Author John Daniel Davidson says paganism in America is on the rise.
39:56 Share

Is your cold making IT hard for you to get to sleep and leading to a bad morning switch to musonius night shift for fast, powerful nighttime multi symptom cold and flu relief new next nightlife fight your worst nighttime symptoms to help you get to sleep and wake up ready to go use next night shift it's come back season users directed.

Y, it's stuck your curls. And welcome to our podcast. The main way that corporate media allied to you is by not telling you things, ignoring stories completely, particular the important ones.

We promise never to do that. You can check out tucker across an outcome for a complete library of past episodes. Here's today.

One thing we know about human civilizations is they are inherently religious. Even, or maybe especially the ones that claim to be secular, everybody worships something. So as the united states becomes progressively and now aggressively less Christian, that doesn't mean that religion has disappeared.

Easter was replaced just the other day by the, by administration with the worship of transsexual ism, trans visibility day. So it's a religion. It's just different.

And in this case, that happens to be a pagan religion. And that's the direction the united states of speeding right now toward piggish. The question is, what does that mean? And does that make anybody happier? Very few people have thought about this in any systematic to tale.

John, Daniel, David and the federal is one who has, in fact, you write a new book on IT called Peggy amErica the decline of and the dark age to come and we are happy to haven't join us now john, thanks very much of for coming on. Um so pay in amErica does a bunch question, but does the decline of questioning, which is demonstrable and obvious and intentional, does that inevitably mean pegged ism? In a word.

yes because in the end there is only one alternative to Christianity and that had is pegged ism and and we should be clear by our terms right um when we say paganism, I don't mean that where is going to be a sudden resurgence of the worship of zoos or a you know and an explosion of witchcraft although that is happening as well yes.

What I mean is a return of the pagan ethos and the pagan ethos uh is and always has been a rejection of transcendent or objective truth, right? Pagans were free to divi ze and assigned divine status to the here and now, to things, to natural phenomenon, even to people. And we are returning to that as the world becomes reenacted from its sort of secular hiatus that we that we've been on for the past century or so. And what that means in america, of course, is a radical moral subjectivity that we see in the trans movement, that we see in black libs matter, in critical race theory, that we see all across our society asserting itself now that rejects the what are fundamentally Christian claims about the human person, our relationship to one another and our relationship to .

got so IT seems like one of the ways, maybe the main way, that Christianity is different from all other religions in in a practical sense, is that IT reject human sacrifice. Human sacrifice being a constant through a all recorded history in every non Christian cultural human sacrifice at the center. So as Christianity recedes, should not surprise us that abortion, Ethane ia killing, war, human sacrifice has come to the center of our culture.

Not at all. In fact, I deal with this at length, specifically with abortion and youth in asia as the most obvious manifestations of the return of human sacrifice in the new paging calls. And it's interesting when you look at the justification for something like abortion, you back after robi wade and and even into one thousand nine hundred and eighties, the justification was this isn't to human being is just a comp cells um you're not taking A A human life and uh these fetuses aren't viable and as medical technology progressed the eighties and nineties and over the past twenty five years, you've see the justification change. Advances in medical technology made the original justification, uh make no sense IT could not be maintain that this was just a compose cells. We all knew and we all know undoubted now beyond any doubt, a objectively and unborn human being is a human being, right and and so the justification has changed from its a clamper cells to safe, legal and rare to shout your abortion and so now you have a positive defensive abortion as a as a good in fact is a moral good that we should brag about and we should champion uh and that is not a Christian value, that is a pagan value. And it's reverting itself now in a modern context.

Well, I I have noticed I haven't thought that through to the impressive degree that you have, but I noticed the justification for abortion went from essentially rational rates of, if the feds is not a human being is no different from an deck to me, I don't agree with that, but that is a rational, defensive abortion. It's not a big deal because the question of taking life does not enter into IT. But once you give that up, and what exactly is what is the justification? Is there justification, publicly declare justification for taking another human life?

Well, there is now at its very pagan indeed. The justification now is that is the will of the mother that determines the humanity of the child.

So we have abortion laws in this country where a child of the same two children of the same gestational age in two different states, one, uh, has to be saved if if borne prematurely, all the medical technology, all the medical expertise that can be brought to bear to say that child's life must be brought to bear same gestational age. Child born in another state can be killed with immunity. The only thing that determines the humanity of this person is the desire of the mother to have the child or not have the child.

