S11 E4: [Quinn] You’re So Lucky to Have Me
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According to the National Sexual Violence Resource Center, online sexual abuse can be any type of sexual harassment, exploitation, or abuse that takes place through screens. Examples of online sexual harassment or abuse include sending someone hateful or unwelcome comments based on their sex, sending unwanted requests to partners or strangers to send nude photos, videos, or livestream sexual acts,

Performing sexual acts on webcam without the consent of everyone involved or in inappropriate settings. Sharing private images or videos without the consent of everyone involved, also known as revenge porn, which is illegal. Sharing porn in spaces where everyone has not consented to view it, like in Zoom meetings or other inappropriate places, also called Zoom porn.

bombing, grooming children for the use of sexual abuse, either online or offline. Additionally, as images of abuse could be re-shared and re-circulated on the internet, there's an added layer of re-victimization. In a Swedish study of 14-15 year old children, they reported that unknown adults had made contact with them via the internet and made suggestions of a sexual nature during the preceding year.

sexual approaches were experienced by 30 to 48% of girls and 18% of boys. The study also revealed that this type of abuse is more common among older adolescents and those who identify as LGBTQIA+.

In this study, 5.8% of the adolescents had sexual experiences online with a person that they only met online, and of those, 9.7% reported that they had been persuaded, pressed, or coerced, meaning that they, by definition, had been sexually abused online.

This research confirmed that online sexual victimization, also including cyberbullying, is associated with adverse emotional and psychological consequences. I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is Something Was Wrong. You think you know me, you don't know me well. Don't know me, don't know me.

Hi, my name is Quinn. I'm 24 years old, and this is a story about what's happened in my life in my early childhood. Summer of 2010, I started on this gaming website with my older brother. That gaming website had chat forums where you could talk to other players and communicate with other players. That summer is when I met Billy. Billy is a

Billy was 18 at the time and I was 13 when I started playing the game and we randomly got paired in this chat forum with the same roles in the game. In the fall of 2010, Billy and I exchanged contact information. We shared our Hotmail accounts and our Skype information, our phone numbers, and we would talk every single day. I kept that from my parents for the entire five years that I talked to Billy.

I would intentionally work my schedule around keeping this information from my parents. As far as his personality, he knew all of the right things to say. He was very charismatic, funny, and relatable. He made me feel wanted and loved more.

And that was just through text. A lot of people can change and edit the things that they say through text, which makes online relationships a little dangerous. But through text, when he and I first met, he just came off as this incredibly caring person.

understanding, outgoing, hilarious person. It was enticing to talk to him. In order to keep their contact with one another a secret, Quinn would video chat and email with Billy late at night when her parents were asleep. This continued for a year and a half. And in the fall of 2011, Billy asked me to be his girlfriend. We still had never met in person, and we strictly communicated over Skype.

Our conversation started out fairly innocent. It's just daily conversation of how are you? What are you up to? How are you doing? What are you going to do later tonight before we Skype? And then the spring of 2012, when I turned 15, Billy convinced me to ask my parents for a laptop for my birthday so that our Skype sessions could be more in private because I had my own bedroom.

And that's when things kind of took a turn. We continued to be able to have these private conversations in my room late at night. Going into the summer of 2012 was when Billy started guilt-tripping me into performing sexual acts on camera. One of the first ever experiences I had was him asking me to do something super simple, but for a 15-year-old who was 15.

very prudish and grew up in the South and believed in a lot of the stigmas that surround sex. It was really uncomfortable for me. He just asked me to wear a camisole tank top without a bra on, on camera. And that terrified me. And I agreed to do that.

My parents were out of the house for the day and so he wanted to watch a movie together. I gave him the option to choose the movie that we would watch and he ended up deciding on the first episode of Game of Thrones.

Which for anyone who's familiar with Game of Thrones, there's a lot of nudity involved in that show, particularly in the first season. So I was taken aback. The moment I clicked on the link, it's like within the first 10 minutes, there's sex and I was mortified. So I kind of freaked out and I asked him to stop the show. And that's when he kind of looked at me and he said, well, we made a deal.

I had worn my camisole tank top, but it was under this very large baggy sweatshirt. I said, yeah, I know we made a deal, but I'm really uncomfortable right now. And he said, but you said you would do this for me. And so I just nodded and I said, I explained to him that I would take off my sweatshirt, but I was incredibly uncomfortable and that I would be hanging up almost immediately. That was my, I guess, compromise for our quote unquote deal.

