Session 79: PinkPantheress
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Hi pussies and welcome back to Therapuss. I'm recording this from my hotel room in Washington DC. I just got back from France. If you didn't see, I had a very, very horrible travel day yesterday. And honestly, like, as I tell the story about it,

I'm like, damn, like it, like it really wasn't that horrible, but like, like I know I'm just so dramatic, but like in the moment, like I thought like my life was over, like in, okay. So, so when I was flying from Nice to Paris for my layover, like I knew I had like such little time to get on my flight and,

And the Paris airport, if you haven't been, is the worst airport in the entire world. It's miserable. It's huge. It's impossible to get around. And like my app tells me this one gate. And so I run to the gate, like sprint, like there is sweat dripping from my face. Like I get on a bus and then I go through passport control and then I sprint. And there's like, there's literally two ways I can go. One to gate K, one to gate M. Okay. Online it said gate M, on the app it said gate K. I'm like, why would the app, why would the app

be wrong. It's feeling like a bit too easy. Like there's no security I have to go through and I know like when you're like getting on a connecting to like America like you have to go through security even after passport even after the passport stuff and I'm like something feels too easy and like I'm dripping sweat. I get to the gate

It's not my flight. In fact, there is no flight I'm just like I have like 10 minutes left and like my body like gives up like I literally can't run anymore I run back anyway, and then I get lost I run back I like try to run back through the passport thing They're like you can't do this and then at one point I just look around I'm holding passandra and dripping sweat and I feel so Defeated finally again on another flight to New York I'm in a middle seat people are eating salmon next to me on both sides and

It was horrible. It was horrible. It was the worst travel day of my life, but I'm here. That's me. That's my update for you. France was amazing. I went to Cannes Lion. It was incredible. I went on vacation. I had such a wonderful time. I barely tanned, obviously, because I can't tan.

I don't even think I got burnt because I put on so much sunblock. Tonight we have on Pink Panther S, who I just absolutely adore. I think she's so incredible. Her music is so amazing and unlike a lot of the stuff we hear today. So it was super, super cool to talk to her. And she's also so fucking funny. Her humor was so similar to my humor. I just thought she was such a fun time to hang out with and to learn about...

her music and her and it was just so fun and I'm really excited for you guys to learn more about her if you don't already I'm still on tour I'm about to perform in Washington DC and then New York at Radio City then Atlantic City then Boston and then I have a few more shows and

To see if I'm coming to a city near you, go to PassThatPuss.com and click live with Jake Shane. And to submit a Tell Me What's Wrong, go to PassThatPuss.com, click Tell Me What's Wrong, and leave a name and number if you're feeling fancy. Okay? Enjoy the episode. Love you, pussies. Hi, pussies. Welcome back to Therapus. Today, we have one of my favorite artists on, Pink Panther S. Hi. Hi, nice to meet you. So your stage name came from the game show and the Pink Panther movies? Yes.

So it came from...

So I was making a TikTok account and then I wanted to call myself... The game show aspect is because I was watching a game show called The Chase. Okay, yeah. And the answer to one of the questions was Panther S. And I really liked the way it sounded. So I wanted to call myself that, but then it was taken, so I put Pinky in front of it. Oh. Like the movie? Yes. Do you like the Pink Panther movies? Of course I do. Well, it depends which one we're talking. Are we talking Peter Sellers or if we're talking Steve Martin? Do you like the Steve Martin ones? Of course I do. Have you seen those ones? I've only seen the Steve Martin ones. Wait.

Wait, okay. Do you remember any of it? Like... I would like to buy a hamburger. Yeah. I remember... I don't remember. Okay. It's fine. I'm very well versed. Wait, I watched your music video for tonight.

Amazing. Amazing. I love it. I love it. Where's the, what was the inspiration behind it? Oh, oh, I was, I was, okay. So I was listening to a lot of older music and I was listening to a lot of, do you know who Jamiroquai is?

Sorry. So there's an artist called Jamiroquai. No, it's fine. And well, he's from the UK, so maybe that's why. Oh, yeah, yeah. And he has a music video from a song he has called King for a Day. And it's very Georgian. It was set in the Georgian times. And I was like obsessed. I was like, I would love to do something similar to this. And I also watched the Madonna, the 1999, I think, or 2001.

Vogue Live. I feel like the Grammys or something. I don't know. I think I know what you're talking about. That performance where she did like, yeah. And I loved it. So I was like, I really want to do something similar and I really...

Yeah. It's amazing. It's amazing. And it's one of your longer songs. Oh, it is actually. It's one of your, because normally you said that you don't like your songs going above 230, right? Yeah. Yeah. But it is, it's nearly three minutes. I think it is on Spotify. It's like three minutes something and four seconds. And then, or do you have any other songs on the mixtape that are just as long? The longer? Yeah. I think,

So I don't know if any of the others actually go over three minutes, but I think they are like similar to tonight. Yeah. Right. Right. And then what, how do you decide between like when you're doing like, it's either a mixtape or an album, like how do you decide? Well, it's all about how you go into it and what you are thinking going into it. So if I'm, I went into this project, not like thinking of as a mixtape. So that's how I proceeded. But if I went on into it thinking it was an album, then I would,

Proceed as such. And then how do you, what's like the difference in your mind between the two? Just how honestly, and this is going to sound really, is how seriously I think about every component. With a mixtape, you have more freedom to be fun. Okay. So I was, I, you can sample more, or I sample more, or I feel like way more liberty to just kind of go crazy and just do whatever, throw in some random bullshit. But with an album, it's like, okay. Yeah. Everybody on mute. Yeah.

Yeah. Do you have like an experience with a song that you overthought and then you were like, you put it out and you were like, fuck. Yes, I feel like I have before. I've had songs where I'm like, I could have just left it at the original demo and it would have been probably a bit more enjoyable for people. But I mean, shoulda, coulda, woulda. Shoulda, coulda, woulda. I read something the other day that was like, those are like the three worst words in the English language. Shoulda, woulda and coulda. Yeah. Because it's like, you can't.

Oh yeah, because you can't. And I was saying this to literally just now with my manager. I was like, whatever. The beauty of an outcome is that you don't know what the other outcomes could be. So you just live with the reality of what the reality is. Do you take a lot of personal inspiration for your music? What's your process like?

Oh yeah, I take a lot of... My process... Well, we were just talking... I was just talking about this to someone else, but a lot of my personal decisions come from my tastes. So... And my tastes are obviously informed by what I grew up listening to and where I'm from. I'm from the UK. So a lot of my music is very... It's all very... It hails a lot from what I grew up listening to. And that's why I feel like a lot of Americans...

are less familiar with some of the genre. Like, other people describe music as, like, hyper-pop sometimes, and I'm like, not quite. Not quite. But, you know, it makes sense why, like, maybe someone from America would think of it as that, because they aren't necessarily too familiar with what it actually is. The genre is called drum and bass. And it's drum and bass, and that's where you'll find the really quick drums and the breaks. And that is a genre called drum and bass, yeah. Or jungle. It kind of leaks into others, but...

That's what a lot of Americans call hyperpop because it's very sped up, quick, very like, but it's not that. But who makes the rules? No one makes the rules. No one makes the rules. So it really is whatever you want it to be. But I wouldn't necessarily call it hyperpop. And then what did you grow up listening to?

