All About Apple Vision Pro!
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What is going on, people of the internet? Welcome back to another episode of the way from podcast where your host mars .

and i'm David.

why do you seem silly?

Anything was like a delay.

okay。 So for audio listeners, I am currently wearing the apple vision pro. Um i'm probably not the only one doing a podcast wearing the vision pro, but there is something weird to IT um you can see my eyes, right I you can see at least one of my eyes.

You can tell i'm looking through at you guys um this is this is basically apple vision pro week on the channel on on the main channel anyway, having all of our coverage, the and boxing covering what was new, reviewing the thing. And I feel like the podcasts, great form ever, just like Q N A. Lots people ask questions on social media, but you guys could probably also ask lots of questions. And I promise you, i've all the answers, every single lapse, every single one.

everyone two up day. I currently have a stop watch going because mark is going to try and hold this. I think everyone's question always is, how happy is that? Is that that happy you're trying to set the door?

Band, band, dollar band, I have a stop watch going. It's gonna like five minutes, but we're going to periodical throughout here. Check in every fifteen, twenty minutes. C I.

yeah. So I will start by saying most of the footage that we've done with the vision prosa was with the solon's band. This is a really cool looking band.

This is the band that in most of the ads, this is the band that's in, like most people's footage. And it's this cool, like a mesh that expands and has a dialect that you twist to tighten. Super cool.

Yeah, but it's not as comfortable as a duo band because it's only the back of your head. And basically IT pulls all the way onto the front of your face, and I get this cheek fatigue and above the eye fatigue a pretty quickly. And I I have not been able to wear IT with this ban for more than an hour without kind of exhausted having to take IT off.

So this do look band, which are wearing now, also adds a strap like right over your head where my headphones are. And so now it's kind of lifting IT off of the cheek bone a little bit and it's much more comfortable. And I bet I could wear this for much longer.

So will see for a long .

periods of time. I highly, highly, highly recommend. And this comes with IT, but I would highly recommend .

to do look sure when you say for long periods of time, like at a certain point, you just put that on. Like would you put this back on to just be like so i'm barely using .

IT and I look cooler using the this one is a messed up your hair slightly less and it's faster to put .

on and adjust. This ones got like velo, you got adjust and slide and put which .

really boats welfare like at the apple store set up. You want to go test that. This does look miles Better. And also it's so cool when you like, you turn the dial and you grass the person's and yes, is like nice orange bands that can expand and .

contracts engineering for for sure.

Can I say something before we get into this? Because I know we have a lot of stuff to get into. I love how interesting this headset is because it's flawed. yeah.

I think that we've for the last year, especially if you look at youtube comments about new tech that's come out, new smart phones, especially, oh my god, this is so boring. This is just a spect blum. There is no risk.

This is even interesting. Why is this leave in a video? All the the flat line has occurred like the plate.

We've reached peaks smartone. All of that comment, we've seen all that a thousand times yeah especially from apple and phones. No new ipad here like tablet like all the stuff is so stagnant.

This is interesting here. This has lots of really high heights. IT has lots of places where fall short.

IT has trade, ffs, pros, cons, flaws that come with how cool IT is. IT is so much more interesting than the boring, you know, stuff we expect every year. And I think why like IT.

part of the reason is because apple is great at designing things, are great at making sure things are really good. So when we say things are unappalled, it's because IT doesn't work. It's and this is a lot of on apple like things, yeah.

And there's they also exist in a lot of very mature category, yes. So like we know what a laptop is. So when we get a new laptop year after year after year, it's like, yeah, we're we're finding at this point this is a first gene product and IT has all of the total l signs of our product.

The battery life sucks. It's heavy, it's expensive. There's not that many apps, but the promise of the future is also super interesting.

I did to say like I had dinner with version from the verge last night. He was like keep their video director there. We're talking a lot about vision progress.

We both use IT pretty extensively. And we are both saying, like, yeah, phones have gotten to the point where they are just so freaking boring to make videos about and stuff. But ten years ago, I could not have imagined that something like this would exist in real life. Like when you use IT for the first time, it's pretty amazing.

And then later you're just like, this is a side fight technology, really like you can look at the screen recordings of what he looks like to be wearing the vision pro and just see things floating around you and just like casting shadows and sitting in like you, you could watch a star track episode and someone would probably put on a headset and start manipulating stuff in space. That's literally what that is. And because the technology has kind of progressed, progressed safely over the last ten years, IT doesn't.

It's not at shocking because I didn't just come out of nowhere. Um a lot of the elements of the vision pro are still so far ahead of other headsets that IT does still feel really advanced. But ten years ago, anything like this would be magic yeah, I think .

that's part of the reason why IT feels so flawed in some aspects is because IT is so far ahead in a lot of things that came out. But then the way apple market is some of those things, they .

market IT are far behind. It's also .

just fly because no do IT yeah that like I can see now. Now can can you go back to how you were looking to take a picture? I can put IT in the video. I can see David mark is eye, and then the way from logo.

yes. okay. So I can see yeah for audio listeners, a very distinct feature of this had said that no V, R headset has and that's the screen facing the outside.

okay. So it's facing it's not for me at all. It's literally for the people around me.

And the like sort of highlighted future you've seen in the ads is called ice site, and it's supposed to put your eyes on the outside of the headset. It's got this particular film over IT. So it's a three. It's got this debt effect was to sink IT into the headset that gives you this feeling of being able to connect with the outside world, maybe even make eye contact. Uh, and you can tell when I am in pastor mode because you can see my eyes.

And then when I go to the munera quick, you have this, a blue, purple film macros over the front of IT that makes you know that OK now in the headset, at least logically, that was supposed to be happening. I don't know that IT works as well as people were hoping. It's not nearly as bright as the video in low resolution. And also this done, this glass dome on my face is so reflective ah that literally every light source that is like beams of lights .

all over is the new gx ias twenty four glass.

Yes, they needed to be antigua in some way. And I kind of we were talking about like White and they make IT math glass or something like that. And I think that that would mess with .

the outward facing sensors. I don't think that I think or the sensors would have to be a different class, therefore being way more obvious.

And look back, yes. yeah. I think ironically, something i'm excited for inversion too, is just the resolution and brightness of eyesight being Better.

Yeah, yeah, I was the most excited. Markets head down. I was like, do I I set up and just like, yeah was like, oh, I wanted to a being greedy y and then you like, you can see, like, no and then you like, looked me straight and the like there is, yeah, I guess.

for the nail of our second vision, poverty that we put out on the main channel, we'd literally have a comparison out of the ad versus what that actually looks like. The ad makes IT looks so much higher resolution and so much brighter. And they definitely were just tracking me.

I think, added in a perfectly reflects .

on this room yeah yeah and but also, so like, I took a picture of a theory on twitter and a lot of people are like, well, if you're a plane and attending comes by, its darker right and like we turn the lives on. Yes, sometimes, but like even when it's dark as is, it's not pitch black. There is a reflection somewhere and it's picking the reflection up. IT is still going to distract or like take over space on that. And even still, it's very dimmed and very I know that .

like the reflections don't bother mean that much and I see them and I notice them, but I can mostly pay attention to the eyes. It's just the fact that that lantis lar film like makes the resolution pretty really and then also the brightest just needs to be the .

viewing angle is really but like i'm ying right now, i'm the view one of marker's his eyes and like a lot unless you're kind of in a perfect like five degree angle where you can see both of them.

it's something like, you know this protective business uh screen pull put on the review privacy shiel privacy shield.

Yes, yeah, yes for this. Okay, even if I I was perfect, it's still a good idea.

It's funny. Now I like just off OK.

If you are looking at someone, just, just take IT off.

Well, well.

right to me, this, do you think transparency mode and headphones is a dum idea? Yes, just take IT all. Okay, okay. I I like.

I like atoms boomer around me. Personally, as a fellow rumer, I will take my headphones. I will transparently I will take this off.

But I do understand that we've gone to the point where we're OK with technology that isn't considered rude. So this maybe in ten years, I see that being okay. I still feel if were working.

but I feel like I don't feel like mark is being rude by looking at us.

We need to yeah I think IT.

I don't know. I think it's also just weird.

You think so, I should take the heads the same thing.

have to slowly get you to headphones, like noise cancer headphones on, leaving them on, but switching the transparency mode and then talking to the person and then once they leave, how fast do I turn the music back on? Yes.

that's why the SONY thing where you can just touch IT and then talk and then let go is pretty cool. Yeah yeah.

But yeah, this still has the the first gene drawback of stopping, very notable and pretty big and awkward. So imagine, I don't know. First, it's hard to make like a comparison and because there's nothing quite like IT, but like the first china iphone when I came out was a pretty expensive, pretty weak technically speaking device that just had some revolutionary magical feeling controls, you know yeah I feel .

like that this arguments come up a lot, not just on this, but also in other things. We've talked about A I P rabbit r one. Like when the iphone first came out, everyone thought I was like, doesn't make sense.