He looked at me and he said, okay, well then I'm going to screenshot you. And I said, all right. And there I was in my camisole with no bra on, just 15-year-old me. I felt completely powerless and mortified. And it seems like such a simple act, but it was terrifying for me. I'd never done anything to sexually appease another human being.

He took a screenshot and I didn't even hang up the call. I shut my computer and I cried. And that was the first of many times that Billy manipulated me into performing acts to fulfill his obsession.

Every single time I performed anything for him or did anything for him that he had manipulated me into doing, he would realize how upset it would make me. I would cry and I'd shut my computer and not talk to him for a few hours. And then he'd apologize. And within 24 to 48 hours, he was doing the exact same thing again, just guilting me. And he would always use the lines, like super manipulative lines of guilt.

This is what healthy relationships look like. People in healthy relationships are sexually intimate. And since we can't be together, this is the only way for us to remain healthy in our relationship. And so I consistently felt conflicted with where my moral standings were and wanting to fulfill this almost prophesied vision of a healthy relationship that he had implemented into my mind.

He would get extremely aggravated and aggressive towards me about sexual frustrations, and he would blame me for it because it's not like I would do some sort of sexual act for him on camera and then I would fall back into it 24 to 48 hours later when he was getting sexually frustrated again. I mean, I would hold off for weeks because I was so traumatized from the previous actions that I had partaken in.

And so he just got more and more aggressive. Over four years into their communication, when Quinn was a senior in high school, her dad made an alarming discovery.

Up until this point, my parents had no clue that this relationship was even taking place. My phone was sitting on my bathroom counter and my phone was unlocked. I was walking into my bathroom to get ready for school and I looked down and I see this explicit text message and I see my dad look at it. And then he looks up at me and he just walks away. And the absolute terror that I felt in my stomach at that moment was unreal because I knew there was no way my dad hadn't read what was in that text message.

Both of my parents waited until about four or five days after to sit down with me. I was one of those students in high school who did everything. I was in an a cappella choir. I was on the tennis team. I was on the speech and debate team. And so they knew I had a lot on my plate and they were very understanding and they sat down with me and asked me about the explicit text. I explained everything to them that I wanted them to know.

which was I was in a relationship online with a guy I'd never met who was six and a half to seven years older than me. And he lived in a state far away. We had never met and we wanted to eventually and that we were very much so in love. And that was that. My parents really tried to be supportive of me.

There were a lot of boundaries that they set up. Quinn's parents took all of her electronics and sent them off to be investigated by a private detective. They also did a background check on Billy, who had no criminal history at the time. At 9 p.m. every night, I couldn't Skype or FaceTime with Billy in a private space. I had to be, like, out in our living room or with my door open in my bedroom. There were no more secrets to be had between the family.

At least, not to my parents' knowledge, sadly. At the time, did you understand where they were coming from? No, I didn't. My dad was a lot more...

He had a lot more of that fatherly protectiveness about him with the entire situation. And I think that's just because of the text message he saw. And so maybe he felt like he was losing a part of his daughter, like his innocent daughter. And my mom was very diplomatic about it. She expressed her concerns very calmly. And she explained that

If you really believe that you're in love with this guy and you really believe that this is something that you want for your future, then we'll help you any way that we can. But there are going to be rules. And I also just want to come out and say, I don't think a relationship, a four and a half to five year relationship that's been fully online is healthy. Particularly for someone who's still in their early adulthood development stages. She kept saying, it's not healthy because you're not there in person with that individual.

She emphasized how important it was to be in person with your significant other and to know their quirky habits and things that they do that get on your nerves and their mannerisms and how they take care of themselves and things like that. That's what she was concerned about. And I kind of understood where she was coming from, but there was another stubborn teenage part of me that was just kind of like, well, they don't understand because they're so much older than me and they don't understand like new age technology and stuff like that.

What about your friends at school? I kept the relationship a secret from my friends until probably the end of my sophomore year of high school. I had two main friends in high school, and they knew about Billy after my sophomore year of high school. They kind of thought it was cool that I was being edgy and keeping my relationship a secret. Not necessarily that they were supportive of it, but it was just kind of like they were also respectful of my boundaries.

And so I don't think people really, including my friends in high school and my parents, I don't think the dangers of the internet were necessarily considered at the extent that they are now. After I had that conversation with my parents just about the details that I wanted them to know, my relationships with my parents and my friends in high school took a huge plummet.