Well, this is going to be very broad, but just British music. Because it really just is that. Because British music is its own thing. Right. There are genres, obviously, in the UK, but it really is its own entity as well, in my opinion. What's the difference between that and like... American music. Yeah. Well, I was just saying like America is... You have to remember how big America is. Right. America is a whole... The music over here is its own...

it's a whole it's its own ecosystem like it's a whole climate right in the uk it's kind of like a more like if for example if somebody knows a song up in scotland i most likely they're going to know it down in london interesting and this and it's not every song obviously you have um local music that will like inform a certain area culture or whatever in the uk but generally speaking a song will be nationwide in my opinion

have to put that out there. But like, in my experience of being in the UK, but in America, it's like, you know, like I had, I had, I had an ex from St. Louis who, who would name artists that like somebody from this state wouldn't know. And then this person would know. And this person would know. And they, and even like genres in one state might be different from a genre in another state. And so for that reason alone, I,

I have to call it British music. Yeah. Who are some of your favorite British artists? Lily Allen. I love Lily Allen. Yeah. I really love Lily Allen. She's amazing. Sorry, I got really excited. It's okay. Calm down.

But no I love Lily Allen Isn't she really good She's amazing Have you done her yet No my god I would die I when I was in 8th grade Went through like the big When she released She's Us Yes I went through like the biggest Lily Allen phase That's such a good What's that one song She has on that's gonna That's like a bitch No no What's that one Oh um Um It's called It's hard out here For a bitch Yeah

I liked, I love Air Balloon too. Yes, okay. The whole album is so good, but yes, Lily Allen, I love Imogen Heap, Kate Nash, I love, obviously I loved Amy Winehouse, I love, I mean, who, I can't really name, honestly, a British artist that I really,

don't like because I think all of them have really informed me like all that classic era of like 2001 to like 2000 and like even 10 yeah that was like the golden years I feel like the golden years and then Disclosure came out in like what 2012 and I was like this is a whole different plane of music Disclosure's British? I did not know that that's crazy their live shows are honestly beyond anything they're crazy yeah

Okay. And do you live in London full time? I do. No. I live between here and London. Okay. Okay. I was just in London. I went to Marks and Spencer's. That's my... I used to work there. What? Yes. They have everything ever. Well, yeah. It's like one of those... What do you guys... Like Sears or something. Oh. Oh. Like a Target. What is Sears then? What is Sears? Sears? It's so random that you... What is Sears? It's like a... What is Sears? Sears.

Yeah. You don't know what Sears is? No, I don't. Like, I know what Sears is, but like... But you just never go in. No, and I don't think they have like Sears, like branded food. Oh, right. Okay. Well, forget it. It's like, like JCPenney. Like, it's like Target.

Girl, no, it's not like Target because Target is like our Sainsbury's. What's a Sainsbury's? Tesco's. Tesco's? Do you know what that is? I know. Okay, good. I know what Marks and Spencer's is because I always get the prawn chips from there. Yeah, okay. Well, that's like what...

Target is for us. Or as does, as does actually is, is the British Target. Well, and I love, what's it, itsu? Oh yeah, itsu. I love itsu. You like a little Japanese food? Mm-hmm. I love Japanese, it's my favorite food. Actually, there's another one that I prefer, I feel like there's another one called wasabi you should try. I love wasabi. Okay. When I had an internship, my,

Oh my God. Do you ever like block out periods of your life? Of course. I'm like, where did I work during the time? How old are you? 25. Okay. How old do you think I was? No, I thought you were like 24. Well, I'm 23. You're 23? I'm turning 24 soon. I know. Happy almost birthday. April what? 19. Yeah. Aries? Are you? Scorpio.

What does that mean? It's like dark and... Dark? Angry and full of like... Dark. Anger all the time. No, it's not giving any of those things. Oh, thank you. It's like, am I being fed lies by those closest to me? Oh, right. I see. That's the darkness in you because you're cynical. Oh, okay. Hmm.

But Mike, so no, JC, we were just talking about birthdays and what were you saying before that? You had an internship. What were you doing? See, that's what I'm saying. I forget. But I remember every day I would go to Wasabi because they had one in Times Square. You don't remember what internship you did? No, one time I got fired from an internship. Can you believe? Why? I went on my phone and I fell asleep at the desk. I mean, who could blame you? I know. Well, I didn't know it was my first foray into corporate America and I had no idea that you weren't allowed to go on your phone. Right. Well, falling asleep though. I mean...

And then I discovered without my phone, I get really tired.

- So what you have, what's it called? Narcotics? - No, like it's a phone addiction. - I also have a phone addiction. I'm trying really hard to. - No, it's really bad. - But what apps are you on? Because I'm not, I'm not, are you on social media? I'm not on social media. - What? - I download apps. - Wait, wait, wait, wait. - Like games, apps, games. - Wait, what do you mean you're not on social media? - I know, I'm on social media, my bad. I mean, I don't like, I'm not doom scrolling on social media. - Okay, I doom scroll. - That's not the reason I'm on my, I'm there 'cause I download games. - What games? - All games you can think of. A lot of escape room games.

Are you serious? Yeah, I love a little puzzle. So I just play, like, I download these scary escape room games where you just have to, like, these detective series games. Wait, is it? That sounds fun. Will you send me them? Absolutely. Wait, that sounds up my alley for a game. Good. I need more people to get on board. Okay, I will. Good. Okay. Yeah, so that. So that. Okay. Wait, so what, like, okay, so we were talking music, but what, like, TV shows and movies do you like?

Like, what are you watching right now? Well, I used to be a film student. Really? I'm well-versed in the film department, or I used to be. TV series, I was just, I don't watch any. What? No, I did watch the one everyone said to watch, though. Oh, what's it called? Adolescence. But was Adolescence good?

You haven't seen it? Oh, okay. No, it was really good. I love all the acting was just so good. I know. I heard the kid was amazing. The kid was amazing. I know. And the dad, what's his name? Stephen Graham, I think his name is. I love him. Oh, it's a British show. Oh, yeah.

What other, oh, do you, would you consider British shows in a different league than like in the same like league as like British, like art music? Cause you know how you're like, everyone's watching, everyone's listening to the same thing. Like, would you consider everyone to be watching the same thing? Let's put it this way. My manager's British. And if I feel like, if I said Waterloo road, Coronation street, EastEnders, if I said Holby city, if I said the bill,

She's knowing all of these. Or if I say strictly come dancing or if I say, listen, this is all going frish. No, but you want to know what I do know that you would be shocked? Tell me. What is the way that they speak? And it's, you know, it's like in code, like loop-de-loo. Cockney. I know cockney. I know, I know, I know it. You're fluent in it. Like, what is it?

apples and pears yeah apples and pears the stairs tea leaf your thief oh i've never heard that one what is there more what is there more um oh god dog and bone phone get off your dog and bone your phone yeah you don't like that i like uh apples and pears see that one's not giving for me because i like loop de loo who was that oh i'm sorry i think i just made that up

Crickets. Crickets. I'm sorry. Loop-de-loop. I'm trying to think what the rhyme would be. I think it was soup. Loop-de-loop. Soup. Oh, I feel like you're talking about spaghetti hoops or something. Or loop-loop. I don't know. We'll get to the bottom of it, aren't we? Yeah. And we'll get to the bottom of it. But your rhyme sounds cool. Well, because my best friend is British. Who is your... Do I know her? Her name's Alice. Is she from London? Yeah. Alice? Yeah. Well, she moved to America when she was 12. Oh.

I don't know. But her whole family is British. So I have, I do very British things with them. Like I have a lot of sausage rolls all the time. Oh, yeah, good. Does she have a British accent? She has a British accent with certain things. So like when she says water, it's water. Oh, water. Yeah. Or like room, rum. Room and rum? Room. I don't know, but her parents have like the thickest and her accents and like her brother has the thickest accent. Thick. Yeah. Oh, that's good. Well, that's nice. I would love to meet her one day. Yeah, I'm sure you will.