And that is also quite essentially pagan, because in a pagan society, what determines right, what is morally correct, is based on the, is based on a power dynamic. Those who have power do what they want to. Those who have no power, and that is their right.

That is there, there, there are god given right to enslave or kill or rape or abuse anyone who they have power over. And that's the dynamic we save. Returning out IT may start with a rational or secular justification, as we saw with abortion.

But as we're seeing now in places like canada with u in asia, IT quickly moves uh into a power dynamic. People who are inconvenient are simply being killed. A and there's very little justification on a moral on a Christian moral basis for IT. Instead, there's a pagan moral justification which is all about power and force and will and and .

there's a delight there. I mean, you watch the treasury secretary, jane elen. I consider a criminal based on crime SHE is committed and never been punished for.

But whatever you think of anne, her job is nothing to do with abortion. She's the treasury secretary. And SHE comes out sort of in, although most like this nonsense, are you to abortion and tells us that it's just a good thing.

It's a good thing. If you want to help, this country will have more abortions. And she's thrill to do IT. So I look at that and there's a supernatural component here. There's GTA because there's no rational justification .

for IT yeah exactly there's no rational justification to allow healthy Young people who are suffer from depression uh or maybe substance to be a addiction to um to kill themselves but to have physician assistance suicide really and yeah that's what's happening in in canada right now. And and they went down the slippery slow but only took a few years to go from only people terminal illnesses to um anyone who is depressed and lonely uh and maybe maybe also people who are costing the national health system a lot of yes, maybe those people do we can get rid of them in there is actually uh, some government studies in canada have actually calculated how much the national hel service will save by expanding their social program.

This is really dark stuff and and we have to understand that for what IT is it's the replacing of Christian morality with pagan morality and and and the transformation of uh of the republic of self governing citizens into what essentially is a slave empire where those with power, the ruling class rules over and underclass that is subject to to that power and that's a very different dynamic. That means a total transformation of american society. And I don't think that many people have really started to wrap their heads the implications of that for all of us.

Well in in canada you have the state murdering its own native population, overwhelmingly the Christian population of canada, people whose ancestors or Christian church covers, and then replacing them with people you know who are not Christians from other countries. So it's it's hard not to see that as as part of the minister. To fact I I mean you could interpret in a different way, but it's it's a Christian canadians who are getting killed by the state. I think that's just just true.

I mean is also you we saw with this um this hooks about the mass graves at the indigenous schools as well that unleashed A A flurry of violence against catholic churches in canada. Dozens of churches were burned down, the analyzed destroyed and the prime minister encouraged IT. He cheered IT on was the same thing with black ized matter protesters here in the summer of twenty twenty the regime did nothing.

They encouraged IT they wanted that to happen. Uh they were willing to countenance violence in the streets and the use again the use of raw force to advance their agenda and some their rule uh and then and then unequally apply the force of the state against Christians, against uh pro life protesters, uh against people who are in the vicinity, the capital on january six. Uh, this is a pattern that we're gona see repeated more and more often as we get away from this idea a the a of traditional Christian morality, that is to say, individual rights, rule of law, consent of the government.

These aren't things that just exist in like a secular liberal utopia. They depend on an actual Christian society to sustain them. And when Christianity of declines or becomes, we enter into a post Christian era, those things are gonna go away like they can't they can't sustain themselves on their own ah and I don't think that, that we appreciate just how much we rely on our Christian inheritance for like are specifically american way of life.

So I think that's really in safety, you just said, but it's also the opposite of what we were promised. So what we were promised, as always, was liberation from the strictures of the ancient religion that kept people from dancing and playing cards and having criminal sex and like any kind of fun at all, was the the footloose model. And but that's but what we got was not liberation. The country doesn't seem for you or liberated as compared to the amErica of thirty years ago. So IT IT does seem like it's a lie.

yeah. Hills dale .

college offers many great free online courses, including a recent one on marxism, socialism and communism. Today, marxism goes by different names to make itself seem less dangerous. Names like critical race theory, gender theory and decontamination.

