You Won't Win With Money If You're Not Aligned With A Plan
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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I am Rachel Cruz hosting this hour with my good friend and best-selling author, Jade Warshaw, and we are here to answer your questions. So give us a call at 888-825-5225, and we'll be talking about your life, your money, relationships, career, anything and everything.

All right, first up, starting us off, we have Joseph in Boston. Hey, Joseph, welcome to the show. Thank you so much. Thanks for taking my call. Absolutely. How can we help? Well, so my wife and I, future Baby Step Millionaires, started on these about a couple months ago. And we also had our first daughter about five months ago. Congratulations. Congratulations.

Thank you so much. Thanks be to God. It was waiting quite a while. So my question is, I kind of came to a revelation in the discussion with my sister the other day about how

All of us siblings are kind of not very good with money, haven't been historically just disciplined with money. And it's weird because we both had very frugal TPA, CFO parents. And so it kind of tells me that just being good with money

isn't enough to kind of impart that. I love my parents. I'm not blaming them for everything. But just something about our childhood, we just didn't get that knowledge kind of instilled enough in that discipline and that prudence with money. And I'm just kind of wondering, I kind of want to break the cycle and what's the best way when my daughter becomes of age, like how to kind of teach her that without being too strict.

Sure, sure. You know, I think you bring up such a good point because a lot of people assume that if you're like – I'm assuming they're both savers, probably very frugal people. Is that right? Your parents? Yeah, they were frugal. We weren't spoiled. We just never really –

suffered i guess we were a very comfortable very comfortable childhood okay and they were already if we asked them about something and especially this is true later in life asking for financial advice they're really open about it but just there was never a really concerted effort to like teach us at like at the time when we were most i guess a little spongy impressionable yeah sure

And do you feel like they missed the mark from the tactical side is what you're saying on how to like budget and that kind of thing? Or do you think the spirit around money? Because what I was hearing you kind of say is as CPAs and as people that are good with money, sometimes those people can lean on the end of being so frugal to the point where there's like not a level of hoarding, but they hold their money so closely that they almost can't enjoy it. And if you don't have this,

well-rounded spirit with money, it can kind of cut you. You know what I mean? You go the opposite direction. You want to go the opposite direction. They weren't like that either. I think it was a communication issue. They didn't seem to be frugal. I mean, they were smart with money. They seemed to handle money really well. And they weren't hoarding anything. We asked them for something. They paid for college tuition.

But we just, I guess there was just never a lack of communication about money. Well, let me ask you this. What areas specifically do you feel like you were missing? And what are those areas that you want to pass along? Was it, like Rachel said, was it budgeting specifically? Was it the dangers of debt? What was it that you feel like, man, if only I'd known that, that would have really, really helped me. And that's the thing that I want to make sure I hone in on. I would say, I guess, yeah, I mean, maybe the budget.

I don't know. It's kind of a little bit of everything, but I guess... Okay. Yeah, the dangers of death is huge, but kind of just, I guess...

being disciplined, like, yeah, just being willing your money to go somewhere. Like the best advice I got from my mom was when I was in college and she'd say when I embarrassingly ask her for more money. And that was another thing too. She gave me money when I asked for it in college. Well, I think, I think the best thing you can do, I mean, I'm, I'll speak to it from one area. I'm sure Rachel will speak to it from another. So my kids are young five and seven. And right now the most important thing that I can teach them is like the value of a dollar, right? They're that,

money comes from hard work and there's a value on that. And the value is not unlimited. The value is to the extent at which you work, right? So that's the most important thing I can teach them right now. If you work hard, you get money. The more you work, the more money you get, but it's not infinite. You go to the store, there's a price tag, right? So I'm teaching them that, hey,

One thing really equates to the other. And what comes along with that is they realize, oh, gosh, I got five dollars from doing this work. And the thing I want might cost seven dollars. So now I have to now wait. So there's the delayed gratification that I'm teaching them. So I feel like at a younger age, those are things that they can pick up on. And truly, I do feel like that's one of those things that you do have to teach. It doesn't really just pop up.

In conversation, you have to teach them that. And you can do that through chores and through commission and that sort of thing. And then as they get older, yeah, there's other principles like budgeting that you start to teach. And then as they get older, then you start teaching them about debt. And honestly, my son has already kind of asked me about debt and like, what does it mean? And yeah, you can start to say it means you borrow money from someone and you have to give it back to them within a certain period of time. And this is the way it makes you feel. So all of that, I think...

obviously they do learn by watching you, but there is a deeper level that when you can explain things further, they're going to understand it on a deeper level. Yeah. And I think, you know, there's in my head to these like layers of money and what it represents, because even on this show, I feel like the calls we get, it can be so layered. So like at one end, I want my kids to know, and I feel like my parents did this well from a

how they actually handled their money and also what they communicated is like, and we were people of faith. And so there was like this like very, very high level that everything we have is not ours and we are managing it for a greater good. And that's God in our faith walk.

And so there's almost this way of having money be something that is bigger than them, because we live in a world where it's so about me. I use my money for me, me, me, me, me, me, me. And there's something, a higher calling almost in this. And so that's a very high level, right? That's the very top overarching. And there's a spirit to that. And there's a way we make decisions as a family. There's a way we talk about money, the way we view money.

And it's coming through that lens. So that's a pretty like high level view. And then there's kind of that next layer, which is what Jade was talking about, like delayed gratification. You know, I would put contentment in there. I would put gratitude in there. It's almost those emotions.

around money. And there's fear around money. There's greed around money, right? There's a lot of these ties to who we are as people and how we view money from our emotional standpoint that plays a really big part in this. And that kind of plays into that more tactical layer, which is that bottom layer of how it actually looks like us handling it day to day. How do we earn it, right? Just like Jade was saying, we earn it through work.

and teaching them that. We give money, we save money, we spend money. We do all three of those things as well-rounded people. We need to do all three. We don't want to spend everything we make because then we'll end up spending more money and money that we don't have and we go into debt because of that. So we only spend what we have. We're always being generous and we're always giving. We're always saving for something. We need that delayed gratification. And that even gets down to, as they get older, saving is talking about high yield account, high market accounts

and high-yield savings accounts and mutual funds and investing. And, you know, you get into like the really tacticals and that's very age appropriate. But I don't know if that helps, Joseph, but I kind of see those three layers for me is something that I think about with my kids because money is complex. I'm like, it's not just the dollars and cents or we wouldn't have an interesting show here. That's right. It is. There's a lot to it. And a lot to it is because it's us, the people that are actually handling it in our character.

So those are kind of the, I don't know, those are just my thoughts. I don't know if that helps Joseph at all. Because it sounds like from what you were saying, your parents did a pretty good job there. I mean, everything you said didn't have any red flags. But maybe there's kind of these deeper meanings that you were wishing you had more thought about earlier in your life that maybe helps then play into the tactical side. So I don't know if that helps. I love that you're asking the question because I think it is an important topic to model for our kids and teach our kids.

Statistics show that half of Americans don't have enough life insurance, or they don't have any at all. I don't understand this, John. Why don't people want to take care of their family? They think they're going to die or something? Well, I used to be one of those guys. I didn't even think about it. And one of my buddies said, hey, the only reason to not have life insurance is if you hate your wife and kids.