But it was just, are you going to Coachella? Say that again. Are you going to Coachella? No, I'm actually not. I love your performances. Die for them. Start playing with them. I'm not. Start playing with them, right? I have a really weird thing. I'm going to be so real with you. I was saying in the last photo card, I'm being very open about mental health right now. Let's talk. Let's be open and honest.

So I have OCD. Okay. And so what that means, so what that means is, and it's pure. I have OCD as well. What's pure? Um, I have, so I don't have it like where it's like neat, but it's like, I have to touch things evenly. I have to like count things. I really like intrusive thoughts. Um, I'm very superstitious. So if I don't do it, it's bad luck. If I don't do it, like, um, the family's gone. No, it's more like, like I'm going to get in trouble in my job. I'm going to lose my job. Like, like I'm going to lose my friends. Um,

But it's really bad. I'm on a lot of meds for it. What's Puro? So Puro, well, that for me is like, I don't have any... I don't necessarily have...

many of the fears that you might have about certain things and I don't need to touch anything and I don't really care about neatness. I'm actually quite untidy, honestly. Me as well. However, I do have this thing where once I have a thought, it's loops, loops, loops for the whole, for a month and it will never stop. Never stop. And I get it over, I get it over. My biggest fears, my biggest fears are always just in the loop. So when it comes to performing, I,

how it plays in that role and also one thing OCD does make me personally personally do is it means that if I'm not the if I don't consider myself a certain standard at what I'm doing I don't see the point in doing it or I don't or I don't enjoy it because I'm like well I'm shit so it's like everything either has to be perfect or it's not done right and that is something which that's something which is is actually very detrimental to me as a human being because it means that I can be very negative and very and people interpret a lot of what I say is like

which and I just said this somewhere to someone else but I said like

people rightfully take my words and they obviously take them to mean exactly what I'm saying but what I mean to say whenever I say like I'm shit this I'm shit this is shit this shit is that in my head I have such a high standard I want to be the best but because I'm not the best yet I don't have any way to word it other than just by saying well shit can't be other shit I'm fucking crap and I don't know whether that is something that purely come and that's something that's birthed from my OCD from not being satisfied with anything less than perfect so all

All that to say, with performing, I love performing, yes. I love seeing the people in front of me. That's why I do it. Corley to say, but very much the truth. But I love my fans, obviously. I love people seeing my lyrics back. And obviously, the learning experience of going from somebody that was really shy to then becoming a better performer is an amazing, enriching experience for me. But can I...

When I speak very colloquially and informally to people about it, I don't talk about it in a positive way, no, because I don't. I just simply don't think I'm that good.

that good yet. So until I'm that good, then I'm always going to be a bit like, I understand. So it's like, you can't be like, I can't be ready to go. You're like, if I'm not perfect, I'm not saying I'm great. Yeah. And that's what, and that is really one of my downfalls as a human being. It really sucks because it goes, because it goes with a lot of things that I do. It goes along with even some songs I put out, like genuinely, I'm very, very much, very,

I'm very much a perfectionist and it sucks, but we are here and we work on it, honey. And we are working on it. I'm 23, but that's like the only thing in life. I feel like I, the only, I'd say it's like, I, other than my, like that one, my OCD, I'm so perfectly like, Oh, like life is daisies and butterflies. But when that hits God,

I didn't know what it was because I spent my whole life thinking. We're not getting into this conversation. But my point is, performing Coachella, if I am so inclined one day to do it, I will be there. But I'm not going. Are you going? I am going to go. Who are you going to see? I'm not seeing many people. I think I'm just going to see Charlie. Yes. And Gaga. You're seeing two artists, but you're traveling to Palm Springs. Well... I mean...

very worth it like for the two you've mentioned i think i'm gonna see charlie and gaga and i think i'm gonna see well because i'm also working oh you're working that's okay and i think i'm gonna see post malone i would like to see green day um i mean i've seen them live there's so good i know i love them i want to see 21 guns yeah you kind of look a bit like billy joel armstrong joel armstrong really actually like younger him do you do you think he's fit

You know what, when he was younger, like he was kind of, there was something, there was some material there. There was some fabric that we could work with. Right, right.

so how long have you been producing music for since i was like 17 and how did you start i was producing for a girl i went to school with i thought that well she's she and she's really she still makes music she's really good and i just really wanted to get involved so i was like let me produce i didn't know how to but i just learned as we went uh-huh and it was fun and then you just started putting them out on like the internet so she would put it on spotify but it was for her music it

It was her music, but I was producing for her. She put it out on her Spotify. And then I got involved in my own stuff about a year later and then we dropped it. Somebody leaked our project recently. Really? From all those years back, they leaked it and I was like... Do you not... And how does it feel when your shit gets leaked? What a sentence. Yeah.

hmm i don't enjoy it but i'm not mad equally i'm very when it comes to the internet era of music i'm very as most people watching this or you or anyone that knows me on what i've said in future i'm very very liberal when it comes to music and sharing and sampling i'm very liberal okay yeah do you so you started putting out your own stuff a year later um what what was the moment that was like things were was a shift was it when you put out just for me

I think it was when I put out Break It Off was when I was like, okay, this is like the beginnings. And then Just For Me was like another beginning. And then Pain started doing, so that was another one. It was really weird. It was kind of like, I was like, boink, boink, boink, boink. It was like, you know what I mean? And then like, it was funny because I wasn't, I was anonymous at this point. So it was very much music led. You were anonymous? Like you didn't show your face? Faceless. No way. Faceless. And then when did you...

I dissed when I was about 21, I want to say. And actually, I really did do the whole, when I did the Boyz L.A. Part 2 video. That was when it was really like, okay, this is her. Oh, no way. Yeah. Did you know Boyz L.A. Part 2 was going to be... A big song? Yeah. I didn't think about it. Yeah. And that's really the case with me. Because I'm very familiar with the internet era of music. It's so like...

You never know. So I was just like, I'm just going to expect nothing and just hope for the best. Right. That's the best. That's the best. It really is the best. That's the best. I don't care what anyone says. Like that is the best. If your expectations are set here, then they'll always be met. So true. Is that horrible to say? No, that's OCD thinking. Oh, okay. Yep. Cheers. Oh, what's that? What's the eyes? It's like if you cheers without eyes, it's bad luck. See? Oh.

So what, you can't walk under ladders? No. No. Walking on cracks? Nothing? No. See, I haven't really thought about that. True. But like, under the ladders, I can't do. Umbrellas and doors. Umbrellas and doors, I won't do. I used to like, have to like, look at myself in the mirror 10 times over. Yeah. And be like. Yes, yes, yes. And then I would have to like. I'm not laughing. I mean, listen. It's funny. It's funny. I've had to do some pretty. I've. I've.

I had a very micro phase of that kind of like compulsion doing a very micro phase of it. And I'm trying to remember what I used to do. Oh, you know what I used to do? I'm, I'm a very big maladaptive daydreamer. So sometimes I, this is really like, okay.

So what I would do is I'd pretend to be in this scenario, right? In real life. And I'd be like acting as if something like I was acting like when I was in high school, I'd act like I had a boyfriend. So I kind of like you going around my house, like I had a boyfriend with me. And then if something in real life took me out of it, I would have to repeat. No, no, no, no, no, no. To like remind myself that this isn't part of my own life.

an adaptive daydream storyline in my head. So let's say my mom comes in. I'd have to... It was like, three, two, one, and scene. That was my... No, no, no. Okay, got it, got it. It's a bit complicated. No, no, I actually very much understand that. My one compulsion. I used to have to pray every time I cursed. Girl. Do you still do that? No, but I would like literally speak in tongue. Oh, ah. Yeah, like... I kind of hear it. I would be like... I would be like, fuck. And then I would be like...

