There’s No I In Trevor Noah [VIDEO]
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Social media is so multifaceted, right? So sometimes you're using social media to connect with family that are living abroad. Sometimes you're living on social media to get your news. I would ban WhatsApp. Why would you ban WhatsApp? African aunties just use it. What's that ever done to you? They just use it. Love a bit of WhatsApp. Let me tell you something.

During COVID... Nothing sends photos faster. Listen, Ben. Yeah. The misinformation that African aunties spread about COVID during COVID-19... It actually is one of the biggest...

It's one of the biggest spreaders. But you know why it became that? They were like gargle with salt and vinegar instead of getting the vaccine. And I'm like, this is not going to work. That's just the wrong family. That's not my fault. That's just talking about who you grew up with. No, no. I'm telling you, it's all a bad thing. The people on my WhatsApp aren't saying anything like that. Well, you're in the wrong WhatsApp. Well, maybe I'm in the right WhatsApp. Maybe I'm in the right WhatsApp.

You're listening to What Now? The podcast where I chat to interesting people about the conversations taking over our world. Today on the podcast, my favorite question. If I ruled the world.

We love a good thought exercise on What Now? And this is one of our favorite questions to ask with friends. If you were in charge and you could change one thing about anything, schools, airports, commerce, restaurants, whatever it may be, what would you change? Well, we've got three folks on the show today with three massive ideas, maybe terrible ideas. Who knows? We'll see. Either way, joining me, writer, journalist, and professional hater, Cristiana Mbakwe-Medina.

and one of our very own executive producers and my good friend and fellow football watcher. Yes, you say soccer. Ben Winston. And let's get into it. This is What Now? with Trevor Noah. This episode is presented by Lululemon. Everyone has those moments where they say, not today, when it comes to fitness. I mean, I know I do.

Well, Lululemon Restorative Gear is made for those days. Days where you want to max out your rest and not your reps. Lululemon's new campaign features Odell Beckham Jr. and DK Metcalf in their buttery soft, breathable, restorative wear. Designed to keep up or kick back with you. Visit lululemon.com for everything you need to bring it tomorrow. Rest day is the best day.

I'm always trying to think of what the music is that's playing before the thing is. Do you want me to sing it for you?

That's actually really good. I see a real talent in mine. It's almost like you did it. Welcome to the podcast, everybody. How are you doing? Good. Terrific. You paused for such a long time. Yeah, because we've got kids. Did you pause because you're English or did you pause... Oh, yeah. Yeah, it's probably a British issue. It really is. Well, we were being polite. I was sort of going, ladies, first you can say how you are and then...

It's always all good. Oh, wow. And now I'm going to apologize for us, Pauline, because it was compulsive. Well, happy podcast day, everybody. This is an all-colonial edition, I guess. It's like degrees of colonization. We have the colonizer. We have one who was integrated into the colony and then one who was just oppressed but has made his way out. I'm not going to come across well in this pod at all. Why are you assuming you're the colonizer?

Okay, maybe I'm up. Maybe I'm up. I'm fine. This is fun, actually. This is fun. This is fun. Ben, we barely get to speak to you because you're always off doing something. If there was an asteroid coming to Earth now, you would probably be asked to produce it as a concept. They would be like, the world's ending. We would like to get Ben Winston to produce this for us. Yeah. The final ending concert of the world. It's lovely to be here, Trevor, when 14 people have said they can't make it.

And then I get that call. It's like, he's already a producer of the pod. No one else is about. We want to do it in person. Let's just get that dude in. Oh, please. Fake humility. More than that. Fake humility, Elizabeth. And as always, as always, the rose amongst the thorns. I love that phrase.

Christiana, how are you, friend? I'm good. I'm good. Feeling good being a rose. I'm normally like the thorn. Where are you the thorn? Because I'm just like, I'm a friend with the opinions that destroys the group chat. You know what's funny? I feel like you've lived in, maybe you've lived in like the Western world for too long. Because if you were in South Africa or many parts of Africa, I feel like you would be like the friend.

Yeah, of course. Because it's just like they like chaos. Yeah. I mean, I think about Joseph, like our friend from Uganda. Oh, my God. We need to have him on. Literally, there was a group text that was sent out to our soccer group.

And they didn't mention his name, but they said, hello, gentlemen, please note that this is a casual game and nobody needs to be instructive and stop telling other people that they're useless and what they need to improve on. And I sent it to him. And in classic Joe style, I said, Joe, this is definitely directed to you. And he was like, oh, first time I've been called a gentleman. Yeah.

He wasn't even phased. Because I think as Africans, we're blunt. We're like, whatever. It's not about being polite or anything. How are you doing, though? I'm good. Where have you been? Where have I been? My favorite CIA asset. Oh, wow. You always ask that question in such an accusatory way. I'm sorry. No, it's fine. It's fine. Because I feel like you're up to mischief.

You know what? You're not wrong. Where I am in the world is generally for a mischievous reason. And where I am in the world is actually the perfect question to ask for our brand new segment. It's time for Where in the World, brought to you by T-Mobile, who can help you experience travel better. They have a whole host of travel perks that you'll love, whether you're on a day trip or your dream trip. Okay. I've debated whether or not I should tell you this. Oh, wow.

This is one of those moments in life where I like to be honest with my friends. Okay. But I also like to be right. By the way, if a man tells you he likes to be honest, that means he's a liar. But... What? I can't believe you'd say that. It's just that when men are like, oh, I'm really honest. No, no, I didn't say I'm really honest. I said I like to be honest. There's a difference. What's this got to do with where you've been? I've been traveling quite a bit. Yeah. In part of my travels. I had a meeting and a conversation with...

The assistant director of military operations at the CIA. Interesting. Is that what you've been doing? You've been having a conversation with the CIA? I think you've truncated everything I've said and made it sound a lot more clickbaity than it is. What did you meet the CIA about?

Again, you've just moved on from, you've now made it the whole organization. I just met an individual. Lovely, lovely gentleman. Okay. And yeah, it was just, but I wanted to tell you this because if I omitted it, I would always feel like I'd kept something from you that sort of made you right. And why did he reach out to you? Hmm.