I was consistently telling my parents I hated them to their faces. I felt like my privacy was completely taken away, and in hindsight, justifiably so. At that point, I felt like everything I had worked toward with Billy was being completely demolished.

Looking back on it, it was an addiction. It was a relationship that was strictly abusive and people found out about my addiction and it was taken away from me and I was having like psychological withdrawals. I kind of realized that my relationships were suffering because of my other relationship with Billy and I walked up to my mom one day and I said, "I need to go to therapy."

She said, "Okay." And about six weeks later, my therapist and I just kind of had that "aha" moment and I went home and I ended things with Billy.

At that time, I asked him to send me video evidence that he had deleted every single file that he owned of me to get rid of anything that I had mailed him that was mine. And he did. He sent me a video of him deleting files that were of me, explicit files. And I didn't speak to him again.

And it was like a light turned back on. My relationship with my parents mended almost overnight. I graduated high school and my friendships were better than ever and things were good to go. And then in October of 2020, I got a call from the Department of Homeland Security.

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So October of 2020, I get a call from the Department of Homeland Security. It is a special agent calling me and I thought it was a spam. I was at a little movie night get together with a few of my friends from school and I ignored it until I looked down and saw like the voice recording or voicemail translation.

It said, this is agent so-and-so calling from the Department of Homeland Security. And I was like, I don't think that's a common scam. So I stepped outside and I called the number back. The first sentence that came out of his mouth was, hi, is this Quinn? And I said, yes. And he said, I'm calling regarding a gentleman by the name of Billy.

A few of my friends came outside with me because you could see through the window where we were watching movies that I had like buckled over. And I stayed pretty calm and collected, but I just, I felt really weak for a second. My stomach kind of dropped and I said, okay, what's going on with Billy? And he said, I have a feeling you already know. And I said, probably, but could you just confirm my suspicions?

He said Billy was arrested about a month ago, the beginning of September, for receipt of child pornography and for the intent to meet up with a minor for sexual interaction. It's like everything around me went silent. It was one of the most...

The Homeland Security agent asked Quinn if she would be willing to meet with a local agent to be interviewed about her interactions with Billy. And so I said yes.

And that local agent told me there are only males at this office. So if you'd like to bring a female companion just to make the experience more comfortable, we totally understand. But we also want to explain that this is going to be very difficult information for you to share. And if you're not comfortable doing it, that's okay too. You can tell us to stop at any moment. It was incredibly emotional because in that moment, I kind of realized that

the reality of my situation and the fact that I was going to be re-victimized, even though I never even realized I was victimized to begin with because I had been groomed for so long. When I got that phone call at my friend's house, one of the reasons that I buckled over was because I realized there was no way I could keep this secret from my family anymore.

I had buried it for so long and it had been pushed so far back into my brain that there was no reason for me to share until now or until that moment when I got called by the DHS. And so my friends are all standing outside and I hang up with the special agent and

And I look at two of my closest friends and I say, I have to call my mom and moms. It's like they always know the first question she asked was, are you okay? And that's when I lost it. I just started sobbing and I said, no, it's about Billy. He's been arrested for receipt of child pornography. And she started crying and she said, please don't tell me that they called you because you're one of his victims.

I just stayed silent. It was completely silent on the phone for a minute. And I said, I'm so sorry I didn't tell you sooner. She stayed quiet for a minute and she said, that's not what matters. I love you. And I'm going to support you no matter what you choose to do. If you want to go in for the interrogation, then you do it. If you'd rather not speak on the matter, then don't. But whenever you're ready, I want to talk about it as a family.

And so I brought my roommate with me to this interrogation at the local Department of Homeland Security's office in my town. We sat down in this little room with three or four cameras recording me with two male agents and me and my female roommate. They held up a picture of me.

at the ripe age of 14 or 15 on Skype. It was a screenshot that I didn't even know Billy had taken. And they said, can you tell us who this is? And I said, that's me. That's Quinn. And they said, okay, thank you. And set that down. And then they held up Billy's mugshot and said, can you tell us who this is? And I said, that's Billy. That's the guy I dated for almost five years online and never met in person.

The entire interrogation was mostly asking about the nature of our relationship and whether or not there were aspects that I felt like crossed a line. After that interrogation, I never really heard anything else about it. I got an update from the DHS agent that was working directly on the case in the state that Billy was in that Billy had pled guilty to his charges.