And I immediately went and got term life insurance. That's a gut punch. Oh, you're telling me. And for decades, Dave, I've sat across people who've lost a spouse. They've lost somebody important to them. Me too. And they don't know what to do next. Me too. I mean, you're going to have a crisis here. And, you know, you got two options while you're sitting and talking to a young widow. She's concerned about how she's going to invest all this money properly and not mess this up. Or she's concerned how she's going to eat tomorrow.

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Up next, we have John in Tampa, Florida. Hi, John. Welcome to the show. Hey, how are you? We're doing great. How can we help?

So I just had a question regarding debt and how I should go about it. I'm currently, me and my wife are currently $310,000 in total debt. $180,000 of that is in our home. So we do have some equity in there. So my question was, should I, or should we entertain the idea of selling the home to pay off all of our debt? I understand there's probably going to be a few thousand left.

We do have a little savings that we could use to tackle the rest of that and then start from scratch. Or should I keep the home and then just slowly start knocking off about one hundred and thirty thousand that we have besides the mortgage? What are your incomes? Household pre-tax, probably about one twenty. One thirty. OK. And can you go can you kind of list through the different types of debt that the one thirty consists of?

Yeah, so there's a HELOC, and that's about $49. There's some private loan and credit card for $28. I have student loans for $24. And then we have two car notes, each about $15 left. And then just some furniture. That's about $3. Okay. Okay.

How do you feel about the house? I would not look at this and go, immediately we're selling our house. I kind of feel like that's a last ditch effort, unless there was some other reason around this. Maybe if you were thinking about moving anyway, or this was something that was coming up kind of naturally, I might consider it. But in this case...

You know, you're in debt to the tune of how much you earn, which is sadly very normal. I think we come across that a lot. So in this case, I'd be thinking, okay, how quickly do we want to get this done? And what's our plan to do that? How are we going to increase our income for us to make this happen? Right?

Yeah, 100%. So the cars, I'm looking at them. I'm guessing that you're probably going to keep them. You can tell me more about them. You can tell me what they're worth and what you owe them. Yeah, so I drive a 23 Elantra. I probably have, if I could sell it right now, probably 18. So I'm positive on the upside on that, about 3K, I'd say. Okay. And my wife has an SUV. Okay.

She had a good down payment on it. So I'm sure she's also on the upside on the equity. Do you have kids? So that's one of the main reasons why I'm just rethinking everything. We do have a baby girl on the way, which is super exciting. Okay. Okay. That's great. Yeah. I mean, it's great that you're right side up on these. You could consider downsizing them. I don't know that I would. What are the payments on both of them?

$400 for the SUV and then $415 for my sedan. Wow, it is a lot in payments. I mean, it's $800 a month there. I just don't know. I mean, maybe you keep one and do the other. That's a beater. You could consider that. Go ahead. Do y'all have any money saved, John, put away? Yeah, I'd say probably about like $10,000, $15,000. Okay. Well, there's some money there. You can drop that down. Yeah.

You know what? Because the baby's on the way, we always say to kind of go in the stork mode, meaning I love that you're thinking about it and that this kind of was the motivator behind being like, we got to get our crap together because we're about to raise a human. But we always say when you are expecting, just actually pause paying off debt, but with the same intensity, be saving. So the goal would be to have a pile of money. And then when baby comes, which I guess you guys would be due, what, February? Yeah.

October, actually. Oh, so soon. Oh, I'm sorry. I thought you guys just found out. No, it's been a couple months. Oh, gotcha. So just between now and October, just stash some money away. But create a plan as if you are paying off debt. And then once mom and baby are home and everyone's good and healthy, then take what you had saved and throw it at the debt. But what I'm seeing here, and it would be up to you guys, John, because as you guys kind of work through and kind of figure out –

you and your wife will sit down and just say, okay, how much extra money could we earn? What could we cut out of the budget? We earn 120, that's pre-tax. So what we actually bring home is around probably 100. And what if we tried to live on 75 and we threw 35 this year and we made extra? You guys can sit there and kind of formulate, make up different scenarios of how you can get out of this debt faster. And then whenever you do that,

I think it's always interesting. Cars is like the number one place where you can sell and get ahead. So I would see, okay, how many hours extra will I have to be working or how much longer will we have to cut lifestyle in order to keep this $30,000 of debt versus you guys possibly selling this, you know, selling both cars. I'm just saying as an example, you can, you have three, you know, around 3000 each, you have 15,000 saves. So what if you threw, um,

you know, an extra three at each and you went and got a six, $7,000 car each, then that takes $30,000, John, off the table of debt and frees up to Jade's point, almost $850 a month extra now to continue to pay off debt that much faster. So it's kind of just a trade-off of time, energy, money. But whenever I see the cars, you know,

It's always where I go where I'm like, man, you can just jump so far and get out of debt that much faster with these assets. There's also the other conversation that I think of whenever somebody calls and the wife's having a baby and that's kind of sparking things. Do you think that she's going to want to stay home? Is that what you're...

I mean, obviously the end goal looking down the next few years, the plan will be for her to stay home. Okay. If it's possible. For now, I think in the, maybe a couple of months,

after uh baby's here yeah we have a good support system here where we are with our parents being around and siblings and whatnot so uh we've got plenty of help there okay so yeah that's when you mention the house my my brain always goes to that because a lot of times a couple will go buy a house based on the two of their incomes and it's like okay this is great it's 25 of our salary then suddenly one of those salaries dips and it's like oh crap this mortgage is suddenly very expensive

So that's kind of the equation that I am looking at is that if that's what you foresee happening, then maybe what you were talking about comes back on the table. But I don't know. I'd have to know more about your mortgage and what you guys' plans are. But that's something you do need to be thinking about and talking about. Because we would say here that once that mortgage creeps up above 25% of your take home, that's when you're really going to start to feel it. Especially when it's greater than 30, you're really going to start to feel it.

So that's just something to keep in mind as you guys plan going forward. And out of the $120,000, how much is hers? It fluctuates a lot. I'd say maybe like $50,000, $60,000. Okay, so it's almost half of it. And how much is the mortgage payment a month? Mortgage is actually very good, $14,000, $15,000. Okay. And you guys bring home what a month? Maybe around...

eight nine yeah so you're good now but you're good now hey by the way I could just tell by the way you were searching for those numbers before you get off we're going to make sure you have every dollar so that you can plan for every dollar yeah no because the budget is coming in yeah the budget really will help you guys John I mean honestly do a really really detailed budget and start cutting stuff

Because when you're living, when your dinks making 120, you don't realize the lifestyle creep that really does occur. And as you go through and see exactly where is my money going? Mel Robbins actually had a video about this on Instagram. She was like, I remember printing out my entire bank statement. I was highlighting all the crap that I thought that I didn't need. And she was like, and I might, that was full of like a highlighter. Like, what could I cut? What do I need to cut?

So it's that kind of mentality, John, from an expense standpoint that you guys really can. I mean, and honestly, what's great, and I always get encouraged when you are motivated to do this. I mean, for you guys, you know, it's a 130. We'll just pretend $130,000 of debt. Pretend the cars are gone just for fun. That's $100,000. You guys are at $120,000. You're bringing home probably closer to $100,000, $90,000 to $100,000.