No matter the names, this online core shows its the same marxism that works to destroy private property that will lead to famines. Show trials and guilds start learning online for free at tucker for hills dale outcome. That's tucker F O R hills dale dot com.

Tucker says its best. The credit card coffees are ripping americans off, and enough is enough. This is senator Roger martial of kansas. Our legislation, the credit card competition act, would help in the grip VISA and master card have on us.

Every time you use your credit card, they charge you a hidden fee called a swipe fee, and they've been raising IT without even telling you this gets consumers and every small business owner. In fact, american families are paying eleven hundred dollars in hidden s White busy cheer the fees VISA and mastered card charge. Americans are the highest in the world, double canada and eight times more than europe. That's why I take an action, but I need your help to help get this past. I M asking you to call your sender to they and demand they passed the credit card competition act painful by the merchants .

payments coalition not authorized by any canada or canada committee. W W W merchants payments coalition dot com. Yeah well, IT is a lot and and I think there's a misunderstanding maybe of of terms that that has cracked into our society as well.

Like when the founders said live liberty and the pursuit of happiness, they understood happiness in a very specific way, which was the cultivation and the acquisition of virtue. right? You are free to not to do as you as you want to, whatever you want to, you're free to do as you ought.

You know, this is something, uh, you know, uh, john pall, the second talk about that the true meaning of freedom was freeing you to be good, right, and to be virtuous. Uh, IT wasn't reading you to you try to change your your sex and or or to to engage publicly in in sexual fetishes and to try to foist that on children or to be out. Not racist.

That's not what freedom is for. And so we see, along with the decay of freedom into into license, right? We also see a disfiguring of reason. And that's also characteristic of pagan societies. Reason and faith are complimentary. That's what Christians have always believed, because this is the truth but now we see creeping in uh an abusive reason um and you see this most obviously right in the covet pandemic where people are invoking science but making everyone do this completely irrational things that had nothing to do with science uh and works totally unreasonable and you see this justification everywhere now in public life and always IT is the we still use the language of science and reason but clearly what is what is what is the determining factor for the people in power is simply force and will we are going to make you do this not because it's reasonable, because IT even works. We're just going to make you do IT because we're telling you to do IT, and we're going to start to see a lot more of that too. Covet should have been a real ee opener, and I think that was for some people about what the regime is capable of and how we're sort of Operating on our new level, even what IT comes to the justifications for major public policy.

So I mean, I think this I think you're exactly right. You Christian has rules, but by its nature, IT rarely uses force to impose them on others. Paganism is the opposite. So the first several centuries after jesus death, the romans were in charge.

IT was a pagan society, and they required all subjects to bat down before their god's, to acknowledge god's Christians wouldn't, and they murder the Christians by the tens of thousands, then constantly converts. IT becomes a Christian empire, but the Christian empire does not force the non Christians to bed on before jesus on pain of death. IT allows them to live there, right? So there, like anthers, Christianity is more against, in the american sense, a bit more libertarian, more libertarian really than any kind of pagan religious structure. Or I misreading this.

No, you're you're absolute tolerance. Like religious tolerance is a specifically Christian principle. IT exists only in Christian societies and IT depends on a Christian world view.

And you have to accept some Christian theological claims about about the Cosmos and about man and god in order to even entertain the idea of something like tolerance or freedom of speech, right? These are luxury goods that only a Christian society can offer row, right? Because, because Christian IT does not compel belief, but pagan societies do. And so the idea that we could have, like, tolerance, and we could have freedom of speech, and we could have sort of a live and let .

live liberty ia is exactly .

without Christianity, is totally false. You actually need a Christian society and a and a public square that is shaped and formed by Christian world virtue in order to have tolerance, in order to have freedom of religion and freedom of speech. So, you know, when the founders, when George washington sent his letter to the hebrew congregation, you know what he was saying in part was, we will not impose force on you.

We will leave you free to practice your faith, because we are a Christian nation, and because we can allow that, we can have tolerance for your, for your beliefs here. Because we are Christian, we are losing that. And when we lose that, we are going to see force and compulsion and coersion come back into the public square with with force. And we're actually seeing that right now. I mean, how much longer are people going to be allowed to be pro life, or to oppose gay marriage, or even to insist that that men, men and women are women?

right? Bow down before my training. god. I mean, that's that's what they're demanding.