He had been arrested in September of 2020 because he had been in contact with an underage girl who was 14. Her dad happened upon explicit text messages just like mine, but he was in level of authority where he could contact the NCIS, and they were overseas.

And so NCIS contacted DHS and they set up a sting where one of the DHS agents that was a part of the case pretended to be an underage girl, spoke with Billy for a couple of weeks and then decided to meet up with him. And he took an Uber somewhere, like a house that didn't actually exist. And that's when he was arrested. Quinn then had to wait five months before hearing another status update on Billy's case.

In April of 2021, I got an email from the prosecuting attorney in Billy's case, letting me know that if I'd like, I could receive restitution for the therapy that I went through during mine and Billy's relationship. And that DHS would offer free counseling services and sexual abuse counseling for me since I was a victim.

I ended up submitting documentation for restitution. And then a few weeks later in May was when I was on a conference call with the DHS agent I had been in contact with in October and the prosecuting attorney. They informed me that I could speak at Billy's trial. I could share my victim impact statement at his trial if I wanted to.

I asked them if I could take a minute and think about it and then get back with them and they said sure. Luckily, I was at home with my parents that week. And so I ran out into the living room and I told my mom about it and she was like, "I'm gonna say the same thing I said about the interrogation. Whatever you want to do, we're gonna support you. We're gonna talk through it and we'll get through it together." I was like, "Okay." I started thinking more about it and I texted the DHS agent and I said,

What's the benefit of me sharing my victim impact statement at a case like this? I feel like these child exploitation cases happen so often. So what's the benefit?

they did another conference call it was between the dhs agent and the prosecuting attorney and they explained that it's very rare that victims would ever even be willing to see the face of their perpetrator and when someone with so much strength decides to come and speak at these sentencing hearings the judge is more likely to sentence the perpetrator to a more just and fair sentencing

So I said, what's that max sentencing for him? And they said, he's looking at an upwards of 17 years. So we're hoping to get as close to that as possible. And that me sharing my victim impact statement, even if I didn't read it in person, could potentially affect his sentencing. That's when I immediately said yes.

I said, if there's any possibility that I could add a year or two years, five years to his sentencing just by sharing my story, I am more than happy to do so to prevent him from victimizing other people. My parents decided they were going to fly out with me to the state that the sentencing was being held in. And I saw Billy for the first time in person ever in July of 2021.

There was a lot of crying. And the first time I've ever seen a man that I wasted five years of my adolescent life on was him in an orange jumpsuit shackled on his feet and shackled on his ankles. It felt like something out of a movie. And he was crying. And my parents were crying. And it was just me, my parents, Billy, his mom,

his attorney, the prosecuting attorney, and the recorder, and the DHS agents that were involved in the sting.

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The following are excerpts from Quinn's witness impact statement. I don't really know if we know what we want at that point.

The behind closed doors aspect of our relationship lasted almost the entire five year duration of my knowing and being in contact with Billy. There were times when the thought of hiding our relationship from my parents crumbled me. But anytime I would mention to Billy that I might tell my parents, he advised me to do otherwise. Anytime that I pointed out our age difference wasn't appropriate, he told me, when you get older, the age difference won't matter anymore.

As months went by of nightly Skype calls and daily texting, Billy began to slither his way into my every waking experience. I remember this so vividly because it was the first of many times that Billy manipulated me into partaking in sexual acts that went against every moral standing I had and against every ounce of comfort I felt.

When things escalated to the point of him wanting me to actually perform certain acts on camera, he would send me pornographic videos to guide me to do things correctly so it would quote-unquote be more enjoyable for me. No matter how many times I voiced to him my discomfort, no matter how many times I cried, no matter how many times I immediately ended the Skype call, he never seemed to fully understand the emotional toll it took on me. He'd give a short apology and jump right back to begging for more a couple of days later.

Billy also had a way of convincing me no one else in my life besides him could be trusted. Every friend I had going into my freshman year of high school had been pushed away by the end of my sophomore year. I never attended school dances or proms because he had told me he wanted to be the one to dance with me and pick me up in a fancy car. He didn't enjoy the idea of me going to social events or football games because he, quote, trusted me but didn't trust other guys, end quote.