And if you earned extra, John, even a thousand bucks a month, you guys could be out of this in like two years. So it's really not great. It's not like you guys are going to be in this for seven to eight years, but you have to be really dedicated to do some really intense sacrifices from the lifestyle standpoint and earning some extra income. And for you, especially between now and October, it's

Because that's going to be the sweet spot. When the baby comes, it gets much harder. It does. And from all aspects to do this debt-free journey. But families do it all the time. People have babies during their payoff process. But you guys stock away a ton of cash. John, I would be working extra, doing what you can. And then map out a plan and write these debts out with your wife. Look at your budget and just say, how much extra can we throw at this debt? And how fast is it for us to get out? Because I think you guys can do this in two and two and a half years. Yeah. Yep. Very good.

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Really done very well from a numbers standpoint the last couple of years, and that's because you guys, and partly because you all have subscribed, you leave reviews and comments and all of that, and that always helps boost and get this show in front of other people that don't know about it, which we want because we want to help people when it comes to their money. So we're always grateful for that. So continue to subscribe and leave a review, share episodes with your friends,

with your friends and your family and continue to help spread the word about getting in control of your with your money and common sense in a world that doesn't have a lot of it these days so that's what we like all right let's go to nicholas in grand rapids hi nicholas welcome to the show

Hey, how you doing? Thanks so much for taking my call. Yeah, absolutely. Thanks for calling in. How can we help? My question is, I recently got married this last year, and I'm considering going back to school to finish my degree, but I'd like to keep working full-time while doing that. And I guess my question would be, what's the balance between working full-time and doing school full-time? So looking at like a 70- to 80-hour week, with balancing...

like kind of the new marriage and just not wanting to neglect those responsibilities. Okay. What are you going back? Like what's the end goal here? Um,

The end goal would be I have a four-year degree right now, and I can go back for one more year, and that would really help me with pursuing my degree. I'm trying to become a licensed architect, and so if I go back for one more year, I can significantly advance my degree. I can get licensed, and so it's important for me to go back, but I'd like to

I have a full-time job right now, and so that's also important to me. So I'd like to do both if it's feasible. And so there's sort of this crossroad between hustling now for kind of a more secure future and kind of getting a better-paying job. And it's just for a year? It's for one year? It's for one year. Yeah, you could do that. Two semesters. Yeah. What's your wife saying about it?

She's a little bit worried that I would be too busy. She's also studying architecture. She's just finished right now. And so I think she is sort of very in tune with how busy it can get in school. And so I think she's a little bit nervous that, you know, 70, 80 hours could turn into more. I mean, what's the worst that happens? You start the program, you realize...

I'm very busy, like too busy. And then you cut back on some of your work hours. Would that be possible? I believe it would be possible to cut back on work hours. I would probably just have to have a conversation with the boss. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the only reason I'm kind of okay with it, Nicholas, honestly, is because it's one year. I mean, if you were talking about doing something,

four years or five years or you wanted to, we get this call sometimes, I'm like, oh my God, where they just got married and they want to move states away from their spouse to start a job. Oh gosh, to work. Yeah, I mean like some really like long-term kind of bizarre decisions where I'm like, no, no, no, no. But this, Nicholas, has an end date so that always gives me hope. It's not like, hey, I'm taking on this extra schooling and I don't know, if I get this, I may have to do this. It's not like it's this never-ending black hole. There's a clear start and stop. So,

So you guys would just have to be on the same page of saying, hey, can we do this for a year? And I think, I mean, yeah, I think you can do anything for a year. Yeah, do it now while you're still just a couple before kids come involved and all these other things. How are you paying for it? Are you working your way through? Is that...

Yeah, that's sort of the idea. I mean, we have a little bit of savings. We're not really in debt. So the idea would be I would be able to pay for it just by continually working. That's sort of where that idea came from was don't go into debt by it. You just keep working and pay it as you go. Now, when you say that's the idea, I just want to know that that's actually the plan. You've really put thought around the numbers and everything. It sounds like you're kind of guessing at it.

No, we're pretty regimented with the budget we've been listening for a while. So we've got it pretty all mapped out. So the work in the 40 hours a week would be more than enough to pay it as we went. It's just sort of the...

Yeah, it's just the sacrifice of time. Yeah. I think it's worth it. Short-term sacrifice, long-term gain. That's the way we'd say it over here. Yeah, and it is. I mean, a year feels long, but it goes so fast, like so fast. So that's where I think – yeah, I don't know. And then, I don't know, in my head, too, I'm like, we talked to people that are deployed in the military, and they're gone for nine months. You know what I mean? Yeah.

people do this kind of thing. And, but yeah, on a new marriage, I think it's really wise that she needs to be bought in. I think she needs to maybe hear from you and,

Yeah.

I think the other option would be we save up for another year in order to afford going back to school while not working, which would basically just push the timeline back by half.

uh another year and you know ultimately a salary boost from getting licensed would get pushed back another year so um what is the salary getting pushed a year uh it would be probably 10 to 15 000 like just by finishing that's great yeah um does she have a preference on a or b yeah

I think she would like us to look more into doing it slower over time. I think I'm a little bit more adamant about getting it done. Because like you said, God willing, we could have a kid whenever. And so I feel like we have the time to spare now. It's just a matter of pulling the trigger and kind of using that time. I will say, I mean, when you first said it, I was more along the lines of, yeah, just do it.

Is it something you could feasibly do? I mean, working a full-time job and being in school full-time is no, like, that's not a cakewalk. Would you be able to meet the requirements fully of both?

I think so. I think I'm pretty confident in my own ability to do it. I just, I guess the question was more around the impact on my wife. You know, I think I can handle it, but I'm trying to step back from that and be like, okay, I can handle it. But I think you guys just put that. I don't think I can see. I think you guys put some guardrails in place. Right. And, and because here's the thing, if you start this program,

Let's say you get the first semester in and then you can you can you reevaluate after the first semester? And then if you do the first semester, you guys kind of have that check in. How do we think this is going? Can we do another one? And if everybody feels good, you green light forward. And if you guys have some. Yeah. And if she throws a red flag after the first semester, you need to listen to her, you know, because you're kind of if you choose a.

You're kind of choosing your way, which again, part of marriage is a little bit of that. Sometimes we just kind of give and take. I've really not. But you want to like, you know, but I think that that gives her give her a lot of weight. And after that first semester to throw a flag if she needs it. And you need to really, really, really listen to that. If she does is what I would say. I think that's a great point, Jade. Yeah. So, yeah. But I think for you guys, thank you. You guys have been married for how long?

We're coming up on one year on June 2nd. Okay, so still newlyweds. It is still very new. That's great. Yeah, so I think, you know, things, and it sounds so kind of tactical and like not romantic, but having things in the calendar...

Oh, yeah. Okay, let's map out. And on this Saturday, let's go. And we're gonna take a day trip here. We're gonna like, do some things that are earmarked throughout that year. So she knows and can feel like some relief in the schedule to have time with you. And plan those things ahead of time, right? It's not like this, like spontaneous for me. And it doesn't have to be every weeknight, Tuesday night, you know, you don't have to be that legalistic about it. But

But you guys be really intentional about the calendar. And I have found in marriage, I don't know if you guys do this, Jade, but on Sunday nights, Winston and I, we look through every single day of the week and we say out loud the schedule of like, okay, I need to leave for work. I had a media hit this morning at eight. So I have 730. So Winston, you got to take kids to school. We had to look ahead. Yeah. Like it's, you are literally mapping out very tactically throughout the week. And something about that brings a lot of peace where there's not a lot of mystery. Cause I think in a busy season, um,

which people experience a lot. These busy seasons, the kind of the unspoken things and the questions create stress and where you can eliminate the stress by having some really clear conversations and communications week to week, even down to dinner. So if like, I'm not going to be home Tuesday, Thursday nights. So like, you know, I mean like as tactical as you can get in busy seasons is always gives me a level of control and peace.

which just helps enjoy where you are in the moment too, because you want to be present. So it's a good question, Nicholas. I'm glad you called.