Um it's physic people got this backwards and I just want to press you a little bit on the on the question of science. So science flourished in the west and really only in the west people. Science flourish only in the west when IT was Christian.

And as Christian recedes course on attack and disintegrating in in its institutional form, um science is going away too. I noticed that the leaders don't believe in actual science. In imparcial, for example, what's the connection between Christians and science?

Well, what we are saying earlier about you know that there is no conflict between faith and reason. These, these are complimentary truth about the physical world is revealed by god, but it's also revealed to mankind through our reason, through the faculties that god gave us.

We are created in the image and likely i've gotten we can apprehend truth about god's creation through our senses and and through our rational minds uh and and using scientific method, using scientific instruments IT doesn't mean that the only thing that's true are things that we can measure with our instruments, right? But the things that we can measure with our instruments are true. They are part of god's truth.

But when you reject the idea of god's truth through the existence of god, or even the existence of of a rational, unreasonable universe, what you're left with again is is just force and will. And so there's we see now A A comfortably on the part of our ruling elite to simply ignore science, to suppress, to sensor IT whenever IT contradicts their agenda, especially when IT comes to things like the transgender movement. We are all of the science and all of the studies that we have point to how harmful and how dangerous IT is and how the people who are are suffering a century from gender is I need help um and all of that is being ignored in favor of this radical hagan agenda is also is being ignored about social media and screens.

We know that those things are harmful. We push them on kids anyway. Ah so we're going to see this a lot more often too. H and a disregard for science and so like appeals to scientist studies and IT appeals to reason and and to objectively uh observable phenomenon are gonna start to fall on death years because because a pagan regime uh really doesn't care about objective truth and and doesn't care about moral objective truth but also doesn't care about scientific objective truth.

Yes it's it's so interesting I mean that's a refrain my own head every day everyone so unreasonable when the people get so unreason by truly unreasonable if you don't care what the establish facts are um but I haven't connected IT as directly um and as eloquently as you just have to regis faith and is just interesting that everything the reality is exactly the opposite of what we've been promised for the last forty years which is a secular society will be more tolerant and more reasonable religion Christianity specifically is the root of division, the root of oppression um and the root superstition right is the opium of the masses but that the opposite has turned out to be true in my misery this .

no that you're write the opposite is true I think, uh, you know, we had to take a step back and understand like the idea of secularism of of a neutral public space where where everyone was free to kind of have their own opinions and go their own way.

That is a temporary that was kind of this temporary, like, say, sa in the life of western civilization, made possible by the triumph of Christianity, but reliance on on Christianity for its its systems, for its vitality. The the the thing that we're seeing now is a return to form, right? You either have a Christian society and and a public square that allows for secularism.

M and freedom of speech means secularism. The a whole idea of secularism was invented by Christianity, so it's product of Christian civilization. But without that, as Christian tty receives, we're onna return to to a different form of society.

And that's what at me when I say there's only two options here there there's the Christian society and is a pagan society and it's we're going to go under different names where it's not going to take the same forms as I didn't agent times. But the ethos and the Cosmological world view of the ancient pagan world is going to be reconstituted in modern times. And it's going to be very bad.

It's going to be the kindness of society that not even, uh, secular atheist will want to live in. I don't know if you saw the other day the famous atheist st. Richard dawkins, in an interview was saying how he's a cultural Christian, he's not a believing Christian and he's upset that there's so much being made in britain about ramadan because he thinks britain should be a culturally Christian and he likes cathedrals and he likes the old Christmas Carols.

And why can't, why can't we just have that? Well, you can't have that, Richard. If you don't have actual believing Christians who are producing the faith, there has to be somebody in the cathedrals that there is worshipping, somebody who's singing the Christmas carls who believes the content of the words without that cultural Christianne wither s and dies and something else is going to come in and replace IT uh, if if you don't have actual Christians living the Christian life in the public square, in your your nation and in your community.

well I don't i'm a little confused by the leadership of Christian churches in this country and why there's this reluctance um to say obvious things. They're clearly true in the interest of their congregations and of their faith um things that they would be required to say really as Christians um and I even more deeply confused by in many cases, the collaboration um between those churches and a regime that hates them why have so many Christian leaders just stood by and allowed to biden, for example, to poses a Christian or people around him to pretend that this isn't really about Christian Christian why not .

just tell the truth yeah I I have as as a roman catholics myself I had to say i'm dismay and confused about why joy and hasn't I X communicated from the cafe at church by now a joe biden and Nancy pollution in many other major political leaders who prompted to be catholic in public. But IT is very confusing and is this heartening? I think a lot of Christian leaders in amErica have given, have accepted this false notion that wind zone's and being nice is the way to win people over to the faith.

