. ♪

Well, there's a couple. Very, very quickly, Gary O'Neill, I found out last week, drinks 20 cups of tea a day. I mean, that's staggering. He must spend a lot of time in the bathroom. That's exactly my first thought. Goodness me. That's staggering. I mean, is there anybody out there who can...

Beat that? I mean, I like a cup of coffee. Who's counting, by the way? Gary. Gary himself. Yeah. But Gary has admitted 20 cups of tea a day. I mean, that's staggering. That's a moment of the week. But also very proud. I might make him an honorary northerner for that.

Yeah. I don't know what's worse. I don't know. I drink Earl Grey. I'm a disgrace to the North. I drink Earl Grey without milk. I don't...

know what's worse the fact he drinks 20 cups of tea a day or the fact he's counting them as he drinks them anyway like it I've got another one I've just I've got another one I know you like a lot very proud moment for me in the week I don't know whether you've seen this that Blackburn and Darwin Council they've named two gritter lorries one one after Alan Shearer Alan Clearer and one after myself Chris Sutton Grit Sutton that's magnificent so that is

That is absolutely magnificent. I'm very proud, very proud. Thank you. Alan Clearer and Grit Sutton. Yes. That's absolutely fabulous. I love that. I've made it. Did they ask you first? No. Can you sue them? Can you sue them then? Can you make some money out of it? Yeah. I've never thought of that. Yes, good idea. I'll be on to my lawyer. I mean, the reason that you only lasted six months as a centre-half is because you were no good at cleaving up at the back. So why would they be naming a Gritter after you?

Good point. That is a great story. Have you seen photographs of him? Yeah, oh yes. Have they got your face on the front? I don't think so. It's a brilliant story. I don't think they had one like face on the front. Alan Clear and Grit Sutton, absolutely fabulous. Very proud, thank you. I love that. Now, one of my moments of the weekend is actually about you. So you were in Glasgow last Thursday for a Celtic match

dinner uh you were there larson was there lennon was there that's neil not john um um martin o'neill was there um and um you had a you had a good night mate didn't you how was things how were things back at the hotel yeah all right how'd you get on when you got back to the hotel all good yeah a couple of drinks yeah yeah anything that anything out of the ordinary happened there

What are you getting at? A few drinks or some tea? And then we went, go up in the night and went to the loo and ended up in the corridor.

Somebody told me. Oh, that was, I, that is a disgrace. Had you had 20 cups of tea? I've done it, I've done it before. I've done it before too. Got up to go to the toilet and mistook the bathroom door and walked out into the corridor and then the door slammed. I am, I am, I did find Sam in the morning. I am 95% certain that I had my boxers on.

I was going to ask you what, what do you mean 95% certain? Why, why didn't you know? Were you sleepwalking or something? Well,

Well, I'd had a few drinks. Oh, so you'd had a lot of drinks, a lot of cups of tea. I mean, at home, sometimes I do sleepwalk. I do have the odd sleepwalk. I do have this flashback of walking into a reception, and fortunately there was a guy on the reception. So you had to go to a reception? Of a key, yeah, down the list. I love that. I love that.

I mean, you're lucky. You're lucky that some, that you, that someone didn't get you on a camera phone. I mean, that could have been all over social media by now. You and your pants in the reception of the Glasgow Ibis at three o'clock in the morning. Yeah, exactly. Your Apple catches. That's,

Who are your sources? That's very good. I do have some contacts in the game. Not as many as I used to. I've started to sweat, actually. That happened to me once after a football righty's dinner in London. I was lucky. I was in one of those old-fashioned hotels that still have a phone in the corridor. So I was able to phone down to reception. They came up to me and I can tell you now I was wearing my boxing shorts, but not much else.

Anyway, there we go. I've got one more moment of the weekend, by the way. Two, actually, very quick. A goal for the Orient goalkeeper, Josh Keighley, in the FA Cup. 99th minute to equalise for Orient against Oldham. Header from a free kick. They went on to win the game in extra time. And also, I've got to give a mention of the Wolves fan,

who desperately trying to put off Justin Kluivert as he took one of his hat-trick of penalties for Bournemouth at Molineux, decided to pull down his trousers. It's there on social media. He decided to pull down his trousers.

and lift up his shirt in a bid to put him off. And of course, it didn't work. Yeah, he was wearing Y-frins, by the way. He was all budgie-slingers, as you might call them, in Australia. Right, there we go. That's it. We're done. Thank you, everybody, for being with us, as always. Remember what I said. Find us on X...

silly name, famous name, all the rest of it. Please go and leave us a review and a rating. That is really important. Follow the show. That's important too. We will be back on Thursday for our weekend preview show. There's a load of football midweek, by the way. The Premier League could look

even more different by the time we get to Thursday. Liverpool are at Newcastle. Man United are at Arsenal. City are at home to Forest. They've got to win a game at last. And on that point, this was a great stat sent to me on X from Adrian M who says, did you know that San Marino have won more games than Manchester City in November? Who would ever have thought that? Um,

That's it, we're done. Celtic are at Aberdeen. There are games north of the border as well. Absolutely, Celtic are at Aberdeen on Wednesday night. Rangers went up there a month or so ago and got beat. What will happen to Celtic? Right, that's it, we're done. I'm Ian Laderman, the chap hopping about in the corridor of the Glasgow Ibises, Chris Sutton. This has been It's All Kicking Off. Kicking off.