主播:我经历了两次失败的婚姻,这让我开始反思长期伴侣关系的意义。我将婚姻和一夫一妻制视为非自然状态和社会建构,以此来合理化自己对长期伴侣关系的渴望缺失。然而,我与一位新认识的人发展了非一夫一妻制但目前保持忠诚的关系。作为南方一位基督教女牧师,我的关系状态面临着很大的社会期待,因此我们保持关系私密。我担心自己是否错过了婚姻的益处,或者是因为害怕而放弃了自己的需求和欲望。我的好奇心会在自由开放时展现为对未来的期待,而在害怕或感到匮乏时则变成评判。我寻求帮助是因为我内心的疑问和陈述并非新鲜事物,我想知道是什么促使我此刻寻求帮助。我寻求帮助是因为我想探索自己内心的好奇,并解决由此产生的对自身需求和欲望的怀疑。我害怕自己不够好,既害怕自己做得太多,又害怕自己做得不够。在南方女性的文化背景下,我因为自信、直言不讳等特质而面临社会评判,同时又觉得自己不够好,无法保持稳定的关系。我为了维持关系,会压抑自己的需求,以迎合他人。我通过在社会工作和牧师工作中扮演帮助者和给予者的角色来维持人际关系,因为在那里我有价值感。我总是陷入同样的境地:要么选择与无法满足我需求的人建立关系,要么在表达需求之前就先否定它们。我了解自己内心的“做得太多”和“做得不够”这两个部分,让我们更深入地了解它们。我在不同类型的关系中,“做得太多”和“做得不够”这两个部分是如何体现的?在专业角色中,我扮演着保护性的角色,关系是不对等的。我常常感到自己为他人付出很多,却没有人能同样地为我付出。我担心随着年龄增长,自己会孤独终老,因为我总是为他人付出,却没有人真正为我付出。我害怕自己最终会孤独终老,因为我与周围人的关系中,自己并不是最重要的。我害怕的是失去那些需要你的人,而不是害怕没有人需要你。在一些专业角色中,人们在最脆弱的时候寻求你的帮助,这让你感到重要,但这种重要感难以在其他关系中复制。我担心在非专业关系中,我无法获得这种被需要的重要感,这让我感到害怕和不安。我如何才能在非专业关系中获得安全感和满足感,而不是匮乏感和恐惧感?我是什么时候开始意识到自己既“做得太多”又“做得不够”的?我从小在充满混乱的家庭环境中长大,这塑造了我既“做得太多”又“做得不够”的性格。我从小就承担了家庭中过多的情感责任,这导致我过度发展了帮助者的角色。我父亲经常不在家,这让我感到孤独和不安,也让我在很小的时候就承担了过多的责任。我父亲在家时,我会感到安全,但他经常不在家,这让我感到不安全和不确定。我从小就过度发展了帮助者的角色,这让我在与人交往时常常受到排斥。我小时候经常被批评为过于自信或傲慢,这让我更加不确定自己的价值。我童年缺乏稳定的关系,这让我觉得是自己不够好,也让我在与人交往时感到自己做得太多。我认为父亲经常离开是因为我不够好,无法让他留下来照顾我。我六岁时就被要求节食,这让我更加体会到自己“做得太多”的感受。我长期节食,直到体重减轻才停止。我从小就习惯了控制自己的需求,这让我在成年后也难以表达自己的真实需求。我需要与童年时期那个被控制需求的自己进行沟通。五六岁的孩子会将事情归咎于自己,但这并不意味着成年后仍需如此。如果成年后你仍然认为自己被他人衡量,无法确定自己的需求,那么你需要与童年时期的自己进行沟通。你需要重新学习如何认识和表达自己的需求,并确定什么是“太多”或“太少”。你需要告诉自己,你已经不再是五岁的孩子了,你需要重新认识和接纳自己的需求。我在专业角色中被需要让我感到安全,但在其他关系中,我却感到不安全。我担心在非专业关系中,我的价值感会降低,这让我感到不安全。我希望人们能因为我的存在本身而喜欢我,而不是因为我的帮助。你在被需要时感到安全,在有需求时感到不安全,这是你这次谈话的核心。我不确定别人是否喜欢我这个人,还是因为我提供的帮助而喜欢我。我总是怀疑别人是否真正爱我这个人,还是因为我为他们所做的事情而爱我。我不确定“我”是谁,如果我不再提供帮助,别人还会喜欢我吗?我想知道别人是否欣赏我的陪伴、探索和创造深度连接的能力,而不是仅仅因为我的帮助。你真正的疑问不是别人是否需要你,而是你是否能接受自己被需要之外的价值。我正在尝试与伴侣更清晰地表达自己的需求。我表达需求的方式很含糊,以避免被拒绝。我表达需求的方式很含糊,是为了避免失望。让我们做个练习,列举你需要的五件事,重点不在于列举,而在于清晰地表达。清晰地表达你的需求,不要让自己过于纠结和害怕。练习清晰地表达你的需求,感受表达需求时的轻松和平静。我需要被看见。我需要被照顾和被滋养。我需要允许自己被照顾。我害怕失去爱的人,这让我无法与人建立更深层次的关系。我需要允许自己脆弱和强大。我需要允许自己不完美,允许自己害怕、不确定和脆弱。我需要允许自己有需求,并满足这些需求。你可以向你认识的人询问,你是否在满足自身需求方面做得足够好。我想知道自己是否能够展现出脆弱和需求的一面。你可以向你认识的人询问,你是否能够展现出脆弱和需求的一面。
supporting_evidences
主播: 'I think by intellectualizing marriage and monogamy as some kind of simply unnatural state and marriage as a social construct that benefits society by increasing generational wealth.'
主播: 'And I met another person there, also alone, quite happily so. And we danced and talked all evening.'