When the ipad first come out, the reactions, this is like there are all really reasonable reactions. And sure, this could go a long way. But like that, we shouldn't just this regard all of the things that feel like they don't make sense. I just because maybe in the future, this will be awesome.

Yeah, I saw some of those and I totally agree. I think you have to draw more parallels than just when I first came out. People didn't like IT.

I think there are certain things about IT that people don't like yeah and certain things about IT that are the reason why I ended up overcoming that stuff, right? So like if you look, if you just go to first gene iphone, if you want to use that example, yeah, IT was super expensive. That's an obvious reason why a lot of people didn't get IT.

There was also Carrier exclusive, but also there were no apps we couldn't change while paper, there are lots of restrictions. I didn't have flash and the browser, yeah, lots of restrictions. But when people used IT, they really felt very intuitive with the controls, with the direct manipulating the thing on the screen that was new and really, really fun and intuitive to use.

And so people wanted that idea to continue in blossom, despite all of its downfalls. And now you draw the parallels to this. Okay, I think what apple is probably trying to feel like is, alright, revolutionary input advice.

How do we do this again, though, I think are you look directly at the item you're controlling is very impressive. IT feels very, very closer, like psychic, like magic. But sometimes that is kind of a night.

Yeah, is of a night for for sure. I did. I did actually .

get to put IT on and try briefly and now I know what you guys are talking about. I don't know if if you want to in the area, but yet the clicking things with your hand was really cool. And I mean, like pretty much biter side cool.

Like when you have when you're using an interface where you have to do with a lot, like if you're trying to use that for the keyboard and do that, yeah I of hurt your eyes because our eyes are not used to doing this. They're used to like snapping and staying there and then snapping back, and it's not that kind me. And also on .

top of that, until you feel comfortable, it's not just like you're looking at A N D R E W. You're looking at a up to that register and up to that register d up to direct like you're adding another thing every time. And you have to understand now that if you look back at the screen, you're not looking at the keyboard. So essentially an extra .

input is really weird thing that your brain does when you're trying to use this headset where your body and your brain says, I need to move my head in order to change what what i'm selected on, but you really just have to move, move your eyes. So it's almost like the like patting your head and rubin, your belly thing, like you only need to do one of them 嗯 but your body is just like I need to be looking at but IT is still .

an actual input because it's following your eyes。 So if you think about IT, you don't just go D A V I D, you go D R V up. Yeah, I know.

So it's like, yeah, it's but it's still more that you have to process, you have to rubber belly. But yeah like it's hard.

Yeah it's it's as soon as you start to try to do more than one task at once, that's when IT becomes a little bit of an extra step to have to look at exactly what you're doing like any act like if you're just using a mac and you have a window open and your input devices, your keyboard, you're not staring at your keyboard as you input. You're looking at something that you're not controlling. That's the difference.

You're looking at something that you're not controlling. We're in this. If I, if I have a window open and a keyboard, I can stare at the keyboard the entire time as I type. But the second I look up to check IT, none of the typing works. I'm now just tapping things that I wasn't intending the tap I have to look back down to the keyboard.

And as all inds of little moments like that, like if I have more than one window open, when I have like my mac connected and I have a vision pro p over here, yeah, what's awesome is my keyboard and track pads still work. So if I have, uh, messages APP open over here and the mac here, I will look over at the APP. The keyboards and truck had still work, or reply to a message in the vision pro APP with the my keyboard yeah but then I look back as i'm finishing typing the message and it's now typing back in google dogs.

Or can we do we know we confirmed. So that's when you're connected to your mac. Have we confirmed you can connect a blue to the keyboard or something straight to IT you? You can.

okay. Is there enough computing powers to run multiple things? We're like you see that as a valid option or does that make more sense to be?

So you're saying, would you go on the go and compute without even a mac at all? So I tube good parry.

And in my eyes, that makes the .

difference between it's a .

that's right. Is that like they're selling this is like this new computing input device, right? If the difference between is I don't have enough spent with you, just throw a blue tooth keyboard on this, then to me that this is just a new monitor, not a new computing system, 是 sort of obviously.

there's a lot more new yeah I think so the aba building, you can get real computing done. It's not quite as powerful as if you know your way around a mac or your computer. So if i'm just doing like google dogs writing and I have a couple tabs, open some browser windows and researching and writing a script, something like that yeah I can do this without a mac at all ah but the second you have like four different apps open at the same time and maybe one of them is only available on the mac or maybe wanted to spotify the background, but now you have to .

have broader type like starts to get annoying. I have a question you can have, safari is an apple? No, but they only like you to do one display of safari.

They ever say, no, you can. No, no. So, so you can have as many windows and as many tabs open in vision pro. I don't MIT sorry.

it's it's a maxing comparing from your mac. You can only you play one window of your mac and then you can have other stuff. exactly. Did they say why that's the case?

They didn't say why. Um I I wonder if that's a compute thing, if that's a .

because of be really nice if I was editing in final cut but I also some other mac applications that I wanted to oh no.

no, that's the first thing I want to to do. I mean, my editing step in the cut pro is two monitors, one full screen with the video preview. So if I want to do animations or text or color graphics and then the other with the time line in the bin have been that's so frustrating.

And I don't understand why that's the limitation. It's not the same thing like they don't have enough PC I E lanes because that's what they did with the m one chip and don't allow multiple displays on the matric air.

I was suspected something to do with I mean, it's literally wirelessly transmitting this to the headset. I yes, I suspect there's just a total amount of pixel that you can marry before IT gets crazy. And you know it's funny.

So we were doing we're making this review yeah there's two aces screen accord actually yeah you can screen record using the built in screen recording in the headset and that will show you exactly what i'm seeing. But the export to ten D P video and the video will have what's called full ated rendering, which means that only what i'm looking at with my actual eyeballs is sharpen and focus. And if you look around the rest of radial notice, it's actually blurry and lower resolution out of focus.

And that's because that's totally fine for the way I sit in the headset. If I looked down the middle at some text and that's crisp and rendered, my eyes don't really care about what else is happening in my field of view, right? The other way to screen record is to connect IT to x code and and develop, promote.

And then we can do full resolution screen recordings on the map without for via rendering. And we have some of those clipsed as well on the review. Those clips all started the headset.

They slow IT all down. Any scrolling starts to get choppy and that's just more sharp pixel being rendered and sent. And I do think there's a compute limit somewhere there.

So maybe that's why they .

I kind of feel like that's one of the reasons why I can do two mac displays.

The same thing about that though is that like the mac is the thing that's power, that's processing everything. So the only thing that's coming .

in is the wireless input. Yeah.

thanks. Yeah, yeah. In terms of, I guess, just a IT like in terms of just the window IT would be so sick if in a world where a final cut straight tup is on this and you're like, I just have this like giant time line and your your viewing screen is pushed back and like a big White screen and you have like. All your color wheels .

over hire .

cut and I I like so much of this podcast, is going to be speculating how sick and APP could be inside of this.

But that would also mean my media has to also be on the vision pro.

You IT comes and I got the .

terrible story. Yeah, the last video was well over. So that's that oh yeah.

I was not to defend the the old zuker berg cook but on that quest for and three, I think it's hard. My brow is sweating but um you I can run three full size monitors on the box cope if you .

happen to other resolution of those just up.

I will have to double check. But IT seems like they run them in full resolution.

I really be no .

maybe but it's big because I have the square monitor and then a Normal baby ten, sixteen monitor right? And then so IT IT does like the square and .

yeah yeah and then I can add a third monitor .

that doesn't have an exit real life. That's so that's interesting.

I I think there maybe a difference in the what they're doing, sure. Yeah, I think that what's happening in the quest is literally screen meiring. That was a surprise me.

And what's happening in the mac is a virtual it's a new virtual display, not mirrors the screen of the man. So it's a totally new resolution of of new rendering happening. And then I think about .

I don't think they're for resolution displays. When you take off the headset and look at my computer monitors, they're cropped by about two thirds and .

then it's rendering it's mirrors that yeah.

yeah, yeah I don't know. I know that everyone makes parallel to the iphone, and I think that makes sense to make parallels to these things. I just want to say that like correlation does not equal caution and tell something that like everyone loves to say, oh, because IT doesn't make sense and it's new and expensive.

That means that will succeed in like that's obviously not true. And then also, the iphone had a very clear thing of, you can replace your ipod and your phone. And this are you getting IT are you getting? You can replace these three things in one. And this is like a you can do stuff yeah and and what .

he said that the crowd inside was like or get where .

is this is just like it's not replacing anything really. It's just a new paradise completely, which is something .

that has to be yeah okay, here's two uses that I think are totally unique to vision pro. And also I just want to know what we've just passed twenty minutes on the time and feeling .

the first of the fatigue start in the middle of your head Better .

ah but two things are totally unique. A vision pro. One is and its super niche, but it's editing videos on the plane.