You see, this is not like he reached out. We just happened to be in the same place and we were having a conversation. You have a strange life. Where are the places I cannot tell you? You have a strange life. I've been to other places. Well, I saw you recently. We literally bumped into each other in an airport in Dubai. It was in Dubai. I wasn't in Dubai. I was flying. You were coming from Abu Dhabi. I was coming from Abu Dhabi and I was flying to LA and then we just happened to be texting. I was like, where are you? You're like, I've just landed in Dubai. And I was like, I'm in Dubai airport. You're like,

so am I and we met at like the business center yes we did indeed and we had like a lovely 20 minutes it was so bizarre I love those like encounters in those meetings just randomly bumping into people in the world but you had been in Bhutan with a load of monks yeah Bhutan Japan and now you're meeting the CIA like it didn't involve the CIA and I was traveling

and enjoying good coverage. So let's jump into the podcast. But remember, I wanted to tell you that that segment was brought to you by T-Mobile, who can help you experience travel better with perks like free in-flight Wi-Fi so you can watch your favorite movies from 30,000 feet. Plus, you can return your dollar rental car without the hassle of refueling. Yeah, that's pretty amazing. And

And get this, T-Mobile's got you covered with 5 gigabytes of high-speed data in 215-plus countries and destinations with Go 5G Plus or Next plans. Learn more at t-mobile.com slash travel. Qualifying plan required. Wi-Fi where available on select U.S. airlines. Terms and conditions apply.

I think it is time for us to jump into this week's podcast, which is really exciting for me because sometimes I think we limit ourselves in how we think because we think through the lens of what is and what could be. And every now and again, I like to think to myself, what would I do if I ruled the world? And that's when I find the magic happens. That's when the true magic happens. So I'm going to kick it off. So I've been thinking about it this week. If I ruled the world, I know this is going to be controversial, but if I ruled the world,

I would shut down social media. It's done. It's finished. There is no more. Considering especially people are probably watching a lot of this on social media. Yeah, it's done. But it feels like you're being hypocritical because how much stuff you're putting out on social media. No, I'm not being hypocritical at all. All of it? Yeah. Now, let's be clear about what I consider social media. Be clear. So it is Instagram, Facebook, Snapchat, TikTok, Twitter. And are there any others?

There's WeChat. I don't think that's normal. I'm big on truth social. I love truth social. As the white member of this panel, I actually am huge on truth social. What's it like over there? It's where the truth is. Wow. And it's social. Wow. It's truth social. Do they know that you're Jewish? No, I hide that.

I hide that. I hide that. I thought I was hiding it from this podcast as well, but apparently not. I've been outed. So you're going to explain why you want to ban all social media, but you at the same time need to acknowledge the many incredible things that happen because of social media. So this is what I think we do sometimes in society that is...

- You know, like there's this idea and I think it's neuroscientists have stated this and psychologists. They've said that as human beings, we overestimate how happy something will make us. And we underestimate how unhappy something can make us. - Okay. - Right? I think social media falls into one of those categories. We take for granted how unhappy it has made us as a civilization. We take for granted how much it's hurt us, how much it... So I'm not saying it hasn't brought the good things.

But I think the good things are far outweighed by the bad. My issue is we talk about TikTok and all these algorithms knowing us well. I think the thing we take for granted is that we're creating a feedback loop where the data that we're putting out becomes the data that we're getting in. What you don't realize is happening to you is, for the most part, the algorithm is...

contracting your view of the world and leaving you in a world where you like the things that you like. And it's just giving you slight versions of the things that you like. Do you get what I'm saying? I do. And I worry about what it's going to do to us as a society. I worry what it's already done. Now, I know some people are going to say, oh, but Trevor, I mean, because of social media, I know what's happening in the world. Yeah, we knew what was happening in the world before social media. Did we, though? We did. We did. But hold on. We did. We did.

No, we knew... Ask me about things. I'll tell you if I knew them. But here we've given the power... Social media... Yes. And listen, one of the things I was thinking about in the lead-up was maybe banning social media for kids who are under 16 and actually just letting them never have smartphones but only have phones where we can reach them and find out where they are because I don't think there's any good to be had from that. But...

Essentially, back in the day, pre-social media, people would get their news from five organizations that would decide how to tell that news. And we have to acknowledge that now we are giving the individual power to tell their story that you're now taking away from them. Yes. I hear what you're saying. Which works for your dictatorship, but might not work for the world. I hear what you're saying. And I love you as my friend, but you're wrong. So...

The reason I say you're wrong with such confidence, Ben, is because I'm not saying that I will get rid of the internet. The internet still provides everybody the opportunity to in some way, shape or form share their opinions. Social media has created a specific machine, an algorithm that is tasked with one thing in particular, and that is keeping our attention, keeping us engaged. So

I'm agreeing with you. Yes, there were maybe like five networks. But I think that would change. You know, cable news comes out, cable television, cable whatever. But then there's also the internet. You can go on the internet. You can search something. There'll be other websites. There'll be other news, et cetera. Because in the same way that you're saying social media has given individuals the opportunity to tell their stories, I think it's also robbed us of a collective understanding of what reality actually is. And I know, I know that I'm sacrificing some things.

But the things that I think we're benefiting from are the fact that reality starts to come back together because your feed can feed you a reality that isn't completely real. How many times have people looked at, like, let's look at the conflict. You want to be delusional? Yeah. Yeah, you're in an echo chamber. I'm happy there.

The thing is... But you're unhappy there, I argue. But life is suffering. Like, people are going to be unhappy, Trevor. I disagree. No, honestly, I think they're going to be unhappy. And I'd rather them be unhappy on their phones than out in the real world doing real damage. But okay, think of it this way.

Pre-social media, you are a crazy person somewhere in the world. You have a crazy idea. How do you connect with other crazy people? You start a religion and you have a home. It's very hard. But people's had cults. Very hard. Very hard to really blow them up. You want to raise the threshold. Is that what you're saying? Back in the day, a crazy person had to be on the corner holding a flyer telling you why you have to join their thing to end the government. That is what you're saying. And again...

I'm okay with it if you want to be that kind of dictator. But what you're essentially saying is... First of all, I don't like the fact that you're calling me a dictator. I just think if I rule the world... We're sat in a room with your name everywhere, even on our mugs. I just said... I'm like, I can't move for Trevor Noah. Yes, yes, yes. But it says with Trevor Noah.

With. And you are with. I am with. And I think it's important to remember that. With. But my point is, if you're saying there's mad people who we're giving a voice to, what you're essentially saying is you want to clamp down on free speech. Yeah, censorship. No, I'm not saying that. You are, because you're saying there's crazy people on the street corner. We're now giving them a megaphone. I'm not disagreeing with you. How much has Elon Musk paid you, Ben? Oh, no, I'm not. I'm all about the TikTok dances. That's why I don't want to lose.

