Fear and Loathing...In Your Body
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Hello, everyone. Welcome to the Jan Arden Podcast and Show. Home life has its challenges. With the dog. I got a very excited...

And desperate text, might I say, from Caitlin Greene yesterday. She does not want us talking about a certain something without her weighing in. And I have to agree. She's always welcome. She's always welcome. She's going to be joining us as soon as she gets her baby to sleep. Poppy, he heard your voice, Sarah. I'm here with Sarah Burke.

She's in Toronto. I'm back home in Calgary after almost six weeks on the road. How do you feel? I am so tired for like three or four days.

But it was a fantastic tour. It was completely sold out. Thank you very much to all the people that came to the shows. To finish off in Newfoundland was spectacular, although it was so cold that one of my nipples did crack off and it's lost. So if you're walking anywhere near Bannerman's, which is a coffee shop there, I think I lost it around there somewhere. But keep it. Hang on to it until I'm back.

Yeah, you could sell that for some money. Oh, yeah. But no, it's a fantastic experience. I'm very well looked after, so I have such a great group of people. We always say we're small, but we're mighty. You know, we made it work. We were all in really cool theaters. So it's an easy show to put together. It's manageable production-wise. You know, we're not spending a kajillion dollars with...

confetti cannons and pyrotechnics going off at the end during Good Mother. There's none of that. It's pretty much me standing there singing with the band. It was great. We had a really emotional last couple of nights. It's one of the things that I wanted to talk to everybody about. My longtime

friend and, uh, work. My bandmate, Alison is dealing with cancer right now. And, uh, it's, uh, such a crap disease. For anyone who doesn't know, what does Alison play in the band? Alison is, she's a lot of people call it a utility player. Alison has been with Cindy Lauper, Shania Twain. She plays multiple instruments. When she lists them off, it's crazy for me. Um,

She was viola, keyboards. At one point she played bass. She's played trumpet. She's played accordion, banjo, mandolin, guitar. Like Allison is an absolute. Wow. She's just a musical genius. She's a Juilliard person. I mean, I think they just begged her to go there. Here, please come. But yeah, Allison was diagnosed with ovarian cancer just over a year ago.

And of course it's showed up everywhere. She wants people to be able to talk about this. She never wants it to be the elephant in the room or to not discuss it. She's a very pragmatic person. And I can say that after knowing her for 25 years. But she wanted to come and play some music with us in Newfoundland. You know, she hasn't touched an instrument during this whole thing. Treatments, as anybody can attest to, are really difficult. They drain your energy.

You know, you're busy just trying to get a meal in yourself, get some rest and prep for your next treatment. So if anyone can tackle this, it's Alison to see her up there just doing what she does. I was going to say doing what she does best, but she does so many things best. So that made it super special looking over to her. There's just lots of tears. I think we're all emotional. Of course, we're worried about her. Of course. You know, when you look at statistics,

For ovarian cancer, yeah. Oh, my God. It's terrible. I mean, I think she had, you know, a hysterectomy and the ovaries removed, obviously, and all that. But anyway, we love you, Allison, so much. And her wife, Kate, came.

And it was really good for her partner too to come. And see her on stage again. She's like, oh my God, this has been such a breath of fresh air to be here. It lifts you. The mind and the heart are incredibly sensitive to what's around you. And that positivity, music is magic. It's so interesting that you brought up Alison and cancer. Last night before bed, I wanted to put on a meditation and sometimes I'm using the Insight Timer app.

And just scrolling on like what was suggested to me, there was one that said working through cancer. And I thought to myself, well, this doesn't really sound like something for me, but like, wow, I wonder how meditation for someone going through cancer would be. Well, to focus on, you know, a disease, right?

It's got to be so taxing on many fronts. I saw a really beautiful tribute. They had a massive, like a state funeral for Olivia Newton-John in Australia.