Ah and and not sort of uh you know speaking clearly about about moral truth and I think it's a great mistake because of course the loving thing to do to anyone if you love someone, you tell the truth, right uh you have to tell them the truth if you love them because you don't want them to persist in a lie that that harms them and damages them. So when IT comes to an issue like transgender m, the loving thing for Christian leaders to do is not to pretend this is Normal or healthy but is to tell the truth about transgender ideology to save people who may be ensnared in IT from from getting involved in IT and to help people who are and snared to get out um and a willingness to tell the truth has been sorely lacking from our religious leaders across denominations in the united states. I think that has to change what we have to grow a spine. And our leaders have to, uh, get some backbone and be willing to speak the truth, the Christian truth about men and women, about the unborn, about how society should be structured, about marriage, about children uh, and speak IT clearly and unapologetically in love uh but but without covets that that is loving that is the way to love people as Chris love them and that's also the way to win souls and to convert a nation and a people uh is to not apologize for the truth and and unfortunately, as you say, we have had a lot of mely mouse weak Christian leaders in this country you don't know what time IT is and who don't realize like what we're talking about that our societies becoming post Christian and in the future pagan order that's coming into being in amErica um you you either speak the truth or you accept the lie and too many of our Christian leaders are tactic right now accepting the lies of the regime.

Tucker says its best, their credit card copies are ripping americans off, and enough is enough. This is senator Roger martial of kansas, our legislation that credit card competition act would help in the grip VISA and mastercard have on us. Every time you use your credit card, they charge you a hidden fee called a swipe fee, and they're been raising IT without even telling you this gets consumers and every small business owner.

In fact, american families are paying eleven hundred dollars in hidden s White busy cheer the fees VISA and mastered card charge. Americans are the highest in the world, double canada and eight times more than europe. That's why i'd take an action, but I need your help to help get this past. I'm asking you to call your senator today and demand they passed the credit card competition act painful by the merchants .

payments coalition not authorized by any canada or canada's committee. W W, W. Merchants payments coalition dot com.

At a public urinal. IT just feels like you're standing there too long. What used to seem like a high pressure hose filling a bucket.

Now it's more like a triple notice, a weaker flow and urge to urinate more often. Sleep is interpreted by multiple trips to the bathroom. And IT is steadily gotten worse.

You didn't think about going to a doctor for IT. They may call IT in large prostate or B. P.

H. I mean, no one talks about this is supposed to suck IT up, right? That's what we do. But we know we need to do something, or life is gonna be different.

But what can you do about in large prostate? The good there is a minimum invasive procedure covered by most insurance called the year lift system. Men forty five and ordered go to help B P H now dot com to find a eurolire system trained doctor near you.

Most common side of extra temporary can include discontent, urgency, inability to enjoy the urn, lud set of x, including blading and infection may lead to a serious outcome, may require intervention, the year lift system may be an alternative to medications or invasive surgery. Go to help B, P, H, now dot com to learn more and find a eulie system. Train doctor near you.

But given that you can only serve one master, um I mean you are only serving one master, right? So if you are a bishop or some sort of religious figure who stands nexium cy pola or job and both of whom have aggressively promoted human sacrifice and you don't you know say get behind me stated then you're not you know you you're serving dark forces or you not I mean it's such a see your polite or shy or something it's you're actively working um against the god you claim to serve I would .

think you are and this kids to the other big thing about pegana m and the reason for its persistence right um in the ancient pagan world IT IT was understood that the pagan guys were real beings that they were um uh god, Angels. Uh what what we might call today distent carnet intelligence or moderate dimensional beings, uh, but the point is they were cast out of heaven. So they're here, they're here, right and and they and worshipping them and swearing guilty to them and giving sacrifice to them confer certain benefits.