Think of all the avocado toast recipes I'm going to miss out on. So I'm just saying that your reason on the one hand is because we're unhappy and I can take that. And then you moved on to the algorithm is damaging. And now you're saying there's crazy people on the corner we're giving a megaphone to. That's a wide spray of bullets you're going with. Because I think it's a wide spray of bullets that's affected us. So let's break them down really quickly. So I'll give them to you as a list. The reasons I say we should get rid of it, right? In my world, if I rule the world. Number one. Yeah.

Misinformation and disinformation spreading at a rate that is far, far, far quicker than any other traditional media could be. Number two, limiting people's ability to live a life online that is making them more alone, more lonely, and feel artificially connected when in fact they're not. That's fair. Right? Because it presents the veneer of connection that isn't in fact there. Number three, I would go with it's fracturing our collective reality. Right.

Now, I'm not saying we have to agree on it or disagree. I'm not saying that. I'm just saying we all have to agree that it happened or it didn't happen.

And I think social media is fracturing that. Social media is breaking it down. I'm not saying my world would be perfect. But Trevor, don't you think that like... Wait, so neither of you agree with me here? Wow. You guys are parents, by the way. The reason I don't agree is because I just think... You're going to wish your kids lived in my kingdom. Listen, the world's a mess. I don't disagree. But I think social media is just exposing how fractured we already were.

Most people never had a real sense of collective reality. No, how can you say this? Honestly, people... The graphs for loneliness, the graphs for loneliness, if you look at it, if you look at it as a graph, all that's happened, I would say from the Industrial Revolution, that's when it really starts to go up.

But if you look at loneliness from social media times, it's skyrocketing. Isn't it because we live in this like hyper-capitalistic culture where people have to work all the time? Very valid. People don't have money for like holidays and housing. Very valid as well. Cost of living. Very valid. Even if people didn't have social media, they wouldn't have the means for connection because we're in this capitalist hellscape. I can agree with many people.

I can agree with many parts of that. Social media is just a reflection of like these kind of dystopian times we're in. You know what my favorite part of social media is? Close friends on Instagram. That little button. Have you ever used the little close friends? Because then it can just be the 15 of you that you allow into your world. And then it's not a status thing. It's not a opinionated thing. It's just it's just a little close community.

Just putting it out there. There's lots of good things about social media. Lots of good things? Wow. I met my husband on Twitter. Wow. There you go. Look at that. People, people, okay. Here's what I'm trying to understand here. She met her husband on Twitter. Guys, let's go with, are you saying, are you saying that you wouldn't want her children to exist? You can't believe you're killing off her kids. Just because you met your husband on Twitter does not mean Twitter is now a good thing. A good thing can come from a bad thing. There are people who've met like someone they like in prison. I don't like prisons. I don't like prisons.

I'm not cheering for prisons. I'm so sorry. I think there's lots of negative things. One of the things that I was thinking about genuinely was like in the things when you said let's do it about what we would change. I was going to say let's ban social media for under 16s. Let me ask you this question. Let me ask you this. Why would you ban it for under 16s and not for over 16s if it is such a good thing for the world? I didn't say it was such a good thing for the world. I said I don't think it needs to be

banned. If I remember correctly, I think it needs to be regulated. If we rewind the tape, you will hear Ben Winston say, I love it. It is the best thing in the world. I want to dance with dictators. See, that's the problem with AI. You've made me say that and I never said that. No, but really, why would you? Because you're having lunch with the CIA. Why would you ban it? I would ban it because I actually think the biggest problem with social media isn't about what you've said. I actually think the biggest problem with it is the

the insecurity that kids feel and the bullying that can happen on there. And that's what worries me about social media far more than like an adult reading a Twitter feed and they should just know better to believe and research facts that they're getting that are true or false. So if I'm hearing you correctly, you're saying that, um,

children are affected by the bullying and the shaping of their reality but adults are not? I think adults have a freedom of being able to not feel as pressurized and if they want to enter into that world where they're bullied like when people say and this is going to be brutal when I say this but I'm saying it anyway like you know when people go in the news and they're like I've had death threats I've had death threats on my Twitter I've had death threats I'm like don't go on Twitter laughter

We're not talking about somebody sending a letter to your house where they've cut up like magazine letters and like real death threats. We're just saying like some dickhead on Twitter who's like DM'd him. I'm like, just don't go on social media if it's so upsetting for you. But like for me, I was on a flight yesterday. I had an hour to kill. I went on TikTok. And you said death threats. I had a lovely time. No, I just had a lovely time. I looked at Arsenal scores. I watched clips. The algorithm, what is frightening about it?

is the algorithm now knows me better than I know me. Because like it started sending me this show about a porn shop, not like sexual porn. P-A-W-N. Correct. It's like from the 90s, this shop, this porn shop in Detroit. And it's decided, TikTok, that I will like it. And it's right. I really do. And now I'm like, it's showing me, it knows what I like more than I would. If I saw that on a cable menu, I'd be like, I'm not going to watch that. And now I'm hooked on it. The algorithm's too precise? It's another reason I've banned it. It's such a precise algorithm.

Do you not worry that you wouldn't be here if it wasn't for social media? Would you have become, without social media and without people going, oh, I love that guy. I want to hear him talk about this. It's unlikely that you would have had the success that you've had. We would not be sat here today with your name on the mugs if it wasn't for social media. So are you not worried about the fact that you're cutting the hand that feeds you? What's the expression? I am willing to...

to accept that there will be some things we lose in society. Because now you've got the house and cars. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. And I mean that honestly. I mean that honestly. I go, I think sometimes it's hard for us to think about the possibility of a better future because we haven't lived in it.

And I don't even mean this in like a dark way. Like if I didn't grow up in an abusive household, I might not be here with you. But would I want that for myself? Are you saying that abuse primed you for a friendship with Ben Winston? In many ways it did. In many ways it did. What I'm saying is like, I do not think that we have to accept something bad

because there has been good that has come out of it. There will always be good that comes out of bad things. But in my world, if I ruled it, I would get social media and I would ban it. We would still have the internet. We would still have TV and radio. I'm not like creating North Korea, people. Yeah, no, I say that. You would just have to learn your own dances. Oh, okay.