And you could go online, which I did, obviously. You could go and join in. And her husband spoke. I mean, countless people spoke, her daughter. But in an interview leading up to the memorial, her daughter, Chloe, who we need to have on the show too at some point. Actually, Chloe reached out to me. I need to do your podcast sometime. We do need you, Chloe. But Chloe, the interviewer asked her if her mom, you know,

Her language was so different because Olivia never said, I'm fighting cancer. I'm battling cancer. I'm in a war with cancer. Olivia Newton-John never, ever spoke that way about her breast cancer that eventually metastasized. Here I go. There's that word. She lived with cancer for 30 years. Her diagnosis was in the 90s.

And I think there's three go-rounds of it. But I loved hearing Chloe talk about, yes, my mother had down days. Absolutely. She goes, I don't want to tell cancer patients, you know, it's not going to be tough. But her mother really, really lived by what she preached, and that is love.

Grace and gratitude. Olivia signed so many of her autographs, grace and gratitude. And I happen to own a couple of them. I bet you do. Yeah. But yeah, it's, and Allison is the same way. Yes, there's being pragmatic, there's being sensible. But Allison said, oh, I did my crying. I did a lot of crying. You know, when the first scan came back, she was on a trial. It was very disappointing.

Let's put it that way. It was not what she had hoped for. And of course, they opted to take her off this trial, but she's on another chemo now. But you know, they're there. We're going to, we need to buy a new car. Life is going on. They're living lives.

And that was so inspiring to me. There's no one way to cancer. I don't know if that's the right way to put it. Like everyone's take on their cancer journey will be so different. There's going to be some people that don't want to talk about it. Yes. Some people just want to like look it in the face. I wonder what I would do or what I will do. Um, there's, I just don't know. I guess you're, you, you react in that moment. Yeah. One of my best friends' moms has, uh,

been through cancer so she's in that like within the five-year window of like monitoring everything and she is that's the closest person I would say to me that I've seen go through cancer and treatments and she's living her best life right now I think it really changes your life for a good way too even though it's shitty everyone says that everyone talks about that yeah um

about that journey and something that's so terrible. And I've long said, you know, good things come out of bad things, but everyone there, that's a general thing, Sarah, that you've hit on is that there's a real through line, a real golden string that people almost always say. It's one of the best things that ever happened to me as far as appreciating life, living life in the moment and

uh, not sitting and staring at your phone or spending all your time on social media or spending your time caring about what other people are thinking about you or spending time in a job that you don't like, or thinking, oh, one day, you know, I'm going to, I'm going to paint the bedroom. Like someday, someday I'll have the right, like those some days suddenly become obsolete because the someday is right this second, some days right now.

And I think a lot of people come away with that. It's amazing what has to jar the human psyche into appreciation mode. Bringing it back to your tour, you know, when we were texting the other day, I just said like, how are you feeling? Like it's wrapping up. And you were just like drunk on gratitude, if that makes sense, in the moment when you were writing back to me. Oh, I mean, I can't believe, you know, I've been doing this for so long, 40 years really professionally. And to sell out a tour,

After all these years and to have people come show up and that we still have so much fun with the band and that I'm still singing really well. Alison sang so well. She had a straw with her and she was showing me this exercise to strengthen her vocal cords. She said that one of the chemos last year knocked out her voice. She lost her voice. She's a singer. And she, of course, was online looking at all the things she could do.

And the straw, she just was kind of tapping the end of the straw and blowing in it and doing these unique little puffing exercises. And she said, this has been the most remarkable thing for my voice. She said, and she just had it tucked in her jacket pocket. She goes, I'll just do it, you know, before I walk out there. And if I need to just sort of touch it up when I'm on stage, I'll do that.

But yeah, it was really, it is very much gratitude and coming home, just so much gratitude to be back in the trees. And I know in no way, shape or form going to stop anytime soon. I really feel like

I have people blazing the trail ahead of me. I think about Tony Bennett in his nineties. And when I went and saw Olivia Newton-John, I believe she was 66 in Vegas. She was 65 or 66, you know, singing beautifully. When I met her after the show backstage, I just said, boy, your voice is better than ever. And she's like, oh, thank you, Jen. Like, I swear to God. I mean, some of those songs are so difficult to sing. Like that Grease catalog. Holy crap. Whoa.