And I could probably expand this to doing a bunch of things on an airplane, but take someone like me, for example, trying to edit and find a cut pro on a laptop on the plane. But it's a top secret vision pro and boxing. So the person next we can see IT or i'm just uncomfortable with that person .

seeing what i'm editing what a vision problem boxing.

But you were the vito secret thing and embargo are one plus full review. okay? So that's happening on the plane. So the person next me, I don't want them to be able see this. I literally have to had set on a black out my max display.

And now not only are they is the privacy of now factor, I can now make the display as I want. So have a new larger display I can take with me anywhere I go. There's probably coffee shop people that would do the same thing, but i'm using the airplanes example. That's a new thing for vision pro. And then the other thing is, I mean, technically just watching V R videos, or watching videos in a virtual theatre environment, or something like that, like this new media washing experience, which this could be the largest display, the largest T, V in somebody's life, technical, this you can only watch by yourself, watch by yourself, and only watch things that are into the headset via apple T, V or disney plus. All sorry, and doesn't have any inputs to play games .

that aren't .

on the rude.

This is like making me to remember when there is that trend of people like taking the score, buying broken macbook so they could just use the computer and the keyboard. That seems like IT could potentially happen for this, like that on the plane. Then you .

don't have your screen open in the person .

in front of your mainly back in position.

I A good when that happens. Got honey. I D capitated the mac book, converting the laptop into the slap top is surprisingly.

Andrew, you discovered a really funny prank with a vision pro a few days ago, too. Did I where you slit your arms?

Oh, we did confirm this works. The scenario, this happening never would really.

really do to people.

But do you know how like those times where I don't know you're like class or something, you have to do a chAllenge where one person is like the arms of the other person.

You have them .

reach through under markets. Was in the vision pro, put his arms on his back and I slid my arms through his and then he looked at things and went click I I could click my hands and I would start IT would register all of them register spite our completion being .

quite different. yeah. So vision pro fairly assumes that if there are hands in this bubble, they're probably yours. But you're right, you can totally hi jack zones.

It's so reminisces of the IT was a pixel for controversy of being able to unlock someone's phone with their face without their eyes being open so you could like, do face I like just like shining at your partner while they were sleeping the reverse like if you're doing that, you should um and then google actually issued an update. So I had to to .

be fair, after we tested that test, your hands being out and me just putting my hand and trying .

to click and a did network IT can only do one set of hands.

Oh man, there's some. We should try one of your hands and .

one of my hands I think could be fine. You work. I mean, I think that's good because um I don't know maybe you are a person that has like a prosthetic hand and if I just recognize any hand .

IT Better yeah they pay a certain yeah .

yeah was the word yeah.

I think that's a good accessibility for me yeah .

and I don't think it's that much of a security even if you .

put your hand. So the other persons like like armholes, you can't see what they're seeing. So why does that matter? IT would be so like your screen meer .

look at a furry look at IT you get IT like, yes, okay, now look but I I com, I know I make .

a movie about that. Hist.

well, I work at twenty eight minutes now. I haven't taken IT off yet. I think we should take a quick break, and maybe when we come back will do like Q N A, like rapid fire stuff, because I thought I am telling you, I got all the answers.

I just need form at all. My thoughts, review video. But we should do that. So before we do that could break, we should do modified trivia, trivia.

I refused to believe mark is, and searching .

the answers I was, say huge actually .

all know what is the question are saying what .

was the first year that the section he was born? No IT wasn't about question. But i'm just saying you can oh no, I this I really don't want this to get Normal .

life bother eighty five .

really that you just did .

that does when the statute liberty was delivered.

Yes, yeah. I don't know how to enforce thirty years.

We watch typing.

Okay, points don't matter for this one, but you can tape with his eyes.

He can just go.

You may have noticed, marchez has said this is both modified trivia and points free trivia. And he's correct. That's because yesterday we taped to the latest installment of wave form trivia extravagance a, which should be out next week.

I I won. Maybe he did. Maybe he didn't. I shouldn't say one. It's at one nine, one really out of an are the winters every time. Yeah.

what do you doing? I know you do something because I, that boy, go.

no.

Jimmy paid to me.

Luckily for us, I pretty sure this question is both ungoodly le table and a little speak peek of a kind of stuff that you guys are going to hear next week in tribe extravagant. So mark, az. Andrew, David, which legendary mobile device was more expensive at launch nineteen ninety six years palm e pilot professional or two thousand two t mobile slash danger side pick if you will not be able to google .

this question.

I can prove so I.

what are you click see IT. We don't have a camera that has marked as his hands on screen, but he's click IT away right now.

So I ask someone for A P, P, P loan. Would IT mean the small business loan that that was given out for covet or a pm pilot professional loan because IT was so expensive? Wait, plump up. Professional was thing called ppp, one like a small business loan that the government gave people.

I don't know. I you deserve to know the question because you have to answer IT that I don't trust you.

A P, P, one is paycheck .

protection program and give IT to.

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way for are welcome back before we have into questions, I just thought of an APP idea for the vision pro. Okay, okay, so get ready, developers. Get ready. So you see eyes when you are looking at someone, right? So the whole thing is that you are looking at them and you're paying attention to them and it's glossed over when you're in something. Can someone make an APP that just shows your eyes so that one like you, you know, playing on the vision pro, doing something cool, and then like your mom, your sister comes distracting, you can just turn IT on so they .

think you are paying attention to them yeah.

And then shows your .

eyes you could call IT realize, realize, realize.

just all IT realize, realize, true that truly, that way you can stay in your V, R, even when your pei parents are trying to .

get you keep head for the entire, and you should .

keep on for the hall. I want to see if you, you can last the entire episode o even the segment that doesn't have to do a vision pro, I try because I .

have a question yeah I even ready for half an hour like, yeah, do you feel I strain in the same way the oculus series no.

no eye in the strain of vision pro is purely wait.

I want to use IT longer. But the first three times I used that, I use of her about half an hour. And then afterwards for about an hour, I couldn't focus on anything close to me.

Does that mean we need glasses? And is are because the oculus X I my eyes, heart you know I think is part of IT.

So the default with vision process is past your mode, so you don't really spend a lot of time in virtual environments. And I decide to so most of the time at what the camp phy to showing you from the outside. And IT does look very, very close to real, but IT is notably a little bit more compressed than immigrants, like a total muted yeah.

Like if you were showing like an ice super bright, like if this light appear was actually dramatically brighter in the headset, I think that would be more fatigue. But when I look at the light, the shutter speed changes and everything gets demand. Like everything stays kind of within this 是 right？ H still all, like what .

I found us still is a screen.

though burning your eyes. IT is a screen. B doesn't change weird. If you you you that always high.

it's just that I just in a high range so you can know ah so .

if you a question, if you go to low on off light, what happens? The question of the answer, most people suspect, as I would get, really walking in bad. What mostly happens as apple tries to keep shutter speed high enough to keep things crisp.

And in order to do that, you have to crank I S O kind of people. You know, that usually results in a lot of noise. So yes, when you're in low light, IT tries to keep things visible and sharp, and therefore IT is more noisy. And IT adds this noise reduction and soft in things a bit. And IT looks like you're looking at a low light camma feed you so IT looks IT works way Better in well that environment and face yeah you are big .

on to do and you mention IT does have a to do up. What is the to do up? And just you pin IT and as a checklist invision .

pro yeah so there is no to do APP. I'm looking at the no to do apps. yes. So i've installed my own, which is an iphone APP, and that shows up in the comparable apps, any ipad APP, basically any ipad APP where the developer is, check the box and maybe that adds a few lines of code. IT will show in the up store, and that will work.

So there, oh, there is things so recently that to do the step called things, added a vision pro specific APP. O, K, I haven't tried IT yet. It's like thirty books.

I imagine there are some fun, immersive features that theyve added that he tried thirty books. Things is crazy. Things is three books per platform. I bought things for a mac and IT was fifty dollars. And then I went to go download the I version and I was like, five more dollars, please and it's thirty more dollars in the VR heads that anyway, so things please .

don't really thirty. Okay, cool.

Is that good?

It's good, but it's not an android. So I can't this .

is my idea for for a uh to do this step in V R and for thirty box. I think you Better do this. You should be able to pin your, to do things on different things.

Three thousand. What do you mean? Yes, long bus. And I walk by and I see a little thing that's like.

finish what I should be is different priority tax are given different speeds and they gradually chase you around. So things that you really have to get down.

you turn around .

and less support things. They are just sort of.

do you know Joanna .

didn't her review? I haven't tried this APP, but there's a cooking up. Yeah and there's it'll have like a recipe that stays like pinned on a cabinet and you can know look over at IT .

and it'll be able .

to set timer for you and you can the timer down and .

place IT on the thing that timer .

title a part the same time. Um you could just cook with two thousand.