We ask you to post for a second and just elaborate. So you're saying that in traditional pagan societies, these gods cast out of having moving from the spiritual rum to the physical rump. But we're occupying in physical realm, like you could touch them, they were physically present.

Is that what you're saying? I'm saying, well, they were physically represented in in temples and in idols and yeah and in in rights, in secret rights and reuters, and in pagan sacrifices, human sacrifices and other kinds of rituals. That was, that was how we connected to these these non physical beings. But he was understood that these non physical beings were they they had authority and power over the things in the earth, a over nature, in some cases over the fortunes of nations and arms and rulers uh and that was a pretty universal belief in in the pagan world and he was even, uh a belief of the of the jewish people, although their account corrected the pagan account.

So instead, uh, the god bail, overthrowing his god l and taking the thone, the attempt to overthrow the one true god by lusa hr was defeated, and lucifer was cast down with fAllen Angels and cast down to earth, right? And so to your point about whether about you either serve god or you, you serve, uh the forces of darkness, you serve the devil, that is still true, right? As Christians we believe that's true uh that that that status real that foreign Angels are real uh and that and that the a cult, uh, IT is something that is also real.

And you know, I think people are becoming more more aware of this. That pegged ism changes throughout the ages, and IT takes different forms, and we use different words to describe IT up. But certainly these these forms of worship in other beings, uh, and other gods besides the Christian god are visible now, uh the their manifest now you can see see at working itself out now, not just in like teenagers, uh you know, practicing witchcraft on tiktok though, although that is one manifestation of IT, but also with the trans humanist movement, the transgender movement.

You know it's very pagan in the way IT talks about what human beings are and what our destiny is even in in the artificial intelligence uh community and the push to develop A I these AI developers talk about IT. They talk openly about creating gods. And creating a god that will do things for us that we can do is more powerful than us. It's very it's a very pagan mentality and we need to understand where it's going to and it's heart going anywhere good.

And that is real. I mean, I guess I would argue that every religion, every religion believes that spiritual beings physically walk among us. That's the heart of Christian.

God became man. You got crucified, came back, met with his disciples, eight boiled fish, and then want to have IT like, but he physically existed. And so and I think every society from the beginning of recorded history has believed that being that dimension are right here and you can touch them. And so like, it's real, I think, effort to say.

yeah, I think I think that more and more people are are coming around to that way, viewing the world. Some of them are question, some reject. And so but so they're not going to serve the Christian, got right, going to serve some other being and and they're gonna get more explicit about IT too.

You I think that and there's a whole bunch of different directions that, that this discussion would go and how we don't have time to get into all of IT. But uh but but we're seeing that play out. And I try to explain some of those instances in in the book maybe that people haven't thought of, particular with with artificial intelligence. I think there are some of this going on with the the U F O U A P phenomenon.

Uh, people who are were looking into that and who are deeply involved in that when they're pressed on IT theyll talk about how they believe that they're in touch with these disc beings that are um they're very advanced and that have advanced knowledge uh and that and will confer that knowledge on us for a Price a and this is exactly how like the ancient massive tamia understood their gods as well that that they would get knowledge, secret knowledge and they would get advantages and technology in exchange for serving these gods uh and you know it's difficult for modern man where we're used to kind of a materialist vocabulary and a scientific way looking at the world. But but that's being eroded and and were seeing the creation. Now what C.

S. Lewis called the materialist magician in the screw tape letters, he talks about how they want to conceal their presence. The demons want to conceal their presence from the materialist human beings, uh you know because because that that way they can make sketch tics and and materialist thought of them but they hope someday to develop a newman who is both a materialist and skeptic but uh also recognize the existence of forces while not naming the spirits and virtuous ly worships them while maintaining his kept ism and and that kind of man is coming into being now oh well.

i've met quite a few of them. Um so just depress you a little bit on that on what you said about U F O U P A phenomenon which know I think people are waking up to the fact establish fact. There is something going on.

It's not from china, russia. The U. S. Government has detailed knowledge of IT which is being withheld from the public like that.

All is a establish fact, I would say. Um but in in the reporting on this, the research into IT that you have done, what are your conclusions? Do you think IT is possible that the U.