It's a really, really difficult book to sing. And she just nailed every note, every note. So, you know, that's five years away from me. So I'm hoping that I can do that. But yeah, gratitude is the way to go, Sarah. And people that don't understand that in their lives, it's never too late.

To live in a state of appreciation and grace and to be thankful. We often wait too long until like a sickness, an illness, a disease. What do you think...

would lead people to that. What would you say to people? How would you get to that point? Like, I don't even know where I would start that conversation because you can't admonish people. Well, you better be grateful for that or you're going to be sorry. Like, that's not the way you start that conversation. I think for the average person, you know, many people are walking through life just coast mode. So you have your things you do every day. And like, if you ask yourself, how many times a day am I thinking about in

intention. You know, me flying out of bed and heading right to the gym, like right away, and not thinking about how I want to set up my day. Like you and I have talked about that before and how I would like to spend a little more time before I fly to the gym. Just those little things you can ask yourself about, how do I want to show up today? I think that's a really good question for yourself. It is little things, isn't it? Maybe that's what's so intimidating is that people think it's these massive overtures, that gratitude is this huge undertaking.

And speaking of gratitude, I'm grateful every damn time. This woman, Caitlin Green, just popped up. She's here. Hi, Caitlin. Is he sleeping? He is sleeping. I'm staring at him on the monitor. It was an emergency gathering, Sarah Burke and Caitlin Green, because we...

I got this text from you, Caitlin. Oh, was it yesterday or the day yesterday? Yeah, it was yesterday. We have to talk about Ozempic or we have to talk about that group of drugs that have hit the mainstream in a way that I don't know if I have seen anything like this since, since what? Since cocaine hit in the 1800s? What was that diet drug in the 80s? Everyone called it Fen-Phen.

Oh, and people are having heart attacks. Yeah. Heart disease, lots of heart damage. Anyway, Caitlin, I want to know what prompted you to send me that text. And you're like, we have to unpack this. And I agree. And, and I'm, I'm treading carefully here because I have a couple of beloved friends. I'm going to tell you what they talked about it. Well, so I brought this up because of this trending New York magazine article about it. So Caitlin,

You know, it's been around for a bit. Sarah and I were texting about it and like, you know, we're, it's not new, right? Like this isn't like breaking a new thing, but it's way more mainstream as in, you know, likely Kim Kardashian was on it to lose weight for the Met Gala because she wanted to fit into that Marilyn Monroe dress. Like this has been in celebrity circles primarily and in Holly weird life for a long time, I think. But now it's very much entered the mainstream and it's,

people are using it off-label to suppress their appetite and so they can lose weight. Now, this is a very effective drug for diabetics. And as a result of its popularity with people who are using it for weight loss on an off-label way, so there's a shortage of it for people who actually really desperately need it.

And it's kind of caused this resurgence after many years of us, I think, in pop culture, seeing a move towards finally like a little inch towards body positivity. Now it's this painfully thin appearance is popping up again and again as being the thing that people should strive towards. Not like thin was ever really out. I'm dying to know what your colleague Meredith Shaw is thinking right now. Honestly? Yeah.

I'm not even joking. This just happens dance. We're having dinner tonight. So like, we're for sure talking about this because she is so fabulous with body positivity and, and she's just so beautiful and confident. And I mean, I just think it discredits the, the,

very layered conversation around bodies that has been happening and pushed to the forefront of people's conversations recently. And it flattens it again. So it feels like it's all been like flattened and I'm not trying to create a pun here, but it's like, it's, it's just very, um, it's kind of upsetting. So this New York magazine article where they interview people who are on it, but they're, you know, once an actress from LA and she's anonymous in the interview and

you know, she's like, thin is power. And like all these really dangerous, like if you have an eating disorder, I would recommend you really don't read that article. Um, because it's just, I don't know. It's upsetting to me. And it's upsetting to see how many people are like, I feel free from food. And like, I get it. Like I look at, we think we all like get it. People have their own relationships with,

with food, but like you do need it. And also you're gonna, you're gonna eventually have to go off this drug and any weight loss that you may have, um, experienced is going to be reversed because eventually they say you gain it back double. Yes. We've heard that, but we've heard that narrative for 50 years in the diet industry from the, the very beginnings of Weight Watchers, um,