主播: 'I'm a clergy person in a Christian church, so you can imagine that the expectations of me and my relationship status, especially as a female clergy person in the southern U.S., are quite big.'
主播: 'And yet part of me is wondering what I'm so fearful of. Am I missing out on some benefit of monogamy or at least a relationship that's not so separate from the rest of my life?'
主播: 'Yes. I would say that my curiosity when it's free and open is like, I wonder what will happen next. And then when I am afraid or I'm feeling like there's some sort of scarcity or urgency, I become judgmental.'
主播: 'I think it's an intersection of what you're exploring in your podcast and what I'm exploring in my life.'
Esther Perel: 'If you were avoiding something, what would you be avoiding?'
Esther Perel: 'Because then the questions are not about monogamy, plurality, transparency.'
Esther Perel: 'Fear that has the ability to take your openness, your curiosity, and your thirst for life, and your confidence, and turn it on its head.'
主播: 'Arrogant, confident, outspoken, all of the things that tend to produce some rejection in society.'
主播: 'So if I can just be easy and giving, then other people will want to be connected to me because I'm in the posture of helper or giver.'
主播: 'I keep finding myself in the same place where either I choose to be connected to people who don't really want to meet my needs.'
Esther Perel: 'And when you, I'm asking you questions just because we just met and yes, but you have met yourself and you say, I have met this part of me that says you're too much.'
主播: 'I think in a professional role, I have such a protective role persona of professional and it's a one-way street.'
主播: 'Another reason I reached out, I think now is I'm 50. I think there is a a scarcity mindset on some level about, am I going to have what I need in these next years?'
主播: 'And then in the end, while I have such good friends and, and I have so many connections, there is a, fear that nobody has to be there for me.'
Esther Perel: 'It's a fear. You're not telling me nobody's there for me. They are there, and nevertheless, I'm still afraid that there may be no one there.'
Esther Perel: 'That's right. And that is true for therapists, for clergy, for medical professionals.'
主播: 'Who wants you as much as... Someone who comes in a dire situation to speak with their clergy.'
