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cover of episode The Origins of “Braiding Sweetgrass”

The Origins of “Braiding Sweetgrass”

2023/8/25
logo of podcast The New Yorker Radio Hour

The New Yorker Radio Hour

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Parul Sehgal
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Robin Wall Kimmerer
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Parul Sehgal: 本期节目采访了《编织甜草》的作者罗宾·沃尔·基默尔,探讨了这本书的起源、影响以及她对环境和人与自然关系的思考。基默尔是一位植物学家,也是一位土著美国人,她的作品试图弥合西方科学和土著知识之间的差距,并引发了广泛的共鸣,在《纽约时报》畅销书榜上停留三年多,销售超过百万册。她获得麦克阿瑟奖学金,也体现了其作品的价值和影响力。节目中,塞格尔还采访了基默尔,探讨了这本书的起源、写作过程以及她对环境和人与自然关系的思考。 Parul Sehgal: 基默尔的写作风格独特,她将科学与价值观相结合,试图让人们重新爱上土地,并理解自然界的馈赠。她认为,许多环保运动都基于恐惧,而她想让人们重新爱上土地,因为缺乏对土地的爱是导致目前环境问题的根源。她希望通过讲述故事,让人们将世界视为馈赠,从而激发感恩和互惠。 Parul Sehgal: 基默尔在事业稳定后,开始用自己的声音写作,创作自己想创作的作品,而不是机构要求的作品。她在写作《编织甜草》时,目标读者有两个群体:一个是科学同行,另一个是她的土著社区,她希望能够尊重和准确地表达土著的知识。她希望在写作中,能够代表自然,并激发读者对自然界的同情、怜悯和尊重。 Parul Sehgal: 基默尔将母性作为一种工具,来表达人与土地之间可以拥有的亲密关系,即被土地滋养,并反过来滋养土地。她认为,学习和使用土著语言,对她来说是一种疗愈的过程,也是对殖民主义造成的创伤的抵抗。 Parul Sehgal: 基默尔的家族史反映了美国印第安人政策的历史,她的祖先曾三次被迫迁移,这使得她重拾并传承这些知识显得尤为重要,因为它们差点就消失了。 Robin Wall Kimmerer: 我想让人们重新爱上这片土地,因为我认为这就是我们现在所处境地的原因——我们对土地的爱还不够。我们把周围的一切都称为自然资源、生态系统服务,或者商品,而从我的角度来看,所有这些都是礼物。当我意识到大多数人并不理解世界是礼物时,我便给自己定下了这个目标:看看我们能否通过讲述故事来帮助人们将世界视为礼物。感恩和互惠之情由此产生。 Robin Wall Kimmerer: 我在事业稳定后,开始用自己的声音写作,创作自己想创作的作品,而不是机构要求的作品。我在写作《编织甜草》时,目标读者有两个群体:一个是科学同行,另一个是我的土著社区,我希望能够尊重和准确地表达土著的知识。我希望在写作中,能够代表自然,并激发读者对自然界的同情、怜悯和尊重。 Robin Wall Kimmerer: 我将母性作为一种工具,来表达人与土地之间可以拥有的亲密关系,即被土地滋养,并反过来滋养土地。学习和使用土著语言,对我来说是一种疗愈的过程,也是对殖民主义造成的创伤的抵抗。我的家族史反映了美国印第安人政策的历史,我的祖先曾三次被迫迁移,这使得我重拾并传承这些知识显得尤为重要,因为它们差点就消失了。 Robin Wall Kimmerer: 这本书的成功,是因为人们互相推荐,这让我感到乐观,并认为这本书是一种邀请,邀请人们进行互惠,贡献自己的天赋。人们对这本书的泪流满面的反应,表明人们渴望与地球建立联系。我现在关注的是如何通过写作,让人们与自然的生命个体建立联系,激发生态同情心,从而避免环境灾难。

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Robin Wall Kimmerer, a botanist and member of the Citizen Potawatomi Nation, wrote 'Braiding Sweetgrass' to bridge Western science with Indigenous teachings, resulting in a best-selling book that has impacted readers deeply.

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Robin Wall Kimmerer is an unlikely literary star. A botanist by training—a specialist in moss—she spent much of her career at the State University of New York’s College of Environmental Science and Forestry. But, when she was well established in her academic work, having “done the things you need to do to get tenure,” she launched into a different kind of writing; her new style sought to bridge the divide between Western science and Indigenous teachings she had learned, as a member of the Citizen Potawatomi Nation, about the connections between people, the land, plants, and animals. The result was “Braiding Sweetgrass),” a series of essays about the natural world and our relationship to it. The book was published by Milkweed Editions, a small literary press, and it grew only by word of mouth. Several years later, it landed on the Times best-seller list, and has remained there for more than three years; fans have described reading the essays as a spiritual experience. Kimmerer herself was recently recognized with a MacArthur Fellowship. Parul Sehgal), who writes about literature for The New Yorker, went to visit Kimmerer on the land she writes about so movingly, to talk about the book’s origin and its impact on its tenth anniversary. “I wanted to see what would happen if you imbue science with values,” Kimmerer told her. She is an environmentalist, but not an activist per se; her ambition for her work is actually larger. “So much of the environmental movement to me is grounded in fear,” she explains. “And we have a lot to be afraid about—let’s not ignore that—but what I really wanted to do was to help people really love the land again. Because I think that’s why we are where we are: that we haven’t loved the land enough.”