In your own world. I'm going to miss it so much. And you'd have to discover TV shows on your own. So, okay, votes. Ben, are you in my world or not? No, no, I'm afraid not. I think you're, I think, no, I wouldn't want to ban social media entirely. Because I think whenever you take something away, you create a vacuum that's filled with something else. And I worry more about what will fill that vacuum than what we will have by it.

Okay. All right. Fine. And I also think Christiana would never met her husband. You would never have been sat here necessarily because of your clips that went viral. All of this. All of this. All of this. All of this. All of this. Christiana, are you voting for my world or not? No, I'm not voting. And your reason is? I just think that humans are going to suffer anyway. And I'd rather suffer in a world where I can doom scroll on TikTok at 1 a.m. in the morning. Mm-hmm.

Okay, well, okay. On that positive note. On that positive note. So cheerful. We'll take a quick break. And then when we come back, let's see what would happen if Christiana ruled the world. And then we're going to see what would happen if Ben ruled the world. It's a great place. It's a great place, folks. We'll see. We'll see. We'll be right back. We're going to continue this conversation right after this short break.

Okay, so I created the perfect world and neither of you want to live in it, although you will send your kids to live in my world until they're 16, which tells me a lot. Which tells me a lot. Yeah. Christiana. Yeah. What would you do if you ruled the world? If I ruled the world, I would abolish private schools. Wow. And say that every child goes to a school assigned by a blind lottery.

So you don't know where in your city or your district where your child would go to school, because I believe that would incentivize rich parents to make sure all schools are good because you don't know where your child is going to end up.

And I'd make it mandatory for people in the community to volunteer in the school. You'd have to get like a CRB check. We'd have to make sure, you know, a pedophile or a weirdo and stuff like that. Abolish private schools. Now, Trevor without children is probably never considered schooling or what it would mean. I'm sorry. I spent...

20 years of my life in school, my friend. I'll have you know that. Okay. So it's not a lot about schools. It's not a lot about schools. I spent half of my life in schools. I'll be honest. My initial instinct is yes. Like, you know, I like this idea quite a bit. But let me ask you a few questions. Sure. Are you afraid that you'll rob kids...

of community because a lot of the time schools represent the communities that they're in and while they may not be perfect when it comes to the education that they dole out but i do think we shouldn't take for granted what it feels like to be in a school that is part of your community and what it's like to hang out with kids that speak your languages or come from your cultures or you know you know what i mean how would how would you deal with my counter is that like most rich people like the idea of a neighborhood school is collapsed for rich people it doesn't exist

Rich people will drive in LA. They'll go 45 minutes across town to a fancy private school and be like, I don't want you to be around these poor black kids. But I'm not talking about them. I'm talking about, let's say, the poor middle class kids. Oh, it's even better. They need to be able to be like, this is who's probably going to

be your boss, perhaps, right? They need to be integrated and be exposed to how the wealthy and affluent people live. I'm actually doing this social experiment where everyone gets thrown into the blender together earlier because the problem is it happens too late.

It happens if you're really lucky. If you're a poor kid, maybe you get to go to an elite college. And you get there and you have a miserable time because you're like, who are these people? They've played sports I've never played. They have references I don't understand. And it's an isolating experience. Or you get to meet them in the workplace and you're like, oh, I don't want to be around these people. They like air conditioning. It's always cold. Why do white people want to be cold all the time? If you go to school with them, you're like, oh, white people like to be cold. And you get used to it, you know? Okay. Very cold. Yeah. Here's a...

Here's a thought that I have, though. Yeah, but here's a thought that I have.

We're now making the assumption that your opportunities in life come from your school. Yeah. When in fact, there may just be a correlation between who goes to these schools and the opportunities that they receive. Well, that's why I'm saying if it's a lottery. That's just a lottery for the school. Yeah, it's a lottery for the school. So you could be like the poorest kid in your city. Yes. Sitting next to the kid of, say, Bill Gates. Right. Bill Gates is going to make sure that's a good school.

I hear you. And the spread of opportunities, the speakers that you get at the school, the sports you do at the school, the computers you use. Trust me. I'm just trying to spread the opportunity. You're allowed to donate. Because parents... You're allowed to donate.

Well, sure. Yeah. No, I'm saying that's a big part of your school. No, because that's what you're essentially saying. No, I see what you've done. I just see what you've done because then you're turning it into a private school. No, no, no. But that's what a lot of these like good public schools are essentially, right? They are privatized public schools in good neighborhoods because it's

send your kid to that school, you need to be able to afford a $2 million house. Ben, jump in with your point. This is like watching a football match and I see a counterattack. Wait, wait, wait. So what it does, I actually don't care as much about the parents giving their money. It's the parents who can afford to give their time.

The mothers and the fathers, let me be politically correct, who bake things. You know, all these people that look out for the teachers, like that type of like social capital. The thing that is like very intangible, those parents. I want those parents to be involved in all children's lives. Well, no, I was going to say that the issue you're bringing up is on the one hand, we're saying we don't want private schools and we don't want extra funding for certain schools. But then with the other hand, you're going,

a kid can sit next to Bill Gates' kid and then they got lucky because Bill Gates then funds the school. Not funds. Well, he does. You said he put his money in. No, no, no. To put his money in to make sure that school's good. Let's say in my thought experiment... Hold on, let me finish. So then, when he's funded that school, then that school suddenly becomes the Bill Gates school. No, you're describing a charter school. I don't want charter schools. No, but you're actively seeking donations from rich parents alongside... No, no donations. Oh, no donations. No donations. Oh, wow. No donations. Cookies. But then you want Bill Gates to bake rather than donate. No, no, no, because I'm like...

And I say this as someone who, for primary school, it wasn't the best school. Secondary school was a very okay school, but I ended up doing well in life. My son goes to a really nice school, right? And the level of investment, I just mean personally from the parents and the time they can give, I'm like, oh, it makes a difference.

And not all kids have that. Some kids have parents that work night shifts. The knock-on effect for the government funding for schooling if we put your plan into place, if you ruled the world, where are you going to get the absolute millions that it takes? Where they get the money for the bombs. I agree. You see those bombs you're going to buy? The bomb money. You're here with her. The bombs or my point? No, no, no. Christiana's point. I think she's right here. They've got the money. They had

the money when they wanted us all to take the COVID vaccine shot, which I took. I'm not an anti-vaxxer, guys, but before you get on me, the money...