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Up next, we have Brandon in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. Hey, Brandon, welcome to the show. Hey, thanks for taking my call. For sure. Thanks for calling in. How can we help?

Well, I've run into a bit of a speed bump here as far as my wife. We did the baby steps. We were in over $200,000 in debt, knocked that out in a few years. And now it's time to put money away, 15% of my income into, you know, mutual funds and

And she's just wanting to park it in a high-yield savings account because she says she's scared to lose it. So I'm just kind of curious what's the best way to go about it. I've sat her down. I've said, hey, over the long term, this is going to run its course. We're going to become millionaires.

And it doesn't seem to stick. I've kind of run into a rut where we're just putting money into a high-yield savings account and 4% is good, but it's not 12%. Right. It sounds like two things or one of two things. A, something happened in the past and she or someone she knows lost money in the stock market, meaning they took money out when it was at its lowest point. Right.

Her dad? Yeah. Yes, ma'am. Okay. That's where it is. So that's where it's originating from. And then that lack of knowledge is continuing till today. So first off, I think what she's not understanding is that when her dad pulled that money out, he's the one, he locked in his losses when he pulled the money out. But had he have left it in, he would probably have tons. Yeah. What's the story with the dad? What happened? Yeah.

Well, I don't know the full story because it's a pretty short subject other than the fact that he had money in there. He pulled it out. I don't know how long it was in there or anything like that, but he's constantly telling her, oh, you can lose it.

lot of money. Right. Is he still living? I'm just like, is he still living? Yeah. Okay. So he's still, he's a big influence on us. Yeah. I was going to say, yeah. So somebody needs to play out the scenario. I'm just trying to put myself in your shoes. If this were my husband, I'd say, well, okay, we know what happened when he pulled the money out. He, he lost a bunch. Has anybody ever played out what would have happened if he didn't pull the money out? And then

I'd look at that scenario because I think I'd be eye-opening to say, here's the thing.

If that money had never come out today, here's what it would be worth. And that kind of shows the truth of how the stock market works. So I think this is a really delicate situation because like you said, it's touchy because money was quote lost, but you don't, it's hard to say, Hey, the mistake was on you. You're the one who pulled it out. Right. But even though that's kind of the truth, you've got to be looking in the mirror. Yeah. So, I mean, I think validating her because yeah, that is scary. You know, if,

you know, if a family member like that, and your own parents went through something, it's like, I want to avoid what they went through because it was obviously very painful, not fun. I don't want to do that. So that makes sense that she's

you know, has that level of fear. But what can happen, Brandon, is fear can, it can paralyze us and fear can make us do really bad, make really bad financial decisions. We would quote this all the time, especially during COVID and someone said it, and now I cannot remember who it was, but they said, we make our worst financial decisions when we're fearful and drunk.

Or drunk. Or maybe both. Was that a date? Maybe both. No, it was like some guy. I don't know who it was. It was like, but we would quote on there. That's funny, fearful or drunk. Yeah, they would always say, if you're fearful or drunk, you make really bad money decisions. That does describe COVID. So yeah, we kept telling people. Yeah. So again, it makes sense that she's fearful, but also we can't let fear dictate and make our decisions because it's an emotion that's not trustworthy. You know, it is there to create, to make us feel

To create safety for us, right? There's fear and our body reacts to it. And it's like, I'm on guard. I'm on guard. And why? And sometimes the threat is real, right? I mean, if you see a bear and you're like, that's scary. Like, that's a very real, right? Your body's response is correct. So run or whatever you're supposed to do when you see a bear. Like dad or whatever you're supposed to do. I don't even know. But the fear here is,

While I understand it, it's not based in reality. It's based in someone's situation, but that's not the reality out there. And so I think that's what she has to really overcome. So maybe, Brandon, even you guys, we always say a three to six month emergency fund. Maybe you bump it up, you know, six, you know, maybe six, seven, eight months just to give some extra buffer in that high yield fund.

Just to know if something happens, we are going to be okay. Like we have an emergency fund for the emergency fund kind of idea, right? So she may just need some extra security.

And then you guys just keep – my hope was that you guys do start investing because I think you're exactly right. From a math standpoint, you want that compound interest as early as possible. And then you guys just keep reevaluating and don't look – she doesn't need to look every day at the market because it's going to dip and the news is going to freak out and then she's going to be like, oh, my God, the world's coming to an end. So don't look at it. But once a year, you guys need to reevaluate and just say, okay, what did this year look like? But it takes –

It does take, I guess in her case, kind of that leap of faith. It's not really a leap of faith because I think there's a lot of facts around it, but it does take a level of trusting the system. And being willing to learn something new outside of a previous experience. That's the hard part. It's a great point. Yeah.

So I don't know if that helps Brandon, but yeah, that's it. Yeah, it's a hard one because again, I think it's, I think her fear is valid, but yet we, just because it's valid doesn't mean that we make decisions around it. That's right. But thanks for the call. All right, let's go to Aaron in San Diego. Hi, Aaron. Welcome to the show. Hey, thanks for taking my call. I appreciate it. Yeah, absolutely.

My question is pretty short and to the point. I currently have just $400,000 in credit card debt and about $11,000 in a car loan. I really have no other debt. I'm 26 years old. I make about $100,000 a year. I do live in San Diego. It doesn't go very far.

Yeah, it doesn't go very far. Yeah. But my question is, you know, I'm an ex-employee of a brother-large tech slash car company. I'm pretty sure we know what company that is. But I love the pretty sizable amount of stock. It is fully vested. However, it is technically a short-term. It hasn't been over a year old. I'm not too...

informed on all the tax implications, but should I sell? I have about currently right now that the market rate for the stock is like 340 a share. I have about like 14,000 right now. Should I sell some of that and pay off my credit card? Should I sell all of it and pay off my car and my credit card? I just, I've been listening to you guys for a few weeks now and

I just, I'm really trying to be focused on that piece of mind. Like it always starts young, you know, it's only $4,000 in credit card debt, but then it grows into 10 and a 20 and a 30. And lucky enough, I don't have any student loan debt, but I just want to knock out any debt at all. So what do you guys think is the best course of action here? Should I just use my income and save up and pay off my debt that way? Uh,

Where should I be going? Yeah. So normally we would say that we always say to sell anything that is non-retirement. And we are not big fans of single stocks just because it is so volatile that if that one company somehow loses everything. Right. That and I think I know what company you're talking about. So I don't know if that's going to be the case, but you never know. Right.

We were even looking the other day, Jade, in a team meeting at Peloton when Peloton was like so big. And it's like gone to nothing basically. You know what I mean? So I'm like, it was hot, you know. So just the idea that, yeah, just because something's working today, it may not be the best long-term play because you never know. So yeah, getting rid of single stocks,

would be something that I would recommend and then using any of the profits to go ahead and pay off debt and then go and take that, the proceeds, everything else, because you'll have way more than what you have in debt. And, you know, you can go put that in a, you know, a Vanguard account, an index fund, open up a mutual fund and just have more diversification with that money and let it grow long term without, again, that volatility of just that one specific company. How much will it be when you cash them in?

