​​The TLDR Interview: Jonathan Pedneault, Green Party of Canada
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Hey, this is Devin Friedman again. Welcome to the second of our conversations with candidates for Canada's federal election. As I explained in the first episode, feel free to go back and listen to the preamble. We are doing something different this week. We decided to go to the candidates themselves to explain how they are going to meet one of the most pivotal economic moments in recent memory.

These interviews were conducted by Mike Ketchum, the CEO and founder of Wealthsimple, who is, of course, the sponsor of this podcast. And remember, none of these interviews are endorsements. Here is the second in our candidate conversations, this one with Jonathan Pedno, co-leader of the Green Party of Canada. Good morning. Good morning. Thank you for taking the time to do this. Of course. Yeah, always happy. Excellent.

Absolutely. Well, I grew up the son of a single mom who struggled with mental health issues. So we, on a few occasions, had to rely on the

social benefits. So, of course, I'm a strong supporter of the continuation of taking care of the most vulnerable in our society. I think that we, all of us, have a debt to Canada. This country has provided many of us with tremendous opportunities, regardless of our personal background or family background or history. And this costs money. A state like

The one we have built through the sacrifices and the incredible contributions of generations before us requires maintenance and it requires taking care of it. So it's an incredibly busy time for you. I'm sure you're out on the campaign trail talking to so many Canadians. Tell us a little bit about what you're hearing from folks. What's top of mind and in particular, anything that might surprise us, anything that surprised you in those conversations? Yeah.

I don't think it's going to surprise anyone, but of course the threat from the U.S. is on many people's mind. The tariffs, the statements from President Trump, the feeling that Canada may not be prepared to face the sort of changing world order. Everyone expected this election to be about the cost of living. It's turned out.

to be much more focused on, of course, our response to the United States and the need to reinvest in defense, in protecting Canada, in shifting our economy to adapt to this new reality. We often get asked, don't you think climate is taking a backseat in this election? And I quite frankly don't think it is.

We're discussing energy an awful lot, or at least other parties are discussing the question of conventional energy an awful lot. We're discussing, of course, the economic pain of the tariffs, which will have an impact down the road as well on our ability to withstand the challenges that are brought forth by climate change. Tell us a little bit more about your views on the trade war, on the threat of Trump and tariffs. What do you think the right response is for Canadians?

I think the Canadian economy for all too long has been trapped in this sort of cycle of ease and facility of our proximity with the US where we've allowed ourselves to grow ultra dependent on them. And in so doing, we never clearly understand

grew out of our infancy as a colonial economy. We extract our raw resources, we ship them abroad to be transformed and then sold back to us. And the various free trade agreements, we've sort of gutted the manufacturing capacity here in Canada, not to say, of course, that the future of Canada is through that kind of manufacturing, but at the same time, we've allowed a lot of well-paying jobs to be shipped abroad.

And now we have to contend with the fact that the United States is a non-trustworthy partner and not one that is likely to go back to, you know, the days of yore when we could

trust them entirely the way we did. So in that context, I think we have the opportunity not only to attract a lot of investments internally, but also from abroad to try and replace the market share that is being abandoned by the U.S. Because when the U.S. turns its back on its allies, its allies, whether it's in Europe or Asia or South America, will not presumably want to trade as much with the United States. We could become the manufacturing hub for the democratic world.

So on this thread of investment, you know, I saw a pretty sobering stat that I've talked about a lot over the last couple of years that the BDC published a study in 2023 that found that there are 100,000 fewer entrepreneurs in Canada today than there were 20 years ago. And when you think about attracting investment and building in the face of the risks that we as a country face, I think entrepreneurship and inspiring people to build out of it is such an important part of that solution.

Tell us a little bit about your views on entrepreneurship and how to get more people to build in Canada. Yeah, there's a few things I think that contribute to this stat. One of them is the fact that, you know, smaller players in our economy face an awful lot of red tape versus the larger ones. And of course, the cost of entry to start a business is extremely high here. So we have in Canada not only a colonial economy, but also an economy that's dominated by monopolies.

We've called for excess profit taxes in that regard as a way to hopefully diminish the incentive for monopoly building. But we also need to recognize collectively that it makes no sense for young people to exit university with an awful lot of debt the way they do right now. You know, we've been calling for free tuition for several decades now as a party. And clearly when you

When you do everything you need to do, you go to university, you graduate, you've got $30,000, $40,000, $50,000 in debt. And so the idea, both for you, but also for potentially for the banks or other investors to say, oh, okay, we're going to help you out with seed money here to start a business, that becomes very difficult.

We feel very similarly on access to education. And in fact, we worked super hard over the last number of years to get the Canada Learning Bond, which is one of the most generous, you know, education sponsored plans in the world to become auto enrolled. And we think that's just a huge step forward towards, as you point out, making post-secondary education more accessible for Canadians. Absolutely. Talk to us a little bit about your view on the oligopolistic nature of Canada's business. We operate in one of those industries in financial services industry.

And, you know, like to view Wealthsimple as a player that has made financial services more competitive, made it more affordable, more accessible for millions of Canadians. What else do you think needs to be done to improve financial services in Canada? I think a lot of Canadians...

see and struggle from the limitations put on their own money by a banking system that remains fairly antiquated, very slow, very complex to navigate, just as with many financial products and just as with taxes as well from the federal government. So a lot of the rules should be simplified.