Let him go.

So there are lots of things work like .

you have a lot of top of your world.

But the promise of how great IT could be if there is a lighter, Better version of the setback is amazing. okay. So did you see this on twitter? There is like a vacuum up. And I was literally, if you have you seen seen IT literally just looks at what you're vacuum and will highlight IT. So you know where you have to complete the level .

I can explain IT to else where he'll probably understand. Have you ever watch power wash?

Yes, I I need. I need. You haven't seen. No, no, I know. So just like i'm so bad at maintaining .

the grid pattern .

when I this is .

exactly should grade.

Here's another one. While we're talking about possible killer apps, there is a render somebody made of .

like watching in f one race.

O so know how harder is Normally to watch an f one race. You're just looking at the camera feed and it's just cutting back for twin a bunch placement races, but you don't really see the whole track. You don't know what's going on where they are. So there was this render somebody made I don't think it's a real APP. So they essentially the whole track layout on the coffee table so could see where all the cars were on the track, who is painting, where the races were happening and feeds of the different races happening around the track.

Yeah, think he was watching the T. V of the general feed. And then is coffee had the track with, yeah, think of IT, I think was cars. Yeah yeah or at least just like where each number .

of each person was um that would be Better than the current did he .

actually make this or I think it's a render a render yeah it's really cool. This was posted on the formula one um that and everyone was like their Normal APP doesn't even work there.

That stuff that I keep on social media of like cool ideas people have that feels slighter. That's exciting for the future of this form factor.

I do think up developer should start making these apps now even though there's a chance that this form factor doesn't work out because five years on the line are going to be a vision pro two or three. And I know like a big argument that people are making, uh, notably netflix, youtube and spotify are not on region perhaps.

And the kind of funny thing about that is that all ipad and iphone apps automatically got ported to be working on vision pro unless you specifically opted out, which means that they intentionally or like no um and so you're making a decision that you don't want to be in this new platform, right? And but IT IT makes a lot of sense to like be in this new pair. I I completely for lost my train of thoughts, so I think you should just back up and I and .

I can't want you to go off that because you mentioned ipad apps here and there is an instagram on this, right?

I'm excited about the age of dashboards if that's like the only contribution we really get out of this whole thing. Yeah like we we get more cool dass boards. It's like like you the way you're describing the f one right, is the A I had IT .

also had the leader board .

and different .

ways cook. I think fun thing is .

that we like there are so many things we can imagine yet that you could do in special stuff. And so people are way more creative than we are and are going to make things that blow our minds over and over again. Yeah.

I feel like this is gna be great when the form factor is the meta glasses. yeah. And right now it's just that. But also when the forever factor is the meta glasses, you know what, you don't need a screen on the front to show your eye. That's a very good point, and I think that's what it's okay.

And i'm probably going to says at some point in review, but I am pretty sure vision pro is the first time apple done the first change product with the word pro in the name yeah, I think the first thing you do on your apple is make a non pro with no eyes, right? But then after so you have vision pro, it's got the eyes on the outside. Apple vision.

And IT doesn't have the eyes is missing a couple of things, but it's cheaper because that's less part and you can make a smaller, cheaper thing. But the idea will be the absolute best version of this is the closest to see three glasses and you keep going further, further towards see three glasses until you can finally actually do see three glasses, and you don't need anymore. I think I feel .

like my argument against that would be is the reason for the eyes coming through is that IT lets you be less disconnected from reality and lets you be that. So then why would you not have that on the version that more people are supposed to haven't be using?

Yeah, that's fair. I don't think that something we get rid of. I think that in sion, you'll have vision pro two and then also release vision, regular vision just is the .

older technology. You know, it's a real bummer about this whole thing that a major apple display manufacturing and supplier didn't just announce a baseless microlight transparently screen.

Well, they start development on this a long time ago.

I don't the joke is they did do that.

Yeah then I got that you nice. I didn't cool.

Oh no.

I think I think maybe that is the marriage between the metal glasses and the and the the traditional V R escape is like like as microloan transparency gets wai way cheaper yeah um you know wouldn't be that hard to map perspective yeah yeah .

or you just see mark as as actual face through here. But there could be a there could that lighting up in front of him?

He's well, I was specifically thinking of the samsung one.

But wouldn't the issue in that me as if I was just is that all the things he's seeing .

out you .

will also see coming so well.

then it's like hard for middle. Like see his like this is trying to make IT see so like he's still has all these things, but then he can connect with somebody where that would be. I'm seeing all these things and they're looking at me, but those things are still like a micro windows in my eyes and like blocking my eyes.

I I think I see you saying, I feel like if there was something blocking the person mark z was trying to connect with that he wouldn't be able to many ways so they're be no point in trying to make eye contact whether if he moved IT out of .

the way of his eye but even if I was, I don't know why i'm arguing so. But like, so mark tz could have me looking right at him, like, right, like hearing at me right now. You can have windows here, here, here all around me, right? And i'm just seeing your eyes. But to him, since it's such a small glasses, ve ve just that I would just see all these things probably .

be blocking as a good point. And samsung, at their micro display demonstration, did not let anyone see IT from the back. So I have no idea what like the other side. No, IT is real. I mean, it's not real.

Maybe come on, L S, L is a, but samsung didn't say there is .

necessarily. But L G S OLED from the back is a lot less what it's clear. It's like IT looks sort of like fuzzy and like .

darker and .

shades what I do .

and more questions. Uh someone is asking if you can use virtual display thing on a windows py. No, obviously not.

Um I thought that question .

before so that I thought .

I was a great question before said mirror a computer and but you .

should be able to just have a display up of your windows on the side.

Yeah yeah they would probably sell them more because they're like isolating out. Well, at the same time, the entire point of the vision problem .

of our apple apps in your head does windows okay? Yeah yeah.

I think that only does .

windows and mac, but IT definitely seems like the windows is what they advertise here.

And the man you can use in the windows for this is .

just kind of my own question, and i'm pretty sure know the answer to. But I guess your way around, remember before you want to multiple windows like from your mac. So if you have a final cut open, but you want to surfy your window open, would you just do final cut and then pin a safari APP off to your right? yeah.

And then you still have IT, but can you only type that safari APP then with your eyes and virtual keyboard, can you still use? So I had a cut. Have I message over here? I could have like so much. So as long as it's an APP, you can add extra windows of IT.

When you look at IT is which is focus right and works on there. The annoying thing about that like sometimes i'll be typing something and then someone start talking to me and I finish my typing as i'm talking to the person because I don't need to be looking at my computer because I know how to touch type. But you can do that.

You can't mult. You can't multibus because your attention is what you are computing. You are not allow. You can't multiple.

That does not like you're going to have like a pop up at or something. And so far and then you're just convert your vision ping.

I'll put i'll get i'll have this all extremely well laid out in the in the review because I think it's the most unique aspect of .

computing on the vision.

Pro is the like looking is the fact that your attention is your task only, that only your task .

is it's a great for multitask, but at the same time basically possible.

I think you can have things happening in the background. You can have apple music off to the side playing music. You can have yeah, but like, yeah, yeah it's one at a time that's not music playing.

The backgrounds not really like what you're paying attention to is just ambient .

yeah yeah there is some when you have when you're face typing with someone else in the vision pro and you get their weird hole express persona.

it's so .

funny. And can you is IT a size window of them? Or can you have, can I be giant if you're talking to me there? Can I be a giant floating and you're talking to okay.

So when i'm wearing the vision pro and i'm in face time, my face time experience is my camera feed is just my personal, and what I see is floating glass like windows of everybody else on the face time, whether there are a webcam or another vision proper sona. I can then drag the entire thing bigger to make those winner bigger. And what's kind of amazing about this is you can you can put them across the the room on the wall.

You can move them to the right, to the left. And the thing that they see when you move IT is accurate to the angle that you just move you, too. So if I put the vision pro window on the ceiling, they will see that top of my person's head. If I put IT behind me, you will see black, because my personal, I I think .

so this was going to be up to my next point, which was when we face time on your computer, David, the other day where we were just a regular. So you saw a window of David's web. Can we saw a window of your personal? And I think that makes sense of you. You do other personas for us when you turned around or literally got out of the box, you just disappeared or like which we saw if you on a .

Normal computer, I guess.

But like IT makes you feel like the whole point of this is that is now strapped to your head and you could potentially walk around the first time, but that would not work because you would leave the window.

So if you have the window like really, really big, far away on the wall, across the room, you can walk .

around always in like.

yeah, if i'm face timing with like my mom, but I want to to go into the kitchen to grab some yeah I don't want to disappear at even know I know that's what would happen on a computer. Uh, I also could Carry my computer to the kitchen, my phone walk .

through .