Oh, okay. Yeah, a pessimist. And I'm not even Christian, so, like, it was super random. God, that's the biggest gag of all time. Wait, I'm curious about your writing process. Tell me. How do you start a song? How do you, like, because a lot of some artists that I've spoken to, like, they view it as kind of, like, formulaic, where they'll, like, write certain, the verse and then the chorus and then, but does your song, does it just, like, how does it come to you?

um for me it comes from hearing the beat first um whether I've made the beat myself or I'm there's a producer that's given me a beat um I have to get familiar with the beat once that happens then I kind of do melody passes with my voice I'm like you know and then um once that's been figured out then lyrics come last for me

Lyrics come last. Yeah, I feel like most people are like lyrics first or something. No, that's... I've heard both. Oh, okay, cool. I've heard both. Do you have a favorite song that you've had like the most fun producing and writing? Fun? Oh, Angel, which I made for the Barbie movie. That's a great one. What was so fun about it? In that studio, you know what's so funny? You know who came in was... And I... This just kills me. It's Charlie Puth randomly came in. Uh-huh. And I... It was just...

It was just so funny and random. I was like, okay, like he's in the room. Love it. Love it. Love it. Love it. And he's such an eccentric. Like his personality is honestly, I've never been around somebody so eccentric before. Very interesting. But he is, I mean, as we all know, genius. He's kind of like,

I mean, I don't even know if I can even say this, but he's kind of like AI in a person musically. Like, if you need something musically done, he can calculate in his head exactly what chord that should be. Yeah! This, like, he played a chord and I was like, this might be the best chord I've ever heard in my life. And that was, we kept it in. Oh, wow. And he was very cool. He was like, you know, you don't even need a, you don't even need a credit mirror to be in the producer cuts and stuff. And I was like...

And then he whisked away into the night, never to be seen again. What do you think? He's a, you know, he's a very helpful in the studio, really cool experience and very random. And that was really fun. And then we had a random Irish jig come into it and it was just such a fun song and I loved it. How long have you been making Fancy Dot for? Because you said you do it really quick. August last year.

It was actually done last year. It's been done since like November. But we wanted to save it for release to this year. Okay. And then what... When you create a mixtape or an album, do you have an overall theme? It's funny. I don't go into... Well, I wouldn't say that I'm the most purposeful when it comes to themes. I am very... I try to be as consistent. I'm more consistent with... Well, I try and be more consistent with my...

this the references for the sonics if that makes sense so like the beats or the drums or the like if I want a certain tempo then I kind of try and kind of stick to a certain tempo or a feel but themes so much my lyrics I they are all pretty some of them are pretty sad and I didn't necessarily have a theme that I wanted to necessarily completely exude when it came to my last album but people kind of

but there was a lot of songs where i was talking about death and that was something which i guess i consciously did so that ended up kind of being the theme death and then with this one i wanted to be not that like more like fun and mature so this one actually i was like yes this is me being a lot more purposeful with my because as a musician i feel like every every musician's priority is different with their music my priority with my music is always really the way it sounds um

and then the feeling that I give off when I sing and the feeling of it I'm not too

necessarily anal about like this lyric means this and this this it's all feelings okay so you're way more like you're way more of a like a sonic person yeah got it got it got it because i have friends that like don't listen to the lyrics that my best friend alice is like i don't do lyrics like i just do like the feeling of the way it sounds yeah how it sounds yeah did you oh when okay so you said you used to work at marks and spencers in the men's department oh yeah well what was your favorite meal from there

What a question. Because how do they make all of those meals every day? The duck and hoisin wrap was my favorite. And how do they make it every day? Are you talking about the ready meal section? Yes, there's every cuisine. I've never seen anything like it in my life. Oh.

Like you mean which factory are they pumping it from? Yeah, like how is it happening that fast? I love. Oh, you know what is the best? It's the salt and pepper chicken. Ooh, that sounds good. Do you like Wagamama? See, I was going to bring this up when we were having the whole itsu wasabi thing, but yes, that is my favorite, one of my favorites. What'd you get? Katsu curry. Yeah, the katsu curry. See, that's a, not even to be that bitch, but that is, those are rookie numbers. We need to get you onto the yakisoba. I've had the yakisoba. Okay.

Okay. No, I've had the yakisoba. I've had the katsu curry. I've had like a chili ramen. No, I'm well versed. What about the starters? Are you getting the beef brisket power buns? No, I'm getting the squid. The crispy squid. Yeah, the crispy chips with beans. Yes, yes. You are. You're a smear drag.

You are my, yeah. Yes. No, I'm telling you, I'm like well-versed in London food. Amazing. Kind of. People hate English London food. I've never in my life had better Indian food in my life. Thank God you said that because let me tell you, the people I've had to convince-

What? I feel like that's like a known fact. But people aren't convinced. I went to this restaurant called Jamavar. Yeah. Where is that? Mayfair. Okay. I will go. It blew your mind. No, no, no, no. First of all, the birani in London is so different than the birani here because it's like a puff pastry at the top and then they have to like... And we have poppadoms. Poppadom is my favorite thing in the entire world. It's my favorite thing in the entire world. Poppadoms! I love poppadoms. They are my favorite thing too. It's my favorite thing. With the little chutney.

Yes, yes. Like a mango chutney. It's really good. Or the green. Yes, I love Indian food from the UK. I mean, I love Indian food everywhere I go, but really, the UK does it so good because there's a certain sweetness that there is to those dishes. I don't know. But you can't replicate it. You can't. You can't. And like, I tried to get biryani here the other week and it like wasn't in like a, it was like, it's like, it's almost like it's served in like a pot pie as puff pastry and they like, and they cut it around. Damn, I've never had the biryani, honestly. Oh.

I've never had a biryani. I'm really basic when it gets to that stuff. What do you got? I love korma. I love lamb korma. Same, same, same. I love chicken korma. I like lamb korma and chicken tikka masala. Yes, go off. Shrimp coconut curry. We're saying this like we're naming the niches things. We're naming like niches.

I know. But it's true, though. Yeah. So fire. It is so good. A little bit of coconut rice on the side. Oh, wow. Yeah. I love the food in London, personally. Good, good. No one says that. I know no one says that, but they're just maybe not going to the right places. Or they're just so biased against it. People really, I've noticed people who hate British people over here. They hate us. Yeah. They're like, or they make, or they say stuff. They'll be like, they'll be like, I'll see loads of tweets that's like,

um realizing pink's british i can't listen to her anymore i'm like wait why do people not like british people i love british people i think it's i don't know if it's like a fake thing i'm seeing online or if it's real life too but yeah people make fun of us but it's fine i'm sure we don't mind too much did i stick together we try you do we do wait so you said you uh took the mask off in 2021 what was like the decision making that went into that

For the betterment, for the advancement of my career and also just... I think there was a point where I was like, I know I'm going to want to get credited. I know I'm going to one day want to have a face to the name. So I felt like doing that made sense. Was it scary? It was a bit scary. I was actually kind of concerned people were going to call me ugly or something. You know what I mean? And they didn't. But... And honestly, I wouldn't have cared if they did. The fear was more so like...

Doing a face reveal and then somehow affecting my career. Genuinely. I get that. You have to think about it from all angles. This episode of Therapist is brought to you by Booking.com. Booking.com.