There's a need for a lot more financial education in this country, starting at a young age. And that's something that is still very difficult to access, I think, for a lot of young Canadians, which then leads to poor financial decision making down the road.

which benefits by and large, large financial institutions oftentimes. Well, it's one of the reasons we appreciate you coming today is I think a big focus for Well Simple has been how do we empower Canadians with the information they need in a way that is consumable and accessible to make good informed choices and take taking the jargon and complexity out of financial services, I think is one of those big opportunities.

Let's go back towards where you mentioned we all thought this election was going to be about affordability, the housing crisis. Talk to us a little bit about your views on what we need to do to address affordability for Canadians, especially the younger generations who are just getting started.

Well, once again, I mean, free tuition is something that would help a lot of young Canadians. Forgiving student debt is another. You know, we've seen in Canada inequality grow at incredible levels right now. There's a lot of Canadians whose wage hasn't increased while corporate profits have significantly grown. So one of the measures we've proposed is for the non-taxable income to be increased from $16,000 to $40,000.

which is something that would only affect people earning less than $100,000 a year. And that's something we think could help people save up to almost $3,000 a year. And of course, a measure like this then needs to be paid. You know, you need to go and get the money somewhere else. One of the proposals we've identified is person-promote to increase corporate tax for businesses earning more than $100 million a year, and then to have a financial transaction stack.

at 0.35%. That's a tax on the stock market, on foreign exchange markets. And that's a tax that could raise up to $270 billion over five years, something that could be invested in building homes for Canadians right now. And part of the challenge with the housing market is that

that. We've abandoned the idea in the 80s, or mostly in the early 90s of off-market housing. So we want to make sure that part of the money that's raised through taxes like these to be invested in off-market housing and in co-op housing, something that the feds haven't done again or started to do again briefly for the past two, three years with the national housing strategy, but at a much lower level than what's needed.

Tell us a little bit more about your views on this financial transactions tax, which I think would be, you know, particularly a point of interest to our clients. In fact, one of the things that I think drew them to All Simple is we took out commissions from the ability to trade and went commission free, which I think brought out an enormous amount of fees from the financial industry, making it more affordable for Canadians in the first place.

Tell us a little bit more about the specifics of how that would work and what you think the upside or benefits would look like. I'll take it back to my initial comments about the fact that we all have a debt to Canada. If we are able to make money or become wealthy in this country, it is because, and I can tell you that we certainly having done, you know, 15 years of work in conflict areas and in countries that are

haven't invested or haven't been able to invest in the collective well-being, we don't want to get there. We don't want to go there. When we say that we don't want to become the 51st state, it's also because we have made decisions to invest in our collective and our common wealth. And that is something that we all need to contribute to. Anyone who has stock markets

is oftentimes more well-off than many other Canadians. If your main source of income right now is through trading, then that sets you very much apart from the majority of Canadians who work and who are

are working right now earning wages that haven't increased sufficiently. And what happens when corporations are encouraged to increase the wages? Then who's picking up the slack? The state is, through various social services. So by and large, we're all currently subsidizing to a large extent the fact that some corporations, I'm thinking about the larger ones, that are providing subpar wages to

they aren't paying their fair share. We need to encourage larger players to contribute more. And again, when it comes to trading a 0.35 tax,

on financial transactions is a pretty small tax comparatively to the capital gains tax, for example, or other such taxes. It's one that still raises significant amount of money for the government to invest in ensuring that we still have in Canada the stability and the rule of law and the social benefits that make it possible for businesses to thrive in this country.

One final question for you, which is, I think as someone that spent a number of years in the US and then came back to build my family and my business here in Canada, I think probably feeling like many Canadians that Canada feels a little lost and trying to find its footing and place in the world right now. Maybe end us with your most optimistic, hopeful sense of what should Canadians think 10 years from now? What's the footing that we found that gives us pride in the country that we've built?

I think what's happening with our southern neighbors, it's providing us with a strong incentive to finally deliver the kind of economy that any sovereign nation should have built a long time ago.

to take bolder steps and to truly realize the incredible wealth of this country, not only in terms of natural resources, but once again, in terms of social peace and stability and in terms of human capital. I think Canada can play a leading role in unifying democracies and providing the kinds of technological and natural resource services needed for these economies to continue to grow and for these countries to continue to be safe.

But that's going to demand courage. It's going to demand significant investments. It's going to demand from all of us that we step in. And my main worry right now, of course, is that we will choose the path of facility instead. And that's something that I think we need to try and avoid as much as possible if we want to be proud of this country and what we've achieved 10 years from now. Well, thank you so much. Super interesting to hear your perspective. Thank you. And thank you for the work you do. Thank you so much.

Special thanks to...

for this extra special politics episode. Go to Jess Oliver, Christine Robson, Lauren Hollywood, Diana McLaughlin, and Cheryl So. Extra special thanks to our interviewer, Mike Ketchin.

The TLDR podcast is offered by Wealthsimple Media Incorporated and is for informational purposes only. The content in the TLDR podcast is not investment advice, a recommendation to buy or sell assets or securities, and does not represent the views of Wealthsimple Financial Corporation or any of its other subsidiaries or affiliates. Wealthsimple Media Incorporated does not endorse any third-party views referencing this content. More information at wealthsimple.com slash TLDR.