S. Government has our elements of the U. S. Government, people in the us. Government are in contact with these beings, spiritual beings, I think it's for to say, and have made some arrangement with them as the ancient repetitis did a an exchange of technology for complaints, for for worship.

for something. I think that's the most reasonable explanation.

You think that's the most reasonable. You think that's the most reasonable? That's like the most far out thing and i've ever that's ever entered my brain.

right? Well, again, so so, so again, you know, reason IT phy, think that the most .

three to reasonable explanation. I mean, I agree with you, but I am just.

it's funny if you think, I think, uh, it's more reasonable than thinking that these things come from space. All right now, they don't come from space. I'm aware hea't like these arent little Green men who are like flying ships through, like from mars to earth.

Uh, I I think that uh the U A P phenomenon is is best explained. The most reasonable explanation for IT is that IT is a spiritless phenomenon and the beings that people are hat report having encountered um are discarded multi dimensional intelligences or what Christians would have called demons or Angels and have called throughout human history. And the ancient people have had different names for them as well.

Uh, no, we, I think we call them aliens a to kind of suit ourselves, right? Because for modern man, for a matter alist skeptical modern, it's too much. It's too scary to say all of these are Angels and demons as so we say all there there are aliens, their alliances that's that's more reasonable. Uh, now A I I, I do think that these things are real, that our government has had contact with them, possibly other governments have to uh and if they're it's being kept secret for obvious reasons um but but I think the more you look into IT that h that's really the only a reasonable explanation that you can come to uh you know it's either that or you have to descend into kind of a uh a rat hole of conspiracy theory, uh thinking that you know oh, we have these secret technologies that are totally man made in this the government has invented UFO has an a laborat way to cover IT up, uh you know and and even these videos that we have saw recent years from navy pilots are all fake and and IT becomes a lot less reasonable to believe that than to believe the ancient Christian belief that people have believed for for thousands and thousands of years yes uh and are tested to throughout all human history uh, I think that that is the demonstration explanation. And I think, too, that as we enter into this post Christian era and and this new pack era arises, that's gonna become a lot more obvious.

I I could I couldn't agree with you more. I wonder, though, if you would just expand a little bit on the implications of that. So of the U.

S. Government, which we pay foreign, does all of this, whatever does in our names because it's a democracy, our government. If the U.

S, parts of the U. S. Government, people with in the U. S. Government employees or contractors have made contact with dark spiritual forces, which I think is true, and have made some arrangement with them with technology exchange. You know, that would require them to be complicated.

And whatever these forces are doing, like what are the applications of that? The U. S. Government.

our government, well, yes, so implications of that is that a amErica is not going to decline and fall. AmErica is going to become evil, right? I mean that what yeah if if elements of the of the, uh, deep state, right, we can call the administrative democracy or awarded the permanent deep state, uh, are doing this, uh then that deep state we need to understand that is a hostile force that is setting about uh evil designs uh and and is pursuing mind ends uh and one thing that that that deep state in those forces are not interested at all is in um allowing Christians to sort of flourish and practice there here openly in the united states.

They're not interested in that at all uh and so Christians need to get get that through their head. Part of what i'm trying to do with this book. I should say I don't go into the U A, P, U, F voting in the book, but it's obviously a Jason to IT and and the are obvious a part of the purpose uh my purpose of writing the book is to get Christians to kind of accept the reality that to wrap their brains around what's happening, it's hard to do.

It's hard to accept that your government is, is, is an enemy, not just of a your political party, but but at your whole way of life and in your religion, in your family and your community uh and that you need to be paid for your government to be an enemy and to persecute you and come after you and you need to be prepared to be uh a minority in a post Christian society and and understand what the implications of that are. I don't have all the answers. There is not a chapter in the book says these ten steps will save america. I think the first big step is to get people to realize this is happening. This is the reality and and uh and to I do not kind of trade along like like, uh we live in the nineties without that world is over.

John denial Davison really appreciate this conversation very, very much. The book is pagan america, the decline of Christianity, ty and the dark aged to come. Thank you for writing IT and for telling about IT. appreciated.

Thanks, sucker.

Appreciate IT. Thanks for listening the tucker cross in podcast if you like IT be sure to hit subscribe and liver and remember we only release some of our interviews podcast. The only place you can get all of IT in, including past episodes, is talker carls and dot com, and we hope you will.