主播: 'And I'm not the crisis counselor and I'm not the clergy. I'm just one real human with another real human.'
Esther Perel: 'So tell me, when did you first meet Too Much and Not Enough?'
主播: 'From the outside, it looked very stable and on some level it definitely was. And on the deeper level, I have a sibling who has severe mental illness'
主播: 'And I would never know when he was leaving or when he was coming back because I was little and they just didn't talk about that.'
主播: 'And so then when I went out into the world with this kind of overdeveloped sense of, I don't know, helper maturity, there was a pushback and I was often rejected.'
主播: 'And I also had my, when I was six years old, my doctor told my parents that I was overweight and they put me on a diet at six where all of my food was weighed'
主播: 'Oh, no, I think I stopped eating so much and lost a bunch of weight. And then they were like, oh, it's great. She's fine now.'
Esther Perel: 'You know, like many five-year-olds personalize. If my parents divorce, it's because of me.'
Esther Perel: 'What's more troubling is when that five-year-old still runs the show and when it still looks that you live with this feeling that people are weighing your food'
Esther Perel: 'So you're left with a certain uncertainty about what's too little, what's too much, what's fair, what's not fair'
主播: 'Yes, there is something about being intensely needed that makes me feel less afraid that I will be alone because if people need me, they come.'
主播: 'So outside of that realm, it often feels some challenging, like, so then who am I? When I'm not this, what's my value?'
主播: 'But they don't come for small things. Come for something simple for a change.'
Esther Perel: 'Yep. This is the organizing line of our conversation. Yes. I am insecure when I have any needs.'
主播: 'That one touched you. I think within every relationship I've had, there comes a point where I've asked that question. Does this person love me for who I am or for what I do for them?'
主播: 'If I'm not helping you, saving you, advising you, ministering to you? Do you enjoy my company? Do you value my presence?'
Esther Perel: 'I think the question is really, really good. And it's less a question about them.'
Esther Perel: 'It's really mutual, reciprocal, open-ended.'
主播: 'Well, I think probably wouldn't be clear to most people because the way I'll state it is so like... Convoluted, yes. And avoidant'
Esther Perel: 'So you ask it in such a convoluted way that if I miss it, we can pretend it never happened.'
Esther Perel: 'The point is not about what you need. This is not in the what. This is in the healthy sense of entitlement to just ask'
主播: 'I need to be seen.'
主播: 'I need to be fed and feed myself. I need to be cared for.'
主播: 'I need to allow myself to be cared for.'
主播: 'The fear of losing the people we love is a fear everyone knows and experiences.'
主播: 'I need to be vulnerable and strong.'
Esther Perel: 'So I have a little suggestion for you. Can you think of two or three people that you could go to and say'
主播: 'Of showing up needy, vulnerable? Yeah. Okay. Vulnerable, need to be fed, need to be held, need to be seen.'
A clergy person in the Southern U.S. reflects on their romantic relationships, questioning if they are too much or not enough. They explore their fear of being alone and the insecurity of needing others, stemming from early childhood experiences and the nature of their profession.
The caller reflects on two marriages that ended in divorce.
They currently have a non-monogamous but monogamous relationship.
They question whether they've suppressed their desires out of fear.
They struggle with feeling both 'too much' and 'not enough' in their relationships.
"Am I too much?" is a consistent frame for a relationship that so many people come to Esther with. This week, a Southern preacher who has made a career out of tending to the needs of others wonders if she's too much or not enough in her romantic relationships. Esther guides her to explore her sense of self-worth and ask for what she needs.
Esther Callings are a one time, 45-60 minute interventional phone call with Esther. They are edited for time, clarity, and anonymity. If you have a question you would like to talk through with Esther, send a voice memo to [email protected].
Want to learn more? Receive monthly insights, musings, and recommendations to improve your relational intelligence via email from Esther: https://www.estherperel.com/newsletter