But I'm saying the money is there. You're right. They spent a trillion dollars on the F-35 jet that didn't work. They've got the money. Guys, that is such a ridiculous way of playing politics. Of going, let's create a huge problem. What problem? Why are we creating the problem? Investing in children is a problem. No, quite the opposite. I would say you're actually investing less in children. No, I'm investing more. Wait, wait, wait. I'll say this and then you speak and then we'll go from there. So, I think what Christiana is saying is

If you misinterpret how the money moves, it can seem like you're creating a gap. But if you look at how we currently run schools, let's say in America, and many parts of the world is different, but in the U.S., for the most part, a school's success or failure, if it's not private, is determined by the zip code that it exists within. In Christiana's world, if I'm correct, and you will correct me if I'm wrong...

I think what Christiana is saying is our tax dollars now become amortized and you can't just aim rich neighborhood money into one school where they now have like random programs like lacrosse donkey dancing, which is excess money vibes. And it goes to all the schools. And so she's saying because of that, because all schools will get all money and all parents will have kids in all schools, all parents will want all schools to be good because they don't know where their kid will end up. So it's not monetization.

more money, it's just the money will be spread out differently. Yeah, I'm not sure that's right. Why? Because I think that private schooling essentially means that

there is a load of government money that is not needed because it's taken care of by those wealthier parents who can afford private schools. Let's say, and I don't know the percentage, what percentage would you think go to private schools over public schools? People or money? No, no, people. Let's say in America. People is nothing, but money is the thing I'm worried about. But my point is, is that that amount of money is coming from the parents. It's not coming from the government. Yeah, we don't care. But let's say it's 10% schools. Now you're taking that 10% and you're creating that burden

on the state school system because now you're having to spread how much investment you're making and you're not allowing donations from parents in your system. So suddenly an education system that was already stretched that didn't have money, you're now going, all of those people that were willing to pay for education so it wasn't our government problem, now you are our problem too. So this is what I'm saying. So like in LA USD, like in LA right now, they are under-enrolled,

because of a combination of COVID, people leaving California and all of this stuff. And that's like a lot of schools are at risk of closure. This is true. And when we say you can no longer have that route of plucking your child out of the system, it creates a different set of expectations of the government. So parents like yourself are going to be like, you're going to make sure that's a good school, right?

Forget the money. It's never about the money. The systems are underserved. There aren't actually enough students. Like the schools are under enrolled. And by the way, it's actually, I just want to say that this is a thing that I find a lot of affluent black and Asian parents like have a dilemma about. It's something I think about a lot. How old are your kids? What's your oldest? So my eldest kid is four and my youngest is 10 months. And the funny thing is with the public schools that are really good, they're not very diverse, right? But the private schools are more diverse.

So like now it's like, I want to send him to a good school. Right. And in my mind, I'm like, oh,

okay, public school, great option, free, but there's a risk he'd be the only black kid in the class. Private school, that's not the case. You've got black kid, Asian kid, Jewish kid. Because the connector's money. And the private school is really, they're like, we care about diversity and inclusion for our school brochure. So they're like, we make sure we want to have anything. They'll be like, yeah, we've got a non-binary Latino kid with four fingers. So what are you going to do? I don't know.

I don't know what I'm going to do. You haven't decided. I don't know what I'm going to do. That's why I want to ban them. So wait, wait, wait. So here's something I would want to ask about your magical world, right? This is you ruling this world. Unfortunately, when you look at history, you will see that time and time again, if you try to do this type of system,

People who are rich, people who may be a little bit racist. I'm not even saying racist people. I'm just saying a little bit racist. Like, you know, just like sprinkled with racism. Those types of people will find ways to...

to get their kids out of or into something else. Let's look at a recent example, COVID. COVID came, a lot of parents didn't agree with what was happening. And what did these parents do? They were like, you know what? We're actually taking our kids out of this little Zoom system you have. And we're gonna create little pods. I believe you now may create with your system, you may actually create

a bootlegger movement of schools where parents are going to be underground with like speakeasy schools? Listen, that's happening in this country already. You've got this homesteading movement, unschooling movement, homeschool movement. You don't think yours would accelerate it more? Well, I think there's always going to be like the people who say, I'm going to pull my kid out. I'm going to try and get around the system. But most humans, especially parents, are lazy. This is what you underestimate. Yeah.

People are very lazy and no one wants to be with their kid all day. Oh, my God. No, no, no. If you're like, OK, you say to the moms and the dads, you have to be a parent who teaches your kid. They'd rather kill themselves. They're going to start it, I'm sure. But some people will be like, OK, we're going to do our pod week two. They're going to be like, send these bastards back to that integrated lottery school and they're going to figure it out. I will. I'll throw this last thing for myself out just from history.

You would think this would be the case. But don't ever forget, America used to have public swimming pools. They were everywhere. People would go to the corner. They would jump in the pool. See you at the pool, Bobby. See you at the pool, Jamie. Everybody loved the public pool. You watch movies from back then. There was always a public pool. That's where the bully was. I'm going to punch you. And then one day, America passed a law.

And America said, these pools should also be open to black children. And the black children came to the pools. And initially, there was just a little bit of racism. People being like, you shouldn't be here. You're making the water black. And people peed in the water while they were in it. Some people threw acid in, et cetera. But even though, even as that died down, what happened to the pools?

they started closing. They stopped getting funding. People were like, "I don't know if we need pools." And what happened at that exact time? Private pools started going up. The idea of having a private body of water in your house was a crazy concept pre the 1960s. And now everyone's like, "I want a house with a pool." Why? Because there is no pool. And I think what you may be creating unintentionally is a world where those same people will go, "Okay, actually,

Why are schools even a thing in our society? Maybe we should close schools down. I mean, we're kind of on the road there with the charter school movement, right? But I think yours would literally, as we say in South Africa, lights off instantly. It would just be like an exodus. And we'd look back and go, wow,

You know there used to be a time when there were schools, public schools, and people were like, I can't believe it. And they'd all be gone. And so that is why I would not be voting for your world, unfortunately. I think there are many great... The ideas behind it, I love. But as much as I would love to see Bill Gates' kid sitting next to some other kid from Compton who's telling him why Kendrick won the beef. Listen. Ben? Ben?

I'm still reeling from the pools thing. I thought people just shut them down because you got Verrucas. That's why people didn't go to public pools. Rubber sock I had to wear as a kid. All that horrible fungus cream.