I am finally back from France or at least I should be by the time this airs. So we used booking.com to book a lot of our stay in France because everybody has different like needs and it was very difficult for us to go hotel by hotel. So on booking.com we just put in what everybody wants like if somebody wants a lot of mirrors or somebody wants a bunch of pillows or yeah I know that sounds stupid but it

really is like people are very particular when it comes to picking a hotel for vacation and booking.com makes it so easy more so I know it is about to save my life for the rest of tour because we are going to get to these places and once again Matt is going to have nowhere booked so it's just very easy in the morning we'll wake up he'll put in exactly what we want

And which, and I always say we need to be walking distance somewhere so we can always walk because obviously I don't drive. And he'll put that in in the morning and book us all rooms and it'll be the easiest thing ever. Booking.com just really makes booking a stay or a vacation so easy. You can book car rentals if you want to drive. I obviously don't, but some people do. Um,

Really and truly, Booking.com has made booking my trip to France, which hopefully, again, I am back from, so much easier. And it has made this tour so much less stressful because I don't ever have to worry about where we're sleeping because I know that Booking.com will always find something for me. Find exactly what you're booking for at Booking.com. Booking. Yeah! Book now on the site or in the app today. I mean, I think a lot of people were very pleasantly surprised. I don't know.

I don't know. For some reason, I didn't realize it was in 2021. I always thought like, no, okay, 2021, that feels so much closer than it actually is. Yes. I'm like thinking it feels like a year ago and I'm like, but you've been on the scene for like four years and then I'm realizing 2021 was four years ago. Yes. Yes.

It's funny because I feel like my career, I'm funny as an artist. There's a few artists as well like this. And usually a lot of my favorite artists are like this. I am an artist that I'm very happy to like take a little period off and come back. I'm not always like boom, boom, boom, boom in your face, in your face. And that's something I chose by design as well. I don't want to, no, no, it's not. I don't think it's very, um,

Good. Do you, like, is making music still a fun pastime for you? Or is it like now that it's your job, like you're like, okay, I don't want to do this right now when I'm off. Well, no, there was a moment where I feared it would be that. And then I took a break. And then I was like, this is just what I needed. Just what the doctor ordered. Because then I came back into it and I was like, God, I'm so inspired. So yeah, which is good. What do you do on your breaks? Nothing fruitful. I'll tell you now. I don't go on holidays. I don't go on holidays. I've never been on a holiday.

Have you been on holiday? When was your last holiday? Like, okay, no work, right? Like, no work. No work. This is a holiday. Oh. Tell me. For the... Today. No, I went skiing for the first time ever in January. Where'd you go? Courchevel. Is that in America? It's in France. Oh.

Never in my life. And that was probably the first holiday I've taken in a minute. Wow, wow, wow, wow, wow. That sounds really fun, actually. I mean, I haven't been skiing. I'm not going to lie. I don't know if it's for me. But... That's what I thought, too. It was really good for my mental health. Yes, because you're like... Okay, so I was really scared to do it. Yeah. And I went with my best friend's family, the Brit.

british ones and um you guys are flipping best friends no i know we do everything together oh my god me and my best friend like that too really yeah she's yeah what's our sign is she or me well you're an aries what's she is she i don't know anything about she is my actual best friend i just don't know anything about i'm a scorpio and my best friend alice is a pisces so we're like oh my god i didn't know her flipping star sign does that mean scorpio and pisces are like what are you yeah yeah oh

Oh, how interesting is that? How do you memorize all of this? What do you mean memorize? Because in order to know that anything... Like I know that Scorpio and Pisces go together because my best friend is Pisces and like it's a thing where like we are together. Okay, but when someone says like I'm a Capricorn rising, how would you know how to react? Okay, so Capricorn are very like regimented and they're very like...

Like, get shit done. Got you. And so the rising is, like, the mask you portray to the world. So, like, my rising's a Gemini. So, like, I come off very chatty or, like, very, like, social. But, like, that's not who I actually am. So, wait, what would it be for Aries? Aries are very fiery. They're very, like... I am quite fiery. Yeah, they're very, like... People can describe them as, like, very blunt. Oh.

Yeah. Oh, I fear that's me. It kind of read me up and down. Wait, what's my... It's rising. She knows everything.

So your Capricorn rising is why you are so, in addition to also it being your OCD, but it's why you're such a perfectionist. Wow, wow, wow, wow, we are. That's really good information. I might have just made that up, but it's what I think. No, I'm joking. That sounds right, honestly. And honestly, that's all very interesting. The only reason why I get shocked when people know all these things is because I'm like, which part of your brain do you store this information? I used to be addicted to like memorizing things when I was little. You?

You, you, you, you got that. Yeah. You got that OCD. Yeah, I used to memorize library cards. My brother, actually, funny, my grandma told me this the other day. What happened? I saw you. And then you were like, where's yours? Yeah. Well, have they got names? Yes, that's Patrick. And what's this? Cassandra. Oh, that's good. Right? Cassandra's like, you know, I haven't, I need to take her to the dry cleaner. Really? Yeah.

Smells really good. No, Patrick's clean. Oh. Cassandra's been on planes. She's come with me on tour. Oh, okay. On tour? Yes. Oh, yeah, because you, oh, okay. I did see that. That's really good. I love it. Do you? Have you done like a full-fledged tour before? Hell yeah. Yeah, I get that. So is it not scary? It's terrible. You've got a harder job than I do. Yes. No. Yes. Why do you say that?

Well, I'm imagining your tours as you like talking. Yeah. Yes. That is difficult to do on stage. It's just it kills when you say something that you think is so funny and everyone's like, like, it's horrible. And you have to then my my escape from that is acknowledging that it missed. Well, that's what I used to do. But now I kind of just allow it to not.

right what do you mean like like i used to do the same thing when like if i say something because i say so much stuff right so and a lot of what i think i'm hilarious obviously you were a fucking hysterical no you didn't need to agree with me thank you i wasn't i wasn't trying to finish right then but but no no no no no no that's not what i'm trying what i'm saying is what i'm saying is i think that i'm funny and then i'll say something and then obviously especially in america because i'm british and we have actually a different sense of

humor we just have a different sense of humor i feel like there's crossover this cause it's way more dry it's a lot more dry and it's hard to tell when someone's telling a joke so i'll say something and also i feel like i think things are funny and they're just not too fair and like silence but i used to do the acknowledgement i used to be like so none of you found that funny but now i'm just like right but i think it's funny when you acknowledge it is funny when you acknowledge so it is funny yeah yeah i think because now i think people think i'm like

like really weird what i think you're honest to god i i think you are one of the funniest guests we've had no i i don't think i'm weird i think i'm i think i i just think a lot of americans because of the timing are like oh i don't know if she's joking or not and i think they think that i'm a bit like off kilter whereas back in the uk it's like we are all like like this isn't weird right but you didn't know what we were going in for then did you i'm gonna trick you

No? Okay. Let's move on. What next? Oh, I'm having a really fucking fun time with you. Are you having a fun time? I feel like we're on a date. I also feel like we're on a date. And like, it's one of those things. I... Oh? I feel like we've really just developed a new friendship. Romance? Oh. With each other. Oh, sorry. I thought you were going to say romance. Well, it's okay. Well, this is like a friend date. Right. I just meant, I think I thought it was something different.

Anyway, but yeah. Okay, I'm going to ask. I don't think I'm really excited to ask you this. Okay. What are you therapist about today? Oh, therapist. What am I mad at in the world? What aren't I? Let me not. Let me personalize this. So I'm not talking about something we'll talk about for years and years to come in this podcast. But personally, what am I therapist about in my own life?