Jenny Craig, you know, all those things. When people left the program, they found themselves right back where they were. Do you remember The Biggest Loser? Yes. The television show that inundated homes and we watched it like a car crash. I know I did. It was right up there for me with The Swan. Yes. Where they took, you know, people that were unhappy with their nose or their neck or their breasts or their rib cage. And they took these women over the course of a year.

and redid everything. Anyway, to get to my point, yeah, the weight gain that always seems to come back and still knowing that people will do it anyway. You brought up Kim Kardashian. I read an op-ed piece that I was telling Sarah about, and I'm going to get this woman's name wrong and I don't want to. Her name is Samhita. I'm just going to leave it there. S-A-M-H-I-T-A. And this is from a magazine called The Cut.

And she leads into the piece going, body positivity was my salvation from an anti-fat world. Then I was prescribed an injectable weight loss drug that upended everything. Huh.

And as I read through her piece, you know, her health hasn't been great. When her health gets worse, she eats because it's part of the disease and the cyclical habits. Her dad died very young of diabetes and weight loss. She's on the brink of diabetes. So her doctor, who was a woman of color who finally would talk to her, a holistic woman of color in the United States that would finally talk to her, she says, I can't even get a doctor to talk to me.

But anyway, she just went on about how, what a blessing it's been to have the drug. And then she just overhears people talking about it. And she's like, I'm one of the girls that are on that drug. And I'm scared senseless. She doesn't know what's going to happen to her.

So her, like it's a doctor who prescribed this to her because she. Because she was on, she met the criteria. Right. She did not go in and she never even said, I didn't even mention weight loss to her. She said, I'm really sick. I'm scared. I have no energy. I had trouble breathing yesterday. And the doctor said, I'm on a sit down and I want to talk to you about the pros and cons of this. And there's lots of pros.

And she said the doctor was amazing. She didn't have a pusher going, I've got just the thing for you. She said, there's going to be a downside to this. And she said, there's a risk involved here.

But she said, I, it's a ship that I wanted to jump on. She goes, my numbers are much better after 12 weeks. She goes, I haven't lost a ton of weight, but she said 10 pounds for me might as well be a hundred at this point because I have not lost a pound since I was 12 years old. Yeah. And so, I mean, obviously when people consult with their doctor, there's no catch all for something around weight and around this type of a drug, but it's,

You do wonder about the people who are already so visibly thin in Hollywood who are going on it. And it feels as though. Yeah, it is a risk and it feels, you know, it just feels bad. I don't know. I read the article. I read the New York magazine article and it.

stressed me out. I experienced secondhand stress and I felt compelled to tweet about it because I just think it continues to vilify food and vilify eating. And I think that that just makes me sad, really. There's no better way to put it. It makes me sad for people that

are not, you know, they just, it feels self-loathing-y. I just remember, you know, your grandmother baking you a cake for your birthday. And I remember, you know, like you wake up in the morning and you have, I said, fresh croissants, popcorn at the movies. I mean, it's not so simple as that for some people, but I do think that there is, for me at least, personally, as a non-medical, you know, professional, there's a lot of joy attached to

to eating and not always. Like I've had times where I want to lose weight. I'm using the new map, which is funny enough that this became like a big cultural moment around weight loss, but I'm using the new map right now. Which is mental. It's all mental, that one. Exactly. So it's developed by psychologists and it's designed to help you maintain healthy eating habits.

It's not deprivation-based, and it's not about trying to be thin. It's about changing a little bit of how you look at food and calories and all that stuff and just providing you with some data. And I love it. You love it. I was going to say, what are your thoughts like that first week? Just...

Did you feel like it was a real jarring entrance into how you needed to adapt your eating or did it seem like this is manageable? And I have a young baby. I have friends that I want to go out with in restaurants. I want to have a beer once in a while. I'm going out with Meredith Schott for dinner tonight. What can I eat? And is it a point system or what is it?