It'd be hypocritical in a way for me to vote for it as someone who went to a Jewish primary school and then a private secondary school and like really enjoyed my education. Oh, well, you see, no, no, no. Before we go to your vote, actually tell us more about that. It's a tricky one. I think it gave me a lot of, I think religion was always a really big part of my upbringing and my family's life and our heritage and our history and actually getting that education between the ages of four and 11 of who we were and where we'd come from.

kind of helped my identity even today. So I think that there'll be a big part of me and the way I run my life every day that would be missing if I hadn't have gone to that Jewish primary school. And because I'm happy with how things have showed up in my life and how it turned up, I wouldn't really want to change that or tweak that. But I do think there is always a responsibility to make sure that children are exposed to all ways of life, however that is, especially if they're in an insular school system.

But I also think you make really good points about what you're saying with the community spirit of everybody being part of the same thing going forward. So I'm kind of on the fence. I'm voting more against it than for. But I'm closer to voting for this than I ever am banning social media like Travis. The thing is what you said about the primary school you went to.

when you don't have a child of that experience in the classroom with you. It feels like an abstraction. Yeah, that's true. And that's something I worry about, not just for my child's own identity as being black and Latino, like how he views himself, but then other people. If you're only in a very insular world where you don't see much outside of it, I think it's impossible. So here's the one way I would augment my vote for you. If your world was school swap, I'd be in. So if you said...

for like two months of every year, kids all go to a different school than I would be in. This is like a premise of like a Hollywood movie. I mean, we'll make it. It's a no vote from me, Ben. I think it's a no from me. I tried. I made a best case. It's a valid point. You've brought up great points that we genuinely as parents need to think about, about how

Like how we approach things and how we don't just push everybody else out of the way to get what we need for our children. And there is a sense of community and integration that's needed in the school system that currently maybe doesn't happen. Yeah, I feel like we should be equally invested in everyone's children, not just our own children. Because when that child grows up and robs you, you're going to have...

some opinions on it yep that's right every rubber is somebody's child don't ever forget that okay alright sound like my dad we're gonna take a quick break we're gonna come back with the final one Ben Winston if I ruled the world don't go anywhere cause we got more what now after this

All right, this is it. We're back. Time for the final If I Ruled the World. So far, we got two no's. Ben and Christiana voted against me. Clearly, the empire strikes back. And then we voted against Christiana. So, Ben Winston. Well, I thought about a few things on the way in and they were, you know,

flushes on toilets should be on the floor rather than on the wall like for hygiene and then I was thinking about like I've used one of those they're great much better like a slow lane for people who are walking slowly that stuff was annoying and then I Japan does that naturally I love it do you know what I mean it's like there was stuff like or like the fact that the plug changes depending on where you are in the world and there should just be one you know

straightforward one and then I realised YouTube were coming up with really intelligent things and I was like oh shit I better think about this so I was quite glad I came last. It's given me a good 40 minutes to work out what I was going to do. I'm going to go for something that has I think been a positive effect in many people's lives which came from religion but for me it isn't religious and I think that we should make the seventh day

And not for religious reasons, because we're worried about God or whatever else. I think the seventh day should be a day of rest where we go extreme. No electricity, no phones, no driving, where for one day, for 24 hours, we switch off. We exist with our family and friends. We eat together. We drink together. We don't go down to the shops and get the stuff. We had to prepare for it in advance.

We don't work. We exist with whatever we've got. We go for walks. We enjoy each other's company. We switch off from everything else in the world. And I think that actually...

It comes from something that came in my childhood. I grew up Orthodox Jewish, right? So my family, they wouldn't use cars on Saturday. We wouldn't use phones. We wouldn't work. And my dad is quite well-known sort of infertility specialist. He would be working from 7 a.m. till 11 p.m. six days a week. But from a Friday night to a Saturday night, as a religious family,

We were just with each other. The time we would spend together, the joy that that would bring us, the switch off that we knew for 24 hours, I just had my dad and like nothing else mattered. And we would all be together and exist together. I think is such a beautiful thing to have and to almost like reset because it's

Whatever job you do, whether you work down the store, whether you host a podcast, whether you're a doctor, nurse, whether you do something silly like make TV shows like I do, it's always the most important thing in the world. And if for one day you just turn off and just breathe for a minute, I actually think that could be great for society and family values and everything. Okay. This is very beautiful. I'm going to start by asking some questions just to clarify, to understand. Yeah.

Is everyone resting on the same day? Correct. Everybody does the same day because we need other people. So what we would have to do on this day is we would go, right,

All day Saturday or Sunday or Friday. It doesn't matter. We can choose. I'm open to whatever my cabinet feels about it when we discuss it in government. But the one day that we choose, everything stops. Okay. Everything stops. No flights. So if you are... No flights because then you need the air hostess. I'm saying for one day we shut down. If you get stabbed the night before... Yeah, hospitals do that. If you get in a car accident... Hospitals are allowed. Wait, hospitals are allowed? Yeah. So who's working in the hospital? Life and death. Anything that is life and death... Shift work. Anything that is life and death

We carry on. No one should die because of my policy. I don't want anyone to die. I'm a giver. You know, Ben, for some people, the liquor store is life and death. But then they can stock up. On a Friday, they stock up. Like many religious people do. They get drunk on the Sunday, but they stock up and you get ready for it. It would also be incredibly good for the environment because for a day, everything's grounded. Electricity, planes, carriages.

cars, it would be phenomenal for the world. And for one day, do you know what? We all just chill out. Okay, okay. So, Christiana, do you have anything? I have a bunch. So...

I like it. Thank you. In principle. Let's just vote now. Let's go straight to the vote. I feel like this is because of like accents. I just realized I'm- I didn't want to like it because I'm a hater. I should have been the American on this podcast because Josh is- I should have- In fact, for the next of the segment, I'm going to be the American voice on this. I don't agree with what you guys are talking about. Okay. This is trash. We should work. Okay, but Christiana, go ahead. You go ahead. You know what it is? Because growing up, we went to church on Sundays, but-

The thing is, my dad's a pastor, so it felt like work. It was always a bit much, but what I did love was...

after church we'd always have like a family meal and people would be over the house like Sundays are a lot of good memories we'd have 100% apple pie and custard it just created that there's something about a ritual as a collective group that is very 100% grounding that I lack now do you know what I mean because like my mum's gonna listen I don't go to church much don't go as much as she can got myself in trouble but like

you know and the people in my world don't observe any rituals because you know there's a day where everyone's like okay Sunday I'm going to be free but everyone's so over scheduled it's impossible to make plans and I do feel if there's something like collective we all know that you've got nothing happening on Sunday we can come together and I think what religion gives people if you take out the religious bit

Right. If you take out the God fearing bit, you take out the going to church, but you take out the guilt bit. You take out all of those elements and then you're just left with a day of rest, actually, like literally rest. And that can be joy and fun and enjoyment. Then you've actually got the really great side that there can be no doubt that is beneficial to us all. I think actually just to go seventh day, bang.