I'm not gonna say anything about myself because I want to be nice to myself today. Oh, I love that. You know what I mean? I was so nasty to myself this weekend. Ew. That's peak. But I know how it is and that's me a lot of the time. I was like, wait, I feel ugly so I went home. Oh! No, you left somewhere? Yes! No! I was like, I looked in the mirror and I was like, I'm gonna go home. Mm.

yeah and then i went home and i watched tv and i had that it was amazing oh that's good yeah you went home and you and you did the right things but and then i facetimed my friends by facetime my friend and they told me they were like what you look really good without even me fishing i even say like i love because i look ugly and then i was like well i just go it sucks i know exactly the feeling and i i know that feeling so well but um yes what am i therapist about i'm trying to think what this week has really gotten got to me uh i don't really

Do you want me to go first? You go first. I'm pissed about traffic on a Sunday. Well, that's what I was going to say. Really? I was going to say traffic on specifically the day of today because I thought it was a weekend or I thought it was Sunday so there would be less people on the roads but there were more people. Isn't that strange? No, it was 9pm last night and I was stuck in traffic and I was listening to This Is Nicki Minaj for three hours. Naturally. And it was amazing but like,

It was also horrible because we were in bumper to bumper traffic and it was 9pm on a Sunday and I was missing white lettuce. That's just so shit. Yeah. I'm going to say, okay, on that strain, I guess I'm therapist about, oh goodness, goodness, goodness, goodness. I'm going to say I need to cut my hair and it's really long.

So underneath this hair, this is a wig. I want to show you kind of slightly, but I don't want the camera to pick up on everything. Do you want to hide? There you go. You see that? Okay, so it's shorter. So you see this? This is my natural hair underneath. This is a reveal. I've never done that before.

And I feel like a lot of people are now going to not be able to unsee. But yes, my natural hair underneath is really short. What is the length? Like here? Oh, like yours, literally. And then why do you need to cut it? Because it's too long. Because that's the thing about... It doesn't work with wigs then? It doesn't... Well, for me, you don't want to... There's a whole... Listen, this is a whole... There's a whole climate in here. And I'm telling you, if the hair's too long, then it bunches too much and it makes the wig look too thingy. So you kind of need to like...

Got it. And look, even right now, I'm like, I'm being much of my thing. I'm like, there's a fucking kind of bump going and it's annoying me. But like, again, we're being nice to ourselves. We are being nice to ourselves. So, and I've never said that, but maybe you were the catalyst I needed to realize like being nice to yourself is so important. I think you were the catalyst I needed to realize that because I made a video this weekend that was like normalize calling yourself ugly. Yeah.

And then I was like, wait. Like, why should we? Why? Am I the problem? That's one... I will say, actually, that's very interesting. My... So is a lot of your, like...

When you're like, God, I feel like, is it a lot to do with when you look inside the mirror and you're like, I want to go? It's just like everything. Like, it's like the mirror. It's like how I feel in my own skin. It's like, oh, I feel gross. Like, I feel like, and then when I'm out, I'm like, I feel like I'm constantly like looking for a partner. And if I'm like, if I'm feeling ugly, it's like, I don't want. Oh, like you're looking for something. Are you looking to date right now? Desperately. Really? Desperately. I don't know why I thought that you were some way, some, I don't know why I thought you were in a relationship. I don't know why you were giving that, but that's actually, I thought you would have mentioned it. You would have said like my boyfriend or something.

or something. Yeah, I would have. I've never had a boyfriend. 25? I mean, there's no rush. I haven't had sex in two years. But what's the problem? What's the problem? I can't find anyone. No, no, no. What's the, I mean like, so you're really trying to get in that bedroom, huh? Yeah, like, I'm. There's people you can call. But,

I'm desperate. Aside from that, there are so many people for you out here. Thanks. I've got my roommate actually might be interested. What? Well, if you like. Yeah, if you like. He's kind of tall though. I love a tall guy. Okay, I might do that. Send me up. I might do that. That'd be really nice because he's also looking for somebody right now. Really? Yeah.

He is. Listen, I'll make sure it works. You're both cute. He's cute. You're cute. Why not? Why not? Something fun for the girls. For the summer. Summer romance and we can go on double dates because I'm, you know. In a relationship? Yeah. We can cut it. I am. I mean, I already said on TikTok that I was. Oh, you did? Yeah, I did. But not too much. But yeah. Well, we're going to... Listen, LA actually I thought was good for dating. Oh my... Says who? Well, no, not me. But I've never...

I don't really date in L.A., but you, is there not a lot of gays looking for love? There's so many. I'm literally, like, tell me. Like, you would think so. But they're just not for you. Oh, you know what it is? They're all twinks. And you're not into that? I think. Well, you are. Oh, got you. Like, I'm looking for, like, a top. True. And, like, they're few and far between in L.A.,

I've got you, got you, got you. And if there are, they're taken. And then if there are, everyone's like, it's like, have you seen the Hunger Games? Oh God. You know, the cornucopia? So that's what it's giving. It actually is definitely giving that to be honest from what I've seen and heard. But no, that's magical. You're going to find somebody. Two years, huh? Two years. Yeah. But like, can I actually say something? Please. It's not.

I would put it this way I wouldn't mind a two I if someone said two years break I wouldn't say no but you've at least like I know I have no I get what you're saying like the options there but I'm saying like a break is good go back into it and it's been a while and you're just like I know but like for me it'll be like ow do you know what I mean I understand what you're saying like you know what I mean I do get what well in so many words I get what you're saying yeah

Got you. Got you. Before I let you leave. Not that. What is this? It's nothing crazy. Okay, good. It's just the tell me what's wrongs. So the pussies write in and they tell us what's wrong and we give them advice. Where did your name come from, actually? What? Pussy? So, okay. I reviewed Octopus. Like, I love eating octopus.

yeah ridiculous yes and so i would go at hi pussies and like hi jake tense up like tentacles up and i would eat octopus and i'd rate it out of eight because they have eight tentacles so i'd be like seven out of eight tentacles you really enjoy eating octopus i've never had it wait where's the best place to get it no boo poo chaconis west hollywood okay it's amazing okay angelini is amazing uh there's a place in florence that's incredible okay cool uh one time i went to uh

What's it called in London? Hakkasan? Oh, yeah. I love that place. Me too. I got the best octopus from there. Okay. Must try. I know. Am I so well-versed in London food? Are you kind of gagged? I'm gagged.

Wait, so you, did they know I was coming in or is it like for everyone? Okay, good. It's for anyone. Yeah. Good. It'd be for anyone. Because I like to leave things up for surprise. Like that. This one guy is leading me on and trying to get with me, but his girlfriend is my, she's kind of my friend. How do I handle this without being messy? It's a mess. I mean, you can just, can we not silently reject the man and call it a day?

Wait, is that... That does apply. That could apply to that. Yes, and he's lying to his current girl. Girlfriend. Silently reject. You know what I would prescribe? Wow, you really do have a vocab here. Boy's a liar part two. Ah, to like listen to and like, yeah. Because he's a liar. True. The girl that he's going for should listen to it, yeah. Yeah. And get some motivation to just... Yeah. I mean, no. I mean, why...

so does she i mean i would love to know more about this separately does she like him back or something yes she wants to go for him even though he's in a relationship with her friend i always think about what i would do in this situation i but i've never been in a situation where i fancy as soon as i know someone's in a relationship i'm like you're not cute anymore oh because they're a liar no because they're in a relationship oh like i just turn it off i'm like i'm done here yeah my mission my work is done oh i get jealous

Do you? I turned off my jealousy receptors when I went to a girl's school. Really? Turned them right off. I said, nah. Nah. I genuinely haven't.

But that's something that comes with OCD. That is an OCD thing for me personally, yeah, because ERP, you have to learn how to filter which thoughts you want to enter the consciousness. What's ERP? ERP is a form of therapy for OCD. Exposure therapy, yep. So I did a lot of that. So I can choose. I'm very lucky, by the way. This is a very lucky thing to have. I can choose which thoughts to dwell on. Jealousy, I said, uh-uh, we are done here when I was like year nine. I think I need to go to your ERP. Well.