It's not really a point system, but you do keep a daily food log. And so it'll count your calories. And you do a huge questionnaire at the beginning about height, weight, all these things, your goal weight. And when you input that,

it will tell you how many calories you have in this window for, you know, weight loss. It's your weight loss window. And it gives you a pretty widespread and it tells you the whole way through, you know, some days you're just going to go over, like, I'm going to go out for dinner tonight. I'll probably go over tonight. Like not a big deal because it says, you know, you're going to get to your goal weight in a period of what, three months, something like to that effect. At least it's not overnight, right? Like that's such a important piece of it that there's like,

A journey there.

but I don't think I realized how many calories certain items actually had and how many calories you need and that I would still enjoy things that were lower calorie. And Jan, I think I texted this to you. A lot of the stuff I'm eating is actually vegan. Another thing I never really knew anything about was calorie dense foods and, um, you vegetables. Yeah. And how good water is for you. And you always want to look for things that have a lot of

water in them. So anyways, I just thought it was funny that this whole weight loss thing is happening as I'm trying to lose weight, but I feel like I'm trying to do it in a really healthy, sustainable way that doesn't change the way that I feel about. Yeah. And it doesn't change the way I feel about food. Well, you had a baby and, and I'm sure for, for women that have, you know, gone through that, every woman that's had a child, um,

with the exception of, I don't know. There's always a person out there that's like, you look exactly the same as you did, you know, when, before you got pregnant, but good for you. And I think it is a health thing and, and it's whatever works for you and, and judges be damned. I think. Yeah. I have to do what's right for you. And we've got to take a quick break as much as I don't want to. We're going to be right back with Caitlin green.

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I just, it made me sad to see that this is now entering the discourse a little bit. And I have friends who are looking for ways to go on it. It's very available in the U.S. Yeah. Yeah. And, and, you know, they're, they're, they're responsible doctors aren't providing it for them. So then it's like, where else can you find it? I know, I know of people, I don't know people personally who are going to Mexico when they're on vacation in Mexico. Out of my mind, I was just going to say there was a thing on Tijuana on, uh, on the nightly news on NBC or something the other night of

people pouring in and this Mexican pharmacist, he's like, I don't have any.

Yeah. I don't have any generic version of it. It's gone. I have people, he says, I have women coming in here, mostly women. Yeah. Mostly, mostly young women. I know. It just bummed me out so much, which is why I texted you also because Jan, I feel like you've been really great about, uh, body positivity yourself. You've talked a lot about how you felt judged based on your weight and you were judged by some people when you came into the industry. And, um, you know, I've been, I've been,

20 pounds smaller than I am now. I've been 35, 40 pounds bigger than I am now. And I've always... But honest to God, I've never...

ran past a mirror. I had a very, I had a good mom. Yeah. And she set the bar and she was never dieting. And she's like, she just was always supportive. There's nothing wrong with your arms. Yeah. You're good in a little tank top. And my inner teenager's like, are you kidding me? But I just, it has never been my focus. I think Emma Thompson went on the most beautiful rant on Jimmy Fallon quite some time ago. It might've even been last year.

She said, when I think about the time I wasted in self-loathing, not appreciating my wellness, my health, my nose, my eyes, my hair that I spent, uh,

worrying about going to a show, worrying about being on camera, worrying about, she did a movie last year. It escapes me. Sarah will look it up and we'll put it, we'll make sure that it's in the notes. She had a gigolo. She had a male gigolo and she spent a great deal of the movie, you know, with her body and part of her character's journey was not being comfortable with herself. And at the very end of the movie, she took her robe off and stood in front of a mirror because this man that she'd become very attached with and had spent a lot of money and time with

on this journey because she never had an orgasm in her marriage. It's a great movie. That's why we need to find it for people. And she just wanted to have one. She was like 55 years old. Anyway, Emma Thompson. But it was such a moment in the movie and quite voyeuristic to be standing there with her. This actor whose character was standing in front of the mirror, she said, listen, I, as a woman,

And, you know, because it's also me. I'm acting a part, but you still have to get over that hurdle of it's me. And she just stood there touching herself. Good luck to you, Leo Grande. I think so. What's the liner note say? But anyway, just... Retired widow Nancy Stokes hires a good looking young sex worker. Yes. Okay. It's got to be it. How many movies did she do like that? But what a full circle. It's a good point you make, Caitlin, just about...