A I guess I mean, I think the apple trying to make you feel as close to an actual computing experience as possible because, for example, when we were face timing, you, I was using my laptop, which is to the left of me, because my main display is in front of me. So you did see the side of my face, and that's exactly what would happen if I saw if you had your window pinned to the side of your face. So technically, this is exactly how a computer would work, is just not, in my opinion, like the ideal form of how .

one interactive, one major downside, you can't show anything to the camera because it's just just like only your hand out.

So when you move your .

hands around and from the headset, IT does actually render a pair of hands that match skin. But I obviously can't show things to you even though I could .

hold something that's down.

Can you not fit the camera around?

And what you do, you have button and show, and I show you something I light is a window with your .

personal and not just a floating persona because then that would look weird if you flip around. And then they would have to like, not be a perfectly shaped, and then be now a square that know only a .

lot of people were complaining because they are like, Normally when i'm on video meetings, I can be on other tabs and stuff and they don't know. But now if on if i'm like looking in another direction on another tab, that will be a little more obvious. But I guess if you're using your phone, you could just kind of like put IT in front of you and they wouldn't .

be able to see that's true true. Um yeah you know funny. You can also make eye contact with individual people in the face time.

What mean?

So i'm face time in three people. And in my vision pro, I look at one of the people. The other two people see slightly off access k because i'm only making eye contact with one of the people in the face time. I regalias that that is more like reality, but that also make you hard to do presentation.

Yes, yeah. I also want to just go back like two steps on when you are saying, like, well, if you're looking off to the side, that's what a computer iphone would be but like, this isn't a computer in the phone. I feel like we should have the step extra of being able to like, I just want to go walk to another room and not have to leave the camera I just face, yeah anyways yeah do it's thirty five hundred .

dollars but I think they wanted to feel intuitive as. I'm not saying that makes IT Better. yeah. I'm just saying that their mindset, I assume, is let's make this as like not different as not having a vision pro as possible.

Can you connect IT to a phone or pad the way that you use IT with A A mac to see the ipad screen? Yeah, no, no. You can do the other way around.

I can ah, I can mire what I see onto an ipad, okay, but I cannot like virtual ipad onto my O K. yeah. 嗯， got I S everywhere.

Anyway, just real quick. Ah what about about an hour? Yeah feel i'm approaching the far i've ever without take the heads set off consecutive.

I feel fine, fine. The number one thing annoying to me is the weight on my cheeks to startling, to get heavy. And also, we haven't talked about this very much, but the field of view of this headset isn't actually super wide. IT does feel like you've had ski gaggles on ah IT does feel like my my preferred is like bottled a little bit. And I Normally on this podcast will just look over and gLance at adam and else I now have to fully look over because the edge of my prefer is like, but I can't see.

I want to put that before. Didn't I bet you that I was like that? I just didn't really notice one hundred .

percent IT takes a couple of uses before you start like poking around the edges and realizing how limited IT is.

You weren't in a scenario you extremely used to where you like in inspiring. Now he does that all the time and the notices, it's not the same time. So you are just .

using IT out there and like.

didn't I was an at any you're t your desk and I said, like, hey David and like you turned around that something you do every single day or if you try to do that and that scary be like something .

was different about yeah that reminds me, my god, just turning like one look at me, David mentioning you, you guys have to demos with this yeah, multiple demos with, we spoke about previously. But when you first set up the headset and put IT on, does that give you like a tour and how to use IT? I don't remember us now.

And then here's happen. You first get IT. Number one thing is we put IT on and IT says, hold the digital crown to a liner ice. You hold IT down and a physically moves the lenders in place to metrics.

And the second thing that happens is you go around this series of dots or IT says, look at the dot and then pincher fingers together to selected and that's a calibration process. But that's actually also you learning that whatever you look at is what you're selecting. OK does a few rounds of that, then you sane your hands like this and then you're in and the ability as there and you're free.

I'll say I I did try very briefly. I was in your gas mood, but at that point, the only way we did is you basically allowed everything in the guest mode. So I don't go through the full set up right, to do my face.

But I did all the tapping in hands. It's crazy into IT if I was super, super impressed by, but IT literally is just like, yeah you hold IT IT changes where they like, the the the space where the lengths is, I can see clearly. Then like a hax ign of dots comes up and you just look at each one, impress them. And all the impress IT goes to another set of IT is doing in different great ness levels to try gage. I guess what's the best .

but I hope you to press your fingers together.

right? yeah. And then you just like tap and then you go through that and then you're kind of just in the space and then you like that shows up. And I was very into if I was just like moving things around IT does a good job when you start looking at things like the corner where you would drag IT out or the bar like highlights that for a second um and is a good point though .

that they don't have any sort of like toral interesting to me .

because even on the phone there's like so many things you can long press in a new action will pop up. I did know there a lot of hidden U I.

I done that before, right? Didn't not tell anyone about three touch.

No three touch got launched. But like there are still things in vision perhaps where I will long press and go.

Now I don't know that I control thing only. They told you about IT yeah .

because they tell me about IT.

So the fact you to stare up at the ceiling to find the only way can access control centers by looking straight up and seeing the little arrow in the new topic, and then IT comes down into your view.

When I was using, I saw the arrow and I just thought them .

and like brother and .

anything appear looked IT is like the consumer .

version of these that people start getting .

is unless they're like alpha, like not we got like a version that people will be getting in stores yeah is people so but there is a ten minute guided tour of apple vision pro on apple to that has surprisingly six and a half million views. sure. Which is crazy. A lot more thing.

And am I correct saying that can you get this deliver to your house?

You have to go pick up an apple style or does have experience going to yeah.

So I I would assume there's somewhat of a tutorial in that aspect of way because you have like this the slots when people are by them, we're filling up fast. I'm assuming they are dedicating time to each of those slots. Man, shadow to this episode comes out on the second rate shadow to all the other employees.

If you're on your way to work today, i'm sorry. It's going to be a rough one, probably the next week. Big toodles to all of you guys and stay strong. It's gonna be a long one.

It's funny how much like the we talk about the more I kind of wanted to play with, but I the more I also know that I will just .

be kind of a page there is a perfect red comment for this that I have .

to find what you're finding that question that I have actually help me. Have you tried regular ear buds with IT that are not airports?

No, but you can. So you can pair blue tooth headphones directly to the vision pro. Yeah you won't get um I think it's just special audio.

Cy, I want to know if that cy actually matters, because if you have anything but the newest U, S, B, C airport's pro, there is a lower late there, a higher atene. Y, but I want to know, like what does that actually really .

change anything? Yeah, I was using the virtual mac display and then using my wired headphones plug into the mac. And even that like and see was low and up and totally fine.

So again, i'm not do i'm not gaming or like doing anything super sensitive the latencies. So and even then it's just audio lencs. I'm not actually really .

minding I want to play a on a .

screen and and see if the audio and see what is .

you just play play on the and see if the band with has high enough to like update again fast. F yeah cause native on max so yeah.

that's yeah. I want to play some sort of game or something. I feel like a first person would not work.

The funny thing is like like games like CSGO pro players will actually get really small screens because they they don't you don't want to have to turn your head at all. You want to be able everything in your power ferals.

IT is confusing though, because there are people who, despite having only four, is usually like the standard for that, which is like small in the computer world. But then they like put their nose to IT, so they do kind of after .

like they put their nose against the screen.

Look, if you look up some like row C S players or over uh violent players, they are like touching the screen is wild um but yeah would like the drive brings yeah yeah really cool yeah okay, with this is the comment I saw on our apple, on our on boxing video. He said, do I want one? no. Do I want to play with one .

for hours? So yes, do I need IT? No, no, no. sorry.

yeah. That's a very videos with four.

It's like the you guys are asking before, how long do you think you're going to continue to use vision pro after the review processes over what are you going to use IT for everyday you going to stop using IT? What going to happen? I think my main analysis so far as I still feels like fun toy that I I would break out every once in a while.

But I still also think there are a couple of things that are amazingly fun on IT that I would want to use IT for, namely the thing I keep talking about, which is on airplane, using my mac on a plane, watching a video on a plane. I cannot wait for the sixteen hour flight I have coming up in a month to just watch videos on the plane. And I even think about what's around me.

Ah, that's gonna great. Uh and I think also want some new games and fun stuff first getting announced. Not necessarily killer apps, but I think really more fun esol you should wear this has set for the entire sixteen hours, like sixteen hours is probably too much, probably going to be want to sleep during that light well.

but if you're able to get a business classy.

you could lay down and have screen on the ceiling. Yeah, absolutely. I could have sky. I, I could have sky guide on the ceiling. And then I could look out the window of the plane and pick the consultations out of the sky and bring them into the cabin. Stay at them.

I just IT.

Can you, when you see the flight attention coming with your first drank, while you wearing this, can you screen record we won post IT anywhere? Because I don't want to like posted there, but I just want to see IT from here. What's reaction .

when I record videos on the outside? Tell me what call this turns someone take a video.