Well, it's hard. It's hard, but once you get it, you get it. I used to not be able to add songs to playlists, so my exposure therapy... Swear to God. My exposure therapy used to be adding a song to the playlist and letting it sit there. Really? Yep, and I would sit there for 30 minutes, and she'd be like, how are you feeling? That's really cool, actually. I'm kind of gagged by that. Mine would be... What would it be? It would be talking about existentialism and... What was it? She'd like...

She would make me talk about being older. Oh, got it. You're so young. Well, thank you. You are. Thank you? It's a fact. Okay. I don't know why I said thank you. My friends are all really fun and match my vibe, but one of us is the star of the friend group, and I can't take it anymore. She's annoying about it, too, and I don't know if I'm jealous or if it's just getting out of hand at this point. Help? Well, I've been in this situation...

there's definitely a way that you could but this is the thing i again are learning not to be jealous you learn to realize that some people have a natural star power and i hate this word but all

some people have that word because that word has been ruined by bloody social media, TikTok, whatever. It's been ruined. It's now a corny turn of phrase in my book, but it kind of has like, I learned that some people naturally have it and some people naturally don't. But the thing is, if you don't have it, then you can't hate on someone for having it. So the girl writing this in, you have to look inwards and think, is it because I just,

I'm not necessarily as vocal or as like quote unquote fun or as mystical as said person, or is it because she's doing too much? Right. She needs to figure that out because if they're doing too much, then girl leave the friendship group or tell her and be like, get out. Calm the feet down. Do you watch, do you watch the white Lotus? No, I don't. Okay. Did you see the finale last night? Okay. So what I'm going to bring up is there is a monologue in the finale last night where

where Carrie Coon is like, so there's this group of three girls throughout the show and they all talk shit about each other the entire time and they bitch about each other and they fight. And then in the finale, Carrie Coon comes to this realization. Sorry, am I spoiling for you, Louise? Okay. She comes to this really beautiful realization where she's like,

I don't know. What would you say it was like? Yeah. She's like, our friendship matters. Like, even if we're just doing nothing, like it feels deep to me. And then she like gets past the point and there's like this star of the friend group. Her name is Jacqueline. And she's like, and she looks at Jacqueline and she's like, I'm really happy that you have a beautiful face. And she turns to this other girl and it's like, I'm happy you have a beautiful life. Um, and I'm just happy to be at the table. Amazing. And so I would maybe recommend that. Well, that's good. It was really moving. I cried. Oh,

No, I didn't. Sorry. But I teared up. The very subtle lie that, well, do you lie comfortably?

no see i but i told you right after see i said i cried see that's me too i do and i call it a prank anyway i do i do i do you did prank me a little bit no i never i am so uncomfortable lying because well back to my ocd i always feel the need to over explain myself and over tell the truth so i can't lie that's so true otherwise then you're a bad person if you lie too much yes okay boom

Yeah, I already answered the question. I mean, like, friendship groups are a bit peak, though. I really do love just a one-on-one best friend. I've got a few best friends. Love them. But a little circle. Do you find it hard to make friends after you've chosen this as a career? I think it's harder for me to meet people. But I think that I'm somebody where if I meet someone and there's a gel, I don't let them go. Do you feel that way? If they don't have me. Do you feel that way about us? I mean...

because i do that's really cute and honestly i would definitely love to join you guys's friendship group and be the star yeah and be that star that you're looking for no i'm joking i think you're great i think you're really fun and yeah i don't i i would listen we're gonna be getting uh no boo at some point no uh-huh yeah no you said this was bad from now it's not great okay oh you know where we should go actually where and i'm actually being so serious about going where i'm

I love Kukaku. I love... Yeah, it's the best. Kukaku. Do you like Korean barbecue as well? Yes. Okay, so across the street from Kukaku in Beverly Hills, Janwha. I know. That's my favorite place in LA. Okay, so we'll set it up. Yep. I will love... Imagine if I go on that and just set that up for us. That's... Yeah. Oh! I see.

I want to become a singer slash songwriter and I don't know where to start or if I should tell anyone. My family and friends aren't exactly the biggest artist type of people. Any advice? Don't tell them then. Like, don't tell them. Like, honestly, this is the advice I give to so many because a lot of people have the same issue. And my advice is don't tell these people. Because I knew it was going to hold me back if people knew in my life because they're also not musical people, you know. Your family? My family and my friends. Got it. And I was worried about judgment.

And so for me, I blocked them off everything. I didn't tell them. Kept it a damn secret. And I allowed myself to blossom in private. And there's no thing I love more in life than a secret. I love well-kept secrets. God. Really? Are you a good secret keeper? Yeah. I mean, yeah. I love when people have secret passions that aren't illegal. Okay, wait. So how long were you able to keep this from your family and friends for? Honestly, a good while. Like, I don't know.

no you know what's so funny it was it was about one month after pain had like taken off and like my friend sent it to me and was like this sounds like you and i was like it's not me shut the fuck that was one thing and then i and then i in the same as you i'm like i can't lie i can't lie so i had to be like actually it is me and that was very gagged huh were they like i'm gagged weirdly enough i actually they weren't that gagged they were kind of just like oh that's really cool good for you i was like

Fair enough, actually. I'm really happy at that reaction. I don't, I will say I don't do things for reaction. Okay, but you had a Hannah Montana, then you lived Hannah Montana. Kind of. Got the wig too. That's fucking awesome. That's another receptor I had to turn off. I had to turn off the caring about appearance, like people commenting on your appearance or me bashing my own appearance. I had to turn it off. It's gone. I can't remember what it feels like. Can I ask how you turn them off?

For me, it's just every thought that comes in. Like, let's say I'm looking at myself and I'm like... Right. I'd say for me, it's about... When the thought comes in, it's about letting the subconscious thought come in, but literally not letting yourself... Like, your conscious thought dwell on the thought. Because you know how thoughts go like this? You get the... This is how thoughts work. You get the subconscious thought, and then your conscious brain is, like, questioning that thought. It's like, well, I'm not actually that ugly. Well...

my best friend said i was really pretty today so i can't actually be that ugly or you'll take selfies to try and these are the compulsions you take selfies looking at them back once you cut all of that out once you don't want if you get the thought i look kind of ugly today and then you cut out all of the compulsion part to like make yourself feel better like you will i promise you like the thoughts will very much either dim down completely or they'll go

This isn't for everyone, though. I think that is some of the most poignant advice ever given on this show. Girl, like, it's... Girl, it changed... Like, the only way I can live is, like, doing that. That is amazing. Oh, that reminds me of a quote I saw once that was, like, emotions are, like, people on the street. Like, you don't have to acknowledge them. Exactly. I think a lot of people... I will say, the only reason why I'm saying, like, it's only... It's not every brain that can...

comprehend this kindness and I'm not saying I'm different I'm not I'm not I had to train myself for years and years so it's not something that you can like do like you really it's like I and I went through a lot of BS thinking wise right and a lot of time by myself to figure it out but yeah I mean damn like anyone can do ERP and it really helps anyone like you don't need to have OCD to ERP right anyone can do it wow I think I'm gonna try to practice that tonight because I have a an event I'm going to and I'm really anxious about it and I'm gonna feel ugly see

Exactly. Try it tonight. Like look in that mirror and kind of be like, okay, I'm having these here, but actually this is what it feels like. It feels like this. What was that just then? That was silence. Okay. Yeah. So that silence, that is exactly what you, that's what your brain should be thinking when you get that thought. Can we try one more time? Yeah. Okay. Allow your subconscious to call you ugly right now. Okay. And then practice what we're doing. It's so freeing. Just like, wait, shut up.