We're back where we were again. Yeah. Yes. And now what's going to unfold is the damage done when people come up for air with this thing is the fen-fen whole thing. Maybe the science is a little bit differently approached, but people are still going to end up being quite hurt in the aftermath. Rosie O'Donnell has been doing a journal of her journey. I don't think it's Ozempic. It's another one. She's diabetic. Right. Right.

But she said it did stem from vanity. She saw part of a series that she was in because she says, I always like to watch my stuff.

And she says, I couldn't believe my gut. I just couldn't believe how I just look terrible. I look gross. And I'm like, I got to do something. And so she went to her doctor, like, what can I do? Oh, well, I've got just the thing. And plus you're a diabetic, so we can bring your blood sugars down and you can lose weight. She's lost quite a bit of weight now. My friend's lost over close to 40 pounds. Wow. But his doctor also said, you need to do this. It's got the worst back in the world and it's pinching a nerve. Yeah. So it was very medical.

Um, his doctor was like, this is, and it has helped immeasurably, but he's hated it, has hated it. And this is a man. There are people who this will work for and who can take it and they'll, they'll, you know, this'll benefit them. The risks might, um, the risks might be okay because they're already getting all these other medical benefits, which is, which is the reason why you would presumably talk to your doctor about this drug and then be prescribed it for

with full knowledge. Right. But when you have so many people, I think who are likely already thin and don't have health issues and certainly don't have diabetes who are taking it because they hate part of themselves. It's just so tricky because you see it being normalized and it's like normal now where people are like, and then also cause those M pick is so expensive. People will buy, um, kind of like the ingredients to make it. Then they're like making it at home and then injecting it themselves and

It's very extreme. In me right now? Yeah. Yeah. In that New York mag article, they explain that I think it's $900 a month for Ozempic. And if you buy, I think it's like semaglutide or whatever is the name of the generic, you know, the active ingredient in the drug, um, you then like add something else to it and then you inject yourself with it at home. Like this is all very extreme. This is a very extreme way to lose weight. And it's,

you know, think of Rosie O'Donnell saying, I saw my stomach and I hated it. So, you know, first of all, that's like a little piece of self-loathing. You saw a part of yourself and you thought, I really don't like this. And that's fair. Everyone, I, sometimes I would see my double chin on in photos and I'd be like, oh, this is driving me nuts. I have a triple chin. So you're like, you know, there's stuff people don't like. I'm not trying to vilify having a human response to something you're dissatisfied with. I just think you owe it to yourself to like explore it a little more than to like run to the doctor and be like, I hate myself. And then inject yourself with a drug. Like,

It's just there are other slower, I think, ways that will probably result in a more long-term weight loss, better health outcomes, and probably like an overall change in your perspective. Where do you see this a year from now, guys?

Oh, I feel like I, I don't know. I want, I want to be like, it'll be gone and everyone's going to be eating healthy again. I just feel like it's going to become more normalized. I really do. The mental health like parallel here would be like someone going on a drug, but not really willing to like maybe do the work that may be done in therapy. Right. There's got to be both pieces here. If you're going to be on the drug. Puzzle me this. When people are

you know, really unhappy. There's mental, there's health issues and all that. Time and time again, I've heard people say, I thought losing the weight would be what made me happy. Exactly. I thought that this would be the magic fairy dust sprinkled in my life. And it is not, it's a piece of it, but it's not what makes us happy. Yeah. You fit into those pants, but you're going to have to figure out some way of staying there. And when you go back up again, you're

And I'm not saying that everybody will. There's obviously a risk involved with weight because it's a science, right? Metabolism is scientific. Like people who are gluten intolerant or things like that, that just end up not eating gluten and suddenly they lose 40 pounds. That's the science in it. It's not, it's just something their body's like, oh, I get this now. It doesn't work for everybody.