So if I were to sell everything right now, if I was looking at my E-Trade account, it's like 13-ish right now. And it's the current rate for the stock is like 340. I don't know how many shares I have. It's like 31 or 32. Oh, I'm sorry. I misheard your numbers. But yeah, so I would go ahead and sell it and put that towards the debt. Just be ready for the tax hit when it comes because it will come on your income taxes. Yep, for next year. Yeah, if you sell in 2025, it'll be there in the 2026 when you get it in April. That's right.

Thanks, Aaron, for the call. Thanks to everyone in the booth. Jay, thanks always for being a great co-host. Thanks to our studio audience here at Nashville. And thank you, America. We'll be back. All right, Dave, you have some strong opinions. Possibly, yeah. I think so. Okay, because you really prefer credit unions over big banks. Well, credit unions, for one thing, are non-profit, which means that the members, the customers, own banks.

the credit union. So any profits that the credit union makes goes back into customer pricing. So you get better interest rate on savings, cheaper checking, and so on, that kind of thing. But what's more important than that, though, is the fact that the customer is the owner changes the spirit on the credit union. So I find very few credit unions that aren't very customer-centric. Well, and I think we have found one that is incredible, and that's Fairwinds.

They are an incredible credit union that is really out with the heart to help the customer. They're the right kind of people with the right kind of values. And they've done a really, really good job with customer service. And the deals that they're offering, the Ramsey Tribe is incredible. Yeah, absolutely. And I love it. The things that we teach, they so line up with. And you're right, their customer service is unbelievable. Winston and I just signed up and we got an account. And I'm not kidding. It took less than five minutes.

It was so user friendly, like the step by step approach was unbelievable. And then the next day, my phone rings and it says Fairwinds on my phone. So I answered it and talked to someone there and they said, yeah, they give calls to every new customer. And so again, they just really care about your experience. And I

I so, so appreciate that. Plus, anything that you can do at a traditional branch, you can do with them at fairwinds.org or on their app. And you'll have free access to over 33,000 ATMs. Hey, you guys know how much I hate banks in general. And so for me to do this is a big deal. Talk to our friends at Fairwinds.

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Live from Ramsey Solutions, it's The Ramsey Show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create amazing relationships. I'm Rachel Cruz hosting this hour with bestselling author Jade Warshaw, and we are here to answer your questions at 888-825-5225. So give us a call, and we'll be talking about your money, your life, marriage, relationships, career, kids, anything and everything. So give us a call.

Up first this hour, we have William in Indianapolis. Hi, William. Welcome to the show. Hello. Thank you for having me. Yes. Thanks for calling in. How can we help?

So my fiancée were planning on getting married this August, so pretty soon. Congratulations. She went into surgery, pretty simple surgery, gallbladder to be more specific, and they coated her on the table. Oh, my gosh.

She is now doing well. She had a trach for six months. Oh, no. In that time, she got a pretty good lawyer, and he won us around – well, won her. I'm not entitled to any of it, but won her around $1.3 million after we pay him and everything. We should have around that. Okay.

So my main question for Collin today is like we're planning on getting a house because we are getting married, but we didn't know if we were going to do like full cash pay for the house and get it over with or a really hefty down payment since neither one of us have much credit right now. That way we could build our credit in the future. But I didn't know what would be the best option. Neither one of us have had money like this before. Sure. How's she doing?

Now, she's doing very well. So my fiance was born. She was born deaf. Okay.

So just by a normal person, you would be able to tell like, hey, there's something a little different. She's not an adult, like an adult size, like airway. You know what I mean? Just by hearing her talk. So you would think that doctors would definitely be able to tell. Oh, man. And so, yeah, but she's doing very good now. So impressive. Wow, she's incredible. Yeah.

Shout out to Cincinnati Children's Hospital for being the best airway reconstruction in the United States. And luckily, we were very close to them. Wow. My gosh. Wow, wow, wow. Okay, so William, you guys, you get married in August. Will either of you be bringing debt into the marriage? Negative. Neither one of us have student loans, any credit card debts. We both drive older vehicles. Wow. Good for you. I mean, yeah, I mean...

I mean, I'll be simple with my answer, Jade. You probably can explore it a little bit more. But yeah, I mean, yes, this would be a really, really, really, really wise way to use this money. If you guys...

started off your marriage with no mortgage payment and the amount of money you guys could be investing and saving for the future is going to be insane, William. What you guys can do versus sending a payment to a mortgage broker or to a bank. You guys pay yourself a mortgage payment and invest that. The numbers are astronomical what that could do. Short answer is I think that's a very wise way to use this money is to

spend cash and um and and yeah buy it out right how what do you think it would cost for you guys to get what you what you want you know in in indianapolis yeah her only stipulation is two bathrooms so she's not very difficult um around 175 to 200 000 is around the price range we were looking at for something that's going to be a lifelong house for us

Wow. Okay. That's a lot less than I was thinking when I look at the median home price in the United States. Well, we live in 500 square foot right now. So anything is an upgrade. That's true. That's true. Okay. Okay. So let's just say you guys went crazy and spent $300. Yeah. So that means you have a million dollars left. So I think the next question – so yes, 100% be paying –

cash for this house, even more so than probably more emphatically than we were thinking earlier. And then, and then for the million, yeah, take some of that, William, you guys can upgrade cars. That would be another, another thing to think about. And then, you know, I would be, we always say to give, save and spend. And so with the rest of that, you know, do some generosity and do some giving with that. I'd probably sit with a smart investor pro and figure out how to invest a good portion of it.

For sure. Of course, if you give to someone, you're going to get back astronomically because that's just how the universe works. It is like that sometimes, although it's not always financial. So keep that in mind. But yeah, I what Rachel said, I'd probably I'd upgrade the cars. I take my time on this. Right. I think that's the big thing. Like,

If you just go out and it's kind of like shopping spree and you buy a house and buy two cars and it's like, I feel like that's probably where you could get into no man's land there. But yeah,

Take your time buying this house. Take your time doing your research. Just as though this money were never there, how would you take your time to do your research on these things, right? And then, yeah, I would set aside three to six months of expenses. I'd throw that in a high-yield savings. You guys come up with some things that might be important to you on the giving side. Yeah. And then that investing, if you invest a good chunk of this and let it grow and just set it and forget it,

that's going to be really, really great for your legacy. Yeah. How much do you guys make a year, William? How much combined income will you have once you guys get married? So combined, she has a fixed income around $1,000 a month that she will not be losing because of the trust fund that is set up through the malpractice case. So she will still get her...

Social Security income, which is what she gets. And then I work around $40,000 is what I bring home yearly. Okay. So you guys are roughly about $52,000. And so that will be her income, correct? She doesn't make anything above that payment? That is correct. Okay. So, yeah. So it's going to take some discipline, which you sound like you guys are pretty disciplined. Seems like it. That you don't start living like, oh, because this money is a one-time thing.

payment, right? This is not an ongoing salary that you all will be getting every single year. And so watching the lifestyle and

not acting like oh my gosh we're a bunch of millionaires yeah right like i would be living and i don't think you will be i don't think you will be you guys seem very mature i'm not gonna change my lifestyle i can already tell i know you said what you wanted to spend on the house i was like we're gonna be fine but i do want you to buy some cars but yeah i will say that as your spender friend yes i drive a 99 right now the thing's about the

Yeah, so get some nice cars. And part of this, too, if you invest it wisely, you guys can be living off of a portion of this every year if you want. But again, sitting down with a SmartVestor Pro is probably going to be your best bet just to make sure the longevity of this lasts, hopefully, beyond you guys. That's what this kind of money can do if you invest it early, which is really beautiful. It's generational if you can invest it right. How old are you?