I can see .

your eyes ten percent .

of the screen.

So i'm recording a video. Now what does that look like?

It's this is just like the new .

meta Robin glasses is just like a blinking kind of a White so IT no part of its screams i'm recording, right? yeah. I do not think this is a good way of showing you really.

I mean, it's Better than the original um google glass, which didn't have any indicator. That's what I killed .

in this should be red blinking one hundred percent. That's like the only thing that screams I am recording. Yes, they cross the.

Little if that was White and blinking and I was the steward or start as I would have no idea.

No, are not a chance. Yeah.

I record a special video.

So IT is like the knock off next cam thing or it's like, hi, you are being .

i'm thinking the like the like convenient store screen that just schools letters across IT that he says you are being recall and just keep calling also.

okay. So you know those those means that keep showing up, which are they make perfect sense. They're don't look too closely at the T, V and then T V face here. The weird thing about that is technically the focus distance of my eyes is further than that would be if the stream is up close to me because of the lenses.

So the way the lens is work, and I guess if I want to explain the way I balls work, like they literally are changing their shape when he focus at something further away. My focus distance is further now and less fatigue. E, now, and if I had a screen, you, that's yes, not a room in the mean, but that's just a .

keep me going on things that the whole reason that tim cook, when IT comes on stage, he says the vision pro is the first of ice that we don't look at, but throw the eyes .

on the outside look like the slaughter mysa ge, yeah yeah, like your guys look like further apart and their nato is quite looking at the same thing and yeah yeah, less than the line. I still really like IT.

though I actually prefer I definitely prefer this to not being the server eyes, this whole podcast.

So I think .

if worked correct, like if I good okay, David can see .

both of I feel we're only seeing one.

I no, I feel like I am .

making eye contact.

You are so are you making OK? yeah. So that's it's technically working. I mean, it's not going to be perfect when you're slightly off excess obvious.

Maybe i'm just more comfortable making I context with slots than you are or with virtual reality. He sets in emo, all the fishes ether on the front of their face.

No, but I swear there's this one fish that I A really wide face that is what you look like.

It's so .

weird and I also can't see all .

of IT that's what's .

like it's glorie.

You need light from the to be able to see IT correctly, like if you're in IT because that the first example the the original intendo game, boy was I was the required reflections of light from the sun to build to see IT because there's no like backlighting. All right. Yeah, on this. Can I see IT Better when there's .

a lot of ambient light? Think so. No, I think it's if you imagine a fill a literal hardware layer over the display, yes, IT is refracting in a that shows a different image to each of your eyes. yeah. So as you move in front of the this shows you different parts of the screen at the same time.

I'm glad they did that because that does look a lot Better than just your eyes being passed the front of the thing. You IT would make you feel like your eyes are just judit out. Yeah actually IT looks like it's around where it's supposed to be in on your face.

I think that's fair most of the time that does. There are some angles words still, I think that there specifically and angle in the first impressions video we put out kind of from after you a bit looking up and your eyes just look like they are in a totally different place on your face then. So IT works, in some cases that I feel like that's the whole montral of this front screen is like IT works fifteen percent of the time. And you were .

clever in the perfect center. yeah. And I like make eye contact with in that scenario.

IT is still about fifty percent of what they showed off in all of the marketing material.

And yeah yes, any other big questions that people had to you, how swap the batteries?

Uh, yes.

you can buy an extra battery. And surprisingly, a lot people don't know this. The only way to actually turn the vision pro off is to take the battery off, just going to a standby mode if you take IT off. But the only way that is just like the airports, max, there's no honor off button IT just turns on when you .

put the battery on and .

IT turns off you, you swap battery. What you can do is easy change yet another battery to this battery and hot swap that one while this one stays.

I know you can do that, but does apple say you should do that? Oh no. Yeah.

that sounds like a serious five. You can't like leave IT running and replace the main large Better.

correct? No, because the way you, David, take the battery off. I know a lot of people in this when he explain this to media that I was confused. But everyone's thinking that taking the court out of where the battery is, is taking the court where the headset connects, is how you can swap the battery. But I will say that is a hard swap .

because IT turns off. Oh right. Yeah swap ah you.

So yeah, you can. I help you can.

you can .

plug a battery into .

the battery. Be careful.

I, I would .

go .

into .

this battery. You know, I know .

that point.

The cor, would you read the menu? Anchor .

bro.

think it's a battery dog. So on an controllable fire. My g putting Better to on my face. Wow, all right. Well, what we give any more advice that will make your insurance rates go up? Why don't we?

I'm buying life and chance americas right now.

All right, and we're back with another tribe around .

having a family.

See what you're doing back here in the meat verse we're doing in tribe. O do you guys want science or tech? I like science. I know either .

different things. I'm there actually. Yeah.

点点 O K。 Here's a question, the election ons, you have an intrinsic property called a spin in which two directions can an electron spin.

That's got IT. I have .

some fun facts .

about you .

really just.

Course.

why? Why would I could go? It's a right here.

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feel pain. Well.

okay, right, right. Welcome back. We are in our third final segment. I am still wearing the vision pro. We are so in real time is about an hour an hour.

Um I will say now and I haven't really done many times, has said other than google in the tribe answers well well. But there is a little bit of warm coming off the top of the headset you want can feel the warming. The headset itself is not warming.

IT doesn't really get warm unless i'm doing a lot and mac marine or whatever. But also I never hear the fans and I never feel the hot air. The thing never actually gets hot on like my face face. So that's my update.

So the high air doesn't come out of the headset.

but that does come out your mouth. The air comes like like as a little, yeah. And there are .

real fans pushing IT out. So and now we're continue to put this on. Would you prefer right now to take IT off?

Honestly, I love that. I can just google things. Well, okay, well.

if you weren't cheating interval, would you prefer to have this off?

This is the best i've ever felt after this long because of the headband. And wearing someone.

if you are wearing this headband.

there's no way I still have IT. okay? Yeah, sure. So the only reason to do that was if you don't want to mess up your hair or you're going use up for five minutes exactly.

If you an apple retail store you want to to look nice on the shop looks nice yeah.

yeah. It's nice that they give you both in the bag, considering the traveling.

caring cases. Two hundred dollars. yeah. Do you want talk about caring?

yes. Thank.

thank you.

Sleep master thing.

Yeah, this is just feel like I transport.

I know, but I love IT.

I'm going to start with the positives of .

this caring kids. Andrew has some thoughts.

beautiful. Is this like alcantra inside?

Yeah.

it's like a beautiful, soft, nice interview, adjustable to where the the, the gog's consider right in their strap in wires, battery place, everything, great material, good zipper, awesome exterior strap that were tracked back. And when you use then IT is made out of what feels like puffer jack material that's been cruel on my college dorm room floor for like four months while neglect .

to do my laundry waterproof rip stop .

mesh that looks like, thank you. It's been sitting on my college, done for .

months without doing.

And how is .

IT so wrinkle in .

the proof and rips up without having this .

much wrinkle? I want to say I really love the protector bouncy .

ban although somebody brought this up I think he was Christian selling from um from exotic o and pixel pals. I think he he was like the vision pro. Can the band can push forward to the goggles? Could this not be half the size, I think make that .

many Carrying cases, but the Carrying case situation for airports, max is a and but but the thing about that is the headphones don't fold or attract in any meaningful way. So that kind of is no good that it's going to be you no matter the back of the headset, you can push IT in and you can actually make IT smaller. You can take the band off even and make IT even smaller. But this Carrying case assumes you just take that off and put IT in and don't try to compressed. This takes up half the .

interior of my backup. The the actual vision protects up like a fifth of them yeah.

Like this feels like not backward, not packed, able less forty percent of yeah and then so like half of the size you could squeeze in a backpack with maybe a couple other essentials of the things you want with you on the .

plane does feel substantial though. I think about the Price two hundred dollars because let's be honey when you're just hear to enter our caring case you like that's insane. I feel like this is deserving of of the press. Maybe that's a hard take, but this feels like a two hundred dollar case.

I'm not even joking. I think it's less of that is a two hundred dollars ase and more of its a thirty five hundred dollars has said .

that doesn't come with because if someone made the point that a lot most of apples cases are five percent of the retail value of the device. So the base iphone fifteen pro is a thousand dollars and the case is fifty dollars were just five percent of the value. Uh, that's two hundred, which is about five percent of thirty five hundred.

Is that just the math on like what we think we can get out of the customer? Maybe i'm not sure it's like apps on ipad costs more because people with ipad have more money. And that's i'm sure vision programs are gonna pricy. Yeah.

i'm not sure if they're just like all of our cases are five percent of the product Price or if it's I mean, that's clearly not the case because if you get a regular iphone that's cheaper, this is still fifty dollars, I think. Um but yeah.

for it's pro one, I guess I want to trying to recall this.

I can. I can literally.

And if you allow me, I want .

to I think .

you should. I don't think .