But if you're celiac and if it's something inhibiting your digestive tract and not letting your body process stuff and getting rid of it, it's going to store in your body. You're a good example of someone who's happy now. Yeah. Right? Like you said, you're in between your two weights right now and you're happy. Oh my God. I'm so happy just to be healthy and well. And I exercise all the time. And I've got it covered. I've got five different sizes of pants.

And, um, I'm not hard on myself, but like I said, it's not my disposition. Yeah. I don't look at myself. I don't, I don't do that. I mean, yes, I've seen some tragic online pictures and I've certainly been attacked by whenever, uh, cis white male guys aren't happy with me, they'll just call me a fat bitch.

Or a fat C word. And they have no intellectual rapport with me. It's just, even if I'm talking about

Horseshit.ca, the banning of live horse export. They'll, if they're unhappy with me, it's always some physical attribute of mine. And that's part of the fat phobia that exists within our culture, that they think the ultimate king daddy topper of a burn on a woman is to say that you're heavy, right? And then to like ignore all these absolutely stunning full-figured women that exist. So again, everyone's so afraid of like...

someone's, you know, they think you're afraid of being called fat. Cause like that's the worst thing ever. And that's why people are running out to Tijuana to inject themselves with a drug designed for diabetics. So I do think it ties back into like what you were initially saying of like, you know, this, there's a psychiatric element to this where you're chasing some sort of version of yourself that you think is going to ultimately make you really, really happy. And all you have to do is look at how many of the most beautiful women in the

world are taking this drug and they probably looked super beautiful before they started taking it and they still are doing it. Like there's, it's never enough. There is no bottom here because you're, you could be Margot Robbie and Kim Kardashian. I'm not saying Margot Robbie's on it. I don't actually know that, but I just mean you could be this beautiful woman in Hollywood and you're still going to end up coming into a movie. So this is going to be the go-to now. That's what I'm saying. And you know, you're probably just listening to this like a regular human being while you're vacuuming, you're in your car and like you're,

you can't, there's no, look what we're all doing to ourselves. This is what I'm saying. Look what we're all doing to ourselves. If you need the drug, talk to your doctor, they'll give it to you and take it safely. Fine. You know, but the rest of it, Oh, I just think it is a real race to the bottom. Well, my grandma always said the best time to go for a walk is when you don't want to go. And I, every time I go for a walk, I'm inspired.

by my gram that's the best time to go when you don't want to I'm just like that just hit me like you don't appreciate that when you're 17 true you don't appreciate it but you fucking appreciate it when you're when you're 58 you're like oh that's so right I do not want to get up right now but um yeah before we let you go I want to I want to talk to both you guys Sarah and you Caitlin and

I just saw on the news this morning, I don't think it's a brand new story, but TikTok is going to limit users under 18 to an hour at a time. Oh. Only scroll through an hour and you're locked out. And I wanted to get your thoughts on that. Now, I don't know if this is something going into legislation. I don't know if this is something TikTok is testing. Families, I think there's going to be a lot of parents out there that will be cheering for

because the statistics are not good. Hey, I need that limitation. And what it's doing. See, I'm not a TikToker. I'll post something that gets eight views like once every three weeks. So I'm not that. Just pulled up an article here. Here, let me read this for Caitlin.

Yeah.

for eligible accounts is expected to arrive in the coming weeks. There will still be an option for teen TikTokers to continue using the app beyond the 60-minute limit. They will have to be prompted by a passcode. A reminder of how long they've been on. But I have grown-ass friends, like young women friends that are in their 40s that I work with that are doing way too much. Is Leah going to be okay if we tell her about this? Oh, God, yeah, Leah. Leah's great at TikTok. You know, I don't know...