I am 24. Oh, most definitely. Yeah. Yeah. I was going to say one more thing. I believe that...

the way that it works in Indiana. I don't know how it works anywhere else, but the insurance company, when they like come through a hospital and like to have a malpractice case, they can only pay us out a certain amount right now. And then they pay a percentage of that over time. So she's going to get $175,000 over a 30 year period. Every five years, she gets a slight increase in the

Okay. Yeah, that makes sense. So what you guys would have to do is just have a timeline of knowing when is this money coming and what are we using that chunk for at a time? So that actually kind of spreads it out, which will slow you guys down some, which is fine, which is fine. I'm glad everyone's okay. Thanks for the call.

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All right. Today's question of the day comes from Patrick in Connecticut. He says, our current mortgage balance is $850,000 and we also have an $8,000 car loan as our only other debt. My wife wants to get a $1.5 million loan for a second larger home and cash out our single stocks for the down payment.

We earn $350,000 a year. I am losing sleep over this idea and it feels like we're going backwards. I want to invest more in retirement and save for our kids' education. She wants to sell our first home later on to pay for college costs. What would you recommend that we focus on? Okay.

So just to clarify, she wants to keep the current house that's $850,000 and then cash out stocks to put a down payment on a second home that would be worth $1.5 million. And she's like, hey, it's all good because in the future when it's time to pay for college, we can just sell the $850,000 house that'll likely be worth more. Yeah, I don't like this. I think that what you're feeling is correct. Yeah.

you're just having a lot of skin in the debt game. Yes, a lot of risk. It's a lot happening. I wonder why she wouldn't just I mean, he's not on the line. But I wonder in my mind, it's like, okay, if you want the $1.5 million house, sell the previous house, take the proceeds and put it roll it to the $1.5 million house. Yeah, it sounds like it's like a, I make up a vacation home or something. You know what I mean? And it's

And the problem with all of this is, you know, she wants the nice second home, doesn't want to pay for kids college right now. She doesn't want to put money away to save for that. So it's a lot of present for today. Yeah, a lot of things today. This is what I want today. So I'm going to make decisions based on today without really looking long term and saying, OK, what's best for us?

Where we can have a fun life today. It's not like you want to be miserable today. Right, right. But yet you want to be wise and not let this be the motivator. Don't let today be the motivator. Be thinking long term because you guys have a lot of life to live. And yeah, it doesn't sound like a lot of wise decisions. You're going to be carrying two mortgage payments. Think about the... So really what we're saying is think about the opportunity cost on it and what that's going to cost you long term. Clearly...

She's not interested in thinking that way today. But you have your work cut out for you, Patrick. But you are correct. Don't do this. Yep. So I don't know. I would sit down and I want to know her motivation for the second home. And if it is a vacation type situation, it's like a vacation home, could you guys –

rent somewhere, you know, for two weeks a year and still be able to enjoy your vacations. But you don't have to own the home that you're going to right now, especially because you guys have still car loans and a mortgage on your primary home. So getting that paid down for sure would be the wiser way. And I would, yeah, cash out some of those stocks to pay off the car loan, especially, you know, if they're not in retirement. Exactly.

Hope that helps. But yeah, sorry, Patrick. We're the bear of bad news for your wife. We are. I don't know why I'm totally reading too much into this question, but I feel like she's just out here trying to live that life. I'm like, you guys are in Connecticut. It's super expensive. I always think about sometimes when you're in an area that's super expensive and you see how other people are living, you kind of feel like I have to be doing that as well. Yes, yes. But that's not...

That's not the reality. I always think about basketball teams, right? And it's like the Jimmy Butlers, they get paid the big dollars, but like the seventh and the eighth man, they don't make what Jimmy Butler makes. So if you go out with Jimmy Butler, you can't get what he gets. You know what I mean? Like you can't live that

life so anyway I don't know why I feel like she's just trying to live the life that she's seeing other people live yeah it's looking that way oh man that's just so funny it's so true though yeah especially like on a sports team yeah like these guys are like yeah the salary ranges is like so significantly different yeah so it takes a lot of maturity a lot of maturity to push through that it does all right let's go to the phones we'll go to Jason in Kansas City hi Jason welcome to the show

Hey, guys. Thanks so much for taking my call. Absolutely. How can we help? So, yeah. So I'm a medical student and I am incredibly blessed. I'm going to be able to graduate medical school 100% debt free. Oh, my gosh. My car is made off. How did you do that? Wow. My parents are both docs, too. Okay. Wow. That is a gift. They've been incredibly supportive. I'm eternally grateful. That's so great. And I currently live in a home that's fully paid off as well. They purchased it for me. Wow. Yeah.

Yeah. It's a huge blessing. So I am pursuing a medical specialty where the prestige of your residency really matters if you want to work in a desirable area later in life. It's a pretty small field and limited job market. The challenge is that most of these top tier residencies are in really expensive cities that would be much pricier than the life I currently live. The

My question is, do you think it would be a financial mistake to leave this very stable, low-cost setup in order to train to the more prestigious program that might be able to open better doors for me long-term, depending on where I go, maybe even having to take out loans for some living expenses? Or do you think I should just try to stay put and risk possibly more limited job options later? Are you allowed to sell the house that your parents got you and use that money to put towards living expenses in the more expensive area?

So, yeah, it is in their name. And that is an option for sure. I think there's another layer of it, too, that I don't want to feel disrespectful just that they've done so much for me and given me this great house. And I'm like, hey, by the way, I'm flying the coop and moving somewhere else. You know what I mean? But that's another side to the issue. Kind of. But the way you set it up, I mean –

To be honest, the way you set it up, it sounds like they're in the doctor field and they've been so supportive. It feels like, based off of what you said, that they would understand what you just explained to us, that, hey, my residency really matters. I mean, have you talked to them about it and what did they say? I haven't, to be honest. I've been a little afraid just because I think I have been worried how they might respond to me saying I might want to leave this.

Yeah, I'm also I also have questions about the vocabulary you're using about they bought the house for you. It's it's in their name. So I yeah, it brings up other questions, which is, is this really my house? Does this mean we can sell it when I'm ready? Or is this?

Is this something that they're viewing as just a rental? And for now, you're the one living there. And when you move on, someone else will. Like, it just brings up a lot of other questions that I have. Yeah. What's the expectation of the home? Like strings attached. Besides what you're just kind of feeling and thinking, was anything ever said when they gifted you the home?

Well, so I think I know they're on it. I think I might be listed on the home, but I mean, they're definitely the ones who have the most ownership in it. And, you know, I think they kind of bought it thinking I was going to stay where I'm at long term, you know, and train where I'm at. And it really hasn't been until I got into medical school and realized that, you know, this this field that I want to pursue is really what I want to do. And it's probably going to require me to possibly move somewhere. So it was interesting.

It came out of the blue a little bit unexpected. Well, I mean, you don't. I mean, don't get me wrong. When somebody offers that, like, on face value, it's a great gift. But at the same time, you don't want it to be, you know, golden handcuffs that keeps you chained to an area. That's the reason that you're there is for a house. Yeah, that would be silly. That would not be wise long term. I think you're exactly right, Jade. So I'm just thinking through going to talk to them.