No work. I love it. I feel you. I get it. Thank you. Okay. I think both of you are probably tired. And so you're just like agreeing. Yeah, we're tired parents. Like ridiculous ideas right now. So let's go through this, Ben. Let's go through this. Maybe let's start at the top then. Because you are ruling this world. What happens to people who don't rest? Do you arrest them?

I'll be here all week, folks. Trevor Noah with the jokes. What do you do to them? What happens to somebody who drops somebody a line on your internet that has no social media? I mean, like, are we talking about discipline and punishment now? No, and I'm being serious. I'm asking, what do you do? Because no one can use my social media because it's banned. So I'm saying, what do you do to people who don't rest? Well, roads are shut, so they can't drive, right? Who shut the roads? The police. So they shut them the night before?

No, you just can't drive. But how do you can't drive? You can't drive. Oh, you can drive actually for emergencies. So this is what I'm saying. So I'm talking about the pandemic is a perfect... You know what I love about the pandemic? It was one of the most powerful natural experiments that humans will probably never be able to conduct ever again. And one of the things it showed me is that while most of society...

We'll follow a rule. There are some people who are just like, whoa. I just heard you say roads are empty. I'll tell you why I find you disappointing. Wait, wait, wait. Wait, wait, Ben, Ben, Ben. This is not... Remember, this is not me as Trevor the person. No, I get it. But you're not acknowledging the great things I'm talking about. You're just saying, well, how are we going to enforce it? Ben, wait, wait, wait. Please understand this. As an optimist, the number one thing I have to do in my life is I first...

have to probe an idea with all the things that might make it fall apart. But you can't call yourself an optimist if the first thing you're asking is, well, how do we enforce it? That's a cynical way of doing it. Let's embrace the joy for a moment. Actually, the first thing I said was, that's beautiful. Thank you. That was the first thing I said. I'm not sure you meant it. That's the first thing I said. I said, that's beautiful, Ben. That was the first thing I said. So I'm just asking you, what happens to all the people who don't rest? Okay.

The same thing that I mean, it's lots of people break rules and laws. Yeah, but what happens to them in your world? They're fined. They're fined? They're fined, but not on the Saturday because we can't touch money. But then how do you know? That's another part of it. How do you know that they weren't? There's no such thing as money. No money. Wait, but how do you know? But how do you know that they weren't? Because there's no electricity, so you can't do online shopping and you can't touch money.

How do you know who was breaking the rules? We've gone like that with the power, like we shut down the electricity. Yeah, but how do you know who was breaking the rules? So Trevor's gone out. You're really getting in the weeds. There's so many more problems than that. There's so many more problems than that. There's industries like, if you're going to unpick it intelligently, then start thinking about, well, how are people going to travel to the hospitals? How are businesses and restaurants going to survive when one of their weekends are

gone the reason how is sports gonna happen when at the weekend no so let me explain to you this is what i this is why i'm starting with the rule all right this is why i start with the rule

Anytime you change the world with a rule, you then have to worry about rule breakers, right? So now you're saying people may not work. And now what I'm saying to you is if they do not work, what happens to them? Then you're like, well, we're going to have to find them. Then I go, but who's looking at them? We have to get some sort of police people to make sure that the people, then the police are working to make sure the people are not. That's not about whether this is a good or bad idea, Trevor. I think there are some parts of it that are good. No, you're trying, what you're saying is. You're forcing me to rest on a day. I don't want to rest on one day. Why must I rest on your day? You can rest on all seven days if you like. No, no, no, but I can.

I don't mind if you rest on more days. What I'm saying is... What if I like to rest for a week and then work nonstop for other weeks? What kind of dictatorship is this where you're forcing people to sleep? I'm forcing people to have a day where they just take a breath.

They surround themselves with people that matter to them. What if those people are far from you? What if those people are far from them? To move neighborhoods. Move neighborhoods? But what are you saying? You're saying, therefore, the world only existed when we had electricity. No. So, therefore, pre-electricity, pre-public transport, pre-cars, the world was a disaster. Wait, no, that's a false argument. People enjoyed themselves. Let me explain why it's a false argument. And it's not the right comparison. Before we had the electricity and the trains and everything...

people were generally confined to the places where they lived.

We now live in societies where people are not where they were always. So some people have had to go work somewhere where their family is not. Some people have had to go live somewhere where their friends are not. So now what I'm asking is if somebody works a job that ends at night, like late shift on the day before the seventh day, how do they then get to their friends and family? How long does it take for them to get there? Some people live four hours away, three hours away. So at nine o'clock they can get there. It's four hours. They'll be there by midnight. They wake up for the day of rest with their family.

I don't know. Christiana? My only modification would be the no electricity thing. Okay. Just for, especially for me, like I love music and there's something to like being at the dinner table. Well, in Ben's world, you better learn guitar, lady. I know, but there's something about being at the... You better beatbox. I know. I want to be at the dinner table, play some Cleo Soul in the background.

So there's something about it. Because listen, I'm a musician. I play piano, but I don't want to play piano. That's work. So there's something about music and the atmosphere. And so for some people, it's a cookout with the DJ. We need electricity.

electricity for that no i think so someone's cooking at this cookout i don't know they couldn't they wouldn't be able to create a fire okay i think we should modernize we need to modernize it we can need to modernize it i'll accept that because for some people like cooking is resting electricity no okay oh my god cooking no i think it needs no it needs the electricity okay what if somebody's on an oxygen tank oh no i said life and death

Don't try and pull me up on the life and death. I said life and death. What I'm saying is, firstly, Trevor, I know you are breaking out in hives about staying still for a day in your own peace. Because one minute you're in Bhutan, the next minute you're in Dubai, the next minute you're on at the Hollywood Bowl, then you're meeting with the CIA for lunch. I understand that just standing still for a day and being surrounded by love and human beings is difficult for you. But...