I .

steam I I want to try steam this and see if .

I can fix that and then wrinkle in forty five. I like glass.

Tex is funny because we didn't know about that. But then geneseo made like a fake post when everybody also posting them. Seeing IT would just like an actual sleep mask. If you go back, IT looks almost exactly yeah.

that's funny. What is that? baggy?

This is for your accessory. So you're charging a cable and brick. And I also have the microphylla here because I think it's infinite fingerprints.

And I have a little nick on the glass as well already. Yes, I mean, you say is tiny, I know because we're shooting. How do you know there's a lot? okay.

So here's a thing I can't do IT because i'm still wearing IT. But picking up the vision pro is kind of a deliberate experience. If you pick up by padding, IT just make magnifies off, IT just falls off. So you got to pick IT up by the metal, which I imagine we've like. You clack the phone up against that once or twice is probably done other like more to .

have some things and escape. So by the time is pods out, our last video will prove out which then, you know, that brand found away with alex and myself to rig this onto a robot. So maybe .

we found .

we had to build on rig connected to the robot.

The question, you hate this, if you could buy just that. Would you put that in backpack like vision road? I H.

I think that's the Better.

yes. The only thing I .

care about the procs, yeah, the inside lanes, I don't .

know how dangerous is.

Yeah, comes on IT. okay.

Yeah then I probably so you don't .

really need that. I guess .

you're only buying that if you're caring IT just by itself.

So maybe that does the dolus strap collapse .

yeah go to the point maybe not as much as hard.

but those buckles when their collapse could scratch.

I put in the .

accessory patch. Does that come with IT? Or does that in the this is just in the vision pro. Nice for you. Like, nice.

I have to be the only personal.

a studio that absolutely adores this case. No, I like IT. No, I like you. I like IT.

It's two hundred dollars well and .

two and IT is .

ingle .

anger and David .

are in the this wrinkle thing is dumb camp. No ugly. I think it's .

it's .

beautiful.

It's so you like that thing. I ve rip stop material like that is the .

kind of have nothing against the rip stop material. I just don't like rip .

stop material that looks like, yeah like fun like that seems like you get up the NASA logo on there. And I would .

definitely be a NASA astronaut shelling man would love.

I think, my proud like if I eventually got wrinkly because used so much but it's so wrinkly that the product photos on apple's website are wrinkle .

as a boy who spent my early years, uh, baking in the california side and well, when I am eighty years old, look justice wrinkly that that I think in a little bit i'll fit me quite well.

Yeah have you guys ever like painted a room or painted a house and you go and you get from home debo those like seven dollar paint suits like the that's what .

the material reminds me of but let's .

call that yeah .

and it's also I do am I crazy for not believing the rip stop claim? I think you could care that with your fingers.

I think that's your fingers. I don't think with your fingers, and I don't think it's you can't care with the fingers. I also think ripped up in general can stop, which is I have plenty of ribs of pants that are right.

Wait.

i'm a good broker bush or a good rockers .

like that.

You see it's just it's Better than regular material.

They have rip, stop, mention the Adams as well, nyon fabric that is woven ven, so that a tair .

will not spread lug.

well, let me see. Yeah, it's it's moving .

well and we're done with the kiss. sure. I think we should talk about tax something else that apple is charging people a lot of money.

Xi teis.

the news article that came out that is extremely confusing yeah to where I will sorry no, no, no, you go i'll just say to where I will preface this where, David, I have both at multiple articles. I've listened. We have contacted multiple developers that we know Christian who have mentioned before, being one of them nice enough to jump on a call this morning and helps.

And then he was confused.

And he was confused, well, actually. And then we went to apples thing. But basically this is about the new E.

U. Third party and APP tax that they will be charging due the passing E U. Laws prefacing this whole thing.

I know David probably jump into this and go into how this all works, but we are a big confused because there are different article. No, no, no. anything. We get wrong as both of our four, but there are lots of articles that say different things and are confusing in the way words IT. So we're going to try and get this as best as we can buy IT new ways public charging apps in the year.

What is happening? okay. yeah. So the european union and apple have a very contentious relationship right now. In many ways. We've seen USB c.

Now they are forcing apple to allow third party APP stores on the iphone, uh, because they see apple as a like gatekeeper of shorts. The iphone and all mobile phones are basically like an essential device that everyone uses in their daily life. So even though apple is this company that can generally do whatever they want.

The europe ion in this saying, well, you need to do IT in a way that is beneficial to consumers or at least like open to consumers and gives people choice. So what they've done is they have forced apple to allow these third party APP stores, but they've done IT in the most. I'm going na put my middle inger up at you, Eugene union.

Even on like moitie complaints, there's a great sub separate for this called our slash militias compliance. Very fine. N that's funny. People like doing what they're told to do, but in a way that is so freaking annoying and that's what apple is doing here.

So like people paying tickets in like pennies yeah like i'm paying yeah i'm gonna for exactly going .

to make your life harder to do the thing you're forcing me to do. Uh so now there are three different options that you as a developer can do if you want to, either one, Operate a third party up story, the european union, which is now forced by law, or have your APP on a third party APP store that you can access on the iphone.

Notably a fortnight has not been on the apple apple store because tim sweeney is very against the thirty percent apple tax they got in a big fight. Uh the whole um epic versus apple things started because tim swing basically like broke the store apple rules and introduced a third party payment method within the fourth night APP on the APP store. So they got kicked off, never really resolved IT. Now they're going to be able to offer the epic APP store as well as their own third party third party payment processing method on the iphone in europe only, which is really annoying.

And one thing to know there is like just because it's in the E U. And me being a moron. So there's probably a couple other more on listening to this words, like there are developers in other countries, but they still have people in the E.

U. Using their APP. So there are still portions of this APP income that are going to be affected by this and how they want to like work .

in the yeah so yeah one hundred percent. okay. So three options.

Option number one, nothing changes. You do literally nothing. You stay in apple le's APP star thing.

They take thirty percent cut. You don't have to think about anything that's IT. You're not changing anything. One option two um you completely leave the apple apple store and you only put your APP in third party APP stores so you don't have to pay the thirty percent cut because you're not being published in the apple APP store. But once you hit one million downloads, uh per year, you pay fifty euro cents, which is word doors sense .

I well then .

the conversion .

was techy fifty four sense U S T. so.

The per year sort of yes, the per year thing yeah touch the the right .

that was what was mostly confusing this morning. Um so yeah, you don't want to pay that thirty percent cut. But then after you hit a million users, it's fifty cents per user that could stack up very quickly.

Um and it's it's per user over one million. So the first one million don't count after that.

Yeah that you guys may have had someone your life that said, what I moved into a different tax back and when I make a less money now and it's like, no, that's not how that works. They take a higher percentage of the its add additional income.

right? Anyway.

option three, uh, you agree to the new terms and you're by the way, once you agree to these new terms and say I wanted offer my up in a third point APP, you're not allowed to say I want to go back to apple only .

it's you talk about locking that's universal. That's specifically to discourage .

people from making. Yes, absolutely. But if you do that, uh you actually only pay seventeen percent to apple. Um but then additionally, after one million users, you also pay that fifty percent v per user. So the tax that goes directly apple goes from thirty percent to seventeen percent, which is good.

But if you are a very large apt that has a ton of users that fifty years since per user could stack a ton, something that I was seeing flying around the internet that were having a long discussion about this morning that was very misleading. A lot of people were saying an update counts as an install. IT does not um IT sort sort of does IT can count as an installed if you have not installed the APP that year or if you have not updated they up.

I think I read this enough. I can explain this good head OK. So it's not that it's actually fifty. I'm just going to keep things fifty cents.

I hope everyone s not fifty six per year, but it's fifty cents per new install per year and you get a twelve one Grace period in that. So if you installed IT after the one million users, IT cost that company fifty cents in a year. If you don't reinstall IT, IT doesn't.

It's not another fifty cents. But if an update happens after that twelve month period, IT counts as a reinstall and restarted the twelve month period. Yeah, so some people were confused because they were like, well, every time I update this, i'm gonna charged another fifty cents per person who updated. You can do IT a bunch of times, but in every single lap is going to update least once a year. So just assume IT, as every APP is basically fifty cents per user per year over .

cover a million. And they do that crucially because if you basically saturated your APP installed market and you got like you got like ten million installs right away, but then you didn't even remotely to get a million installs the next year. If they didn't have that as a thing, apple wouldn't make any money.

So they have to recharge you every year if you update your up at all. Yeah um okay. So apple makes IT a big deal that oh ninety nine percent of developers are actually paying, probably less if they go through the third upstart cuts seventeen percent and they many .

people that's framing this is framing .

because crucially, uh the top one the top one percent of APP developers are on like ninety five percent of people's phones yeah .

um and we will probably pay equally as more load of money .

you like million like like sixty million. And I also weird .

because then it's making smaller developers hope that their apps don't get popular .

if able to like compensate for IT somehow. Yeah if you have a free APP you don't really make money on and IT gets popular and you have IT in an exterior APP store, you're screwed like you're going to oh apple a ton of money unless unless you can like make money through ads or something, you're kind of just screwed.