I mean, yeah, I mean, I would definitely just tell them kind of what you're thinking and where you're at and maybe be a little prepared in the conversation of running some numbers of, you know, here's probably the top three areas I'll probably end up in and do some research and just say, OK, how much realistically will rent be realistically? What would life look like from a financial standpoint? And how long would you be in these cities?

Residency is going to be about five years. Okay. So it's, yeah, it's a significant time. And when you're saying expensive, are you thinking like New York City, San Francisco, Seattle? New York, you know, San Francisco, L.A.,

you know, some of the Boston, some of the more really expensive cities that have, you know, really reputable healthcare systems. Sure. Okay. Yeah. So I would run some numbers and just know, okay, here's how much it's going to cost me to live per month. I would not take out loans, Jason. I think, um, I think either you figure out another way to make some money to support yourself during that time. Um, but also have that conversation and just say, Hey, I'm looking at all my assets and

And I do have this house, you know, in my head as an asset. But I want to be respectful of you all. Just tell them how you're feeling and just have a conversation about it. But be prepared with some numbers so you at least kind of have a plan going in knowing here's the direction I'm leaning. But you may not be able to afford it, Jason, if they don't give you this house.

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specifically for you and your situation. So go to ramseysolutions.com slash checkup to take the coverage, check up or click the link in the description if you are watching on YouTube or listening on podcasts. Up next, we have Derek in San Jose. Hi, Derek. Welcome to the show. Hey, Rachel. I'm a big fan. It's a real honor to speak with you. Thanks so much for taking my call. Absolutely. Thanks for calling in. How can we help?

So I recently got engaged. My fiance and I are both 36 years old. We're looking to start a Brady Bunch. We've got five kids between 10 and 12 between us. Oh, wow. Between 10 and 12? Is that what you said? Yeah.

Yeah, I have twin sons who are 11, and she has a 10-year-old, 11-year-old, and 12-year-old. Oh, my gosh. That's going to be a houseful. That's fun. So great. Yeah, it's been really fun. So the reason I'm calling is because we have a pretty large difference in assets. And I think based on your advice, the advice would be that we should get a prenup. So I have roughly $12 million, and she has roughly $50,000.

And so we started the process of looking into a prenup, and it's been an emotional one. And I totally understand why. And I think especially, like, we went through a questionnaire talking together about it. But then when we got the first draft back from my lawyer, that's when she's really not been feeling good about it. And I understand the concern. So, I mean, she feels like...

I wouldn't be fully entering the marriage in the same way that she is. Cause it feels like I'm holding assets, uh, like separately off to the side. Um, and I'm sensitive to that. And especially in some of the contexts of her, um, former relationships. And so I'm just looking for maybe more clarity and, uh, like what you guys would recommend. Oh man, this is a hard one. Um, because, um,

It is. I think it is a wise decision to do one. And I say that even more. I have a friend who's going through not a great situation and she came in with a lot more. And now he's just I mean, it was it's just messy. It's messy, messy. And there's a level again, you're not you're hoping that.

And praying, obviously, that this is the one and that it's going to last a lifetime. But as you guys have experienced, you know, there is a reality to all of this. And whenever any of us get married, right, I think there is like this like, okay, I'm choosing you for a reason and for a lifetime. But we also don't live under a rock and know that things change in life and situations come up. And unfortunately, some really hard things happen and does causes marriages happen.

To break up, right? To enter into divorce. And we don't want that. So what were the... I'm curious, what were the parts of it that was making her... Because you guys went through a questionnaire together and it didn't sound like the questionnaire brought up a lot of red flags, but when she was actually reading it, does she feel like she won't be taken care of if something happens? Or what's the...

What's that underlying concern? Yeah. Yes. And I think especially like, you know, her kids as well, too. And it's something that I want to address. And I think we could address like in a will or like some other document or method after we get married. And it's something that I want to do. Like, I absolutely would want her and her.

her kids to be taken care of too if something didn't happen to us. I think it also feels very condescending to her that either she... And I don't see it being a problem for her at all. My goal in this, and I think that's what your advice is, is that in our case, that I know is rare, it would help protect our marriage.

And that's what I want to do. But I totally understand that she feels it's condescending, like to her, maybe her and her family and her friends, that they might be a problem. And that we would need this to like protect against them. Can I ask how, how like stringent this prenup is, like how strict it is? Because when I've heard calls about this before, my, my question is always, is there a way to,

That this can be more progressive, that over maybe over time and over years, some of the restrictions fall off. Like, does that make sense to where it's like the longer we're together and the more that this feels right, some of this starts to fall off and now we start to become one. And after a while, it's all gone and we are one. Is there anything built in like that?

So there's nothing currently built in like that. So other than that, it's pretty basic. So everything we enter into the marriage with is separate property, except she has a small amount of debt and she's been awesome about eliminating debt, especially the situation she came from. I don't want her to carry it all. Like I would just pay it off.

And then everything after the date of the marriage is shared. So income that I make or she made, we just share it. Our plan is that she would stop working. She'd be able to be home with all these kids. Does that include interest on the 12 million as that grows? Or does any growth on that 12 million remain yours?

Yeah, so at least as it's currently structured, the growth in that would remain mine. I think we have talked about it's not in the document, but like if I were to stop working to also help with the kids, which would be an option, like the income that we drew from that would be considered our income. I think I would. Yeah, I'd be wondering about that if I were entering in that marriage, like,

How can we protect what you've already created, but how can I be a player and how that grows from here on out? Like, how can I be a part of that? I think I might be wondering about that. That's tough, man. Yeah. Yeah. And then the only other additional part is we're planning to get a house and I was just going to buy the house. We title it in both of our names. I just consider it community property. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, well, it sounds like you're being very gracious about this, Derek. I think it's such a hard line to be wise in a situation and being... I mean, you don't sound like you're drawing these crazy hard lines and you know what I mean? And you're pushing it like it's... Your tone feels very humble and gracious, which I... Yeah, I mean, I think she probably very much appreciates. So, yeah. I'm trying to think if I...

were in her position which you never can fully do for somebody you know there's a part of me that I don't know I think I would understand you're coming in with 12 million yeah and I understand that's not mine right now right like there's I don't know yeah this one's hard for me I I see are you an are you an anti-prenup no I'm not I would not go that far I think it's just it's

it's, it is a very tough way to start out a marriage clearly because we're dividing yours versus mine and everything else in the marriage is out is we say we, us, our, so it, it is tough. And if you're a person, let's, you know, I'll put myself in the shoes. Uh,

I've always viewed, oh, when you enter a marriage, it's like this. Yes. You don't know who you're going to fall in love with. And that person happens to be loaded. And now suddenly you're like, oh, this picture I had of it being ours is not possible. Yeah.

That's just tough. I'm not saying it's wrong. It's just tough.

if something happens. But up until that point, it's ours. Like we're sharing assets. That's a good point. That is a very good point. We are living our lives together as one. But for some reason, if something ever happened in a divorce, this part still goes back to me. Does that make sense? I wonder if framing it. That's a good way to frame it. Because it can be hers, right? Like you guys can share on this. It's the only time it's not hers is if you guys legally go through a divorce.

Does that make sense? Yeah. Yeah, it totally makes sense. And that is how we want to live going into the next year. Yeah, and it sounds like that's, yeah, and that sounds like your attitude because you're going to take some of our money and we're going to buy a house together with this money and use this money for our family. So I think it's, it's such a fine line, Derek. I mean, it's so hard, but I think I would keep it and bring in a third party. If there's a great marriage counselor or therapist, honestly, it's something to think through and even get other opinions because yeah, you want to be on the same page with this.