I think you will find a community locally. And you know what? If you're far away from people, go for a walk. Everybody else will be out for a walk. People won't be on their phones. There is something nice about community. And community has been destroyed by the modern way of life. And what I'm saying is, wouldn't it be beautiful if we all just went back for one day, just one day, and we just had a little, simple, beautiful life where we actually had a moment together

to spend time with the people we love. I love this. And to just appreciate what we have. I love that idea. Otherwise, before you know it, we're all dead and we've just been running around on the freeway struggling to get to a meeting. Can I just say, and I hope this is very clear, I love the sentiment behind that idea. It is fantastic. Thank you, Trevor. It is beautiful. It is beautiful. Now, I think...

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. I'm saying if we create one day where everybody has to rest, where everybody has to do it the same, we may not necessarily get to what you think we're going to get to because there are some people who go, I don't like my rest being on a predefined day.

And then some people might go, okay, Ben, what if we want to do another day? And the reason I'm asking these questions is because it takes me or it makes us all think about many of the things that we have lost in creating a world where people can move around a bit more. And that is, it becomes a little more fractured, right? So what I'm saying, and I mean this honestly, it's not me just trying to play devil's advocate.

What happens when Christiana wants it to be Tuesday and Trevor goes, well, I like Thursdays off and then Ben goes, no, I like Sundays off. Like what happens in that world? So you like the idea, you back the idea. The only problem you've got with it is you want to choose different days to have your day off. In the same way that...

The Christian day is a Sunday. The Jewish day is a Saturday. The Muslim day is a Friday. I think if I'm right. What you're saying is you like the variety, but you love my idea. You just don't like it all being on the same day. Is that what I'm hearing? Forget I. There's no I in this. Okay. Well. What we're looking at. It does have your name on the mug. But it doesn't have I. No. And it says with. What we're looking at is with each other. We're looking at what happens when your world suits someone

some more than others what happens then well that is life isn't it

And who decides then? Well, it's I ruled the world. That's the name of the game. So when you say who decides, if you're going to do a podcast and you're going to invite me here as the 15th choice guest, and you're going to say, if you ruled the world, what would you do? And then when I give you a very, very well thought out plan, that's much better than banning social media or scrapping schooling systems as we know it. And then you go, and then you go, and then you go,

who's going to be in charge, I'm going to say, well, you just told me I am because you created a stupid game called If You Ruled the World. Well, I'm going to put my vote in and I'm going to say if I was voting for the system, I would say no because I think it would lead to unnecessary unrest. I think it would lead to massive conflicts. I think it would lead to a group of people, we'll call them the Thursdays, who would rise up

and want to know why their day is not the day. - Shame on you. - And I unfortunately cannot vote for this, even though, and I must reiterate, I love the sentiment. And I mean this not facetiously, my friend. I genuinely believe, and it's why I do it in my life as well with my people.

It's so important to take time off to be with people. But I unfortunately cannot vote for your world where it's enforced on everybody on the same day because I don't think that will lead to peace. I think that day will be the day of revolution. And so my vote is no. Christiana? Yes. But with a caveat, I would need electricity. Because I think...

But then wait, does that mean cars though? No, I don't. I hate driving. Wait, so your world's going to have electricity? Well, hold on. Which electricity? Can we define what you mean by that? I wouldn't want to cook. I hate cooking. I'm a very lazy homemaker. So you essentially want... I want music. Just let's negotiate here. You want music. You want to be able to play a record. Yeah, I think music is a big part of the black experience and having a day of rest where black people... Wow, did you go to the

No, no, I'm saying... Ben is screwed now. What is Ben going to do now? How is Ben going to say no to the black experience now? A day of rest where black people can't watch what they like or play music. Ben, tell us why you don't want the black experience. Yeah, why don't you want black people to listen to music on their special day of rest? As the minority on this podcast, let me tell you about the minority experience. With you two and Josh, I...

As the minority. No, you know, listen, here's the deal. Nothing's passed today. Everything's got shut down. They've been two no's, right? This, I'm about to win the game because when you vote, that means 2-1 it passes because you got 2-1 against you. You got 2-1 against you. No, no, because I voted before your amending. So please. Okay, so what I'm going to allow. Here's what I'm going to allow, guys. Yeah, go. So in Orthodox Judaism, what they have so that people can cook

is for 24 hours, they plug in a little hot plate and they have a little kettle and it lasts 24 hours. That's what they do. So with that spirit in mind,

I'm going to make a little exception and everybody can buy a little generator. You have it in your house. So it's limited because we don't want people to go crazy. We don't want to like a whole, you know, everyone going wild, but you'll have your generator. And therefore, if you want to play music, it will happily do that for the day. I accept that will mean that you get your rest. Some people don't want to sit in quiet. My wife's one, she can't accept the quiet. She goes insane with it. She needs stuff in the background. So I think with a little bit of generator, um,

I think in order to get this policy through, like all good politics, you need a few amendments to get through Congress. I'm willing to provide this solution so that we can vote on this and we'll have a day of rest. This is our first amendment. Absolutely. You vote yes now. All right. So now that it's changed, I should be able to vote again because that's how it works. I think that's how it works. I want to change you.

But it's still on the same day, Trevor. I'm not shirking from that. Yeah, yeah. So now I will vote yes as well. Wow. I will vote yes as well. Wow. Because I will team up with all of my friends. We will combine our generators and we're throwing a concert. It is the only show in town. If you want to come and watch Trevor Noah perform with all his friends at the, we're going to call it the electricity is alive bash. Come on through.

We've got charging, we've got phone charging, we've got food cooking, we've got music playing, we've got movies, because we've got all the generators and we've combined them. And the good news is there's no police because they're not allowed to work today. The vote is yes. Ben Winston, you've won the game. Thank you so much for coming, everybody. Welcome to another episode of What Now? If I Ruled the World with Trevor Noah.

What Now with Trevor Noah is produced by Spotify Studios in partnership with Day Zero Productions and Full Wealth 73. The show is executive produced by Trevor Noah, Ben Winston, Sanaz Yamin, and Jody Avigan. Our senior producer is Jess Hackle. Marina Henke is our producer. Music, mixing, and mastering by Hannes Brown. Thank you so much for listening. Join me next Thursday for another episode of What Now? What Now?