She would probably tell you that she spends too much time on it. Yeah. It's just the latest way that you're addicted to your phone, right? I mean, I don't use TikTok that often slash at all, really, but I'm on my phone all the time. So I know that I have a raging phone addiction. This is a great idea. I hope it makes people a little more aware, but you have to really want to change something to...

actually change it. I'm sure there's a way to override that. You know, that's kind of the way it's been when they're like, oh, Apple wants to alert you to your screen time. It just started bumming me out. I was like, oh, okay, this is how much time I've spent on my phone. I tried. I tried when Apple rolled it out. I was like, oh, this is good for me because I'm on my phone too much, right? So I did the thing and it, so first it's like a mental clue, like, oh, okay, shit, my time limit for this app is up for the day.

But then, you know, I'm at a concert and I remember I was at Backstreet Boys. I will never forget this. I was at the Backstreet Boys concert here in Toronto, like the last indoor arena one. And it kept popping up. I'm trying to like videotape. I'm like side stage basically with amazing tickets. And it's telling me, no, absolutely not. You're done. So I ended up turning it off. The Backstreet Boys night, I turned it off forever.

Yeah. And it's just, you know, it's all compliance based. It's like anything, right? You have to kind of want to stick with it. It's hard. It's hard for me. I mean, like, I get it. I'm, I'm addicted to my phone. So I don't know. How many hours do you do a day? Like, I'm always shocked when I get into bed. Like when I got home from, I hardly looked at, did my phone a lot on tour, which really surprised me. But normally if I'm at home, I'm like between three and four hours a day, which always is like. I don't even check. Yeah.

I don't even check. I don't even know. Um, it's less than it was obviously cause I have a baby. So, you know, but then like, even like he, you know, he goes to bed and he naps now. So he, he previously it was like very sparse. It would be like, I'm awake at two in the morning of like dealing with him. So I was on my phone at the same time, but like, yeah, now it's a bit, it's, it's returned. It's still less than it was, but like, it's definitely a couple hours a day.

What are you saying, Sarah? I just got a new phone this week. It was overdue. And so everything's very fresh. It's told me that I have picked up my phone since I woke up 39 times. So you've picked it up? Yeah. This phone tells you how many times you've picked it up? Do I have that? Yes.

Probably. It's in the screen time if you go to screen time. So that's crazy. It says I've spent 25 minutes today on entertainment and two hours on social. And that's where you have to ask yourself, like, okay, what is it considering a social media app? YouTube? I watched a video this morning while I was getting ready, right? So there's things like that. Yeah. And I mean, like, I'm, you know, there's screen time, but it's like I'm also on that new app. I'm using Noom.

Um, and so, and like, well, you know, you use your phone to, to FaceTime family members. Like there are ways you use it now, but like I will all to say though, it is glued to your hand most likely. Yeah. Yeah. If I forgot my phone in the car, like while I'm doing my radio show, I'm like, Oh, I got to run down. Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah.

My phone is telling me that I've done eight minutes in productivity and finance. Nice. I wonder what that's all about. What did I do? Online banking? Did I buy something online?

Well, I mean, I don't know. I like that. I like the notion that they're going to try to make some awareness or put some stipulation in place. Like, I just don't. I'm skeptical of what it's going to do because I kind of feel like the horse is out of the barn on that one. Yes. And that being said, watch for some content featuring Caitlin on our socials this week. Yeah, exactly. So lovely to have you back. Thank you so much. Thank you so much.

Thank you so much, Caitlin. And please say hi to Meredith Shaw. I will. Eat something delicious for me. And me. I'm looking forward to it. I've been thinking about Vietnamese stuff all day. So I have a studio appointment today with Russ. So I'm definitely going to stop and get myself a big bowl of that to bring home. Yeah, we'll enjoy some noodles. And it was nice chatting with you guys. Good to see you too. Okay, bye. Bye. Always nice to have Caitlin.

And keep those comments coming. We're on Facebook. We are on Twitter. We are on Instagram. Let us know what you think about this week's show. You can subscribe on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your favorite podcasts. Bye for now. Totally do. This podcast is distributed by the Women in Media Podcast Network. Find out more at womeninmedia.network.