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at ramseysolutions.com slash giveaway. That's ramseysolutions.com slash giveaway. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. Up next, we have Melissa in Charleston, West Virginia. Hi, Melissa. Welcome to the show. Hi, how are you? Doing great. How can we help?

Yes. So I recently purchased a home in West Virginia about a month ago. And since living there, my family and I have got really sick, experiencing allergy-like symptoms. Got the, long story short, ended up getting someone to come and test for mold. And it's very high numbers in stature botulists. I don't know how

Probably butchering that name, but it's the one that's really, really dangerous. So now I'm in the flip other side. I'm post-closing. I did go to the property disclosure. It was as is, and it was a flip. And also, I did also get a home inspector as well. And this is through a VA loan. So now I'm trying to figure out if I should do a mold remediation myself or go ahead and do a deed in lieu of foreclosure.

situation because now I don't feel comfortable staying there at all because what else is concealed in this house? I don't know. And turns out the guy that flipped it has a horrible reputation around the community for doing basically pig lipstick on a pig blitz. So when you did the when you did the inspection to purchase the home, it didn't come up on the inspection, but now it is. Can you clarify that for me?

Yeah. The mold is on plain view, but from a lay person, if you look at it, it looks like mildew or maybe like dirt, just like a dirty basement. But the second inspector that came in said, this is definitely mold. It's in plain view. Nobody called this. He said the appraiser could have called it, but I know they're there for just evaluation purposes. But he said that, you

you know, you, you, you potentially have a case and I've contacted attorneys and they are all pretty much that, that I don't have a case because it's a buyer beware state, which I wasn't, I didn't know what that meant. So the onus is on the buyers and it's not a lot of consumer protections for us in West Virginia. Have you had any estimates on what it would cost to buy?

try to go through and I mean, mold is such a it's such a frustrating part of the, you know, that whole process of renovation. But have you? Yeah, what's the cost?

Yes. So I had an adjuster come with my homeowner's insurance, but of course they deemed it pre-existing. And the adjuster told me that the basement is not even up to code. So the cost of going to the basement is like $20,000 plus. And the mold remediation itself would be $10,000 plus. Is that how many...

Okay, so let's keep, I think for now, we keep the mold separate from the basement not being to code and find out. Because here's the thing. If you get the mold out of the house and you're ready to sell the property, then you can say you can sell it. You can feel good about it. There's no mold here. The other question, but I did have the question. So you're telling me your inspector missed the mold and missed the fact that the basement wasn't to code?

Yes. And he said, one of my questions before I hired him was, you know, how long have you been doing it? You know, what are your, just ask him his history of his work. And he's like over 20 years. And I looked at reviews. He has great reviews, great reviews on the BBB and all this stuff. And I was like, are you approved by the VA? And he was like, yes. And I verified everything and everything checked up on paper, but yeah,

Yeah, none of that. And there's nothing on him. There's he's completely there's no liability towards whoever did the inspection. That's what the lawyers are saying.

But they're saying that the likelihood of it winning in court is low because of that caveat on tour buyer beware thing in West Virginia and the fact that they have no duty to disclose anything.

mold in West Virginia. What's the point of the DACA inspection? What's the point of it? Exactly. Exactly. You would have to hire a mold inspector on top of the regular home inspector and a radon inspector and whatever other inspectors separately in order to do this. And they said it was a law just passed with the Supreme court, um,

Yeah. Yeah.

take an L and, and I mean, it's going to ding my credit, but I need to get out of it because we're essentially homeless. Why can't you just put it on the market? You've purchased it. Can't you just put it back on the market for sale? Why does it have to go into foreclosure? I guess is what I'm saying.

Because I don't, I'm going to have to disclose it and it's not remediated. So also I asked that question. They said a lot of lenders won't allow you, won't lend on a home with mold, with active mold. Now the mold, I don't know if it's active because I've got a dehumidifier down there and I've sealed up where moisture may have gotten in. Uh-huh. But, um...

I don't know who deemed it active or not, but you can see it now because I've pulled paneling off. It was hidden. It was even more like the obvious mold that you would be behind paneling. So what if we said this? What if we said, let's get a couple of opinions on what it's really going to cost to get this remediated. And then do you have any money anywhere?

No. And the money I am getting, I run a business out of West Virginia. And right now we're living with my man and we're going back and forth two and a half hours between Columbus and where we're at every other day. So I can still take clients and that money is going towards gas and food. And because I've had to take the kids out of school because they are allergic to it. And I got them allergy tested to verify what I'm saying. Yeah. How much are you making a year, Melissa? $1,000.

I make, so I'm a disabled veteran. So on top of that, I would say about 80, 70, 80,000 a year. What do you get for the disability per month? About five. Okay. So just under five is like four, nine or four, eight, something like that. Okay. And then what do you take home from your actual job? Take home. Per month. I would say about five. So we've got 10K a month. How many kids?

And how much is this mortgage out of your take home? $1,500. $1,500?

Okay, that's good. This is Melissa. I almost would just go rent somewhere. I mean, be paying the mortgage, go rent because this isn't feasible. The two and a half hour thing. I think that adds stress. I think that's like that's exhausting everybody pulling the kids out of the routine. I mean, that's just miserable. I would just go rent somewhere. Go rent a one, two bedroom apartment. Knowing it's short term. Cheap, cheap, cheap. Yes. Just knowing like we this is what we're going to do just to have some stability from where you were.

And then they can get back in school. Yes. And then from there, gosh, I would probably get even a second attorney's opinion. And sometimes, you know, they'll take cases and with what is won in court, if so, then that's how they get paid. So you're not having to go deeply in debt with all this litigation and stuff. So maybe even from a different standpoint, from a payment perspective, you can find someone different on that end. But I would probably still pursue that because this doesn't – this feels –

like a lot of negligence on the end of your inspector, even on the mold thing, which I guess is the biggest part of all of this. If he doesn't have to disclose it or find it, it has to be separate in West Virginia. I mean, that's just bizarre. And then I would be saving and I would do the cheapest renovation you can to get this mold out. That would be safe to resale so that you can in good conscious sell this home and

Would you want to stay in the home if you did get the mold all clear? I don't. And I don't want to stay. I love the home. That's why I bought it. But I no longer want to stay there because now with this man's reputation being the way it is. Yeah, you don't know. You think more things will be. Sure. You don't know. You don't know. Yeah. So I would I would save Melissa really aggressively stage by stage. Be getting redoing this house from just the mold. Right. Not the up to code basement thing. You know, someone can renovate that if they want. Yeah.

But just getting the mold out, put it on the market and sell it. And in good faith to say, yeah, you know, this was cleaned up. Yeah. You don't know. I mean, yeah, the guy has a terrible reputation. You don't know what else is there, but you don't know. Right. And if the inspector finds something else, then we can deal with that. But I would put it on the market and try to sell it just to get out of it. And we'll give you every dollar so you can really plan this $10,000 a month to make that happen. Yes. Oh, I'm so sorry, Melissa. It's such a headache. Terrible, terrible, terrible.

Go on now.

Don't make it weird. Okay, I got nowhere to go, so you need to go. Okay, bye-bye now. All right, this is getting weird over there, guys. What do we do?