Christian was mentioning to us how like IT could it's potentially harmful if you make an APP and you don't convince the person to do the premium version which subscribes and then they have auto updates on. And now every year, they just kind of forget about that APP. And now you potentially have a bunch of users who aren't giving you the income from IT, but now you're getting charge fifty cents per year per year, yeah, and that adds up if you are .

on a larger APP, right? So it's very confusing definitely on purpose just to try to keep people in their regular APP store system. And then there is a new set of taxes, uh, if you are trying to Operate a third party APP store, so those world for just developers that either wanted to be on just apple apple store or both or just on a third party APP store.

But if you say you're um you want to make the epic APP store, which epic definitely wants to do, this move is definitely just a giant metal finger two epic because of the whole trial thing. Um you don't get the one million user Grace period. So if you're Operating a third party APP store, no matter what, you have to pay fifty year o cents per user install a period?

yes. And again, we're saying player assuming the whole actual twelve Grace period, which is just going to always yes, I just want to know. So this is this is .

what IT feels like if your epic, not only do you have to pay fifty cents per user who download your APP store at all, but then you also have to give seven, seventeen percent of all commission from that APP store to apple.

Is, I thought, those only if if they're still on the apple APP store as well. I think if they are only on third party, then they don't have to .

pay the percentage at all.

I believe. So okay. Well, I guess this is a little more confusing with that. But I think I think it's if you're on both at seventeen percent plus one million year fifty, if you are just totally by us, I guess this is you are creating the third body APP store, which I assume if you are creating the third body APP store, you don't want to be on the regular APP store.

This is how I feel anyway, this is uh created a lot of contention with developers this uh, week because it's just been it's so confusing on purpose. It's trying to keep people in their in their world guard on purpose. And then there's a whole another thing with like you can offer a third part payment methods as well.

So that's the thing where like I do think some this is the potential win win for some companies. Some I think the verge use spotify an example because spotify does not let you subscribe to them inside of the APP because of the apple tax. yeah.

So if they can now allow you to subscribe inside of the APP, but they're just going to be paying the fifty cents per year per year, if they will probably get the extra amount of revenue through subscriptions. yeah. And because it's easier and then the fifty three years cheaper than the thirty .

percent tax on the done, like a twitter suh X I had a way to they still have this. You can subscribe to x premium in the APP on the phone, but IT literally costs thirty percent more per month and they don't really tell you that very obviously. But if you go and subscribe on a desktop, then you pay thirty percent less every month, which is um so now I would be nice if you you have spotify let you describe in the APP, but they just said, heads up, it's gonna fifty cents more per month if you subscribe here .

versus I think even if they just do IT Normally like they're getting a Better revenue out of yes or they are like making IT up. So it's still they they OK with how much more revenue theyll get by people being able to subscribe in the APP because it's easier verses paying that for. Yeah, again, this is also only the E.

U. They obviously all over the place, all over the world. So it's like a lot, but also a little to companies that are that big. So yeah and then also apple is going to be making so much money off of spotify in that scenario. The yeah fifty three .

epic is also specifically um they're prepping to chAllenge the changes because IT kind of is a direct target at them.

I was also going to say the E U. Can still look at this review IT. So this is still ongoing.

IT is surprising. The apple is being this present against .

the couple developers we talked to were basically like we are going to do nothing at first. Let IT just keep writing the thirty percent and see, lets some other people be any pigs on this, and see if they IT ones are causing them less. How big of a differences, if it's worth the huge hassle. All of this kinds seems purpose vely confusing and in crazy to just hope that nobody makes any changes and just continues to eat the thirty percent.

Yeah yes, definitely.

They're hoping. I also realized David and I, we're going and on that for a while and I hadn't heard my things like, is he listening and intrigued inside of an APP inside vision? right? I was.

Anyway, this is an evolving story, as all of this apple E, U stuff has been. If anything, apple pissing off the E U. Even more makes IT even more likely that maybe I message could be into up. That's exciting in the future because the whole beeper thing really did start a ripple like senator senator Elizabeth war .

and started tweet about beeper not my and .

they forgot about that and didn't totally ut like ut down .

the rip when w but okay.

So yeah, that was confusing. David and I tried very hard, probably if you think we could go wrong, please know we did in a nice manner .

but do the research first because people say a lot of things at us and then we look at up we are not developing.

We don't know you. So thank you. Um hate and markets.

I'd markets chat out a while ago. I can see the blue glaze. You you need, you need .

that apples. Now, next one forty five.

yeah.

There's an next five. Yes, this span .

is a way Better. Man, way Better. Are you .

excited to take IT off though? Yeah look yeah making .

me vision pro. But I know that I will not use IT consistently .

know there's one in the office won.

be used as much. I'm just out here like a learning.

There is a really great comment on there. Ready about another comment on ready about how, when you are in on boxing, the very first time you put on go, this is really heavy.

Do the difference between this solon IT band and the way the way it's holding the weight on the front of your face verses the way this one takes so much of that weight off of your Jones is enormous.

Have you ever thought, just like working .

out my other, all the jokes are like your next drink, next drank. The only way I feel IT on my neck when I do that, that's.

that's when I feel IT on my neck.

I just like.

yeah, I just want .

all over .

the place apple .

fitness plus ads like a chicken muscle. It's like how many reps of smiles can .

you do grow going to add the f one like like pulling work out .

and the past with me taking IT off and seeing how .

many lines are on my things. What do I am?

But of course we should, before we get to the end. Trivia, you trivia, trivia do, do trivia. Yeah, we do that.

We should do that. Yes, yes. All right. TV quick look.

update markets cheated score is .

no matter because mark is cheating, but check out the trivial extra ginza .

episode dropping .

next week and i'm done. First question.

which legendary mobile device was more expense at launch? Nineteen ninety six six pom pilot professional or two thousand two t mobile slash danger, some market you do. I like watching him sheet in real time.

what? Someone.

yeah, sucks.

yeah. Well.

you don't want to play my game. I'm not play in your game.

You guys know the other one. You just guessing the other one.

I actually know one of them. So just put a tone down just despite you. Well, I like you.

My answer is quantum. Wow.

A, B, A and B.

A, A .

would .

be correct.

You think of the same Price? No.

no. What do you think i'm saying that there, both or neither, until you tell me the answer and then IT collapses and Alice, my .

answers .

in a superposition .

IT that's I say .

he is.

i'm i'm going with the one megabit palm pilot profession.

which retailed hout.

Next question, electrons have an intrinsic property called the spin. Which two directions does an electron spin in?

But do we do.

To google electron spin direction.

close. sorry. okay. And my answer is a spin up or spin down, often denoted by negative z or positive z interesting. So what does disease and for markets? Ah I wasn't the question, but I can google.

Andrew, I just dw fold in backwards.

David, as electrons .

are in a quantum states.

I.

the spain.

until you, yes, I of particles.

inherent anger momentum is parameterized by spin quantum numbers.

Clearly the answer .

is up in.

Yeah, I know that's what I wrote about electrons be.

So to identify .

spend direction, you determine the number of electron's the adam has, then you draw the electronic configuration for the adam, see electronic configuration tions for information, then review the electron's things up and down to represent the electron spin direction. So, well, bad reality. You guys look way Better and they are two hours.

Two, i'm not used to seeing you with that glasses on.

Yeah, no, this this is really goggle eye opening in a stressful way, but literally. Thanks for watching. Thanks for listing. Thanks for spending time with us in or not in division pro, we have a lot more to talk about with a lot of the stuff, but to the next one, faster pace anyway.

right?

Oh, away from the stress by elsa van adam melina, we are part of the box media podcast network and our intrada music is by vin sel.

Then IT is so brighten here. Here, that band mark on your head is pretty intense.

There is a conversation that somehow went from .

canby's sm into news. David, hey, we spend a lot of time talking about some of the most important people in taking business about what they're putting resources to and why do they think it's so critical for the future. That's why we're doing this special series diving into some of the most unique ways companies are spending money today.

For instance, what does that mean to start buying and using A I at work? How much is that costing companies? What part are they buying? And most importantly, what are they doing with IT and of course, podcasts? Yes, the thing you're listening to right now, well, it's increasingly being produced directly by companies like venture capital firms, investment funds and a new crop of creators who one day want to be investors themselves.

And what is actually going on with these acquisitions this year, especially in the A I space, why are so many big players in tech deciding not to acquire and instead license that can hire away cofounder? The answer, IT turns out, is a lot more complicated than that seems. You'll hear all that and more this month on decoder with the lie presented by strike. You can listen to the coder whether you get your podcast.