Yes. It's like, wait, shut up. Yeah, it kind of, well, it kind of is treating them like they're nothing. Yeah. Yeah. But listen, yeah, it's not for everybody, but if you struggle, then it's good. It's good for anxiety. I've been in a situationship for 3.5 years. No. And we finally had a real talk about feelings. And then the next week he had a new girlfriend. Should I tell her and how? Well, we can't know unless we have the, we don't know what was in the contents of the conversation. Yeah.

Because what if they decided that they weren't right for each other? I mean, a week later, though. Fuck, you know? I mean, that might mean that he was cheating, though, if there was overlap. Should she tell her? No. I don't think so either. No, because what? Because, yeah. No, only tell if there's overlap that you are very, that you can discern. So maybe do some detective work and see if there was overlap. For me, personally, I'm not doing that detective work, honey. I'm going to bed. I'm going to bed like this.

Good night. Very silently and very comfortably. But if I find out there's overlap, of course I'm going to tell someone. Of course I'm telling you. Hell yeah. Hi, Jake and gorgeous guest. How do I get over a friendship breakup with a group of 11 girls? Oh my God. I didn't do anything wrong. I just drifted away from the friend group. I've been friends with some of them since I was five and I've spent my whole life with them. 11. I know we can't be friends forever. 11.

I know we can't be friends forever, but I feel like I can't even state my case. They keep avoiding me. Oh, my God. I have been there. 11 girls? No, less, but I have been there, and it is genuinely the most heart-wrenching, worst feeling I've ever experienced. Like having to leave a friend group? No, like being left is what they said. Oh, they leave. What this sounds like is like she drifted, and then they were like, we're done.

And now they won't tell her why. It's so immature. Like, you really just have to tell yourself, like, if they're behaving this way, like, this isn't who I'm going to want to be around. Well, actually, this is something that I came to reckon with. Girl school. Girl school. I learned everything about life in that place. I'm being so serious. And I will say, for me, it's as simple as,

Choosing not to be friends with people that treat people so disposably. If that makes any sense. And this isn't just friends. This can also be your boyfriend, girlfriend, lovers. Any type of lover or friend or anyone in your life that you can tell treats things very...

at their disposal I can't and there are signs where you can tell like what are some of the signs like not being able to tell friends I mean this isn't also a must by the way these are my signs these are my personal signs which I look for when I'm looking for a close friend I like friends that say they love me I like I like friends that can it's not a required thing but I like people that

can laugh at themselves when they're with me. Need to self-deprecation is key. You have to be able to laugh at yourself, but you also have to laugh at me. I actually, funny, this is quite controversial. A lot of people don't understand why I do this. I only really like friends, not really like, sorry, but my best friend, the way that, the reason my best friend is because she literally,

kind of like bullied me what yeah she's not gonna like me for this but she knows exactly what i mean she bullied me into being a better version myself i have similar situations she bullied me into like i'm telling you like she wouldn't let me get away with anything and what and the reason why this is good i mean some people say it's bad for me the reason it was good was because it stopped me being a little a little what do you call it i stopped me being super sensitive it taught me the ability to joke at myself it taught me the ability to like

I mean, exactly that. Take a joke. It taught me to take a joke. Taught me to... That's not to say that everything's a flipping joke. There are obviously some things we have to take seriously in life. But when it comes to me, if you're poking fun at me...

I'm like, I have no choice but to take it as a joke. Me too. I just can't like, I even, that's why exactly with the internet comments and like, I can deal with being a person in public, in a public eye now, because if somebody says, Oh, she's mid, Oh, she's ugly. Oh, she's this, she's fat. She's like, I'm like, I don't have the receptor again to care anymore. Right. Right. I've already had this growing up. Like, sorry, my best friend wasn't saying anything of the sort to me like that, but even having her like me wearing some trousers and she's like,

So it's like sisters and she, it was like sisterly, like she had you grow thick skin. Yes, that's exactly what it is. And I'm so thankful for her and I love her for that because she taught me the element of humor. Yes. Oh, that's awesome. Love her. But yeah, but,

You've had that too? Yes. And going back to this girl, like if your friends can't teach you anything and they're not, they're not even talking to you. And there's no love? In five years, like I know this sounds crazy right now, but in five years you were going to look back and be like, oh my God, thank God. Yeah. Thank God. Thank God. Cause it led me to whoever I'm with five years later. Disposable, genuinely, so many people that think of others as disposable. And honestly, a lot of couples, I fear there's a lot where couples, where one member will be somebody that's fairly like disposable. Right.

And that's why a lot of... There's a lot of advantageous partners out there that take advantage of their partners because they know that... The couples that don't work, in my opinion, are couples where... I feel like you either have to be both or... What's it called? I'm trying to separate so it's an easier conversation. So let's call... There's two types of people in the world. I've described this a few times. In my opinion, the way my brain works, there's two types of people in this world. You have people that are kind of, in my opinion, more...

more shallow surface level emotionally tied people and then you have people that are like really all in I will die for you I love you like we are tied soulmates for life I used to be this person I used to be a more shallow enjoyer of friends and family whatever I used to be that person and

until I met my best friend and until I got older and I met my managers and everyone. And I realized that being for me personally, it works way better to be an all in. I'm invested in you. We're going to be friends for life. You're going to be the Godfather, Godmother of my kids. You know what I mean? And so now these days I don't choose to make friends with people that I only see as like, you know, like,

We're friends on the weekend. Right, right. I can't do it. It's really hard for me because I'm like... Because I always have this doubt in my head that you'll have my back. And I need people to have my back. Right. Also, as you grow older, like...

in white lotus last night she she said as i as we grow older i feel that uh it's hard it's we need to justify all of our decisions like we it's harder to make passive decisions because everything needs a justification as you grow older and i think part of that is that wow sounds like i need to watch this it was seriously no no her monologue last night changed my life because i was like yeah because i because everyone hated that friend group the entire time everyone hated them

And something about it, I was like, no, they love each other. And I know they love each other. You do. Okay, Pink, what did we learn today? I honestly learned a lot about you. You learned a lot about me. I learned a lot about you. What'd you learn? Well, I learned that you won, like, a lot of Japanese restaurants in the UK. I mean, that's, I mean, come on. That's rookie, rookie numbers, as I said. You have OCD. Uh-huh. You enjoy going on tour. Mm-hmm.

and that you make it obvious when your joke didn't land. You know what I call nuggets? Nuggets? Do you guys call them that over here? Like a punchline. The nugget didn't land. Oh, okay. I like that. That's a good nugget. Yeah. I mean, yeah. I learned that you're a perfectionist, but it's tied back to your OCD. And you've actually done a lot of work on your OCD because of exposure therapy, and you're able to turn those negative receptors off in your head. Yeah. And that you're a really, really fun time person.

Thank you. And I love hanging out with you. That's really sweet. You are amazing. You're so funny. You're so funny. Did you, what did you explore? I mean, you said you listen to my music. What did you expect something coming in? Were you meeting me or did you kind of like, I thought, I didn't think you were good. I knew you were funny. I did not think you were going to be this funny. Yes. I did not think you were going to be this funny. Like I thought I was going to be the leader. Like I thought I was going to be, I'm a star.

No, I thought I was going to be way more intimidated. And like really, cause like, I don't know. I thought you were going to be like, I'm the coolest. Like, I don't know. Like, I don't know what I was expecting. I was scared. That's really fun. You, as in, you thought I was going to be on like some stuff. So like superstar shit. So I'm like, but you got really vulnerable and really honest and really fucking funny. That is just, I will say that's so interesting. I'm really want to set the record straight. I'm not that at all.

No. Well. Well. No, you are so fun and thank you. Thank you. Thank you for being here. Well, pink. Thank you. Thank you for being here.