For a long time in my adulthood, I thought that the detriment to all of my personal relationships was rooted in typical teenage angst. I may have that was a slight factor, but when I fully reflect on Billy's actions and the dynamic fire relationship, I realized that a lot of the tension came from the emotional and mental abuse I experienced from him. I viewed men in general as disgusting and repulsive. I feared them.

For several years after mine and Billy's relationship, my interactions with men were, for lack of a better term, fully transactional. Up until recently when I entered a healthy and enduring relationship, I felt as though my body and sex were things that I owed to men. I did not conceptualize relationships as consensual partnerships involving teamwork and communication, but rather a means to an end with no fulfillment to follow. Billy messaged my father several days after I ended my relationship with him,

I can't remember what the entire message said, and I wish there were a way for me to find it, but I do remember the first line. "'Fuck you, and fuck your entire family.'"

Regardless of Billy's ill-willed message, the moment our relationship ended, it's as if a light switch turned back on. My relationships with my parents mended overnight. My relationships with my friends continued to grow and flourish. I attended the last ever prom available to our graduating class. I went off to college, and I moved on with my life as if he never existed.

There were times I reached out to Billy, and one of those times was when I realized he had been grooming me for the entire five years I knew him. And when I messaged him to tell him that, he tried to twist the situation and tell me I was mistaken. I decided to leave it alone and in the past. And it has remained in the past until this year when I got a call from the Department of Homeland Security. All of the memories came rushing back.

Old wounds were open and new truths were spoken into existence amongst my family about what really happened between Billy and I all those years ago. And it seems to fit the gambit for other victims of cases like these. Although I am lucky enough to say I have taken this experience as an opportunity for growth and reflection, I know there are many others who can never claim the same. I have continued to battle with my body image,

bouts of anxiety. I was placed on anxiety medication soon after our contact officially ended. I've struggled to maintain relationships with men. I've struggled to maintain fulfilling past service level relationships with people in general. And a lot of that, I believe, relates to the basis of mine and Billie's relationship. I wish I could speak to the 14-year-old me who knew nothing about the dynamics of a relationship and tell her just how much she can and will accomplish without it.

I wish I could tell her that trusting the wrong people will only dim her light temporarily. I wish I could tell her that the people who say, I am here for you no matter what comes your way, are the ones who will be her foundation. And the ones who say, I am here for you because you need me, are the ones who will try to shatter that foundation. I'm just lucky that the people who built my foundation are still here with open arms and that I am safe, happy, and strong. Thank you so much. That was absolutely beautiful.

You are so incredibly strong and brave and resilient and powerful. Wow. Just hearing you read that was so incredibly moving. Thank you. What did it feel like after you read your victim impact statement? It felt liberating.

It felt like a huge weight was lifted off of my shoulders. And luckily, I had given my victim impact statement to my parents to read beforehand because there was a lot of detail in that statement that I had never shared with my parents. I mean, I had given them the general details of the fact that I was a victim of his actions, but I had never really explained what exactly happened. So having them read that prior to me reading it aloud was probably a really strong move.

But it felt liberating. It felt like every single secret I had kept to myself and buried deep down was finally out in the open. After Quinn read her statement, she stepped out of court while Billy's attorney was allowed to retort. So I stepped out because I felt like that would negate any closure that I had. And then I came back in for Billy's apology, which was...

super half-assed and incredibly disappointing to listen to. But my hope was that speaking there not only helped with giving him a fair sentencing, but also made him kind of realize the concrete effects his actions have had on an individual.

He's hid behind computer screens for 15 years now. He's 30 years old now, and he was victimizing a 14-year-old when he was arrested. And that's absolutely disgusting. I wanted him to understand that his actions don't stop reaching just at the little chat box he's typing in. They reach so much further and deeper.

After he gave his apology, the judge stood up and she said, I'm going to explain the process of me determining the sentence, but first off, I want to address Quinn. She said, you are a lioness and it takes more strength than I could ever have to speak in front of a perpetrator I have never met. And she looked over at Billy and said, this is a direct result of

of your actions and all of the victims that you have affected will never be able to just set your actions aside. And he cried a lot harder. And that's when she explained that he had victimized 48 other children, boys and girls. And mine was just one of the more extensive cases. It was one of the longer lasting, I guess, relationships that he had. And so I

They had a lot more information on me than they did a lot of the other victims. When they had arrested him, they had found thousands and thousands of files pertaining to children. And a lot of those were mine. And then she sentenced him to 14 and a half years with lifetime registry as a sex offender and lifetime surveillance of all electronic devices. I'm so incredibly sorry that you went through this.

