We're sunsetting PodQuest on 2025-07-28. Thank you for your support!
Export Podcast Subscriptions
cover of episode Nathalie Tocci on the birth of a new Europe, and what it means for Australian security

Nathalie Tocci on the birth of a new Europe, and what it means for Australian security

2025/5/23
logo of podcast Stop the World

Stop the World
AI Deep Dive AI Chapters Transcript
People
N
Nathalie Tocci
Topics
Nathalie Tocci: 我认为当前西方国家，包括欧洲、美国和澳大利亚，正面临着前所未有的安全挑战。俄罗斯对乌克兰的入侵以及美国可能减少对欧洲安全事务的参与，促使欧洲国家更加重视自身的防务能力。欧盟正在积极寻求与志同道合的国家建立更紧密的安全伙伴关系，以共同应对这些挑战。这种合作不仅包括军事层面的互助，更重要的是在政治和价值观上的相互支持。我认为澳大利亚与欧洲加强安全合作，符合双方的共同利益，有助于构建一个更加稳定和安全的世界秩序。我们不能将欧洲与印太地区的安全问题割裂开来，因为这两个地区的安全局势是相互关联的。中国和俄罗斯之间的紧密关系就是一个例证，它们之间的合作对全球安全格局产生了重大影响。因此，欧洲和澳大利亚需要加强合作，共同应对来自这两个地区的挑战。

Deep Dive

Chapters
This chapter explores the proposal of a security partnership between Europe and Australia, analyzing its significance, potential merits, and potential drawbacks. The discussion includes the EU's SAFE instrument and the interconnectedness of European and Indo-Pacific security.
  • The EU's proposal for a security partnership with Australia signifies a broader trend of Western nations seeking closer economic, political, and security cooperation.
  • The initiative is driven by Russia's invasion of Ukraine and concerns about potential US disengagement from European security.
  • The EU's SAFE instrument aims to increase security and defense capacities through joint military projects with participating countries.
  • The interconnectedness of European and Indo-Pacific security is highlighted, emphasizing that these issues cannot be disentangled.

Shownotes Transcript

European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen this week initiated a conversation about a security partnership with Australia. Prime Minister Anthony Albanese responded with a ‘maybe, sort of’.

To talk about this development and much more, we have Nathalie Tocci, director of the Istituto Affari Internazionali, former adviser to two EU presidents and one of the world’s top experts on European foreign and strategic policy. Nathalie gives her thoughts on the link between European and Indo-Pacific security, the China-Russia relationship, the centrality of Ukraine to European security, and the best and worst possibilities for US support to Ukraine under Donald Trump.

Nathalie also outlines her (very useful) theory about ‘thick’ and ‘thin’ norms as foundations for international cooperation, and expands on a wonderful line she wrote recently in the Guardian about what it would take for Europe to pull itself together security-wise.