What do you hope others will gain from hearing your story? For me, it's about prevention. I hope that people take this story and they understand how vulnerable children are and how terrifyingly dangerous the internet is. It's just this deep, dark void.

And so for me, it's about protecting your children and ensuring that they don't experience something like this because it's so easy for it to happen. These types of people are all over the internet and children fall so easily victim to things like this.

Absolutely. And it's one of the reasons I'm so incredibly thankful to you for sharing this story, because I think it's so important for everyone to hear how insidiously these things can start even on something like a game and a chat feature. Something that parents might think or kids might think is a totally safe environment for them to interact with others.

What do you think your parents, in hindsight, did right to support you? Oh man, so many things. I know they hold a lot of blame for this entire situation, but I wish they wouldn't.

My parents' life motto has always been, we want you to figure things out for yourself. And they let me do just that. And they have cultivated this incredibly open and loving environment in our home.

My brothers and I and my parents were all so tight-knit and we communicate so well and we're so open with our problems. And I think that was harder for me to see and appreciate as a young angsty teen who is experiencing sexual trauma. I think when anyone's experiencing trauma, they shut out the good in their lives. Or at least I did.

And so my parents, no matter how difficult the hardship is, have always kept their arms open and their minds as far from judgment as possible. And I could not ask for a better support system from them. I love that so much for you that you had that support of them. And I also wanted to ask you about any red flags in hindsight that you think about now

One of the number one red flags was that when Billy and I first started dating officially, or whenever he asked me to be his girlfriend, he would constantly say this sentence that was, and I read this out loud in my victim impact statement and the judge laughed, but he would say, I'm so glad that you have me and you don't have to endure one of those bullshit, unhealthy high school relationships.

And it always sounded so weird to me, but we were teenagers. We were trying to figure shit out. We were trying to understand the world around us. And so I think those high school relationships, not dating someone who's six and a half, seven years older than you, I think those high school relationships help us figure out ourselves. I don't know where it came from, but it was always that manipulative language of, God, you're so lucky you have me. And I really started to believe it.

Also, he would get absolutely furious if I wanted to go to like a high school homecoming game or just a football game in general. If I was doing something other than my actual extracurricular commitments, he would get very angry. If it were social life activities, he would get very upset.

So homecoming games, spring dances or prom or like Sadie's Hawkins, we called it formal. He would get really mad if I tried to go to those and he would get mad if I tried to change anything about my appearance. So like if I thought about dying my hair or cutting my hair shorter, he would get really upset. Those were three major red flags.

I saw a quote the other day that has kind of resonated with me, and I think this applies to many people, not just victims of sexual violence or sexual assault. Trauma is an injury, and injuries are typically not our fault, but we do have the capability to heal. And I think that's the journey that I'm on right now.

I've had a lot of trouble realizing that the trauma I've gone through is not my fault because I was such an impressionable young child. And no matter what age you are, when you experience trauma, it's difficult not to blame yourself for being gullible or vulnerable or open to people. But it's not our fault.

Thank you so, so much for your time and your energy and your bravery in sharing your story with us. Thank you so much for having me, Tiffany. I really appreciate it. It's been awesome being able to share my story.

If you're a victim of sexual violence and are in need of support, please reach out for help. The U.S. National Sexual Assault Hotline is free and confidential 24-7 at 1-800-656-4673. Another great resource for victims of online child sex abuse and exploitation is the non-profit organization SOSA, Safe from Online Sex Abuse.

SOSA offers free resources such as webinars, workshops, and school presentations. And SOSA provides compassion-led education to young people as well as their caretakers and other responsible adults to help the community stay proactive when it comes to the safety of minors.

In addition to working with law enforcement and technology experts to help consumer internet brands recognize and respond in real time to harmful and hateful content on their platforms. For more information or to support SOSA's efforts, please visit sosatogether.org. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time, stay safe, friends.

Something Was Wrong is an Audiochuck production, created and hosted by Tiffany Reese. Our theme song was originally composed by Gladrags, covered this season by Kenna and the Kings. So what do you think, Chuck? Do you approve?

If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.

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To the infamous scams of Real Housewives stars like Teresa Giudice, what should have proven to be a major downfall only seemed to solidify her place in the Real Housewives Hall of Fame. Follow Scamfluencers on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to Scamfluencers early and ad-free right now on Wondery+.